This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
IMF Now Ready To Slam The Door On The U.S. And The Dollar
Submitted by Brandon Smith via Alt-Market blog,

As I write this, the news is saturated with stories of a hostage situation possibly involving Islamic militants in Sydney, Australia. Like many, I am concerned about the shockwave such an event will create through our sociopolitical structures. However, while most of the world will be distracted by the outcome of this crisis (for good or bad) for at least the week, I find I must concern myself with a far more important and dangerous situation.
Up to 40 people may be held by a supposed extremist in Sydney, but the entire world is currently being held hostage economically by international banks. This is the crisis no one in the mainstream is talking about, so alternative analysts must.
As I predicted last month in “We Have Just Witnessed The Last Gasp Of The Global Economy,” severe volatility is now returning to global markets after the pre-game 10 percent drop in equities in October hinted at what was to come.
We expected such destabilization after the wrap-up of the Fed taper, and the markets have not disappointed so far. My position has always been that the taper of QE3 made very little sense in terms of maintaining the manipulated illusion of economic health — unless, of course, the Federal Reserve was implementing the taper in preparation for a renewed financial catastrophe. That is to say, the central bankers have established the lie of American fiscal recovery and then separated themselves from blame for the implosion they KNOW is coming. If the markets were to collapse while stimulus is officially active, the tragedy would be forever a millstone on the necks of the banksters. And we can’t have that now, can we?
This is not to say that individual central banks and even currencies are not expendable in the grand scheme of things. In fact, the long-term goal of globalists has been to consolidate all currency systems and central banks under the outward control of the International Monetary Fund and the Bank Of International Settlements, as I outlined in “The Economic Endgame Explained.”
That particular article was only a summary of a dangerous trend I have been concerned about for years; namely the strategy by international financiers to create a dollar-collapse scenario that will be blamed on prepositioned scapegoats. I have no idea what form these scapegoats will take - there are simply too many possible triggers for fiscal calamity. What I do know, though, is the goal of the endgame: to remove the dollar’s world reserve status and to pressure the American people into conforming or even begging for centralized administration of our economy by the IMF.
The delusion perpetuated in the mainstream is that the IMF is a U.S.-dominated institution. I have outlined on many occasions why this is false. The IMF like all central banks is dominated by the international corporate banking cartel. Central banks are merely front organizations for globalists, and I am often reminded of the following quote from elitist insider Carroll Quigley when I hear people suggest that central banks are somehow independent from one another or that the Federal Reserve is itself the singular “source” of the world’s economic ills:
It must not be felt that these heads of the world’s chief central banks were themselves substantive powers in world finance. They were not. Rather, they were the technicians and agents of the dominant investment bankers of their own countries, who had raised them up and were perfectly capable of throwing them down.
The substantive financial powers of the world were in the hands of these investment bankers (also called “international” or “merchant” bankers) who remained largely behind the scenes in their own unincorporated private banks. These formed a system of international cooperation and national dominance which was more private, more powerful and more secret than that of their agents in the central banks.
No one can now argue against this reality after we have witnessed hard evidence of Goldman Sachs dictating Federal Reserve policy, as outlined here.
And, most recently, we now know that international bankers control political legislation as well, as Congress passed with little resistance a bill that negates the Frank-Dodd restrictions on derivatives and places the U.S. taxpayers and account holders on the hook for more than $303 trillion in toxic debt instruments. The bill is, for all intents and purposes, a “bail-in” measure in disguise. And it was pushed through with the direct influence of JPMorgan Chase CEO Jamie Dimon.
The Federal Reserve, the U.S. government and the dollar are as expendable to the elites as any other economic or political appendage. And it can be replaced at will with yet another illusory structure if this furthers their goal of total centralization. This has been done for centuries, and I fail to see why anyone would assume that globalists would change their tactics now to preserve the dollar system. They call it the “New World Order,” but it is really the same old-world monetary order out of chaos that has always been exploited. Enter the IMF’s old/new world vision.
While the investment universe has been mesmerized by the deterioration of the Russian Ruble and oil prices, the IMF has been a busy little bee hive...
In articles over the past year, I have warned that the plan to dethrone the dollar and replace it with the special drawing rights basket currency system would be accelerated after it became clear that the U.S. Congress would refuse to pass the IMF reforms of 2010 proclaiming “inclusiveness” for developing economies, including the BRICS nations. The latest spending bill removed any mention of IMF reforms. The IMF, under Christine Lagarde, has insisted that if the U.S. did not approve its part of the reforms, the IMF would be forced to pursue a “Plan B” scenario. The details on this “plan B” have not been forthcoming, until now.
The Financial Times reported on the IMF shift away from the U.S. by asserting the authority to remove the veto power America has always enjoyed over the institution. This action is a stark reminder to mainstream talking heads and to those who believe the U.S. is the core economic danger to the world that the IMF is NOT an extension of American policy. If anything, the IMF and the U.S. are extensions of international banking power, just as the BRICS are nothing more than puppets for the same self-serving financial oligarchy clamoring for the same IMF-controlled paradigm, as Vladimir Putin openly admitted:
"In the BRICS case we see a whole set of coinciding strategic interests. First of all, this is the common intention to reform the international monetary and financial system. In the present form it is unjust to the BRICS countries and to new economies in general. We should take a more active part in the IMF and the World Bank’s decision-making system. The international monetary system itself depends a lot on the US dollar, or, to be precise, on the monetary and financial policy of the US authorities. The BRICS countries want to change this…"
And of course the Chinese have pronounced their fealty to the IMF global currency concept:
The world economic crisis shows the "inherent vulnerabilities and systemic risks in the existing international monetary system," Gov. Zhou Xiaochuan said in an essay released Monday by the bank. He recommended creating a currency made up of a basket of global currencies and controlled by the International Monetary Fund and said it would help "to achieve the objective of safeguarding global economic and financial stability."
The BRICS are not the only nations demanding the U.S. lose its supposed "influence" over the IMF. Germany, the core economic pillar of the EU, called for America to relinquish its veto power back in 2010 just as the reforms measure was announced.
The IMF decision to possibly eliminate U.S. veto power and, thus, influence over IMF decisions may come as early as the first quarter of next year. This is the great “economic reset” that Largarde has been promoting ad nauseam in multiple interviews and speeches over the past six months. All of these measures are culminating in what I believe will be a more official announcement of a dump of the U.S. dollar as world reserve currency.
Along with the imminent loss of veto power, I have also written on the concerns of the coming SDR conference in 2015. This conference is held only once every five years. My suspicion has been that the IMF plans to announce the inclusion of the Chinese yuan in the SDR basket and that this will coincide with a steady dollar dump around the globe. Multiple major economies have already dropped the dollar in bilateral trade with China, and engineered tensions between the U.S. and the East have exacerbated the issue.
The timing of the SDR conference has now been announced, and the meeting looks to be set for October of 2015. Interestingly, this linked article from Bloomberg notes that China has a “real shot” at SDR inclusion and official “reserve status” next year, but warns that the U.S. “may use its veto power” to stop China’s membership. I have to laugh at the absurdity of it all, because there are many people in the world of economic study who still believe the developments of globalization and fiscal distress are all “random.” I suppose that if it is all random, then it is a rather convenient coincidence that the U.S. just happens to be on the verge of losing veto power in the IMF just before they are about to bring the BRICS into the SDR fold and supplant the dollar.
This is it, folks; this is the endgame right in front of our faces. The year of 2014 is the new 2007, with all the negative potential but 100 times more explosive going into 2015. Our nation has wallowed in slowly degrading financial conditions for years, hidden by fake economic statistics and manipulated stock prices. All of it has been a prelude to a much more frenetic and shocking event. I believe that we will see continued market chaos from now on, with a steep declining trend intermixed with brief but inadequate “dead cat” stock bounces. I expect a hailstorm of geopolitical crises over the next year to provide cover for the shift away from the dollar.
Ultimately, the death of the dollar will be hailed in the mainstream as a “good and necessary thing.” They will call it “karma.” They will call it “progress.” They will even call it “decentralization” and a success for the free market. But it will not feel like a positive development for the American public, who will suffer greatly as the dollar crumbles. Only those educated in the underpinnings of shadow banking will understand the whole thing is a charade designed to hide the complete centralization of sovereign economic governance into the hands of the globalists, using the IMF and BIS as “fiscal heroes,” saving the world from a state of economic destruction the elites themselves secretly created.
- 79842 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -


by the looks of DX action tonight.. something again is brewing..
http://hedgeaccordingly.com/2014/12/to-boost-ruble-russia-may-be-forced-...
Get a fucking life!!!! You want people to come to your blog then ask yourself one question. What can I offer my readers that nobody else is doing? Its called a fucking niche.
Bring it on already.
Chinese crap is waaaay overvalued.
I am totally mystified why so many on this site are constantly calling to "bring it on".
I don't think one in a hundred have the foggiest idea of what the totality of chaos would be if the system came crashing down and it was every man (or woman) for him/her self.
The system is corrupt from top to bottom and all the way through. Western society deserves judgment, but not for the reason so many are clamouring for. It is morally, spiritually bankrupt and therefore economically so as well. (Men with high morals are not economic crooks).
Does our society deserve what's coming? Yes it does. But that does not mean I am looking forward to it with any sense of joy or satisfaction.
Joy for our future generations - I'll glad take the brunt of this bullshit to spare my kin.
Apply - I can understand that sentiment and can even agree with it to a degree.
What I am talking about is the cavalier attitude of bravado that seems to exist that is utterly clueless of what a chaotic hell this world would be when the system collapses and millions are starving to death and you're one of the number.
This is not a popcorn at the movies scenario that so many like to use. It will be brutal beyond comprehension.
Because slavery is more painful.
No, what is painful is the obviousness of the outcome. It is mathematically impossible for the US to pay down the debt at this point. Ergo, the necessity of a collapse at an unspecified point in the future. What Brandon has missed here is the collusive nature of the players. The US is is largest stockholder in the IMF. What he terms as the 'merchant bankers' are essentially the fed's primary dealer list. If you examine the largest stockholders in the IMF (http://www.cgdev.org/files/1425483_file_IFI_Briefs_IMF_FINAL.pdf), you will find that the US, Japan, Germany, France, and the UK own a third of the stock. As Brandon mentions, and we all know, these 'merchant banks' dictate policy to their respective central banks. If you think the people controlling this shitshow will let their oxes get gored, you are smoking crack.
So where does that leave us? Tyler loves to point out the size of the derivative pile of the 5 gangsta banks in the US along with Deutsche Bank. It has not been lost on the crowd that 80% of this exposure is in interest rates. And this exposure is dynamic; it matures, expires, is rolled over, new contracts are created each day. And at the point of the scenario that Brandon describes for the takedown of the dollar, the net derivative position will be structured to insulate these 'merchant banks' from harm from such an event. These merchant banks don't object to the terror created among the sheep as long as their positions are covered to neutralize exposure.
Where the shitshow comes crashing down, is they won't all get the script correct. It only takes one big counterparty on the wrong side to throw the net derivative exposure theory out the window and lock up the whole market, and there will be another 'rogue' trader that nets an entire organization on the wrong side.
biggeast gov problem i see ; bad behavior is rewarded by crony thieves...
would you let your relatives go in your bedrrom and take your valuables?
society is being corzined daily, weekly, monthly> a gradual creep towards chaos...
I say bring it on because I would rather take the pain now insted of muddling on "a little" longer and consqeuently making the pain exponentially worse and longer lasting.
the -bring it on- is guessing that it is a financial goal.
There are billions of people everywhere that are the targets of other planners.
They are like smaug, but without the black arrow waiting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7TSP_FxCe3E
Preppers are just realistic.
No, not "stockholder" in the IMF. The US has been looted the most to fund the IMF annd its crooked antics. Looted.
For many, the 'bring it on' attitude is because we realized what the true situation was, and the full implications of the impending crash, many years ago and expected the collapse on a daily basis since 2008/2009. All the gimmicks used to delay the inevitable by the Fed and it's subsidiary, US.Gov, only served to compound the problems...like a dam given height by piling sand on top.
When it blows, the effects will be tremendously worse than they would have been in 2008.
'Bring it on' to end this financial theft, to end this farce of a government, and to end the Fed.
Besides, prolonging it at this point is just making it worse. The "bring it on" is similar to the cancer patient walking into to the doctor's office for his first round of chemo. The chemo tries to kill you, may even actually kill you, but the alternative is dead set certain.
Our current path as a nation (USA) is one that will lead to slavery and death if it isn't cured.
I believe the false bravado (don't truly appreciate what kind of hell they're asking for) crowd is a tiny minority of those who ask, typically secretly, for the collapse to hurry up and happen already.
I think it's mostly the result of a feeling of helplessness--not knowing how to fix things--because the vast majority of people are too stupid or clueless to see what is in front of their noses. So the underlying thought process, I suspect, is that people hope for a collapse to convince people that real change is necessary. In other words, it's believed to be the only way to move from this track, which is quickly descending into hell, and jump over to the track based on free markets and the type of freedom reigning in the U.S. until about 1913.
To put it another way, nobody is offering us a red pill. Feeling powerless to escape the matrix on our own, it seems natural to hope for the matrix to collapse.
I view every day without a collapse as an opportunity to enjoy a relatively beautiful day and to better weather the storm that is coming.
Where have you been, under a rock? Here in the USofA at least, the slavery began over 100 years ago, in 1913 to be exact. The best slave, is the slave that doesn't realize he/she is one.
I must admit -- this is a majority of my "bring it on" attitude.
Once I realized how truly screwed we were -- and it became crystal clear this system is 100% unsustainable without abject authoritarianism (possibly fascism) -- I check ZH multiple times a day. Not because I like reading about the coming financial end of the world -- but so I can prepare for it to save as many of my kind as possible. I would also prefer a collapse to outright authoritarianism. Its the reason I have relocated across the globe, its the reason I finally liquidated my 401k (3 weeks ago. HUGE lol there as my broker couldn't understand why I wanted to liquidate my equity positions when -- "but but but the market can go higher.") and moved out into the country.
Its why I have planned off highway route to my bug out location here in Germany, and why I moved a good chunk of my stash to Switzerland.
I say all this to say -- my "bring it on" attitude stems not from the "joy" that millions -possibly billions of people will lose essentially all that they have, but from 3 things predominately --
1) The financial collapse is a 100% certain thing. We are 1 Lehman-Brothers-Krakatoa event away from complete financial Armageddon. The quicker it comes -- the quicker I, as well as society has to rebuild before I retire.
2) To those that are prepared (and prepared appropriately -- none of this "I ordered 5 Kg of Silver with the AMX and had it delivered to the house" kind of nonsense -- that stuff will be "nationalized" in the quickness) -- this will be the largest wealth transfer of your life. Period. Full Stop. Will I be the next Bill Gates? No -- absolutely not. Will I be materially wealthier than I am now? Yes, definitely.
3) Before the internet gets turned off, I have a list of people on a list of forums I am going to PM and be like "HARDY HAR HAR FUCKING TOLD YOU! ENJOY POVERTY YOU KOOLAIDE DRINKING BASTARD! HAHAHAHAHAH PERHAPS I CAN BUY YOUR HOUSE/CAR/FAMILY HEIRLOOM IN REPO ON THE CHEAP!"
"I would also prefer a collapse to outright authoritarianism."
the problem with this "collapse" theory is that Hollywood and the media, fuelled by lots of religious beliefs in Armageddon-like scenarios, paint a "collapse" of Apocalyptic proportions as a matter of faith
the theory behind is that Americans are exceptional, while they go into frenzies when something about this "exceptional" is taken away... of course by evil foreign globalists
this awful propagandistic article is about the US Dollar and it's "dethroning" by them. Here the link to my rant about it
note the second comment by "fervent in spirit":
"What I am talking about is the cavalier attitude of bravado that seems to exist that is utterly clueless of what a chaotic hell this world would be when the system collapses and millions are starving to death and you're one of the number. This is not a popcorn at the movies scenario that so many like to use. It will be brutal beyond comprehension."
There you have it: faith, movies, hell on earth, brutal beyond comprehension, all written by "fervent in spirit"
interestingly, most of the religious denominations's faithful that believe fervently in "Armageddon, soon" are in the US
Buddhists, Hindus, Muslims, Atheists, even non-reformed Christian denominations like Orthodox and Catholic (in short, most of the world) don't have this faith in this kind of Apocalypse
when they have a currency crisis... well, they behave like Russians are currently behaving. you know, without hysterics
"I would also prefer a collapse to outright authoritarianism."
same stuff, both case someone want to be the governor...
Sure -- but in the chaos of a collapse I think we (as in the people) have a better shot at getting someone into power somewhere who isn't invested in the system. The current system -- without some cataclysmic and unplanned "BOOM" is destined to follow down the path the globalists have laid out.
We need something, somewhere, material to break unexpectedly.
We just need 1 "Western" nation to break free of this neo-liberal insanity -- for then there is a choice. Those of us who want to live in tyranny can stay, but those whos freedom is more important can move.
This is why B9K9 told you to be afraid of the strong hand. What you're proposing is incredibly dangerous. For better or worse, some portion of our present governing system represents the collective bargaining of us muppets over a fairly long timeline. I urge you extreme caution in wishing that collective bargaining thrown away in a shift to outright authoritarianism or dictatorship. While it is neat to think of the benevolent dictator as someone who can fix everything (so long as he parrots your own ideals), the reality is usually far more sinister.
I'll also posit that your expectation of being insulated from the carnage and emerging in a relatively better off financial position is purely delusional.
Could be, I admit, I could be delusional, and I might end up dirt poor.
That being said -- I have done everything in my power to hedge my bets, and prevent this from happening to me. Could it still? Absolutely. Things could get so out of control, we get a Stalin/Castro clone in the charge, etc., etc., but listen to my reasoning once again --
1) The current system is unsustainable. No amount of sticking your head in the sand or "wishing" things will just "keep going" will make it so. The collapse so many of us predict is coming. It will be horrible. But it will also be surviveable.
2) Did you know that more millionaires were made in the Great Depression than at any other time (as a % of the population) than at any other time in American history? Why? Not because they did things "better" than everyone else -- they did things differently. They planned ahead, and when it fell apart back then -- people did well -- better than they could have otherwise. Lots of their accumulated wealth came at the expense of thousands of other people who failed to plan. You need to find yourself a country that recognizes this difference and honors property rights.
3) The idea that the whole world will descend into anarchy is not what will happen. Its not what happened at the end of other empires. One empire fades away and another two or three take their places. Our current empire is no the USSA, but the banker oligarchs behind them. I look forward to their downfall.
to be honnest, and i have nothing against usa ppl, but.... if you compare the lifestyle, the mentality, the 2nd amandment, the relation americans have with guns, compaired to europeans ( in europ you not possess a gun, you buy it under sport licence and gov conditions, - if you do not renew the licence, dring dring allo, police come home take the weapon. possessing a gun must be seen as a locating.
not a single ppl in europ with legal possessing of a gun will make a revolution to change the system.
and those monkeys in blocks with stolen bulgarian ak47 cannot do anything, they already bypass totally the system, parallel ecoonomy, drugs etc... many layers on same land.
USA people is much more close to the breaking point of showing the world by the inside that " system is fucked, lets reset it " and take your psychopath politicians out with guns, as you all are already armed :)
if you know what i mean. not saying you must go shoot anyone at will, but, franckly, at this stage of virtualized finance, the reel world has, must ring the bells of the physical worlds and reaffirms the sens of what matters.
a world with nobody able but the 1% to buy what the market offer, cannot work, i'm still amazed how they can think by shrinking half world population in jobs over 50 years they will be able to produce for their own use.
Excellent read Ghordo. Well written and on point. I do assert your whole premise is flawed though.
Americans would like, just as much to see our own globalists fails and get hung from lampposts with nailgun wire as we would like our foreign ones.
I think what you failed to realize in the analysis is that many of us (bloody worthless exceptional Americans) lump most of our governing structures into the "globalist" nomenclature.
What I mean by that -- is the people who are at the top of the "American" banking/financial/political spectrum (who are we kidding -- they are just 1 huge Kracken-like entity) -- we don't look at them as "Americans" but as Globalists. A globalist is someone who -- wants to "unite" the world in a single government and financial entity. Everyone the world over reports to the same guy. It will be passed off as "preventing war" (they need a bloody horribly war to justify this but that is too far down the rabbit hole today) -- but in the end, if they accomplish their goals, there would be a one world government. A "GLOBAL" government. This idea -- is hugely dangerous.
Just a short example, what happens in a market place when there is a monopoly? The person in control starts shitting on everyone, because they can. During the Cold War, if we shat on a country too much -- they would just run to the USSR, or vice-versa. Now with no USSR -- we can shit on everyone (see the Middle East) without fear of retribution. If things really get bad though -- one has the ability to leave their country -- wherever it may be -- and move somewhere else and experience a different governing structure. Under a "globalist" framework -- it would be the same structure no matter where you go.
I think you have dramatically misunderstood "globalist" and why we (again, those pesky Amis) hate them so much. First, Globalists are the leaders of the world -- the go by many names, Bohemian Grove, Council of Foreign Relations, NATO, Bilderberg, etc., etc., these people are not there to support democracy of the people and of the nation state. Why? Simply, these people feed (derive their wealth and subsequent power -- or is it power and then subsequent wealth -- oh well -- nevermind) off their respective populations. They cannot have two powerful nations really compete against one another because, said nation's leaders -- there would be a winner and a looser. These "globalists" realize it is them (the globalists) bs everyone else. They can only win if we all loose.
Thus they have put many political sub-structures in place, the NDP and GOP in the good ol' USSA, NATO, the UN, and in Europe there is the EUR, and the EU, don't forget Japan. All these groups are linked together via international finance. The leaders of these groups -- they just switch places, and never really go away. They are here to stay, but their existence is dependent on keeping the sheeple distracted with Bundesliga, the NFL, the Kardashians, etc., etc., and the various nations 1) not really competing with one another -- or if they do compete with one another it is in a very controlled fashion where no matter who wins -- the both lose and their banker overlords get richer and 2) no one stopping them or offering a competing system. #2 is the reason why they are going after Russia with fervor. Its why the Chinese are helping out the Russians -- as they know they would be next.
This is why we look at "globalists" with suspicion. They want to give to themselves more power, more wealth at the expense of everyone else.
Haus, I presume you are commenting on my linked rant below in the same article
I think I understand the criticism against "the globalists". What I am complaining about is about this "globalists are international", which leads to "globalists = foreigners"
which then is fuelled also by "globalists = jews/Israeli/Zionists = two passport holders = foreigners", which then leads to "all foreign is the devil", which then includes NATO, the UN, etc.
this article is full of lies. that's beyond suspicion, that's hate speech against "foreigners taking away American prerogatives". I just try to identify the obvious lies
fact is that it's the US Congress that is blocking the IMF reforms. fact is that it's the US that controls the biggest packet of IMF shares, which leads to the power of veto in the IMF
fact is that out of the G20, 19 countries want this reform. further, China is already setting up their own, BRICS - "IMF"
this article blames "globalists" of plotting to take away the power of global reserve currency from the dollar as if US decisions had nothing to do with it, starting with US federal budget deficits
all this has nothing to do with this other bogus thing, i.e. "the globalists" "wants to "unite" the world in a single government and financial entity", which is regularly trotted out when the same propagandists start to moan about the UN or again against the IMF
as a foreigner, I look into this "anti-globalist" propaganda and regularly find lies, lies and more lies, and ask: "if your cause is worthy, why do you have to lie so much?"
meanwhile, I see the very word "globalist" as not even defined. a typical instrument of willful, planned propaganda. it is regularly used in order to make a populist message (i.e. simple, catching, glossing over unwanted wrinkles, details, aka lies) against the "usual suspects", i.e. the UN, the IMF, NATO, but also the EU, the EUR, etc. etc.
google in ZH's archives, search my nick + "globalist", and you'll find an extensive collection of lies and my rants about them
Yes, I was commenting on your rant, but this is higher up on the "Tree" and more people will see it.
Our best weapon we have against globalists is ideological consistency and facts.
I am not commenting on the article above. If you notice, all my comments within the thread have been responding to other comments. I, like you, was not horrilbly impressed with this article, as I got the feeling it was written for the low-information semi-paranoid lower-middle class American voter. Not people that spend most of their time on ZH.
That being said -- anyone who thinks that the Globalists are everyone else BUT the USSA are morons.
Haus, it goes further. This propaganda campaign with the "globalist" tell tale is carefully planned
you know I'm usually busy here trying to debunk "conspiracy theories". But propaganda campaigns are a completely different matter, they exist, and this article is part of one
and the ugliest part is that those who finance this "globalist" campaign are so full of it, from arrogance to hubris, that they don't even care that they have this "globalist" tell tale sign
please note my words, and I'm convinced you'll see the patterns
Absolutely propaganda campaigns exist. On both sides.
There are propaganda campaigns that deal in -- exclusivly propaganda -- for causes that are near and dear to your heart. What defines a "propaganda campaign" and "oppressed truth" are simply the amount and the times something is repeated, and who receives the message.
That being said, there are (FACT) groups of extremely wealthy people who are unelected who have more control of things due to their money that millions of people with nouthing. This is not correct, nor is it disputable. Moreover, there is a consolidation of power going on in the world. The problem is no one has voted for said consolidation of power. These are horrible things that, at least to my eyes, the "globalist" propaganda stream is trying to issultrate this.
I approve of the globalist propaganda stream, much more than I approve of the neo-liberal "progressive/lean forward" propaganda stream we have eminating from the West. If I could chose which group of people ran the world, it would be the anti-globalists (yes I see the irony in what I just wrote) than the status quo.
Haus, as long as you see the irony... but one question: are you sure it's not the US megabanks that drive the "anti-globalist" propaganda campaign?
note that they are strenuosly defending A) the current US Congress position, B) the US Treasury/FED veto on the IMF and C) the Dollar as Global Reserve Currency
they have lots of power/money in A), they have their people in B) and they profit before anybody else from C)
what you are looking at is propaganda for an entrenched position
I don't know what group of "Anti-globalists" you have been reading and getting info from. Sounds to me like you've gotten a nasty dose of American neo-conservatisim.
I associate myself with the group that wants to burn the world's entire financial system to the ground.
a) The congress' current position is suicidal. They just signed the American tax-payer up for quadrillions in derivative exposure. Next pop -- and thats it. Game over.
b) I would be completly happy if the IMF ceased operations tomorrow, and returned everyone's money. No vetos needed. (Seriouly -- the world worked great for thousands of years without an IMF. The IMF idea is based on the EU herp derp we have to do this to prevent war nonsense.
c) The dollar is one of the 3 sluts on the street corner -- USD, YEN and GBP. Then there is this disabled child trying to bite his ear the EUR.
interesting. thanks for your posts, Ghordius
piratepiet, you are welcome. note that I'm not defending this IMF reform
for all purposes, the IMF is the enforcer and the "good doctor" of a system of international lending to sovereigns that often rapes "lesser" sovereigns. or I should say that the international secondary sovereign debt markets often rape the sovereigns and the IMF comes, puts a band-aid, consoles the victim and makes sure the victim is ready for the next rape
but those issues are complex. and they existed in a relatively similar form at the times of Baron Rothschild, in form of gold backed debt enforced by the British Navy
and the sovereigns are often those who should be blamed. it's often their governments that put the ship of state into those messes, often aided by corruption or just bungling
I'm thinking about Argentina, or when Ireland bailed out Anglo-Irish, or the Squid-aided cooked books in Greece, with all the lies to the european partners
but the situation is serious. all members of this "hospital gang" or "sovereign healthcare system" that is the IMF are saying that the IMF has to be capitalized more
all bar one. The US, represented through the blocking of the US Congress
of course there is power-play in it. China does want to take that US veto right on the IMF away, and Russia, India, Brazil, SA and a few more applaud this move
and I'm no friend of an SDR-scheme. but that's a completely different matter, which has not a 19 of 20 "majority" in the IMF shareholder governing council
as a reminder, the "presidency" of the IMF is still... French
this is not a "default thing", it's still about geopolitics and the funny fact that France had and still has a geopolitical position that is "in the middle of the road" of those things
and when you have a "centrist, moderate" position... well, they you get attacks from all sides. it comes with the (geo-) political middle ground
IMF = "hangman"
The hangman puts the noose around the neck of [insert soverign country of choice here], on behalf & at the behest of THE SQUID, so as to forever capture and eventually enslave the citizenry up until [& well past] the point that they can figure out a way to steal the natural resources that exist within those boundaries. In simple terms, they HANG 'EM with unpayable debt. It's no different from any banker printing up a loan for a house out of thin air, then eventually foreclosing on & taking possession of the property. So, in addition to being labeled as 'hangman', 'REPO MAN' also fits. It's nice to have the franchise of being a money printer (especially when the public at large has no freakin idea as to what you really are & do). Henry Ford knew. Today's teenage dolt, not so much.
When you're talking about a small [for lack of a better word] 'backwater' country, the hangmans job is relatively easy. Think: Afghanistan poppy fields, or Libyan oil.
It's more complex to strip the carcass of United States down to useful spare parts because of the relative resource diversity, area of land mass, & even logistical military foothold.
Someday, the job will be accomplished [i.e. US will be chopped up & sold for parts], but that day will likely be hastened more from INSIDE maneuvers, than from the OUTSIDE. If there are 'seeming' delays in this process [vis-a-vis 'Congressional' stymies, as you say], more likely than not it's because those players themselves are stalling until they can maneuver a piece of the pie for themselves &/or are acting as shadow puppet figures for higher ups who have placed them in that position.
Somehow ~ this whole [now global] entrapment got started many centuries ago, when clever bankers were able to wiggle their way into 'financier' advisories to the lazy & idiot offspring of the crumbling Hapsburg dynasty kings & queens, [who'd ruled the greater portion of the roost for a half a milennium prior]. Add in the sweet mix of 'technology' & eventual global outreach & VOILA. The entire world is held captive by the whims of an extremely small conclave of, dare I say,, "FOLKS".
I say 'held captive' very loosely. Because, in fact, nobody is captive to anyone in this world if they don't choose to be. Most people will TRADE the comforts that that captivity offers, rather than fight it out on their own outside the Matrix.
nice
The fact that IMF considers weakening of US dominance and indirectly abandoning the dollar reserve position is a significant shift. The smartest indeed seem to start leaving the sinking boat as I wrote a few days ago, leaving the US politics to the second-class bureaucratic staff to complete the crash. France wouldn't have any say if such decision hadn't been prepared and agreed upon among the highest-level oligarchs before.
Optimistic thing about this is that IMF considers fluent transition away from bleeding currency to something more vital without turbulences. However, I doubt it will be SDR. SDR is just another fiat and in case of dollar crash the fiat paradigm will be discredited as a whole. Unless completely redefined (e.g. by involving gold) SDR would just be more of the same.
I have my doubts too about the SDR scheme. It would anyway need a wholehearted support by the US
dt
I agree to an extent but at least people are awakening slowly. I would believe a cavalier attitude is preferable to one of fear, or worse, denial.
i would love to move out to a cabin in the woods high altittude maybe northern nh or mn and would do so if i did not have a child. i have done almost everything u have done except move to germany. all the best to u my friend. cheers..
Thanks!
I think the first week post collapse -- things will continue on as normal. People will still have gas in their tanks, the electricity will still be on -- other than the financial panic and cleared out WalMarts all over the country -- I don't think much will change.
However -- as we approach the 5 day period or so, unless supply chains have been reestablished -- somehow -- things will start to get really bad. It'll start with the poorest of the poor in densly packed urban centers. They will all run out of food at the same time, and that is when things will get bad. It will start as begging, and then once its all picked apart, the violence, riots and outright theft will start. We would be smart to contain the urban centers from the rest of the country -- but I have the PC culture in the US will prevent that. PPeople will spread out into the burbs -- and this point, you can either stay, or run. I expect many people will hunker down at home with their weapons and hope no one comes to the door. The problem is the urban populations have lots of weapons too -- and you can't eat lead.
Once violence really gets going -- it will be impossible to contain without martial law. It will be impossible to reestablish supply chains in chaos, and making everything stop will be necessary.
I just hope I have the forsight to know when its time for me to "bug out." I can survive 4-6 months pretty easily. Thereafter things would get really tough.
It is kinda funny how some of you are going on about this and your 'prep' to survive it.
"I have a bug out location filled with gold!" - yeah you may have a trailer buried somewhere with canned food and gold coins but just how are you going to get there and back? If this hits do you really think you're going to be able to just jump in your 1973 camper and drive down the road? You don't think all travel will be monitored? How are you going to get past the checkpoints on the highways? If a cow in a slaughterhouse pen suddenly becomes self aware and decides to run do you think the guy at the gate is just going to tip his hat to the cow and say have a nice day?
You must think that there will be little markets set up in the countryside that you can hike to with a gold coin or two and grab yourself some raman noodles off a shelf. Of course the tyrants will ignore these black markets and the gold in your pocket. Do you really think little Switzerland will protect you and your ilk when this hits?
I'm pretty sure that when this starts all travel will be banned or monitored. If you're not already hiding in a pine tree in far north Canada when it happens you're gonna be stuck sitting in your chair at home. That gold that you have buried in the ground will remain buried in the ground. You will be standing in line along with everyone else getting your daily rations.
Sadly the vast majority of people will welcome this from the very beginning. Salaries will be frozen and it will become illegal for companies to fire/layoff employees. Property owners will be barred from evicting people for not paying rent. Large trucks will pull into neighborhoods and hand out 'free' food to the needy. Your neighbors and family will be encouraged to report anyone with gold/silver and those who frequent black markets. House to house searches for weapons will be the norm.
But hey I'm sure you guys are well prepared and your 1973 Volkswagen bus is full of gas and food. Your pockets are jingling with silver coins and you fully expect to just drive off down the road with a smirk on your faces.
The only people who are really prepared for this are the ones who already live someplace that doesn't have internet access. And they sure aren't on Zero Hedge bragging about their hidden gold.
>>>your ilk<<<
awe. You mad I'm not gonna share?
You don't think I've thought about this? I'm sorry, you don't make plans like this without thinking first "how to get there." Don't fool yourself.
What I'd like to explore is "your ilk" comment. What makes me -- looking out for myself and family "ilk?" Is it because it doesn't work out with your social "everyone shares everything" nonsense?
Also, while the sheeple in the USSA have no problem bending over and taking extreme social controls -- the Germans have experienced this -- twice in the past 100 years, and just don't put up with it.
Take your 4 weeks and shove it straight up your ass.
Aww man how are you gonna get along with the rest of the survivors if you take offense to the words they choose to use? But hey it's gonna be OK brah. I do agree that the best choice you have made so far is to come onto ZH and brag about your plans to 'bug out' and describe in detail what plans you have made.
The gooberment will NEVER figure out who you are or where you're headed. lol
You missed the question. Its ok. The English language can be difficult.
From which city am I coming from? To where am I going? When would I be leaving? What plans do I have to get there? *DESCRIBE* the details I've given out, which could be identifying.
The next question -- is spending the time and resources to figure out, who exactly I am, be worth it for them? Sure -- I am on here, but I've been on here for years, and no one really knows anything about me here, save for the nation in which I live.
The fact of the matter is I am prepaired for a whole wide range of things that could happen. Am I prepaired for everything? Nope. No one is. But I am doing much better than the overwhelming majority of the population.
The government is much more likely to just flat out confiscate your bank account than spend the time going after me. Easier for them, you'll bend over and take it, I'll put up a fight (because my stuff is physical, yours is 1s and 0s). If you are the government -- and you need funding, ASAP -- who are you going to go after -- the low hanging fruit first or last?
Ok I agree. You're right. You're using the internet so the government won't be able to find you.
Government lackey 1 - "Hey this Game of Thrones fanboy seems to have some guns and gold hidden and just might cause some trouble."
Government lackey 2 - " But but he used the internet to hide his identity. We could never find him!"
Government lackey 1 - " Dang it!"
Just a bit of advise brother. Being smart does not mean you are wise.
I would imagine googling my "Haus-Targaryen" username would result in a ton more info they have to sort through --
https://www.google.de/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=zuGSVJ2aGMuK8Qes0IGYBA#q=Haus-Targaryen
Compared to your unique username;
https://www.google.de/?gfe_rd=cr&ei=zuGSVJ2aGMuK8Qes0IGYBA#q=ufos8mycow
Moreover -- right now I am behind a VPN. You likely are not.
Lastly, in case of a crisis -- the government will be looking to fill its coffers as quickly as possible. Spending 2 dudes time tracking down random people on the internet with PMs isn't nearly as efficient as having said two guys at check points confiscating any cash amounts more than $100.
Efficiency vs necessity. At a point -- the government would likely start spending time on the net tracking individuals down -- but if this ever happened in Germany -- if it got to hat point -- and everyone's bank accounts were drawn down to zero, and the world had come to an end -- I would be long gone by then.
You must think preparedness is like a boyscouts weekend off in the wilderness. Its about looking at the facts and thinking logically. Both of which appear hard for you.
can't fault your reasoning. damn, I have to find time to read those "Game of Thrones" novels
That is correct. It appears that Chris here (ufos8mycows) is a fan as well.
Whats your favorite House Mr. Kohler?
Oh noes! You googled my nickname! I must be the only person in the world using it!!! lol
Anyways. You seem to be destined to hide in a cave and count your coins when things get bad. I can't see how you're any better than the ones bringing the pain really. You seem to be focused on personal attacks on me though. From what I've read you want to hide when things get tough so you can climb out of your cave when it's over and become one of the new overlords. While the rest of us will be fighting them from day one. Street by street.
It's ok though. When it is all over and done with we won't forget you or your ilk. We'll remember that you did NOTHING to defend this country while hiding in your cave counting your gold.
Cowards hide. Patriots fight.
The object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other bastard die for his.
I'll pop up, buy a few properties in AG/AU - RE swaps, and as the new system begins to set itself up, rent them out, and multiply.
Just like in Vegas in 2010 where people were buying homes in foreclosures 6 months after the Fed stepped in to put a housing floor in place -- people were purchasing home for $0.30 on the dollar, if they could pay in cash. The same thing will happen again -- but there will be no Fed stepping in and instituting a price floor. It will be world-wide and the people with the liquidity will be the people who come out on the other side considerably better than the rest of the population.
You have fun fighting them with their drones, nuclear weapons, tanks and other assorted weapons systems you cannot even dream about -- I'll be at home, playing my role as the poor dumb schmuck that had no idea what is going on -- when times are tough, I'll follow the rules, and try to blend in as best as possible. When the market opens up again, I'll play my hand, and go from there.
You'll either be on some "most wanted list" or dead. Have fun with that.
EDIT - My cave has enough prestacked and dried fire wood, I live within walking distance of at least one freshwater estuary, I have a boat and the population density is low enough that getting overrun isn't worrying me in the least. I have solar power, as well as backups in storage. Shoot, I even installed a sauna there this past October.
So what you're saying is you will step over the dead bodies of the people who actually fought to end the tyranny so you can bring your own type of tyranny?
You do know that the only way for your plan to work is for someone to defeat the people who put us in chains right? Do you really think that after millions of people die for your freedom that the survivors will allow you to grab the spoils after you hid like a coward?
Truth is you run from adversity. You're a scavenger who will crawl out of your hole to pick at the bodies of true patriots.
Why should I fight and possibly die when other people will do it for me?
EDIT - If you are expecting some "civil war" in Germany -- I think you will be sadly mistaken. Germany has had 5 currencies and 4 total wipeouts in the past 100 years.
This group of people will go "oh shit, that sucks" bitch about it for a few weeks, write a few strongly written letters and get back to work. The USSA has never experienced this, and will descend into a state of total chaos and anarchy followed by despotism.
I think you are underestimating my brothers and sisters in Germany.
But I do wish you my best when it all falls down. I hope you find the courage to fight alongside me when we need you the most. I hope your German wife keeps you warm in your cave and your gold coins fill your belly when you get hungry for freedom.
Picture a really big Switzerland.
If I have to -- I'll fight. But it pays to use your brain before your weapon. Braun alone cannot win a fight -- pick your battles and know your enemy better than he knows himself.
"hungry for freedom"? what freedom are you exactly talking about? he is in Germany
for all their faults, in times of war and catastrophes Germans become very, very supportive of each other
the object of war? one word: profit. "WOAR FOR MOAR". no "moar", no "woar". wars are expensive. nobody makes war without having a sucker that will have to pay the bill
Normally the loser.
I guess its a good idea only to go to wars with countries that can pay it back, or resources that can be plundered.
Oh HAI THAIR MR. Putin.
*makes = "goes to" in your above post.
"hide in a cave and count your coins when things get bad"
from what I read from "Haus", he has catched an East-German girlfriend. bloody good assets in bad situations, those gals. though like nails, very resourceful. worth way more then their own weight in gold
as soon as he realizes this, he will have become an... European
I'll be popping the question within the year -- and yes -- she is definitely worth he weight in Gold.
Shoot -- she is even getting me to sort the trash now.
FACEPALM
remember that getting along with those gals is like driving a Tiger panzer, or facing dobermans. see her as your own "Deutschland" division
you are in charge. you are the boss. that just happen to like her very much. don't ask "the question". tell her. "Ich will dass Du mich heiratest"
even if you change your mind about things, pass from a forceful opinion to a new forceful opinion. in doubt, "manly without doubts"
I learned all this while boxing a few of them through The Berlin Wall. It was a bit like "why do you flee a dictatorship if you crave for dictatorship?"
later, I learned that this applies for all women. it's just more evident for them, because - bless them - they have less negative cultural baggage then others
Yeup - manchmal ist sie etwas schwierig sein, aber sie lohnt es sich.
East-German GF? All I can picture is an 180 pound olympic swimmer with zits that has to shave the beard off her face.
You would definitely be mistaken with that one my friend.
oh, you have no idea what you are talking about, FredFlintstone. I've seen women there that make every Y-Chromosome in your body stand up in attention and shout "Charge!"
what you are talking about is that tiny class of... near-men that were probably full of drugs and testosterone so that Socialism would win Olympia medals
To those that are prepared (and prepared appropriately...
There, now that's the 64K question.
How so. Please give examples.
fervent in spirit, your nick is spot-on, is it? Please don't give yourself a stroke. We're not talking collapse or apocalypse here, just the mere loss of reserve currency status for the dollar.
Which would only mean America would at last have to actually produce in order to gain - pretty much like every other country in the world - instead of printing its way to prosperity on everybody else's back. If every country can do it, I'm confident America is no less capable.
But I suspect your mind functions on American exceptionalism: if you can't be first, it's the end of the world, there's a gigantic collapse ahead, kaboom, and "millions will starve"(?). Well, let me tell you that's the reaction of a spoiled brat, and it ain't pretty.
Once you've accepted that it is going to happen, the waiting is almost worse. And...the sooner the scabs are yanked off, the less collateral damage they inflict (maybe). Lets deal with this while we still have people around who know how to actually DO things, and FIX things, and GROW things.
Since my kids know where the boat went down, I think they'll be just fine.
If you've ever wanted to know if you can stand on your own and make it, you might look forward to the time when the system crumbles and unstoppable manipulation ends.
Be a man or go to daddy for protection.
I don't need universal chaos and economic disaster to prove myself to "be a man". If you do, then I feel sorry for you that you're not one now.
It's not the circumstances surrounding oneself that makes him a man, it's the character within - whether in good times or bad.
The problem to me is that you are admitting that you need a government created government run society to survive .
I say that a government system is wholly destructive to survival.
Socialism fails in comparison to fascism and fascism fails in comparison to freedom.
I am not admitting that at all. The problem is not government per se. It is government that moves outside its proper sphere. No society can run without some form of government, however loosely it may be put together. Try running a family with NO government. It is a disaster.
The problem is when the family 'government' becomes onerous and individuals operate outside their spheres of authority (abusive fathers / husbands for example).
Good government is not destructive to survival. Freedom is not the absence of all rules. It is found in reasonable rules for the protection of life and liberty that are followed.
Here's an example: My freedom to drive a car would not exist if there were not 'rules of the road' that not only I obeyed, but others as well. The moment you think you are 'free to drive on any side of the road you choose, in any direction you choose' is not freedom. Not for you and certainly not for me. We both drive with an expectancy of enjoyment and safety because there are rules and we expect them to be obeyed and enforced.
Can this system be abused? Absoutely and we all know it is done so every day. But the problem is not with having rules for the road and having them 'governed'. It is a problem with improper governing that makes them bad.
Agreed and excellent post, fis, very clearly formulated too. Government is never nor can it ever be a simple ON/OFF-proposition. Oversimplifying does not add to the quality of the debate in this particular case.
Your right. Thinking does. It seems to be quite absent on zerohedge for quite some time now.
There are plenty of examples of actual thought here, clear arguments, and should i say it... nah... well maaaaaybe, ok... ...logic.
These people who post using logic usually get ridiculed.
Which brings me to the only reason that government should exist, and I think a pretty persuasive argument. Government is for the stupid. (I would also say government is for the coward.)
There are plenty of those around these days. Pointing fingers at anyone but themselves, and above all else never never thinking:
http://www.quickmeme.com/img/7e/7e75bf7fac3b7061ec61d04bff4121f4aa17ed16...
Government is not necessary because man is stupid. Government is necessary because man is inherently ... dare I use the word ... sinful? Government should be a restraint from that which would be harmful. It was not created to harm, but protect. That is what the word means.
Think of the idea of a governor on an engine. It governs it from revving too fast. It is for the engine's protection so it doesn't self-destruct. It is a good thing. Removing it leaves that engine open to destruction whether self-destruction or destruction from outside of itself.
I detest bad government and desire to see justice come to those who abuse power and use their positions for selfish gains at the expense of others.
But life as we know it could not exist were it not for government. Even our conscience is a form of government - it puts a restraint on our actions and points out when we have abused our position or acted wrongly.
I am against bad government, onerous government, immoral government, abusive government, etc. But that does not mean I am against government itself.
In my view society needs some authority which impose the decisions of the people/community/society and that needs some kind of structure and thus apparatus. And if the society/community is stupid and suicidal (intentionally dumbed down), well we see what is happening.
The question is what will stop the suicidal run?
BTW I downvoted you.
Silly examples.
Cerebral control as an example is okay but the cerebral control of those in government is occasionally totally absent or most often, vastly inferior to people in general.
Apply that concept to the analogy of the engine and its governor. The engine lacks control while the governor provides it. In reality, government lacks control, whether cerebral or physical, while the public is the only possible control. Government isn't a bright light to psychopathic moths for without a reason.
As for roads, privatize them. The road companies will provide rules, as would any business wishing to please its customers.
"I am against bad government, onerous government, immoral government, abusive government, etc. But that does not mean I am against government itself."
The very basis of government is theft so by your own words you are against all government.
Which brings me to the only reason that government should exist, and I think a pretty persuasive argument. Government is for the stupid. (I would also say government is for the coward.)
No. Not remotely. This is the contemptuous viewpoint that leads to a nanny state and an out of control government.
The answer to your question is simple and has already been answered, ad naseum... government's most basic function is simply to protect the minority and those without viable societal power. From a market perspective, this would mean actually attempting to enforce competition upon entrenched power. Government should not do that for you that you would not do for yourself, but government can get a boot off your throat so that you can help yourself.
Fortunately or unfortunately, governmental mission creep can never be curtailed over a long enough timeline because curtailing it requires more diligence, critical thinking, and objectivity than we can procure... our natural state is apathy and we demand peace and quiet, especially after the dust settles from a large social strife... hence our perversion for booms and busts... we can only be bothered to try to correct things when we believe the last glimmer of hope is all that remains.
Government can never be off for very long. It always comes back. It's human nature. 100% unavoidable.
It's man's nature and a development of the animal world.
Even though government is wholly destructive, its very existence ensures it will be a long time before it is bred out of mankind.
Abscence of government does not mean there are no rules. Government OTOH is not rules for those in power.
Perhaps you are conflating The Law, with The Rule of law. The Law protects the Lawbreakers from the Law Abiding. This, and nothing more, is the function, and purpose of coercive government.
By your own admission you are speaking of abusive, self-serving government. Specifically 'coercive government'.
If you have rules, then you must have government, because to be governed - by definition - means to have rules. The very word comes from a Latin word meaning "to steer". Governing is the concept of 'steering' or 'directing' something, or to be more specific in this instance, someone.
The issue is not a simplistic one of government or no government, but good and bad government, and what constitutes such. It cannot be a person's personal feelings, it must be something external to us.
When you say "the Law protects the Lawbreakers from the Law Abiding", that is an opinion, not a universal fact. It is a fact only where either the Laws are bad (immoral) or the Lawmakers are usurping an authority that is not morally theirs.
If you want to go back in history a few thousand years, there were the Israelites wandering in the wilderness, and they asked for law. So Moses went up on the mountain and came back down with the law (10 commandments). This was OK for several years, but then the people asked for for more. So Judges were established for them. (see book of Judges). After a period of this, the people, who had watched other cultures were envious, and said 'let us have a king to rule us'. And so it has been henceforth. Just couldn’t live with good enough.
That is probably the best Biblical lesson I've ever heard. It was so good, I had to log in and comment. Very succinct, and another one of the faults of man captured in the best-selling book on this planet.
Personally, I'm ready for the WOAR to happen for several reasons.
ONE: We will never revert to the stone ages. There will be no second coming of the Roman Legion, no revival of the Vandals and Visigoths, and certainly no return to the Cavemen. The crossbow and pneumatic potato cannons (mortars) are here to stay, making large standing armies of melee infantry ultimately pointless. Even if gunpowder were to go away completely, "pike and shot" formations would still exist (although the tactics of squares would be abandoned immediately after they get revived).
TWO: My standard of living would be incredibly high. With all the land being depopulated of useless eaters/morons, and with myself being well-prepared in advance, I would never live in want. The American Indian lived in this country for thousands of years without ever considering to build stationary farms and settlements. There's a reason for that: this country is a land of plenty, as long as you know where to look, and you know which plants are good to eat. Hunting with a crossbow is essentially free, since you can make bowstrings from the sinew of deer and other large game, and a simple foot lathe and some wood will create arrows (or you could try making a stone bow instead, and use stones/ball bearings).
THREE: I could do whatever I want, regardless of laws. I can build my own house, without any "building codes". I can create my own industries, without a "permit". I could make my own alcohol for anti-septics, drinking, engines, and flamethrowers, and there would be no ruler to tell me I couldn't.
FOUR: I would be free to retire whenever I accumulated enough, without anyone taking a cut of my work in advance. No social security cut, no cuts for insurance, no taxes, no scams labeled as "investments"...I would have what I worked for, when I worked for it, and that would be enough.
Do those sound like good reasons for WOAR? Does anyone else see what I see? Opportunity?
Before one gives Bible lessons, one should read it at least, and preferably study it. The nation of Israel didn't ask for the Law. It was given to them. According to the Bible God wrote it, then gave it to Moses to deliver to the nation.
And when Jesus was later questioned about the laws He said there are really two. Love the Lord with all your soul, heart, mind and strength AND love your neighbor as yourself.
It was an answer to a lawyer who was trying to trip Him up in His own words. (Lawyers were the same back then)
Specifically what Jesus said was this: (Matthew 22:37-40)
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
This is the first and great commandment.
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
In other words, the 10 commandments were simply a codified expansion of these 2 commands. Or putting it the other way around, the 2 commandments were an condensation of the 10 commandments. There were 2 tables of the Law. One dealt with man's relationship to God. The other with man's relationship to man.
Philosophically and theologically it is called the Moral Law (as opposed to the various ceremonial and civil laws of their society). Any law that goes against that becomes immoral.
ask belgium 400 days no gov... system kept working.
gov is BS fucktards worms in you wallet
Government is enforcement of rules, imposing penalties for breaking rules. Without that, there are effectively no rules. If nothing happens to me when I break a rule, there is no rule. So, absence of government does mean, exactly, there are no rules.
Bullshit
Come over to my place and light up a cigarette and you will find a rule. And signs from my youth: Private Property. Trespassers Will Be Shot.
Private property and voluntary interaction would create only rules necessary for people, not rules necessary for government.
Very bad examples.
Family - lets see. I know in my family is based on respect and negotiation. No government there. No rule of force there. A happy and productive family is where EVERYONE wins. I hope you are an adult, obviously not a business person. (Business is the same way. At least if your not a con.)
Car example - You make a partial argument again. So then according to your theory we function better with government what exactly?. Well sorry guy, again clearly lack of knowledge. You didn't need a license pre what year again? When was there the national highway authority again, the year?.. check you facts mac, you like straw-men... a lot... like a whole bunch... like you actually maybe made of straw or move it out of the way to get to your keypad. (Your examples of driving the the wrong side of the road are completely ridiculous. People DO NOT try to kill themselves, they tend again maybe something you don't know, try to get along. Again a WIN-WIN. Look at videos of driving in India if you don't believe me. Check them rules out.)
I get it. You NEED government. You cannot think on your own, and you believe rule by force is required. Well, just a heads up: Some of us don't need that. This question is what ALL of our problems boil down to today and perhaps always have. So you may want to actually examine your thoughts on this one a little more intently before spouting. It is the largest question of our day.
If you hand over FORCE to an entity over YOUR SOVEREIGNTY it WILL BE ABUSED. ALWAYS. I hope you got that. I capped it for you an all. This is why LIBERTY is to the individual and cannot be GIVEN.
Oh dear. Where to begin? I'll leave it to others to read what you've written to see the illogic of it all. Just one point (of many I could make, such as your attempt to refute my driving example; a non-starter, if you'll pardon the pun).
You have NO rules for your family? Of course you do. They are, in your own words, based on respect and negotiation. And there is government. Can your kids spit on their mother at the dinner table? And if they do, do you just sit and "negotiate" with them? They obviously don't respect her if they do. And if there is no apology, then ... nothing?
Your comment is so classically ill thought out, I think I'll use it as a text case in a class.
There is a difference between rules and government. following rules, in a sense, are voluntary. There are consequences, but those consequences are social in character- shunning of various degrees depending on scale and repetition. Government implies a system of laws enforced through coercion, regardless of your acceptannce or approval.
Secondly, all governments are models of slavery. You are free here to provide a single example of one which is not. Now, a person may prefer slavery (depending on the circumstances and severity), but others may not. The problem is, the population at large is not given an opportunity to choose between liberty and slavery.
In a fractional reserve banking system, it is even more odious. If, for example, you are "gifted" with the opportunity of representation to legitimate the taxation of your labor (we won't consider political manipulation), how do you justify the theft of future generations labor for debt they are not responsible for creating?
Next, you write as if rules and laws are always useful and superior to a lack thereof. You can now defend the NDAA, The CRomnibu and the Patriot act. Perhaps I have chosen selectively. How about the the creation of ex post facto constitutional powers through a single branch of the goverment? The ESF? Judicial review? Executive actions? The Commerce clause? The evisceration of the Fourth amendment? The Tenth amendment? Or should we just consider spectacular feats of tyranny? Shays rebellion? Lincoln's suspension of Habeus Corpus, Lincoln's war against the States, FDR's confiscation of gold or the bankcruptcy of the USA. Undeclared warfare? The use of law and regulation to protect corporations and cartels? Shall I go on?
Worse, you act as if civilized society can not exist outside of government. While it is difficult, in a world built on tyranny, to find examples, it does not mean it is neither desirable nor attainable. People are infinitely creative and have tremendous ingenuity, especially when motivated by the potential for better lifes ( here, of course, opinion becomes important). For all our technology, are we better off?
When you define arguments in polar opposites, you do more to obfucate than literate. The world is one of many different choices (grey if you will) which humans are quite capable of weighing and making choices. While removing the opportunity (government) may make these skills rusty, a little lubricaton via liberty and personal responsibility would vastly improve their ability.
There are no perfect arrangements in an imperfect world. Still, when given the choice of the darkness of slavery versus the chaos of liberty, I find myself willing to take a chance on intelligent human action over the draonian edicts of proven criminals.
Did you read my posts before you wrote "you write as if rules and laws are always useful and superior to a lack thereof." ?
I specifically stated that many laws were anything but useful and superior to a lack thereof. I don't mind defending, explaining even reconsidering under the weight of a good counter argument what I wrote. But it is impossible to do so when you say make me the author of something that I didn't.
By defending government, you defend rules and laws as superior to a lack thereof. You cannot have government without rules and laws. The fact you refuse to debate my argument demonstrates the poverty of yours. You cannot attempt to choose one law, here or there, as bad while still supporting government and hide behind it like some badge of reasonableness.
I'm married, great partner, three kids between 13 and 18, all three pretty awesome too (no major problems up til now, I'm counting my lucky stars). Are you seriously telling me that these five people living together for at least a span of 20 years would be able to do so without any mutual guidance or strict rules? If my partner and me had decided from the start to negotiate our way through family life, I can tell right now it would have been absolute pandemonium from the onset. I particularly shudder to think what my 16 year old son would have turned out to be by now.
Course you need government, as much as you need a decent rule of law and the tools to keep both of those in check. You don't need them to do the thinking for you, but to structure a number of things in our complex societies. I'm living in a very small country of 11 million souls. Good luck trying to run things here without any form of government. Where I do agree, is that you need to keep a close eye on the size of your government and how it works. A VERY close eye.
People tend to try to get along? How's the weather on your planet? Here's what people do. If they see someone with stuff that can be acquired, they will do so at minimal cost, zero if possible. There are many people out there who would take all your stuff, if they could. Absence of government is license for those stronger than you to take all your stuff and kill you. Simple as that. Great for the strong, who become sovereign (see feudalism). Not so great for the rest of us.
What you are saying is that the threat of government retribution keeps criminals from theft. It doesn't, actually, or we would have no theft in society. Instead, we have thieves, and others (bankers) who steal, thinking that somehow they can get away with it. Government agents (police) do sometimes catch them and put them in jail; sometimes they aren't caught, quickly or even ever.
So let's have anarchy, no police. You come to my house to steal; if you kill me, you win (for now). If I kill you, your stealing days are over NOW; no trial, no lawyers and their arguments / delays, you go in the ground today. If I die, my neighbors notice. It won't do me any good, but they are likely to band together, hunt you down and kill you when you sleep. (Think, a posse in the American Old West). Again, no trial, no lawyers, you go in the ground that day they catch you. Over a rather short time, it becomes known that theft is a really bad idea unless you absolutely have nothing left to lose, because you are really likely to lose it all.
Over time, groups band together for MUTUAL protection, tribalism of sorts, small towns in the Old West; we figure out how to make it work. Technical knowledge is sufficiently widespread that working water supplies, working sewers, and so forth are fairly well understood and widespread. If you really are being taken advantage of, you can leave for another group that suits you better.
The problems I see now are:
(1) The governments are corrupt / captured by the corrupt; Joe Blow goes to jail for stealing oranges, Jamie Dimon stays out of jail after stealing millions.
(2) The systems are failing to self-regulate (FED, Trasury, Congress) and blowing up (inflation / deflation, excessive taxation, excessive spending).
(3) The people are failing to self-regulate (drugs, casual sex without thought of consequences, excessive debt).
My father once told me "Jail is for those without sufficient self-discipline". If you don't steal, lie or destroy, jail is unnecessary (although political prisoners do exist). Because our individual Congressmen lack sufficient self-discipline and spend excessively, we all suffer; because our President has apparently never understood the value of self-discipline, the rule of law is degraded at this time. Because the people operating them lack self-discipline, the systems cannot regulate themselves. But rampant hedonism leads to disease, organ weaknesses and internal breakdown; even the strong fail with enough drink, drugs and dissipation. It just won't be fun until self-discipline is re-established; Robert Heinlein said "An armed society is a polite society", but there were plenty of gallows and executions for those who failed at self-discipline.
Dammit, I can USUALLY spell "Treasury" correctly!
Governments always move outside their "proper sphere". Until people wake up to the fact that governments aren't necessary, we'll never achieve true liberty.
To counter your driving example, I present the ice-rink example. There aren't any signs or rules at an ice rink, and yet people navigate the chaos quite well. Also, it seems like you're ignoring the fact that people break the rules of the road all the time, almost constantly really, and it still works.
There are rules in an ice rink. Just because they are not posted, they are still there all the same. Total lack of rules would allow big skaters to run over little kids, people to skate in groups and harm individuals or smaller groups, etc. The rules are those generally accepted by society and applied in the skating rink. But it is folly to think there are no rules when you go to the rink.
About rules of the road... Of course people break them, but I disagree with "all the time". If that was the case, at least 50% would be driving in wrong lanes, on sidewalks, at any speed, disregarding traffic lights, stop/yield/ merge signs etc. If even 5% of drivers drove in that manner, there would be a total breakdown of personal liberties of others to drive.
The fact that "it still works" is precisely because there are rules and we hope that they will be maintained. I was at a traffic accident recently. There was absolute chaos on the road while drivers all decided that their needs were more important than anyone else's with the crash scene blocking much of the road. Traffic was at a standstill because everyone wanted to get where they were going and people had to make decisions as to how to proceed. Nothing worked until a motorist got out, and directed traffic. People followed this person's direction and things flowed until the emergency crews were there. But it was "rules" that were for the good of those injured and the prevention of others getting injured that brought about the process so everyone could exercise their liberty to travel to their destination.
The problem many have on this subject is that they don't differentiate between being a libertarian or an anarchist.
You seem to be unfamiliar with the term "cooperation", so unfamiliar you fail to see it in your own example. The person who got out to direct traffic was NOT a government employee- yet people followed his lead for everyone's benefit. However, when people are so accustomed to waiting for the government, chaos ensues until they show up- yourself included.
A great example is the parody film on Kim Jong Un. Theatre owners, worried about lawsuits in the case of a provocation, refuse to show it. The law places the theatre owners at fault, though any action would not be theirs. Even though the government failed to keep society safe (one of those so-called benefits?). So, now all contrary opinions can be held hostage to a group of hackers? Hackers probably in the employ of a government?
Do you enjoy having that "log in your eye"?
fervent, quite correct in that a collapse will be catastrophic for most...I remember my mother's tales of the Great Depression with her Dad bringing home strangers who hadn't eaten in a bit for dinner, a wash up and a bed for the night. That was in the days of social conscience so I hate to think what would happen now a days?
i dont think anyone can really imagine the chaos that will follow the collapse. it will indeed be terrible. however i think when people say "bring it on" it is because we have accepted the collapse as inevitable. the fact of that matter is that right now we live under a tyrannical system in which we are debt slaves. i call for the collapse to end the oppression of the globalists. i recognize that the period following the collapse will be tremendously difficult. but i hope that we will be able to build a new, better world after we get through that trying time. as terrified as i am about what happens next, i am optimistic about the future. to get that to future, we must first go through the collapse.
Hate to trod on your optimism but the collapse won't end the oppression of the globalists. The collapse is planned by the globalists. It has been implemented by the globalists. You see, once democratic governments collapse worldwide, the globalists then have a platform to say "See, freedom doesn't work, democracy doesn't work, follow us and we will make everything better. We can bring order to this world of chaos". And then we will be faced with a choice, 1) follow them into a world of despotism or 2) die at their hands.
You think this is oppression? You haven't seen anything yet.
Ordo ab Chao
Whether ones believes the coming events to be planned or happenstance, Joker's scenario is the most likely of outcomes. Given the choice of submitting or watching one's children be murdered, raped, starved or all of the above, most will choose submission Even then, the outcome for many will be the same.
And most should realize that all of our preparations for this eventuality will most likely not save us or those around us. This won't just happen to 'other people' - we are ALL 'other people', and it CAN and WILL happen to us, individually and collectively.
Which is why it is important to understand a collapse is neither destined nor neccesary. The People can stage an orderly withdrawl from the system by turning their backs on government, the FED and the military. All a society requires is cooperation, trade via exchange and community security through united efforts for individual actions.
Governments require acceptance from the general population. As soon as we opt out, they are left with no one to govern and no one to enslave.
fervent,
I agree with your assessment of the "bring it on" nonsense.
It is just as sensible as the nutters in Ferguson chanting "burn this bitch down."
Perhaps you were not paying attention last week but Congress and your president cold you out to illegal aliens. The Democrats and the Republicans. It was a non-Constitutional acts as well.
You now have FEWER rights than illegal aliens. Idiots still think voting matters.
That is not an argument for no government. That is an argument for good government. Good government would protect its citizens and their personal liberties, not destory them.
Yes, but we all know that things start off well-intentioned and eventually spiral out of control. Many times this is due to subversion. It may take the form of excessive money printing, promises of jobs and benefits, forced migration etc.
This is why the only answer is to have limited government. You address the problem at the root. Keep it small, effective, with a clear mission and avoid the possibility of blurring the lines.
Which government has ever done this thing you say a good government would? Pray tell?
fervent in spirit I am totally mystified why so many on this site are constantly calling to "bring it on".
----
It's called the torched earth strategy. If I can't have it, then neither will you. Burn it all down.
I for one know it is inevitable and don't look forward to it. Because I realise, as history shows, it is us serfs that pay the real price, not the top 1%.
I would prefer real reform and solutions instead of a reset that starts all this crap over again.
I say bring it on, the sooner the better. The sooner it starts the sooner it ends and we can begin the next phase. I am confidnent of my ability to support my family and for whatever reason I have envisioned this for many many years, even as a young child. Though back then I never understood what it would be that caused the calamity. TO this day, it is not likely anyone understands or is able to predict what the final trigger may be, but at least lease many will have an idea of what it will include.
Really good posts, fervent in spirit. Belated welcome to zh.
I have an extremely clear view of the totality of the chaos. That is why I have been stocking up on food and water and gold and solar panels...
We say bring it on because the longer we have to wait for the collapse, the worse it will be.
The problem is that all you have prepared can be taken away in one brief moment.
This has happened before still within our memory.
Think of the division of Poland / Lithuania between Germany and the USSR in 1939. The end result in Lithuania was the deportation of 20 to 30K people from the city of Vilnius alone to Siberia. My wife's grandfather owned an estate in the countryside, they were self sufficent for the most part, growing their own food etc. Her grandfather, considered part of the intelligencia, was executed on the spot by the NKVD, the land and goods siezed, and the remaining family members scattered, some to Siberia, some were able to flee to western Poland. Eventually, some got out of Siberia and traveled to Iraq to join the Free Polish there. I don't have the time to tell all the horrors that they experienced, those that lived.
No matter what preparations you have made, no matter how deep in the countryside you go, when an Army comes to you, they will take what they want and do with you as they want. You may have 50 guns and a ton of ammunition, but you will never be able to stand up to a platoon of Infantry soldiers sent to the countryside on looting missions. So many here at ZH think the only problem will be looters from the Democrat Plantations in the cities or nieghbors who failed to prepare. This might be a short term problem at the start, but the organized gang known as the Government will be your real problem. You will starve to death before they miss a meal. You will be living in a chicken coop before they have even one night without sleeping in a bed under a sturdy roof. You will be naked before they pass a day without clean socks.
This is the reality that history teaches us.
Anyone smart enough to run a business understands this, and that it is becoming more likely under Socialist / Marxist / Keynesian rule. I suspect that is why no one is taking out loans for new businesses (if the banks would make them); why go through all that pain if it's all likely to be taken away from you to create "fairness", "ecological balance" or whatever other bullshit slogan du jour?
But Americans are armed to the teeth; and when enough soldiers die trying to take farms that they then cannot run, the FSA will starve. The FSA certainly cannot run even a small garden, and after they are gone and the Big Ag farms "nationalized", then we can be Zimbabwe and suffer until sanity returns.
All that you say is true...so if you are (as Moe and the boys would say from time to time Trapped like rats!) then you make them pay, and pay dearly.
I never said it was guaranteed that preperation would allow you to survive. It just greatly increases your odds.
I am betting that the next collapse will be so comprehensive that many cops/soldiers go awol to protect their own families.
"If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace."
- Thomas Paine
I think you're being a little generous in thinking that only "Western" society deserves judgement. Are you saying that China, Russia, all of OPEC, etc., etc. have no corruption seeded deep into every level of leadership?
As has been stated before each country is trying to be the, "cleanest dirty shirt" in the hamper. The biggest problem with this is all of the leaders are swine who like to roll around in their own excrement.
I agree. I live in western socieity so I see it better than other societies. But yes, the whole world is in a moral mess.
I so agree. But it is coming one way or another eventually. We need a backup plan to "their" plan. That's why I am not so loving this gold backed currency thing. Who has most of the gold? I think we know here on ZH. I for one, do not want to bow down to the golden calf, that being India, Russia, China, etc. Let's triage and face this and do what we must, but NOT THEIR PLAN. It is suicide.
Well said.... I don't want it either but, that will not stop its arrival.
I'm paying attention but, the thought of everything changing has me up at night.
The main reason is because the wise know the longer it takes to collapse the worse things will be.
That's where I believe you're wrong. I think many people undstand exactly what would happen, and are even rooting for it.
To the treasonous facilitators that helped this plan along, you do realize that your usefulness will be over soon..
Domestic traitors of all stripes have much to answer for
More fear porn. Doesn't this site ever tire of such bullshit?
I used to enjoy this site 3 years ago when it was an informative, news-breaking breath of fresh air. Now, it's about clicks. Don't disagree with the Jew-hating, Putin-loving, gold-stacking, prepping members, or you might get banned. I now visit this site for two reasons: 1) To see the how the rubble of a once great site has devolved, and 2) To understand how the demented underbelly of the Internet know-it-alls bathe in their confirmation bias.
I marvel at the hubris and cock-sure attiudes of the commenters. It's a lot like being in a sports bar where a bunch of drunks are spouting their expertise about how to coach a football team. Except here, it's a bunch of assholes (probably drunk) spouting their expertise about how to run the global economy.
If I didn't like this site so much 3 or 4 years ago, I'd just stop reading it. But... it's like a car crash. I'm drawn to watch the carnage even though I feel worse after seeing it.
The fresh air has become stale, and that's a shame.
Come on now. In a world of make believe what else do we have. Its like riding the roller coaster screaming for our lives, relatively sure we are simultaneously in a near death state while also secure in the back of our mind that there is no threat at all.
Upvote for both the content and the awesome metaphor!
You mean things may get better?
As an iside, Oldwood, I see our demographics are pretty similar. What do you custom manufacture?
Custom furniture, mostly for corporations that we all seem to despise. Oil companies, hedge funds and big banks.
That's awesome! I have a similarly despicable career serving the "evil-doers". But the work has kept my family well. Good health and happy holiday's to you!
Same to you. My business is just now beginning to show some recovery from five years ago and now it looks like the oil companies may be tightening up on the discretionary spending again. If so, I think I will just throw in the towel this time. Too old, too tired and it just seems pointless.
I made a codensor for a still for someone I don't know in miss. For a friend sake. Old school hand soldered 6 coils. Hadn't made one in 30 yrs. for free
If you live in Houston, we're all nerveous.
Close to 80% of my work this year has been oil companies large an small. Big ExxonMobil project in Houston wrapping up. I don't have a clue about next year. I seldom see work out much over 90 days so I always have my ear to the rail trying to guess at what's coming....or if. We have spent a lot of time in the last five years sweeping.
Ever thought of hiding something in those Goldman Sachs boardroom chairs? Right below the nutsack, with a lead casing that opens just a crack when 200lbs presses down on it?
Nailed it.
You failed to give the slightest hint at what you believe is happening in the world, contrary to ZH opinion.
Keep trolling
Ah... the obligitory troll comment. Disagree with the confirmation bias, you're a troll. That game is played.
Take great care to never make a specific claim, and wallow in generalities!
Like the specific arguments you made in that post?
Do chime in with where you find fault. If a comment seems like rubbish to you, by all means appear and post the counter arguments. Why not win a following with your opinons of the economy of 2014. I suggest you do that, and ZH will improve. I am ready to hear any reasoned arguments.
But, from the last few posts I take it the anti Zionism, and the failure to back the American neoconservative polices is what has you depressed. You can counter this trend by simply getting to work and exposing why we should change our views on things.
Have it it, nobody will troll you if you are sincere. Defend your points of view. ZH does not ban you for being counter to the posting trends. If they have not banned me in 5 years, they will not ban you.
Jack, I've read your posts and silently upvoted many of them. While my opinion may be of little value here, I appreciate the thought and insight you put into your (sometimes lengthy!) posts. I'd honestly be delighted to express my views and to share my real-world experiences here. I managed two hedge funds in the past and have since opted to pusue different objectives.
But on ZH these days, it seems that any sincere effort to provide an informed, opposing viewpoint just gets shouted down. All the zionist, talamud, bankster talk dominates any real dialogue. And I'm an Italian who is none of the above!
Hence my little rant about the degredation of this site. I would like to debate the details, but this site no longer provides a useful platform.
It would improve the site somewhat if posters simply ignored the up/down vote arrows and simply posted their reasoned opinions on the subjects. I think the site would improve simply by removing the 'voting mechanism' thus forcing readers to either write something or leave it alone.
P.S. Now watch all the down votes for this idea... :-)