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Ron Paul: "Lessons From Paris"
Submitted by Ron Paul via The Ron Paul Institute of Peace & Prosperity,
After the tragic shooting at a provocative magazine in Paris last week, I pointed out that given the foreign policy positions of France we must consider blowback as a factor. Those who do not understand blowback made the ridiculous claim that I was excusing the attack or even blaming the victims. Not at all, as I abhor the initiation of force. The police blaming victims when they search for the motive of a criminal.
The mainstream media immediately decided that the shooting was an attack on free speech. Many in the US preferred this version of “they hate us because we are free,” which is the claim that President Bush made after 9/11. They expressed solidarity with the French and vowed to fight for free speech. But have these people not noticed that the First Amendment is routinely violated by the US government? President Obama has used the Espionage Act more than all previous administrations combined to silence and imprison whistleblowers. Where are the protests? Where are protesters demanding the release of John Kiriakou, who blew the whistle on the CIA use of waterboarding and other torture? The whistleblower went to prison while the torturers will not be prosecuted. No protests.
If Islamic extremism is on the rise, the US and French governments are at least partly to blame. The two Paris shooters had reportedly spent the summer in Syria fighting with the rebels seeking to overthrow Syrian President Assad. They were also said to have recruited young French Muslims to go to Syria and fight Assad. But France and the United States have spent nearly four years training and equipping foreign fighters to infiltrate Syria and overthrow Assad! In other words, when it comes to Syria, the two Paris killers were on “our” side. They may have even used French or US weapons while fighting in Syria.
Beginning with Afghanistan in the 1980s, the US and its allies have deliberately radicalized Muslim fighters in the hopes they would strictly fight those they are told to fight. We learned on 9/11 that sometimes they come back to fight us. The French learned the same thing last week. Will they make better decisions knowing the blowback from such risky foreign policy? It is unlikely because they refuse to consider blowback. They prefer to believe the fantasy that they attack us because they hate our freedoms, or that they cannot stand our free speech.
Perhaps one way to make us all more safe is for the US and its allies to stop supporting these extremists.
Another lesson from the attack is that the surveillance state that has arisen since 9/11 is very good at following, listening to, and harassing the rest of us but is not very good at stopping terrorists. We have learned that the two suspected attackers had long been under the watch of US and French intelligence services. They had reportedly been placed on the US no-fly list and at least one of them had actually been convicted in 2008 of trying to travel to Iraq to fight against the US occupation. According to CNN, the two suspects traveled to Yemen in 2011 to train with al-Qaeda. So they were individuals known to have direct terrorist associations. How many red flags is it necessary to set off before action is taken? How long did US and French intelligence know about them and do nothing, and why?
Foreign policy actions have consequences. The aggressive foreign policies of the United States and its allies in the Middle East have radicalized thousands and have made us less safe. Blowback is real whether some want to recognize it or not. There are no guarantees of security, but only a policy of non-intervention can reduce the risk of another attack.
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you cant argue with a man who is right.
no, but people will still try. Anything and everything will be done to convince people that all of the western govts are completely blameless in all this, expect to hear a lot of "we could have never seen this coming". And expect a lot of people to beg the govt to protect them, which will cause the govt to do what it is always seeking to do: grow. These people are asking for an even bigger and more intrusive police state, and are lining up to sacrifice even more of their liberties on the alter of security, which is an illusion anyway. All they will accomplish in the end is proving Orwell right
Barry went all in with his Paris absence. The US is now the worlds' pariah nation. Hope you like your Change, SUCKERS!!!!
Off Topic:
Anybody else notice that Bitcoin is crashing tonight?
http://www.kitco.com/finance/bitcoin/
Down to $245; that's an additional 17% loss in just the last 5 days...
Fonestar? Was that you?
I think he's on his 4th alias, poor misguided fella...
I like Ron, but the argument falls apart in the following: Many countries, not just those fighting wars in islamic countries, are the victims of islamic attacks.
These people are just fucking crazy.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Islamic_terrorist_attacks
Fucking crazy! Kind of like the progressives who think socialism will work THIS time.
the argument does not fall apart. How about we try a non interventionist policy for the frist time since at least 1898 and see how that goes for a little while before saying 'his argument falls apart'. what you are implying is that we can invade and occupy half the middle east, fly drones over these countries and indiscriminatly kill civilians, conduct regime changes all over the world, and have over 1000 military bases in over 100 countries, and then dismiss those things as possible reasons why people might want to attack us.
Think of all the people of all different races and ethnicities that we've subjugated/bombed/fucked with/pissed off in the last hundred years. The vietnamese aren't busting into kosher markets with AK's. The Germans aren't hiding bombs in their underwear on the plane. Most islamic terrorist attacks aren't even on the US, we just get the most pissed off about it. The Madrid bombings, the multiple attacks in France,the Chechnyans in Russia, or the Uighurs in China. We're the only country doing shit about it but not the only country suffering it. We're not provoking it except for by buying oil, which is the only reason most ME countries populations exist in the first place.
"we're not provoking it except for buying oil"
Where the fuck have you been for the past 20 years? you don't need dozens of military bases in a foreign country or region to just 'buy oil' from them. You need that to keep the local populations in subgegation. In a simple transaction as you describe, all you need to do is show up with money and a suitable shipping container to carry the product, not military hardware. And in EVERY SINGLE ONE of those other situations you mentioned, those countries were not just randomly attacked out of no where, do a little research. The french and germans have gone along with our misguided middle eastern adventures, and the chechnyans don't want to be part of russia. Therefore conflict an violence is inexcusable. that sounds like some sean hannity type shit.
So because we "attacked them out of nowhere" they get to strap bombs to themselves? Wake up. Apologies and mea culpas aside, they're just nutjobs who have been doing this shit for the last hundred years and pretending that's our intervention that brough it on is wishful thinking. What did Spain do to deserve the Madrid bombings? What Bali do to deserve getting their nightclubs bombed? What did two buildings worth of 9-5r's on Chambers street do to warrant them jumping out of a building do? Dude, you're an idiot, it's not our fault these people are nuts. Even Hannity knows that.
Actually your Jew friends invented terrorism. And sold the playbook to neocon Governments.
Australia, for example, only experiences "terror" events of a false flag variety during Liberal (our version of Tories) goverments:
Bali bombing;
Port Arthur;
Sydney Siege;
This type of even seem to enable the expedience by which some governments want to trasition into full blown fascism.
Bullshit Prisoner,
There's no way Port Arthur could be called a 'terrorist' attack, it was one long term seriously mentally ill young man, not in a group, with no political statement or demands, who bought a bunch of rifles, and went killing tourists and locals, for fun!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Bryant
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_%28Australia%29
As for the general thesis it is completely wrong. If anything, it's the other way around!
Terrorist attacks while Federal Labor Governments were in orifice:
1972 bombing of the Yugoslav General Trade and Tourist Agency
1986 bombing of the Russell Street Police Station in Melbourne
1986 Melbourne Turkish consulate bombing
1995 bombing of the French Consulate
And:
Cut the completely warped shit mate, calling an Australian Conservative Govt a 'Neocon' Govt is about the dumbest load of utter shit I've ever heard a fellow Australian say. You might want to remember that Labor PM Gillard's partner was Jewish and that her own foreign affairs minister complained and wrote in a book the problems he had and the Labor Govt had with the Jewish lobby!
Wake up to yourself fool.
Where did the automatic rifle come from?
It was terror, and worse, state terror, because it was "allowed to happen" for political reasons.
The fact the guy was a patsy is irrelevant.
No warped shit here. I post in good faith. You sure don't think George Brandis and Cori Barnardi are anything but nazis.
Good faith maybe (I do believe you), but very ignorant and strange good faith.
Bob Carr's texts to Gillard reveal 'extraordinary' influence pro-Israel lobby had on former PM
I think George Brandis and Cori Barnardi are stuffed shirts and stumble-bums, ignorant enough and authoritarian enough to be dangerous. Actually, Joe Hockey bothers me a fair bit too, the crap he's said on Australian ID cards and chip technology ... well it's here.
If you actually think 'Man Haron Monis' was a Muslim terrorist, died at the scene along with Dawson and Johnson, and the news agencies were caught completely unaware by the whole thing, I wonder why you frequest zerohedge.
Surely the 7pm Project is more your style?
Or if you want coverage of what actually happened at the Lindt Cafe, you'll have to go to alternative sources.
Try this one for starters.
Who are you talking to?
Why are you posting that crap at me?
I said nothing about it.
france happens is france responsability, fully.
what if...i tell you, in marseille prisons... the thugs got internet, in jails, with computers... with phones...with drugs...with knives....with facebook accounts....
then... i wait the 1st mofo gov guy gonna try to explain to me society is bad shape coz of xxx or yyyy...
when i pay tax to get wall rights to lock thugs, i do not pay for let em like in hilton hotles with friends and beers.... i mean, fuck sake , can we wipe with ziklon any prison make some room ?
for days now it is full jews blabla, any word for muslim cops shot ?hmmmm okey...
fine, let em go israel... all this for hiding the big one coming pretty sure this year, if not why to produce such event.
I already explained it to you. You are just another garden variety republican with your head firmly planted in the sand, refusing to see reality. I can't help you, ZH can't help you. Keep on believing the govt line if you want, I don't care. You are clearly very dense if you can wrap your head around something so simple as "IF YOU MAKE WAR ON ANOTHER CULTURE'S CIVILIANS, THEY WILL MAKE WAR ON YOURS. thats it, simple as that.
The Chinese just executed 12 Islamists and banned the celebration of this past Ramadan.
THEY GET IT! the whole reaction is extreme brain wash.
try to think of a reason to kill your self. protecting your loved ones-check.
because someone you don't know makes a joke about your god, fucking insane...
now tell me your reason, blowback is shallow...
these are weak humans vulnerable due to life circumstances being preyed upon by idealogs with a hidden agenda...
to actually do it, in-fucking-sane by any measure except in the name of alah..
How can a non-interventionist turn be even possible if the population isn't prepared mentally/intellectually for a lower consumerist standard of living because of world events making the US likely an island nation with much less trade with other nations?
it can't be, and isn't, possible. Thats why we find ourselves in this situation. Our dumbshits demand moar, and demand a nanny state govt protect them from all consequences, so we kep chugging along until we hit the brick wall of reality. it won't be pretty.
Two words: "Barbary pirates".
We tried sending them tribute payments, but it just turned them into international welfare bums.
So, Tom Jefferson sent some gunboats and some marines. Problem solved.
Blowback by terrorists is just the cost of doing business. And it only affects little people, so what's the big deal?
I wonder how Americans would react if another country bombed them, droned them, indebted them, tried to steal their resources and tried to overthrow their government? Well, the last one they might not mind.
Poor whatshisface....
The "JV" team strikes again!
The Paris thing was all pathetic posturing of balless crepuscular europussies. Obama should logically have been right there with them.
That's what Greeks said too!
"Firstnshe was hot. Then she was rich. Plus she was MARRIED.". Three big strikes right there if you ask me....
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JuOH0k_lkg#t=153
BBC NEWS: Paris Shooting Is A False Flag https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wfpm-T3IaHsNobody knows what really happened in PAris. The French saying that sanctions against Russia should be lifted just before this is an indicator.
Also about 2 weeks ago, Hollande, made like a emergency trip to Moscow to speak directly with Putin and warn him about something. he did not trust any communications devices.
What is sickening is Porky is there while his junta nazis are shelling civilian towns in Donestsk. He is a vile POS.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kdN1EbkzIUM#t=283
Yep. I was watching a Liar....err....Lawyer argue with Jan Helfeld over min wage today. The Liar had no arguments, other than logical fallacies (not arguments) but he sure as shit tried to continue arguing.
http://thedailyknell.wordpress.com/2012/03/11/old-rothschild-and-rockefe...
Closing the circle, in this article Memehunter connects the founding fathers of the Libertarian party directly to the top of the Money Power chain of command. It was Alfred Kohlberg, fronting for his boss Bernard Baruch, who played a key role in both the cover up of Jewish involvement in Bolshevism and building up the other side of the dialectic: Libertarianism...
Read it and weep. Fooled again.
I support Liberty, but not the fake economics known as Libertatianism.
..and you can't tell an azzhoe like the corrupt divisive arrogant narcissistic illegal indonesian kenyan alien muslim sociopathic pathological liar in chief fudgepacker it's an azzhoe.
Whatever, Ron Paul can go fuck himself with this bullshit. And his devoted flock can fuck themselves as well.
Thank you very little.
hell ya bro. MURICA!! These evil muslims hate us for our free-dumbs, they attacked us completely without provocation of any kind, its not like we have been waging war on their homes for the past few decades, we did nothing to them. Nuke their ass and take their gas! Hoo-ra.
You have a very . . . narrow view of history and particularly Islam's worldview.
And you have a very dim view of sarcasm. Read the rest of my posts, in addition to the one above, and try to see how well they go together... Hint: one of them is not like the others
I think your Badger brain has had a bit to much common sense for the day. You need to get some badger nap time.
I can be counted as one of the flock since shaking his hand wouldn't make me feel dirty.
I sure you'd say that if you were standing in front of me instead of seated on the commode in your mommies basement.
Say that to my face.
;0p
Touchy WaPo columnist: I hate House of Cards, it's making us look bad!
http://tinyurl.com/ofbarkr
Ron Paul is getting better at getting his point across. This was good and persuasive.
Right, where did I put that case of gin and that Morrissey CD.
Your Morrissey CD is right next to the five gay porn tapes you left on the coffee table.
Drummond, just get a new CD. Don't go back to GoBadgers to get it from his coffee table. He sounds like a shitty ex. You can do better.
You must be related to my wife.
Why he is not the president of USA?
Why are you not voting for him?
Because he cannot lead people. As unpopular as it is among this crowd, it is true. Paul never accomplished anything in his days in Washington. If you think he did, by all means list out all of those things he led and persuaded others to do. Crickets.
I don't dislike Paul, but he has no record of accomplishment.
Because the standard for being president is "accomplishing something."
Obama? He wrote 2 memoiors
Bush? Failed at every business he ever had.
Clinton? Fucked around. Two bit hustlers.
Bush? CIA director. There's your only person that "accomplished" anything. And I guarantee you're not allowed to know about most of those things.
voting against pointless war, voting against unconstitutional spending, and warning everyone who would listen about the dangers of govt over reach. Being the sole voice of reason in a house of fools and whores. He spoke over most peoples heads, and said thigns that were unpleasant to hear, which is why a lot of people never connected to him. But millions did. You will never see a more enthusiastic crowd at a campaign rally than RP's. But, the braindead masses in this country want to be coddled, and since most politicians will simply tell people what they want to hear, they will get the votes. Its a lot easier to fool people than it is to convincee people they have been fooled
He was also a military officer, so I feel he has a pretty fair understand of what its like for an average young man who might be deployed at any moment, for any idiot reason under the sun, even if it, at its core, violates the oath we swears on.
I think he would certainly stop the wreckless foreign policies of the of recent presidents and be very careful about military entanglements. I think he would use the Constitution as his playbook.
Sometimes returning to the basics straightens out the complicated shit that happens when our Supreme Court even fudges from the letter of the Law as written.
I see no other person to vote for with clear conscience, if he were to run. It makes no difference voting D or R as they wear the same underwear.
That's some uncomfortable truthiness right there. The only people who get "elected" are scum who happen to know the right people.
CIA director.
Also Naval Aviator F6F Hellcat, shot down by the Japs in combat.
Congressman, oil tycoon.
I think he accomplished a few things. I do wish his kid would not have taken us back to Iraq as we had Saddam in his cage and those that are prone to misbehave were kept in line by him.
Gadaffi kept the goons in line as well. He even leveled the playing field for women in Libya. He too was in his cage after President Reagan bloodied his nose so to say...
I often wonder what the world would be like if we would mettle so much in the business of other countries.
Accomplished as in creating thousands of new laws for us all to trip over? The man was a total success in congress as far as I'm concerned. The feds can stay the fuck out of my business.
Everything Congress and the administration regimes did during that time was illegal. Ever consider that? Nothing, and I repeat nothing Congress passed should have done so. If you are looking for criminal progressive accomplishment then do not look to Ron Paul.
Grimaldus
Political "accomplishments" are code for the use of force, fraud and coercion upon the public for the benefit of the few, the corporatists, the militarists, the statists, the bankers. Thank God "Dr No" did everything he could to prevent those types of accomplishments. Bush, on the other hand, was able to claim "Mission Accomplished!" Slaves need to be "led". Free thinking, free people in a free society require no Masters.
2 time voter
Cause he's not running...and Rand has zero governmental executive experience... and, face it, is only where he is because of who he was spawned by.
All countries would be safer if they stopped doing what the US wanted. Which would also make the ones the US wanted them to help stomp on a little safer too.
Moral of this story, quit meddling with shit.
Meddling with shit?
What did one fly say to the other fly?
Pardon me. Is this stool taken?
good thing his guy didn't get the nod from the republicunts
I doubt that even most Merikans would be happy to live in a world wherein the US wasn't the head of something...free world, the world, whatever. If the people want this interventionist gov't, that is what we've had and will continue to die and waste the national treasure upon until we lay prostrate. Just like all of the Empires throughout the ages. Nothing new under the sun.
Lets for eg look into lessons from Mumbai. Where did India intervene ? Mumbai attacks are a consequence of Radical Islam !
Imperial Islam long predates European colonialism and survived as Empire until the Ottomans fell at the close of WWI. What we've been observing since WWII is a resurgence of Islamic imperialism.
Yes but who opened the borders wide open to the west for muslims to flood in? It was not muslims.
Correct. It was the British.
[Thanks T.E. Lawrence...]
I would opine it was "liberal" western thought...guilt for its period of colonialism. So, the UK and France in particular have attempted to atone by allowing these commonwealth nations free access to the former mother country. I would further opine that the current ruling classes within Europe and the US are now more socialist than ever, and consequently are almost derisive of national borders (Marxist tenet), allowing nearly unfettered entry. This immigration grows the influence of the State, and guarantees an almost permenant voting block dependent on other people's money bestowed by the State...you know legal plunder (Biastiat). History moves in long sine waves, rather than chaotic accute events.
The Hindus and Muslims have never gotten along. That's why Britain had to split India up and create Pakistan and Bangladesh...
After India-Pak partition Pak was 24% Hindu. Now its 1%
And who would want to be a Hindu living in Pakistan?
Forget being a Hindu in Pak. Radical Islam doesnt want a non-muslim anywhere in the world !
who the fuck would want to be anything living in Pakistan?
Ron Paul must have Mad Cow Disease, cuz his brain is severely malfunctioning:
If islamic terror, oppression, conquest, enslavement, rape, forcible conversion to islamic cult, etc are the result of USA’s policies, then WHY have the islamic cult worshipers been practicing these behaviors FOR CENTURIES BEFORE THE USA EVEN EXISTED ??????
He didn't say we created them! He said we armed them and then pissed them off.
Back in 700 A.D. ? Tell us more
which came first, US interfering in middle eastern countries, and putting troops on their soil, or muslim attacks against western countries?
Exactly. 700 A.D. was well before 1776. Hell, it predates the Magna Carta by centuries.
That's not what I meant. Going back that far is irrelevant. All people's made senseless was on each other back then, all to satisfy the ambitions of their rulers. I'm talking about modern times, when people aren't supposed to attack each other for no reason. Who attacked who first? ALL of this stems from Sykes-picot after WWI, and western insistence in ruling the world. We have been occupying and ordering those people around for the entire last century, and then act surprised when they lash out. You have far more in common with the average Muslim on the street than you do with the elites of western society calling the shots. This is why you are conditioned to the them all like this, and you are conditioned to not be aware of what we have done to the rest of the world to bring this about. This conditioning has obviously worked quite well on you, since you seem unable to grasp basic history.
Its simple if you don't fuck with the hornets nest you àre much less likely to get stung.
Bad analogy. Hornets aren't flying around trying to convert you and others to become hornets or die. Muslims are.
It baffles me how some refuse to acknowledge this concept and thus have flawed foriegn policy ideas like Ron Paul.
Let me put it to you this way. Ron Paul is against the western intervention, thus he should be safe from redical Islamists. So let's have Ron Paul go visit ISIS and let's see how that turns out.
My bet is Ron Paul's head would be severed.
My approach would be to just saturate spray the hornet's nest.
didn't they bomb us when we left them in their hell hole. Kill em all and let the virgins sort it out!
Y&R 1987 opening
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=es1WgCf3Cao (0:30)
SLUs Top Ten Soap Opera Themes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M5Fe3iZisUU (9:34)
maybe if Obama stopped heloing the terrorists we would be better off. Obama is helping the terrorists in Syria!
I'm sure there is a photo of McStain and this troop of "freedom fighters" floAting around somewhere.
"Another lesson from the attack is that the surveillance state that has arisen since 9/11 is very good at following, listening to, and harassing the rest of us but is not very good at stopping terrorists"
that's because everything after the conjunction helps create everything that precedes it
This surveillance state didn't gestate after 2001. Various reporting requirements by businesses go back many decades. All business must report their activities to the federal gov't at least since the 1940's. One program in particular gave me my first on paper proof that nothing was beyond the reach of government back in the 1980's when it passed into law. It is called the Know your customer program. That requires banks....at the time only those who weren't privately owned banks to track bank depositors behaviors of deposits, withdrawals, types, and amounts. This program was suppose to thwart drug money laundering. Of course, it's reach was broad and curtailed everyone's privacy. The Patriot Act was crafted in many respects based on this earlier law and set of regulations.
Islam has been a warlike death-cult long before the USA even existed. Ron Paul has his head up his ass on this one.
yes. And up until recently we had the sense to just leave those people to their own devices. If they want to act like savages living in the middle ages, let them have at it. Eventually, enough people in those places will pull their heads out of their asses and decide being lorded over by religious nutjobs isnt the ideal way to live, and rid themselves of it. Ron Paul isnt defending islam, he is saying that our interventions in their countries invites blowback, since people don't like to be meddled with. If you can't tell the difference, its you who has his head up his ass. And its not like christianity's hands are clean either. religion and govt are the two most dangerous and deadly ideas ever cooked up by man kind, and what we are witnessing today is the worst of both
Pretending there is moral equivalence between Islam and Christianity is sheer idiocy. 1 of these 2 ideologies actively allows for peaceful tolerance of non-believers. 1 demands conversion or death. And I wont even touch on topics like the secular rights violations that occur under Islam. To my eyes, the feral savages are taking over a # of countries, including France.
Yes, there is a moral equivalence, since all religions are created in the minds of men because most people are weak minded and weak willed and need something to act as an emotional security blanket in a scary world, and because most people need and like to be told what to do and what to think. Arguing over which religion is better is the adult equivalent to children arguing over who has the best imaginary friend. I don't care what it says in the Quran, I just know that if you make war on people in their homes long enough, they WILL strike back eventually. Maybe we should try leaving the hornets nest alone for a while and try solving our own problems instead of attempting to force(at gunpoint) our version of democracy on a people who clearly don't want it.
This is the usual ZH ideological and complete nonsense. The world has become ONE place and extreme Islam feels threatened by the west just as all fascist ideologies always will be from Putin to Lukashenka and Erdogan from Communism to Mordor...
There are bridges, there always will be and extreme islam lives among us. We have to embrace it, teach tolerance and understanding, but we also have to repel those who want to kill us.
The west makes mistakes, big ones! That is no reason to attack 3000 people in a skyscraper. We live here and now, THIS IS PARADISE, and we must protect it it and the Earth that carries it.
Ron Paul stand for 19th century isolationism. Its ridiculously outdated a concept.
I don't believe that the Constitution is a ridiculously outdated concept from the 17th, 18th, 19th or any other century.
The middle east is a fucked up mess because of our foreign policies. If you can't see that you need to be in isolation
i don't believe that advocating trade with all nations, entangling alliances with none is an isolationist policy. I think that waging undeclared wars and conducting economic warfare on any country that doesnt toe the US govt line is 'isolationist'
Very big difference between between confrontational and isolationist. US foreign policy pre-WW1 was isolationist. Not our problem was their mantra. Modern US foreign policy is psychopathic aggression, first thru economic sanctions and CIA activity, then thru military proxies, then direct militiary intervention. This is basic stuff, and you are missing it.
So, the Spanish American war was isolationist, as was our unwanted colonization of the Philippines in order to "Christian-ize" the already catholic Filipinos? Invading other countries and commuting atrocities on their people qualifies as the 'psychopathic aggression' you mentioned, not even close to isolationism. This is very basic stuff, and you are missing it. Your govt approved public school education is showing.
The middle East has been fucked for centures, way before the US was around.
Because you don't see that, you should be isolated.
"That is no reason to attack 3000 people in a skyscraper".
The us.gov kills millions of innocent people around the world, allowing over 5000 of their highly valued soldiers to get killed, and many more thousand to get injured, many of which commit suicide and your concerned that this was not fair!
Maybe you should go off to war, you know for the cause!
Just keep paying your taxes (only to be wasted), keep watching cnn, your learning lots.
'That is no reason to attack 3000 people in a skyscraper.'
Get your mind off silicon inflated tits ... !!!
http://www.corbettreport.com/911-a-conspiracy-theory/
hwho: great tits, is it a selfie?
"Ron Paul stand for 19th century isolationism. Its ridiculously outdated a concept."
well I guess your in the camp of "a few eggs must be broken to produce an omlet"?
mixing the lower class in ways that cause conflict does not bother you, or are you one of the .01% who never live with the results of open borders free trade and military interventions as you profit from it all?
the plan is one world gov run by elite do gooders (do gooder translated into its good for my pocket book .01%)
looking at the world from the trenches of ave joe tax paying american- every policy out of DC just makes me poorer, destroys my freedom and enslaves us to beaurocrats and sociopaths..
eat your paradise utopia .. while killing children with drones what a waste of air you are.
The Paris attackers were Algerian. This would be blowback from France's own imperialism.
Maybe. Just maybe Charlie hebo are just a bunch of leftist bigots. And no one else need die or get hurt defending them.
Blowback from leftist immigration and welfare policies. The French chose to let these peoples colonize them. The French chose to subsidize their fecundity, their unemployment, their chain migrations, their mosques, their housing, their education, and on and on.
Ok. Are you somehow making a separate point? Yeah. They let immigrants in from their colony. Maybe they shouldn't have colonized Algeria. That's the root cause of all this.
Their welfare state was a series of opportunistic politicians gaining power by buying votes through immigration.
That's exactly what I was thinking too. When you fuck over brown and black people by forcibly colonizing their country, installing dictators against their will, and/or bombing the living daylights out of that country, it's going to be a shitty result no matter what happens. Some of those people will turn on you and attack the same Western countries fucking over their homeland. Others more will simply immigrate to a less shittier country, which is where we've been seeing a lot of the Muslim immigration into Europe the last few decades or so.
Sweden is a good example of this problem. Most of their 3rd world immigrants come from countries that the US has meddled around in forever like Iraq, Somalia, and now Syria. Does anyone really think that's a coincidence? Looking at it from a relatively recent point of view, if the US and the rest of the West hadn't decided to overthrow Assad and completely destablize Syria, Sweden wouldn't be looking at tens of thousands of Syrian immigrants flooding into their country with each passing year.
The US bombs brown and black people and Europe gets stuck picking up the mess by having to take care of all the immigrants fleeing. Sounds like a deal to me if I'm in TPTB.
The reality is that he west enriched a nomadic people due to the discovery and subsequent uses for oil.
The big increases in their populations have been predicated on this windfall and when the revenue coming in from oil starts to fall away, these people will either have to re-create themselves or starve.
One way or another there will be an angry mood shift at some stage by these people and it will make for an Arab Spring the likes of which we have never imagined.
They have blimps and overpasses in France?
Sick of hearing about this 'tragic event' and the endless nauseating spiel of various dickheads taking a very serious tone and flogging the thing to their own rhetorical advantage without stopping to examine the highly questionable series of events and subsequent further disempowerment of the serfs.
Yo, Hedgeless Horsedude, are you out there? Where's this fucking asteroid you promised us?
The symbolism is all that the West can muster.
The Islamic fanatics don't hate us because of "our policies." They hate us because they are life-hating, death-worshiping religious mystics who hate the modern world we have produced that is spreading everywhere.
The fanatics don't want to live. They want to die and take us with them.
If we don't fight them over there, we will be fighting them here.
Ron Paul is an old fool.
Interesting how killing people is a "policy" by governments, but "terrorism" when it is people killing the people that are killing them and theirs.
Funny how that works.
The banksters need to repay us.
The pols, crats and funcs can ponder that while waiting their turn on the guillotine.
If there is one lesson to learn from issues ranging from QE to 'training' ragheads to do the CIA's wetwork to the repression of Constitutional rights, it is that government manipulation is sure to create blowback. Ragheads have been bloodthirsty, regressive, feral savages for >1000 years. The CIA just went full BASF, and made 'em even more bloodthirsty, regressive, feral, and savage. QE? Rather than cause inflation, it accelerated DEFLATION thru the direction of free money into commodity production. Repression of Constitutional rights? This one hasn't blown up in .gov's face yet, but the gears are turning. I predict the outcome will be a number of these 'blocs', including the USA and EU, falling apart.
You know why your life sucks? Why you are always depressed and desperate? You want to know why you don't have any real friends. You want to know why every year things get worse, why people all around loose jobs and it's only a matter of time before you loose yours? You want to know, why prices go up, taxes go up, bills go up and just about everything goes up, short of your desire to live? Want to know why you're fucked, your children are fucked and their children are fucked even more? You want to know why your individual life ain't worth shit and you either can't or don't want to do anything about it?
Deep inside you know the answer. It's been right under your nose all this time - on the tip of your tongue. You just needed a little hit - a wake up call. Some cosmic event that would align the stars and spell it out for you. The answer's been buzzing around at the back of your conscience like an annoying bee, but it's becoming clearer and clearer. The cause of your misery, the reason your society is doomed and your individual existence is practically irrelevant is... it's all because of b... b-a.... ban.... Yes, you got it! It's Muslims!
Isis was created and is supported by the US. Why is it not possible to destroy their 40+ tanks in the desert? Because the US supports them and created them. What kind of extremism is this? It's the rogue US MIC not some muslim extremism. Even Ron Paul seems to be on board with this propaganda.
These are not foreign policy mistakes. This is precisely what foreign policy is aiming for.
Sorry Ron, these are not foreign policy mistakes, they are domestic policy mistakes.
Perhaps one way to make us all more safe is for the US and its allies to stop supporting IMPORTING these extremists.
The US and its sometime allies may be stuffing up with stupid foreign policy, but the domestic harm would be far less had the political class, dominated by guess who, not decided to import people who are unassimilable and antagonistic to their host societies.
Nailed it again Baz.
Precautionary Principle applies to raising taxes and fucking up the energy sector over imaginary global warming, when empirical quantified global SAT temp data shows there's not been any global warming for over 18 years running, the trend is a flat line!
But we can't use the same principle of due precautions as a Duty-of-Care to say no to more of these ME fanatics getting into the country?
Boy, did we get sold a bridge.
But our diversity is our strength! /sarc
Ask an Eskimo.
Whom do we call terrorists?
People call the Charlie Hedbo killers terrorists. But they were simply enforcing "the law" of several Muslim majority nations.
They are called terrorists for enforcing "the law" in France, but state actors enforcing such laws in other countries are not terrorists?
The US created the first extremist Muslim fighting force to fight the Russians in Afghanistan.
Talk about blowback.
Really?
What was US policy in 753 A.D. when muzzies boiled out of their barren sand pit to carry their holy word at the point of a sword murdering an estimated 270000 non believers?
Your statement disregards over 1200 years of murdering, barbaric behavior by a people who insist that ALL must live by their tenets of faith.
The willful ignorance of what the civilized world faces is appaling.
It would be difficult for the US to be completely non-interventionist; it commands a large swathe of the global economy, not merely directly but indirectly. However, being militarily non-interventionist would bring with it considerable savings in blood and treasure.
Heard you lima-charlie the first three times.
could you please repeat that?
It would be difficult for the US to be completely non-interventionist; it commands a large swathe of the global economy, not merely directly but indirectly. However, being militarily non-interventionist would bring with it considerable savings in blood and treasure.
It would be difficult for the US to be completely non-interventionist; it commands a large swathe of the global economy, not merely directly but indirectly. However, being militarily non-interventionist would bring with it considerable savings in blood and treasure.
It would be difficult for the US to be completely non-interventionist; it commands a large swathe of the global economy, not merely directly but indirectly. However, being militarily non-interventionist would bring with it considerable savings in blood and treasure.
RP, truth is sexy and blow back's a bitch, you win.
TheCharlie Hebdo sace has been revealed as an Operation of the Illuminati that are upset with Frncoise Hollande's attitude about the sanctions against Russia .
https://www.youtube.com/watch?...
A quarrel is ongoing between the vassals of the USA and the Illuminati
tsk tsk those pesky Illuminutty...
i love ron paul but this middle ground on the fence position disapoints me, and may work against him with those who dont understand the nuance of his situation.
if hes not gonna call a false flag a false flag then thats not really telling the people the truth and the same thing the authoritarians he rails against do.
What do you mean "work against him"?
He's fucking retired and to my knowledge he is not pimping a book at the present time.
I'm not afraid and I don't want the government to do anything except be replaced by open source software.
Has the Tea Party been sufficiently paid off and infiltrated with enough spies?
Just follow the votes and public statements made by supposed Tea Partiers in CONgress and decide for yourself.
22- infiltration of political parties what a new concept! almost like some tin foil hat types think our presidents get selected before elected..crazy crazy thinking they all tell us..
Only the "Tea Party" isn't an actual political party.
It's a faction or "movement" within the Republican party... and in my humble opinion it's a "bowel movement" within the Republicrat party.
Smoke screens.
You are wrong. The reason they hate us is because the quran tell them to. Search google for "violance in the quran" and you will know more on why they behave the way they do. It's ok to love the muslims if you are a muslim, otherwise, you are a kufar and they will kill you too eventually.
So, you are saying that even if we weren't occupying Muslim lands, even if we haven't been meddling in their affairs for the past century, even if we weren't flying drones over a dozen countries in that region and killing civilians indiscriminately, even if we didn't regime change numerous govts, they would still be trying to attack our civilians in western countries for no reason other than the Quran tells them to, and our own foreign policy is completely blameless? You, good sir, are a fucking idiot.
You are wrong. The reason they hate us is because the quran tell them to. Search google for "violance in the quran" and you will know more on why they behave the way they do. It's ok to love the muslims if you are a muslim, otherwise, you are a kufar and they will kill you too eventually.
As long as there are influential people saying its the West's fault, its Israel's fault, its the US's fault etc etc, we wil never come to understand the nature of Islamic fanaticism, never see it for what it really is and therefore never be able to take the decisions and actions needed to effectively cope with and overcome it.
danepol"decisions and actions needed to effectively cope with and overcome it."
the conflicts across the globe do have one similar component: us military and intelligence agency actions..
our founding fathers in America were for the majority isolationists..we might try it some time.
islamic fanaticism is an islamic problem, why import it here or in the EU?
do you mean the uncontrolled migrations (invasions) of muslems into EU and USA has no part to play?
policy has worsened conflict and made us police states..for the elite it is what was intended.
Our western free societies do not have the tools to combat terrorism, especially not while obama the traitor is in office.
Simply killing a terrorist who is already willing to die for his cause is not and cannot be a deterent.
But the more we kill the smaller the cause.