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Thanks Obamacare: This Is What Americans Spent The Most Money On In Q4
If readers need clarification on what was the primary source of spending-based "growth" for the US economy in the fourth quarter, the same source that bumped up final Q3 GDP from 3.9% to 5.0%, please ping us: we will gladly explain the chart below. And just in case it is still unclear what Americans are spending their "gas sasvings" on, here it is one more time.
And just in case the fading impact of Obamacare is not already priced in, here is what Q4 inventories did: rising by $113.1 billion in Q4, this was the second highest quarterly increase in the 21st century, second only to September 2010. It's all GDP-crushing liquidations from here.
So big in fact that even the most upbeat permabull has no choice but to admit the truth:
A $113B inventory build in Q42014 means we could see less production and hence #GDP in the current quarter.
— Joseph A. LaVorgna (@Lavorgnanomics) January 30, 2015
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When you need them, they will help your 'health'! In fact, you will be a LOT healthier than someone without them!
see without obumercare the USSA would be screwed forget all the jobs that were lost because of this healthcare bill. GDP was positive now BTFD and give us MOAR pretty please
Now you know why the insurance companies didn't stop Obamacare... They could have bought enough votes in Congress to stop it, but instead they bought enough votes to modify Obamacare such that they could lock in more subscribers who have to pay more for more covered services that they will never need or use. And because the subscribers will not use those services, it is all profit for the insurance companies!
Deductibles are a healthcare utiiization deterrent for sure. Rate hikes for everyone yet expensive to use it and forced by law to have it. Really disgusting.
Insurance company lobbyists WROTE Obamacare. That is well known. They met with the congress and prez, behind closed doors, in secret, and hammered out what they wanted, and they got everytting. And we got the bill.
Jose fails to see that they're all on the same team, separated only by rhetoric.
FuckenAjose! Finally a commentor with a brain..you nailed it...ObamaCare isn't Socialism, it's Crony Capitalism.
I think it's a good mixture. How many people taking the subsidies have no idea they are now on the FSA welfare program.
it's Crony Capitalism
Capitalism is "two years". The only version of it is "crony".
Yup. Somehow we went from a market where you could buy bare bones insurance for catastrophic needs for peanuts. Now, those are illegal (See, "Land of the Free") and all you can buy is high deductible outrageously expensive coverage. The insurance carriers got exactly what they wanted.
It hasn't even been fully implemented yet. We didn't overturn the government whn they instituted the income tax, and we didn't overturn the government when they implemented this shit sandwich.
Beyond done. Let the motherfucker burn.
make no mistake, the GOP is on the big insurance company dole too...
christ, I can barely look at that chart. sickening...
makes you wonder what the next "no lubricant" scenario planned is...
Absolutely -- the GOP could have stopped Obamacare but didn't, and you will not see any major changes until at least 2017.
Depends on the SCOTUS ruling this summer. the whole thing could collapse under its own weight if Roberts wakes up
http://www.nationaljournal.com/health-care/what-obama-can-do-if-scotus-c...
The House has the sole right to propose Spending under the Constitution.
At any time, the "republican" House could have shut off funding for this abortion. Did they? No.
I sure hope the Reality begins to surface with citizens that these two political parties have no allegiance to the American Citizen.
Regardless of who is in the WH, regulations on Healthcare will reduce and prices will go up.
It has become a luck and brains lottery:
I wonder, is Bill Frist a billionaire yet?
"Frist fucked by a stink Frist", hard?
Obamacare supporters will point to this as a reason to support the AFA
Grubers are everywhere
Another indicator of a physically and mentally sick society.
Like it matters? So, consumers spend on another new Chinese-made I-Phone instead, and that is somehow better? Healthcare employees are big spenders. They get paid well and then buy new SUVs and I-Phones. Rinse-repeat. Seems like a pointless article.
All that matters is Fed money creation and super-low rates, that is all that keeping us from sinking into a depression. They can never raise rates, the government couldn’t pay the interest on all those trillions. It is all an illusion. More jawboning, then more QE if the markets tank. We cannot exist on Amazon, Chinese-made goods, and illegals washing cars. Something has to give.
Ummm... well paid healthcare employees are a very small subset of the consumer base. Meanwhile, the rest of them are being impoverished by this scam.
Your post is nothing but a broken-window fallacy. Spending on wasteful beauracracy lowers the pool of funds that can be spent on true needs, lowering demand in the entire remainder of the economy. Instead of capital being spread out amongst many productive enterprises, it collects in the pockets of the politicized economy, which does NOT create jobs for these very same consumers.
So yeah, it matters a LOT.
There are no productive enterprises any more, at least, not enough for the amount of money available. This is why companies are doing share buybacks. They are essentially "investing" in their own paper yielding like what 3-5% (P/E ~27?). There is simply nothing better for them to invest all the money into.
I swear that said motor vehicles and pants - Curse my jacked up eyes! I'm sure the admin response to this is 'just think how bad it would have been'. Win.
No doubt the US might fall behind the curve.
Pods-
there is a doctor in Denver that does disc replacement
Doc Janssen is the name Center for Spinal Disorders 303 287 2800...
I need that replacement ...$60k cost
That's okay, 'cause we can just raise the minimum wage (helps like what, 1% of the working population?) and then everyone can make a living.
Until this happens:
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/china-city-hikes-minimum-wage-12-but-ma...
Gross Domestic Product. Health insurance actually contributes to this? What a loser nation.
Thanks to LOBBYISTS. Sorry for yelling. Lobbyists run the US government, son, not the other way around.
I understand your frustration but there will always be people looking out for their own interests. Corrupt politicians create the moral hazard. Lobbyists just recognize the opportunity.
Healthcare does not = Obamacare you dolts. the portion of healthcare represented by people on obamacare is, what, 6 million people out of a country of 320 million? Obamacare spending only acounts for a small sliver of that total healthcare spending.
Healthcare premiums went up across the board because of ObamaCare and that is why everyone is spending more on healthcare. Everyone I know is shocked at their new premiums, deductibles etc. in order to support the AFFORDABLE CARE ACT. There is no major medical plan anymore. You gotta have the WHOLE THING and spend out the ying yang to get it or pay the penalty. You need to reASSess your comment.
Healthcare premiums were going up well before Obamacare and continue to do so. Corporations are using Obamacare as an excuse to lower the precentage that they pay for each employee, but the graphs that have been posted here on zerohedge (I'll dig it up in a minute) try to claim that all 12 billion in healthcare expenditures in Q3 are due to Obamacare, and this is simply false. My company still pays 100% of my healthcare costs. Sorry you work for a shitty company.
And those skyrocketing premiums are due to the exact same effect as Obamacare, subsidized care in the form of government benefits.
My company pays most of my healthcare insurance costs too. Thing is, they are no longer able to fund pay raises.
Sorry for your economic illiteracy. You pay 100% of your premiums by working. It's not from the toothfairy and your non-shitty company doesn't give a damn how your compensation is spent, only the bottom line. They include health care in your compensation because it's tax preferred.
You are clearly not spending enough time in front of the Television and or no where near enough aluminum and stanous flouride in your diet. Report for re-education immediately.
Room 101 ---->
The rise in spending has increased more than before. I used to carry a Blue Cross major medical plan like millions of independent workers do. It just covers the big expenses (heart attack, surgerys etc.) It was inexpensive but protected my finances. NOW, I must be covered by a Cadillac plan with bells and whistles I will never use. I rarely went to the doctor. MY COSTS are $500 a month vis about $120 before and the bad thing is I still dont want to use my insurance because the deductible is $2000 which is more than my old premiiums for Catastrophic care plan.. This has affected millions due to the ACA. This is just one area of substantial increase. I can list plenty more areas of increase but dont feel like typing. You dont see it because you have a great plan where you work.
I'm right with you hotrod. This law is not independent worker friendly. Those old catastrophic plans were really nice.
It would have been better just to help any uninsured get a vanilla catastrophic plan but no. This is about CONTROL, CONTROL CONTROL, and growing the insurance companies profits too.
Our politicians are whores. The people who thought they were getting free health care are idiots. The MSM should be shut down cold for the helping with this fraud. The health insurance companies are greedy pigs.
Does anyone want to take any bets on the Republicans doing anything about this mess? They are as owned as the Democrats by these monied interests.
You two nailed it. The government essentially made the same products and services more expensive and far more painful given it is now a plan run and governed through the force of government. You are going to see people fined and jailed for failing to buy a product.
Take a look at any industry that has had many years of above average inflation and you will find big gov't regulations and subsidies. Housing, college, healthcare; anything they touch skyrockets.
You don't get it. Even if your company is paying the full freight for you they are spending more for the same converage. In fact, they may pay a punitive tax on top of the policy price. Even if you do not feel the pain it is there.
The country is going to pay more for the same or less healthcare. That is what is going to weigh in on the economy.
You are truly clueless and blinded by your ideological goggles. Your last sentence is boilerplate leftist arrogance.
http://www.zerohedge.com/sites/default/files/images/user5/imageroot/2014...
This chart would imply that all healthcare expeditures were Obamacare related. Eliminate Obamacare from the face of the earth and this number doesn't change that much.
I'm not saying that Obamacare is good, or making anything more affordable, but you can't just lump all money spent on healthcare into an "Obamacare" category, unless you're a mouth breathing idiot.
Sorry there chief, Healthcare is governed by Obamacare even if you are not officially enrolled on the FascistCare exchanges or taking those subsidies. This bullshit law has spread its tentacles into every facet of healthcare.
An example, I have a radiologist in my family who during a procedure was able to scan further if he saw something he thought might need further diagnosis. Under Obamacare, he is confined to a specific predetermined box. Should he need to go outside of the box he will be subject to penalty if he goes rogue. He must consult a clerk level employee for approval to schedule another procedure thereby increasing the risk to the patient and the costs. This is a complete insult to a highly competent professional.
Or take the case of a friend of my sister who is covered by her retired husband's former employer's plan. She has COPD, and the Obamacare compliant insurance policy has determined that she no longer needs her supplemental oxygen.
Healthcare is now Obamacare, period. So enjoy that shit sandwich.
In my case, it has priced me out of being able to afford health insurance. I make too much for the subsidy and not enough to pay for an overpriced policy that still leaves me responsible for 40% of the bill plus the outrageous deductible. I can only dream of affording the plans that provide decent coverage. Hell, that would be a mortgage on a really nice house.
I have to eat the penalty, and go without insurance as that is what makes the best financial sense in my case. Guess who's really paying the penalty? The businesses whose services I have cancelled or just do without. I have also noticed a marked decrease in restaurant traffic as this beast strangles our real economy.
By the insurance companies, for the insurance companies and of the insurance companies.
+1000
"Under Obamacare, he is confined to a specific predetermined box. Should he need to go outside of the box he will be subject to penalty if he goes rogue. He must consult a clerk level employee for approval to schedule another procedure thereby increasing the risk to the patient and the costs. This is a complete insult to a highly competent professional."
I could add more anecdotal evidence but this pretty much sums it up for all medical professions.
i imagine that if your radiologist relative is doing the same work on a medicaid patient that he can expand his test. when the state is paying there are few if any limits on procedures. that raises the issue, since the intent (as it see it) is to get more people on state medicaid. if you cant afford obamacare the default provider is the state. the catch is that you arent eligible for medicaid until you have exhausted the limits of your mandatory private industry policy. there are a few people who qualify directly, homeless, for instance, but the vast majority in the grey area must pay their premiums, even if the HC policy is inadaquete and they cant afford to use it. when they can no longer pay the premiums, then the private HC insurance company hands you off to medicaid, and they get to pay the bills (but only after the policy has bled you dry)
Yes, what a convoluted mess they have created. That's what you get when you have to pass it before you can see what's in it.
I have a disabled niece who is being forced onto medicaid as my brother in law is retiring, and she will no longer have access to his insurance. My sister is having a terrible time finding a GP doctor who will even accept medicaid. My understanding is that the reimbursements on medicaid are so low that you're pretty much guaranteed to get the bare minimum they can legally give you. I think a lot of them just go to the emergency room as that's the easiest place for them to go. You do not want to be on medicaid.
I'll have to ask him about his medicaid patients the next time I see him.
not sure how it works if you have a chronic problem. there are clinics in my area which provide other then ER room care but if you live in a rural area it could present serious difficulties. my mother goes to specialist through medicare, and after one or two visits they handed her off to the nurse practitioner. i believe thats the future of the system. a true story from several years ago, friend was being treated at UC, and he had a pacemaker installed. went for a followup exam, guy in a white coat walks in the room, precedes to examine him, says absently, well it seems like our pacemaker is working fine . my friend says what? the man in the lab coat says, im not a doctor i am the pacemaker salesman...
Sorry, Cowboy, but you have nailed it better than most any here and you are the poster-boy for the evil coming our way. I take no pleasure in saying that.
I do work in healthcare and this thing has tentacles and will show unbelievable unintended consequences in places no one has dreamed.
It all makes sense if you remember it is about leftist-statist control and not healthcare. It has all the arrogance and coldness that goes with it. Anyone who defends it will be telling you who and what they really are.
Only total repeal or the collapsing of the system will fix it.
Thanks FreedomGuy. I take no pleasure in being the poster-boy as it does impact my access to healthcare to say the least. It has forced me to learn how to take better care of my health in a preventative way and study how folks treated themselves before modern medicine. I also pray a lot and refuse to do anything physically risky. I almost feel like I'm living in the 19th century in the wilderness.
It's almost like those eggheads who designed this hydra either forgot about people like me, or don't want people like me to even be around.
They don't call it the F.I.R.E. economy for nuthin'.
You are owned.
Have you read the law?
No, nor do I intend to ever read it. I only observe the real effects of the law.
I will admit a certain random minority percentage of people benefit, but the vast majority have lost ground. A one size fits all behemoth cannot lead to anything good overall.
Look, dumbass. When you make the purchase of something mandatory, the people selling it got ya by the balls and can raise their prices to whatever they want......... sky is the limit. This has been true since the beginning of time.
What don't you seem to understand about that?
The weapons sold to Ukraine also added to the GDP. Off course the money was borrowed from the IMF.
Geopolitical and Bankster and MIC win
Triple polusa!!!
Have you ever typed a couple of informative posts and then deleted cause you are too disgusted with everything and so dealing with the misspellings just does not seem worth it.
That only happens when I spill bongwater on my Ipad while surfing The Hedge :-)
That only happens when I spill bongwater on my Ipad while surfing The Hedge :-)
Healthcare...thank God for Prevention, it's the most energy efficient route to take, not to mention, least expensive.
Organic, non GMO, wholesome food.
Plenty of Rest.
Exercise.
"You can pay me now, or you can pay me later"
Looks like this phony health scam system may have just been a deal to gain big profits for the healthcare industry while also working to assist the Cloward-Piven scheme of bankrupting the US and its people.
We all know on the face of it the entire Act was unconstitutional by any common-sense reading of the Constitution, not that it would stop the neo-statists from enacting it.
Voters expressed their disdain for this Act partially by turning over the Parties in Congress. I suspect the hopes of these voters will be dashed, as majority rule by 'republicans' will be the same as majority rule by 'democrats.'
Not until the US is being torn apart and people are Really Hurting will there be a move towards a Third Party.
There is a great illusion in the US over voting. You could vote in the USSR- but for only 1 Party. The scam in the US has been to create 1 Party with two slightly differing sides to maintain a false sense of Choice.
Right now, the only legal way to fight all of this is to 'go galt,' and refuse to participate as much as possible.
Make no mistake, Bath House and his Masters see Venezuela as a template for the US.
i got a nice little Republican "popularity Contest" in the mail the other day. They wanted my input on who I thought would be a good canidate, oh, and some money.
I mailed it back with the most conservative names checked, and a little "Fuck You Letter" on the back.
I let them know that I'm not too happy with boner, mcconnell, mccain and the other monsters running around on capital hill. GO TO HELL GOP.
First, it does NOT make big profits for the healthcare system. It moves money to only one place, the health insurance system. It imposes large regulatory and management costs on almost every other part of the system with it's pie-in-the-sky liberal mandates like disease management teams and possible foggy money pools, but they will not materialize.
Here is why. If a person is now paying say $6k per year in premiums with a $6k out of pocket deductible whereas it was less than half of that previously, they do not buy any more healthcare. There is no extra money for the labs, doctors' offices, or even drug companies. There is only extra money going into the insurance premium which partially comes out of other things they might have bought in healthcare. The first studies of RomneyCare show this is exactly what happened. People actually bought less healthcare.
The rest of your post is okay, but most posting here know little to nothing of healthcare. Just know it will be a monster that grows worse each year. It will be worse on the economy, on your health and will grow the police state in ways you never imagined.
Between $12k per year healthcare for my family of five, and college tuition for two of my kids who will be enrolled at the same time, I'm dead broke and have no after tax income at ALL. Keeping my business going involves long hours and paying my employees' salaries. On the other hand I could fold it up, move into the zero income bracket, join the FSA and most of this stuff would be free right? Seriously considering.
I know EXACTLY what you mean. I am trying also to keep any college loans at minimum so my kids dont graduate debt slaves to the Govt. Paying 7% to them on money that was printed. The Govt loves making all these loans to these kids and tagging them with 6-7% interest. Govt pays nothing on money loaned to them UST.
A few years back I got my first 6 figure tax bill. Within six months my wife quit and we shutdown a part-time business and fired our only W2 employee.
I had enough I was working 80 hours a week only to feed the beast. I have more free time now, never looked back.
Thanks I may follow your footsteps.
My brother (and I for that matter) were unemployed for two years. He went from a high salary to job shopping for pennies.
He took the opportunity to sit down with his kids who were approaching college and had a heart to heart about college costs. Their grades skyrocketed, and they became college grant specialists. One of them was getting flow around the country to try and sell HIM on their college.... Now he is working again but they still benefit financially from his reduced income for the last few years via grants for school.
Now if he could just train his wife into recognising that the Beaver Cleaver world is no more....
Maybe you could talk your sister in law into using a razor instead of a cleaver.
Obamacare including the massive government control pushes us significantly closer to that collectivist end point where work or at least hard work and risk no long pay off.
My suggestion to the leftist control freaks is just to print enough money so that no one has to ever work again. ;) (Some of you will get it.)
Personally, I am wondering at what point I make for the exit doors.
The proper term is 'Going Gault'... congratulations, that is the only rational path in a totally irrational system.
So you're one of those wealthy, cold-hearted business owners that only thinks of themselves, when in reality we all know "you didn't build that".
Ever feel like Dagny Taggart or Hank Reardon? Moving into the zero bracket is probably not in your DNA, but feeding this beast while you have a target on your back can't continue either.
Nice information but it is not the narrative the tribe is reporting.
This is what the sheeple get to read brought to by the Jewish run media
The Commerce Department said Friday the overall economy grew at a 2.6 percent rate in the October-December period, down from sizzling gains of 4.6 percent in the second quarter and 5 percent in the third quarter. Most forecasters had expected fourth-quarter growth of at least 3 percent.
Consumers did their part in the fourth quarter, pushing up spending by fastest rate in nearly nine years. But businesses investment, trade and government spending weakened.
Let NRA clean house
"Who is that guy, Muchkins?"
"Raul Castro's tailor. Next year, I'll be wearing a new...uniform."
"Goody!"
"By then, I will have eliminated all employment in America! Everyone will be on EBT cards, Reg! I will be In Control!"
"We've got to pass it to see what is inside it" - Nancy Pelosi... Those 10 words are the stupidest uttered since the dawn of time. She should have been taken out and executed immediately after saying them...How about reading it? you dumb cocksucker...
I prefer Joe Biden's "we've got to borrow money to make money" comment, along with his second best effort "a three letter word... J-O-B-S". we have a fucking retard that can't count to 4 in the second most important seat in the country.
She was punished with reelection which says something about where we are headed.
Dear Leader is so proud
Huge wealth transfer to health insurance companies.
1.)Any "losses" on underwriting covered by the feds through 2017?
2.)Hefty premium hikes
3.)Insurance BLOCKADE when it comes to insurance companies having to pay for medical care: High deductibles and copays which prevent the hapless insurees from ever being able to use their insurance.
How much have Humana, United Health, Aetna etc stock prices increased? Would like to see the numbers, and better yet what might be more instructive is to see if they have increased faster than the rest of the FED turbocharged S&P.
Hedge the healthcare costs, by buying the health insurance and health care stocks. I know this is zero hedge, but why zero stupid?
In the United States of Oligarchy that makes perfect sense. It is why Obama will go down in history as the Inequality President.
Wasn't the act called "The Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act"?
Definitely a sense of humour.
Oxymorons
And the "Department of Defense" is a real knee-slapper too.
The fix is in kids. Sadly there is no evidence of anyone getting it yet in my neck of the woods.
Obama's "Mission Accomplished!" moment
I would like to know who benefited from the higher prices and exactly why they needed that benefit at all.
imagine what the employment numbers would look like without all the people working in HC? next time you're at the super look at the young women in scrubs, and floor shoes, some of them still wearing their badges. and as long as they dont go to the single payer system, and the central medical records database the HC industry remains terribly inefficent.
College professors reap the rewards from the indebted young people through the pension transfer payment scheme. The indebted people must charge a lot for their services.
No way am I EVER signing up for this shit, no matter what they try and do to me. P.S. Please send me to a FEMA camp in the South where it is warm; I don't like cold weather.
www.traderzoo.mobi
You get your FEMA Camp assignment after you register with the local Health Death Panel Bureau. The warm weather assignments go for those who have "Organ Harvest" ecoded on their Homeland Security Implant chip.
Obama Macht Frei, bitchez!
FEMA camp another GDP hedonic tradeoff? you (and several thousand like you) decide to relocate (for a better job opportunity, washing dishes in the camp kitchen) that GDP number is still hanging in there.
Should insurance premiums properly be counted as "health care" ?
or "housing" ?
or "motor vehicles" ?
How are the premiums being counted?
Is the financial overhead (burden) to the economy being misleadingly under-reported
(perhaps for some political reason)?
Conversely, is the financial overhead to healthcare being under-reported or hidden?
and how do hedonics factor into consumer spending for healthcare related needs? if insurance is too expensive and you substitute organic vegetables does that mean rising healthcare costs aren't calculated in CPI? what if y ou bought a box of herbal supplements? how about going to the curandera, or a voodoo priest, instead of an AMA approved doctor? bound to be less expensive. so you see excessive HC costs are not inflationary if we apply hedonics, and the GDP number is clean.
The only 'affordable healthcare' necessary, is the relationship one has with his/her doctor, sans palm-greased 3rd parties lining up to take their unearned 'cut' of a transaction between two consenting parties. End of story.
I've been buying ammo and LifeStraws with my extra cash. You know, for when the "Votes" stop working.
Oh... wait...
Ammo, for life protection, there's another hedonic tradeoff, inflation inflation go away, come again some other day.
Obama's one moment of genius was marshalling the corporate toadies in his party to get the Progs to schlep along with "We have to pass it to see what's in it" retards plus the Pressitutes sold the sheeple on the true heart of the scam Subsized Health Insurance = Affordable Health Care
Truly the only clever thing he has done. Everything else has been living down to my dim expectations when he was a Judas on the FISA vote. I knew it was over before it even started with this guy.
Thank you for pointing out the difference between "Insurance" and "Care". We need to keep reminding the sheeple that there is not one millgram of Care in Obamacare.
No honorable mention of Bitcoin??
Thanks to O-care I recently had to pull staples out of my own head, seriously.
premiums doubled, deductibles quadrupled
I had to reset my own dislocated pinky toe. Good as new.
My friend threw his hip out of joint, and after waiting 8 hours in the emergency room that was serving all of those FSA members getting their free healthcare managed to reset it himself and hobbled out of there.
Fairy new to the 'Hedge: What is FSA?
free shit army
-
Would be nice to see the spike from ACA compared to prior, you know before they "fixed" our healthcare system. I stick to diet and exercise, and if I take a spill on the Harley I ride fast enough so the bill is for a empty can of Folgers.
Just shows that all of you Americans are a bunch of healty people.
Just like i expected.
Roberts, although I agree with many that he was being a complete ass casting his vote as he did. did leave the door open when he declared it was only constitutional as a tax. Perhaps he was looking forward to his legacy so he wouldn't be remembered as a complete douche.
Back door: Defund or eliminate Obamacare through budget reconciliation. Of course since the public re-elected the same stooges back into office (well, credit them with getting rid of the vast majority of Democrats that actually did vote for Obamacare), I don't see much hope in this happening.
58 Democratic Senators and two liberal Independents voted to pass Obamacare in 2009.
Lost and replaced by a Republican:
Sen. Mark Begich, D-Alaska
Sen. Mark Pryor, D-Ark.
Sen. Mark Udall, D-Colo.
Sen. Kay Hagan, D-N.C.
Sen. Mary Landrieu, D-La.
Russ Feingold, D-Wis.
Blanche Lincoln, D-Ark.
Arlen Specter, D-Penn.
Left Senate and replaced by a Republican:
Jay Rockefeller, D-W.V.
Max Baucus, D-Mont.
Tim Johnson, D-S.D.
Tom Harkin, D-Iowa
Ben Nelson, D-Neb.
Byron Dorgan, D-N.D.
Evan Bayh, D-Ind.
Roland Burris, D-Ill.
Left Senate and replaced by a Democrat:
Jim Webb, D-Va.
Joe Lieberman, I-Conn.
Herb Kohl, D-Wis.
Daniel Akaka, D-Hawaii
Jeff Bingaman, D-N.M.
Chris Dodd, D-Conn.
Paul Kirk, D-Mass. (appointed to replace Ted Kennedy -- seat later held by Republican Scott Brown)
John Kerry, D-Mass.
Ted Kauffman, D-Del.
Kent Conrad, D-N.D.
Sen. Carl Levin, D-Mich.
Died in office:
Robert Byrd, D-W.V
Daniel Inouye, D-Hawaii
Frank Lautenberg, D- N.J
Roberts has a chance to undo what he did, this summer
If SCOTUS strikes down subsidies, the ACA is over
Thank the lackeys who insisted gov't be prevented from using its leverage to force down medical costs when ACA legislation drafted. Asshole republicans spend a tenth the energy making it a plan that works instead of putting all their feeble brainpower into trying to find ways to wreck it, we might have a worthwhile system. Fucking congress serving as running dogs of pharma and big biz insurance companies. Don't lay that off on Obama.
Republicans are to blame for this? Although they suck, they suck much less than the other party.
Why did Democrats (I use that term loosely) overhaul 1/6th of the economy to provide Health Care for a few dozen million that didnt have it? hundreds of millions did have it and were happy with it.
It was completely unnecessary - unless you understand their real objectives which was never about Affordable Care
promise me you will drop the left right distraction when the republican congress refuses to repeal obamacare.
obamacare is a giant giveaway to the medical industrial complex(18% of the economy) both parties, all the inhabitants of dc, are responsible for. they will not bite the hand that feeds them.
people who vote for the party(whichever one) are ultimately responsible.
it doesnt distract me. I already said they both suck. i was responding to someone who blamed the ACA on Republicans which is nothing short of supporting Gruber's assessment on the average Americans intellect
agreed. unfortunately the bottom half of the class rules the world but we are all lowlife scum.
Freak, you need to check your history. I'm pretty sure that Olympia Snow might have been a Republican. She is responsible for the ACA shit sandwich.
yeah, you got a point. her vote on clouture was enough even though she didnt vote for the bill. that wasnt what the OP was referring to though, im pretty sure
You must have forgotten Jonathan gruber and how much he thinks of you.
"This bill was written in a tortured way to make sure CBO did not score the mandate as taxes. If CBO [Congressional Budget Office] scored the mandate as taxes, the bill dies. Okay, so it’s written to do that. In terms of risk rated subsidies, if you had a law which said that healthy people are going to pay in – you made explicit healthy people pay in and sick people get money, it would not have passed… Lack of transparency is a huge political advantage. And basically, call it the stupidity of the American voter or whatever, but basically that was really really critical for the thing to pass....Look, I wish Mark was right that we could make it all transparent, but I’d rather have this law than not."
http://newsbusters.org/blogs/pj-gladnick/2014/11/10/jonathan-gruber-obam...
Also it was written into the law that will compensate the big insurance for any loses via the taxpayer.
To blame the republicans for a law that not one of them voted for shows how much of a douche you are.
Loser.
hi Geruda, Glad to hear you enjoy your free medicare paid for by working americans. Medical costs would be a fraction of what they are if government would have stayed out in the first place. And I'm not talking about the AHCA...I'm talking about the early days of the road to Hell is paved with good intention programs.
You're so full of shit you don't know what you are talking about. Food could have been a lot cheaper too if corporations weren't required by gov't to make sure it was inspected, safe, not just the flesh of any dead animal that could be disguised well enough to get over on folks like you too stupid not to think big companies put you first in their hearts.
Anybody here have to pay for medical attention for their pets? i don't think animal medicine comes under the purview of ACA and it's yet another example of rapaciousness on the part of anyone who can gin up a way to take away your money. It costs you more to have your dogs broken leg reset than to send the Vet's kid to boarding school for a year.
If you want to curse Obama because your health provider thinks it's perfectly OK to charge you more to stay in a funky bed in a funky room for one night than you'd have to spend to stay in the best suite of the Hilton Hotel of your choice and $40 per aspirin then you deserve the stupidity with which you were born.
We have had loads of specialty care done for elderly dogs over the last five years. Dog neurologists, dog dermatologists, dog gastroenterologists, dog internal medicine specialists, dog urologists, dog opthamologists (yes, really), dog dentists, dog oncologists. The cost is typically one-fifth or (much) less the cost of a human medical procedure. We talked with a person in a waiting room who had just had a pacemaker put into his dog; it was $5,000 including both the machine and the vet's fees; I can assure you that the pacemaker that my cousin's husband just had put in cost ten times that much or more if you include doctor's fees. Veterinary costs are what the market will bear, when people are spending their own money. If you think vet care is expensive, you clearly haven't been paying for human care.
Chameleons UK – Monkeyland, while we watch Obama turn everything into a US taxation government feeding zoo! Leave no plantation worker behind.
/sarc
i think the only solution to the GDP gap (other than the magic of hedonics) is to make a lot of people very very sick, and heres the top scandal for 2015, the worthless flu vaccine, had it got it, and nearly died. hospitals were turning people with the flu away, as were doctors offices. pay your hard earned money for healthcare insurance, which buys you a worthless vaccine, and then you're turned away at the doctors office after you come down with the flu.
So this is 100% due to Obamacare, and 0% due to changing demographics or Americans not taking the slightest personal responsibility for their own health, etc, etc.
Or is that just the narrative that will be hammered home until it becomes 'true'...
hammered home until it becomes 'true'...
you mean like - if you like your doctor you can keep your doctor, or...the affordable healthcare act will reduce the average family's medical expenses by $2500 per year.
We can argue cause and effect all day. The fact remains that the good old USA is being strip mined by the corporate ruling class elite via political process. These people are clinically insane period. A multi trillion dollar entitlement thrown on the back of an insolvent treasury. The continuation of this system will eventually reduce this country to extreme poverty, racial rioting, and civil war. It is my belief that the true powers behind this outcome know exactly what they are doing. Mission accomplished.
You have the cart before the horse. It is the Federal Government that is strip mining the American people with the support of the Fortune 500. Gov is enemy no 1...by far. It is easy to figure that out with one simple question. Who is likely to show up at your house with guns and take your property, liberty or your life?......FedGov or a Corp Elitist?
Corp Elitists now OWN and control gov and dictate pub policy foreign and domestic.
Most Corp Elitist entities are heavily BANKSTER BACKED if not majority owned by Banksters.
There is no difference between the government and big business at this point - the government is just the muscle for the corporations. Just because Chevron and Coca Cola don't show up at your house armed doesn't mean they are the lesser of two evils.
It's become an Animal Farm.
All Health Care is equal
Some Health Care is more equal than others
yogibear,
Very astute. I tend to transition towards Lord of the Flies on this specific issue. Both are classic books.
Lord of the Flies: Ending Scene
kill piggy.
Yogibear - Yep. Back when I was doing more political publishing I talked to Marc Faber over email. I said it was looking more and more like the book "Brave New World." He said nah, it is becoming Animal Farm. From what I see to what he said back in 2009 he wins the argument.
The solution to what government itself recognizes as the "agency problem" is more agency (middle men). No wonder empires collapse....
I spent nearly 10K on prescriptions and medical care for my family last year. Five years ago I would not have spent anywhere near that, and we had 100% coverage, no deductible, and low monthly payments. Now we have 80% coverage, a 7K deductible, and much higher monthly payments. Paying for other people's medical care is expensive after all, so of course our costs went way up. Yay for medical welfare!!! /sarc
"I want to see the evidence linking this increase to the Affordable Healthcare Act. We need to be scientific about this and provide reason and evidence for all of our conclusions. This strikes me as sloppy journalism. I don't personally believe that these healthcare costs are the result of Obamacare - in fact, I believe that this increase in healthcare costs calls for even more legislation to make healthcare more affordable."
=======================
Such a post just proves the old saying, "You can't fix stupid."
My Mom-in-Law had BlueCross $2,500 deductible for $320 per month, paying 20/80.
Then Obama with his Cr*pCare cancelled it and now she has ObamaCr*pCare Bronze with a $5,000 deductible for $650 per month, paying 30/70...and just raised to $680 per month.
Affordable?
Geez! You are either zoned on drugs, had a total mind wipe or hopelessly stupid.
DK
You're stupid if you think your own personal anectode reflects the national statistics. Health costs are out of control and have been for some time, while only a fraction of Americans are enrolled in the ACA. This article is just more anti-Obama spew. Not that I'm a fan, I just don't care for propaganda no matter where it comes from.
The number of people "enrolled in the ACA" is not relevant. One of the main points of the ACA was to require all policies to be ACA compliant - not just policies bought through the exchanges. All policies now must by law cover things that didn't have to be covered before, and so most policies have become more expensive. Your ignorance is breathtaking.
Hey kids which table did this data come from... Cant find it...
Table 2.3.5 shows Housing as top dog followed closely by Healthcare. Goods spending actually dropped Q/Q. At least the way Im reading....but I did work until 6 am ...so I could be loopy.
Obiouvly you didn't stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night
Medical care was a lot cheaper prior to 1965.
Wasn't POTUS just jerking himself off about having healthcare costs not increase for the 1st time EVER last quarter during the State of the Onion address?
We had a pretty powerful senator you may have heard of named Ted Kennedy,” Gruber said during an event at Simmons College in February. ”Ted Kennedy had managed to figure out a way to rip off the federal Medicaid program to the tune of about $500 million a year through a series of strange manipulations.
Here was Mitt Romney’s dirty little secret that we don’t like to talk about in Massachusetts, which is the way we passed our law is the federal government paid for it.
http://dailycaller.com/2014/11/13/obamacare-architect-ted-kennedy-ripped...
I think the Kennedy family should be forced to sell everything they have and payback the rest of the country for paying Massachusetts healthcare via FEDERAL TAX DOLLARS.
It's only fairness in a social and economic justice world we live in eh liberals.
Does that include cigarettes and booze as your health care?
obambamcare is backdoor eugenics. most of the people who are forcedinto this tax cannot afford the deductible or the copay so they are effectively paying for something they cannot afford to use. how are the deductibles and copays being collected? are they paid upfront?
only a krugman economist would think this is good for the economy. providing an incentive for the insurance companies to charge an exorbitant price for something that is effectively unaffordable is a huge misallocation of resources but i wish i had a business that .gov mandated, under threat of financial penalty, everyone must patronize. it sure would make life easy.
the only way to reduce your healthcare costs is invest in health insurance companies.
Forget Obama, he's just a bitchass punk clown. The ACA is an extension of the IRS subsidiary of the IMF division of the UN,, a Rothschild-Windsor-Vatican-CFR corporation. Blame them with extreme prejudice.
My wife and I have a deal. We will not squander our modest nest egg on medical care.
It's the kids money now. Not ours. We're simply managing it.
Spending our entire life savings in order to squeeze a few years life out of us is insane.
But that's what the government's medical industrial complex wants. And we're not participating.
Read my post.
I'm running on low sleep, I'm still brainstorming ways to keep healthcare costs down. I have no money, got screwed with unemployment- got really sick- and just ended up curing myself because I literally had to.
It IS possible, you just have to pay attention. That's all. The research IS out there.
Cheers!
was shopping for dental floss the other day, and there is a dental hygenists tool kit, hanging on the rack. curious if it comes with instructions. it was fairly inexpensive, plan being the husband does the wife and the kids, you can save a lot. my DH gets $100 for a hour.