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Chinese Rating Agency Warns Coming Crisis Is Worse Than 2008, Blames US "Printing Press"
The head of China's Dagong Rating Agency, Guan Jianzhong, had some very blunt words for the world's investors and policymakers overnight. As ITAR-TASS reports, Jianzhong warned , "the world economy may slip into a new global financial crisis in the next few years... that is even worse than in 2008."
"I believe we’ll have to face a new world financial crisis in the next few years. It is difficult to give the exact time but all the signs are present, such as the growing volume of debts and the unsteady development of the economies of the US, the EU, China and some other developing countries," he said, adding the situation is even worse than ahead of 2008."
"The current crisis in Russia is caused by Western countries’ sanctions rather than internal factors. If we look at the US and the EU countries, their crises were caused by internal and not external factors," the president of China’s Dagong rating agency said.
"As distinct from Russia, the scope of crediting in these countries exceeded the potential for the production of goods and created a bubble.
This crisis was transmitted to the entire world through the policy of quantitative easing and the use of the printing press. All the countries had to pay for that," he said.
A setback in the growth model focused on credit-based consumption may become a source of a new crisis, he said.
"Developed countries, including the US and the EU, remain the main consumers. But these countries develop only if there is consumer demand while the main potential for this consumption is based on borrowings. The US, the EU and Japan are increasing consumption through growth in crediting, which poses a risk," he said.
Some emerging market countries have also been increasing consumption through crediting in recent years and the global economy has been based on the model that promotes consumption through funds that will be earned in the future," the head of China’s Dagong rating agency said.
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Oh god the nail gun guy or Kyle bushs x girl friend just got a new contract
"Buncha fat jap nattering nabobs of negativism"
-Spiro ("Kete") Agnew
"They all look alike"
-John Wayne
I am sure the suicide rate will rise like the stock soon
I said it before I'll say it again: All this time we thought The Fed was painting themselves into a corner, when in reality they painted every other CB in the world into a corner.
Those no good anti-semitic Chinese heathens....how dare they question our benevolent hebrew overlords?
I know, right? We might have to put the next Israel in Shang Hai.
TPTB didn't get the collapse of the USD and economy they wanted in 2008, so they have doubled down and the next time it will be a doozy...
Speak truth to psychopathy.
As FUBAR as The Fed Reserve Bank 4 Banks is, this agency should really focus on the PBOC and regional/provincial Chinese Banking entities at this point in time.
China is going to spark the next meltdown along with Japan & the EU.
now that qe stopped, it is king dollar
S&P trained them, what could go wrong?
I suggest measuring it per capita. How many Americans are there? ( including central America, since they're all citizens, now)
How many Chinese are there?
What amounts of easing occurred in per capita terms? I bet it's near even.
what is pegged to the dolla? and why are they pegged? float your shit(pigs in da river) and yea we fucked you over by printing. tough shit fucking copy cat loosers. can you smartfucks invent anyrthing? oh, yea run with the original concept(just like the guks). mindless fucks...slave labor commies, build another city, real fucking smart policy. fucking dumbest clones, yea almost 1.35 billion of ya. try exporting pollution, your fastest growing industry- pay up you possers. fuck the chinese...
As much as the virulent anti-semitism on these boards irks me, I have to confess this made me laugh.
Why do you think anti-semitism exists?
Funny story, was at a shabbos dinner at the rabbi's apartment.
This one guy was ogling a woman across the table. Knowing the rabbi's wife isn't even to be greeted with a hand shake, I felt it was odd this guy would be openly flirting at this dinner.
Plus the shot glasses the rabbi used to pour me some fine single malt was actually the smallest plastic cup ever sold.
So this guy works at the Fed. Since I'm drunk on my thimble of single malt, I ask him, "You know it's funny. Every organization humans have been a part of has had a scandal. Except the Fed. No scandals. Isn't that weird?"
He just looked at me and kept flirting.
Sorry this was off topic. There was an Asian guy at one of the dinners, but I don't think he worked for the Chinese Fed.
No Jews in China. You can't change your name from Kohn to Kerry and try to fit in.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kaifeng_Jews
Dont take it seriously. Jews are an invented people.
They sure do hate your freedoms.
Can't think why you don't invade.
And themselves.
For the low information crowd here, Chinas' central bank is printing like crazy. So is Japan and the ECB.
So pre 2008 we were exporting inflation and in this upside down world we are know exporting deflation.. interesting idea
No. The Fed and all the worlds central banks are trying to fight off the global deflation that is happening because of the US engine slowing. They have no tools against deflation except to print moar.
The only solution to global deflation is the ending of the global war on drugs. Ending it will end government deficits and reduce military spending while allowing millions to enter the workforce and pay taxes on their labor.
Plus the Marxist terrorists around they globe would not be able to lie to the meek that material equality can be found through theft.
Or if we move to wealth taxes or a flat tax, the millions of extra workers will still contribute. Forbes just had an article on how much capital outlay is being spent by these new entrepreneurs in Colorado. Money being spent! Think of it!
First, Marxism is not a political ideology or program. It’s a philosophy of science and economics or a method. Basically comprised of two interdependent elements: dialectics and historical materialism. In other words, it is a tool to analyze/view society/history, but not an instruction to how society should be. Communism and socialism existed long before Marxism.
Second, you sound like someone who thinks he is informed. So please enlighten me and name a couple of ‘Marxist terrorists’?
Lenin? Stalin? Pol Pot?
Isn't this going to moonshot oil? I mean, after the us is done with the sanctions. How does oil factor into this? It needs to be driven up or else everything is deflated. I think they have figured that out and that's why oil has finally bottomed. Or am i smoking too many blunts here and off base while i jam to my nigga tupon?
Just temporarily. The FED's waiting for their turn to unleash QE4.
Don't amyl nitrates only last a little while? Gotta pop another, and another, and another. Amyl nitrates being QE in this analogy.
At least, that's what Chloe said before she died of cancer.
Consider the source.
The Chinese ratings agency's report is not the point of this article, nor is the behaviour of China's central bank or other non-"Western" CBs. Instead, the carefully inserted point appears to be to blame Russia's economic woes squarely on sanctions, and to a lesser extent on the world's various QE programs; that is, on anything but its own government.
If it's wise to be skeptical of the MSM (mainstream media), it's surely wise to be at least as skeptical of the MSM (Moscow state-owned media).
Yea, Its a good thing the Asians are fucking idiots or I might be worried.
The only thing they are good at these days is memorizing stuff and copying western ideas. Oh and cheating their way through school.
Guess you didnt keep up on all the cheating scandals here in the USA colleges, Harvard had one not too long ago.
OK, you must be living in a box or something with no immediate connection to reality. ‘Ideas’ are always copies – there are no atomized (independent) ideas. All thinking, innovation and ideas are created on the shoulders of others. The language (concrete or symbolic) used to generate ideas is created by generations – it’s a (should be a) common property. The whole copyright, trademark and patent paradigm is basically theft of our common property. No one should ‘own’ any knowledge.
But what irritate me the most about your obviously ignorant and Eurocentric comment is the idea, that it is the East that’s ‘stealing’ ideas from the West. Gunpowder, fiat currencies, paper, printing, rubber, Daoism/Confucianism (and the state building that followed – almost 300 years before the ‘Westphalian’ state-system of Europe), silk etc. etc. are innovations of the East. But it doesn’t matter – all innovations and all knowledge belongs to humanity at large (and not the ‘masters’ who have brainwashed you to think otherwise).
You're so witty! You crack me up.
china down grading the us. does that mean all the chineese oligarchy will pull money out of the us? hope that means i see less chineese colledge kids driving supercars in orange county.
Those kids better be careful, cops here love to seize stuff.
Nothing lasts Forever..... even cold November Rain.
How long does death last?
186,000 MPS is how long death lasts. Milestones
that's really en-light-ening.
Until your next incarnation.
longer than you got
howbout purple rain
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AuXK8ZbTmLk
Nothing lasts Forever..... even cold November Rain.
Sad truth is we didnt even get started yet.
Man the Chinese listen to Limbaugh too. FireBrander get on top of that! The racist Chinese are taking his advice. Burn China to the ground. FireBrander!!
That would be Mr. Chang Limbang, the resident Chi-com of the show.
Ever wonder why the US Libs never use the race card against say, Putin?
What is
"because as fucking communists, they would never chide the person they have sworn their allegience to?"
is the race card better or worse than the nazi card?
They call him Hitler don't they?
News flash China.you best worry bout your own credit issues..fucking hypocrites
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/2014/06/01/can-this-be-good-china-...
If it wasnt for that fucking ass hole Clinton giving way the store ...youd still be flat on your coomunist ass...btw, we consider hacking of entities like Anthem to be an act of War
Fuck you China....best STFU while you still can
HAHAHA! LOSER.
HAHAHAHAHAHHAHA! IDIOT (to me or you)!
You smell like Hasbara.
Notice has been given warmonger.
What you going to do? You going to write a scathing comment?
you smell like you take cologne showers you fucking peasant fuck...
OR MAYBE you smell like MOIS ........you fucking douche bag
Wauw, what a sophisticated and well written rebut! Your intellectual capacity and the depth of your arguments sets a new and higher standard for the debate on ZH.
I can see that all your posts share the same standard!
May the light of your mind illuminate the masses!
China is sooooo scared of guys like you.
good ol' China... always willing to point a finger not realizing three are pointing back at them when they do...
"chinese accounting"
"chinese audit"
ror
Looking up the wrong Bush - That would be Kurt Busch.......
Guan Jianzhong must be reading Zero Hedge. In fact, isn't he William Banzai?
Now all your base belong to us.
No, but all the Chinese gold will belong to us as soon as the Yuan un-pegs and the POG in Yuan soars. The Chinese will be selling their gold just to stay solvent, forget adding to their stacks.
I, for one, am encouraged that the Fed has a plan to protect our interests. Can you imagine a world without petrodollars?
Bring the gold home!
A fool's ramblings, nothing more.
Zero_Head:
Speaking of a fool's ramblings, the only fool(s) I seee on this thread are the idiots who don't know satire when they see it, a la Million Dollar Bonus.
So here we go again, a bunch of dumb shits taking the obvious satire seriously and not just downvoting it, but actually getting worked up into a tizzy over it.
To you and the others who are Zero_Brains, please contain yourselves so you don't continue to make fools of yourselves . . .
-30-
I think the fool is serious, what did he/she call you on the batphone to say it was humor, pffft
Unix:
GFY.
"American Liberal" posting on ZH with obvious liberal BS . . . and you can't grasp the blatant satire of the entire package . . .
Dumb ass.
-30-
Lets be fair. satire in pure text form is hard to pull off, and we're not professionals. Most who try it fail, and that's why the whole '/s' thing came about. It doesn't help that the world has gone insane and what once would have been obvious satire is now actual policy. That said, I vote MDB king of ZH.
maybe one satirical text comment from one central banker to another started this whole thing.
Damn do I miss Francis Sawyer.
ok, i will take that under advisement, i do see real liberals posting stuff here, but how is one to really know? i do like the /s, even maybe in his nick - that would really help lol
and please do gfu too, heh
Serious fools don't post on ZH. We only draw the frivolous fools.
The problem with AmericanLiberal's posts is that, if they are serious they are stupid, and if they are satire they are not funny. So down-arrow in any case.
The Chinese tend to think just slightly ahead of such moves AL, but carry on...
A couple of things you may have missed.
1: No sane person would exchange any physical asset for paper promises, unless said paper was imposed on them under the threat of violence.
2: The Fed doesn't give a shit about 'our' interests, just their own.
Just trying to help.
you still dont' understand mercantilism. free trade is a myth created by the winners of wars.
free trade is enforced at the end of a gun barrel to keep ports open. if china disobeys the u.s. in any meaningful way, she will see many of her export markets closed off to her and with her swelling and massive population, adn extraodinary amounts of debt, she will have a narrative to deal with that inevitably results in the replacement of her oligarchs, or rather, in a blood bath by them of the chinese people.
either way, the oligarchs are happy to delay that day of reckoning as they continue to beef up their industrial base and tech sector in preparation for the next great war.
all peace time growth is temporary. physical assets will be exchanged for paper so long as thos ein charge deem fit. they don't necessarily give a shit about 'china' or 'america' or any other bullshit narrative. oligarchs first job is to worry about retaining their own power.
I find it interesting the hopium from Afghanistan was exported ( in anthrax coated goat hides and planes) to Russia and the northeast USA, but not China.
Gun boat diplomacy, coupled with free hopium, can break the back of a citizenry faster than obesity. But China wasn't the focus? Makes me wonder.
bwahaahahahahahahhahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaarg! another lost soul AND mind, oh well. AL, you need more kool-aid
Beat head on wall; for even reading such a comment!
Jeesh.....
The force is strong in this one, or a troll...
I'm confused...I thought ratings wars had to do with TV and radio.
Has Holder filed the lawsuit yet?
No, but Obama has written an executive order.
"We Executive Ordered Some Folks"
"We Executive Ordered Some Folks"
Dow 20,000...
And more! Remember the PPT is on our side.
Now that sounds more sarcastic. Don't forget Rule 48, can't have it going down too sharply now, can we?
in a few weeks, now worries. it's called hyper-inflation and that's what happens when you print a few trillion and it has no place to go.
It's hard to get any inflation when you buy paper that's worth zero. Yes, you've printed to buy an asset you put on your books. But if the asset is worth zero that printed money is gone.
Yes, the bank that sold to the Fed got that dollar. But they are also buying things worth zero like facebook and twitter.
Will they be fined $1.5B like S&P for these terrorist statements? lmao.
So I would read this as BULLISH!!!
well fuck ya never give a banker a printing press
AAA-rated full faith and credit baby! If you say otherwise we sue first and invade second.
Got to make more ammo now. thanks for the laughs!
"Next few years"? Howbout 2015!
The cliff looks far away, but we're in a Lamborghini.
"It all happened so fast."
Don't discount the power of the printing press to hide the obvious cancers.
It may be months but proably years and maybe longer. That doesn;t change the fact that the end of fractional reserve and fiat currency is coming.
Next few years is probably right. But until the very moment it happens, bang the fkn markets higher every day. Never worry today about what might happen tomorrow.
huh? china is waking up to reality? man strange world when russia, china and greece are closer to reality than the west. the bizzaro world is taking over.
This is just more propoganda from the Chinese communist bastards. Thank god Goldman Sachs is doing "God's Work" and keeping us all employed and out of the finanacial shit. How else are we going to pay for stuff if we don't have paper money? Barter, gold & silver, don't make me laugh. Well answer that Mr Fucking Guan, you communist fuckwit!
Yours sincerly,
Warren Buffett
P.S. And also be glad that we have independent and reputable rating agencies not like those Commie state-controlled ones.
Warren..
China is a production ponzi... Am economy based upon neomercantilism. The US is a consumption ponzi. There's 1 and only 1 semi stable solution to the mess...
perfect result of a ping pong game to stop the mayhem in Nam.
The US Oligarchs love going from one type of mayhem to another. Its the only game they know.
Not exactly. As long as China depends on the Middle East for oil, and that oil sells for dollars, everyone is happy. But what if the Islamic State takes over the whole Middle East and denominates oil in gold?
Isis came out of nowhere, and as soon as Assad is removed, a US puppet is installed in Damascus, and the gas pipeline through Syria is guaranteed, Isis will evaporate faster than an ice cube in the Arabian desert.
Why don't you do something meaningful like dump all ust's and publicly condemn the us's involvement in Ukraine/Russia? Until then, shut your stinky chinky ass up mother fuckers and go eat some rice.
Gold is still low and available. China does nothing until one of those attributes changes.
A notable omission in Jack Ryan Shadow recruit. Watched it again cuz I'm sick and laid up.
Same plot as today, but no mention of China or gold. Just Russia and America gamesmanship.
China is using USTs to buy Gold.
Aside from that, they avoid direct confrontation and prefer diplomacy and negotiating.
Somebody speaks the truth and he gets put down.
We in the Western world have never been taught how to recognize truth as we were lied to since infants, from Santy and the Easter Bunny to learning how great the Constitution is which government ignores, how bad torture is, except the CIA does it to Obama's shutting down Gitmo, one big effing lie.
You forgot religion.
Preparing everyone for surveillance given the invisible man in the sky who even knows what you are thinking.
And I thought NSA were bad!
Regardless what a person's opinion of religion and the big invisible man in the sky may be, the majority of religions everywhere stress loving God, loving neighbor, not stealing, not murdering, not screwing around with someone's wife, not desiring to keep up with the jones and not lying about what someone has done or didn't do.
It seems our governments and many of the citizens have a problem with a few of these precepts as they cannot hold to them.
A government that loves its people wouldn't squander their taxpayers coin for the likes of a CIA, Nukes, or put them into a position the little people haven't got much hope for any kind of future.
loving neighbor? what about crusades, djihad, etc.? I upvoted your 1st comment but had to downvote the 2nd one
It all started with that fucking baby Kevin Costner who just had to build that so-good-it-must-be-Hollywood ballpark with state of the art lighting just so he could talk to his fuckin' dead Dad.
If you didn't like the sandlot before, you better learn to love it now.
The dogmas of the foolish past are inadequate to the stormy present. Dey best disenthrall demselves lickity-split!
So the Chinese watched that movie and built al the ghost cities? "If you build it, they will come"
More like the Americans convinced themselves and everybody else of it (even Dubai!) and the Chinese bought it and built (most of) it. The rest was on the backs of the usual slave suspects (poor men from the greater region). I'll bet the Chinese even know the movie too.
Sweet piece of work from the Ministry of Props. The "dream" was all an AMERICAN DREAM. Just look at the architecture. Remember Tiger's 20 Million check for a course to nowhere in the deserts of Araby, or Brad Pitt's island off Dubai shaped like Missouri or Iraq or some fucking thing?....... Well?
The USS Titanic is unsinkable!
When you hear crap like that, it's time to book a flight instead.
All bullshit.
Fact is China and Russia too enjoyed their easy printed money from west.
Those jokers."saved" them in US instead of distributing them to their own people, thus creating this crisis.
If today they withdraw the money then value of Dollar will drop like stone.
They know and so, they do it very slowly, thus perpetuating the crisis.
China and Russia could do what Japan did in 70s, buy billion dollar children's paintings from USA to balance the trade. After all most US production was also stolen by China.
Stop blaming US alright.
Given the US's global hegemon status over the past couple of decades it is pretty safe to say that nobody stole anything that wasn't being given away. Figure that one out and, duh, duh, duuuh. It ain't good for the US. Treason rarely is.
And when our hegemon ends, whose hegemon will you accept? Russia's, China's? Europes? Hell ALL governments can go straight to hell
That I think is the answer to all our problems.
We do not need a Government. Without a Government some believe Corporations will control the world.
But the truth is that without a Government to enforce Copyright and Patents, the world will be much more vibrant and innovative.
you are correct except that the chinese didn't steal shit. the rockefellers planned this out and financed the technology transfer as it made them a ton of money in doing so.
same as ford sending factory plans and engineers both to germany and soviet russia preww2. ITS JUST BUSINESS until your debtors cannot pay up. then it's war!
Oh, I'm definitely selling every long equity position on this "news". HahahahHaha
Must be a former ghost city architect.
One more thing. If China is so powerful, how come I've never bought anything INVENTED there. Ok, so Americans with big ideas go to china to produce their stuff on the cheap, factory workers get paid peanuts while the American makes millions.
How exactly does the US lose in this arrangement?
Ever watched fireworks on the 4th? Ever shot a gun? Ever worn a silk shirt? Ever read a newspaper? Ever used a compass? Like booze? For whom the bell tolls? Gonna be buried in a coffin? There are a couple more but chances are you've never heard of those either.
The Arabs didn't give us much either... ;-)
The Arabs, like the Egyptians, Libyans, Malians, Yemeni, Turkish, Persian and Palestinian people are under military occupation by a religious/political terror regime. It was that organization, not the Libyan people, who went to war with the United States in 1784-6 due to our lack of submission to their religion.
The fact Arabs also were at a crossroads of Asian and European minds doesn't mean they created algebra as some inherent aspect of their racial being. Hell, calculus was discovered in two different spots at nearly the exact same time.
I don't give a people credit for their forefathers inventions. It's how we, as living beings, use them.
so what have they done lately? NADA...who the fuck cares!
Apple factory slaves. Merikans love their Apples.
That's right!! America's full of "knowledge workers" -- got so many it has to employ them as bar tenders and at checkouts.
I suppose it is just possible that when you export all your manufacturing, the young engineers in those foreign factories gradually learn all the technology of the things they are manufacturing, and they (not you) learn how to improve the manufacturing process and how to design major improvements in what they are producing -- maybe just like the Japanese did after WWII. And then they start inventing new things based on the practical knowledge they have gradually acquired. Might take a few decades of course.
Meanwhile, back in the good ol US, those bartending knowledge workers will be thinking up all sorts of new technological ideas.
Didn't they invent fiat currency?
In the aggregate citizens of both nations lose. One group works as slaves with suicide nets around the factory while the other group watches their factories decompose. One has ghost cities- the other ghost factories. One has savings- the other mountains of debt. In the end the citizenry who is solvent will probably overtake the one who is insolvent.
The funny thing about those who have profitted from the U.S. middle class is they have not figured out they have shot themselves in the foot. Yes middle classes are growing in the East and South but not at a rate needed to fill the hole left by the American consumer. Also how did those in the East and South become middle class. Didn't their rise have something to do with the level of disposable income in the West.
So by not sharing in the wealth and keeping their workers salaries flat they have killed demand- the very thing that made them profits.
Just off the cuff, if you have ever owned anything that contains gun powder, or a gun for that matter, you have bought something invented there. Second, you got it EXACTLY correct. Chinese factory workerS get paid peanuts (while the American factory worker is unemployed) while THE American (not Americans) makes millions.....
Starting to see how the US loses in this arrangement?
Were all here discussing what government types have to say.
Government is the problem, FFS. No point looking to government to fix things.
Good government is an oxymoron.
Yeah but no matter how loud you scream that government is going to try to fix things and "accidentally" make it worse. Or is that try to make it worse and accidentally fix things? Either way, there will be more government waiting on the other side with more solutions.
Yes, but freedom from government is a fantasy.
Some days I like how our condo association psychopaths handle our declining complex /unit value by increasing our costs/ regime fees.
(Those are the days they go to visit relatives who don't like them either.)
WWLSD...What would Left Shark Do!
Thats right, just make shit up and hope no one notices Amerika
Dude doesn't know shit.
"Bang Dagong,
Get it on,
Bang Dagong."
Fuck the lying Chimps!
Yeah, but what is the actual failure mechanism? In 2008, You had an electronic version of a classic bank run after Lehman went under. If you want to talk about a future collapse, you should postulate a failure mechanism. The system won't go down unless at least one of these things happens.
-- a big bank run, either electronic or classic
-- a major financial institution becomes unable to make required payments (insolvency alone is not sufficient. Payments is where the rubber meets the road)
-- a major currency hyperinflates
-- a major currency hyperdeflates in a NIRP death spiral, where all currency units are taxed away by rapidly increasingly negative interest rates.
-- foreign powers change the system, which pulls the rug out from under other countries.
-- major world war
Excellent question, even Lehman went under not because of leverage as such or bad loans as such but becaues of "market failure" when banks were required to square their positions every night and mark to market in a volatile environment and suddenly counterparties started failing and capital vanished from the entire system. It was an acute and temporary problem that killed Bear Stearns and Lehman, the systemic problems were much, much worse at AIG and Citibank, and they survived, sort of. Not to mention the damnfools at BofA picking up Countrywide and Merrill Lynch and not knowing what they were stepping into, and then TBTF stepped in and that was the problem, nothing in the underlying economics. Since Greenspan and Long Term Capital, preventing the banksters from taking losses has been the problem, not the solution.
Therefore that will probably be the form of our destructor, that or the Sta-Puft Marshmallow Man.
Chris Christie is going to be our destructor?
Fuck, that's going to stink!
Is it time for the 'Dead whale on the beach' meme yet?
Great Ghostbusters reference!!
I often use the same reference in my head when I'm trying to figure out what is going to be the catalyst for the next collapse.
Really funny that someone else out there is as weird as me....
Unfortunately I suspect it will be option three (major currency hyperinflates) followed quickly by option six (major world war)
Just located some shotshell reloading powder. Hard to come by these days.
Ah yes, the ChiComs have been practicing Jeffersonian and Jacksonian governance since the Great Leap Forward.
More old thinking in China, they're still working on capitalism but we've moved on.
BARTENDER
"A round of denial for everyone. On me."
(aside) the poor suckers don't realize that the only solution to the global financial crisis is a ruinous dose of Orwellology. Sad.