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1941...
And 73 years later, the war is back...
...if only in the world of currencies (for now)
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73 years ago, when we actually made stuff and had to defend China from Japan.
The government and it's banker owners have learned over the past 73 years that currencies and money are a more effective and deadly weapon than anything used in WWII.
No, china was none of our business then, and none of the rest of the world is our business now.
"Peace, commerce, and honest friendship with all nations; entangling alliances with none."
Silly Jefferson.
Never.
We long ago succumbed to the philosophy of
Every Man For Himself
And we have reaped the price, and are going
to reap an even harder price going forward.
I think this is by far the longest period in history maintained by war machine. Naval carriers FTF.
I beg to differ. If there was ever a time when good and evil were clearly defined it was the US against the Nazi's and Tojo's Japan. The rape of Nanking of 90,000 and the obvious evil of Nazi fascism made that a fight worthwhile.
WWII and Korea was the last instance when it was clear that we had moral superiority
Keep telling yourself that. All of that shit happened due to our misguided entrance into WWI. There is a reason why the founding fathers advocated no involvement in the rest of the worlds affairs. Europe, throughout its history, has engaged in a near genocide on each other every few generations, never for any reason other than the royal families playing a real life game of chess with other people's lives. The only time we have fought in the just war is the civil war on the side of the south(no, I'm not defending slavery) and the revolutionary war. Every single other conflict we have involved ourselves in has been senseless killing, which, like WWII, we typically entered based on lies.
I doubt that the founding fathers would have not defended this nation once attacked. That argument can be made against our involvement against Germany ( Hitler would have attacked the US eventually) but certainly not against the Japanese.
Whether Roosevelt suppressed intelligence or actually violated neutrality laws with Lend lease does not change the fact that the Japanese attacked the United States and the British and the Dutch and the Chinese and the Australians. Did Roosevelt orchestrate the simultaneous attacks across the entire South Pacific?
I am not defending Japan attacking us, I just refuse to ignore our own warmongering that made it inevitable. We instituted capital controls, massive economic sanctions, and basically cut their entire economy off from oil. Sound familiar? The us govt INTENTIONALLY backed them into a corner, because we wanted them to declare war on us, since we knew the nazis would follow suit, which would give us our way into WWII, which had to be done like this since Americans had no interest in fighting another European war. And sure enough they did, exactly as FDR wanted, and exactly as he assured Churchill, America was in the war. A war which never would have happened without our involvement in WWI decades before. If those sound like good reasons to send teenage draftees to go kill other teenage draftees then I hope you will be among the first to volunteer next time it happens. Or, you could do a little research and learn all this yourself. You are a product of the govt education system, it's not entirely your fault. Start over at lewrockwell.com and read Ralph raico.
"Hitler would have attacked the US eventually"
It's really sad that this type of nonsense still passes as common knowledge. Hitler would have attacked you say? The same Hitler that couldn't even cross the English channel to invade Britain? The same Hitler who controlled virtually no oil? The same guy whose army still employed over a million horses? Please, what other insightful historical lessons will you teach us today?
The US government knew that the "surprise" attack was coming long before Dec 7th. It is no coincidence that the carriers were not sitting in port like all the other ships, whose poor souls who were deemed worthy of sacrifice for the greater good.
Richard Maybury has some great books, one specifically about WW1 and WW2 from a historical, non-statist view. I only wish it was easier to convince people that they have been fooled than it is to fool them in the first place.
Except for those last 2 bombs we dropped on the Japanese.....I'm pretty sure most people (leaving room for the reptiles and Krugman here) will prefer QE to one of those going off in their backyard.
Dude, we seriously are in need of a number of articles on the Reptiles.
Some folks would no doubt coldly shed some light on the topic
You think those have only been used in the last 73 years.
You have a lot of reading to catch up on.
No , iit didn't stop shooting wars, before that, from breaking out.
Just a precursor to the shooting, as it is now.
It was never about China. Just like dropping those two nukes wasn't about Japan either.
America nuked Japan to send a message to Russia.
And Goddammit those Godless Fucking Commie Perverts got the message loud and clear. We showed 'em then and we'll show 'em again. What we lack as a People and Leadership is Balls. Balls. That's right, you heard me, Balls. No fucking balls anymore. Where are Leaders like Curtis LeMay and Joe McCarthy when we need them? Gonads, gravity and gigatons is all we need. Scare the slimy little bastards back into their holes right along with their camel jockey and nosee'ems white of their eyes little sycophants and camp followers, the no good for nothing fellow travelers, Progressives, Lefties, Democrats and Establishment Republicans, all in cahoots with the Illuminati, Bilderbergers, CFR and Rockefeller and Soros money, all aligned with a Commie-assed Supreme Court and pansy panty waist-ed politicians. What we need is a superior show of Balls. Backed up by Action. Wipe a few useless islands off the maps and they'll shiver in their boots for the rest of eternity, Goddammit. Balls I say, balls. And whado we get? The Weak Willed and Women in politics running for public office when their real place is barefoot, in the kitchen, pregnant, darning socks while the little ones suckle her fine soft white breasts. Where are the good folks of the John Birch society, the manly men of yore, willing to canoe down hillbilly infested waters, fighting off the degenerate advances of one toothed moonshiners and radicals living out in the woods with the snakes and lobsters. Taking care of themselves, feeding the brood with no assistance from anybody, proud to stand tall on bare feet waving the worn felt hat with holes in it as the jet bombers fly overhead protecting us from the rabble, tightening the old rope belt about the waist, crying out loud thanking God for the moment of surreality we've come to live in. Poontang and Papy's shine forever.
All those Manly Men with their Balls got gassed at the Furry Convention in Chicago yesterday.
Knucks,
You are REALLY off your meds tonight . . .
did your nurse leave early?
Seriously.
You need to read a few more sources and not ones promoting that progressive shit. The bomb being dropped was a political message but the military leadership wanted it done for very good reasons.
I had an Uncle at Leyte Gulf on a jeep carrier and my wife's father was at Iwo Jima. ( Also had relatives in the Wehrmacht but thats not pertinent to the Pacific theatre)
Best estimates at the time of the bombs being dropped was 1 million casulties if the US invaded (Operation Downfall). The Japanese were not going to give up. the Japanese had 25 divisions and over 10,000 planes including kamikazes, baka bombs and kamikaze boats.
This does not include the fanatical civilians that would have died in waves or killed themselves. ( Read about the civilians on Saipan)
If you want to get a better sense of the scale check out this paper on the preparations and auumptions made by each side. The Japanese high command had a battle plan to defend the main islands. Those bombs needed to be dropped.
http://www.upa.pdx.edu/IMS/currentprojects/TAHv3/Content/PDFs/Operation_...
You are very sick.
You must be very young.
and without critical thinking skills
Someone with critical thinking skills would probably ask why, since FDR is universally loathed around here for his gold confiscation, new deal prolonging the depression, and socialist govt programs like SS, you are still willing to trust him in entering us into a world war based on what our history books tell us to be the case. Critical thinking skills would make you question why you believe a thing our govt said back then, or now, when they told so many easy verifiable lies.
Spot on, brother.
Most people are unawares that the US military had over 1 million. Yes, that's million, Purple Hearts ordered and delivered in preparation for the invasion of the Japanese islands.
To this day, most of them remain stored in a warehouse in SanFran and are still being distributed
The plans forecast horrific casualties.
And much of the madness of the civilians was documented on Sipan.
It also did let Uncle Joe know that we simply, were ahead. There was no question after the truce in Europe that the Rooskies had taken a piss load of the German scientists and technology just was the West had.... any other monologue is simply rubbish.
Not true at all. That's more Americans than were killed in the entire war, don't be ridiculous. Worst case estimates put it at 50000 casualties. And well before the atomic bombs were dropped, the Japanese were trying to surrender. Several months before. We demanded 'unconditional surrender' which is a stupid reason to make war on innocents, since neither of those cities were any kind of militarily important targets, which is why they were hardly touched by any of the previous bombing campaigns. They were instead saved for our little science experiment, since the brass wanted to see how their new bombs worked on an actual city. The only condition the Japanese put on their surrender was that their emperor be allowed to keep his throne, which the allies allowed anyway. In the end, the us accepted their surrender under virtually identical conditions the Japanese proposed months and weeks before those bombs were dropped. There is a reason why many top officials, even generals later spoke out that dropping the bombs was unnecessary. Once you strip away the lies, we just fried two cities full of civilians, which is considered a war crime.
Here ya go
http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2012/10/the-real-reason-america-used-nucl...
You're wrong.
My Late Father fought in the Pacific on Submarines; and my Mother lived as a Teacher and (as every able-bodied child and adult did,) work at the Factories.
I was BORN THERE, GREW UP THERE, and served as an Naval Officer for the USN while being STATIONED there. I probably came across more articles and historian on print, web, tv, and radio on this for a lot longer than most of you here.
The JPN Govt was petitioning Terms of Surrender for Months prior to the Bombs being dropped. They had no Fuel, No Food. No supplies.
They were land-bound; and the USA had complete control over the Sea Lanes and the Airspaces.
This saving lives if we invaded rant IS BULLSHIT meant to placate the Souls of those who saw the Nuke Casualties.
Nuke were for the MIC and to imtimidate RUS.
The Pacific Theatre, like the European, was the result of a War for Dominance by Powers of the Imperial/Colonial Era. The USA sabotaged JPNs efforts of their buildup before the War, while exploiting CHN themselves (most European Nations did - e.g., Boxer-Opium Wars that finally ended in 1999).
I'm not thrilled on the misconduct done by the Imperial JPN Forces during their expansion/occupation; but they did go through a Coup d'Etat by the Military in the 20's - they were to a degree harsh on their own Citizenry.
Another side note is that JPN, along with RUS, are the only 2 "Empires" in the Modern Era that actually "Invested in the economic development" of their Colonies to raise their standard of Living.
Compared this with GBR, which exploited IND/CHN, starved millions in Bengal during WWII, and the USA, who took over HI(for the American Oligarchs) and the PHI (even when they declared independence after the Spanish American War). The PHI Freedom Fighters who survived the USA Killings which suppressed their Independence Movement (guess Freedom and Liberty couldn't be exported) actually sided with the JPN Forces to kick out the Americans.
The Age of Colonial Wars and the Cold War are filled with Tragedies and Moral Compromises.
Strutting the "We're Americans; and we're the good guys because we won WWII for the World", and Vietnam, etc. BS no longer flies well.
The Late Chalmers Johnson wrote several good books on the matter regarding the American Empire. I recommend "Sorrows of Empire" - brings the reader up to speed from Past to Present.
Those bombs was just to shock Japan: destroy it's proudness and culture forcing it to become USA's bitch for the next 70 years and more.
Today one reason of Japan's fall is that they followed USA since then, haven't searched to get Independence and returning to their Asian cultural roots.
We try do to the same thing with Russia BTW.
The Japanese were ready to surrender on the only condition the emperor would stay on, which after dropping the two bombs still happened.
It was a demonstration to the world to set the stage for the next fase: the cold war.
and it worked really well, and I am grateful for it
thank you
We are going to debauch some folks.
Little know fact: Jon Hilsenrath's grandpappy was writing for the Journal back in those days. Pushing the Fed's koolaide on the hapless masses. The apple does not fall far from the tree......
(actually, I totally made this little story up)
I fear all we have done is to awaken a printing giantess and fill her with a terrible resolve.
So we sacrificed Admiral Kimmel and General Short back then for the greater good, and now today we are preparing to do the same with everyone else...good thing all wars are bankster wars, otherwise that wouldn't make a lick of sense.
And some obsolete ships, planes, and a few thousand men.
Sometimes history rhymes, doesn't it? (asbestos abatements, not enough tenants -- obsolete -- few thousand Americans)
A 'surprise attack', some useless over-production conveniently disposed of, and now a reason to sway the American populace to support an agenda that had little or no support amongst that populace the day before.
Hmmm...
PNAC? "New Pearl Harbor"?
73 years ago, like WWI, America was scammed into yet another war. Ignoring radar having located the incoming raid, ignoring messages being decrypted faster than the Nippon Embassy, Sending standard telegram for war alert, and gee we don't know where their carriers are. lol.
Sound familier boys and girls. It's a well known fact Roosevelt wanted the u.s in the war but like WWI americans wanted to stay out. Wilson even run for president on a no war platform. Changed as soon as elected.
Yep, it was all the same then as it is now, including gullible americans. Different names same old shit except now we can really screw up the planet.
Back door way into the war 'we couldn't help it, we tried to stay out, but they attacked us for no reason, and we couldn't have seen it coming'
FDR tried to bait hitler into attacking American ships since what we were doing at the time was against international law, just like Wilson did in WWI, but hitler didn't want us in the war and didn't take the bait. So, we had to pick a fight with Japan, back them into a corner, as they made several read attempts at negotiations and peace, which were all ignored by the usgov. Then we got our entrance into the war to help the Brits, just as FDR had assured Churchill we would do. It culminated in our dropping of two atomic bombs, not out of necessity , but more of a sick science experiment to see what they would do to a real city, and to intimidate the Russians. Also done after Japan tried to surrender. Their only condition was keeping their silly little emporer on his throne and not have him tried for war crimes, which we ended up conceding anyway. Such a stupid waste of lives and resources.
Speaking of carriers. In every account of Pearl Harbor there seems to be a comment that it sure was a good thing our carriers weren't moored in PH at the time of the raid since the battle of Midway would have not happened and the turning point in the war etc. etc. i always wondered why they weren't there and there is never an explanation given as to the cause of this serendipitous event. As it turns out our carriers were not in port because...they were delivering planes to the Dutch East Indies where the attack was expected to take place. Hmmm. Odd, that. What was actually the case was that the politicians (FDR) were micromanaging things and also left the military in PH out of the loop because they thought the chances, even though PH was recognized as a potential target for a surprise attact, the chances were just to low that the Japanese would be so audacious as to steam all tha way when there were other "more important " targets closer. So Kimmel and Short got caught with there pants down, largely because the poiticians screwed them before and after the attack. For the straight poop see this book that came out a couple of years ago.
http://mises.org/library/pearl-harbor-seeds-and-fruits-infamy
They were decoded approx 3 Months prior to the Attack.
The JPN Fleet could have been exposed after they crossed the Half Way Point or up to a few days travel to Carrier Wing Range - while the USA could have set up a Submarine / Fleet Screen to counter them.
Hell, send the Fleet out to strike them at dawn of the 7th. Give them a chance to survive.
3 Months is plenty of time to station assets. I've relatives on both sides of the War; and I found the Top Brass' decision to sacrifice our Troops and Citizens in HI being one of the most despicable acts of betrayal.
Conspiracy Fact: UN reports confirm Israel aiding ‘rebels’, Al-Qaeda groups fighting in Syria
Ben Selvin Happy Days Are Here Again 1930
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5dd-Un22DzA (3:19)
"Happy Days are Here Again!" (Ben Selvin and the Crooners, 1930)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqsT4xnKZPg (3:20)
These other countries may not have our technology, but they are willing to sacrifice bodies and we can’t stand heavy losses. Dow would probably soar on news that the Russians are exchanging fire with us and we are shooting each others’ planes down across Europe. More orders for replacements! Go figure; all insane.
The USA cannot withstand ANY losses more than a few thousand.
"The Japs bombed us without first declaring war"
America blockades Japanese exports of Indonesian Oil (international act of war) so technically the US declared war on Japan **THEN** the Japs bombed Pearl Harbor. Now it's all fixed up with the facts...
That's what I was saying yesterday. Last time they used an embargo. This time it is financial terrorism. Is there really any difference. If you know anyone in the NWO it is time to tell them they are freakin out of it. They have no idea what tech is actually out there.
No wait I have a better one....notice the price...
https://twitter.com/papaswamp/status/542136734809481216
Dhurka dhurka. Mohammed Jihad!
(Nirp, nirp, nirp)...
WSJ only costs seven cents.
NAW, this CAN'T be real.
Next thing, you'll be saying that John Wayne's REAL name was Marion Mason or something.
Look on the actual Dec 8th 1941 WSJ page and you'll see that the SEC was tightening their grip on Wall St crooks. Sad to say they have lost their grip over these 70 years. Back then they were tough and ruthless. Now they are rough and toothless!
looking at the comments it is clear that this site has been severely infested by the OWS-type scum