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Meet The Millennials: All You Ever Wanted To Know About America's Youth, In Charts
When it comes to the future of the US, the biggest question mark by far is anything relating to the Millennial generation, those Americans born between 1980 and 2000, which happens to be one of the biggest generations in US history.
In fact, the largest US age cohort is currently the 23 year olds. However, Millennials are different from previous generations in many ways. For example, today’s 25-34 year olds are more likely to be minorities (40%) and a higher share of them has college degrees (35%). In addition, they are choosing different fields of study in college: while engineering was in the top five bachelors’ degrees awarded in 1980, in 2010, psychology replaced it in the top five rankings. This student debt-bubble funded college infatuation also happens to be the biggest curse of the Millennials, and as discussed a year ago, "Millennials Are Devastated As American Dream Becomes Nightmare For Most."
Still, despite their differences, and the over $1 trillion in student debt which is making the US economic recovery virtually impossible, Millennials are in many ways like prior generations. Or rather better be if there is to be any hope of the conventional Keynesian medicine fixing a problem that may be at its core demographic (just like in Japan).
In order to get a better grasp of the wants and needs, as well as problems and liabilities of the Millennial generation, we present various extensive charts that highlight the key issues surrounding those young Americans which are gradually entering their post-college careers only to find pervasive disappointment.
First, as noted, here is the size of the Millennial generation in context:
They may be everywhere, but their job opportunities are limited, and not only in the US...
Which is also pushing the labor participation rate lower. Sorry BLS apologists: it has nothing to do with demographics and everything to do with global economic depression.
So without job opportunities, Millennials are forced to spend more and more time in a state of suspended occupational animation while hoping for better days.
Although as we noted earlier this week, record "student debt" is not just a young person problem any more: increasingly people in their 50s, 60s and 70s are crippled by loans they took out to help their professional development, which they find they simply can't pay back.
Still, there is some hope that the college (and student debt) bubble are bursting: college admissions in the past two years have declined.
So with fewer job opportunities available to Millennials, and with virtually no wage growth to talk of (for anyone, not just the young), it is not surprising that median incomes for those in the late 20s and early 30s have stagnated, usually at the expense of those 2-3 decades older.
In fact, of all nations, America's youth seem to be the most disadvantaged of all relative to the national average in recent years (whether Gen X and mostly the Baby Boomers are to blame is a different topic entirely.
The simplest way to show the lost income opportunity for Millennials is the following chart of median income for 25-34 year olds as a % of total:
With less disposable income, and thus fewer assets, today's youth is finding it ever more difficult to build up a solid credit history...
... which means with less credit available, they have to save up cash for rainy days...
... and another logical outcome: fewer can afford to buy homes and start familiies, instead chosing to live in their parents' basement...
... which assures that a Japanese style demographic collapse is just a matter of time.
It also means that the old American Dream of buying a home is increasingly impossible for most. The new American dream: renting.
To summarize the Millennial predicament: overeducated, with less disposable income and drowning in student loans. Yet like every other generation before them, they too have needs, wants and desires. In the purely materialistic realm these are the key needs as self-reported by Millennials.
The charts below summarize what they spend money on compared to all households:
Somewhat curiously, there hasn't been a dramatic change in the distribution of household spending over the past two decades:
Still, there is a notable shift in more recent years, especially when it comes to discretionary spending and education.
They may not have much disposable income, but they do have a vocal brand preference.
And while it is unclear if today's youth consumes fewer calories due to health reasons or simply because it can't afford to eat as much (or simply is getting better at self-delusion when reporting consumption patterns)...
... one thing is clear: they want their cell phone...
... and their online video.
So with all that bad news, what are Millennials to do? Why drown their sorrow in booze of course. Or rather, beer: that may be all they can afford these days.
Finally, for those who want to put all this together and invest based on the above information, here is a quick snapshot from Goldman of what the bank's preferred Millennial-inspired strategies are:
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BETTER BE VOTIN' FOR ROMNEY
When are they going to realize they are screwed by libtard Boomers? It is too late, money was spent years ago.
"So with all that bad news, what are Millennials to do? Why drown their sorrow in booze of course. Or rather, beer: that may be all they can afford these days."
And Pabst, no less....the official beer of World War II. Where's Bob Hope, Phylils Diller, and the liberty ship full of Pabst? What's old is new again.
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0063459/reviews
Listen.
This post is too fucking long with "WAY" too many embedded pics.
Ever heard of Twitter? "REFORMAT"!!
Make no mistake about it, millennials are here to take over the world.
"Make no mistake about it, millennials are here to take over the world. "
Selfie by selfie.
I hereby apologize for using dry subtle humor on the internet.
It won't happen again.
I'm surprised at how many didn't get it.
Wakey, wakey. Hint guys: Demographics. No-one lives forever. If we have to explain it any more than that, oh hell, I've already said too much.
Thanks NEP.
If I wanted to take over the world and in order to do so, design a generation so fucked up that they couldn't organise a Chook Raffle, let alone any meaningful resistance beyond a FaceBook post, or at best, a gathering where they throw colourful dust at each other (GAG!!!), then I'd create a world of Gen-Y....but I think someone surpassed even my wildest dreams.
Yeah-Yeah, give me a thumbs down or post some bullshit comment, WHATEVER!
Deep down we all know that Gen-Y are incapable of taking over the reins…I just wish they weren’t so fucking gay (no offence gay demographic).
"Make no mistake about it, millennials are here to take over the world."
With what? A smartphone and facebook account? Millenials are too pre-occupied with social media to do anything constructive. Or did you mean the Millenials plan to turn the fictional movie "Idiocracy" into documentary? http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/
Millennials picked Barry for 2012 (Millenials are apart of the FSA):
http://www.forbes.com/sites/joelkotkin/2012/11/07/why-obama-won-hispanic...
Millenials = perpetually distracted.
All by design.
The smartphones will be great when it comes time to riot. Flash riots will be the next big thing, of course when TPTB shuts down the phone system they'll be easily herded since they don't know how to do direct verbal exchange.
It was a joke and you missed it. I'll try to spell it out for you: When the older generations die out the millenials WILL indeed take over the reins.
Then again, who knows? Maybe the children / grandchildren of the millenials will snatch the world out from under them and they'll be too busy face-booking to notice.
okay, as much as I detest most of your posts here ...
you are absolutely SPOT ON here!
Good Gawd Tylers!!
WAY too many charts .. I mean, most of us here just know them as the #SELFIE generation.
'nuff said.
I enjoyed all the charts. I must be a sick person.
Kinda sums it up, doesn't it. One guy says too many charts...most likely meant too much information. Or to say another way, please spoon feed me small bits of information that I can understand because thinking and parsing is hard.
Others appreciate all the charts and information in one location so they can compare easily different information and come to their own conclusion.
The former will inevitably wait for the latter to tell them what to think.
You haven't had your attention span destroyed yet so I recommend 1000 hours of reality TV to kill off those pesky brain cells.
I'll take charts anyday over clickbait!
What charts?
If its too tough, stick to those comics!
Geez where are all the comments about how these kids should pull themselves up by their bootstraps, and what lazy fucks they are and all the usual 'boomer' clap trap about how they [boomers] did it. Our society is FUCKED, Fucked I tell you and it is not a matter of lazy, inept, or 'drugs' older generation[s] sold out the future of the children for the benefit of themselves. Personally I am of the opinion that all liberals and boomers should commit Seppuku for the betterment of all humanity, y'all allowed this to happen either by active participation or by complacency, so now do the right thing and give the future a chance, cause this Gen X'er sure as shit would not take any 'wisdom' from either group I listed above.
More millenials than GenXers? Then GenXers really will be screwed at retirement time. Assuming, of course, that voting counts. Actually, even if voting doesn't count (I believe it doesn't), it'll still make a great "excuse" for TPTB.
I'm a 'boomer' and resent what you say...because it's stupid. No one group is responsible for this mess. It was a multi-generational, collaborative effort, so get off your high horse, Mr. Gen X...you benefited from the lifestyle your boomer parents were able to give you...if it turned out to be more expensive than we planned, well, other factors played their role too. But you really don't hear Gen X'ers from third world countries doing this kind of generation-blaming, because it takes a certain comfort of lifestyle to have the time to ruminate about the unfairness of that life.
"I'm a 'boomer' and resent what you say...because it's stupid. No one group is responsible for this mess"
Right. Boomers sucked just as bad the previous and future generations. But boomers will be commiting mass generational warefare. They voted quadruple the size of gov't, and will demand 100 Kg of flesh to pay for the promised unfunded entitlments. I've never met a boomer that didn't like an gov't entitlement program!
You can't reason with boomers, but I sure as hell will enjoy watching their suffering in the decade to come. I only know a few, very very boomers that get it and they are doing everything in thier power to right the wrongs, them I respect the rest not so much. Besides still have yet to hear a good argument for why they should get a pass for this shit show.
I don't need a pass from you nor do I have to give you a good argument.
Think about that ...
Typical response from a chick. Is it that time of the month little girl.
Your generation gave us the likes of Bush and Obama, the surviellance state, militarized police, epic waste, fraud, and abuse, and potentially a full on marxist like Hillary. When this thing breaks it is going to get very messy.
I will not be surprised to see a repeat of 1930s Germany except this time I predict it will not be Jews going into the ovens but a generation.
So no, you do not have to give a good argument. On the other hand, you just might want to start coming up with one.
Boomers are a lot tastier than iPads.
It turns out that the greatest entitlement programs were started by Roosevelt and Johnson. By shifting personal responsibility to the state they destroyed self-reliance.
Very true. However let us be realistically honest. The only generation since the beginning of this thing that had to heft to make changes has only fought for its place at the trough. The boomers have done nothing but make things worse for more and more people.
"I've never met a boomer that didn't like an gov't entitlement program!"
Its in the boomers DNA to be entitled. The prototypical Free Shit Army (FSA). They fund the Pentagons FSA-MIC trillion dollar budget.
Thats why you see such gnashing of teeth on this page by the entitled tattlers when you call them out.
Boomers loath introspection.
The boomers created this huge spying apparatus and are fine with it.
Death Panels for all of them.
I'm a 'boomer' and resent what you say...because it's stupid. No one group is responsible for this mess. It was a multi-generational, collaborative effort
Thats a nice excuse now give me a REASON why your generation helped push this shit show further and further ahead without ever considering the consequences of the choices all the liberal hippies thought would make the world a paradise.........
BTW I am glad you resent my statement, I hope your Gen-X kids remember your words when they have to change your depends while you are fighting to stay alive and you have to look into their eyes and know that it was YOUR generation that could have stopped or at least severly slowed this mess, but you didn't you kept on partying like it was 1999, fuckwad.
not until we eliminate boomers from important decision-making bodies in america are we going to be able to right the ship. we've seen the consequences of their decisions, we've watched friends suffer poverty and die overseas because of what boomers manipulate the country into. that manipulation extends into every aspect of our lives, from wanting 'the american dream' (but is is really my dream? or did i inherit other ppl's dreams?), to sacrificing youth to jump on the bullet-train to the working world, to accumulation, to prepare ourselves to become members of the power structure as quickly as possible.
is in any wonder "psychology replaced [engineering] in the top five rankings"?
we see it now, we get it, and we're biding our time. boomer ideologies are dying along w/ its population, and america will be a much better place when they both do.
Talk about excuses ...well where the hell were you during VietNam? That's right, nustled right up under your mother's wing. Silly Gen X'er's ... LOST generation.
I'l raise you Combat Spec-Ops Gulf War Vet, keep talking out your asshole, you couldn't walk an inch in this SnakeEater's shoes
De Opresso Liber.
okay, you wanna go there ...
I'll raise your totally bullshit whatever with this ....
I am an Army vet with EOD training.
All it takes is some C-4 and a blasting cap.
bitch.
Yawn, I went in as a 97b with basic at Ft. Lost in the Woods, and AIT at FT. Huachucca AZ, then was selected out for 18F at Bragg. You think I don't know that same shit, stop being an internet tough guy, it don't mean shit in cyber space, watcha gonna do blowup my laptop, silly little man. BTW you shouw your hand with your lack of knowledge what a SnakeEater is, muchless not understanding my sig line. So lets agree to disagree and leave it at that, as most likely we are vastly differnt types of soldiers. Huah
De Opresso Liber.
My dad can beat up your dad.
And both you military turd buckets fought to keep a Fascist government alive. Be proud.
"Talk about excuses ...well where the hell were you during VietNam?"
Do you mean the pointless war that costs 50K US american lives? In Vietnam, We came, we false flaged (Gulf of Tonkin) we fought for ten years costing dear lives and treasury, then left with the communist in control. All for nothing. I am not sure what your point is, or what your argument is either. I wonder if you do either.
He has NO idea what his argument is, just that 'boomers' were insulted [by me] and he's gonna stick up for them period end of sentence. So NONE has figured it out here, just because you are in the age bracket of the boomers does not make you a boomer. Simple minded fucks fall for it every time. Its like insulting the Yankee in front of a Cult Member Yankee fan, they will fight you to the death for insulting 'thier' team, see this is why we are FUCKED, people can't get out of their own way, much less their overdeveloped Ego's.
RIP 'meriKa, its only a matter of time now.
deleted
You two arse bandit admin company typists wanna circle jerk each other in a private room???
Generational Warfare. The old divide and rule.
Your kids will hate you too when their time comes.
Doesn't matter what you do. It will never be enough.
I believe this is why professional sports were invented. To help push along the early propaganda campaigns that embodied their divide et impera motto. Being so emotionally invested in the "my team" mentality gives cattle, I mean people the biggest motivator besides food & water in self preservation, protection of their own ego. Once they vicariously identify with the ego of the team, projection of the "My team" is easily transfered to "The State" or Homeland, "The Party", Race, Religion (which is the original My Team) gender, generation. etc., etc.. Then once ideas of the group are created & instilled in a section of the population that identifies with them, the members can be weilded like an army to fight wars of those using them as chess pieces to win a game of their own making & taking all spoils for themselves. Most participants never even realize their is a game at all, let alone they are just a pawn serving the will of the chess master. This is why the Matrix red pill/blue pill is so fitting, most would rather deny the horrible truth & take the blue pill. Returning to wake into the dream they feel comfortable in, rather than suffer the harsh reality that they have been duped.
The human brain is a scary thing, they should be illegal.
My point would be that I lost family in that 'police state'.
maybe they didn't actually die in the war, but they damn sure did die a slow and painful death as a result of it.
How in the FUCK can you make your previous statement then/ Ad Homenim much? Did you even serve? Both my father and my uncle are dying of Agent Orange exposure, you think your the only one out there? At the risk of being rude, but do you not see your Me, ME, MEEEEEEEE attitude? You prove my point about boomers without me even trying...
Dude .. my father and 3 of his brothers <my uncles> served in VietNam.
My father <the oldest of the 4> served THREE tours in 'Nam.
The younger three served one tour.
I am DAMNED PROUD of all four's service.
To further prove my point, my father has passed <2006> my uncles are still well.
You need to take your Meds or see a psychologist. I don't even think you're a Boomer, just protending to be one. Second you didn't personally risk your life fighting in Vietnam or any war, unless you experienced combat, you have no right to claim it as some sort of trophy. You're like a sport fan claiming you've won a chapionship watching from the bleacher seats.
Lucky for you to have four murderers in the family. Dammed Proud to have fought in Vietnam .. you stupid Yank. The USA went to war with a small nation of peasant farmers and fishermen , murdered over a million and still lost and your are dammed proud ! Yeh go and fight in the Ukraine , maybe even Syria or go after ISIS !
What's so deliciously ironic about these welfare redistribution programs you boomers love so much is that it is going to kill most of you. You need a large, powerful gov't to carry out such programs. A large, powerful gov't which just seized control of the healthcare system by way of Obamacare. Obamacare will wind up being monumentally inefficient and wasteful. Medical care will be rationed. It will be rationed most heavily for the old, especially the retired, because it simply isn't in the economic interest of the state to keep old, retired folks alive.
"A government big enough to give you everything you want is a government big enough to take from you everything you have." - Paul Harvey
The hand that giveth life may taketh life.
I will have no simpathy for any of you in the years to come. You were warned decades ago about the inevitability of the welfare state's failure. You were just hoping to kick the bucket before your chickens came home to roost. It looks like that's not going to happen.
Most of us 'boomers' have made plans for our retirement so your assertion that we are 'dependent' on social welfare is incorrect.
But yeah, repeat the lie enough and it must ring true? Not so much amongst the realists.
Most boomers? Really?
Most boomers may have "made plans" for retirement, but it sure as hell didn't do them any good. Otherwise they wouldn't be putting off retirement in order to man the counter at McDonald's. Whether that's on them or on the system is a different matter, but most boomers are gonna go out penniless and totally reliant on the government or relatives.
Uncomfortable but true.
Most boomers will probably be fine. Gen X is surely fucked.
"Most boomers may have "made plans" for retirement, but it sure as hell didn't do them any good"
Right! They made plans on paper, The just failed to implement those plans. Its still sitting on their bookshelf gather dust. Plans had to wait so they could play "keeping up with the Jones". Unfortunately the all lost that game, and are now subject to impoverishment, and relying on entitlement to save thier asses from skid row. If Boomers are so well off, why didn't they vote to end entitlements?
"Most of us 'boomers' have made plans for our retirement so your assertion that we are 'dependent' on social welfare is incorrect."
So your not going to collect Social Security or use Medicare?
Most of your generation has failed to save for retirement. Average Boomer over 55 has less than $50K saved. barely enough for 5 years of retirment. Most Boomers are now working after retirement since they have little saved. I believe about 40% of boomers have no savings at all. They spent their money during thier working years buying fancy cars, European vacations, etc.
Cry me a river. In a couple years I will enjoy taking out what I put in.
BTW I paid for both my father and mothers funerals. My kids won't pay for mine.
Maybe I will work past 62 and blow another $150k in vegas.....Tis fun
"Cry me a river. In a couple years I will enjoy taking out what I put in."
Sorry, nothing left to take out. Its already been spent, mostly to the beneifit of boomers. Boomers want to spend their tax money twice. First on big gov't spending, and again on their entitlements. You really think Gen-X and the millenials are going to pay for your entitlements? You're dreaming. But like I said, I didn't meet a boomer that didn't like gov't entitlements and you just proved my point.
You have to be one of the dumbest mother fuckers on ZH. I am a tough guy. Going to blow 150k in Vegas because I can...lol! What a retard.
Hey Atime, y r u arguing with these
AH's? It's like arguing with your kids, they're
Never wrong and no point in trying to have a
civilized discussion. Wah
It must suck to go through life stupid and poor. It sounds like you're the one who needs to off himself.
Normally, one needs to go to a bowling alley to meet someone of your stature. Good luck in prison.
Assumption is the Mother of all Fuckups and your making huge ones. Bottom line is the boomer do have a HUGE sense of responsibility and culpability for this mess.
I'm a boomer.
and
I pick up pennies....Bitchez
"Personally I am of the opinion that all *voters and boomers should commit Seppuku for the betterment of all humanity,
*Fixed
It looks like the rate of beer consumption is actually plummetting in that chart, and the rate for spirits is rising.
Our generation had Johnny Cash to sing to us. We had Bob Hope to make us laugh. and we had Steve Jobs to inspire us.
Now, the young people have no cash, they have no jobs, and they have no hope!~!!!!
that is WAY too funny you mentioned this movie (private navy of sgt o'farrell, with phyllis diller, gina lolabrigida, and bob hope). I thought I was only of 14 people that saw it (in the movie theater no less). My two cousins were extras in the movie (one of them was the fake nurse rehearsing the arrival of the real nurses and the balloon flew out of his bra, now a bigtime atty in charleston sc). what a blast from the past! been a long time since i've thought about the movie. thanx!
ps trivia: movie was filmed in puerto rico, and my cousins both said G L was a kunt and a half, but P D was as cool as she seems on TV.
Did they walk ten miles to get to school everyday? Didn't think so
...Uphill barefooted in the snow, both ways... Fuckin' pussies.
No, but you can bet they lied to their youngsters about the good old days. Seems to be a generational trait.
Demographics are destiny and we are accelerating toward being a 3rd world country.....image that this cohort is ar 40% minorities, kids under 10 yrs are at 50%, & 10 years from now it will be 60% minorities. Balkanization is the future...United We Stand....yep...they took care of that one....
99.99% boomers are victims too. Voting is propaganda. TPTB will ignore what they don't like and continue on their merry way.
Okay, in our country voting managed to delay the introduction of GST for a few years. But then we got it anyway.
Govts make thousands of decisions. Every four years you get to tell 'em that at least one of those decisions was wrong. No guarantee the next mob will right any wrongs. All MSM pre-voting propaganda will concentrate on frivolous stuff and ignore any real issues. Demographics determine the vote, but for what? One party promises to put the country through the blender, the other promises to only use the low speed setting.
http://www.bostonglobe.com/ideas/2014/10/18/vote-all-you-want-the-secret...
I'm wondering if Mr. Glennon will be handed his hat by Tuft's board of governers in the near future.
That Globe articles is only interesting due to it's appearance in a "mainstream" outlet.
My take on the above is that the dysfunctional fakery of the US "two-party system" has gotten so in-your-face obvious, that there's no real point in denying it. The take home point (i.e. lie) of the above article, however. is that those actually running the USA are pupported to be hard-working, smart and public-spirited yada yada yada. No one's to blame for anything, you see; politics and economics, why - it's just like the weather....
"That Globe articles is only interesting due to it's appearance in a "mainstream" outlet."
I thought it was worth noting for the same reason.
So rather than calling what happened in 2008 "The Great Ressession" we should name these events like Hurracanes? I think that's a great idea. Let's start with Shitstorm Lehman Bros.
top beauty item...
URBAN DECAY...
nice...
And get a load of the prices at Rag and Bones.
Slavery to fashion.......literally.
Oh yeah, like those Establishment Fuckers are going to change anything. This country had its chance with RP and dropped it. Maybe he woulda maybe not... made a difference or changed diddly squat. Nonetheless, it's an environment, globally, where these kids cannot get "good" jobs as were availabe earlier times because the jobs don't exist. Period. For any number of reasons. I have kids of this generation and know a bazillion of 'em, both from my kids, my friends and mentoring other folks in need at a variety of stages in their lives.
This is not the same world it used to be. I am offering no solutions nor pinning any blame. That's for other times and discussion.
And many of these "kids" (so says an old geezer in his 60's) do not have the plethora of opportunities presented to previous generations.
In fact, a huge amount of them are considering Not Having Children because of the bad voodoo on the horizon.
Too bad many more don't feel that way, but when ya got a bazillion takers g;lued to the Free Shit Army teats, that's not gonna change either, as long as the gpoobermint wants to breed a voting poverty state assistance addicted class.
Many thanks to the pols and bankers.
And if y'all think differently, ask why the surveillance and militarized police state is growing so fast. It ain't to watch the rag-heads in the Af-Pak, etc. It's control of an increasingly restless people.
That alone is a good indica of the times. And the times, they suck
With all due respect Knuck's when will it be time to pin the blame? I only ask as that is kind of a 'politico' type response I hear from many boomers about how well yes the damage is/was done on our watch, but lets deal with that after we fix it! Which IMO is a copout. If we do NOT pin blame and have those responsible either by active participation or tacit denial of what went on in the 60's, 70's & 80's that got us here, how will we ever learn from those mistakes so they are not repeated in the future? Also if NOONE is held accountable then what lesson are we teaching the young? Just my 2c ~ YMMV
Oh no no no no....
I place the blame squarely upon the current administration's shoulders. Regardless of Red/Blue/left/right/Bildergergers/CB's/joos/A-rabs, whatethefuckever. (And I do not ascribe as much to those forces as most/many here)
These people been in charge of enough long enough that it's a shit show that they own, real or perceptions.
No excuses.
QED End of Conversation.
"what went on in the 60's, 70's & 80's"
Civil rights movement, anti-war protests, women's liberation, gay rights, etc.
Sorry about Disco. In hindsight, that was a big mistake.
Don't sweat it, there will be 50 million Mexicans willing to do those jobs they can't. "hey Juan can I take my lunch break? "
Where's the hours wasted on playing video games chart?
I got a whole krewe of tools across from me wasting the day away playing that shit. And they all roll up in their sticker-bombed JDM's reving the shit out of them. I'm waiting for the day one throws a rod in the driveway.
Great article, but I dont need graphs to see how fucked my generation is....
my friend's step-sister makes $67 every hour on the computer . She has been fired from work for 7 months but last month her pay check was $14130 just working on the computer for a few hours. blog here... www.Yelptrade.com
TL;DR: You're fucked.
Social skills of piss ants.
"... In addition, they are choosing different fields of study in college: while engineering was in the top five bachelors’ degrees awarded in 1980, in 2010, psychology replaced it in the top five rankings..."
More psychology majors is what the country needs here in the 21st Century economy....sure right....unhuh.
General "engineering" has been replaced by more specific engineering degree programs. Most engineering positions will ask for a specific engineering degree such as electrical engineering, not a broad, general one.
Doesn't change that an art degree is still worthless in the real world.
artistic talent will always be paid. My son has a 15 year old (online) friend who is scary talented. That kid can write his own ticket...he does not need a degree.
He didn't say "talent" he said "degree."
Spot the difference.
Many companies in the U.S. are choosing to hire foreigners with H-1B work visas (especially technology companies) often at much lower wages:
http://www.businessweek.com/table/08/0305_h1b.htm
http://www.redstate.com/2014/06/19/h1b-visas-bad-policy-bad-business/
Society needs more psychologists to deal with all of the screwed up people out there, lol.
Nero fiddled while Rome burned.
Today young Nero would text a selfie set to hip hop or Rap music..
For Millenials in this Empire, we have the best bread & circus, plus 4G coverage.
Or golf when not making narcissistic speeches to an inattentive audience.
To go from reinforcement of Messianic Proportions to Ignored, is damaging to the self-worth.
Can at times be tough to be King.
'Prolly why they need all the new shrinks
They're pretty much fucked.
These charts are meaningless when you're hungry and alone.
Just like a newborn baby is programmed to take it's first breath from a fluid filled world, so shall some men be made of children.
I was jaded for the last 20 years. I'm GEN-X.
I looked at the complete lack of social engagement youngsters have today.( based on MY intrepretations)
Sure there's some losers. Sure I'd like to see more "face to face" communication. For the most part these kids aren't different. They're just living in different circumstances.
Well said, Yen. Well said. Different and terribly difficult circumstances.
They never saw the "before", just the "after". Which to them are no other memories other than "now"
Thanks Knuks. I was just remembering/renumerating all my past mistakes, and decided I wasn't qualified for the esteemed "Pot calling Kettle black" Trophy.
Yes and no, knuks. I didn't live through the depression or a World War, but I sure listened to the stories. These kids don't give a shit. It's like junior high goes on forever, but with endless sex and booze.
I deal with some of the best students, but it's a scary crew. Some good ones, but so little depth or even genuine interest in anything but pop culture. Arrogant, full of shit. OK without looking, trying to avoid this crap, I know of three young "men" who think they will have a great career as artists, because teachers praised their work, and in every case their stuff sucks. Stuffed full of self esteem from the time they filled their first diaper, and this is where is leads. Oh well, some will make it, but damned if I know how.
They're severely stunted.
They're just living in different circumstances.
Agreed....but if we want to be honest with ourselves, we should stop and discuss what changed and created those new circustances and what can be done to fix it. A unique charachteristic of the current landscape is this acceptance of the downward spiral and never being able to stop and address it. Always a push to change things. But rarely an admission of things going wrong or made worse., just a blase shrug and attitude of 'well, we tried' as the world crumbles around them.
Is having $20K (average) in student loan debt really that big of a deal?
What would that be ~~$150 a month?
The problem is they can't find a decent fucking job - not that they have $20K in debt.
BTW anyone that gets a worthless liberal studies type degree - and goes $100K into debt to do it is an idiot - that is not what I am talking about.
The point you make is true. However, I think the average student debt amounts include people from the 80's, 90's, 00's, which probably have little to no debt.
In my previous home (ohio) it costs in the low 20's (per year) to attend a state school and continues to go up 8-10% a year.
My longwinded point is that if you think the average people are screwed now wait until the classes that went to school from like 2006 and up.
They are fucked when you add in the job market.
The chart is debt of 22-25 year olds - so I don't get your point.
I'd love to elaborate.
That chart is incredibly misleading. WAY more kids who start school never come close to finishing it. I know a lot of kids with tens of thousands of student loans who never made it to their 2nd or 3rd year. This chart adds them, not just graduates.
I'm not sure of your age, but of kids who go to state schools (let alone private) without parental help are hard pressed to graduate without less than $50,000 in debt.
No, no, that can't be right, I just took the trolley downtown for a nickel to see that new talkie...
"BTW anyone that gets a worthless liberal studies type degree - and goes $100K into debt to do it is an idiot - that is not what I am talking about."
Let's consider the options here
- liberal arts/black studies/women's studies : free money shows up for 4 years. attend/pass. 4 years of free beer.
- engineering : 1 year of free beer. dismissed for 0.0 GPA. 1 year of free beer. did i already say 1 year of free beer?
This idea that permeates left and right now that lib studies education is a waste is so stupid. We need people in the arts. It's one of the main things that separated us from the Soviets. Whereas we had actual music on the radio they just blasted their horsehit "information" over the airwaves.
Although, I don't have a drop of artistic talent myself, I recognize that art can have a big help on our environment and overall make people well rounded, non robots.
You need engineering to produce commoditized stuff that works. You need art to make that stuff look good, create desire and turn a profit.
IBM vs Apple in the late '90s.
Yeah, you say it better than I could.
Good example, too, with IBM v. Apple.
After all, we and the Soviets both built rockets.
Perhaps, the problem today isn't kids getting a fashion design degree, etc. but that education costs have gone up 10% a year for the past 30 years, and if one were entering school today would probably take on $90,000-100,000 to graduate from most schools, regardless of major choice.
An artist is born, a monkey that works the state controlled entertainment industry needs a four year degree in art.
I think some of you are more than a bit out of touch with how things work these days.
Only 10% of people actually have the brain power to be leaders and job creators. The rest are simply worker bees who now have to compete with a global emerging economy that can work cheaper (lets blame boomers, wait maybe the polio vac.). If your dumb enough to pay $80k for a college ed when all your able to do is mow the lawn, well you can't fix stupid. Put the money into the best lawn mowing shit and before you know it, you need help....ding ! I'm a landscaper. Well that's if you actually don't mind working ! Houston we have a problem...
"we and the Soviets both built rockets"
built being key. The Russkis still do, us, not so much.
Yeah, art me a bushel of corn. My pasture is quite thin.
Have him make it rain.
So we need to graduate 10 people in liberal studies for every engineer so we have have cool looking iPhones?
BTW - if you go back 100 years (guess maybe farther back) almost all degrees were liberal studies - but those degrees taught a person how to solve problems and also had things like math and science built in.
Today a person can get a degree in liberal studies and not even have to be able to tie their fucking shoes. The current standard for most liberal studies programs is hardly even an education.
How do you define well rounded? A liberal studies degree in the past gave you this well rounded education you are talking about - the current system simply does not.
They graduate with no marketable skills - have not even developed any problem solving skills.
I guess you could say the dumbed down the program so any idiot with $10K to spend per semester could make the grade.
confusing 'liberal arts' and 'arts'? There was a time when a liberal arts degree prepared a person to succeed quite nicely in life by teaching them analytical thinking skills and also including fair amount of math and science. I have no idea what they teach kids now since few seem to have analytical thinking skills.
The arts, like fine arts, are great, but these are not the types of degrees that are going to enable a person to make enough money to pay back large loans without putting them behind the 8 ball from the get go. Those degrees should be paid for by the student, or perhaps via philanthropical institutions that see the value in developing artistic talents. And........why does one need a degree to be an artist? Why does one need a bachelors degree to be and accountant or a computer programmer?
It seems a lot of money and time could be saved learning marketable skill such as these without getting a 4 or 5 year college education.
I was talking in general terms. I'm in favor of both fine arts and the traditional lib arts. We need both. In my opinion we don't have a shitty economy because we have too many Psych majors. But I agree, someone should not assume a hundred grand of debt to pay for it though.
My point was you used to be able to work your way through school, regardless of your major choice, and not come out as indentured servant.
Keep in mind that most of these students didn't 'take on 100,000 in debt'...they now HAVE that much. It is generally accrued in incremental fashion, a few courses here, books there, next semesters registration fees, and the shit they find out they need to buy on the first day of class...
These kids have no education in personal finance...none. No understanding of how debt works, of compounding interest, and how quickly it can become unmanageable. Then they turn 18, and are expected to navigate the complex world of loan financing, and use credit cards responsibly, because they're adults now. This all works out as well as you'd expect, and here we are.
No one would hand a kid keys, give him a car, and say, "Go drive now...You're an adult." We understand the obvious, that you need to teach the kid to drive first, how to handle this powerful thing in traffic, to obey the rules of the road. We make them aware of the incredible damage that can be done if you are careless, and the penalties that could result. We would never assume that attaining legal adulthood alone was enough to qualify them to get out there on the roads.
I was not talking about a degree in how to play the violin or paint a portrait.
I was thinking more like anthropology, history, philosophy, political science, psychology and sociology.
Excellent point, brother.
I didn't feel like I had the energy to get into a discussion over the quality of education at most universities.
I think that's actually another post tonight on ZH.
I agree very much that we need artists, but a college degree in his field is much more important to the engineer than an artist.
150 a month, times 12 months, times millions of students, adds up to a LOT of consumer spending not happening...
For DECADES...
THAT is the problem. Not the one student with a heavy monthly payment.
One zit isn't a major issue. But hundreds of zits is.
It's a matter of scale.
I disagree - the problem is not the $150 a month payment - it is the graduates can't find a job that pays them enough.
Use to be - you graduate from college and get a BETTER PAYING JOB - so even paying a student loan payment you still had MORE cash VS not going to college. Those days are gone.
If you get your degree and can only find a job that pays you $8 an hour for 28 hours a week - you are fucked with or without the student loan payment.
If the kid was able to get a $50K a year job paying a $150 a month would be no big deal
When I graduated back in 1980 (not exactly a great time for the economy) I was able to get a job that paid me 3X what some of my friends were making that never went to college.
Even with a student loan payment I had way more spendable cash than they did.
"If the kid was able to get a $50K a year job paying a $150 a month would be no big deal"
Yeah, and if wishes were nickels we'd all be rich...People forget the kid CAN'T get a 50k job, so it's not relevant. And it remains a big deal, both to that kid, and to the rest of us.
For many of them, even 50 a month isn't possible. And the lesson here is that you can't turn everyone into a revenue stream, and then expect them to go out and keep your economy going. A kid saddled with debt may provide some income through his attempts at payment for awhile, but he'll never reach his productive potential, and he will quickly become tapped-out, no more payments. And economically neutered.
Then what? They never say...just keep repeating the "You gotta pay your debts!" thing over and over and over. Like it's some kind of magic charm that will overcome the reality of that students life.
All the "fixes" they offer are merely re-arranging the burden, not lightening it. Like that Honeymooners episode where Ralph and Norton are moving a bureau, and Ralph pulls out the drawers to lighten it, and puts them on TOP of the bureau, and says, "Ok, NOW let's try..."
Soldiering offers good employment perspectives
good employment perspectives - die for nothing
I'm curious.
How much are you paid per month? 40k rubles? 50k rubles?
What is the weather like in Moscow?
You should tell us what it's like to work for Langley first.
Nid the guy lives in Canukistan. You're really overthinking things.
EKM is an air-conditioning repairman. ;-D
"Listen, Kid...we're all in it together". HT
The Flower Children of the 60's are still fucking us. Fucking Hippie Bastards.
Oh yes, the freedom, love and leave us alone generation of Birkenstockers has turned into Fascists controlling an ever increasingly intrusive state, maker of all decisions personal and private.
Some tough love and a punch in the face* might have been of assistance in the character development field
*h/t Mike Tyson
Those fuckers sold out, put on a suit and tie and went for the Money. A few of us moved to the country where the Real people live and said fuck a bunch of those traitorous assholes.
Exsqueeze me, but how many are illegal aliens?
EBOLA – CIA Project Codename MKNAOMI & Hi-Tech Assassinations
In 1948, Henry Kissinger, a 23-year-old American intelligence officer, recruited Nazi expatriates to serve in top positions in American military, aerospace, and biological science and medicine. Twenty years later, he left Harvard’s esteemed faculty and resigned a lucrative position as Nelson Rockefeller’s foreign policy attache’ to become President Nixon’s closest advisor and director of the National Security Council. Seeking alternatives to tactical nuclear weapons to bolster America’s “diplomacy” abroad, the paranoid and egomaniacal Kissinger quickly ordered the Army’s Chief of Staff to requisition $10 million from Congress for the development and testing of EBOLA & AIDS-like viruses. Within ten years, the AIDS and Ebola epidemics erupted coincidentally in the regions of Africa ravaged by CIA military covert operations also ordered by Kissinger.
In 1984, Dr. Robert Gallo, of the National Cancer Institute, claimed credit for discovering the AIDS virus. He announced it most likely originated from a monkey virus which spontaneously mutated and naturally jumped species. Dr. Gallo was a biological weapons contractor for the CIA’s top secret “Project: MKNAOMI,” and was paid to produce and test EBOLA, AIDS-like viruses as early as 1970.
EBOLA – CIA Project Codename MKNAOMI & Hi-Tech Assassinations
I didn't know Kissinger was involved in bringing us the ex-nazi scientists. We at least he did one good thing in his life.
I think most GenX'ers would agree... WHO GIVES A FUCK!!!
It's a matter of perspective, I guess?
Fucking a right!
the money system is fucked from the get go, so ...
.
"...some get spiritual because they see the light,
some because they feel the heat." r.w.h.
.
Ray Wylie Hubbard - Conversation with the Devil
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qX5TSmTyHc
.
Willy DeVille - Come A Little Bit Closer
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=--9itpIiPXE
Millennials are half illegals and mostly colored...very few blonde and blue eyed folks in that age group...but hey a lot of folks think that is just fine and dandy. Que bueno...pass the matzos eh
And the white ones hate the white race.
Millenials are a scourge upon this world.
The systems already in place that programmed them to behave the way they behave are the scourge, bro.
i don't know that these charts say millemials have it so hard as much as they say these guys are as useless as the reputation they are known for says they are. at least they aren't eating as much.