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Why Blackrock (And Every Other Bondholder) Is Freaking Out (In 1 Simple Chart)

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Just last week, we explained why Blackrock - the largest asset manager in the world - is gravely concerned about the 'broken' corporate bond market. Simply put, thanks to The Fed's continued presence in the Treasury market has left the corporate bond market a liquidity-starved ticking time-bomb if faith in the stability of defaults ever falters (with firm balance sheets at record high leverage) and "selling" begins. As the following chart from Deutsche Bank highlights, the current level of liquid assets as a proportion of total HY assets is about as low as it has been tracking data back around 25 years.

 

In other words, the massive (and likely levered) positions The Fed has forced the world to take on by its repression face a dramatic liquidity risk cost if they are ever to 'realize' any gains from the Fed's handouts (by actually selling).

That's what every bond manager 'knows'...

*  *  *

As Blackrock concluded,

To BlackRock, the dangers of price gaps and scant liquidity have been masked in a benign, low interest-rate environment, and need to be addressed before market stress returns.

 

...

 

The risk posed by investors trying to dump bonds after the Federal Reserve raises interest rates is “percolating right under” the noses of regulators, he said.

*  *  *

And so here we are...

1. Corporate Bond Managers "KNOW" they can't sell as much as they want/need to (due to the illiquidty), so..

2. They Hedge.. first through CDS (HY CDX small sample and does not cover risk of the lowest crappiest names that many firms have bid up as the search for yield accelerated),

2a. or HYG/JNK (but that includes rate risk so the hedge is liquid but less accurate), so...

3. They Hedge... through stocks (beta-adjusted hedges - akin to capital structure arbitrage - can help more idiosyncratic risk control in the HY portfolio), and

4. They Hedge... through volatility (credit spreads and equity volatility are explicitly linked via the firm's asset - or business - uncertainty).

 

 

That's why small caps have suffered more as credit fell (as more directly linked to the weaker balance sheets).

How this ends... the hedges start to fail (i.e. MTM differences between portfolio delta and hedge delta grow large), someone else decides to "sell" and throw in the towel and prices gap down in HY... and the avalanche begins...

That's what Blackrock fears.

*  *  *

Bonus Chart 1: Forget "best balance sheets ever", Leverage has never been higher...

 

Bonus Chart 2: The Fed is leaving the building and it's time to realize this 'spread'...

 

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Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:38 | 5256690 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

Further proof rates must not be allowed to rise.

 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:39 | 5256713 PartysOver
PartysOver's picture

This may be true but inflation will turn the bond paper into ass wipe paper.  Two ply please.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:43 | 5256741 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

when the asset bubbles burst (and it will)

 

DEFLATION

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:47 | 5256757 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

Leveraged assets will deflate; commodities and consumers staples at the retail level will go up at an even faster clip than they have.  Depreciating fiat will chase after short-term needs, and away from assets. 

It's not an either/or - it's both.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:49 | 5256775 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

not a chance

 

soaring $US = importing deflation

 

NO inflation till it shows up in wages ... and it won't

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:50 | 5256786 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

You must not buy anything. 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:58 | 5256829 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

setting aside latest CPI being negative

 

QE/ZIRP disinflationary (see japan)

 

will prove deflationary when asset bubbles burst

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:07 | 5256872 cifo
cifo's picture

Blackrock is not freaking out. And they will never will.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:25 | 5256954 knukles
knukles's picture

Why, just last week I said their complaining was an a priori excuse for not being able to sell all sorts-a garbage into a down market.
Alcoholic thinking.  (While I really caused my own problem)  I'm a victim and everybody else is responsible for the malady.
If those people didn't put in redemptions I wouldn't be faced with giving them back their own cash.
Let's put some gates on withdrawals
There.
That'll show 'em.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:23 | 5257654 J Pancreas
J Pancreas's picture

As a fellow AA'r (by the grace of God), your analogy is brilliant.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:36 | 5257697 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

As a fellow AA'r, I'm now only interested in Opiates, thanks to my Higher Power. heh-heh.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:54 | 5257976 Manthong
Manthong's picture

What’s the big deal?

Liquidity is only a keyboard stroke away.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 21:23 | 5258226 eclectic syncretist
eclectic syncretist's picture

Because if it keeps on raining the levees gonna break.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NRUTJAO7uLE

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 23:26 | 5258544 The Doofus
The Doofus's picture

The boys at Blackrock cornholed my mother.  I'll never forgive them.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 21:07 | 5258181 Livermore Legend
Livermore Legend's picture

Beautiful....

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:29 | 5257678 DetectiveStern
DetectiveStern's picture

I'm seeing increasing margin calls for them ;)

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:31 | 5256984 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Bullshit.  Name one society/currency that collapsed/died because their purchasing power was too strong.  The entire planet cannot be japan...

totally fucking stupid.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:49 | 5257053 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

where did i say any of that?

 

next cycle is deflationary ... doesn't mean it is bad (well, maybe for wall street) ... or that it will last

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:38 | 5257709 Yellowhoard
Yellowhoard's picture

Agreed.

First devastating deflation, then moar printing.

The double whammy of Wall Street.

People must beg for their destroyer.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:39 | 5257928 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

Just another black swan amongst the growing flock...and they are staying around for the winter.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 21:43 | 5258294 BeanusCountus
BeanusCountus's picture

Certainly hope so. But it can never occur without losses from excess credit creation being realized. Not "recognized" like in a few footnotes to financial statements, REALIZED as in losses being borne and absorbed. And that, my friend, is when risk can be re-priced and there will once again be opportunity to make some serious $$$. Central banks around the globe will fight this to their last breath. And that is the problem. They are all simply buying time until (hopefully) reserves can be built to absorb the losses. I think they are running out of time.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:00 | 5256839 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

Inflation now is due to the free money credit bubble. When that implodes, when no amount of stimulus gets the economy high anymore, the crash will cause deflation. My guess is that they will attempt to solve the problem by papering it over again. Huge helicopter drops which will hit wages directly and boom, we are Zimbabwe.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:09 | 5256879 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

I know that if they did a helicopter drop to the populace, the first thing I'd do is try to convert it to something tangible before everybody else did.  Something that I'd find useful that not everybody else would think of right away.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:20 | 5256924 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

...so why wait for the helicopter drop to do so?

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:27 | 5256966 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Something tangible that I would not be able to afford otherwise.  

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:25 | 5257669 J Pancreas
J Pancreas's picture

Cmon dude BBY has financing for the new 80" 4k idiot boxes. Yes we can afford it!

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:38 | 5257710 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

I give up. What is the answer? what is it you wouldn't be able to afford ?

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:27 | 5256948 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

a lot of inflation not related to monetary policy

 

housing?  a lot of games there.  Banks allowed to mark assets to models ... and keep REOs on balance sheet rather than liquidate ... and when they do sell it is via bulk to investment groups to avoid price discovery (not listed on mls)

 

health care? cartel.  drugs $100 across the border.  $10,000 in US.  Much cheaper to fly to india for procedure than have done in US.

 

Education?  Allowing kids to sign loan documents for tens of thousands of dollars.  No incentive for institutions to cut costs when Uncle Sam more than willing to dole out $US.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:20 | 5257172 ersatz007
ersatz007's picture

who will be raising wages?  the gov't for gov't employees?  i don't see wage inflation in the corporate world happening.  most corporations think they're being EXTREMELY generous when they give you a 3% salary increase...and only those who 'exceed expectations' get that.  

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:13 | 5257831 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Think massive tax refunds as if that has never happened before.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:33 | 5256980 edwardo1
edwardo1's picture

Wage inflation will not be the mechanism for inflation and, ultimately, currency collapse, aka the domestic ill effects of the reversal of longstanding global dollar hyperinflation. The government bidding in the physical plane will be the mechanism that causes the spiral in prices as Uncle will not curtail his spending in the absence of sufficient support for his debt. The process whereby debt purchases disintegrate is underway, but it has not reached the critical stage that will engender runaway prices in the physical plane.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:44 | 5257726 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

If youi go on saying rational things like this, you're likely to upset people, you know?

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:39 | 5257022 Honey Badger
Honey Badger's picture

Inflation can show up as a complete loss of confidence in the currency, regardless of wages.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:44 | 5257942 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

That's the hyperinflation scenario. HI is not a monetary, it's a psychological phenomenon.

And it probably will happen, after the deflationary collapse.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:42 | 5257721 sandiegoman
sandiegoman's picture

You make a simple mistake, there are 2 types of inflation.  You are referring to demand-pull inflation (wages), arguably the better kind of inflation. Increase in the money supply will eventually and ALWAYS cause cost-push inflation; the bad kind with no increase in wages.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:19 | 5258046 cnmcdee
cnmcdee's picture

The Shemitah Year has predicted *ALL* market corrections, depressions, and pullbacks with 90% accuracy.

"The greatest financial turning points, peaks, or long-term collapses of the past forty years that have taken place within the biblical Year of the Shemitah or its autumn wake is 100 percent!

•  Where there has been both a financial collapse and an economic recession, the period connecting their starting points has fallen within the biblical Shemitah 100 percent of the time!

•  Thus, from the forty-year period beginning in 1973, every single one of the five greatest financial and economic peaks and collapses have converged, clustered, and taken place according to the set time of the Shemitah.

Cahn, Jonathan (2014-09-02). The Mystery of the Shemitah: The 3,000-Year-Old Mystery That Holds the Secret of America's Future, the World's Future, and Your Future! (Kindle Locations 1239-1245). Charisma House. Kindle Edition.

On September 17, 2001 the stock market experienced a 684 point drop or 7.1% which occurred EXACTLY on the 29 Elul of the last day of the Shemitah Year.

Exactly to the DAY 7 Hebrew years later on September 29th, 2008 the market drops 777 points or 7 percent EXACTLY on the 29th of Elul the last day of the next Shemitah Year.

TODAY FYI is the FIRST DAY OF THE SHEMITAH YEAR. It Starts on the 25th of September 2014 and will run until 13th of September 2015. And Ironically the market started tanking perfectly in accordance with the opening day of the Shemitah.  I would *RECOMMEND STRONGLY* that everyone read this book.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:48 | 5258136 Tinky
Tinky's picture

Don't encourage the anti-Shemites.

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 07:16 | 5259057 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

He's just advertising the book and posting on many different websites.

But nevertheless I find it very interesting:

www.wnd.com/2014/09/get-ready-shemitah-begins-this-week

Head of the IMF, Christine Lagarde, 2014 will be extraordinary: www.youtube.com/watch?v=QYmViPTndxw

Henry Paulson, one year advance knowledge of crash: www.youtu.be/uTj9HEt3Mc0?t=22m52s

 

 

rafzen.wordpress.com/2013/12/03/kliczko-lubawicz-kaczynski-and/

www.chabad.org/therebbe/article_cdo/aid/695370/jewish/The-President-Cons...

snippits-and-slappits.blogspot.co.at/2012/02/anatomy-of-one-world-religion.html

davidduke.com/the-white-house-honors-hateful-jewish-supremacists/

 

Google: lubavitch white house.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 21:15 | 5258198 Livermore Legend
Livermore Legend's picture

"All with 90%"

Mon, 10/06/2014 - 22:01 | 5297277 rbg81
rbg81's picture

Inflation will not show up in wages.  The combination of immigration (legal and illegal) and ever increasing automation will continue to depress employee wages low until the Reovolution comes.....or never.  Probably never.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:34 | 5257908 Whootie_who
Whootie_who's picture

Margin calls Out tonight.. Who wants to be long over the WEAK-end?

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:43 | 5257935 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

If liquidity becomes scare everything is sold.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:43 | 5257938 Shaznardickleze...
Shaznardickleze the Doon's picture

Conflagration ? yesh I think that covers it.

ITS A TRAP SIRS

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:53 | 5256796 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

And soon. Thats the reason the bankers want the SDR & SDRM, and want it now.

That does pit them against the MIC, which has nearly  outlived its usefullness to them.

They've known this day was coming from day one ,so it will be interesting to see what they

have planned.

EKM does have it partly right.

Best any here can hope for is to not be trampled by the giants fighting it out.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:16 | 5257840 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

We can always hope one of them trips over us and impales himself on a skyscraper.

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 08:21 | 5259182 drdolittle
drdolittle's picture

Isn't the MIC owned by the banksters? Maybe not top military command but the industrial complex. I think the sociopaths will fight for top dog. It's the power and control they're addicted to, not the money. Someone asked Rockefeller, don't you have enough money, how much is enough? Just a little bit more was the answer. More than the other guys, being the pure alpha.

Hope you're all right. I'm not much of a fan of the military, the business of murder isn't cool to me. I do have more faith in a military junta than our current political establishment. At least some of the top miliitary men still believe in honor. There is nothing approaching honor in top politicians and beaurocratys, only personal ambition. I hope the military shoots all their asses.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:13 | 5257141 crazybob369
crazybob369's picture

Not gonna happen, but what if it does? Is deflation really a bad thing? Lower food prices, lower energy prices, lower health care prices. But do you really see any of these things happening?

   Food prices: Given the severe drought in California (More than half the nation's fruit, nuts, and vegetables come from here. California is the nation's number one dairy state.), don't think so.

   Energy prices: With the Mid East clusterfuck and the administrations bungling of our energy bounty, not likely in the long run.

   Lower Health Care Costs: Don't make me laugh.

So, unless you're talking about cars, big screen TV's, computers, etc., I just don't see it. Besides, by definition you cannot have deflation when the money supply is increasing exponentially.



 

 

 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:38 | 5257696 Dapper Dan
Dapper Dan's picture

But what if all the money is tied up in cash?

 

 

“I hired a counterfeiter the other day. I told him, “As for your salary, how much you make is really up to you.” I love a business model where the employee pays the employer.”

Jarod Kintz

 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:46 | 5257731 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

Ha. Ha. t ha t's pretty funny; "how much you make is really up to you". Ha-Ha.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:26 | 5258069 Peak Finance
Peak Finance's picture

Some confusion here:

but what if it does? Is deflation really a bad thing? 

I don't fear deflation and I don't think anyone else here does either.

We fear the GOVERNMENTS / CENTRAL BANKS RESPONSE to the deflation


Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:48 | 5256767 madcows
madcows's picture

Conserve T-Bills, wipe with both sides.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:50 | 5256785 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Three ply.  And make it soft, because I'm pretty sure that our assholes are going to be sore from the financial fucking.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:55 | 5256813 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

Game.

Set.

And Motherfucking match, Bitchezzzzz.................

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:42 | 5256731 kaa1016
kaa1016's picture

You mean that they don't want rates to rise. At this point, whether rates rise of not is now out of the Fed's control and once that becomes the consensus view, all hell will break loose. It's all about perception.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:37 | 5258097 Think Like A Crook
Think Like A Crook's picture

Ding ding ding ding!

Cant get over this view that the Fed is omnipotent. They are lost.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:48 | 5256763 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

Doesn't matter Tim. They will.

The Fed will do a 2004-2007 esque rate hike. This will turn everyone who's been front running the Fed in, to front running it out. As bonds trade down , this will flood the forex markets with dollars which will cause an uptick in velocity . As velocity goes up, we will get an uptick in price inflation. Which will cause more bond outflows and more dollars on the forex market. This is where we get the 70's all over again. Then the Fed will try and raise rates to stop the outflow. This is what Bernanke said he can stop in 15 minutes. At this point, it's all over folks

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:54 | 5256803 nope-1004
nope-1004's picture

I don't follow the logic of the Fed intentionally losing control of the currency markets.  Unless, they intend on destorying USD confidence, but the geopolitical landscape makes this a much different time than the '70's.

We'll see, I guess.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:55 | 5257078 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

They are the ones saying that they are going to raise rates IE, turn the front runners toward the exit

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:04 | 5256857 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

The Federal Reserve will never (yeah, i know ... never say never) get overnight rate over 1%

 

anyway, long end of the curve will just yawn if rates raised ... inverted yield curve will show who's the boss ... and it ain't the Fed

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 04:26 | 5258924 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

It's the Tacoma Narrows Bridge all over again!

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:51 | 5256788 Pareto
Pareto's picture

+100. Yup. The Fed, whether it wants to or not essentially has to provide the liquidity to protect its own rate suppression initiative(s). No more whistling past the grave yard - it must serve as an intermediate provider of liquidity to allow a sort of orderly process for positions to close without rates sky rocketing.

It's ironic actually. The very market the FED sought to control (bond) in effect, now controls it.

Dontchya just love it when a plan comes together? It's almost like instead of the bond market calling out the FED, it's the stock market calling them out instead and the question becomes, in my opinion, is how much dry powder or how many tools are left in Bernankes tool belt that Yellen can actually utilize without full blown In your face currency dilution.

"The FED can change what things look like but the FED can never change what things really are." (James Grant, 2013). Nuff said.

Let's go golfing!

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:10 | 5256883 edwardo1
edwardo1's picture

They are in a box (named Hobson's Choice) from which they can't escape. If The Fed becomes the marginal toxic sludge (aka bond) buyer they screw pension schemes from Portland Maine to Portland Oregon. And if they step away from that role then

rates will move higher, as they have done since it was merely hinted that QE would be wound down. But, guess what. They will be back in the QE business. They can check out (any time they like) but they can never leave because ultimately The Fed is government's bitch, and Government will seek to keep borrowing costs down until they can't. However, as soon as it becomes apparent that The Fed is well and truly in a mafia vortex, "Everytime I try to leave, they suck me back in" the whole shebang will not be long for this world.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:23 | 5256945 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

In a stock market crash, you'll see a flight to "safety."  So long as they can keep other parts of finance from coming apart at the seams, that's one method of keeping rates down, albeit a temporary way.  After that, government theft of retirement accounts is another way.  For the retirees' "protection," of course.

 

However, during those, if other shit starts to happen, they very well could be forced back into QE, and once those are done, I don't see any other options than QE.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:47 | 5257048 edwardo1
edwardo1's picture

Yes, bond yeilds come down for a spell. At this point such an eventuality, and those like it, count as happy accidents.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:13 | 5257139 goatmug
goatmug's picture

You guys forgot to remember the convienient "unforeseen" attack on the homeland where all the cops and DEA and US Marshalls and FBI guys are all watching porn and fail to notice the brown skinned marauders with big fat back packs of c-4 into our subways or other soft targets.

Yes, we may see a correction, but we'll also see a wonder artificial QE without any Fed intervention.  Now, if Janet was smart, she'd be willing to let a few institutional holders buy some of her bonds on her balance sheet, allowing her to offload some of the sludge.... but my guess is that she'll just purchase new bonds to help the treasury out.

Mark my words, when things get close to getting out of hand, we'll see some kind of attack whether here or in a western european nation, just to keep things orderly in the credit markets.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:03 | 5257586 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

Safe haven buying; bidding up the price of the underlying, drives down the quoted interest rates; but this is a temporary situation. and likely to reverse badly; well, somewhere between badly, and very, very, very, badly.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:04 | 5257588 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

yes; agreed.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:05 | 5257595 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

Agreed. You're a pretty smart penguin. sorry if you're not a penguin, it's hard to tell.

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 04:30 | 5258928 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Ha, next you'll be saying I'm not a sentient, wooden robot (formerly made of metal!) -- you can kiss my splintery, wooden @ss!

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:19 | 5258045 lotsoffun
lotsoffun's picture

NO.  the government is the fed's bitch.  jamie and lloyd own suckbutt's like obama and schumer.  they proved once already.  there MIGHT be a time when the populace wakes up, and they could correct this through voting for people that would change legistlation, but it will not happen anytime soon.

the .gov is FED's bitch.  if jamie and lloyd want to cash out now on top - they will.  nobody in congress has any say on when or how the fed will stop buying and start selling.

 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 17:58 | 5257564 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

all sellers and no buyers when the mass mind rolls over; it's gonna be interesting.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:36 | 5256706 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

What is this "default" you speak of?  Shirley you jest.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:47 | 5256765 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

AIG will save the day. Well, as soon as Greenberg's investor lawsuit is settled accordingly.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:51 | 5256787 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Default is not in our stars dear Brutus, but in ourselves.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:11 | 5256886 Strider52
Strider52's picture

Obligatory "And don't call me Shirley".

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:41 | 5256728 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

I've been Defcon 5 for years

 

cash and long bond Ts

 

don't mind being a turtle, at all

 

just waiting to pick through the wreckage to realign

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:48 | 5256774 Herodotus
Herodotus's picture

Both cash and long bond T's will eventually be worthless.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:53 | 5256793 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

won't matter

 

they'll  be golden till the next downturn (put me down for sooner rather than later)

 

and then i'll be skedaddling out of both

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:09 | 5257615 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

You have a good point. or a well reaoned position. It 's so bloody difficult to be sure of anything. I guess I'm just predjudiced in favor of Silver.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:14 | 5257628 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

My thesis is that the price of the Long Bond has already topped; what is your take on this ?

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:11 | 5257621 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

"eventually doesn't have any usable definition. If you want to discuss this, it will have to be in terms of "years"; or months; something that has a knowable meaning.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:49 | 5256780 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

How did that work in the 70's ?

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:55 | 5256809 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

this ain't the 70s ... haven't you noticed ... disco still dead ...

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:13 | 5257623 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

As if you could drive on the autobahn using your rear view mirror. LOL.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:07 | 5256869 Catullus
Catullus's picture

Just a shitty comment: as the defense condition number is lowered, you're put on higher alert. For instance, DEFCON 2 is more severe than DEFCON 4.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:12 | 5256895 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

oops, my bad

 

make note: watch more war movies

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:17 | 5257634 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

Yeah; got me too. Don't watch movies at all, of course. I suppose it'll come in handy in cocktail party conversation though; except I don't go to cocktail parties either.

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 08:39 | 5259212 drdolittle
drdolittle's picture

My kind of people. except I do watch the occasional movie that's been well vetted by someone I trust. There's some good stuff out there, just low probability of finding it randomly

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 04:33 | 5258929 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

As I recall, should it ever get to DEFCON 2, not very many lifeforms will be around to see DEFCON 1.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:14 | 5256894 oddjob
oddjob's picture

Strange how you signed up 5 weeks ago to inform everyone what you did 5 years ago.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:20 | 5257644 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

Undoubtedly, a deep conspiracy. What out ! They're all out to get you !

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 19:37 | 5257919 oddjob
oddjob's picture

You sure have a lot to say.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:42 | 5256734 Spungo
Spungo's picture

This hot chick once asked me if I like bondage. I said "fuck yeah, I work for Blackrock" then walked away.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:45 | 5256748 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

I'm guessing this hot "chick" was named Lola.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:43 | 5256737 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

I can't wait 'til the part when the avalanche reaches Uncle Warren's infallible bank holdings.

https://tammyheff.files.wordpress.com/2013/01/calvin-hobbes.gif

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:45 | 5256752 Spungo
Spungo's picture

The fed still has ultimate control of the interest rates. If interest rates start to rise, the fed will open the discount window. The government can then borrow at no cost. The trick is that this needs to be kept a secret otherwise it might cause a bit of a panic, and countries will go to great lengths to avoid doing trade in dollars.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:53 | 5256795 Spitzer
Spitzer's picture

You are aware that ppl thought that in the 60's when rates were under 2% and gold was $35 eh ? And that was when the U.S. was still a creditor

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:24 | 5257665 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

LOL. And as they like to say, "and how did that work out, eh?".

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:08 | 5256873 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

Federal Reserve controls the short end (overnight)

 

Mr Market controls the long end

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:13 | 5256890 Catullus
Catullus's picture

Wrong.

The fed is not actually in control of interest rates. The primary and secondary markets are. The Fed can purchase this debt. But they don't otherwise control the clearing prices for bonds.

The discount window will not save the corporate bond market. Nor can corporate and particularly junk bonds be used as collateral to access the discount window. And hedge funds or mutual funds use the discount window. The discount window is for member banks of the Fed.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:39 | 5257020 Bell's 2 hearted
Bell's 2 hearted's picture

Federal Reserve opened to discount window to a slew of folks during the crisis.  Who can forget the "coincidence" of Warren Buffet's big investment in goldman sachs ... shortly before GS gained access to discount window.

Even harley davidson was in on it.

 

"But in the crisis, to support financial markets, we had to provide liquidity to nonbank financial institutions as well"

 

http://www.federalreserve.gov/newsevents/speech/kohn20100513a.htm

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:54 | 5256753 Mercury
Mercury's picture

Speaking of Blackrock and their concerns about FI liquidity...

 

A while back I posed the question as to whether or not illiquid financial instruments could really be made liquid by the miracle of securitization.

The short answer seems to be: only if/when the securitizing entity is actively buying the illiquid financial instruments in question.

It seems that this issue is now an acceptable thing to worry about in Polite Society. Matt Levine covers it here (featuring Blackrock's concerns) following the revelation that Pimco has been in the habit of buying odd-lot bonds for cheap (due to their illiquidity) in the marketplace, then marking them to model (higher) via a third-party pricing service in their always super-liquid ETF(s).

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:48 | 5256770 techstrategy
techstrategy's picture

The only way to re-liquify the system and maintain central bank solvency is for gold to go parabolic (assuming the central banks actually still have the gold).  If not, when they they will all get hung in the public square because it is the ONLY semi stable path.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:49 | 5256771 techstrategy
techstrategy's picture

The only way to re-liquify the system and maintain central bank solvency is for gold to go parabolic (assuming the central banks actually still have the gold).  If not, when they they will all get hung in the public square because it is the ONLY semi stable path.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:52 | 5256798 mayhem_korner
mayhem_korner's picture

 

 

The suppression of gold prices is the best indicator that Ft Knox is filled with 8,000 tonnes of Wonka bars and yellow-painted tungsten.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:04 | 5256856 Almost Solvent
Almost Solvent's picture

Bingo.

 

The gold was 'loaned' decades ago. When it's time to collect, we'll turn to the guy that 'owes' it to us, that guy will then turn to the next guy it got 'loaned' to until the last guy turns to see nothing there to collect.

 

Paper promises, paper deliveries. Once physical is demanded - the peasants will start to notice that the king is indeed naked. That's when the fun starts.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:31 | 5256985 cognus
cognus's picture

correct....  and even that is probably in disrepair, since nobody will ever be allowed in...  that is, nobody that will emerge and breathe air for very long

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:31 | 5256978 cognus
cognus's picture

it matters not whether the CB's "have gold".  since it is non-auditable, it only matters whether anyone believes or not.

"good faith and credit".  In fact, the mere fact that you bring up Gold impunes YOU as a "konspiracy Kook"!!

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:49 | 5256776 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

Articles like this are why CNN Money can EABOD.

Kudos, Tyler.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:57 | 5256823 Cheduba
Cheduba's picture

Hah! +10^6

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:28 | 5257673 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

10 and six carats ? is  that a lot ?

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 04:39 | 5258934 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

You must be a FORTRAN programmer, so I'll translate for you:  10 R = 10.0**6.0

C Which equals 10^6 (1000000.0)

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 14:50 | 5256778 starman
starman's picture

Inflation is a bitch and deflation is a cunt!

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:12 | 5258025 lotsoffun
lotsoffun's picture

i don't mind bitches if they've got hot cunts.  brings it on.  i'm stacked and ready.

bitches need to get paid too, and they tend to like cash and shiny relics.  somehow - not a lot of them like amex cards.

and i don't blame them (the bitches).

only greenspan takes amex, and i don't think many people really wanted to buy what he 'shoved down all of our throats'  (and i was meaning to be graphic, but thanks greeniebeenie, because that's what he did).

 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:09 | 5256880 Otto Zitte
Otto Zitte's picture

tick... tick... tick... 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:23 | 5256940 Lmo Mutton
Lmo Mutton's picture

Somebody needs to hedge some moar.

Long nail guns.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:24 | 5256946 astoriajoe
astoriajoe's picture

I jounced the limb.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:27 | 5256965 cognus
cognus's picture

Japan says we're nowhere near the precipice - not even close.

this knife edge can be walked a long, long, long ways.  likely longer than any here will live

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:34 | 5257000 cognus
cognus's picture

Here ya' go:  the Perfect Antidote to this Poisonous ChickenLIttle article that Ty had the gall to post -

:

 http://seekingalpha.com/article/2292095-need-7minus-8-percent-yields-in-...

 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 15:57 | 5257086 Duc888
Duc888's picture

Give each US citizen 1M backed by gold. Problem solved.

LOL.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:09 | 5257122 Salsipuedes
Salsipuedes's picture

I thought they were freaking out because they just figured out that "the truth will out"... eventually.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:11 | 5257134 Kreditanstalt
Kreditanstalt's picture

BRING IT ON!!!!    JUMP, you f---kers...!

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:31 | 5257683 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

now, now. calm yourself. try the de-caf. it tastes okay, really.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:25 | 5257192 Downtoolong
Downtoolong's picture

How this ends... the hedges start to fail

Ha Ha Fink, you sucker, it’s payback time. Remember me, the London Whale Master? Well you now own the New York Godzilla.

Jamie D.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:25 | 5257196 esum
esum's picture

the house of cards............... now the wind..............

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 08:04 | 5259139 AdvancingTime
AdvancingTime's picture

When this house goes down it will take down the house net door.  The more and more I study derivatives it now appears the main goal of QE may have been to hold up the underlying value of assets that feed into and support the massive derivative market more than help the economy.

QE has up to now stopped an implosion of derivatives and the resulting contagion and shock that would have spread throughout the financial system. In postponing this collapse the Fed has created a whole slew of new problems. More on this subject in the article below.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/03/derivatives-house-of-cards.html

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 16:42 | 5257286 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

i'm guessing all that hedging is free. /s

good for you jack [/gary]

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 17:23 | 5257439 nbsharma
nbsharma's picture

tyler, this is one of the most important posts. i think a lot of weak companies, who probably should go bankrupt, have taken advantage of low-interest rates to sell corporate bonds to keep the charade going on for a while.

the real stock-picking in this current environment is to identify who these companies are, and initiate a short.

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 08:01 | 5259131 AdvancingTime
AdvancingTime's picture

The low interest rates is a "oneoff" bonus to many companies. This one tine bonus flowed directly to their bottom-line as profits.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:11 | 5257620 Ban KKiller
Ban KKiller's picture

Can't we just add more chairs and put in a few more bullets?

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 18:32 | 5257689 SAT 800
SAT 800's picture

Let's invite the Sabines to a new Religous festival, and tell them to bring their wives and daughters.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:07 | 5258013 GrinandBearit
GrinandBearit's picture

Tomorrow will most likely retrace most/all of today's loss.

Total mind-fuck market.

 

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 20:48 | 5258137 p00k1e
p00k1e's picture

“How this ends... the hedges start to fail”

It’s all vaporware.  Try to have a paid-off house.  At least you can burn before the taxman seizes the place.

Hoard numbers into the thousands are going to be pissed and want to kill you for being you.  

Obama already booted old-stock generals and has begun filling rank and file with illegals.  

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 07:56 | 5259128 AdvancingTime
AdvancingTime's picture

 It might soon become apparent the economic efficiency of credit is beginning to collapse and the additional money poured into the system coupled with lower rates can no longer drive the economy forward.  When this happens we are at the end game.

At some point the return on loaning money is simply not worth the risk!  Why do you want to loan money if most likely you will never be repaid or repaid with something that is totally worthless? When this happens the only safe place to store wealth will be in "tangible assets" and the only lenders will be those who print the money that nobody wants.

The collapse of credit can pose major problems such as what we saw when many sellers were forced to demand payment up front before shipping goods in 2008. More on this subject below.

http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/06/the-economic-efficiency-of-credit...

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 21:49 | 5258314 OhNo
OhNo's picture

I'm starting to think Zeroshit is part of the Problem-Reaction-Solution with a whole lot of intellectual bullshit.

Thu, 09/25/2014 - 22:12 | 5258366 OhNo
OhNo's picture

I'm starting to think Zeroshit is part of the Problem-Reaction-Solution with a whole lot of Intellectual bullshit.Its easy-all Lizards and there Allies need to be exterminated of the face of this planet once and for all,Or humanity will never have peace.

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 07:54 | 5259124 AdvancingTime
AdvancingTime's picture

 If the economy was healthy and balanced we would not be experiencing slow growth while massive amounts of money are being printed and poured into the system. The crux of our problem remains in the fact that both people and governments have lived beyond their means by taking on debt they cannot repay. Over the last several decades we have created entitlement societies built on the back of the industrial revolution, technological advantages, capital accumulated from the colonial era, and the domination of global finances.

Promises were made on the assumption that the advantages we enjoyed would continue in both Europe and the US. Ever greater prosperity and entitlements were to be sustained through debt financed consumption growth. In that eerie fantasy world, debt fueled consumption was to be the catalyst to bring about evermore growth. Debt does matter and the following article delves deeper into why kicking the can down the road will ultimately fail.

 http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/08/modern-monetary-theory-is-wrong-d...

Fri, 09/26/2014 - 09:29 | 5259370 Ewtman
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