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Alibaba Open Indication Puts Its Market Cap Greater Than Facebook, Verizon, JPMorgan, Just Under Wal-Mart
Moments ago, the NYSE revealed that the latest indication for the Alibaba open, due sometime in the next hour, is in the $82-$85, $84-87, $86-88, $87-89, $88-90, 90-91, 91-92, 92-93 range.
So assuming a mid-range price (which will surely be overtaken now that the market is in full on dot com bubble euphoria mode as even the Fed's Fisher admitted moments ago) , this means that Alibaba's market cap will be $227 billion, putting it among the 15 highest valued companies trading on US markets, above both Facebook and Verizon, and... JPMorgan.
Update: $92-93 now, which means $227 billion market cap.
And as we await the final price, Alibaba has surpassed the market cap of JPMorgan and, should it continue, it may even eclipse Walmart's $245 billion.
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Oh well, another insider deal I missed.
84-87 now...BAHABAHABAHA....man i wanna see the look on the retail sheep who puts an order in and it gets filled at 104...and yup. its currently trading at 86...
holy shit, what happened to Silver.
Apparently they are "looking for sellers"... do they really leave this shit until the last minute? Would have thought this is a least somewhat planned in advance.
Are people dumping Silver in preparation of buying BABA??? WTF, look at the intraday XAG
the markets are really effing up internally even though everything is still green...for the moment...well except precious metals
wow silver broke 18
BABA song from the 1980's:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LK6wglhklKg
Dump GOLD To Buy This Shit ???
Oh Yeah
Everybody remembers the "Chinese glove" business plan from b-school.
Nice to see they've updated it for the 21st century.
These IPO's are an underwriters' dream. They fleece everyone by taking the order, holding it, buying in advance, then selling back higher. THis is so controlled and obvious. YOu've got Goldman and JPig as underwriters.... what could be more legit?
Buy BABA, suckers!!!
Using the bigger fool theory they are try to determine the actual fool size calculated in cubic morons...
this all smells fishy
Look at all those names, except facebook, thay all have collateral and assets.
Alibaba..............not so much.
Hey, a "name" is an asset and collateral - don't-cha-know?! /sarc
Logic for Alibaba's future rise is simple.
Every company on the planet cannot be compared to US corporations. US Corporations were innovative (like Motorola or Yahoo or Hotmail or Mastercard, Visa), used to be big (like Lehman or Merrill Or Bear Stearns or Enron), had a global dominance (like IBM, McKinsey or Kodak) etc. But that concept does not exist anymore.
Around the globe, from Asia to Latin America to India, Russia and most importantly China, regionally strong players have emerged. There are dozens of players inside those countries who are globally dominant in their sectors.
China is the only exception where they used to have regionally or domestically giant players who are now ascending to the global stage. It is a very long list of Haier, Baidu, Huawei, Lenovo, Alibaba, ICBC, ABC, CCB, Sinopec, CNOOC......
Another major difference with China is two pronged. They have 1 billion more consumers than there are in USA. USA has around 330m population, bulk of them getting poorer by the day, while China has 1.35bn and bulk of them getting richer every passing year.
Second difference is that until now, all companies were state owned and now they are gradually being privatised in China and shares being listed whether in Shanghai, HK or NY. This allows foreigners to participate in the growth of China because foreigners are otherwise not allowed to find work in China easily, nor buy real estate nor open a bank account, nor transfer funds in or out or invest in stocks etc. However, all this is now slowly changing every month. There seems to be a fast pace 2013 onwards, possibly due to the oncoming collpase of the dollar and/or US hegemony.
China's free zone is a start since last year to allow foreigners to own companies and do business in China without a Chinese partner.
China's currency is being opened up and allowed to be bought by foreigners to pay Chinese exporters in their own currency to stimulate trade etc.
Gold trading has just started in Yuan for foreigners last night.
Foreigners are just being allowed to enter China and realise profits which until now was purely restricted to Chinese inside China or their Govt.
This is a very long term growth trend. Until the profits and growth story is intact, the risk of weak corporate structures or fraud etc will remain minimal which anyways exists around the world. Just look for Madoff or Lehman or Enron and google it. (while you are searching just search for Jon Corzine and MF Global too...;)
Corporate structure weakness is a weak defence for not investing. Fraud is done with intent to cheat not worrying about the 'strength' corporate structures. I am sure Enron and Madoff had 'strong' corporate structures.
Another major factor is that China is the only country in the world where money is sloshing around at a very high velocity. This enables growth to be faster, easier and profitable. Imagine, now more money, from foreigners, is waiting to enter China and what will that do to the high velocity of money. It will simply create more growth!
If, instead of feeling jealous, we try to partcipate in this growth and not compare to US corporations because the sheer size of Chinese companies just within China is 4.5 times bigger in population/consumer size, they have barely started venturing out of China, so just like American corporations created a hegemony in the past, they have just started entering Europe, Russia, Latin America and will dominate the whole planet.
US at its best of times about 20-25 years ago could not become such a giant what China will become in the next decade purely because they do not interfere in the politics of any nation but more importantly the GDP size of the world is much much larger in 2014 or will be 2025 than it was in 1990 or 2000 when US was at its peak.
By the way, the last similar company to list in US was Baidu, in 2009 which has grown 6.5 times from USD 37 to USD 227 today......maybe someone can find me a American company that has grown 6.5 times since Sept 2009.
Even the American darling Apple has grown about 350 odd percent but just Baidu which is not even as big as Alibaba has grown more than Apple. Check it here: http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=BIDU+Interactive#symbol=BIDU;range=2y
Alibaba is a conglomerate not a tech company and it has just literally been born for foreign investors....just wait for a few more years....Lets give the Chinese also a chance to come up...http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=BIDU+Interactive#symbol=BIDU;range=2y
Alibaba is one giant company and has multiple US companies rolled into one....http://qz.com/268018/alibaba-is-all-of-these-companies-rolled-into-one/
With so many companies rolled into one, plus 4.5 times more population of China alone and remainder of the world yet to be captured, what is there not to like about the friendly BABA? :)
Anybody else feeling kicked in the balls lately?
I'd hope the Scottish people would vote for independence.
I've hoped for sanity in the financial markets.
I've hoped there would be real price discovery in the PMs.
I'm downtrodden. I'm feeling low. And I've come here for someone to call me an "ignorant motherfucker" or something like that. It always cheers me up to have someone say I'm teetering on joining the dark side of the sheeple. So someone have at it. Take out your anger on the Scottish bastards who didn't want freedom. Flame like I'm Jamie Dimon across the desk from you. Help those of us who just want to medicate.
Jane, you ignorant slut.
Cheer up, it's Friday. Go have a couple with your buddy, Ho Lee Fuk. Get laid. It'll all be back here Monday, same time, same place, same actors, same cognitive dissonance.
If any consolation, Jack Ma has a face only a mother could love, of if you are a casting director for the next Star Trek movie...
There are no more Scotts no more Britts no more Irish no more Americans!
Its only the millions of sheep and sheep herders.
The only orders accepted after 4PM yesterday were those with a LIMIT. no Market orders were accepted. Now we see if the insider sellers will step up and force this down.
i bet the 40 thieves didn't miss it though.
The Chinese are looking forward to fleecing Americans with this IPO. Some chinese guy studied PT Barnum's lessons well.
I don't see how you could be more correct. "Let's stop fucking around with the fake Rolex watches already and hit 'em where they live". It's also a nice measuring stick for public idiocy.
Oh well, it probably is worth as much as J.P. Morgan; the govt. supported insolvency case. LOL.
told my broker to get me in anywhere under 100... watch and learn muppetz!!
/sarc... but probably a good call in Yellens bizarro world
the usa banks will sell a stinking turd for a fee
Wait.....I'm confused......I thought that's what they already do.
<Boss, I've created a new turd security that actually smells like a turd. It'll sell like hot cakes.>
they are gutting this country like a fat hog
will
do
lol worth more than Intel. Intel consistently has 10 billion per year in free cash flow. Alibaba is a real company with real earnings, but come on.
But Intel actually makes stuff and where's the value in that? /big sarc
It's China man! You have to buy, because it's made in China...... just like everything else in this country.
...and what is JPM's or GS's position in Alibaba...
shamwow!!!! ...and that's why they will always be "richer than you"...
guess Ali Baba ipo'ing is a fine reason to sell paper Silver...
http://www.kitco.com/charts/livesilver.html
FUCK OFF BANKERS...
Jesus wtf. I went to that site a few weeks ago to check out all the hubbub and they were selling a bunch of shit. Not even remotely close to amazon. WTF is this garbage site?
Welcome to the future...
Gold and Silver dropping like a bucket of mud..
Amazing everything is in the bubble territory...except PMs...they are treated like trash...you would think if artwork is hitting new highs..gold would be too....or if condos in NYC are hitting new highs..gold would too...or if bonds are hitting new highs..gold would too...strange huh....and dont get me started with Alibaba....gold should too
I am frustrated too by the price of silver. I am getting really frustrated by the miners themselves. They lose money on every ounce and plan to make it up on volume. Last quarterly report Hecla came out with their losses, but bragged about hitting some high content silver veins. What good does it do to find more silver when you lose money digging it up? I guess it is okay for the employees, and the CEO probably still gets a bonus, but the investors get the "shaft." (Sorry). Hey you miners! Maybe think about cutting back production to your lowest cost mines and see if you can turn a profit! Shit, Wake up!
T he year is 2000; the Stawk Market is going to the moon, expecially the Nasdaq; PetsRus.com is worth more than Ford; Silver sells for $4.35/ oz. but what happened next? Remember the name of the game is Futures; not "Presents". the present merely tells you what's coming next.
Investors, please ignore the man behind the curtain with the shears. He's just the... um... he's the gardener. Yeah, that's it.
Alibaba Booey !
The markets will rise for the rest of September.
Howard Stern's penis.
Alibaba is fracking Wall Street and getting deep dark pools of fiat finance to the surface and delivering juice. Squeeze the Alibaba.
Hey this must be a great company, what do they make?
they cook - the books that is
Fools. T hey make fools out of their buyers. Next question?
Virtually everything.
Nothing really.
Its got the VC's up all night !
P.S. Its structure is very risky as a Cayman Island holding company...from the news...
"Alibaba is Chinese, but is incorporated in the Cayman Islands and will list on U.S. markets -- an unusual setup that can make an investor's head spin. China has prohibitions on foreign ownership, which means U.S. investors won't actually own the company's Chinese assets. Instead, investors will own a Cayman Islands company called Alibaba Group Holding Limited. The structure is risky and may even be illegal under Chinese law."
You should be ashamed of yourself, that question must NEVER be asked.
When there is no yield anywhere, we must make yield somewhere.
Ah, yes.............Alibaba.............
and the Forty Thieves!
Can someone explain? According to Marketwatch, retail investors were not supposed to get to buy before the public. It was supposed to go on the market at 68 dollars a share... Why have they delayed the IPO to (to find sellers)? And why will it debut at 84ish. They have literally price manpiulated it....
Why, that's shocking !! Someone should tell the SEC, right away.
Lol.
The IPO took place at 66 or 68 - whatever. This latest is the indication of those who want to buy shares they didn't get allocated in the IPO. Basically, buyers submitted limit buy orders and that is what they are reporting about. We don't know about the insider seller volume that will overwhelm this price, nor the volumes behind they buyers' bids.
Thank you very much. Well explained. It will be very interesting to see what happens. I was orginally gonna try to get in at 68 and play the day trade momentum but 87 to 89 is way to expensive. Not to mention, over 8 billion worth can be sold by Ailbaba ownership anytime..
That's just the 'wrong' price!
Strange day. - First my Scottish cousins don't take the chance of freedom, and now this over priced crap website.
Are 99% of people walking around in a total daydream? - The gullibility is astonishing.
That's just the 'wrong' price!
Strange day. - First my Scottish cousins don't take the chance of freedom, and now this over priced crap website.
Are 99% of people walking around in a total daydream? - The gullibility is astonishing.
Hopefully it will ad some competition.
If this isn't the sign of a top...
Amazing what people will buy these days; junk company, junk phones, junk food. As a people, the disaster that comes is well deserved.
the sign of a top is after a quality top is revealed, not before. There will be more than enough time to sell a decline After it has presented itself. Price action more often than not, retraces the initial reaction providing sellers an opportunity to sell with good trade location, market structure, and structured stops that will have a lower chance of getting hit. Cash stops without market structure are foolish. Interact with the market, not predict it. Have patience with a purpose. In the meantime since 2010 you would have been getting paid to wait for the next crash and may have been stopped out in 2007 before the market broke down.
Price action is at 15 year sell signals, and a decline will make 2008 look like the appetizer, but there is no need to be a short in front of a freight train of a climax tape.
because...stocks are made for selling.
my $.02 with millions of reasons why.
Good points. I try not to front run too many things but if there were ever an advance long overdue for a significant correction, this would be it. And the Alibaba IPO, a company of dubious distinction, is indicative of THE top (mass stupidity in spades). But, I let the market talk to me and am a patient individual. All things in time... ;-)
Great, now I'll never buy it...
Corki is poor
Could Silver rip higher from these levels? Are there now too many sellers? The wash and rinse price action looks like "whale tracks" to me. Will need to wait for price structure to reveal itself to prove that a quality bottom was printed.
Guess the world has stopped buying real electronics and solar power things.
Its all virtual economy from here on out (e.g. Alibaba, Amazon)...lots of virtual surfing and not much 'do'ing.
Silver will be used only for replacement hardware (computers, phones, etc.), but there will be negative growth (recession or depression) going forward.
Since the real tangible economy is down...so Silver.
I'm holding PMs what I have anyway as a hedge.
Open sesame...
Babalicious.
$220 billion reallocated from the US to China in the blink of an eye...
I imagine there is enough malinvestment here in the US for the time being. But TSLA is gonna need a few billion in the near future, I hear.
Tesla is a political handout and every one knows it.
They make a good portion of their money selling stupid california carbon credits. Legislation that shouldn't even exist.
Looks like just another overcluttered web site middleman to me...
Exactly. Asians LOVE to invest. HFTs make up over 70% of the market's volume in the U.S.
Clinton mucked up the Multilataral Investment Agreement circa 1995 between the US and China.
Maurice Greenberg and Hollywood are the only two business people who were smart enough to pursue China.
Our sector literally needs to physically pick up and move 99 Wall Street into the middle of Macau then stick ticker tapes on the slot machines. Too bad (it's too obvious) that the cream didn't rise to the top in the U.S.
I certainly hope that everyone here has their market orders for BABA in!!!
can you still put a market order for 68 dollars a share?
"can you still put a market order for 68 dollars a share?"
Only if your a bankster
Griffey, you deserve whatever carnage comes your way.........more stools trying to game something they have no clue about........
You are right. Thats why I am on ZH trying to learn. I have never actually put money in.
Everyone on this site says how the population is uninformed, well I am proactively trying to get informed and learn how to invest wisely.
dont bank on this site fully, thats for sure... U will end up hunkered down with too much PM and guns and a fear mentality that will stifle your decisions and lower your sperm count. sometimes, they let a bunch of fuckin nut jobs run rampant from time to time in here with piss poor return performance advice. that includes whatever the Tylers want to put up...diversify and don't believe all the Alex Jonestown hype...here or anywhere. I will also prove how biased this site can be... so just watch how far i get junked and down arrowed in 3, 2,..
Thank you I appreciate it.
anyone using Softbank to play Alibaba ..if so, thoughts
This makes me sick watching this hype....its a circus
Agreed. Like the 2008 election all over again...
I think I hear the Muppet Show theme song in the distance...
http://youtu.be/1M0X6OymIjg
Bob Piss on me..is sure selling the NY stock exchange big....he is a walking advertisement for them....
Bob Pisani... So. Fucking. Gay.
CNBC so desparate for dot com glory days
has thier CEO been invited to 2015 bilderberg yet... all the other CEOs on that list have...
Drowned!
Somebody, pls, explain to me how BABAs cap is 3x+ that of eBay? How exactly are they different?
lol, you are clueless
How do you say "full retard" in Mandarin?
Domo arigato.