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Carl Icahn: "The Fed Turned This Market Around Here"

Tyler Durden's picture




 

By now, 6 years after America's grand experiment in recreating Soviet-style central planning started, it should be clear to all except that subset of Homo Sapiens also known as "economists", that the Fed's QE is not helping the economy. In fact, it is merely boosting wealth inequality, leading to asset price (hyper)inflation, middle class devastation, and its inevitable outcome is yet another asset bubble can which will need to be kicked eventually leading to even greater economic misery, greater inequality, more conflict, and increasingly: outright warfare. In fact the two final outcomes of more QE are becoming increasingly clear: broad hyperinflation a la the Bernanke chopper to offset ever steeper episodes of deflation (as one monetizing nations exports its deflation to all the other nations), which implies a failure in the reserve currency, and rising social conflict, which culminates in a French revolution-type social revolt when the poor finally roll out the guillotines.

The above is also largely clear to most, except the abovementioned economists and members of the Fed of course. So it is for their benefit that we present what two people who actually work successfully in the markets for a living, something that nobody in the Marriner Eccles can say, have to say about QE. We can only hope someone in the US money printing department reads it, but we doubt it.

First, here is David Einhorn, who spoke at the annual, and amusingly misnamed, hedge fund gala known as the Robin Hood Investor Conference, talking about Fed policy:

"I think they're behind the curve in terms of helping the economy. It's like too much of a good thing. They're actually, I think, slowing down the economy, even though they don't realize that they're doing that," he said.

Spot on. And the following is even more accurate:

When interest rates increase, the economy would ultimately benefit, he said.

 

"I don't really concern myself that much with the exit (of quantitative easing) because first of all, if they did raise rates I think it might be bad for Wall Street, but I think it would be good for the real economy and everyday, normal people out in the world, and, ultimately, you'd have faster GDP that would come from that," he said. "So, yeah, there would be a little hiccup in the market, but I think that would be a good thing to have happen."

Sadly, as both Williams and Bullard confirmed last week, the only thing the Fed cares about is the market. The economy is low on the Fed's list of priorities.

And speaking of the market, as a follow up from the same conference, here is another billionaire who has made his name in the market: Carl Icahn, on the topic of the market:

The Fed is really holding the market up.... The Fed turned this market around here because it let it be known that the Fed funds rate isn't going to be raised in March. I am concerned about the high yield market, I think that's in a major bubble, but nobody knows when it's gonna burst...

Good luck Fed with the whole "exit" thing.

 

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Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:21 | 5361750 SilverIsMoney
SilverIsMoney's picture

Fuck you!

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:20 | 5361754 NYPoke
NYPoke's picture

...and the horse you rode in on.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:21 | 5361759 SilverIsMoney
SilverIsMoney's picture

How could I forget! Great save NY...

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:23 | 5361760 markmotive
markmotive's picture

The upper limit on the Fed Funds rate is officially the most boring graph on the planet.

http://www.planbeconomics.com/2014/10/the-most-boring-graph-on-planet.html

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:26 | 5361772 bunzbunzbunz
bunzbunzbunz's picture

Carl Icahn is smarter than everyone here. /troll

No but seriously. He is smarter than most of us. Also, most of you are fat. Me too.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:35 | 5361801 zerozulu
zerozulu's picture

OT..

The freelance cameraman who contracted Ebola while working with NBC in Liberia is now disease free. So Ebola kills only blacks???????

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:39 | 5361810 Mr Pink
Mr Pink's picture

They had him hold a clipboard for a few days...all better

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:45 | 5361817 Rememberweimar
Rememberweimar's picture

We must print more Monopoly money to buy all of the resources from the people... http://www.dailyslave.com/jew-billionaire-carl-icahn-under-investigation...

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:45 | 5362015 flacon
flacon's picture
"The Fed Turned This Market Around Here"

 

Tell that to the mining stocks: GDX / SLW

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:46 | 5361835 Ness.
Ness.'s picture

He had scissors on his belt too.  Whew.  If only he could've hid under a wooden school desk, he would have been protected from everything.  

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:48 | 5361813 Rememberweimar
Rememberweimar's picture

Chosenites never lie, cheat or steal. And they would never murder ... And printing money is different than stealing money...

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:51 | 5361860 bunzbunzbunz
bunzbunzbunz's picture

It is different than stealing money. That is correct. Saying it is not differnet would be like saying growing hybrid tomatoes rather than heirlooms is stealing. It's like saying making a chair is stealing. After all, you didn't invent that chair.

Now, printing money has consequences. But so does not printing money. It allows a different group of rich evil bastards to gain wealth and power. I guess you think those evil bastards deserve it more.

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 00:00 | 5362206 Blankenstein
Blankenstein's picture

So plundering companies isn't stealing......

 

 

"How To Ruin A Company"

 

 

http://community.seattletimes.nwsource.com/archive/?date=19911103&slug=1...

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 00:37 | 5362287 orez65
orez65's picture

"And printing money is different than stealing money..."

Issacc Newton tried to be an alchemist by trying to turn lead into gold. He failed in that project.

Gold and silver are money, nothing else is.

You can not print money, you can print Federal Reserve Notes. Notice that US Dollars don't say Federal Reserve MONEY, because they are fuck.ng paper!! That's right PAPER! FUCKI.G PAPER!!!

So yes printing US Dollars is different than stealing money, that is stealing gold or silver.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 23:08 | 5362070 jerry_theking_lawler
jerry_theking_lawler's picture

Very interesting observation...been thinking about this for awhile. We should know really soon as the two nurses are slightly different ethnicities...are they 'trying' them all out (asian, black). Or is it a function of getting a blood transfusion from a survivor.?

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 09:25 | 5362836 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

Isn't that racist behviour?

Nature is racist? Nature IS racist. So we must destroy it...

Wait. This ideology really exists: Marxism! Stalin's favoured biologist Lyssenko: "Human DNA are useless artefacts."

Yes, nature is racist. And nature doesn't know equality. That's how life is kept healthy and the sick and degenerated is kept in check and balance with the healthy.

But if you want to promote the sick and degenearated you also know what you have to do: promote equality of what is not equal! That destroys all natural order and therefore every human culture and society...

 

Ofcourse nature is racist. Therefore races do exist!

It's fascinating to observe how propaganda can make people believe even the opposite of the most elementary facts they can see everyday with their own eyes.

And the principle why nature is racist is well understood, too: It's called biodiversity and it's a mechanism to INCREASE the chance of survival of a species, while reducing the number of races means reduction of biodiversity and reduction of the chances of survival of the species.

Therefore any sane person must be racist.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 23:57 | 5362195 Blankenstein
Blankenstein's picture

Nope 

He is just willing to steal others' livlehoods through raiding corporations' cash, pension funds, real estate, you name it.  The current bought and sold media replaced  "corporate raider"  with "activist investor" to try and fool the herd into thinking these crooks are humanitarians.

 

 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:26 | 5361967 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

"Carl Icahn: "The Fed Turned This Market Around Here"

"

"

Carl Icahn: "The Fed Turned Wall Street Profits Around Here"

"

There fixed you @ssHat

 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:01 | 5361893 ziggy59
ziggy59's picture

iCon doth protest too much...

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:03 | 5361895 tarsubil
tarsubil's picture

In Soviet America, horse ride you!

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:52 | 5361838 WhackoWarner
WhackoWarner's picture

Ultimate goal here?  In the West anyway is serfdom.  Slavery was too costly.  And today it is blatantly bad PR for whomever still exposes through journalism.

 

And I wish the US would get it.  This is your version of the detested Soviet planning.  Oh the horror. Oh the brainwash.  Oh No.  And on we go.

 

Slaves, like pets, cost money to maintain,  And maybe even a bit of a twinge of conscience now and again. 

 

But serfdom/ghettos;  oh well We can phase down the soup kitchens as we control civil disobedience and inflation.  So those "soup kitchen cards" will buy less and less. Until when?  How many people in the US have to become homeless or under the poverty line? before this "democratic" pinnacle of human rights wakes up?

It is like a football scoreboard of criminal behaviour every time I look at the climbing charts of people on "welfare".  Then you get all the Average Joe Millionaire politicos telling you how this is their problem.  AND many right here.

 

Many people here are one heartbeat away from what they distain.  (or disdain;  either one actually applies).

 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:55 | 5361869 bunzbunzbunz
bunzbunzbunz's picture

There will ALWAYS be people who only obtain enough to stay alive. And human nature will always be to only work harder if you can have more than someone else. Please make a point.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:34 | 5361992 daveO
daveO's picture

Debt slavery has been their intention forever. Due to the FED's success since 1913, serfdom is the ultimate destination. Lifelong welfare recipients (paid serfs since the 1970's) serve a purpose and are worth the investment, from the gov's perspective. So long as the world accepts dollars, the investment in serfs will make sense to the gov. parasites.

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 00:19 | 5362249 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

Detroit?

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 01:58 | 5362374 CASTBOUND
CASTBOUND's picture

my neighbor's half-sister makes $71 hourly on the laptop . She has been fired from work for 9 months but last month her paycheck was $17975 just working on the laptop for a few hours. look at this site... www.job-reports.com

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:24 | 5361751 ekm1
ekm1's picture

Bank lobby via Congress and White House is trying to lure suckers by ordering the Fed to keep QE.

Problem. There are no more suckersl left

 

There is absolutely no way out.

Bank lobby must and will choose few of their own to die as sacrificial lambs.

World is moving out of the system slowly and nobody will be left to trade with. The system is dying

 

If this continues (it won't), we'll suddently see countries world wide simply withdrawing from world trade and going just regional trade. They will simply dump USD and go barter.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:31 | 5361786 downrodeo
downrodeo's picture

Guns gold and ammo baby! That's the way out...

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:37 | 5361807 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

Given the MOA between the FDIC & BOE that puts the gamblers ahead of depositors on payout should a failure occur, that would result in the depositors enduring confiscation a la Cyprus & issued worthless stock.

Then there's MyRA...

So, knowing the LE has been militarized & thieving like Ali Baba, how do you see this playing out? Praetorians abandoning post? Mutiny?

I see supply chain issues leading to anarchy, amongst shortages of all necessities as we import everything & prices will dramatically rise due to scarcity. 

You've lived it. What's in your crystal ball?

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:57 | 5361874 ekm1
ekm1's picture

We were unarmed.

Americans are armed. Different kind of rage, the rage of an armed mob. See Ferguson.

It can't last very long. This is about to end

They wanted to end it in 2011 with MF global, then changed their mind

Then in May 2013 when yields rose, then changed their mind again.

 

It gets more and more difficult.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:30 | 5361975 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

If, I may ask, are you from Romania? 

I could never have dreamt they could keep the plates spinning this long.

There's the elections...

Do you see them levitating this farce until the 2016 elections?

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:45 | 5362018 ekm1
ekm1's picture

albania

 

 I think it has already gone too far. Elections have basically become irrelevant.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:40 | 5362004 daveO
daveO's picture

Ferguson is an example of TPTB, gov. and media, moblilizing their serfs as a distractionary tactic. 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:57 | 5361877 WhackoWarner
WhackoWarner's picture

@ekm1

 

Is regional economy necessarily a bad thing?

It hurts multinationals and their ownership of the political scene.

Other than that it benefits people working.

I have said over and over and over.  It is econimists and gov.s and Cent, Banks  that have brainwashed savers into the belief that INFLATION is necessary.  It is not when you have a stable currency and spending controls on gov. debt.

Inflation does not benefit anyone but the banks and government. Period.

 

Contolled inflation is nothing but theft.

 

 

 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:00 | 5361885 ekm1
ekm1's picture

Any region does not have all commodities and energy necessary to maintain standard of living.

 

If people accepted lower standard of living, then yes

It is all about acceptance

http://www.thegrocer.co.uk/Pictures/420xAny/0/8/5/38085_nutella-supply-c...

Here's Nutella's supply chain, global.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:04 | 5361902 WhackoWarner
WhackoWarner's picture

ekm1

 

Is regional economy necessarily a bad thing?

It hurts multinationals and their ownership of the political scene.

Other than that it benefits people working.

I have said over and over and over.  It is econimists and gov.s and Cent, Banks  that have brainwashed savers into the belief that INFLATION is necessary.  It is not when you have a stable currency and spending controls on gov. debt.

Inflation does not benefit anyone but the banks and government. Period.

 

Contolled inflation is nothing but theft.

 

 

 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:50 | 5362024 daveO
daveO's picture

To generate inflation, they must keep interest rates artificially low. This also benefits the largest corp's who have access to the nearly free money. Co's like Sears, Rite Aid and JCP. I remember J. Cramer calling for the imminent demise of RA about 6 or 8 years ago. In a 'free market' he would've been right. 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:10 | 5361917 FredFlintstone
FredFlintstone's picture

EKM, how are you hedging if I may be so bold to ask?

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:15 | 5361935 ekm1
ekm1's picture

canadian 100 day treasuries, that's it

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:11 | 5361925 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

If I get a vote for sacrificial lamb...... BANK OF AMERICA. 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:16 | 5361938 ekm1
ekm1's picture

also barclays

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:34 | 5361993 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

Whoa, whatabout GS?

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:42 | 5362010 ekm1
ekm1's picture

too intertwined

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:30 | 5361982 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

One lamb won't do it for me.  I want one full street sacrificed:Wall Street.

I have a feeling it won't happen.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:20 | 5361753 Pooper Popper
Pooper Popper's picture

These Assholes are really starting to piss me off!!!

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:30 | 5361761 fed_depression
fed_depression's picture

He's foobared. Rates are going to near 0 ala Japan or the system fails. It's that simple.

 

How can this idiot say high yield debt is too high but Apple to $200 in one week?

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:24 | 5361767 orangegeek
orangegeek's picture

icahn is dogshit and talks his book, nothing else

 

but the Fed is holding things up with POMO - thurs and the 28th for Oct

 

then the Fed will use proceeds from POMO to do similar things

 

notwithstanding the possiblity of extended POMO

 

while icahn is dogshit, yellen is pure filth

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:25 | 5361769 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Wasn't some part of some "law" passed in the latter half of the oughts something about a Dual Mandate given to the Fed to "create jobs"?

Time to fire them yet? ;-)

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:28 | 5361774 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

5.9% unemployment.  I'd say they're more likely to get bonuses than a pink slip.

Nobody said they had to be good jobs or that they had to count all the unemployed as unemployed.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:33 | 5361792 nmewn
nmewn's picture

True.

With these clowns in power we'll never see REAL 4.5% unemployment with good paying jobs ever again. Hey, lets do amnesty for millions of illegals, that should help!!! ;-)

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:56 | 5361873 surf0766
surf0766's picture

We can't have voter id cards but we gots 34 millions illegal id cards ready for the replacement voter force.

 

 

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:32 | 5361781 hobopants
hobopants's picture

Lets double down on the irony and fire the BLS while we're at it.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:41 | 5361823 nmewn
nmewn's picture

They're running neck-n-neck with the Fed excluding fuel & food from "core inflation" thats for sure...lol.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:14 | 5361937 Implied Violins
Implied Violins's picture

More like time to tire-fire them.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:52 | 5362032 daveO
daveO's picture

The dual mandate was put in during Carter's miserable failure, late 1970's.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:26 | 5361776 I Write Code
I Write Code's picture

Er, what was his first clue?

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:32 | 5361788 Squid Viscous
Squid Viscous's picture

Die "already" you old, class-less fuck, stop keeping us waiting!

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:34 | 5361793 Life of Illusion
Life of Illusion's picture

 

these fuckers ever produce anything but scams and BS ??????

Just great for a nation going down in flames!

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 00:03 | 5362217 yogibear
yogibear's picture

"scams and BS"

That's the new  employent critera now?

Being more dishonest and fraudulent is in these days. Your an odd-ball if your honest.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:41 | 5361822 new game
new game's picture

beyond hope for current morphined system. eventually the patient dies, but hey party like it's 1999! 

just plan on argentina with hillary as the czar of merica ruling by executive order, clear to see...

parallels are uncanny,ha...

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:44 | 5361832 surf0766
surf0766's picture

And now the dollar selloff begins

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:47 | 5361840 tempo
tempo's picture

60% of all operating earnings now invested in buybacks compared to 40% 10 years ago. Number of shares available for purchase down 1.3% per year. no opportunities for more capital investment w disposal incomes down.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:47 | 5361848 bugs_
bugs_'s picture

Boris Carloff Icahn

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:50 | 5361851 DOGGONE
DOGGONE's picture

Please see
http://www.showrealhist.com/yTRIAL.html
I think that this is obvious, or at least the leading candidate:
The MAIN ENABLER of sizable asset price bubbles is keeping the real price histories seldom seen!
The doers of 'seldom seen' testify to its effectiveness by their near unanimity, I say, see here:
http://occupywallst.org/forum/higher-education-panders-to-intellectual-s...
"America the Backstabbed!" -- by the financial sector, by journalism, by higher education, by holders of elected office, et al.
Last but not least, 3 Fed Chair warnings in a century:
http://www.showrealhist.com/3warnsRD.html

PS. The financial sector bought them all.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:11 | 5361920 WhackoWarner
WhackoWarner's picture

Sweetie until many people see how much they have been screwed there will be nothing.  Occupy was defeated and ridiculed into a joke or passing fad at best.

 

We are at a turning point in awareness.  That is why "they" worldwide want to shut down the internet or control it's message.  And troll around. 

 

Hey? I got time CIA. NSA  I could be a troll.  I have no objection to running around telling lies.  Know why?  I would know the difference.  Ethics cannot be bought.  But for $25/hour I will run around and act like an idiot.  Get in touch, I am sure you know how.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:50 | 5361852 world_debt_slave
world_debt_slave's picture

the rich elite for the rich elite, we are not invited

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:50 | 5361855 SillySalesmanQu...
SillySalesmanQuestion's picture

Carl should take a ride on snow plow soon. Preferably on a airport runway, while it's snowing....

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 21:53 | 5361863 stant
stant's picture

Sovreign debt crisis t minus 11 months ish

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:04 | 5361898 BouncyTheWonderbunni
BouncyTheWonderbunni's picture

NYP is alleging a backdoor prop up by the FED through foreign banks through an exchange in chicago called

 

the CME group buying S&P derivatives at a discount to stop last weeks crash.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:08 | 5361911 red1chief
red1chief's picture

The rich get much of their compensation from company stock, and the more it rises the more compensation they get. Hence the pressure on the corporate/bankster controlled Fed to keep the market propped up and rising.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:16 | 5361945 Colonel Klink
Colonel Klink's picture

Please slip into something more comfortable iCON, like a coma!

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:30 | 5361976 Duc888
Duc888's picture

 

 

Wallstreet = skim

46% os USA = leachfucks

Everyone else = producers.

 

Wallstreet is covered, as are the leachfucks by the producers.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 22:55 | 5362036 buzzsaw99
buzzsaw99's picture

he is losing his mind. paypal is the jewel but he expects a lot of competition in that space soon? diaper wearing maggot.

Tue, 10/21/2014 - 23:51 | 5362180 Midnight Rider
Midnight Rider's picture

The Fed's mantra is "just think how much worse things would be if we didn't print all these trillions of dollars, drive rates to zero and sacrifice the middle class for the greater good".

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 00:00 | 5362204 syntaxterror
syntaxterror's picture

What would these pussy traders be without the Fed?

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 06:49 | 5362573 Atomizer
Atomizer's picture

Carl,

When you start dumping your iCrapple Stock...We'll know. 

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 08:09 | 5362692 Last of the Mid...
Last of the Middle Class's picture

Spoken like a man who just lost a couple of billion and now wants the fed to print more to cover his losses while everyone else pays in higher prices. ESAD MF~!

Wed, 10/22/2014 - 10:09 | 5363097 falak pema
falak pema's picture

Janet Yellen's FED  vs the ZH's take on the markets : who is gonna win ?

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-most-successful-market-timers-the-f...

Bottom line, according to FED's Bullard : Don't take on the FED ! (You'll always lose)/

So, it goes back to what Robotrader used to say from day 1 : BTFD !

Some things never change!  As the FED fed market roars again !

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!