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Meanwhile In Kiev...

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Not satisfied with fighting pro-Russian separatists, Ukrainians are fighting among themselves in Kiev. As RT reports, Kiev police deployed additional forces around the parliament building after a group of demonstrators started throwing smoke bombs and firecrackers at guards in an apparent reprisal over MPs' failure to honor past nationalists. More than 15 officers have been hurt as far-right protesters clash with riot police at the government buildings on the anniversary of UPA (Ukrainian Insurgent Army). Perhapa more troubling is, if this is the internal tension now, how bad will it get in the winter when they are freezing as Ukraine says it won't prepay for Russian gas.

 

 

Bats, Chains, and firecrackers...

 

As RT reports,

The protesters launched their offensive shortly after Ukrainian MPs voted against considering a bill, which would treat Ukrainian nationalists, who fought against Soviet troops during World War II, as war veterans.

 

 

Tuesday is the anniversary of the UPA (Ukrainian Insurgent Army), an armed Ukrainian nationalist organization that at one point during the war sided with the Nazis to fight against Russian troops. The organization was accused of war crimes, including the killings of Jews and Poles in Ukraine, and was hunted down after Moscow fought off the Nazi invasion and took control of Ukraine again.

 

 

Modern Ukrainian nationalists from the Svoboda party are celebrating the anniversary with rallies across the country. The party's flags as well as those of the radical Right Sector movement can be seen in the crowd of people encircling the parliament building.

 

 

The bill, which the MPs decided not to consider on Tuesday, would give surviving members of the UPA benefits similar to those given to war veterans. Incidentally, it was submitted by the Svoboda party.

The scenes are ugly...

 

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Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:38 | 5328277 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture

 

 

Oh yeah....I almost forgot about all that crap.

 

I guess I'm just getting crisis-ed out.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:41 | 5328289 negative rates
negative rates's picture

Yeah, even this won't end well.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:42 | 5328300 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

note the black and red flags

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:49 | 5328324 stilletto
stilletto's picture

What do those flags signify? They are not the flags of the Eastern separatists.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:56 | 5328335 philipat
philipat's picture

Putin to Nuland: "You want it? It's yours. Now pay for it, including our $5 Billion arrears in gas payments and advance payments for the upcoming winter". Love, Vlad.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:58 | 5328358 pods
pods's picture

That chain is good for 1 strike, then you get your ass pummeled by the other 50 cops while you try and reset for another strike.

pods

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:17 | 5328731 Uchtdorf
Uchtdorf's picture

Why don't those 50 nail him while he's winding up?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:35 | 5328795 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

As the economy circles down the IMF toilet bowl, so will the Ukies turn on each other as diminishing resources are increasingly appropriated by a corrupt oligarchy and international banksters.

It will be easy in a few months to tell the difference between Ukies and Russians. The Ukies will be the ones jumping up and down to keep warm.

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:39 | 5328835 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

..As for the guy with the chain, swinging it at the cops: coming to an USSA neighborhood near you.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 13:41 | 5329392 Metalredneck
Metalredneck's picture

Never.  Way to fat & anaesthetized.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 14:20 | 5329634 COSMOS
COSMOS's picture

LOL, in the USA that dude with the chain would die in a hail of bullets a thousand times more in number than the links on his chain. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:16 | 5328736 phaedrus1952
phaedrus1952's picture

One strike at best. Simply stepping into (and thus under) any overhead strike with a weapon both nullifies its effect and leaves the attacker extremely vulnerable.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 14:21 | 5329638 COSMOS
COSMOS's picture

If I was a cop and that dude swung that chain, he would drop to the ground before that chain even started coming down, I would cap his ass.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 18:23 | 5331071 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Do Ukrainian police carry firearms?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:58 | 5328363 Headbanger
Headbanger's picture

Red and black flags symbolize  Anarcho-synicalism:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anarcho-syndicalism

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:00 | 5328373 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

correct colours, wrong slant

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:09 | 5328410 Manthong
Manthong's picture

..couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of U.S. backed crazy fascists.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:37 | 5328539 thamnosma
thamnosma's picture

However, the Ukraine was the center of anti-Bolshevik anarchist resistance, e.g. Machno.  Anarchism has a strong, very strong, recent history among the Ukrainians.  While that flag may indeed represent the Ukrainian Independence Party of WWII times, one should keep in mind the anarchist movements of WWI era.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:02 | 5328660 conscious being
conscious being's picture

Re. WWI Ukraine anarchists

In the present conflict, the anarchists are on the NovoRussian side. Like this guy who wants all oligarchs out, dead or alive - Alexey Mozgovoi [Commander of 'Ghost Brigade', People's Republic of Lugansk]

You might like this - History of the Makhnovist Movement (1918-1921) http://theanarchistlibrary.org/library/peter-arshinov-history-of-the-mak...

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:45 | 5328577 Debugas
Debugas's picture

probably the flag is of nationalist party

http://www.vexillographia.ru/ukraine/images/kun4.gif

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:39 | 5328547 1000yrdstare
1000yrdstare's picture

"Were an Anarcho-syndicalyst commune"....Dennis the peasant

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dOOTKA0aGI0

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:21 | 5329027 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

The Catholic Church loves both colors:  Red and Black.  Just look at the dress code of Priests (black) and Cardinals (red).

Now that the Pope/Mope had opened the Door* to Gays in the Church, Church-sponsored Anarchists can now be called Analchists.

* Which door, the front or back door?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 14:09 | 5329552 Diogenes of Sinope
Diogenes of Sinope's picture

The red and black are the flags of Stepan Bandera.  Just one of Nazi factions in our new democratic Ukraine.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stepan_Bandera

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:53 | 5328336 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Let me guess - they're not anarchists.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:58 | 5328351 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

excellent! correct, though many still don't get it even in Ukraine. it's blood and soil. better known in German, "Blut und Boden" (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_and_Soil)

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:12 | 5328428 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

Thanks for the link.  That might have implications to the present movements we are starting to see in the US...

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:20 | 5328464 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Just remember that in the US, black and red (or black and white, or just plain black) flags are generally waved by anarchists.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:22 | 5328469 thamnosma
thamnosma's picture

Not surprising since it's the flag of independent forces from Western Ukraine that fought ALL foreign occupiers -- Russians, Poles AND Nazi Germans.   I really doubt those are the people being supported and used by Obama and Nuland.  They are using the people already in power.   Using German terms to describe them is misleading.  They were not Nazi collaborators.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:37 | 5328536 giovanni_f
giovanni_f's picture

They are Nazis, plain and simple, Julija.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:38 | 5328543 thamnosma
thamnosma's picture

You haven't a clue, ignorant moron

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:49 | 5328607 giovanni_f
giovanni_f's picture

They are Nazis, plain amd simple, Victoria.

P.S: You are beautiful: http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/IASvymY63eE/0.jpg

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:44 | 5328310 Headbanger
Headbanger's picture

Next it will be a plane loaded with Ebola infected refugees from Africa gets shot down over Ukraine by ISIS..

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:57 | 5328353 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Never fear, the CDC will be Johnny-On-The-Spot and set up Forward Operating Base Ebola.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 14:14 | 5329604 Diogenes of Sinope
Diogenes of Sinope's picture

Already happened ;)

https://www.google.com/search?q=mh17+ebola&rlz=1C1CHFX_enUS455US455&oq=m...

The plane was filled with experts on their way to cnference, and the infected cadavers they were to use as subjects.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:51 | 5328334 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Yeah, this is right up there with the Ottom...errr, ahhh, the Turks launching air strikes against...

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-10-14/turkish-jets-in-first-strikes-since-pkk-peace-talk-says-hurriyet.html

...the Kurds.

I suppose they're going to keep dickin around and playing footsie with these guys (ISIS) until Jihad John shows up in Ankara with his butcher knife.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:55 | 5328345 The Phallic Crusader
The Phallic Crusader's picture

Yes. The two situations are quite similar.

 

Until you give it a moment's thought.

 

;op

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:02 | 5328382 nmewn
nmewn's picture

What, that one faction can benefit from the actions of another faction and remain amusedly disassociated from it?

Sure, I guess so ;-)

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:07 | 5328399 junction
junction's picture

The Svoboda party leaders must have told their members to not wear their swastika pins to this event.  Gazprom just announced it was setting up loss reserves to cover the 3.5 billion dollars Ukraine owes Gazprom.  In other words, Gazprom is writing off the Ukraine gas debt as uncollectable.  Wasn't the West supposed to have paid Ukraine's gas arrears?  Obummer has no concern that thousands of Detroit residents have had their water supply cut off for non-payment of their utility bills, yet he worries about the deadbeat now-Nazi nation of Ukraine.  Obummer has his priorities, principal among them  supporting the Saudi/CIA IS mercenaries in the Middle East.  American generals are an obedient lot but Obummer may be going too far, bombing Syria, protecting and supplying IS and violating his oath of office by entering into an illegal conspiracy with the Saudis to overthrow Iraq, Syria and Iran.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:27 | 5328486 thamnosma
thamnosma's picture

Svoboda may be fascist but they are not Nazi.  That term is tossed around here so ignorantly.  Obama, Nuland and that crowd want control of "moderate" forces who are easily manipulated with power and money.  Opportunists.  Like Karzai in Afghanistan or the idiots in Baghdad.  In Syria they find corrupt exiles, put them in suits in front of a camera and call them "moderate rebel leadership".   The people inside the Ukrainian government are the ones being controlled by Washington because they CAN be.

When you try to control and use nationalists, who deep down disdain outsiders, control is tentative if not doomed to failure.  IS isn't controlled.  Oh yeah, the West caused their creation but those guys are laughing at the West.  Svoboda is not controllable by incompetent, naive and sloppy Washington DC progressives.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:03 | 5328675 giovanni_f
giovanni_f's picture

In short: Fascism isn't so bad after all because its namesake, fasces, was a symbol of power and jurisdiction in ancient Rome. Julija - your mafia-bitch logic is inimitable.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 13:17 | 5329263 ebear
ebear's picture

"Svoboda may be fascist but they are not Nazi."

Of course they're not Nazis.  They just like the uniforms, flags and badges.  Kind of like those geeks that dress up for Comic-Con.  Everyone knows they're not really super heros.  They just like to imagine they are.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:39 | 5328281 LULZBank
LULZBank's picture

Vicky Nuland was here. Burn baby, burn.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:39 | 5328551 tonyw
tonyw's picture

Recent visit no publicity or press releases, so why was she there?

Usually after a visit from a high ranking overlord the junta forces attack again.

Recently they have been moving equipment into positions for another attack.

Maybe nothing will happen until after the upcoming elections in November.

They've just put an even more fascist guy in charge of the army, so he'll want his moment of glory.

Poroshenko will remain in charge until Vicky decides he's outlived his usefulness.

Might be better for him to use his other passport now and scuttle off with what ill gotten gains he can.

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 18:28 | 5331088 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Tanks and APCs require fuel to move around.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:39 | 5328282 symtex411
symtex411's picture

now don't start that again

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:40 | 5328283 IridiumRebel
IridiumRebel's picture

Ukraine? What's been going on? I haven't heard much.

 

 

 

 

#KansasCityShuffle

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:41 | 5328285 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

Has the Vodka come flying out of Putin's nose yet from him laughing so hard. Guess the Nationals are complaining that Keiv is not Fascist enough.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:45 | 5328315 Phuk u
Phuk u's picture

Chupacabra

I couldn't agree with you more. More Ukrainians shooting themselves

in the foot.......a national pastime.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:04 | 5328947 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Seems like they are playing a game of Chicken.  Kiev style.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 18:30 | 5331097 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Chicken Kiev is highly overrated, waaay too much butter!

Chicken Cordon Bleu FTW!

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:41 | 5328294 eurogold
eurogold's picture

I really hope Russia does let the Ukraine freeze this time, this winter !

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:45 | 5328313 man of Wool
man of Wool's picture

They deserve it. Why does the EU want these fruitcakes in the EU? More cheap labour and political lunatics.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:59 | 5328328 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

did you ask... Poland? SERIOUSLY, IS IT THAT SO DIFFICULT TO BELIEVE THAT POLAND HAS A NATIONAL INTEREST IN UKRAINE?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:04 | 5328393 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Poland doesn't sit on Russia's border. I'm sure that if you were Russian and NATO was expanding their territory right next to your counry, you would have some concerns too.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:14 | 5328434 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Poland shares a 210 km border with Russia's exclave of Kaliningrad. I agree with Russia's concern of encroaching NATO. I was always against it, btw

But Russia's concerns have to be put in context. Fog of war lifted, and the Russian Bear has a piece of sovereign territory annexed. This is just a... fact

I love the cuddly Bear, I love Russia and it's People. I fought their previous inhuman regime. But I don't have a... romantic blindness about the Teddy Bear

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:19 | 5328453 Ondoron
Ondoron's picture

You should rather read all of Putin's speaks to the Germans and the Europeans. A Europe from Lisbon to Vladivostok. But that's not what the Anglo-Americans want! Remember: The USA is the "exeptionalist country"...

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:31 | 5328502 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

I do read what Putin writes, I do listen to what Putin says. My problem is that I also listen and read to what his advisors say and write. And some of it is at the same level as some of the worst inhabitants of Washington

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:50 | 5329150 Shizzmoney
Shizzmoney's picture

Make it be known that the US and the Oligarchs that nbankroll the empire are backing the far-right wing folks who love the Nazis and WW2 war crimes.

Eisenhower and Patton must be rolling in their graves.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:18 | 5328454 Ondoron
Ondoron's picture

You should rather read all of Putin's speaks to the Germans and the Europeans. A Europe from Lisbon to Vladivostok. But that's not what the Anglo-Americans want! Remember: The USA is the "exeptionalist country"...

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:31 | 5328507 thamnosma
thamnosma's picture

That is a good point.  That enclave is important to them.  I believe it houses tactical nuclear weapons, aircraft and submarines.  It's an all-season port as well.   A potential flashpoint as none of the Baltic Countries or Poland want that remnant of Soviet times there.  For the Russians it's Crimea light.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:30 | 5329052 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Ukraine has never been a sovereign nation.

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 13:18 | 5329266 corbeau
corbeau's picture

Hmm..., annexed? What about Texas, New Mexico, etc.?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 13:49 | 5329453 ebear
ebear's picture

"Fog of war lifted, and the Russian Bear has a piece of sovereign territory annexed. This is just a... fact"

If you mean Crimea, it seems to me the people there voted to join Russia after the legitimate government in Kiev was overthrown, but I guess that's for future historians to decide, since it's them, not you or I who write the history books.

One point of interest though.  Given the propensity for violence in that part of the world, where are the Crimean protests and rebel activity aimed at reversing this Russian "annexation?"  As far as I can tell, the people who actually live there are just fine with the new arrangement.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:54 | 5328907 giovanni_f
giovanni_f's picture

The Poles have no strategy. Driven by hatred, rooted in a gargantuan complex of inferiority towards Germany and Russia, they once more lend their hand to the anglosaxons' strategy of destroying everyting that threatens their hegemony.

Given their royal teatment by Churchill who sold them to Stalin after WWII (which the Poles did not forget) and the fact that few nations would profit more from a prospering Eurasia more than Poland, one wonders about the readiness (stupidity) to self-mutilatorily act the subservient role of an agent provocateur in war games designed by its worst traitor. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:07 | 5328404 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Careful Ghordius, you're talking to an eleven week old european there who has no idea of the history of the place...lol.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:28 | 5329044 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

@eurogold: "I really hope Russia does let the Ukraine freeze this time, this winter !"

Why not have a 1-2 punch:  Have them Chill out a bit, and then turn up the political Heat by repaying the Kiev Junta in kind:  Foment Uprisings.  Shouldn't be too hard, when large parts of the population are properly motivated.  :-)

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:54 | 5329166 eurogold
eurogold's picture

Kirk, live long and prosper !

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 18:46 | 5331145 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Go long thermal underwear! :>D

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:41 | 5328295 lim
lim's picture

2 chains

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:41 | 5328296 lim
lim's picture

dupe

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:45 | 5328304 q99x2
q99x2's picture

That giant swinging the chain looks like Jihadi John. Wonder if it is the same guy.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:43 | 5328306 Stackers
Stackers's picture

I think I saw about 4-5 guys with sticks and chains, 100 people standing around waving flags and 200 photojournalist snapping pics

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:45 | 5328309 HamRove
HamRove's picture

Yeah, this shit is funny. Not really, but kinda. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:48 | 5328316 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

"Far right protesters" I never tire of seeing that term in MSM when referring to anybody who disagrees with .gov. Yeah I'm looking at you Tyler since that intro was written by you.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:54 | 5328341 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

You could call them smelly hippies.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:56 | 5328348 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

But don't call them late for dinner.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:04 | 5328384 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

it might be tiring to hear that in the American context, yet if you do notice that they carry the horizontal red and black flag, and you understand what that flag means... see comments further up

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:12 | 5328415 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

The term "The far right" in America is used to pigeonhole anybody who disagrees with .gov as radical wild eyed psychopaths. And never ever will you see any mention of "the far left"especially when they are busy burning the place down. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:17 | 5328447 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

I think the Occupy "Movement" was referred to as far-left.

Or smelly hippies, which is my own preferred term for myself.

When I was dodging CV gas canisters with my Garfield High School students in Seattle in 1999, and participating in the F15 march before the run-up to the 2nd Iraq War, I seem to remember that we were referred to as "far-left."

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:52 | 5328586 Dr. Engali
Dr. Engali's picture

Maybe I notice "the far right"terminology a bit more since I tend to oppose .gov intrusions and the left tend to oppose the private sector. Both of which, if we've learned anything over the past few years, have merged into a fascist state. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:00 | 5328643 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

Big State loves Big Biz and Big Biz loves Big State. What you have is not fascism in the classical sense, what you have is... "Big Is Beautiful"

and the greatest trick was to convince everybody that anti-megabusiness equals anti-business, and that anti-megastate equals anti-state

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:05 | 5328680 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Yes - scale.

That's the core of my own socio/political orientation, and the source of my criticism.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:19 | 5328752 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

lately, Bill Gates was fawning about the economy of scale of Chinese industries

there I thought: wow, unbridled capitalism has, eventually the same results as unbridled socialism: one giant factory for each product only, for the whole globe

interestingly, this is what Marx predicted as a result of unbridled capitalism

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 18:47 | 5331152 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

So, one factory makes Right shoes/boots only, then...

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:06 | 5328671 Spastica Rex
Spastica Rex's picture

Like Ghordius alludes to, language has become extremely imprecise in the US - we pretty much just hurl epithets at one another. The devolution of American English goes farther than that, of course, into the realm of Newspeak where "universal healthcare" has little to do with health and everything to do with profit, and "clear skies" means increased freedom to pollute.

In my case, the "Left" in the US wants nothing to do with me, and neither does the "Right." Interestingly, libertarians (big "L" and otherwise) generally think I'm OK, but as sceptic of all classical economic models, I'm excluded right out.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:24 | 5328473 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

agreed. in fact, I'd go as far as saying that both left and right have no meaning whatsoever in the US context. I wrote recently that you could as well say "pessimists" and "optimists" (damn, can't find the link). Yet "left and right" have a meaning, in Europe. We have Classic Liberals, Classic Socialists, Classic Conservatives, three permutation on this scheme and at least three extreme versions of it

all this highly visible in the fact that we have over one hundred political parties. and seven main "families" of pol parties in the EU parliament

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:46 | 5328319 Quinvarius
Quinvarius's picture

Obama sure picked the winning team to run this shit show.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:48 | 5328323 LULZBank
LULZBank's picture

Putin needs to take advantage of this situation.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:49 | 5328327 jm
jm's picture

FT doesn't report that if you try this at the Kremlin you will get your skull pulverized.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:01 | 5328374 Miketheterrible
Miketheterrible's picture

Not true. Only people who get beat and thrown away in protests in Moscow are people who usually instigate a problem in the first place. Many times during lgbt protests in moscow, people thrown in a cell were neo nazis who threatened and attacked people, or lgbt people threatening others and attacking (sometimes self defense so it becomes semi questionable). Last protest in moscow over Ukraine ordeal happened, no one arrested or attacked, even if both sides yelled at each other, then people went home.

Propaganda is silly here in the west.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:22 | 5329023 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

good post again

west propaganda ranges from silly to depraved

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:39 | 5328838 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

that is for rethinking your purpose

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:49 | 5328329 wesson
wesson's picture

Well, using litteral nazis as muscle for a so called "revolution", what would you expect then, that they drop quietly their weapon and let a democratic process to oust them occur without reacting ?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:51 | 5328333 nah
nah's picture

looked like alot of groaning, hurts pretty bad those cops need gloves

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:52 | 5328337 Reaper
Reaper's picture

Where are the snipers?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:13 | 5328429 The Phallic Crusader
The Phallic Crusader's picture

Tel Aviv?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:18 | 5328456 Infinite QE
Infinite QE's picture

Yep. Preparing for round 2 of the holocaust in Gaza.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:56 | 5328349 Miketheterrible
Miketheterrible's picture

Oh well. Not surprising since stuff like this happens a lot in Ukraine and happened a lot in the past (prior to USSR). Reason why my family left that place many years ago. They lack an actual national identity so they created themselves one that is Anti Russian, where they believe that they are completely different people on one hand from Russians, yet claim on the other hand that they created Russia.  It is simplistic stuff like this that people there cannot get along and nothing truely progress. Wont here or in EU. If they get into EU, they will find out Ukrainians dont have real control, so they will be back out on the streets. All the while, the average Ukrainian who isnt interested in this silly shenanigans, will suffer too.

Elections coming up soon. Svoboda may just get in. Then they will try to secure their position and poop may hit the fan real hard.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:15 | 5328726 Joe Plane
Joe Plane's picture

< They lack an actual national identity so they created themselves one that is Anti Russian>

Quoted for truth. This is the root of the problem.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:26 | 5328770 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Ukraine has never been a sovereign nation.

no national identity is understandable

It can be argued that there is hardly such thing as an ethnic Ukrainian....most unqualified quickly as live in former Polish and other lands...Polish, Balt, Hun, Rus, whatever....they Ukrainian nationals  

if you think about it

"Ukraine A History" Orest Subtelny  Best book on this subject for English language reader

Author is of Ukraine heritage

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:19 | 5328739 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

My friends there tell same as you. 

I wonder what city/region you lived?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:22 | 5328763 Miketheterrible
Miketheterrible's picture

We are from lviv.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:31 | 5328798 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

I see

I only know of a few people Kyiv and more south, esp krim not west

Your posts are interesting

 

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:58 | 5328355 Infinite QE
Infinite QE's picture

Everywhere you look, tfj's are creating endless chaos.

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 09:59 | 5328361 The Phallic Crusader
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Can't blame the Ukrainians 70 years ago for siding with the German national socialists against the Bolsheviks.  I mean, surely the starvation death of 8-10 million Ukrainians at the hands of the Russian Bolsheviks, many of whom were as Russian as Alan Dershowitz dosn't merit a mention in our history books or anything, but still, 25 or 30 years out they probably had more reason to hate the Commies than the Nazis.

 

In a sense, they are fighting the Bolsheviks all over again.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:07 | 5328411 Miketheterrible
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Russians starved in the millions too, so what? No one in Ukraine starved now. Only people starving anything is Ukraine politicians to local businessmen. Nothing to do with Russia. Just became one when Russia said they will have to protect local industries by putting tarrifs on Ukraine if they joined EU so it wouldnt flood Russian market, and so Ukraine stayed out and then Yanukovich was thrown out by protestors. Then sovboda took advantage of this chaos and started an anti Russian campaign.

Ukraine has been its own for over 21 years and they managed to screw up. Russia, as usual, gets the blame even thougg evidence says otherwise. But then people, like yourself, bring up skewed history facts to base their ignorant pov. In the end, Ukraine has a history of starvation, even before so called Russian intervention.

Germans were cruel to Ukrainians as well. But they simply ignore that. Also the fact Bolsheviks were helped by Germans prior to the second world war, during the revolution.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:12 | 5328426 The Phallic Crusader
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huh?

 

Why don't you try reading my comment more slowly.  It went, in essence, to why siding with "Nazis" needs to be understood in the context of Ukraine's suffering under the Russian communist government.

 

Your comment is inane and beside the point.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:18 | 5328451 Miketheterrible
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Ukraine was one of the better developed soviet nations and where a lot of scientific and insutrial development happened. If it wasnt for that, Ukraine would be more agrarian than not now, and would have even more economic problems. Russia built our manufacturing development during soviet era. We destroyed it in 90's. If anything, we should be blaming ourselves. Prior to all of this, we were simple slaves or soldiers for either the Austro Hungarian empire, Czar or Polish Lithuanian empire. My family suffered more under those regimes than under Soviet.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:30 | 5328497 nmewn
nmewn's picture

I think thats what he's saying...the context...of the situation that the Ukrainian people have always found themselves in.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:14 | 5328721 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Good post

 

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:26 | 5328480 Miketheterrible
Miketheterrible's picture

Post 2: sorry, maybe I read you wrong. Dont know who you are referingto them fighting bolshevics now? Whom are new Bolsheviks? EU? Poroshenko? If anything, I see them fighting off another Monarch as Poroshenko is like a king ad yatsenuk is aristrocrat.

Anyway, no one worth supporting in Ukraine. I can only hope the people of my former nation get a decent leader who can work with both the Europeans and their Russian friends/family too withought alignment to anyone but themselves.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:09 | 5328698 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Reds are Reds...The "Red" mafiya oligarchs from violent takeover...

the usual suspects

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:06 | 5328681 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Bolshevik/Soviet was never a Russian construct

From 1917 thru Stalin was never Russians in control

 

Even Kruschev and Breznev were Ukraine nationals

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:04 | 5328386 Amerikan Patriot
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The problem with this article begins with "As RT reports...."  As a funded arm of the Soviet state-controlled media regime and constitutionally incapable of printing a negative word about Putin or his policies, RT isn't a trustworthy news source.  It can be counted on to report everything that reflects positively on the Soviets and negatively on the West. 

In other words, it's propaganda.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:10 | 5328416 The Phallic Crusader
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There's no question RT has a bias - a bias that serves to counter the slant of the American and to some extent British and Canadian MSM.   I don't think anyone who watches it doesn't think so, although that strawman inference is often seen in comments here.

Calling it 'propaganda' does not, without more, prove it untrue, or less reliable than CNN or FOX.

 

Indeed, I would argue that RT is no less accurate as to, say, Ukraine, than the NYT or CNN, and probably more accurate.

 

Similarly, Arab news sources as to Israel/Palestine are obviously slanted, but thir slant is likely closer to the truth of the occupation than the Zio-sanitized packaging in the US press, where the raw and unvarnished truth is generally deemed "anti-Semitic" by an army of paid trolls. 

 

 

 

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:40 | 5328557 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

the old Russian saying was: There is no pravda in Izvestia, and there is no izvestia in Pravda

which I found it always optimistic, meaning you could find truth, but not in "The News", and you could find news, but not in "The Truth"

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 21:46 | 5331847 Amerikan Patriot
Amerikan Patriot's picture

No.  "Has a bias" doesn't begin to cover it.  Russia Today never prints an anti-Russia story.  Never.  CNN publishes stories that cast aspersions on Obama and his policies, even though it's known as a liberal news source.  Even conservative Fox gives time to liberal viewpoints.  But RT only has good things to report about Russia and negative stories about the West.  Tune in any hour of any day and that's what you'll hear...hour after hour and day after day. 

It's propaganda, pure and simple, and only knaves or the willfully blind can't see it.  Which are you?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:12 | 5328424 Miketheterrible
Miketheterrible's picture

Interfax is reporting it and they arately owned. Same with Ria whom a no longer funded by government as well.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:16 | 5328441 rejected
rejected's picture

Yes, its a godsend to live in a country where the media is so independent and never pushes government agenda. Of course they never print anything negative concerning the leader of the free world as He is the most transparent, freedom loving and peace nurturing President ever.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 23:40 | 5332231 Amerikan Patriot
Amerikan Patriot's picture

Apparently you have difficulty reading, Bob.  I've read numerous stories today in the American MSM that are openly critical of Obama and his policies.

You silly goose!

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:39 | 5328546 Infinite QE
Infinite QE's picture

Compared to the zionist controlled media the west has to suffer through, RT is a breath of fresh air. No, no one believes everything they say but it's at least half way to the truth and not 180 degrees out of phase with it like the western shit.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:09 | 5328699 The Phallic Crusader
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I'm not sure if "Jewish controlled" might be both less politically correct and more accurate.  Not all Jews are Zionists, but Jews have an overwhelmingly disproportionate presence in news and entertainment media.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:14 | 5328727 Ghordius
Ghordius's picture

and not all Zionists are Jews. meanwhile Zionist has a very mundane and understandable meaning in Israel. like... national

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 11:26 | 5328772 The Phallic Crusader
The Phallic Crusader's picture

understood - an that strengthens my point, actually.  It is not Christian Zionists that own and publish and edit major newspapers, but Jews [disproportionately, i.e. far more than 2.5%].  Some, perhaps most are "zionist" in the general sense of supporting the existence of Israel as a Jewish-only state  {I support the existence of Israel's people, not necessarily an ethnarchy on land ethnically cleansed in living memory - but then I'm a secular humanist}.

 

If we're being honest and plain about it - Jews, many or most of whom are "Zionist" i.e. very pro-Israel, probably don't "control" the media, there probably isn't a "conspiracy" to do so, but it remains the case that it is very, very difficult to name a major news source that does not have Jewish ownership/editors/managers/writers.

 

Magazines like Commentary are explicitly Jewish while many, like The New Republic essentially are.  No other ethnic or religious group has such a media presence.

 

There are 10 times as many Latin rite Catholics than Jews - from the media landscape, and pop culture, you'd never know it.  That's just religious terms of course - but, for example, the Germans, or Irish, or Scotch-Irish, or Italians have basically no MSM presence, and if they did, they'd likely be sued for insufficient "diversity".

 

Anyway, rant over.  Pro-Israel bias in the media is also largely buttressed by 60 or 70 million Evangelicals, whom I don't myself regard as actually "Christian" in belief, but I don't care to argue the point.  It is clear, however, that "Christian"  Zionists are a major part of the bias, too.

 

Basically, you have lots of people who don't care much about the Palestinian/Israeli conflict.  Those who care in the US are mostly Zionist in outlook - the press will cater to that bias.

 

And it means Americans in general are ignorant of the plain facts of the ethnic cleansing and terrorism used to create Israel, and the ongoing brutality and colonialism and apartheid of Israel's relentless occupation.

 

Israel doesn't want peace, it plainly wants all of Palestine - and the American press is absolutely blind to it.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:40 | 5328552 Infinite QE
Infinite QE's picture

And another zioqueer agent:

 

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Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:59 | 5328646 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

RT is elegant

 

 

you will be happier go watch the full coverage on CNN

more your level

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 14:03 | 5329523 Miketheterrible
Miketheterrible's picture

All I can say is that RT is good at photos/videos and if they re-report news. But their journalistic sense is bad. In other words, they are good at giving their own slant view to a topic like a lot other media out there. Why I truely do not think RT is government controlled, is because they cannot get a lot of their own nations facts correct. Oil and gas info is biggest one. They stated in one aeticle it accounts for 70% of budget, but thats wrong. It accounts for 70% export but around 25% consolidated budget. Their stance on US is worst.

Good Russian news is Itar-Tass, Interfax, Ria and if you need it english, RBTH is decent. Their opinion articles are bad, but they usually just rehash the same news. Because I am a nerd, cnews.ru is my favorite.

Oh, if for Ukraine news, good luck. They are all owned by same people. Ukraine Today is worst than RT and FOX. Fox is better than both IMO, mostly because their rants are funny.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:11 | 5328419 WTFUD
WTFUD's picture

These NumbNut Ukie ISiahISts have finally caught on to YatsNutSacksuck's & ChocoMan's Nulandski SCAM. At least the daily protests will warm their cockles until the penny drops on the whole moronic Kiev and western Ukie fucktards who gave licence to CronyBankerOligaffs to commit WAR CRIMES.

Yats weasel like features will look particularly nice when that rope tightens around his treasonous neck.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:53 | 5328628 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

I have come to conclusion they will never catch on fully.

The worst radicals are far west Lyiv and regions..Pollacks

They always seem on the wrong side of everything

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:20 | 5328458 ELYSIAN
ELYSIAN's picture

Don't get your sources from RT you idiots.
RT RT RT
ANTI-SEMITIC
I come to Zerohedge to hear a pro-Russian side. However, everything I hear from this site is absolute bullshit now.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:30 | 5328493 The Phallic Crusader
The Phallic Crusader's picture

You're a tass-man, eh?

http://en.itar-tass.com/

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:32 | 5328504 ELYSIAN
ELYSIAN's picture

Don't bother blaming the Jews.
I know that you stand against the Jews and are anti-semitic. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:31 | 5328505 ELYSIAN
ELYSIAN's picture

Don't bother blaming the Jews.
I know that you stand against the Jews and are anti-semitic. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:10 | 5328981 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Poles make the best butthurt ointment out there...

get yourself some    and use it

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:33 | 5328516 ELYSIAN
ELYSIAN's picture

Don't bother blaming the Jews.
RT is an anti-semitic site.

"Russian Bolsheviks"
I know that you mean "Jewish Bolsheviks"
Stalin.
Is not.
Jewish. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:47 | 5328600 The Phallic Crusader
The Phallic Crusader's picture

Stalin was Georgian, of course.

But the early Bolsheviks were largely Jewish - there's no real question about it.  A lot of them were vitims of Stalin's purges, of course.

Just as the neocons were/are mostly Jewish - then as now, you just can't speak certain facts.

Most of the men who killed the Tsar's family were Jews.

This is simply the truth of the matter - if you're too obtuse to understand the difference between "Jews" and the/all Jews" - blame your parents, not me.

 

Anyways, not all Jewish people are Likudnik Zionists, thank the gods.  In fact, liberal and moderate Israeli Jews are absolutely vital to avoiding what the right would like - naked genocide of the indigenous population.

 

So stop your whining.  Here, of all places, it will fool no one.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:07 | 5328608 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

That is in dispute.....but.. 

his wife

brother in law    look who dynamited Christ's Cathedral

commissars and henchmen

all qualify

but if these are semetic or not is disputed also

recent dna says many not at all, or only a little

 

your little guilt trip is bored

you don't seem right in the head

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:37 | 5328537 Infinite QE
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Another US taxpayer funded zioqueer agent:

 

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Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:43 | 5329124 ELYSIAN
ELYSIAN's picture

You're just as bad as Svoboda lmao.
Anti-Semite. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:43 | 5329125 ELYSIAN
ELYSIAN's picture

You're just as bad as Svoboda lmao.
Anti-Semite. 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 14:13 | 5329583 Jano
Jano's picture

anti semite means against the arabs.

what do u want to say? there was no arab discussion until now.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:38 | 5328538 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

go away then

 

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 12:44 | 5329130 ELYSIAN
ELYSIAN's picture

Pro-Russia?

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 14:25 | 5329666 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

pro sanity   that why I told you go away

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:36 | 5328530 homiegot
homiegot's picture

Long chains. Long live chain guy.

Tue, 10/14/2014 - 10:47 | 5328598 alexcojones
alexcojones's picture

What falls first: Ukraine parliament or Bagdad US embassy?

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