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Spot The Total Logic Fail
It appears the leadership in Spain has reached its panic-point. Following Catalonia's President Artur Mas signing of a decree calling for an ultimately democratic referendum on independence for the region, Spanish Prime Minister Rajoy uttered this mind-numbing phrase:
- CATALAN VOTE PROFOUNDLY ANTI-DEMOCRATIC, RAJOY SAYS
It appears Rajoy's perspective on democracy and the will of the people is a little different as the situation has become serious enough that he has gone full-Juncker.
"Catalonia wants to speak," he said after signing on Saturday. "Wants to be heard. Wants to vote. Now is the right time and we have the right legal framework to do so."
The referendum's two questions
"Do you want Catalonia to be a state?"
"If so, do you want Catalonia to be an independent state?"
Soon after the decree was signed, the Catalan hash tag EstemConvocats9N ("We called it for 9 November") became the highest trending topic on Spanish Twitter.
Until recently, few Catalans had wanted full independence, but Spain's painful economic crisis has seen a surge in support for separation, correspondents say.
There is resentment over the proportion of Catalan taxes used to support poorer regions.
And Rajoy is clearly concerned...
- *CATALONIA GOVT HAS TAKEN UNILATERAL DECISIONS, RAJOY SAYS
- *SPAIN TO CHALLENGE CATALAN INDEPENDENCE VOTE, RAJOY SAYS
- *CATALAN VOTE WON'T HAPPEN, IS AGAINST CONSTITUTION: RAJOY
- *CATALAN VOTE IS AGAINST RIGHTS OF SPANISH CITIZENS: RAJOY
Then followed that up these 2 stunners!!!
- *CATALAN VOTE PROFOUNDLY ANTI-DEMOCRATIC, RAJOY SAYS
- *LAWS CAN CHANGE THROUGH DEMOCRATIC MEANS, RAJOY SAYS
And concluded...
- *CATALONIA STILL HAS TIME TO CHANGE COURSE, RAJOY SAYS
- *DIALOGUE OVER CATALONIA MUST RESPECT THE LAW, RAJOY SAYS
- *CATALONIA'S MAS MUST COMPLY WITH THE LAW, RAJOY SAYS
So in summary:
1. The Catalans want to exercise a right to democratically vote for their independence.
2. But Spanish PM Rajoy say a vote is anti-democratic and against the law
3. And then adds that laws can be changed through democratic means... (like voting for independence?)
Lost in translation?
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California Governor Vetoes Bill Requiring Warrants for Drone Surveillance - MarketWatch
Rights? what are those.
The userper demands that they keep their important "job".
RIPS
IMPORTANT ARTICLE
The Newest Issue of Foreign Affairs (official NWO organ) has a series of articles about how the Tea Party, et al, Globally Must Be Co-Opted as they represent a threat to "liberal" democracy (read Progressive) due to falling employment, immigration,inflation, falling wages, etc.
READ THIS
http://www.propagandamatrix.com/articles/september2014/290914_co_opt.htm
We need a new constitution: Here’s how we save American democracy from charlatans, loudmouths and the 1 percent - Salon.com
The EU is frightened since they know even with vote rigging, Catalan separatists will win. Spain is a failed state. Expect more full retart statements by EU politicians.
was in spain recently, the tension was so thick you could cut it with a knife. Unless the vote is rigged, they have a much better chance of a yes vote then scotland
The Catalans language is distinct from Spanish, and they have a cohesive identity. Moreover, Spain is an endless economic disaster in progress. They will leave given the opportunity.
Why should anyone's life be held hostage by someone else's beliefs?
Spain's "Constitutional Court" suspends Catalan voting.
Because when it gets serious, you have to stop the vote.
http://headlines.ransquawk.com/headlines/spain-s-constitutional-court-su...
That's the kind of shit that precipitates revolutions.
It's just one step beyond what the U.S. does. Here in the States people get to vote, but Harry Reid still goes into office...despite evidence to the contrary.
It only matters who counts the votes...
Democracy only "works" when it provides the desired results. everyone knows that leadership, be it democratic or otherwise, believes itself the possessor of benevolent wisdom and incumbent to lead the people (sheeple) to their own best interests whether they want it or not.
Spain's "Constitutional Court"
A constitution is the modern day equivalent to the "Divine Right of the King".
A fiction that is a declaration of enslavement.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/fiction
Word History: To most people "the latest fiction" means the latest novels or stories rather than the most recently invented pretense or latest lie. All three senses of the word fiction point back to its source, Latin ficti, "the action of shaping, a feigning, that which is feigned." Ficti in turn was derived from fingere, "to make by shaping, feign, make up or invent a story or excuse." Our first instance of fiction, recorded in a work composed around 1412, was used in the sense "invention of the mind, that which is imaginatively invented."
A constitution is the modern day equivalent to the "Divine Right of the King".
A fiction that is a declaration of enslavement.
This is a powerful statement, and I agree. Constitutions are being proven absolutely useless as long as there are people in power who are more than willing to pursue exactly the opposite course of that written on the paper. What the system of government is doesn't matter to the old dictum that power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Until the people of whatever political entity we choose to talk about rise up and take back their own God-given rights (this involves direct confrontation with the power structure, not asking it nicely), those who "rule" them will take as much power as they are able to. A piece of paper is less than a speed bump to people who are so sure they are "the good guys."
Which of you are going to buy Catalonian debt for financing their democratic but defit welfare state?
/rethoric question
Viva la Pepa!
TIS sez: "Because when it gets serious, you have to stop the vote."
Exactly so, Truth. If you can't rig the result because of overwhelming numbers against you, then the vote will be stopped. They like it much better when the outcome is projected to be "close." Then, Plan A kicks into effect: Ballot-Box Buffoonery.
Because when it gets serious, you have to stop the vote, or discredit the opposition to tilt the outcome in your favor...
Liechtenstein informa de que Artur Mas estaría ligado a 'negocios ilegales' de los Pujol
Or make them vote again like they did in Ireland.
France will shit too, as Catalans are on both sides of the border. Then there's the Basques, Navarenes, Galicians...
I bet they'll all have Salmond's notion of sticking two fingers up at their part of the national debt, too.
'Unless the vote is rigged, they have a much better chance of a yes vote then scotland'
You are right because the money goes in the other direction.
Talk about some Progressive-Socialist screed! -1
The only good idea was term limits for Senators, Reps and especially the SCOTUS!
Add another amendment: "Congress shall make no Law abridging the freedom of production or trade."
Rajoy then also said...
War is Peace
...and some other stuff...
As long as nobody decides to divide by zero everything will be okay.
WAR IS PEACE
FREEDOM IS SLAVERY
IGNORANCE IS STRENGTH
democracy is dictatorship ?
wow , shit is really getting sideways
Dogs and cats, living together! Mass hysteria!
Scary... but not in the least bit surprising. Already saw it on some level with the US tea party movement. What started out well-meaning was hijacked by the right and then completely marginalized by the left. Mission accomplished.
How about we use "FWO" (Fascist World Order) instead of NWO? Because, as pointed out by another prescient ZH commenter, anyone alive has been born into it, and thus there's nothing new about it.
Make sense to me, anyway.
Yes but it is really fascism or are they using fascism as a means to reach their goal of full on communism?
The corporates are not owned by the governments (communism), more the other way round think huge donations and lobbyists to have laws that benefit major donors against competition. Laws that are too expensive for small companies to comply with so they go out of business. Laws against collecting your own rainwater or growing your own food ...
The government is owned by the corporates = fascism.
Look at the "revolving door" between corporates and government, endless wars on .... that are only to terrorise the people into agreeing more military spending ....
If you still can't see it then please go back to dancing with stars and shelter in place until you are called.
According to the Rothschild banksters and their pol and crat farm managers: "You have the rights of any farm animal--pull the plow, eat your gruel, make more farm animals, be eaten."
An American, not US subject.
"In a brief veto message, Brown said that although there are some situations where a warrant would be appropriate."
Some situations where a warrant would be appropriate? WOW! And this guy used to be the California AG?
We are more screwed than I even thought.
"Brown said that although there are some situations where a warrant would be appropriate."
When reading that, just picture a real estate sign sticking out of his ass with "sold" plastered all over it.
An American, not US subject.
Posted on my guillotine: "Treason Macht Frei."
The opposite of "Lefts".
Hence the reason every progressive will fight against "rights" at all costs.
The liberals and Democrats have been allowing the Brown klan to run California for a large part of the past 50 years. Freaking retard liberals and Democrats.
Surrounded by geniuses, we is!
What's going to be absolutely awesome and terrifying at the same time going forward, is watching as this idea that globalism and liberal democracy was ever anything but a complete disguise for tyranny, and as that exposure becomes more and more pervasive, watching all the hopey and feel good politicians of love, peace, and diversity, turn into little mini Mussolini's!!!
It's already happened actually, with the Prez leading the transformation, now dipshits like Brown have the cover to follow suit!! That cocksucker once sat at a party I was at in the Bay Area, before he was even Mayor of Oakland and spouted on for an hour about "what this Country needed was a revolution" and he was a "recovering politician" and some other great shit about the "charade of racial politics" etc etc, it was just unreal looking back on it, considering what the fucker is currently doing in CA!!!
Think of how difficult it is to prove voter fraud in a small state. Once we have global democracy, the oligarchs will "win" every election 51-49. Shucks, the opposition almost won. Came up just shy. Better luck in the next election. Rinse and repeat.
"...it was just unreal looking back on it,..."
Think about the psychology behind that: He sits at a party, identifies the prevalent attitudes in the room, and then instinctively and reflexively begins spouting lies and bullshit to lull, patronize, and placate those around him.
Scary, and why the guillotine is so needed.
An American, not US subject.
"Think of the guillotine as an 'off-button' for bullshit."
No offense, as I generally agree with you, but the guillotine thing is both disgusting and getting old. This is America. What is wrong with shooting or hanging? Why do we have to get all Frenchified and talk about guillotines?
An American, not a frog.
Long tar and feathers!!!
Thank you for the feedback.
"Guillotine" is actually a literary device that is designed to get people to be more open to the eventual notion of Retribution and punishment of these criminals.
Saying, "They all need put up against a wall and shot," or, "They need hung 'till dead from the nearest tree," is too crude and has too many words. They are also too hard to work into sarcasm.
I.e. I am practicing using the tools of propaganda that power uses to influence people's thinking. And the goal is "think" not agreement.
Probably has little impact here on ZH, but the experience and sometimes feedback here assists me for when I am speaking to the sheeple face to face and when writing more substantive pieces.
Ditto, "American, not US subject." I am not saying, "I'm American, and you are not," I am saying to my fellow Americans, that there is a difference between them and the criminal DC US government occupiers of the American country--You, we, are not the US, on the contrary, you, we, are American citizens of the American country, not subjects of the criminal US government--We make and eat our own cake.
It is also an exclamation to the world that while we Americans do share some responsibility for the DC US' crimes against them, it is mostly they, the criminals of the DC US, and not us, the American people, who are committing the crimes.
However, there is then another motivation for taking action as an American against the DC US--it is mine, and our, responsibility to acknowledge what they are doing to the rest of the world and stop them, not to just stop them from doing what they are doing to us.
An American, not US subject.
Hey, I'm all in favor of using an industrial wood chipper/shredder as a 21st century guillotine.
Very painful when fed in by the feet, and automatic fertilizer for the garden.
Sir Wood Chipper,
Go for it.
An American, not US subject.
"Anyone that has seen Fargo will never forget the wood chipper scene.
Translations: "You can't leave, as who will pay your share of our Rothschild pound of flesh?"
An American, not US subject.
Stated policy: Democracy
Unstated policy: Control
Caulking compound: Propaganda
In order to save democracy...we had to install a dictator.
Sounds like something Yogi Berra would say.
Well, think of it this way.
Before Lincoln could free the slaves*, they had to be sold into slavery
So quitchur bitchin', everybody
*not
More like a Bush...
".. to save the free market, we have to abandon free market principles"
Somehow I'm thinking that somebody is forcing regions in countries to break up to create some sort of bad bank good bank, bad country, good country deal.
No way that now everybody gets to break up at the same time!
http://www.realworldorder.net/
time for Spanish Civil War 11 the Internet Movie
Obama should ship arms to both sides.
War is Peace
Freedom is Slavery
Ignorance is Strength
Voting is Anti-Democratic
Big brother loves you
The love comes from telescreens
Excerpt from http://www.studymode.com/essays/1984-The-Watchful-Eyes-Of-Big-1685952.html
There are many techniques used to control the people of Oceania, such as propaganda and memory hole. The one in which seems to be the most effective is the placement of telescreens on every street, in every house and building, which are used to watch each persons every move and to deliver information to the citizens.
I'm affraid the smart phone devices will serve for this purpose much better. Orwell would be pleased how good his fiction was going to match reality.
I don't think he'd be pleased at all.
The more integrated the European Union becomes, the easier it will be for smaller states to gain independence from the sovereign, but remain under the supranational umbrella of the EU. It won't be long before we see states such Catalonia, Flemish Belgium, Venetio.. gain independence from their respective national sovereign. The EU has removed the need for several layers of heirarchy. Why answer to a sovereign, who answers to the EU, when the sovereign can be bypassed.
+1 !
As power flows to Brussels, people view their national governments with increased suspicion. The European project has the intended consequence of making national governments weaker and Brussels and Bankers stronger.
And as banks and Eurocrats gain power, people grow alienated from their less-fortunate or less industrious "countrymen". Flemish resent Wallonia, those in Veneto resent Sicilians, Catalans resent Valencia and Andalusia, etc.
Younger people in particular prefer separation because they've seen the epic failure of national government. Young Scots voted "Yes". Why should young Catalans vote "No". They were not born when the current Spanish Constituion was written. But they sure as hell have suffered from the massive looting by the Spanish elite in the prelude to the Crisis.
http://www.realworldorder.net/
The Greek Council of State, through a short announcement, has officially confirmed the propaganda by the neoliberal banking-media dictatorship in Greece. As expected, not a single word has been said by the mainstream media mouthpieces about this: “An organised propaganda campaign is being waged in various publications, TV shows and social media against the functioning of the Council of State, which has been criticised by the the IMF over its 'adverse court rulings' that represent 'downside risks' for the country's austerity programme.” “The head of the country’s supreme administrative court has claimed that an organised campaign is being waged by the media against his institution and that this 'propaganda' could have implications for the independence of the body.” “In a communiqué issued to judges and other officials on July 2, the Council of State’s president, Sotiris A Rizos, refers to the existence of a “campaign of publications, TV shows and social media” targeting the institution. 'The propaganda is being exercised in an organised manner and could potentially harm the freedom of judgment of the judiciary and, eventually, cause irreparable harm to the judicial work of the court,' he added.” “This would serve to reduce the willingness of judges to offer legal protection to citizens, the communiqué continued, which was published on the court’s website.”http://failedevolution.blogspot.gr/2014/07/greece-media-propaganda-offic...
Look, we already know that Greece is a non state at this point. Nothing from over there is really news.
Looking at Greece is looking into future..
You think we had a crisis? Wait until the derivatives crisis
I hope they have better luck than we did in 1861. We are not yet finished though.
Yes it appears Appomattox was just halftime. Just sorry I will be to old to be anything more than collateral loss
Water rationing hits California: limit of 50 gallons per person per day or face fines of $500 - NaturalNews.com
But building new houses and allowing new people into the state is the solution.
California needs a few million more illegals to fix their water shortage.
Never go full retard
I bet we get a shot at this in the USA in the next couple of years.....I could see Texas trying it....I would wish California would
=> vote to secede
=> be voted "off the island"
California is controlled by Mexico now.
critical thinking was tossed out the window long, long, ago
Animal Farm
Subjects have never voted themselves freedom, nor will they be allowed to this time. The election will be a fraud like in Scotland.
As n Anarchist/Libertarian. I cannot even begin to understand the minds of those who reject independence.
Do they fear responsibility for themselves? Or has the Free Shit they are promised bought the elections?
When the Free Shit stops arriving, perhaps then I hope to see the change in heart I believe is coming.
I say I because in the end, there is no we.
in the end, we are all one.
No Scotland wasn't a fraud if anything it illuminated some hard truths people are trying to not face.
With that said I can see why people like Rajoy are nervous about this one. You have the muslim factor at play here. If Catalonia goes you can bet shit stirrers like Qatar and other Sunni groups will be stirring up trouble if Andalusia also goes afterwards. That is where the majority of muslims reside in Spain. Then the Brits get sucked into it whether they want to be involved or not because Gilbratar. That is a strategic entryway into the Mediterranean sea. Think of the ramifications if it is muslim controlled for Europe.
Aye Gus however the new popular front in Scotland is receiving a delegation of the Taliban for a chin wag on going forward. We tried to bring in Al Nusrah but they informed us that the US gubbermint had booked them right up until Nov. 2016
Fuckin amateur..,
Hey Rajoy, you wanna beat that referendum? Listen to your pal George.
Call in a press conference on primetime.
Wear a nice fancy suit.
Tell them if Catalonia wont be longer part of the spanish republic the FC Barcelona wont be part of the Primera Division either.
Thank me later.
You have my bank details.
Yours truly
George
Soros? DIE!
EBay to lay off 1,600 employees, cites economy - ABC News
We really have gone full Orwell in our political language since 9/11 if not before.
My god, the amount of otherwise intelligent, decent people who actually believe Israeli violence on Gaza and Lebanon in the past 10 years is "defense" is profoundly depressing. How can one have a strong opinion so at odds with the facts?
Bias, I suppose. The ongoing villification of Arabs/Muslims in the media is another {helped of course, by *actual* Islamic extremism - whether or not actually enabled/funded by the US and its allies.}
Yeah, Born in the shadows of the holocaust, Israel is only surrounded by hordes of Islamic psychos who have attacked them relentlessly since 1950, bent on their total destruction. How paranoid can they get?
http://www.salon.com/2014/07/14/our_endless_war_on_terror_the_truth_behi...
Nice rhetoric.
Here's a book you might read:
http://www.amazon.com/Ethnic-Cleansing-Palestine-Ilan-Pappe/dp/185168467...
They're "surrounded" because they forced their way in and ethnically cleansed 750k natives, razing and renaming aroun 400 villages. Israel was born in Zionist terrorism and has continued to kill thousands of people every decade. Armed to the teeth with nukes and subs and tanks - it ceaselessly cries "defense" to the cheers of credulous, racist louts such as youtself.
not that you give a shit about that though, right?
Palaestinians are louts that are just as bad and with as much blood on their hands. Not even their own Muzzie neighbors want anything to do with them except to waste their lives to harrass Israel.
They don't pay for them and they won't absorb them. No one should cry over Pelstinians who don't cry over anybody else, not even their own.
You've gone full retard there I see. How many Jews live in Palestinian controlled lands? ZERO (out of a total population of ~3 million). How many Arabs live in Israel? 1.5 million (out of a total population of ~8 million). Who receives constant free shit at the expense of Israeli taxpayers? Those same 1.5 million. Ever walk around a campus of an Israeli university? If you have you'd have heard and seen semi literate Arab kids straight out of high school (no compulsory military or national service like the jewish kids) attending clases and strolling along pathways and frolicking on grassy knolls FOR FREE. At the behest of progressive fucks like yourself. Ever walk around the intensive care units or rehab facilities or any one of the dozens of other wings of Israeli hospitals? You'd see and hear a disproportionate amount of Arabs enjoying quality healthcare FOR FREE. Ever walk by the claims desks in any national insurance-bituah leumi office (Israeli equivalent of SS+Medicaid +Medicare )? Again you'll see a disproportionate amount of Arabs submitting requests for and/or collecting welfare checks with relatively large sums written out to them in the beloved Israeli shekel. Ever visit an Israeli government office and dealt with some obtuse bureaucrat? There's a more than 25% chance he/she will be an Arab, well, because Israeli career politicians believe in "equality " as much, if not more than their braindead counterparts in the US and EU and have via an equivalent of affirmative action hired him/her.
You know what happens to an Arab who makes the financially wise decision of selling land to Jews (who pay top shekel for otherwise undesirable land)? He gets shot up along with some of his family in the town square. Sometimes it's televised.
Go fuck yourself.
Oh and if you're going to refer us to an Israeli historian at least make it one who doesn't have the ebonics equivalent of Hebrew that the sexually molested, London residing, neo-leninist Pappe possesses. For starters you might have tried Benny Morris. At least he has a minimal grasp of the language of the land it's history he attempts to cover. But then you'd have to deal with facts, eh?
When you can dismiss every single criticism as "anti-Semitic" - doesn't that tend to make one act completely amorally, if not immorally?
You bet it does.
Bastard Israelis are best known for hiding in their mosques, hospitals, schools, and using their own children as human shields.
So those Orwellian evil-doers will do just about anything.... even hire stupid dupes to troll the internet for propaganda to give them cover......
Getting kicked-out of the Euro will be the best thing that ever happened to thje Iberian Peninsula.
Don't piss off the thought police comrades
Note to airlines: don't fly over Catalonian airspace for awhile.
Rajoy would welcome them as a separate state as long as they keep paying taxes to Spain for "military protection".
Sorry Catalans......there's no f'n way. Have not we learned by now how many "votes" TPTB lose? None.
Gott vom Himmel is that PROPER CUNT RARANOJOY as corrupt a member of the Cabal as they come not in prison yet?
What crime does a Cabal , Troika member have to commit to appear before the Fool Rule of Law? (that's a rhetorical question by the way as we ALL know they have unlimited access to the full flotilla of heinous skulduggery ). It's in the genes/bones.
“CATALAN VOTE PROFOUNDLY ANTI-DEMOCRATIC”.
Well, of course. He forgot to declare that those who want independence are also mentally deranged, as the English regarded American rebels; and Judeo-Bolsheviks regard dissidents.
Besides that, don’t get your hopes up even if there is a vote and it supports independence. For, there may be a hand full of Catalans who understand what “democracy” means, if your cause is liberty; even Americans don’t understand it. And, without knowledge of historically-proven procedures of liberty, all efforts in that direction will be nothing more than missions of suicide.
You see, Americans have the power to redress any grievance that could be named (which is the security of liberty), and they refuse to use that power. Actually, every man on the planet has this power; but only the white man has a history (a well-hidden history, to be sure) of using it; all other colors of men have been more genetically modified than the white man to be slaves, and are, thus, less capable, and less desiring, of freedom than the white man.
So, all men have this power, and none use it. There are three main reasons for this failure: one is that they have no knowledge of such power; the second, they’ve been herded into a kind of impotent stupor by medication and indoctrination; the third, that they aid, benefit or were complicit in such evil (full article).
In addition, there is hardly an American who knows ideals won by the Revolution.
For example, Founders repeatedly declared the co-called right of consent: that no man was obligated to obey any law or pay any tax unless he gave his personal consent to such. Did they really mean that? Of course they did. They had been living by those rules from the first English settlement to the Revolution. That is, according to the origin of English/American law, “laws” and “taxes” originated in contracts between various assemblies and those who petitioned for redress of grievances. Terms of such contracts were sometimes referred to as “laws” and money payments as “taxes”. And, no one but petitioners were obligated to obey or pay such “laws” or “taxes”; that is, all non-petitioners were exempt from such. Further, when redress was completed, such “laws” and ‘taxes” were extinguished.
When you realize the significance of this right of consent, you will discovery that there is hardly a constitutional tax on the books.
Today we no longer live according to American law: for, petitioners make themselves exempt from laws and taxes necessitated by their redress while all non-petitioners are saddled with such burdens. For example, when munitions makers, big banks, and Main Stream Media wish for another war, they petition Congress, Congress grants authority for the war, petitioners receive the booty of war and non-petitioners are stiffed with the expenses (thru payment of taxes and lives of their male children). This inversion of American law is generally known as Persian law, law of the conqueror, law of the high seas, mouth law, martial law, ecclesiastical law… it goes by many names.
And so it will continue unopposed until a few Americans (1%-2%) learn lessons of their Founders; the same for any other men.
The vote will only be allowed by Madrid if is is guaranteed to fail...SSDD
Spain can't have the hand that feeds be cut off. It's as simple as that. It would blow up Spain, and by extension the EU and the banking system.
Yeah so what's the Problema?
Tiz doing ever so wonderfully well under the current troika disciples at moment JA?
Catatonia.
How dare you Catalonian rubes want "independence". Don't you know we apparatchiks here in Brussels know what's best for you? Rules are for the little people; now get back to making our salaries.
www.traderzoo.mobi
Ever since the international court of justice in the Hague declared that there was nothing illegal about Kosovo declaring independence (without saying that the independence iself was legitimate or not) everybody and his cat can now basically call for independence. That doesn't make independence itself legal but the call for it is indeed not illegitimate. Catalonia uses Kosovo (which is not recognized by Spain) as an example.
We support the Catalans and their independence movement. We want an independent South for our posterity. www.leagueofthesouth.com
We might be relations. My maiden great aunt was Cullman County's Miss Cegenation of 1923.
The EU will fail within 18 months. Probably less.
Rajoy's comments look like he's preparing to round people up and arrest them.
SINCE WHEN IT IS A LEGAL RIGHT, PART OF DEMOCRACY, TO CHOOSE TO FORM YOUR OWN COUNTRY???!!!...
WHICH IS BASICALLY EQUIVALENT TO SAYING YOU DON T WANT TO PAY TAXES ANYMORE...
FOR US CITIZENS YOU JUST NEED TO GIVE UP YOUR NATIONALITY...
WELL THEN, I GUESS CATALANS CAN START MOVING ABROAD IF THEY RE NOT HAPPY BEING A PART OF SPAIN...
So you Catalanistan Bowsers wanna make local free independent decisions with zero consideration for bankster booty skim?
I will wager that no Catalans active in this movement were of age in July 1936. This will not end well.
Many old people there remember and they passed it on to next generations.They know how they were oppressed and not allowed to speak their language.
I know people in Catalunya and the feeling for independence is widespread. I am not Spanish but speak the language but I don't speak Catalan. In some villages in Catalunya some older people don't even want to reply to you when you address them in Spanish.
It is hard to imagine that nowadays in 2014 something like this could not end well. But when that initial thought slips away then you realize that in this mad world with geopolitical and geo-energy conflicts chances are that this indeed will not end well. The PP comes forth out of the Franco government and there are some really strong fanatics in that party. As an Ecuadorian friend of mine living in Barcelona says: "Spain is in many respects still a very conservative and Franquista country".
Over twenty years ago I fell instantly in love with a beautiful little Catalan girl in Paris. She was so fair and freckled that I thought she was Irish! So even at my advanced age I may follow Hemingway's example if the people call. But she is probably a fat dumpy old grandmother by now.
Eventually we all turn into fat old grandmothers/fathers or as ZH says: everyone's survival rate drops to zero. But going down memory lane and relive those moments of passion gives warmth and comfort. It is important in live to collect fond memories!
this is pure and simple the EU's interpretation of democracy
To All my Subjects.........
Go fuck yourself. This is MY country, not yours. You have no say, now shut up and go buy something.
Everybody is throwing the word democracy at each other's head. Nonetheless, Rajoy seems to either have gone full Orwellian or to have lost his marbles. All of them, the American and EU "leaders" are part of the same worthless bunch. Stupidity levels are astonishing, and I am beginning to doubt they fake that.
The Spanish are amongst the worst in Europe, BTW. There is no progressivist gobbledegook they won't swallow lock, stock and barrel. As a result, they don't give a hoot about sounding half-sane anymore. It's more sad than funny. Imagine a country where they can have serious TV evening debates about, for instance, using human male sperm for facial beauty masks, and where on top, the female hostess is a transvestite... That's Spain.
Moar Spanish bombs.
The Spaniards will send in the army as any vote cannot be rigged to the degree required. Then there will charges of treason, arrests etc.
If Catalonia does break apart then issues about debt and what their portion is etc will precipitate a Euro breakup or a German walk out.
Democracy is undemocratic, left is right, black is white and war is peace, 2 + 2 can be 5. WTF happned to this world?