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Systemic Failure: "Doctors Prescribing Meds Based On Drug Company Kickbacks" Edition
Submitted by Mike Krieger via Liberty Blitzkrieg blog,
When the drug maker Genentech introduced a major product in 2006, it found itself in an awkward position: persuading eye doctors to start using its new more expensive drug instead of a popular cheaper version that the company already sold.
Ophthalmologists had been enthusiastically using the company’s cancer drug Avastin, which cost about $50 a dose, to treat a common eye disease in the elderly, wet macular degeneration. Then Genentech introduced Lucentis, a nearly equivalent drug that cost $2,000 a dose and was approved specifically to treat the disease.
Now, a new federal database shows that many of the doctors who were the top billers for Lucentis were also among the highest-paid consultants for Genentech, earning thousands of dollars to help promote the drug. The data raises questions about whether financial relationships between doctors and drug companies influence treatment decisions, even though physicians maintain they cannot be swayed.
Half of the 20 doctors who received the most money from Genentech to promote Lucentis in 2013 were among the highest users of the drug in 2012, billing for higher amounts of Lucentis than 75 percent of their peers. The figures were compiled from two federal databases that covered different periods, and it is not known whether or how much Genentech paid the doctors in 2012.
– From the New York Times article: Paid to Promote Eye Drug, and Prescribing It Widely
The topic at the heart of the following post is not a commonly discussed one here at Liberty Blitzkrieg. It has to do with big corporate money influencing and corrupting the medical profession. The reason I chose to highlight this particular article, is because it perfectly puts into focus two of the most important macro cancers plaguing these United States today: A complete loss of ethics, and the dangers of over-centralization/corporatization.
Let’s start with ethics. If there’s one thing I want readers to take away from reading this site, it’s an understanding that the banker bailout following the 2008 financial crisis was one of the most destructive events to happen within the U.S. during my entire lifetime. The other was the government and public’s reaction to the attacks of 9/11. The terrorist attacks turned most of the American public into groveling cowards, while the bailouts taught every criminal and person of questionable moral character that systemic crimes are encouraged and rewarded, while petty crimes will be punished to the full extent of the law.
In other words, if your criminality is compatible with and supportive of the status quo power of large corporations and government bureaucrats, it will be permitted to flourish without punishment. On the other hand, if you commit even the slightest infraction against anyone or anything even marginally related to the status quo (police, banks, government bureaucrats, corporate profits, etc) you will likely end up dead or in jail.
While criminals will often be attracted to positions of power in order to conceal and protect their schemes, criminal tendencies and a lack of ethics exists throughout all socio-economic layers of a society. Such a mindset is particularly dangerous in certain professions, which is likely why the hippocratic oath came into prevalence to begin with. Here’s a brief description from MedicineNet:
Hippocratic Oath: One of the oldest binding documents in history, the Oath written by Hippocrates is still held sacred by physicians: to treat the ill to the best of one’s ability, to preserve a patient’s privacy, to teach the secrets of medicine to the next generation, and so on.
Basically, the idea is to do no harm. While the medical industry/profession hasn’t been a key theme of mine, I’ve covered some disturbing trends and developments previously. See:
Americans are Now Traveling Overseas for Surgery
Fraud Alert: FDA Allowed Drugs with Fraudulent Testing to Remain on the Market
Problems in the Education System? Solution: Give Toddlers Powerful Drugs
The second main problem I want to highlight, are the dangers of centralization and corporatization and how these things provide a fertile environment for systemic criminality.
The overwhelming majority of people who become doctors do so with good intentions. You don’t enter medicine to make as much money as possible, particularly not these days. The few friends I have who became M.D.’s are good people with strong ethics. This is where centralization and corporatization come into play.
There is no doubt that the historically personal and intimate relationship between patients and doctors has been in a long-term decline in the U.S. My contention is that a lot of this has to do with the centralization and corporatization of the industry. In this day and age, most of us merely owe a copay and some deductible when we go in for treatment, but beyond that, one’s insurance company or the government is responsible. Thus, when a doctor decides to prescribe a much more expensive medicine versus a cheaper alternative, in that person’s mind he or she isn’t directly harming the patient. The insurance company or the government pays for it, so such a decision becomes much more ethically justifiable in the doctor’s mind.
Of course, taxpayers and society as a whole ends up footing the bill, but it is this disconnect between patient and doctor that makes it an easier choice. That, and the overall decline in societal ethics ever since the no strings attached banker bailouts told everyone that systemic crime pays.
The people who blew up the global economy are doing better than ever, as well as better than everyone else. What sort of message do you think that sends? What sort of culture does it promote? You’re seeing the answers to those questions all around you.
When the drug maker Genentech introduced a major product in 2006, it found itself in an awkward position: persuading eye doctors to start using its new more expensive drug instead of a popular cheaper version that the company already sold.
Ophthalmologists had been enthusiastically using the company’s cancer drug Avastin, which cost about $50 a dose, to treat a common eye disease in the elderly, wet macular degeneration. Then Genentech introduced Lucentis, a nearly equivalent drug that cost $2,000 a dose and was approved specifically to treat the disease.
Use of Lucentis took off, and it has become one of Medicare’s most expensive treatments — costing the federal government about $1 billion a year — even though several studies have concluded Lucentis has no significant advantage over its cheaper alternative.
Now, a new federal database shows that many of the doctors who were the top billers for Lucentis were also among the highest-paid consultants for Genentech, earning thousands of dollars to help promote the drug. The data raises questions about whether financial relationships between doctors and drug companies influence treatment decisions, even though physicians maintain they cannot be swayed.
Half of the 20 doctors who received the most money from Genentech to promote Lucentis in 2013 were among the highest users of the drug in 2012, billing for higher amounts of Lucentis than 75 percent of their peers. The figures were compiled from two federal databases that covered different periods, and it is not known whether or how much Genentech paid the doctors in 2012.
The 20 doctors earned $8,500 to $37,000 over five months in 2013, payments that included consulting and speaking fees as well as travel expenses and meals. Genentech says it has an annual cap of $50,000 a doctor for speaking fees.
Sure they have an annual cap of $50,000 per doctor, but this is just one company. If a doctor can earn that amount from 2 or 3 companies, that quickly adds up to real money.
Since Lucentis was approved in 2006, several studies have shown that the drugs are nearly equivalent, including a large government-sponsored clinical trial involving 1,200 patients that was completed in 2011. Avastin is still the most popular choice of doctors: About half of patients who were treated for wet macular degeneration received Avastin, with Lucentis and Eylea sharing the rest of the market.
Genentech has aggressively promoted Lucentis to doctors to encourage them to switch, even paying rebates to those who use large amounts of Lucentis, a practice that critics have described as improper but the company says is legal. For Genentech, the stakes are high. Lucentis is one of its top products, generating $1.3 billion in sales in the first nine months of this year, an increase of 5 percent over that period last year.
Even with widespread Avastin use, injecting Lucentis remains one of Medicare’s costliest procedures. In 2010, Medicare paid $1 billion to treat macular degeneration patients with Lucentis, while it spent $27 million for such patients treated with Avastin, according to a 2012 study from the Office of the Inspector General for the Department of Health and Human Services.
Here’s the problem I alluded to earlier. When a doctor can say to him or herself “who cares, Medicare pays for it,” you make a questionable ethical decision much easier to justify.
In 2011, the office determined that if all patients being treated with Lucentis were instead given Avastin, the federal government would have saved about $1.4 billion.
A review released this year of nine clinical trials showed that Avastin and Lucentis had similar safety profiles and that Avastin did not appear to increase deaths or serious side effects. The review was conducted by the nonprofit Cochrane Collaboration.
Still, several doctors, including those who speak on behalf of Lucentis and those who do not, said the choice between Avastin and Lucentis was not simply a matter of cost.
For example, Lucentis is specially prepared to be injected into the eye, but Avastin must be divided into smaller doses by outside compounding pharmacies, which can lead to contamination in rare cases. In 2011, more than a dozen people developed severe eye infections, and some were blinded, after they received injections of contaminated Avastin.
You’d think Genentech could figure out a way to safely divide Avastin into smaller doses, wouldn’t you?
Some doctors say there is no good reason to use Lucentis more frequently than Avastin.
“They keep talking about evidence-based medicine, and they keep pretending the corporate-sponsored research is nonbiased,” said J. Gregory Rosenthal, a retina specialist in Toledo who has become an outspoken critic of Lucentis and Eylea. “The evidence says that Avastin has at least the clinical efficacy of Lucentis and is perhaps safer.”
As above, so below.
Corruption and lack of ethics is now endemic to American life and the economy.
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And this is a surprise to who?
When William Binney blew the whistle at NSA he had two major complaints. One, was the illegal mass surveillance of US citizens contrary to their oath and the law. The second, was that systems were alll ready to go post 9/11, but it had been developed in house and the cost was modest. But the corporate vender rats wanted to re-invent the wheel and bag a few billion in the process.
My health is MY concern. I exercise hard. I eat very healthy. I find ways to reduce stress. I find hobbies that allow an outlet for me. I find ways to enjoy my kids and spend quality time with them. I read and work my mind.
If you're popping pills for health, you're missing the secret to great health.
Lose a few pounds. Pick up an athletic hobby. Play with your kids/grandkids. Garden. Devour a good book. Spend an extra hour making a healthy, delicious meal and share it with people you love.
Eat well. Converse (face to face) with intellectually stimulating friends and people you care about. Exercise! Live longer because you love life.
No thanks!
I drink (tequila) heavily and avoid arrogant health nuts like you who are always getting severe head injuries doing those "athletic hobbies"
Cause as you can see, I get enough of my own!
Interesting that this phenomenon of drug company / doctor kickbacks, which has been so prevalent in US&A 'private healthcare system' is a relative non-issue in single payer healthcare the world over..
http://www.eoionline.org/wp/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/us_spends_much_mo...
I drink (tequila) heavily and avoid arrogant health nuts like you who are always getting severe head injuries doing those "athletic hobbies"
I can imagine the distaste is mutual.
Kickbacks exist everywhere there is prescription power.
Other countries you don't need prescription....
Other countries you don't need prescription....
Uh, yeah you do. US&A been going after nz forever on this:http://www.cbsnews.com/news/new-zealands-drug-price-controls-in-us-cross...
http://www.nzdoctor.co.nz/un-doctored/2014/october-2014/07/big-pharma-tp...
Thanks for the links. Slightly OT. Based on replies to another post I made there are doubters in the USA who maintain that Government-run single payer is a non-starter. Maybe in a nation as corrupt as the USA, yes. But I guess the doubters simply won't even look at the contrary evidence from most other nations, and refuse to exercise their critical faculties (if they even have any ;-) ). Cognitive dissonance, psychological denial, willful ignorance, heads in the sand (or up their own arses), call it what you will...
NZ and Oz are examples of healthcare systems that work "well enough", especially on limited budgets.
Here endeth the rant.
The lack of rule of law is the problem. The drug company is defrauding the patients with the doctors acting as frontmen. It really is that simple.
String a few up and see if behavior changes.
Or
Implement full blown medical communism so that someone at the top can make better decisions for all of us.
Oh and go to hell Jame_Cole.
+1 for US&A. Very Nice
http://punjabigraphics.com/images/17/borat-very-nice.jpg
and brag about your side effects? Go You!
Good Whiskey, fast horses and loose women do the same for me.
I'll drink to that!
Now about how old are these loose women you got there??
And are the horses for gettin to em, or gettin away?
along with loose whiskey, good horses and fast women
You will die the best looking 135-year-"young" dude on your block. Progress!
After 36 year old Charle Parker died, the doctor thought they had the numbers reversed on his chart.
I lived healthy and did all the things you write about. Then a drunk driver pulled out and struck me. no fault of my own. 100% his. It wasnt his car he was driving. the car didnt have insurance. It was his 4th offence. His license was suspended. My insurance company abandoned me He was out celebrating his birthday. he was jobless and living with a girl friend who was taking care of this "bad boy". The collision could have killed me. The fucker refused to take responsibility and ran from the law. He finally got caught and got a free lawyer and all the rest of the shit you get for being a criminal. Life isnt about living well... its about luck and circumstance. If that "drunk driver" comes your way there is nothing you can do about it. You are going to DIE. Eat... drink and be merry.
Awfully preachy, doncha think? And I don't think more exercise or a specific diet will prevent you from getting macular degeneration in your elderly years if you have the gene markers for it. Nor will a special diet and more exercise help you slow the loss of your sight. There are appropriate uses for drug therapies.
After I took my xanax I didn't even care.
Love that stuff. Ex-Girlfriend got all she asked for; I had to beg because I was a Man and was supposed to "take it".
Relative who is a Doctor lamented to me years ago that the Pharmaceutical reps. made as much as she did, or more.
Big pharma handed out sky-box season tickets to the local NBA team, Club Med vacations, and paid for catered lunches for their office.
No conflict of interest there! Too bad the A.M.A. and the Medical profession has been bought just like CONgress.
ew, not disagreeing with most of that, but usually the AMA is buying; not bought. Conceptually, the AMA and the medical profession is the same relationship as the fed and the banks. A Cartel.
Xanax hell, I think we're probably all about ready for some good ole LSD, just to help tolerate this fucked up world...
Have they Re-Marketed that yet?
There's quite a large psychedelic community in my town and such things are easily found. I ate entirely too much though.
But I bet it was a great attitude adjustment!
I think in the prevailing state of mind, an acid trip would be a terrible idea. The stuff completely dismantles your filter. That's the last thing you need in a world like today's. Mushrooms would be the furthest down that road I'd be willing to go, with the dire thoughts back in the corners of my mind.
I've heard most of the "LSD" available actually isn't LSD anymore. Mostly derivatives of it with a slightly different formula. Sometimes the difference is very consequential. Sometimes not. Either way, pretty risky and no way to know what you're getting until you're too far committed.
youve clearly never done LSD. all about love and opening your mind to new ideas. im at least partially convinced that my frequent marijuana use and my two or three hallucinogenic experiences when i was in college were the first step of my waking up. if you dont currently smoke pot, i would advise you start immediately. i use it when i have a problem that i cant solve or need a different take on a situation. it's amazing how quickly these drugs can provide clarity and profound introspection. also helps to put your problems in perspective.
i also really want to try DMT. anyone ever done it? apparently it lasts for 5 minutes and you get to talk to god and see the entire universe. yes please.
I've tripped maybe 40 times. 3 of those were on DMT.
1st DMT trip: went to a church of impossible architechture and attended a mass given by an alien priest. All the worshippers were from different species.
2. Was up on a stage. Got a standing ovation from an infiinite number of nutcrackers. Not a lot. Infinite.
3. This one is sort of hard to describe. You know how you can remember the past and speculate about the future? All that was reversed.
Even though objectively a DMT trip lasts 5-10 minutes, subjectively due to time dilation t feels like forever. Literally.
DMT is completely worth it. If you have the opportunity, do it. It's a lot better use of your time than what you'd be otherwise doing.
how psychedelics are saving lives:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3uqBGTnUukg
try peyote, its free.
Kickbacks driving a government controlled industry? Say it ain't so!
Kick-backs is such an ugly word. The preferred term is "revenue sharing".
"Revenue smoothing".
this country is toast....
More like a burning bag of.....
I don't recognize this place any more..... we don't MAKE anything are obsessed with faux news focused on mindless celebrities and, frankly, are well on our way to the future of 'Idiocracy' (but with a few evil 'smart' ones pulling the strings and profitting off the proles)
You gotta love the Ivy league.
Uuuuh Whaaat?
Alternative version; "You gotta love the Ivy league on Roundup".
USA represents 4.3% of the world's population and spends more than 50% of the world's spending on pharmaceuticals. Nothing like fraud, deceit and chicanery to ramp up spending.
Besides, it boosts the GDP. So it is all good.
Also consumes 25% of the world's energy resources.
Americans spend at least $50 billion a year on statins. MIT scientist calls them poison:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZomZEPBdbM
Total US spending on pharmaceuticals a year is at least $500 billion. Or $1577 per person per year. Per capita spending on food in USA is $2400 per year.
Per capita food is $2400 a year? Damn, someone ain't eating!
We are way on the high end of that bell curve.
But look at every old persons counter, medicine cabinet, etc. They don't even know why they are taking many of their pills anymore.
If they had to pay for them, well that would be different.
Cost shifting is a big influence.
When I hurt my back years ago and had the $20 per script I didnt care what they gave me. Now with everything out of pocket I would find out what is absolutely necessary.
Most shit doesn't work anyways, and the fun ones (meaning addictive) aren't handed out anymore. Hell, Vics went schedule II now. Easier to just buy heroin.
Or just buy some coke with fentanyl in in like just happened here and have your Uma Thurman moment before you die.
What if governments didn't regulate what you put in your body?
pods
"What if governments didn't regulate what you put in your body? "
We wouldn't have nearly the problems we have today. If only because many would have taken themselves out of the system. (Uma Thurman moment and all...)
Western "medicine" is a most disgusting practice.
Mask some symptoms with some pills, present the belief of betterness, wait for more symptoms to reappear with more vigor, inse and repeat.
For a few dollars more...
They don't call it the "practice" of medicine for nothing, you know.
The only time I visit those leeches is once a year for my company mandated physical.
Otherwise I say fuck em.
"If you have to ask how much the treatment is, you deserve to die from the disease."
- Somebody said this, I guarandamnedtee you
The powers that be formed the AMA last century. What the hell did you expect??
The current AMA has only 17% of current docs on their rolls. It has become an insurance company with a good source of income. It is sad that people still they they represent doctors in any way. The AMA has become a socialist organization that chums up to government to receive continued cash flow. They are like AARP. They lie about who benefits from their suggestions.
I wonder if the AMA can buy their health with their robbed funds.
As far as health is concerned, they're parasitic thugs who have no idea of what they're doing.
As Joan Crawford and Steve Jobs pointed out, money can't buy you your health.
I can HELP- unless the status quo is pulling for quality control, God help us.
Just don't do drugs. ANY drugs, especially from the legalized "professional" drug dealers.
Oxy - the gateway drug to Heroin....... the legal stuff leads to the illegal....
funny how prescribed painkillers were all the rage when the Taliban had pretty much eliminated Opium production in Afghanistan.... now after teh US running Afghanistan for a dozen years, heroin is freely available and they're cracking down on prescription painkillers.....
actually i think its the other way around, but i would say you move up to the good stuff when to go with big pharma
tard
good advice if you are healthy..just don't get any of the problem I treat.
tard
good advice if you are healthy..just don't get any of the problem I treat.
It's been happening for a long time, and they also pay professors at medical schools.
Don't forget all of the failed models and actresses that end up hawking the pills to the doctors.
Back when I had chronic tonselitis (toke those bitchez out!) I would sit in the waiting room and look at those hookers with a pitched tent.
I'm sure it's just a coincidence.
Makes me sick. This is one of the reasons that we have made no progress in fighting cancer.
No progress fighting cancer????
Tell that to the survivors of childhood leukemia, now there are a lot of them you could ask.
Some solid tumors are still a problem but it is a competitive market. The idea someone would hide a successful drug is simply crazy. There are big bucks to be made with good drugs. Who do you think benefits from not bringing new, better drugs to market?
All of the advances have been INCREMENTAL in nature. Improving the basic chemo & radiation-based treatments. Broad spectrum stuff. Kill the cancer just before you kill the patient.
They've also paid a lot more attention to the role of viruses in cancer as well. THis is not exactly new, but its getting more attention.
When the game changes is when you get genetically-targeted, individualized treatments. Not just because of their effectiveness against the cancer but because they would, in theory, have RADICALLY fewer side effects, which is a basic problem with all current treatments.
"There are big bucks to be made with good drugs. Who do you think benefits from not bringing new, better drugs to market?"
When your tribe also owns the printing press, you don't provide drugs for profit. You provide drugs for CONTROL.
We know what the 'cure' for Cancer is Rick Simpson Oil [ie Cannabis Oil], I should know I am using it myself to treat my own Cancer at the moment. IMO that is one of the BIG reasons against the "Legalization" of Cannabis [marijuana is a made up word BTW]. When Cancer is a $250 BILLION dollar a yr industry, do you honestly think 'they' want us to know that you can KILL/Cure it with a weed you grow in your backyard that you make a medicinal oil from?
Cannibis oil doesn't cure shit. A close friend of mine died last Feb. of throat cancer. Tried cannibis oil and a few other alternative "cures". Bubkis. To be fair, the traditional Western medicine didn't do shit, either.
Sorry your friend died.
"A British researcher has found that cannabinoids, a term for chemicals derived from marijuana, can kill leukemia cells, and he expects clinical trials for new medications to begin soon.
The findings, published in the October issue of the journal Anticancer Research, show that certain non-psychoactive cannabinoids "resulted in dramatic reductions in cell viability" and "caused a simultaneous arrest at all phases of the cell cycle," according to an abstract posted online."
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/10/24/study-cannabis-compounds-...
There are other studies too where they are finding that the CBD's in cannabis do in fact arrest and kill cancer cells. More studies needed.
If you want to understand the epidemic of cancer in the US, you have to read Dr Mary's Monkey by Edward Haslam. Or you can listen on You Tube:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZ5-liXcXLI
This is the best kept secret of the last 60 years with more subplots and surprise situations (with no endings in sight). Haslam is a very modest and humble man calling for what should be an obvious formal investigation into many issues still unresolved. He claims he's NOT the investigation, but his exposure is enough that if one reads the work entirely with an open mind, they will understand why 60 Minute TV Magazine Producers call this the "story of the century."
Haslam introduces us to an unsolved murder of one of the leading cancer researchers of the last 75 years, Mary Sherman. Her autopsy was sealed for around 30 years, and Haslams explanation of how she died makes far more sence than the official police report written under questionable police procedure. Most importantly, Haslam introduces us to the dark side of the Polio Vaccine and the complications it went through during it's development and the lasting problems we are now struggling with because of it -- the SV-40 VIRUS. It's all over your interest, but ask your doctor or a med school faculty doctor about the SV-40 Virus, and you'll learn, they know nothing about it. Their education and training has been so carefully compartmentalized and they know nothing of these issues, but they are all over the internet if you choose to look. Haslam teaches us about many doctors who lost their careers trying to blow the whistle on these issues.
In short the polio vaccine made from monkey kidneys carried the SV-40 virus which remains dormant inside baby boomers who received the polio vaccine until the immune system is weakened to the point where the SV-40 Virus can transform into one of the major cancer's: lung, breast, soft tissue, bone cancer, etc
http://www.amazon.com/Dr-Marys-Monkey-Cancer-Causing-Assassination/dp/19...
Eerie case that's stranger than fiction and fiendish in it's results. Knowingly injecting children with a cancer causing virus is pretty damned depraved.
Boomers are dropping like flies from cancers at 3X the rate of their parents.
This is a must see /read.
krieger this has been going on for decades and decades. not at all a new story. stop trying to shove everything into your "new collapsing failing america" theme
Hippocratic, hypocrite..... there is something peculiarly similar about those two words.
big pharma, big hooters. nothing new here.
My ophthalmologist, who I have known professionally for 20 years and hold in high regard, tells me the new injections work, the old drug not so much.
I have been a physician for 40 years. I am aware of very few cases of physician bribery. Even the lunches we still get are regulated.
Yes Medicare paying for drugs eliminates the cost part of the equation off the doctors shoulders. I agree no one is minding the shop. there are no rewards for being efficient....but patients notice. I usually discuss costs with patients even if 'medicare is paying'.
Most docs want to do the right thing. Sometimes we err in deciding what is right but I don't see big Pharma directly influencing doctors....now Medicare, yes I think that is where they do their influencing. Medicare is where they get their prices set.
you cant be serious. 20 years ago they regularly gave dinners and cruises and paid board advisory positions to doctors. completely and totally widespread. in fact, it was the norm. not a peep from anybody. you must be a naturopathic physician
.... there are a percentage of doctor bad eggs out there who abuse this and are co-enabled by medical supply and device companies...those individuals should be damned and not the whole profession as obamascare is working hard to do. However, as a still practicing doc since 1991 I have NEVER seen personally much less been offered any of these kinds of outrageous lucrative perks.... the medical supply and device companies can't even hand out pens or pads of papers any more but FYI your elected political ruling elite can take all kinds of pay offs usually disguised as "campaign or PAC contributions". Other stuff is likely to be going on which the sheeple are kept blind to. BTW, they passed a bill hidden in which was their ability to trade legally with inside information.
Its not about the cost, metrics or data. Its about trust. Without trust what do doctors really have to sell.
Data is avalible online, and will tell you more then a visit to the local doctor ever will about that potion, tonic or pill.
Gatekeepers are no longer required for information. Doctors can go back to doing house calls for fretful mothers and their children.
Everyone who likes to beat up on Dr.s has never had a chronic pain situation like I have. I absolutely LOVE my neurologist. He managed to find a balance of anti-convulsants to keep me from a screaming intense pain that is like being tazered.
I wouldn't care if my Dr. collected more vig than John Gotti as long as he can keep me from committing suicide to escape the kind of pain I get.
Thankfully, opioids do nothing for this nerve pain or I would be a $1000 a day junkie.
Try getting pain management from the FDA.
Love your Dr. You might really need him some day.
Well said. I also have chronic health issues. With the right combinations of pharmaceuticals I have a much higher quality of life.
Now, I could stand to exercise more and eat better, but that's a whole different discussion.
I have chronic pain and my doctor spends about 5 minutes with me and does what the computer says. Glad you guys like your dealers...
Interesting situation. Mind sharing what you're neurologist is prescribing? This is for personal insight and has nothing to do with this conversation. Thanks.
There is nothing else in life quite like chronic pain.
I once worked transcribing physician interviews for Boston Scientific. They pay the docs more cash than most folks make in a week just to give some bullshit positive reviews of their products. If you haven't seen "physician bribery" then you must be out of touch with your peers...or you live in rural nowhere and don't hang out much with the immigrant doctors who moved to the US to make MONEY, not help people.
What are you people....on dope?
Yeah, and it's causing me to see double.
Wow, doc, you must be psychic. You replied a minute before he commented.
What are you people....on dope?
Yeah, and it's causing me to see double.
The top comment hit it right on the head. Having worked for the big PBM's (Caremark, etc.) for 25+ years (not anymore), I can tell you this is SOP, not to mention the other kickbacks down the line. Glad to see nothing has changed since I got out. /s
Who is the true "drug dealer"? The corner crack dealer in the 'hood or the pharmaceutical sales rep in the McMansion?
I think we all know the answer to that.
Look up your doctor here:
https://openpaymentsdata.cms.gov/
Stupid Americans would spend $425 on glitter pills and whine about $2000 drugs? (No seriously, you can get capsules at any vitamin store and fill it with glitter! For less than $20 in most parts of the U.S.)
They're not complaining because they're doing it with other people's money.
i don't know if they were inherently stupid, high on mind candy, born mentally handicapped of if the press was promoting stupidity. Being that the Duhmerican population pops homicidal sociopathic prepped chemical cocktails at their bodies without quality control, somebody got the bright idea to do this.
It would be funny to see them **** glitter and colors after snorting their baby laxatives!
Excuse me. I was doubled over in cramps again today because of an endocrine issue that big pharma garbage bribed the doctors not to treat. After waiting to speak to a live agent on my Affordable Care Act account after being on hold for 12 hours in a week. I don't know that Big Pharma isn't worse than North koreans poisoning kimchi for their refugee prisoners. Thank God it wasn't a heart attack since I like just dropped my LDL 55 points WITHOUT STATINS or chemicals!
The Boomers said, "I paid my life into Medicare, the doctors will take care of me!"
Who wants to make bets when these boomer patients and a bunch of glitterazi popping teenage idiots flood the ER on public dime because of some pills they popped? "all together now!" (this is a warning to not get sick- I'm doing what I can to avoid the hospitals right now.)
IF there was ever a "smart" drug, it was taken off the shelves before the 70's.
Not just doctors. Architects, engineers, interior designers, all have thier favorite 'products' to specify. I see it constantly.
........ and don't forget the elected ruling political elite turds who benefit from all kinds of payoffs (aka political campaign contributions and who knows whate else) but also get to legally inside trade....
you lost me at let's start with ethics.
actually i am more inclined to categorize a doctor as an insurance claims adjuster. if helath insurance was like no fault auto insurance, those with good auto policies would be given a can of spray paint to fix their dent, which those with no insurance would get a new car. to wit, when the state pays for the indigent, there is no procedure which is too expensive.
If I was a doctor with Obamacare a coming...I would do whatever to get the goods now..because in 5 years you will be out of business...if not sooner....
My doctor who I've been seeing since the 80s was cash only becasue he was sick of the meddling bullshit has to now accept the ACA bullshit. In the past I could go in and pay 100.00 and he would see me as long as it took. Now he has to be electronically motivated to subserviance.
This is an old topic on these two drugs that actually doctors discovered and are proposing the use of the cheaper drug. Yes pharma gets in the way as well as needing the FDA approval for Off Label use, I agree. This is a little blown out of proportion as was said, most doctors want to do the right thing.
Again the cost here too and those "big dollars" paid, it's a very tiny drop and the entire MD data base on what was paid to doctors is far out shadowed in many other places and yes you go right back to the pharma on this. Doctors have a lot on their plate today with regulations and did you know there are 38 government agencies that an MD practice has to answer to today or can shut them down? It was 4 agencies for years. so add that on.
By the way if you like your doctor and what they do for you and value the doctor patient relationship, nominte them to the Gold Foundation that futhres the need for humanism in medicine. It's a good thing to do.
http://ducknetweb.blogspot.com/2014/05/humanism-in-medicine-sometimes-its-ok.html
Please also don't forget that Quants are now modeling the insurance policies we buy for health insurance and one big one, United Healthcare is a pharmacy benefit manager and sells drugs, so how about those apples.
http://ducknetweb.blogspot.com/2014/10/data-scientistsquants-in-health.html
By the way, don't depend on web sites to give you accurate listings on doctors either as we get table scraps. He's an example of how you can still go to the hopsital that the CEO is wating for sentencing, facility is shut down, California state senator was caught in this with being bribed, and yet no mention of this and the closed facility has tons of MDs on staff with 5 star ratings. Pretty good isn't it:) By the way, according to this site you can still go see Michael Jackson's old bankrupt doctor too who's been out of business for years.
http://ducknetweb.blogspot.com/2014/11/why-does-hospital-that-was-closed-by.html
http://ducknetweb.blogspot.com/2014/02/operation-spinal-cap-former-owner-of.html
Taking back medicine, a group of videos you might want to see telling the doctor's side of the story with over regulation and how they function today, it's not easy.
http://ducknetweb.blogspot.com/2014/07/taking-back-medicine-maintenance-of.html
What I read is the drug companies first converted the doctors to there cause, had them become a part of the drug development and subsequent launch. They evangelized them, and turned them loose to convert others. Now they are honest to God true believers in what ever they are pushing. Why would they pick any other drug at that point?
The real culprit here is the third party pays system that removes all incentive to save money or be efficient. Obamacare just worsened it by centralizing all decisions and removing competition.
Snake oil TV Pharm advertisement pill peddlers disclosing disclaimers to avoid liable lawsuit’s ( i.e. rectum bleeding, depression, and suicidal thoughts, etc) . Just don’t take the prescribed medication.
Bathhouse: Hey Doc, you got anything for my depression and suicidal thoughts? My ass quit bleeding,and its got me on a O'Bummer.
LOL. Still in a lot of pain. New bone inserted into my spine, nerve damage and extreme discomfort. Why would you buy legalized narcotics to offset throbbing pain and jack up insurance cost? Tail wagging ACA dog antics.
Stupid fucking Obama administration trying to make people go from private insurance to public insurance. I have private insurance!
Do not accept any drug from any doctor that has only been in widespread public use less than 10 years. I have friends who work in drug research labs. Based on what they tell me, I'm fairly certain that the lack of rigor in their investigations would make witch doctors from the 12th century BC seem like ethical people.
In fact, I would recommend that if your doctor is prescribing you newer drugs, that you find a new doctor.
I spend most of my money on women, alcohol and cigarettes, the rest I waste.
Old news
Yes I can relate, as a parent with three kids I accompany them for checkups etc and often inquire about the importance of nutrition in preventing illness. The doctors, however well-educated, go into a daze like I am from a different planet to suggest anything other than DRUGS is the answer to illness.
I knew a guy who became a heart surgeon. All the way through his medical training, he had 8 hours on studying health. 8 hours! All they study is disease and have now become a major disease as western medicine is the second leading cause of death in Amerika.
"What does what you eat have to do with anything?" - my fail of a doctor for my autoimmune disease
And here is even the bigger crime folks. MacDGen is reversible. Listen & learn. I'm a convert that has had very good results no longer than I've been following protocols based in science, not hack & slash medicine.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=acIQUWR_qvc
Marilu Henner endorses Wallachs products. Learn his history as a veterinarian first (wild kingdom) then on to become a naturopath.
http://www.suntimes.com/lifestyles/splash/15352943-418/daily-splash-marilu-henner-on-how-her-husbands-small-steps-scored-a-big-win-over.html
BTW there's a website doctors for dollars that you can look up any physician to see if they're on the take. Their gift exposure is in excess of $250. After being diag'd w/fibromyalgia (this after showing xrays of my broken neck) this idiot wanted to prescribe lyrica. It just so happened it's made by Forrest Labs. Low & behold, guess who was taking "gifts" in excess of $250 from Forrest Labs???
These bastids will killya I say.
I'm looking for a doc in my area that can hook me up, is there a search engine for this?
sarc
Research Rockefeller influence in the early 20th century and you'll have your answer as to why the medical system is 99.999% drug based.
When I had my spinal surgery back in October. Doc prescribed me with Percocet and Flexeril. I still have the RX slip showing the prescription was unfilled, 10/28/2014. My revisit on 11/11/2014, Doc learnt that I was not taking his prescribed drugs. Issued me another slip for neurontin medication on 11/11/14. Didn’t fulfill that obligation either, still have the slip.
Meet with doc on Tuesday, bet he prescribes another miracle drug that I won’t take. PSP, Heroin, Cocaine doesn’t cure. They make you become legalized pharmaceutical pill addicts. Under the umbrella of new breaking cures. Complete rubbish! FYI..
The Hippocrtatic oath morphed into the Hipocritical oath once doctors started openl and with official sanction allowing abortion. There is the genesis of the corruption.
Good for you Atomizer. Judging from the fact you are able to type comments on a message board, I'm willing to guess you recovered just fine without the assitance of opiates.
Thank you.
The Hippocrtatic oath morphed into the Hipocritical oath once doctors started openly and with official sanction allowing abortion. There is the genesis of the corruption.
The drug companies test all of these drugs on individually -- if you are on more than one drug, from different drug companies, then you are a 'guuinea pig' and part of the giant field testing of the 'human research' experiment. Decide what is your worst problem and if you absolutely need it, take a drug that helps that. Once you start adding a second drug you start adding complications, which mean you get drug #3 to help with the interaction between drug #1 and drug #2. The cycle never ends until either you die, or the drug companies get rich!
You blame the,
"dangers of centralization and corporatization and how these things provide a fertile environment for systemic criminality."
It's not centralization that has caused this bureaucratic cluster, it's our state governments that gave Ambulance or Allopathic medicine a government-protected monopoly to diagnose, treat and cure disease.
That's what has empowered this class of criminals behind what I refer to as Monopoly Quack Medicine.
With government-protected Monopoly Medicine it's all about maximizing profits and getting patients on daily "maintenance" drugs. There's no interest in cures or cost containment.
In fact investors who have Big Pharma stock should sell ASAP because when the dollar collapses, corrupt agencies like the FDA that protect the "Standard of Care" favoring Big Pharma and all these expensive, unaffordable and dangerous "miracle" organ replacements and organ and cancer removal surgerys, will probably collapse too.
Like the corrupt Fed, these are the last days of government-protected monopolies and if they had to compete with cheaper, safer and far more effective natural medicine like Homeopathy, Naturopathy or Chinese Medicine they would likely be starved for patients.
The last time the dangerous Allopaths competed in the marketplace in 1900 they could only attract 14% of patients. The public was afraid of them and fortunately there was still a free market in medicine so they chose affordable, safe and vastly more effective natural medicine.
In the 1918 Flu Pandemic, the Allopaths lost 30% of their patients. The later banned alternative medical providers lost 1%.
Allopaths were known as the Quicks (later Quacks) for the quicksilver or mercury they poisoned their patients with. They're still poisoning patients with toxic mercury in vaccines along with aluminum, MSG and formaldehyde embalming fluid. They're also poisoning and killing patients with chemotherapy for cancer that's a derivative of WW1 mustard gas.
Because we allowed EU Organized Crime through their Jesuit, Zionist and Masonic agents to take over our money and medicine around 1913, we allowed the Quacks of the day, a government-protected monopoly and drove out the true healers.
The sheeple to this day still believe the myth that Ambulance Allopathic Medicine earned it's government-protected status because it's the only "proven and scientific" medicine.
Nothing could be further from the truth. It's a vicious, cruel lie that 95% of the public not only believe, but even defend this myth.
Forget about government-protected monopolies containing costs, our hidden rulers are getting a huge belly laugh on their way to the bank.
The pinnacle of this story is Truvada. Gilead developed a daily treatment for gays so positives wouldn't have disease progression (but not cured) and negatives will take it so they can have unprotected gay sex. I'm not kidding either. This is how it is being marketed and promoted as PrEP. Also, might not be too well known is that the government subsidizes these treatments and expensive drugs as disease prevention. Only a completely insane government would do this.
Since when is this news? Drug makers have been providing junkets to Hawaii and hiring hot blondes as drug reps to do whatever it takes to get their swill scribbled on all those pads since before Hipocrates.
A white lab coat is a key sign of a whore.
what are the doctors names ?
Big pharma = Drug cartels with government approval and good PR
Isn't this what they're doing to children in schools that do not conform?
You spend years and years deriding every positive value, honesty, rectitude, empathy, consideration, etc. Sooo passé, right? You promote the figure of the successful crook, the Ayn Rand amoral businessman who is a "winner", the mafia boss, the serial killer, the soulless lawyer, etc (I could make a long list of Hollywood movies that give a good image of lowly thugs).
You're so cynical you think that showing men for psychopaths and bandits is a no-nonsense vision of the reality of mankind. In fact, you end up trapping yourself into believing crooks are the norm, only people won't admit they all are.
And then, you go indignant and yell blue murder because those in charge take you at your word, lose all their unwanted integrity and fashion themselves after your beliefs, hence become corrupt.
Lol.
You cannot BE an official doctor in the USSA unless you are fundamentally corrupt. The corporate drug pushers and FDA are even worse.
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You forgot all the ads for perscription medicines that are on TV that are aimed at the general public. Mr. Public is supposed to go into his doctor's office and demand a perscription for the new drug. I think the reality is much worse: the commercials are a payment by Big Pharma to the media; a payment not to look too closely into their business. As in investigating the psychotrophic drugs the theater shooter, the Connecticut school shooter, and the Navy Yard shooter were on when they did their rampage.
Anecdote is anecdotal. Remarkable.