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Netherlands, Germany Have Euro Disaster Plan - Possible Return to Guilder and Mark
Netherlands, Germany Have Euro Disaster Plan - Possible Return to Guilder and Mark
The Dutch and German governments were preparing emergency plans for a return to their national currencies at the height of the euro crisis it has emerged. These plans remain in place.
German Gold Deutsche Mark - (Special Edition)
The Dutch finance ministry prepared for a scenario in which the Netherlands could return to its former currency - the guilder. They hosted meetings with a team of legal, economic and foreign affairs experts to discuss the possibility of returning to the Dutch guilder in early 2012.
The Dutch finance minister during the period has confirmed that Germany also discussed such scenarios.
At the time the Euro was in crisis, Greece was on the verge of leaving or being pushed out of the Euro and the debt crisis was hitting Spain and Italy hard. The Greek prime minister Georgios Papandreou and his Italian counterpart Silvio Berlusconi had resigned and there were concerns that the eurozone debt crisis was spinning out of control - leading to contagion and the risk of a systemic collapse.
A TV documentary broke the story last Tuesday. The rumours were confirmed on Thursday by the current Dutch minister of finance, Jeroen Dijsselbloem, and the current President of the Eurogroup of finance ministers in a television interview which was covered by EU Observer and Bloomberg.
“It is true that [the ministry of] finance and the then government had also prepared themselves for the worst scenario”, said Dijsselbloem.
“Government leaders, including the Dutch government, have always said: we want to keep that eurozone together. But [the Dutch government] also looked at: what if that fails. And it prepared for that.”
While Dijsselbloem said there was no need to be “secretive” about the plans now, such discussions were shrouded in secrecy at the time to avoid spreading panic on the financial markets.
When asked about Germany, Dijsselbloem said he couldn’t say whether that country’s government had made similar preparations.
German Silver Deutsche Mark - (1951-1974)
However, Jan Kees de Jager, finance minister from February 2010 to November 2012, acknowledged that a team of legal experts, economists and foreign affairs specialists often met at his ministry on Fridays to discuss possible scenarios.
“The fact that in Europe multiple scenarios were discussed was something some countries found rather scary. They did not do that at all, strikingly enough”, said De Jager in the TV documentary.
“We were one of the few countries, together with Germany. We even had a team together that discussed scenarios, Germany-Netherlands.”
When the EU Observer requested confirmation from Germany, the German ministry of finance did not officially deny that it had drawn up similar plans, stating simply:
“We and our partners in the euro zone, including the Netherlands, were and still are determined to do everything possible to prevent a breakup of the eurozone.”
This is quite a revelation. At that time the German finance minister Wolfgang Schauble had said that the Euro could survive without Greece. Whether it could survive without the Dutch is another matter entirely.
A Euro without Holland and especially Germany is currently inconceivable. De Jager also states that other countries found the prospect of a Euro break-up frightening.
So much so that they buried their heads in the sand rather than deal with the situation facing them. It appears that no emergency contingency plans were made in the unfortunately named PIIGS nations - Portugal, Ireland, Italy, Greece and Spain.
One has to wonder if the plans would have been made public had a TV documentary not forced the Dutch government to confirm the claim.
It is interesting to note that it is these two countries, Germany and Netherlands, whose citizens have also been at the forefront of the gold repatriation movement currently sweeping across Europe - France's second largest party entered the fray this week.
In a climate with a lack of faith in fiat currencies, any return to a purely fiat guilder or mark would be risky in the absence of the confidence that gold backing provides.
Despite the implication that secrecy is no longer necessary because Europe is over the worst we believe the Dutch repatriation of 20% of it's sovereign gold from the U.S. indicates that the Dutch are still, wisely, preparing for the worst - whether that be a euro crisis or indeed a dollar crisis and an international monetary crisis.
Their stated reason for returning their 122 tonnes of gold to Netherland’s soil was to instil public confidence in the Dutch central bank.
The prospect of a Euro-break up is a frightening one. It would appear that most Eurozone nations are ill-prepared and indeed unprepared for.
As always we recommend investors act as their own central bank by taking delivery of bullion or keeping gold and silver in secure, allocated and segregated vaults in safer jurisdictions such as Switzerland and Singapore.
For investors and savers currently using the euro, it begs the important question do you have a euro failure contingency plan?
Indeed, for investors and savers internationally using other fiat currencies, it begs the important question do you have a currency failure contingency plan?
While the risks in peripheral European nations of reversion to their national currencies and currency devaluations have diminished – some risks still remain.
The risk is that individual national governments may elect to take this route rather than suffer deflationary economic collapse and Depressions. Alternatively, it could happen through contagion or a systemic event like the collapse of a large European bank, a la Lehman Brothers, that leads to a domino effect jettisoning a member state out of the monetary union.
It could also come about should the German people and politicians decide that the European monetary project is not worth saving or they decide that it cannot be saved and elect to return to the Deutsche mark.
All significantly indebted nations, so called PIIGS and non PIIGS such as Japan, the UK and the U.S. are at risk of currency devaluations.
Competitive currency devaluations or the debasement of currencies for competitive advantage and currency wars poses real risks to the long term stability and prosperity of all democracies in the world and to the finances and savings of people in all countries.
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Not surprised the Swiss referndum failed...but astounded that it lost by sucha huge margin...
Obviously the Swiss don't like gold.
http://www.20min.ch/schweiz/news/story/Gold-Initiative-droht-Schiffbruch...
I said to be ready to sell Gold if there were to be a spike on a YES, but the more likely scenario for this week is a puke to test the lows of this year. Its a race to the bottom between shining Gold and Black Gold
The ENEE sadism
http://failedevolution.blogspot.gr/2014/11/the-enee-sadism.html
German Silver Deutsche Mark - (1951-1974)
Ahem, there never was a German 1 Deutsche Mark coin with any Silver in it.
Prior 1918 there was a silver 1M, also a 1/2 Mark piece.
But that one was not called a "Deutsche Mark."
Right. There has been silver in the German 5 DM coins though, about 7 gramms per coin, from 1951 to 1974.
No disaster plan will be good enough to avoid the collapsing of the biggest credit bubble in human history...
http://www.globaldeflationnews.com/anatomy-of-a-bubble-how-the-federal-r...
America is a multi trillion dollar enterprise, I seriously doubt it will be allowed to just deflate or collapse. Be on the lookout for some false flag events soon...
What is the disaster plan of Goldcore ? te one he should have given to his clients whos been fully invested, or overleveraged since gold was at 1900$, 1800$, 1700$, 1600$ ? isnt there any some kind of stop-loss ? of excuse ? with gold 1175$ at the last print ?
will he still be saying the same bullshit when in a few years Gold is trading at 700$ ?
maybe the plan is to not borrow money to invest on speculative price arbitrage
Except come November 30 one country will have gold reserves and the other...mmmm not so much....but wait, there's always silver!
Dude there's bitcoin and ethereum. In other words if they don't care to purchase gold or to fractional reserve it, or use silver, they can create their own currency if they haven't already.
Hopium coming soon. Convertible to SDRs
That would be epic. But we know Bitcoin isn't real because there are no ETFs for it...wait...it is less derivative...it is the new direct ETF (minus the underlying asset..so it it gains bonus points for disclosure which will be some consolation as you stare at your empty hand and contemplate whether a non-derivative without an underlying collateral is more valuable than the alternative.)
Was it the shoeshine boy that told you so? This is so unlikely it's laughable.
Now you know where all those trillions of US dollars went back when Ben Bernanke flat out refused to say where all the money went when asked by a Congressional committee.
http://youtu.be/P8p0nBa866E
Wow what a waste of time that congressional hearing was. Bernanke is in the Arab lands giving $200k talks while the American people keep on believing everything is ok....
Zero Hedge reported, I believe in 2010, that $16 trillion was secretly printed and given to Europe to support the CB's.
its impossible to print or type a digit worth any trillions...
It also "emerged" a couple of years ago that Germany had sent an order for the printing of DM to a large banknote printer. This was discussed right here on ZH at the time.
I swear I read somewhere that the Germans had old DM notes locked up in vaults just in case.
Going back around the time it happened, the Germans I knew wanted to keep the DM no matter what. Italians also wanted to keep the lira. The lira was not perfect but they knew everything would be more expensive with the euro.
The euro has killed Italian trade for many products. About the same time, the EU opened up more trade with China. This has devastated smaller and southern European countries.
1968-9 Bad Nauheim, DE: 4DM: 1USD. That was a good rate. One dollar got you four Deutch Marks.
You could go to the local gasthaus and eat and get full, play foozeball all night for 3 or 4 dollars and still have a bunch of phennings left over. I toured with a musical group through NL, DE, FI, NOR, SE, FR, BE and had all their currencies to exchange every time. I remember the coins were like lead if you dropped them on a hard floor. Most times I came home with several different currencies and kept it for the next tour. Then the Euro came, it was a lot more than the dollar was at the time and if you exchanged back to USD, you lost a lot. The Euro clubs liked paying in dollars to USA tours, the dollar was weak and cheap. Good for the Dutch, the Guilder was cool.
“The Dutch finance minister and Eurogroup chairman, Jeroen Dijsselbloem, stated that Germany must do more to enhance its competitiveness, mentioned reforms implemented by Spain, Portugal and Ireland in recent years, adding that Berlin would be well-advised not to rest on its laurels. [...] Germany becomes now a key factor for the desirable federalization of the eurozone through an unprecedented 'haircut' of the social state, labor rights, pensions and salaries, in the name of the fiscal discipline and competitiveness.”
http://failedevolution.blogspot.gr/2014/10/plutocrats-tighten-siege-arou...
That's kind of reversing what Dijsselbloem said, Dijsselbloem advocated increased public spending in Germany.
Apparently, all good things come to an end.
The euro will do just fine. The ECB has 10,800 tons of gold. How could such a currency collapse? It won't. The dollar will fail and the gold price in dollar (physical gold price that is) and the ECB balance sheet will explode to the positive, in dollar terms.
All this currency collapse stuff is really only of interest to those who store their savings in paper wealth assets. Those holding physical assets and especially gold will be fine, go back to the games. Those with nothing will just get paid in different, after economy recovers a bit. Not much will change (except for the horrible depression that is just around the corner). Those with nothing but paper assets will see their paper worth much less whether it is denominated in dollars or euros.
The euro will survive but who knows how much of a beating it will take as the whole dollar based system goes down.
...buy gold bullion...
I heard 3 years ago the buck would go up then crash. J Willie just repeated it on a blog.
Hold on to your PMs etc!
Only a matter of time.
Could have a competition to return to gold.
The Netherlands, Russia, the USA.
All three are the major natural gas producers and consumers in the industrialized world.
Sweden some type of "Nordic League" might be an interesting fourth.
GB and Japan sold the bulk of their holdings a while back. France is looking pretty cranky of late as well.
1921 was the last Morgan Dollar.
Still don't know where all the supply is coming from but clearly there is no shortage of demand at the mint and that truly massive demand is being met.
Not in euro's, yen or pounds obviously. The Loonie got hammered on Friday as well. "That's a lot of beef."
In the back of my mind is an explosion higher in electricity prices but so far "this is not the hyper inflation I have been looking for.". Indeed its the exact opposite.
" just stop paying your bills and see what happens" is kinda how I look at things.
It is about time that I start a list of conspiracy theories turned reality.
How have we been ridiculed for years saying the Government is prepared and they know the Euro is doomed.
Changing from Deutsche Mark to Euros has cost me half of my income. It will be interesting to see if my income doubles when the Euro is gone.
"Changing from Deutsche Mark to Euros has cost me half of my income."
A tall call. Explain how. Did you live from FX speculation on the DEM crosses?
No it won't double, the MONEY CHANGERS got the difference in the first place.
And if they control the second time round, you will lose again.
Get behind in the queue, there are millions of us Muppets.
Where is Your Gold? the Italian's Gold?, Greece's Gold? and on and on and on.
Now if you pop over in Basel you may SMELL IT.
This coin that coin what does my labor buy? HAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHA!
Most folks need to pace themselves as they will be working their whole lives. It's the new normal. Once depression sets in, reality will be back!
. . . you're of the opinion that it
HASN'T SET IN YET ?
+10.
Hold out your labor most of all.
That is why the robots are such bad harbinger for those who won't toil for scraps. They can give all the mexicans amnisty that they want but the machines work even cheaper than they do. Even soldiers jobs are no longer safe in the very near future which doesn't bode well for any of us "mouth breathers". Need some of those EMP things from the matrix...
Some jobs will never be done by robots. Skilled trades mostly. I just dont see robots doing RnD or other jobs that requier thinking on the fly. Now congress sure they should be replaced by robots right along with the clown that messed up my order at the drive thru.
In a currancy change over. The smart move would be to sit on all of your inventory? No?
The Euro-zone is in a far bigger mess than recent headlines and figures suggest. Most of the growth in the Euro-zone over recent years has been in Germany and that bright spot is now under pressure. Italy has been in recession for two years; France’s economy has been stagnant for months. Now that Germany is in trouble, many economist think the chances of a Japan-style deflationary spiral have risen sharply.
Blame is being cast upon German policymakers that remain pigheadedly opposed to the stimulus the euro area needs. Bottom-line and what it all boils down to is Germany can’t keep buying Greek bonds with German taxpayer money until the end of time. The article below looks deeper into why the euro may be on its way out.
http://brucewilds.blogspot.com/2014/10/global-economic-malaise-due-to-debt.html
One of the bright spots was German trade with russia along with other European countries trading with Russia. Yeah Russia has control of nat gas to Europe but the Russians buy European goods in exchange aka free trade.
Well I guess this did not sit well with the USSA SS/SA Soros-State Department Zio-Thugs.
"Bottom-line and what it all boils down to is Germany can’t keep buying Greek bonds with German taxpayer money until the end of time."
This is in too many ways patently false
It does not, and it could. Just remember Greece's size
Agreed re Greece.
However, could they bail out Spain?
And France is definitely too big.
Personally, I think the Germans are going to get their DEM back, though the process may be messy: the choice will be between Merkel (very popular but pro-EUR) and the DEM.
Watson
"In Swiss vaults is more than 73 thousand kilos of gold that in fact belong to the Netherlands. The Dutch government has given up on its efforts in 2000 to repatriate this gold, worth now about 2 billion euros. But opposition party CDA sees plenty of legal options. However, that comes to nothing if the Swiss on Sunday say "yes" to the rescue of the Swiss gold. 'Fishy gold' - The Dutch gold is there since the Second World War, when the Nazis raided nearly 150 thousand kilos from the vault of De Nederlandsche Bank and sold it to the Swiss to finance their war machine. Switzerland reluctantly gave half the gold back in stages, the last time in 1998."
Part of an article in a Dutch newspaper, today: http://www.volkskrant.nl/buitenland/zwitsers-stemmen-over-nederlands-gou...
And suddenly, gold's in the spotlight, never mind the spot price...
The Euro won't collapse, but will violently change.
One Eurozone nation, Greece, Italy, Spain, Portugal, ?, will revolt and repudiated the Euro and their Euro debts. The associated pols and crats will be annihilated, and the nation occupied and taken over by "administrators."
Other "catfish" economies will also be occupied and "administered" for their "own good."
In the chaos, the Slavs, eastern Europe, Greece, Slovakia and Estonia, will bail and join an economic union with Russia.
Turkey, while not a Eurozone member, will finally fall victim to the giant vacuum of the Middle East and fall into it, though it will be nominally allied with Russia.
Watch for it.
An American, not US subject.
Note: Once The City of London, in the coming chaos, finally gains control of the Euro, the Rothschild banksters of The City will then have the UK become part of the Eurozone. They will probably do so disguised as "saving" the Euro, while they actually take control, of it.
I'm looking at the USDRUB and EURRUB and thinking ummmmmm....no.
Yep I like an energies backed coin. It all comes down to what the coin will buy. A coin with a fixed real value is the only way thats fair.
I'm blind, but Energy estimates, gas estimates, coal estimates, oil estimates... they are like US financial ratings.
Total BS.
Would you loan on Fracking wells with one year life, but with huge clean up costs?
Fracking is only viable with low or ZIRP interest rates... sure the fixing can continue but the clean up is ignored, social cists are ignored.
Whatever.