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Propaganda 101 – How The Pentagon Is Trying To Rewrite Vietnam War History
Submitted by Mike Krieger via Liberty Blitzkrieg blog,
In case you weren’t aware, the Pentagon is set to roll out a 50th anniversary commemoration of the Vietnam War. Personally, it’s hard to get excited about commemorating an event that led to the death of over 58,000 American soldiers and more than a million Vietnamese, particularly since much of it was the direct result of well documented lies and deception, such as the Gulf of Tonkin incident.
What’s worse, the Pentagon intends to rewrite history by whitewashing this period of civil unrest and government shame from American history. The propaganda is so blatant that it has resulted in many of the era’s most well known protestors and activists to come together in order to stop it.
The New York Times reports that:
WASHINGTON — It has been nearly half a century since a young antiwar protester named Tom Hayden traveled to Hanoi to investigate President Lyndon B. Johnson’s claims that the United States was not bombing civilians in Vietnam. Mr. Hayden saw destroyed villages and came away, he says, “pretty wounded by the pattern of deception.”
Now the Pentagon — run by a Vietnam veteran, Defense Secretary Chuck Hagel — is planning a 50th anniversary commemoration of the Vietnam War. The effort, which is expected to cost taxpayers nearly $15 million by the end of this fiscal year, is intended to honor veterans and, its website says, “provide the American public with historically accurate materials” suitable for use in schools.
But the extensive website, which has been up for months, largely describes a war of valor and honor that would be unrecognizable to many of the Americans who fought in and against it.
Leading Vietnam historians complain that it focuses on dozens of medal-winning soldiers while giving scant mention to mistakes by generals and the years of violent protests and anguished debate at home.
In one early iteration, the website referred to the 1968 My Lai massacre, in which American troops killed hundreds of Vietnamese civilians, as the My Lai Incident.
The glossy view of history has now prompted more than 500 scholars, veterans and activists — including the civil rights leader Julian Bond; Daniel Ellsberg, who leaked the top-secret Pentagon Papers; Lawrence J. Korb, a former assistant secretary of defense under President Ronald Reagan; and Peter Yarrow of the folk trio Peter, Paul and Mary — to join Mr. Hayden in demanding the ability to correct the Pentagon’s version of history and a place for the old antiwar activists in the anniversary events.
Mr. Hayden, 74, and other 1960s-era activists who helped him gather signatures, say they do not quarrel with honoring the sacrifice of soldiers. But they object to having the military write the story.
“All of us remember that the Pentagon got us into this war in Vietnam with its version of the truth,” Mr. Hayden said in a recent telephone interview from Berkeley, Calif., where he attended a rally to mark another 50th anniversary, that of the free-speech movement. “If you conduct a war, you shouldn’t be in charge of narrating it.”
He promised “educational materials, a Pentagon exhibit, traveling exhibits, symposiums, oral history projects and much more.” The mission, he said, is to “help the nation take advantage of a rare opportunity to turn back to a page in history and to right a wrong, by expressing its honor and respect to Vietnam veterans and their families.”
Many of the longtime activists also see the petition as deeply relevant today.
“You can’t separate this effort to justify the terrible wars of 50 years ago from the terrible wars of today,” said Phyllis Bennis, a Middle East expert who has known Mr. Hayden since the early 1970s. “When I saw this, I thought immediately, ‘We’ve got to stop this.’ ”
This problem of people in power rewriting history to serve their own ends has been an issue throughout human history, something Julian Assange recently discussed and outlined here: Video of the Day – Hologram Julian Assange Talks George Orwell, Bitcoin and Preserving Human History.
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So, you can both escape the misguided economic dogma and geopolitical misinformation.
http://www.amazon.com/Never-Serious-Crisis-Waste-Neoliberalism/dp/1781680795/ref=pd_ybh_16
Yes. It is quite unfair.
After the MSM has spent so much ink and pixels on defining and deconstructing "neocon", for the word to be so unjustly misused by the American public.
Oh, wait....
NeoCon is the new word for the old word Nazi. Prescott Bush essentially was a Nazi. His connections saved him from too much harm for being a Nazi. They're still doing business with a changed name and an under the radar operations. They have many willing duped to help them along, like the Tea Baggers.
Sure Soros is a scumbag too. But don't let the dirtbags like the Bush's and Cheney off the hook because you're too busy watching Soros. otherwise you're just a useful dupe for the new Nazis.
You should study the origins of neoconservatism.
I recommend you start with Leo Strauss and Leon Trotsky, then look at its evolution up until the dissolution of PNAC.
Slight ideological differences, same tactics, world view, operational model, etc... My sincerecest apologies for know using the exact, precise, specific terms to define them. An assholes is an asshole, is an asshole.
Yup, the -isms. There's so many, and every decade they change definitions so it's hard to keep up.
"Slight ideological differences..."
No. The Nazis were nationalists and big on ethnic and racial solidarity. The neoconservatives are internationalists and enthusiastic supporters of a pluralistic, multicultural, multiracial society. Big difference.
Who can tell what the NYT is?
How many articles have they written about the missing Ukrainian ATC tapes?
Have you read much recently comparing the similarities of the nationalist riots today in Kiev and in the Maidan in February?
Or the fact that the US and EU is in bed with Ukraine's nationalist/nazi movement?
The New York Times may be anything but Neocon -- BUT THEY CERTAINLY ARE NOT NON-NEOCONS NOW.
The American Media has cross the Rubicon the other way.
Not toward Rome, but well into Goebbelian Gaul.
That's my point with my smart-assed commentary here. It's all so convoluted anymore with so many different factions joining each other then fighting each other with so many lies thrown at us from every angle, public and private, that you can't find a sliver of truth in the BS anywhere any more. Yet we have people on here who are going to blame their mentally fabricated "liberal" straw men for ALL of it without ever looking at who's hand is pulling their own strings. It's ALWAYS the communist under their bed. All I can say is the Cold War propagandists did a great job on the more pliable minds in this country.
We have reached the point where there is nothing so off the wall the government tells us that is shocking or surprising.
The only question left is where are we going from here?
Exactly. That's why pointing fingers and calling names has a bad rep.
It's not so much about what someone else did, intentionally or not. It's about what do we want to do now.
The key is how we decide we want to trade our time, our work, our ideas, and our things with each other. It doesn't have to be the way someone else decides.
Without showing us any evidence, the Gov. and MSM declared that Viktor Yanukovych was responsible for the atrocities in the Maidan
He fled before the strength of the Jacobins and their EU allies, which proved his guilt, never mind that he never called in the army or the water cannons.
Because VY was removed by a coup, Crimea quit Ukraine and was annexed by Russia. Then the Russian majority in Donbas revolted against Kiev.
The American government, with the connivance of the American MSM wanted a pro Moscow president out of office and a pro Brussels one in.
The damage this caused in lives and destruction is breathtaking.
And the events of February 2014 are not over.
Because VY is out of office, Russia wants Ukraine to pay its arrears, some $4-5 billion, for Russian gas that was sold to Ukraine but not paid for.
Which threatens to deprive not only the Ukrainians, but all of the Eastern European countries whose gas transits through Ukraine with a cold, miserable winter.
All because our stereotypical stupid black president bought a worthless plan from some of his advisors, with massive unintended consequences -- unless a global depression or WWIII was what they wanted.
What do we want to do now?
What can a nation of eunuchs do?
Same as always: bread, circus and Dancing With the Stars.
"We replaced a government of thieves
with a government of killer oligarchs"
-Victoria Shilova- Ukrainian MP
"But in 2003 they were inoperative, broken down and no more a threat than a WWII fighter plane in mothballs for 50 years."
Really? What is the "half-life", if you will, of chlorine gas? Sarin? VX?
Do you know anything about chemistry, munitions, or delivery systems?
Inoperative weapons are injuring soldiers merely moving them? Have they been beating on the warheads with hammers to make sure they're "inoperative", like that Bugs Bunny WWII cartoon with the little demon?
If they're "no more a threat", then let's store them at YOUR house - as long as you live nowhere near me!
There are many sites in Iraq like this. It was an old weapons depo and now used to store ammo that are dangerous to handle. Most of it is made in the US and the EU. They were used against Iran and then after disarmament, they were dumped at sites like this. To secure the site, some of the old ammo was moved which causes problems and exposed some the soldiers to these old chemicals. As they were not told what was contained in them. If the IS are stupid enough to go there and tamper with the junk then its their own fault. They were too dangerous even to dispose off properly and why they are left there.
The sites are not some hidden black ops areas. Even the nuclear sites where there is still raw uranium stored. Suppsedly all are under UN seal. But anyone can break in once the guards run off.
That makes sense. Isn't it odd that the same MSM that said there were no WMD's when Bush was in charge, is now saying there were WMD's? We already know that they cover for Obamas mistakes at every turn, but the fact that the liberal NYT chose to put this out before the election is strange, everything the MSM does has some hidden alterior motive.
Please. the so-called liberal media kissed Bush's ass at every turn. the held him to a lower standard because they knew he was a retard and because the blinded conservatives in this country would whine endlessly if they held him to the same standard as any competent person. You single minded perspective makes you a good patsy for you handlers.
You are such a red team cheerleader.
Of course they had WMDs. Rumsfeld sold them the WMDs a few years before the war. That's probably why they hid them, because they had Made in the USA stamped on all the containers.
Gotta love the ideologically blinded Zeros on this site. only those other guys are bad. their guys are good. Such good dupes for their owners.
[Steps into Fight Club Octagon] Horbanger, you're a fucking Moron! Either that, or paid shill.
If you'd watched the Daily Show last night, you'd have learned that These "WMD" are scrapped, old chemicals that the US sold to Saddam, to fight Iran. Rumsfeld even went over there to shake Saddam's hand. Do your homework or STFU, you propaganda Hore!
[Steps out of Fight Club Octagon]
"If you'd watched the Daily Show last night, you'd have learned"
and you call me a moron?
Nice dodge on the truth he told you. You look like Neo dodging bullets in "The Matrix".
As I do now, you Moron.
Those old Chemweapons were monitored prior to the iraqi Invasion; and were dispersed when Saddam kicked them out prior to the Invasion of '03.
Some were found smuggled to the Black Market via Syria.
This info has been around for years.
The Daily Show just debunked the Propaganda by doing some basic fact checking.
Harbanger,
What, no reply?
You lack the integrity to admit you are a factional partisan (red team in this case) and you are trying hard to peddle the "Bush was right" meme.
The inconvenient truth is that the U.S. was aware of the existence of such weapons at the Al Muthanna site as far back as 1991. Why? Because Al Muthanna was the site where the UN ordered Saddam Hussein to dispose of his declared chemical munitions in the first place!
Those weapons that could not safely be destroyed were sealed and left to decay on their own, which they did. The site was neither “active” nor “clandestine” – it was a declared munitions dump being used to hold the corroded weapons which Western powers themselves had helped Saddam procure.
This partisan re-writing of history is getting out of control.
Seems the nemesis of most of the worlds problems have been caused or influenced by the US gov and banksters.
Vietnam era veteran
Alex the 1st Cav is mobilizing to head there as well. Most have gotten their shots and now they are being instructed on how to use haz mat suits. I kid you not!!!!!1
WWNam was the trial balloon that emboldened the fruit salad crowd to really ramp up the weapons bidness. Scare the sheep, Ramp up the defamation rhetoric. Send in Bechtel. Blow up the tax funded toys. Whoop up the patriotism. Leave the vets cold and coughing. Look around for the next plausible moral outrage. Rinse and Reapeater.
The Orwelian rewrite is astounding. But the fact that people actually cared enough to march and yell and scream about the horrors and unjustified atrocities during the Vietnam war, says something of how our people were ready to sacrifice themselves to the batons and the horrors of the police here in our own country. What happened? No one stood up after that. The great mass of people seemed to not care anymore. We are still embroiled in these horror schemes. Egypt. Libya. Syria. Afganistan. Pakistan. Ukraine. Palestine. Iraq. Iran. and the list goes and goes. The power elite is losing the high ground. They have the power to cordone off funds and use our military or a mercenary military to do the dirty work. But meanwhile our name...the meaning of our name....The USA is considered a Paper Tiger. We have lost our soul to the CIA Pirates that have run this country into the ground using PR to manipulate the masses.
I'm making over $7k a month working part time. I kept hearing other people tell me how much money they can make online so I decided to look into it. Well, it was all true and has totally changed my life. This is what I do... http://goo.gl/yioYBZ
We are now at war with ebola. We have always been at war with ebola.
Bla bla bla. And 9/11 - Ft Hood etc weren't Islamist events. We're re-writing history faster than ever these days.
US servicemen of today, just need to do this.
Fuck you Obama; fuck your Pentagon NWO toadies
Soldier: Just Say No, I Won't GoUS servicemen of today, just need to do this. Fuck you Obama; fuck your Pentagon NWO toadies
Could not agree with you more AJ.
And if we want to avoid a nuclear shooting match with the likes of Russia on a border situation in Ukraine we've created for ourselves again we better hope they have the guts to all go AWOL simultaneously!
Love him or hate him. The only leader on that front is the poor kid from Oklahoma that had a conscience and couldn't live with what he was seeing and doing and has made the ultimate sacrifice rotting in a cell for telling the World the truth of what his government's been doing in the Middle East.
Second to him the only other one I can think of had he lived would have done the same was Pat Tillman. But of course Don Rumsfeld and General McChrystal and all the other "yes" General(s) who buried the lie of what happened to him deep in the ground along with his remains never made it that far, although his story and what happened to him certainly did.
Ever stop to ask yourself how it is with all the lies that have been told so many in the service can stay loyal to their paycheck when they know and understand that what they've been doing is so criminal especially after all these years and what the foundation for it was based on?
"Ever stop to ask yourself how it is with all the lies that have been told so many in the service can stay loyal to their paycheck when they know and understand that what they've been doing is so criminal especially after all these years and what the foundation for it was based on?"
More of a human trait in general: the ability to turn a blind eye when one's paycheck (which the reptomamallian brain interprets as survival) is at stake. For the most part, humans are weak and pathetic, herd-following creatures with short time horizons and are primarily driven by unconscious animal impulses; the rare individual notwithstanding.
P.S.
Speaking of Pat Tillman...
Somebody find this cocksucker in Washington State and put him "on ice" for what he's done and the lies he's told in his betraylal of a fellow soldier in being the Pontius Pilate for the U.S. Army's "official story"!
If nobody peels him we know that none in the U.S. Army have a soul and that you will all get what is coming your way through your continued deeds in this World!
Looks like they need to quarantine as many voters as possible.
Fortunately, it is working flawlessly.
Oh wait..
Games are being played, aren't they?
Orwell didn't always have great or meaningful quotes which may be confirmed, when the inconel tablets of Q99X2, the tablets that were dropped into the ocean between Hawaii and Clalifornia, are read, by my anscestors, in 1.2 billion years from now.
Read by your ancestors? What, will there be a time machine?
ffs hell no, can't imagine sending obama just something like 200 years ago ?
today world would be... no, the world of today would not be anylonger.
Just give the Vietnam veterans the 15 million dollars. Now. Cocksuckers.
Wait....what?......someone owes me $15 million? Tell me more.
Comment from another forum:
Dixie fan • 3 hours ago
"Has our fearless leader forgotten that it's called the "National" Guard for a reason? Just look at what our nation has become.
1. The VP's son is booted from the military for cocaine, and I guarantee he won't see even one day in the brig and he'll keep his multi-million dollar per year job on the board of directors of a Ukranian energy firm working for a coup imposed government.
2. The president's wife videotapes herself dancing sensually with a turnip. Can you imagine the spouse of any other head of state acting so foolishly?
3. We are now openly supporting terrorists in Iraq and Syria when our military has spent the last 13 years fighting against them. Did the mothers of the dead soldiers that have only flags now sacrifice their sons for this?
4. We have the lowest labor participation rate in my entire lifetime but the stock market is still stable thanks to trillions of dollars going directly to the banks that steal from all of us.
5. In America today it's impossible to run a small business because the large firms can hire lobbiests to protect them and accountants to get them out of paying taxes.
6. In the America I grew up in we got a week off of school in April and it was called Easter break, nobody cared. In the America I grew up in everyone in polite society, regardless of religion still said Merry Christmas, nobody was offended.
7. Today college kids can't find a job after they graduate and they have to move back in with their parents. When I got out of college 20 years ago, I had a job in 2 weeks, and it paid enough to get an apartment and buy a decent car.
8. When I was a child, I never saw whales driving scooters in the grocery store, look what we have now. And you know why? Because they live on food stamps and they can't afford to buy nutritous meals.
9. My wife is from Venezuela. She remarked to me recently that she is astounded that America is the most powerful nation on earth. She said you're just as corrupt as my country, and at least in Venezuela the people are aware that the politicians are ripping them off.
And last but best
10. When I was a child American leaders lectured the communist leaders for their hypocrisy and brutal treatment of their populations. Now, we have a former KGB leader lecturing our leaders for the exact same things. And you know what? He's right."
Re #2: It could have been worse. Imagine, if you dare, what she could have done had she had a cucumber rather than a turnip.
Well, at least a cucumber would still respect her in the morning.
One of the reasons for trashing the Militia for the National Guard was to be able to send them anywhere. As the national guard is a part of the standing army the general government can do as it pleases with them. Not so with the Militia. Of course with the supposed ratification of the 17th and the loss of their Militia's the states are no longer sovereign. 1913 was the year the Republic died... officially.
At some point in time either we re-establish the Republic or go full fledged Dictatorship. I personally believe and history pretty much agrees it will be the latter.
As a VN Veteran I believe we fought gallantly but for the wrong reasons which was why we gave up. Same goes for all the other wars. Fighting for your country is one thing. Acting as mercenaries for your government is quite another.
"10. When I was a child American leaders lectured the communist leaders for their hypocrisy and brutal treatment of their populations. Now, we have a former KGB leader lecturing our leaders for the exact same things. And you know what? He's right.""
Best comment of the last two centuries !
Dirty hippies won't stop causing trouble.
EH Carr wrote (in "What is History?") this about the Middle Ages but it fits any historical narrative:
"Our picture (of history) has been pre-selected and predetermined for us, not so much by accident as by people who were consciously or unconsciously imbued with a particular view and thought the facts which supported that view worth preserving..."
I think it is important that historical accuracy prevail. Glossy is not accurate. To the victor go the spoils--part of those spoils is making your version of the events into the 'historical narrative'. This new effort by the pentagon shows you who 'won'...the MIC.
I commend you Mike by bringing this to light, but there is another oversight that needs to be brought up. Vietnam, like any other military action since WWII was not a war. It was a "police action". People need to understand exactly who as the power to declare war, and it's not the president. The MIC gets around the constitution by naming their butchery names like "police action", or "kinetic action", and now we have the never endig war on terror.
Very good point. Things like this need to be pointed out on every occasion.
Ideas, principles, and language are too Important to let them slide into meaninglessness.
Dr. I agree it has been termed a police action ( I think the same was said our move to get UN backing in Korea) but I would argue that in a sense the war was declared. Not officially by Johnson going to the Congress to ask for a declaration of war, but didn't Congress abdicate that and actually bless the escalation with the Gulf of Tonkin resolution. If I remember correctly only one or 2 congressmen voted no.
...... honor and valor???? Fucking murderous assholes..... the VN war had many facets to be sure and as in all wars the everyday folks suffered the most but really fucktards.... the only valour displayed was by the grunts on the ground fighting not for some fucked up ideal that was being rammed down the sheeples throats but truly for the man beside them the country of most became the size of a platoon when the bullets and blood started to fly and that my fucked up psycho friend has little to nothing to do with domino theories or any of that other horseshit that gets punted around your fucked up little world.
...... or maybe you believe there is valour in the golden triangle drug trade, it certainly helped to keep the facade alive for many years - or how about the arbitrary genocide carried out with your carpet bombing of haiphong and hanoi in 12-72 yeah thats something to be really fucking proud of, murdering civilians just to save face with the southern puppet, Agent orange, sarin gas yeah y'all got a lot to be proud of alright......but the one that really gets me every time i see that fucking psycho J Mac is how you abandon so many just to save a few fiat bucks - fuck you were just printing them anyway - Johnnys role was much more cowardly though just couldn't stand the shame of having broken ..... asshole everybody breaks but not everybody is a coward about it....
Vietnam doesn't forget they just celebrated kicking the french out last week and every year they celebrate surviving your murderous reign of terror - and me well I feel so proud every time I give money to a young man or woman on the streets of Hanoi who was born with majorly deformed limbs or no limbs at all thanks to your chemical warfare legacy....... yes Pentafucks you really should be so proud.....
Assholes.....
You got that right. Buddy of mine died from ALS. Higher ratio of ALS with people exposed to agent orange. He won two silver stars and two purple hearts to my knowledge.
One day I asked him, "Jim, do you know what you were fighting for?"
He looked at me, "The President ordered us to go, that's all I need"
I didn't say any more, what use would it have been?
Why am I not surprised?
Heinz Kissinger has been re-writing his own history for decades now, as he learned from his hero, Metternich.
Commentarii de Bello Gallico, perhaps the most widely read Latin text, was Caesar's master propaganda piece.
There's nothing new here; it's the same as it ever was.
The '60's kids are so desperate to relive their youth one last time before they kick off to their great reward. Narcissis generation 1, whom begat the narcissis generation 2 who now "question authority" by securing as much power as possibble to themselves.
very agree with this state of mind and this observation about how 60' child raised - but also and mostly the 45'-50'
they acts like a revenge of their childhood... and they know by experience kids this days not help that much old parents...mostly coz of the cost i can tell.
Trashing boomers time... How bout' this:
According to CNN exit polls, millennials voted for Obama 60% to 36% and accounted for 19% of all voters, up from 17% in 2008. Although white male millennials turned slightly less enthusiastic, the President’s huge margin among white women as well as minority millennials — roughly 40 percent of this huge generation — more than made up the difference. FORBS
President Barack Obama has always had a broad base of support among America’s youngest voters. In 2012, 60 percent of voters aged 18-29 took to the polls to reelect the president. According to a Harvard University’s Institute of Politics poll released on Wednesday, however, many young voters are regretting the votes they cast just over one year ago.Harrrvord.
How you enjoyin that O-Care? LOL
John McCain sure would've helped those millenials!
/sarc
Go back to your right wing radio programs, and regurgitate their talking points to someone else who cares.
What a queer retort based on unbased presuppositions.
speaking of rewriting history - the wiki entry on american entry into ww1 makes absolutely no mention of Balfour or Zionist efforts... which is strange because the entries on Lindbergh [and others] spends considerable time describing them as "anti-Semites" very largely for his claims that Anglophiles and Zionist Jews were trying to get the US into the war not out of concern for American needs, but for foreign ones.
Also "Jewish Bolshevism" assures us that there were like, hardly any Jews amongst the early Bolsheviks, and anyone who says different is merely an anti-Semite - a word meaning "a person who says true things Jewish people do not wish to be known"
The war on Amazon in "literary circles" is, parenthetically, driven by ADL, AIPAC, and the National conference of Presidents of America's 6 million Jewish/Zionist Organizations.
Amazon.com Targeted by Censors+1 for the link - I've been thinking Amazon was not Libertarian enough. Thank you for the reminder that they do offer a wide variety ;)
-1 for the Zionist reference. It is another ill-defined word designed to divide emotionally. Why not use a short phrase, or paragraph even, that describes the ideas or beliefs that you think the word represents?
"The war on Amazon in 'literary circles' is, parenthetically, driven by ADL, AIPAC, and the National conference of Presidents of America's 6 million Jewish/Zionist Organizations."
In celebration, I just purchased this book from Amazon:
The Culture of Critique: An Evolutionary Analysis of Jewish Involvement in Twentieth-Century Intellectual and Political Movements
http://www.amazon.com/The-Culture-Critique-Evolutionary-Twentieth-Century/dp/0759672229
Covers the Jewish-dominated pseudoscience excreted over the 20th century (e.g., Boasian anthropology, Freudian psychoanalysis, various leftoid political ideologies, Frankfurt School) in both conscious and unconcious service to a group evolutionary strategy (that seeks to fundamentally change the gentile culture of the host nation).
Duffy, thanks. I'm keeping this - anti-Semite - a word meaning "a person who says true things Jewish people do not wish to be known"
I think Vietnam is important as it shows that the drama is all bullshit. (Read my following statements knowing full well that we were in Vietnam so the industrial military complex could be funded.)
Then:
We went into Vietnam because if we didn't, those godless commie bastards would be walking down main street USA within a few years.
Guess what, we pulled out, those godless commie bastards are still there and they never showed up on main street USA.
Now: We must go into the Middle East because those radical, god worshipping bastards will be walking down main street USA within a few years.
You're correct that the commie bastards never showed up on main street USA. They're now headquartered at 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue, Washington, DC, USA.
And they're doing what they can to vaporize main street and its inhabitants.
One of them is in the White House right now, but he's scared to walk down the street.
'Dictators ride to and fro upon tigers from which they dare not dismount.' -Hindu Proverb
Dude down the street from me is a Vietnam Vet. He claims that he never once fired his rifle in combat because he didn't want to kill anybody. He still has shrapnel in his back and he sure as hell has PTSD. He's not dangerous, but he's not very functional either. He was drafted and it looks like that war really fucked him up.
Wars - all wars - really screw up the participants, physically or emotionally or both. WW II vets suffered in silence; none I knew when growing up wanted to talk about it if they'd been in combat. The problems caused by later wars are better recognized and publicized.
So the communists and enablers have a problem with how Vietnam is portrayed? The Pentagon got us into the war?
The liberal messiah Kennedy didn't escalate the proxy war against Krushchev in Laos and then Vietnam?
Kennedy didn't establish MACV and take troops levels from ~1000 to 16,000 ?
Kennedy didn't sanction if the assasination of Diem?
Johnson didn't take us to 400,000 by 1965.
Sounds like one group of historical revisionists don't like the perspective of another group
pssst. eisenhower sent the first usa troops into vietnam to fill the gap left open by the french defeat at dienben phu in 1954.
kennedy was the first to try supply side economics with the dramatic revision of the tax code that reduced taxes for the wealthy and the middle class.
goldwater, lbj's republican opponent wanted to nuke the world to assert usa dominance.
at that time foreign policy was the one thing both parties agreed to agree on.
try again without your political party crap. when are you going to learn both parties conspire against the american people as equally as they can. that is the only political difference.
Yes, I know the history.
My point is not the origins of american involvement as you can go back to WW2 when the prescursor to the CIA worked with Ho Chi Minh and the VietMinh against the Japanese.
My point is that all of the 60's radicals hypocrites glorified Kennedy as this great liberal ikon who would have pulled us from Vietnam when in fact he sanctioned the assassination of the Vietnam president and dramatically escalated us from assistance to active participants in the fighting.
He was no messiah, but this is a truncated history that conveniently leaves off the fact that Kennedy had a political awakening and reversed course away from war towards the end.
Much to the consternation of the war-loving psychopaths in the Pentagon, he ultimately resisted all proposals to send troops into Laos and opted for a negotiated settlement in lieu of war. They hated him for denying them their war in Laos.
He also decided to withdraw from Vietnam (see NSAM 263, which began the process and which LBJ reversed).
There are also his policy reversals (détente) with respect to the USSR and Cuba to consider. He was unquestioningly backing up the lofty words in his commencement address at American University (calling for an end to the Cold War), with action. Khruschev hailed the speech as "the greatest speech by any American President since Roosevelt" and made sure it got plenty of airtime in his country.
The CIA (with help from others) killed him for it. At the time Kennedy was surrounded by the criminally insane - men who literally wanted the US involved in a nuclear war and who were willing to resort to any means to bring it about.
The idea that Kennedy had an "awakening" is suspect in the least and really just another liberal revision. Kennedy was something that doesn't exist today and thats a Democrat who beleived in the supremacy of American military power in the world.
If you think by giving a few speeches you can count on a demonstrated change of heart with certianty well then all I have to do it point you to the Current POS occupying the White House. If that idiot had expired in office the first 2 years then we wouldn't have all of the demonstrated proof that he is in fact a POS.
Sorry actions speak louder than words. Thats the out for those liberals that keep saying Kennedy would have ended our involvment. 2 weeks are he sanctioned Diem's assassinated he was himself removed from the public stage and forever enshrined in the legacy of Camelot. Liberals can claim he had an awakening and a bullet to the head prevents any proof of that.
"Sorry actions speak louder than words."
Since you apparently struggle with reading comprehension, I'll again list those actions that demonstrated his turning away from war:
*He ultimately resisted all proposals to send troops into Laos and opted for a negotiated settlement in lieu of war, denying the war pigs the war they desperately wanted in Laos.
*He had decided to withdraw from Vietnam and began the process of withdrawing troops via NSAM 263 (which LBJ reversed immediately upon taking office).
*Détente with respect to the USSR and Cuba in an attempt to end the Cold War.
The "national security" establishment hated him for these actions and killed him for it. The Cold War was their gravy train and Kennedy was taking concrete steps to try and bring it to an end.
Has nothing to do with "liberal." I'm certainly no liberal in the modern (progressive) sense. It has to do with the ability to read books on the topic and absorb facts. Perhaps it's your own partisanship and tendency for flag-waving and authority-worship that prevents you from seeing through the fog of lies.
The desire to "get the rich" via taxation was used to further escalate wage imbalance. Taxing some (much) more than others, resulted in an ever higher wage scale at the top. The higher wage was necessary to pay the taxes.
It's never good to cheat or steal, even when you think you're justified.
If someone is treating you unfairly, then find someone else.
I thought we already had a whitewash of this thing?
It's not like they're trying to say it didn't happen.
And Agent Orange was good! So good that nowadays its ingredients are used as herbicides to be used in combination with GMO (cause the previous herbicides caused weeds to become resistant to it becoming 'superweeds').
its not as if what they are rewriting was anywhere near the truth, just the standard propaganda model they've used for past 50 years
my lai was just one of a large number of similar incidents thet went completely unnoticed by the msm.
the people of vietnam still suffer horrendously as a result of injuries/birth defects/unexploded ordinance/long term effects - cancers complex mortal diseases, poisoning - dioxins/etc, and may not recover fully for another 100 years
you were the aggressor, you invaded a sovereign nation and sent it back to near medieval times, you sacrificed the blood and treasure of an entire generation of your own and a 1000 times over of 'the enemy' - the peaceful illiterate and backward in our terms, peasants. you justified your warmongering by claims of fighting for freedom, you stacked lie upon lie and the media patriotically, lol owned by the masters, gleefully regurgitated your insane rhetoric, you the corporation that is the united states are guilty of first order crimes against humanity for which there can only be one appropriate punishment, extreme times call for extreme measures...............and so it all began again.
in ww2 50% deaths were civilians
vietnam 75% civilians
gulf war/afghanistan 80-90% civilian
next war 99% civilians?
america the corporate grand wizard of the world of the 93rd degree you really are the great satan.
i think everything we see is little more than the symptoms and the underlying cause was contracted at the moment the americas became a federation back in 1776. why else would you want to conceive of a whole continent of relatively independent pioneer built states, than to look to dominate the world, this is americas absolute peak and at the same time its absolute defeat we are sitting on the edge of eras brothers and sisters, what will the new masters bring? i wonder.
So are you for the master slave dynamic, or for freedom? You appear to be for both.
Honor the Viet Nam war dead by NOT surrendering to global Socialism
Kill a Kenyan Communist to honor our war dead
The profiteers, banksters, pols, funcs, and crats profited as planned; for ten years.
Vietnam was a great success.
An American, not US subject.
"War is a racket."
We have not had a government of, by and for the people for many, many years. We have a government of, by and for a tiny, wealthy elite dedicated to enriching themselves.
Princeton's study says it takes 85% support to go against them.
Remember why it was referred to as "General Dynamics"?
War profiteering at its' most blatant.
A standing military force, with an overgrown Executive will not long be safe companions to liberty. The means of defence agst. foreign danger, have been always the instruments of tyranny at home. Among the Romans it was a standing maxim to excite a war, whenever a revolt was apprehended. Throughout all Europe, the armies kept up under the pretext of defending, have enslaved the people. ~ James Madison, Speech before Constitutional Convention (6/29/1787).
A good article on this: http://archive.lewrockwell.com/vance/vance110.html
I personally think the constitution itself was the first step to the tyranny we all see these days but Mr Madison, some say the Father of the Constitution, allowed a constitutional standing Army?? And thus this ZH article isn't really surprising.
IMO We should have stuck with the Articles of Confederation.
No one ever called me a hippie during the VietNam era. I didn't burn my draft card and didn't hightail it to Canada. However my gut told me the last place I wanted to be was VietNam. I just didn't "get it." Luckily I got into the National Guard and was never deployed overseas. Here I am, 45 years later, still waiting for someone to explain to me why tens of thousands of my fellow countrymen died over there. It was the same pile of BS we're hearing now from the insatiable neo-cons. Then it was "we must save the world from communism". Now it's ISIS, or weapons of mass destruction, or any other line of BS they can come up with. It was BS then, and it's BS now. BTW, Hagel looks to me like he attended one too many pot parties during the 60's. How can anyone in their right mind believe anything this dope tells them. That goes for the rest of the criminals in DC, both parties included.
In these days I knew highly decorated vets and a few who high tailed it to Canada. Twenty years later I was discussing this with a Colonel in the Air Force. We disagreed on the character of those who went to Canada.
He thought they were scum. I retorted, "Any man who will give up his lifestyle, leave family and friends and does this knowing full well many will call him traitor. But if he does this, not out of fear, but bacuse he believes the war was wrong and he wanted no part of it because of beliefs, he is a brave person.'
So Kent State will be erased from the history book?
that was a hoax. those were crisis actors.
lmao besnook, that's a good one
It's "Tonkin"...
Here's an idea: STOP ENLISTING.
And why the hell not?... We've got business in finishing off the Middle East and Russia's closest border neighbors which means we need lots of "fresh ones" in line to replace the mentally handicapped and disturbed that are used up and ready for "throw away"!
I showed this one earlier and it is definitely worth revisiting given this post!
http://warisacrime.org/content/laughing-our-way-destruction
The losers have a greater need to rewrite history .
"We were wrong, terribly wrong. We owe it to future generations to explain why." — McNamara, writing in his 1995 memoir, In Retrospect, on the management of the Vietnam War
Bardèche’s Nuremberg or the Promised Land foretells the future much better than Orwell's Nineteen Eighty-Four.
Maurice Bardèche’s Nuremberg or the Promised Land is a revisionist classic. . . . That anyone in 1948 could have foreseen so accurately our modern world is to me astounding. Bardèche recognized that the judicial travesty at Nuremberg was not simply an act of vengeance by victors against the vanquished and that what was on trial there was not just the particular German defendants, nor the German nation, nor even National Socialism, but rather nationalism itself: the idea that a people own the land that they have long lived in and have the right to live in it as they wish and to exclude others from living in it if they so wish. It is nationalism in any form which was condemned at Nuremberg.
With amazing prescience Bardèche foresaw in its condemnation the coming of an international system which is first and foremost economic, not political or governmental. Its purpose is to protect an international economic élite, not ordinary persons, or peoples, or nations. It offers the latter lots of rights but no guarantees that these rights will be respected. Its laws are unclear (unlike those of a prince) and broadly unenforceable, but the system does not attempt to enforce them broadly but only selectively. For selected victims punishments are severe. Victims are selected not so much because they have broken laws but because they have offended the “universal conscience,” the conscience created and fostered in us all by the media (Bardèche’s “radio”). Bardèche clearly foresaw the system which we today call “globalism,” although he nowhere uses that term. He also foresaw at least implicitly many other aspects of our world: Third World immigration, the irrational glorification of democracy, loss of sovereignty, humanitarian wars and interference, hate crimes, affirmative action, racial miscegenation and replacement, etc.: “At the bottom of the sanctuary there sits a Negro god. You have all the rights, except to speak evil of the god.” “And, from one end of the world to the other, in perfectly similar cities . . . there will live under similar laws a bastard population, a race of indefinable and gloomy slaves, without genius, without instinct, without voice. . . But this will be the Promised Land.”
In 1949, one year after the publication of Nuremberg or the Promised Land, another prophetic book was published, George Orwell’s novel Nineteen Eighty-Four. In it Orwell describes a scary future in which there is a single party dictatorship, living conditions are drab, food is scarce, people’s thoughts are openly controlled by Big Brother, their words and actions are monitored through “telescreens” which they cannot turn off, they are given no choice over what they view on these screens, there is only one channel on the “telescreens” and one film (always a war film) in the theatres, in one such film refugees trying to escape are shot to the delight of the audience, some of these refugees are Jewish, “the Enemy of the People” is a Jew, Emmanuel Goldstein, who is condemned for “advocating freedom of speech, freedom of the Press, freedom of assembly, freedom of thought,” people are openly taught to hate him and his followers during “Two Minutes Hate” and “Hate Week,” sex is discouraged through a “Junior Anti-Sex League,” the Inner Party is called the “Inner Party,” thoughtcrime is called “thoughtcrime,” Thought Police are called “Thought Police,” the media propagate obvious, self-contradictory lies such as: “War Is Peace,” “Freedom Is Slavery,” “Ignorance Is Strength,” people are told that democracy is “impossible” (although the Party is said to be its “guardian”), capitalism is viewed as a barbarity that has “vanished.”
The world described in 1984 little resembles that in the Occident today. We live in multi-party democracies. Our mainstream media tell us not only that democracy is possible and a very good thing, but that its triumph everywhere is virtually inevitable, an inevitability which we should make every effort to encourage. Living conditions are generally good, food is abundant. Capitalism is alive and well and is promoted as an economic panacea. Our politicians advocate the same things as does Emmanuel Goldstein. Our media propagate obvious lies such as: “Diversity is our strength,” but they at least avoid flagrant self-contradictions (some kinds of diversity may indeed be a source of strength, although certainly not the radical ethnic diversity that our media promote). Refugees do not flee our societies, but rather risk their lives trying to get into them. We are not taught to hate, but to tolerate. Sex is not generally discouraged, even among the young. With our multi-channel televisions and the internet we are free to see, hear, read, and discuss almost anything, if not everywhere. Freedom reigns. Yet to some that freedom seems, if not illusory, useless. It is useless because people’s thoughts and actions are monitored and controlled not by anything outside themselves but by their own warped consciences, consciences deliberately warped by our mainstream media, consciences closely resembling Bardèche’s “universal conscience.”
Orwell’s and Bardèche’s books have had quite different careers in the Occident. Orwell’s, although formerly banned in the Soviet Union, has been widely read and praised; Bardèche’s is still banned in France and is generally unknown elsewhere. 1984 has served to warn us against the dangers of Communism, and for that deserves acclaim. But one cannot help but wonder if its general acclaim today is not also an index to its irrelevance. We have escaped the dreadful future envisioned by Orwell in 1984. We have not escaped the dreadful future envisioned by Bardèche in 1948.
http://www.theoccidentalobserver.net/2013/07/maurice-bardeches-vision-of...
Orwell not only made EG Jewish, there is a reference to a painting or photo of a woman and child as victims of war early in the book and she is said to 'look Jewish'.
But Jews as a group are, by far, and inarguably, the wealthiest, and most politically powerful ethnic or religious group in the country - and not just that, but very disproportionately to their numbers.
In other words, Orwell's picture of the scapegoat and victim is outmoded. If anything The Inner Party is probably over 50% comprised of Jews - who are 2.5% of the population as a whole, and who, as a group, have allowed Israel to essentially compromise the NSA, buy Congress, and conflate US foreign policy with Likud's.
But - there is resistance.
Maybe the Jews are the 'Chosen People' after all.
Chosen to shove this hypocritical world -- and themselves -- down the hungry maw of the garbage disposal looming before us, larger every day.
If anyone else has posted this -it bears repeating!
Let the Vietnam Veteran have a Clockwork Orange moment watching this one with eyelids "forced open", over... and over... and over... Again!
That includes the rest of America that never served but ignored what their Country was doing over there as well!
My goodness but we must have an abundance of PTSD vets on this site who either don't give a shit about what they did in Korea, Vietnam, Latin America (pick your country), Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya, Syria, Yemen and now Ukraine, or want to blame what they did on everyone else but themselves.
All I can say is that the U.S. military and the state of Israel has taught you well!
I wonder if there will be a chapter about members of GIs United protesting the Vietnam War. I was part of a crowd of at least 2000 GIs at the May 1970 rally in Fayetteville N.C. where Jane Fonda, Rennie Davis, Mark Lane and others came to speak. I was dissapointed that Abbie Hoffman was not there to add a touch of humor to the affair. Most of us, myself included, were serving in the 82nd Airborne, and more than half had already done their tour in Vietnam. I don't recall seeing anyone in uniform. It was a great day. I think some bands played and Jane Fonda was beautiful.
I wish just one conspiracy fact (and there are many) could come to light and be finally proved to avg america in spite of media spin or attempts at whitewash or cover up. I just dont see how, with all the investigative talent of US citizens and other countries heads of state and citizens, that 9/11 is not even seriously questioned by most americans.It all comes down to who you consider a credible news source and thus far MSM has not disappointed the masses. Even if it's not an 'event' but rather an institution like hidden tax through monetary policy. Just fucking expose something, anything, with enough proof to grab attention of the sleeping, willfully ignorant sheep.
I hope they cover "beers for ears" and the kilos of coke in the cavities of the corpses in the coffins.
Should be an interesting, if horrifying, read!
"Who controls the past controls the future; who controls the present controls the past. NOW TESTIFY!! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j_zyb-XXWz0
Sooo, before my time, but I gather it was a heroic war fought by brave US soldiers to stop the spread of Communism and cannibals who were set to invade the United States, the few dissenters were mainly hippies and pro cannibal rights people and they should be thankful that they live in a free country and were not shot on sight at the time.
you were not there, and dont sound like you are all here, at this late date. Many hundreds of thousands protested the war as time went on. people of all types
Dreadnaught, I think you missed the "sarc" button.
are they going to include the "kill em all and let God sort it out" attacks on villages? The Pentagon willingly paying $1000.00 for replacement toilet seats, etc?
what about the many superior officers killed by their own men via "fragging"-tossing a live grenade into an officers tent while they were sleeping?
just sayin-KEEP IT BALANCED-our poor boys were pawns in a game NOT of their own making
veit nam beautiful country, from SAPA in the north to the scuba diving in the south.
Still suffering from the Agent Orange sprayed over a massive area.
Go to the war memorial and see the horror spread by the U.S.
Communist government seem to run things quite well even though the country is poor. Lots of russian money invested, and U.S. still quite hated.
Please go live in your beloved communist country
Par for the course for this administration. More Bullshit. Going to war in Vietnam was stupid, predicated on a lie, resulted in millions of dead and injured, ended in defeat and did not have the support of the American people, at least once they saw through the propaganda.
These characteristics are more or less the same for Afghanistan Iraq Libya Ukraine Syria they are just unfinished so defeat hasn't been declared yet.
Free from the american military Vietnam went on to become a thriving Comunist/Capitalist country. We can only hope
There are no "thriving" communist countries, nor have there ever been. China started to thrive when it abandoned communism and when Western governments and businesses gave it almost all their IP and shipped their jobs there, to the benefit of Wall Street and no one else. Deng Xiaoping left the communist party in charge but set them on a path of junking communist economic policies.
Vietnam ultimately followed China into a path of a politically authoritarian one-party state with economically liberal (non-communist) policies, getting wealthier by providing cheap labour to use Western IP to replace jobs in the US and Europe.
The Chinese are an industrious people and always have been, as are the Vietnamese, except when hamstrung by government, particularly communist governments.
Singapore and Japan, which were never communist, grew affluent far earlier than China or Vietnam.
Chapter 1
.
we never did anything important bitchez
Fair dinkum, what a bunch of hogwash, bowled up by a bunch of self-serving leftists.
There were countries, North and South Vietnam, similar to North and South Korea. In both cases the North was communist, being adjacent to China. In both cases the North invaded the South, supported by both China and Russia.
In the case of Korea, the US and its allies blocked the invasion from the North and left troops in place to prevent a resurgence. In the case of Vietnam, they initially fought back but were undermined at home. It was a war fought by the western countries mainly using conscripts. Plenty of cowardice masqueraded as patriotism back then.
Personally, I went (not US) and was impressed by the heroism of many of the South Vietnamese fighting for their freedom against North Vietnamese armed and supported by the USSR and China, and whose families and villages were subject to continual terror.
Did political leaders and some military leaders cock it up? Sure, that's what happens in war on all sides. Did some war crimes get committed by allied soldiers? Sure, for the same reason, but NOT as a matter of government policy. On the other hand what we call war crimes were a matter of policy by the communists (Viet Cong and North Vietnamese).
Was a peace agreement signed by all parties in 1973? Yes. Did the North Vietnamese quickly break it after the US left? Yes. Did the Democrat controlled Congress refuse to allow the US to honour its treaty with South Vietnam when the North reinvaded? Yes.
The US has become careless and destructive in where it intervenes around the globe. But that does not mean all its past fights were dishonourable.
There was a real global conflict between communist and non-communist states and that Cold War era was marked by widespread, rational fears about nuclear annihilation. The strategic military buildup started under Reagan led to the fall of the USSR, without firing a shot.
Ironically, neither Russia nor China are now communist, though the latter in particular has a fairly authoritarian one-party government. But Western countries increasingly resemble the old communist states, with socialist policies, authoritarian surveillance control, central planning. All the policies espoused by people like Hayden and Fonda.
The US could beat its enemies abroad but not the ones at home.
you've got to read some revisionist history on the cold war.
So true Baz - there are many who will be searching the internet so they can report what the internet told them to say.
Very good analysis... And this is the reason why we could invest in Cambodia and have a better life here than in Europe!
Very good analysis... And this is the reason why we could invest in Cambodia and have a better life here than in Europe!
de nile is not only a river in egypt
War is always about currency. Im surprised it took these creeps this long to put the Vietnam "movie" into syndication.
All of the listed "scholars and activists" are worse propagandist than the pentagon.
And their job is easy. Ask their followers what century and in what country the war was fought.
"1700's? South America?"
Mr Hayden is not crediting the corrupt politicians in DC for drafting American young men and woman into this quagmire of a war, I think he is missing a few brain cells. This is the reason Anti war protests led to the largest and most organized protests on Washington DC. We have a similar problem currently operating from DC today though the politicians have now figured a way to have perpetual and continuous wars around the world fighting an unknown named Terror.
and they do not even fight it, they send our soldiers into a war zone with 'rules of engagement' which a cop in the streets could not follow.
Can't we all just get along? Fuck no.
Take the gloves off.
The first casualties should be the imbedded reporters.
Then we would be free to take care of business.
Maybe they should send in the Ferguson cops.
I worked in Vietnam two years ago, dredging rivers for gold.
The vegetation there, after 45 years , agent orange still retards growth.
A geologist, a colleague of mine, got his leg bown off 6 years ago from an American mine.
Apologists can say what they want, but Vietnam was an American disaster.
for all countries involved, it was a disaster - Vietnamese lost millions of lives
all wars are hell, no exceptions
they're still digging up bombs in europe and some still go off
mentalities were much different 50 years ago
Dredging is a disaster for rivers.
For gold no less.
An American disaster started by the French, perpetuated by the British and dropped in Americas lap like a shit sandwich.
Yes sir, somebody held a gun to the CIA's head and made them order the assassination of Ngo Dinh Diem .
Then they covered it with napalm and agent orange and ate it with relish.
Yum yum
Sounds like a Vietnamese disaster.
PATRIOTISM - a particularly virulent disease that primarily strikes males in their prime causing death, dismemberment, and severe mental issues. Older males in the age range of 40 to 80 are remarkably immune to this disease. Currently, there is no known cure and there is absolutely no research on developing a vaccine...
There is nothing wrong with patriotism, it is in fact good.
What is wrong is having government and politicians in charge of war, be it just or unjust.
Government in today's form is the virulent disease which needs a cure.
What is not mentioned is the fact that the left is re-writing virtually all of our history and teaching lies to our children.
We are being destroyed from within by a virus which has killed billions - communism.
Spoken like a true French whore.
They all sat down and saluted their fuhrer when he went around the Maginot Line.
If it weren't for Patriotism, you would all be goose stepping and mumbling german right now.
Their choice was to fight and lose, along with a few million lives and destruction of an ancient country. or to accept reality. The war continued with countries who saw their national interests threatened by Hitler and were in a position to succeed.
In fact, we succeeded in large part by an alliance with a virulent communist regime who fought like heros and lost around 30 million lives attacking and destroying Hitler's eastern front.
In the subsequent decades we had to contain said communist regime and ' protect' countless lesser Fascist regimes from communism.
Seen in this context it was , like all wars, a farce, but in the context of individual lives, a tragedy.
the main problem with the vietnam war was that the pretext of the war --the Tonkin Gulf incident--was a LIE.
The Tonkin Gulf Incident--the causus belli for the war--was fabricated by the american military. They lied about what the north vietnamese did. Period. The whole thing was a lie.
The real problem is that the USA is not really a nation, but instead is a labor camp and war machine for the corporations. Always has been from the start.
End the USA by voiding the constitution and reverting to the Articles of Confederation. End the USA and end the death grip the corporations have on the world. The USA is a pseudo-democracy, and the corporations control it and its huge military. Through this military and the american consumer market, the corporations control the world. We must end the USA and thereby end the death grip the corporations have on the world.
Restore democracy to america by voiding the constitution and reverting to the articles of confederation (which were illegally discarded over 200 years ago by our founding plutocrats).
'Leftist Conservative' sounds a lot like a synonym for 'Retarded Communist'
now that is the kind of deep analysis you can only find online....
Quite true
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=V4s9pdL7tpA
Suck it up neoliberalism trash bin.
There is a quote which I think was attributed to Orwell, something like: "The sole purpose of a bureaucracy is only survival." I searched for hours reading Orwell's quotes online, and could not find it. If someone has a link to the quote I'd appreciate them posting it.
do you need to know he said it to know it is a truthful idea?
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=V4s9pdL7tpA
Another tidbit to suck off your faggot partner.
What War hasnt been re written by the victors???
The War Between the States was just about slavery....ask anyone who hasnt read about it.
And as a conversation about WWII went, Churchill's aid said "and what will history say?"
and Winston said, "don't worrry, WE will write it."
Yes. That's why the two term elected nigger agenda failed. The issue is simple politics and Wallstreet humping the market.
Our next President of the United States can be blue, Pink or Guantanamo bay orange. The banking industry is so fucked up. That's the focus we need to tend too.
What War hasnt been re written by the victors???
The War Between the States was just about slavery....ask anyone who hasnt read about it.
And as a conversation about WWII went, Churchill's aid said "and what will history say?"
and Winston said, "don't worrry, WE will write it."
JJP, One Fine, HELL of a man.
We were the Victors? Now that's what I call revisionism.
Here's some pictures of the USA's triumphal last days in Saigon, for your propaganda:
http://iconicphotos.wordpress.com/2009/05/19/the-fall-of-saigon/
I believe he meant Vicar. Correct me if wrong.