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Guest Post: How Vaccine Hysteria Could Spark A Totalitarian Nightmare
Authored by Lee Hieb, M.D., originally published at World Net Daily, via Alt-Market blog,
Gov. Chris Christie has been vilified for making a very simple statement – that parents (and presumably patients themselves) should have the freedom to choose whether to vaccinate their children. I have been asked for years what I thought about vaccination, so let me lay out the issues.
Before getting into the science, lets discuss the philosophy:
1. The voices shrieking to forcibly vaccinate people are the same voices shrieking to support a woman’s right to choose abortion under Roe v. Wade. If a woman’s body is sacrosanct, if she has the right to choose to deliver a child or not, if she has total authority over her body, how can she not have the right to accept or refuse a vaccination?
2. Medical ethics are clear: No one should be forced to undergo a medical treatment without informed consent and without their agreement to the treatment. We condemn the forced sterilization of the ’20s and ’30s, the Tuskegee medical experiments infecting black inmates and the Nazi medicine that included involuntary “Euthanasia,” experimentation and sterilization. How can we force vaccination without consent? Vaccination is a medical treatment with risks including death. It is totally antithetical to all ethics in medicine to mandate that risk to others.
3. Science is never “concluded.” Mr. Obama and other ideologues may think the truth is finalized (“The science is indisputable”), but the reality is our understanding of disease and treatment are constantly being updated. Just like Newton’s mechanical paradigm of the universe was supplanted by Einsteinian physics, and physicists today modify that view, medical “truth” is not the truth for long. In an attempt to quantify change in medicine, years ago a cardiology journal discussed “The Half-life of Truth.” cardiologists looked back in their journal at 20-year-old articles to see how much of what was believed then was still believed to be true. The answer? 50 percent. So in cardiology, at least – and in all of medicine to greater or lesser degree – only half of what we believe now will still be true in 20 or so years. The last word on vaccination is not in. It hasn’t even begun to be written.
4. If you believe absolutely in the benefit and protective value of vaccination, why does it matter what others do? Or don’t do? If you believe you need vaccination to be healthy and protected, then by all means vaccinate your child and yourself. Why should you even be concerned what your neighbor chooses to do for his child – if vaccination works? The idea of herd immunity is still based on the idea that in individual cases vaccines actually are protective.
5. If you think the government has the right to forcibly vaccinate people – for the good of society – what is to prevent them from forcibly sterilizing people, or forcibly euthanizing people, or forcibly implanting a tracking device – for the good of society? You make think those examples are extreme (although two-thirds have happened), but the principle is the same. You are allowing government to have ultimate authority over your body.
So, I’ve been asked, “Why not vaccinate your children? Why not take the influenza vaccine?” Well, I believe the choice is up to you. I’ve covered my thinking about the influenza vaccine in an article in the Journal of the Association of American Physicians and Surgeons, available online, but here are some facts about childhood vaccines that make me think twice about their use. I traced these points back to the source, so these are not blindly reprinted from hearsay Internet articles. In some cases I found public references to be wrong but the data to be correct when I got to the source. Much of this comes from government reporting. Anyone can research disease incidence by reading MMWR (Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report) from the CDC and accessing the search engine for VAERS (Vaccine complication reporting site) at http://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/index.php.
1. Since 2005 (and even before that), there have been no deaths in the U.S. from measles, but there have been 86 deaths from MMR vaccine – 68 of them in children under 3 years old. And there were nearly 2,000 disabled.
2. In countries which use BCG vaccinations against tuberculosis, the incidence of Type I diabetes in children under 14 is nearly double. (“Infectious Disease in Clinical Practice” no. 6 pages 449-454, 1997)
3. As reported in Lancet in 1995, inflammatory bowel disease (i.e. Crohn’s and ulcerative colitis) is 13 times more prevalent in persons vaccinated for measles.
4. In a nested case-control study within the General Practice Research Database (GPRD) in the United Kingdom, patients who had a first MS (Multiple Sclerosis) diagnosis recorded were compared with controls. The authors concluded that immunization with the recombinant hepatitis B vaccine is associated with a threefold increased risk of developing MS (Hernan et al., 2004). No increased risk of MS was associated with other vaccines, which included tetanus and influenza vaccinations.
5. In 1982 William Torch, a prolific researcher and publisher on Neurologic topics, presented a paper (later published) at the American Academy of Neurology reviewing SIDS deaths. He reported that in 100 consecutive cases, 70 percent of SIDS deaths occurred within three weeks of pertussis vaccination. In very convincing confirmation, a Japanese prefecture stopped vaccinating after associating SIDS with the pertussis vaccine. It is worth reading the entire description from Viera Scheibner, PhD:
In 1975, about 37 Crib Sudden Deaths were linked to vaccination in Japan. Doctors in one prefecture boycotted vaccinations, and refused to vaccinate. The Japanese government paid attention and stopped vaccinating children below the age of 2 years. When immunization was delayed until a child was 24 months of age, Sudden Infant Death cases and claims for vaccine related deaths disappeared. Japan zoomed from a high 17th place in infant mortality rate to the lowest infant mortality rate in the world when they stopped vaccinating. Japan didn’t vaccinate any children below the age of 2 years between 1975 and 1988, for 13 years. But then in 1988, Japanese parents were given the choice to start vaccinating anywhere between 3 months and 48 months. The Ministry study group studied 2,720 SIDS cases occurring between 1980 and 1992 and they established that their very low SIDS rate quadrupled.
6. A mail survey was done of 635 children in the Netherlands in 2004. German measles and whooping cough (pertussis) were twice as common in unvaccinated children. However, throat inflammations, ear infections, rheumatologic complaints, seizures and febrile convulsions were much more common in the vaccinated group. Aggressive behavioral episodes were eight times more frequent in vaccinated children, and sleep disordered more often. Tonsils were removed in 33 percent of children who had been vaccinated vs. 7.3 percent unvaccinated.
7. In 1947, the first reports of brain inflammation and chronic brain damage, including death, after pertussis vaccination began to be published (Brody, 1947; Byers and Moll, 1948, Low, 1955, Berg, 1958; Strom, 1960, 1967; Dick, 1967, 1974; Kuhlenkampff, 1974; Stewart, 1977, 1979). But it took more than 40 years of collective evidence before academic medicine decided it was true –1981 National Childhood Encephalopathy Study (NCES) and in 1991 and 1994 by the Institute of Medicine, National Academy of Sciences.
In 1991, after reviewing vaccine safety, the Institute of Medicine admitted, “In the course of its review, the committee encountered many gaps and limitations in knowledge bearing directly or indirectly on the safety of vaccines. These include inadequate understanding of the biologic mechanisms underlying adverse events following natural infection or immunization, insufficient or inconsistent information from case reports and case series, inadequate size or length of followup of many population based epidemiologic studies [and] few experimental studies published in relation to the number of epidemiologic studies published.”
So the next question is: Does vaccination work? Does it really protect you against disease? The answer is variable. Smallpox vaccine seems to be nearly universally protective against the very fatal disease of smallpox, and use of vaccine led to the eradication of the disease in the wild. But the dirty little secret in recent outbreaks of mumps, measles and pertussis is – they are occurring in vaccinated people in highly vaccinated populations!
In 2006 an epidemic of mumps broke out in my state of Iowa. Ultimately, 11 states reported 2,597 cases of mumps. The majority of mumps cases (1,487) were reported from Iowa. As reported in “Mumps Epidemic – Iowa, 2006,” “Despite control efforts and a highly vaccinated population, this epidemic has spread across Iowa and potentially to neighboring states.” According to the CDC, “During the prevaccine era, nearly everyone in the United States experienced mumps, and 90 percent of cases occurred among children, although 97 percent of children entering school in Iowa had received two doses of MMR vaccine. ” Of note, this outbreak mostly occurred in young adults of college age who had received the vaccine. Only 6 percent of those affected were known to be unvaccinated, 12 percent received one dose of MMR vaccine, 51 percent had two doses of MMR vaccine, and 31 percent (mostly adults) were not sure of their immunization history.
In 2008-2009, Australia had epidemics of whooping cough and measles. Health authorities there must reveal the vaccination status of children in epidemics. Eighty-four percent of Australian children who got whooping cough were fully vaccinated, and 78 percent who got measles had record of measles vaccination.
In the 2010 outbreak of whooping cough in California, well over half the victims were fully vaccinated.
Whooping cough continuously declined in the U.S. from over 100,000 cases in 1922 to around 1978 when 2,063 cases were reported. That year, pertussis vaccine became mandated for school attendance. Beginning around 1995, when the U.S. had 5,137 cases, the incidence has increased, to 2012 when over 48,000 cases were reported, including 20 deaths. The majority of deaths were in newborns under three months of age. Why is this happening? It is not because people are not becoming vaccinated. The CDC says more than 84 percent of children under 3 years old have been vaccinated with four doses of pertussis vaccine. But the current vaccine does not include all strains of pertussis. And the most vulnerable to the disease – the small infants – are not able to take the vaccine. Since older children and adults are much less likely to die of whooping cough, the question that must be asked is this: Is vaccination effective in producing antibody transfer from mother to infant? Or is it better to allow the natural disease to occur?
Finally, it turns out that death and disability from many childhood diseases is preventable by means other than vaccination. Vitamin A has been known since the 1930s to reduce mortality from measles by 60 percent. Vitamin D is protective against viral illness. And numerous authors and studies have shown the damaging effects of chemical antipyretics (fever lowering drugs) on the natural course of disease – a practice still sadly in widespread use in America. Better understanding of disease mechanisms, utilizing nutritional support and better scientific care of the sick child are safer alternatives to widespread vaccination.
Perhaps one of the best perspectives on the whole vaccination paradigm is provided by Dr. Harold Buttram, M.D., FAACP:
As one of today’s senior citizens who grew up in a Midwestern state in the 1930s, and as a doctor who has treated many children, I may have a special vantage point of time and experience in regard to the changes that have taken place in the health of America’s children since the relatively innocent times of the 1930s. At summer camps in the New Mexico Mountains that I was fortunate to attend, no boy had allergies, none was on medication, and no boy was ever sick with the common ailments of today. It was much the same in schools. I don’t recall ever seeing a child with easily recognized behaviors now described as hyperactivity (ADHD) or autism.
Today in stark contrast, approximately one-third of our youngsters are afflicted with the 4-A Disorders (Autism, ADHD, Asthma, and Allergies), as described and documented by Dr. Kenneth Bock. School budgets are being strained to the breaking points in providing special education classes for autistic and learning disabled children. Allergy problems are proliferating, as indicated by long lines of children at school nursing stations for their noontime medications.
Could today’s infant and childhood vaccine programs, with their steadily increasing numbers of vaccines, be a contributory cause of this ominous health trend? As reflected in the U.S. Congressional Hearings (1999 to December 2004) on issues of vaccine safety, in which major deficiencies in vaccine safety testing were disclosed, it is a real possibility that vaccines may be one of the major, if not the major cause of this trend.
I, too, am old enough to remember these times. We are changing the pattern of disease, but not necessarily making our children nor ourselves healthier. We are converting benign childhood disease into more severe adult disease. Consider the chickenpox vaccine. We used to have chickenpox parties where small children were purposely exposed to kids sick with chickenpox. In those days, every mother or grandmother knew it was safer for toddlers to get the disease early and not wait until teenage years. Now we vaccinate, but of course that vaccine is only effective for 15-20 years, so now adults must constantly be revaccinated or run the risk of getting a life-threatening severe form of chickenpox. The shingles uptick is directly attributable to the lack of re-exposure of older people to the wild chickpox virus. But not to worry – the drug companies can sell us a shingles vaccine for a disease their previous vaccine created.
We have forgotten that for most normal children, childhood diseases are benign. As recounted about mumps in the Iowa Department of Public Health Manual, “it is more common in infants, children and young adults. Of people who are not immunized, >85 percent will have mumps by adulthood, but symptoms may have been mild and therefore not recognized.”
At the end of the day, the issue here is one of freedom, and freedom is the freedom to choose – even if we make a bad choice. The argument that I must vaccinate my children for the good of the community is not only scientifically questionable, it is an unethical precept. It is the argument all dictators and totalitarians have used. “Comrade, you must work tirelessly for the good of the collective. You must give up your money and property for the good of the collective, and now … you must allow us to inject your children with what we deem is good for the collective.” If American’s don’t stand up against this, then we are lost. Because we have lost ownership of ourselves. Our bodies are no longer solely ours – we and our children are able to be commandeered for the “greater good.”
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If you believe in god, no vaccines for you. We don't want to be depriving god from picking winners and losers, do we? Got sick? God's will apparently. It's your time! Appendicitis bothering you? Here, have some holy water and pray for anesthesia. Don't believe in evolution? Well, with the immune system being a product of evolutionary development, you don't need vaccines either. Why bother strengthening something you never had to begin with.
And there you have it, ladies and gentlemen! 3/4 of the country need not even have this discussion!
As for me? I'm all for vaccines. I think all politicians should be vaccinated with Ebola... no not against Ebola - you read it right. With most of them not willing go against religion or question intelligent design, there is no need to be protecting them from diseases either.
We pick to win by believing in God or lose by not believing
My AK, AR, and Glock are my syringes for immunization against the criminal, Unconstitutional, and Zionist wardog, the DC US, that is occupying, and oppressing, the American people, and country.
The banksters need to repay us.
They are also my payment of all fiat debts, "public, and private."
When the bullet of papillomavirus that was injected up your ass starts to run wild, I guess those weapons will be sooo useful. I heard of praying the disease aways. Your methods are just novelty.
Injection are always supposedly for the good but after seeing constant injections of capital, liquidity and loans into the economy, I can't say these things are safe.
Personally, I do not recall anyone becoming sick from vaccinations when I was much younger but I do have a suspicion that something has been happening to make injections a lot more unsafe.
In the case of measles it turns out that the vacination didn't provide the lifetime immunity they claimed. In the 80's you had a breakout of measles which infected previously vaccinated people. So, basically they made the dose stronger and urged a second one. I'm sure autism is not related because the folks that claimed you had lifetime immunity from the first vaccination could never be wrong.
Your perceptions are NOT wrong. While all vaccines undergo rigid testing before being allowed on the market, there is a very critical missing step. Doctors guidelines allow up to 8 vaccines to be given in the same day. But there have never been any tests done as to the potential interactions of multiple vaccines injected at the same time. Are certain vaccines compatible together and others to be avoided on the same day? Nobody really knows because the research has never been done. What is the reasonable vaccine load that a 6-month old infant can handle (taking into account both the vaccine components, as well as the additives such as Thimerisol, aluminum and other chemicals and biological material)? Nobody knows because the research has not been conducted. What is the optimum spacing between vaccines for a normal, healthy child? This is also not known. There is the recommended CDC schedule, but it is not based on research. It is based on an artificial schedule of needing to get all these vaccines into kids before they start school. What about children that are in some way immune system compromised? How should the vaccine schedule be modified? There are no allowances made for this by the CDC because there is no acknowledgement that there might be some impact on the immune system due to too many vaccines given in too short a period of time. But there has never been any research done to validate this position.
Since the 1970s, the number of vaccines children receive before starting school has quadrupled. Over the same period of time there has been a similar explosion in the incidence of Autism, ADHD, Allergies and Asthma, but we are assured by the medical authorities that there is no correlation between the increase in vaccines and the increase in these childhood diseases.
so if you heard about an outbreak of
bubonic and pneumonic plagueyou wouldn't get the vacination?
Maybe not. Why do you care what I do, if you have yours?
If it comes right down to it, we all have choices, even if it affects others. If I so choose, I can drink and drive. Free choice --regardless of the impact on the rest of society.
But, just like drinking and driving, if you don't get vaccinated, you open yourself up to being sued for damages by those impacted by your "free choice". I can also see a time where if you're not vaccinated --for your own safety and the safety of others-- you will not be allowed into the hospital.
If you really believe what you are saying, then you should be well protected from those who choose not to be vaccinated. So what is your complaint? That you can't force your will upon others?
Yes and i should be able to sue them if i or my son get an adverse reaction to the shot but i cant.
proximately one-third of our youngsters are afflicted with the 4-A Disorders (Autism, ADHD, Asthma, and Allergies), as described and documented by Dr. Kenneth Bock. School budgets are being strained to the breaking points in providing special education classes for autistic and learning disabled children. Allergy problems are proliferating, as indicated by long lines of children at school nursing stations for their noontime medications.
the author hits on something very very important.
in modern america, children are increasingly sick. we have brought down infant mortality only to create a world of sick kids, and of helpless parents teachers and doctors who know nothing more than to watch the symptoms get worse and do as they are told by drug companies , plantiffs lawyers, and psychotherapists who can get their kid suspended from school or worse.
much of the reason kids have these problems is a group of issues that have to do with both the actual environment changing ( food patterns, particulate patterns, vaccinations, staying inside all day, video games , a social behavior )
and the the changing responses of people to their kids problems ( we medicalize kids problems instead of treating the source cause. in the case of adhd , i was a camp counselor for young boys when i was 18. i saw over a group of 10 year old kids some of whose parents forced them to take stimulant drugs ) .
it is clear that mothers intuitions are being used against them by doctors and others whose job it is to get paid to TREAT. the best old school doctors tell you "there's nothing to do" or "rest and relax" . or "give it another week and come back" . they don't immidately throw anti-biotics or other drugs at you or your children.
but now the anxiety prone and competitive society we live in is filled with mothers who want to DO and doctors , clinicians, and therapists full of costly solutions ALL OF WHICH ARE PAID FOR BY HEALTH INSURANCE.
the country is going broke, paying for solutions that make itself more sick.
it is a truly vicious cycle. and my instincts tell me the only thing that will fix it is mass poverty and the destruction of the insurance company regime.
If you've been in the US military...
http://usmilitary.about.com/od/theorderlyroom/l/blvaccinations.htm
You probably remember walking between a group of corpsmen and getting it in both arms. I also remember them giving penicillin to everyone, and thankfully I had proof I was allergic to it. Others were not so lucky, went right into anaphylaxis shock and down they went. It's not like you could opt out.
The issue is people not getting their kids vaccinated for MEASLES. Not the same thing at all. Educate yourself.
http://www.wired.com/2015/01/vaccinated-people-get-measles-disneyland-bl...
I read that New Jersey has the highest rate of autism and it has the highest percentage of Jewish shrinks - the very people who diagnose autism.
More ignorance, WRIT LARGE! Clearly someone that knows NOTHING about the diagnostic process that a parent goes through in discovering whether autism is part of the challenge they are facing with their child.
MORON!
I know about autism and the misdiagnosis of such. There are, of course, genuine diagnosed autistics. And there are not genuine autistics. Perhaps someone will look more into the parental enviroment of a child as well as vaccinations. A child not call people morons. That is a bad start. They end up doing it as adults and that attitude certainly affects children.
You can quibble about the side effects of vaccinations - 1%, maybe 3% if there is rampant fraud or mismanagement - but when you promote anti-vax, you put yourself with the groups who argue that fire departments and national defense should be voluntary - i.e., the retard table.
If you disagree with a particular vaxx regime, then use a staged dosing. The free market will provide for such alternatives.
Anti-vaxxer = retard.
Let me be more clear. Anti-vaxxer = retard.
The powers have become more 'scientific' since smallpox blankies.
Can you fool a Sioux twice?
Well argued. Let me attempt a rebuttal along your level. Vaxxer = retard.
Thanks for being so informative.
Only a complete Asshole uses the term retard!
boy that swine flu pandemic, was horrible
Skip the flu vaccine. I do. But the issue is people who opt out of having their kids vaccinated for MEASLES, which is STUPID and IRRESPONSIBLE.
What is your bais for that statement? The mortality of measles versus the vaccine? Please provide the data that leads you to this conclusion.
Sure, cause the data certainly bears out the "fact" that measles was only eradicated due to the timely introduction of the measles vaccine!
http://truth11.com/2012/11/08/real-history-vaccines-not-responsible-for-...
/sarc/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C5HTx758IpE
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http://prn.fm/gary-null-show-02-06-15/
GARY NULL SHOW – 02.06.15
Posted on: February 6th, 2015 by Archivist Categories: Gary Null Show
2
First Guest: Prof. Mary Holland
Prof. Mary Holland is a Director of the Graduate Legal Skills Program at New York University School of Law, specializing in international human rights, public law and vaccine safety law and injury compensation. She also has a son who regressed into autism following the MMR vaccine. Yesterday she was a guest on Democracy Now along with Dr. Paul Offit, the guru celebrity of the pro-vaccine industry. Since Offit was the last to be interviewed during yesterday’s program, we have invited her on to respond to Offit’s comments. Mary has degrees in Russian studies from Harvard, and graduate degrees in international relations and a JD from Columbia University, where she has also taught international law at its Law School. Mary is the co-author of “Vaccine Epidemic: How Corporate Greed, Biased Science and Coercive Government Threaten Our Human Rights, Our Health and Our Children.” The website is VaccineEpidemic.com
Second Guest: Dr. Sherri Tenpenny
Dr. Sherri Tenpenny is an osteopathic medical physician who incorporates integrative medicine in her practice for treating allergies, childhood illnesses and women’s health issues. She is also one of the country’s most knowledgeable and outspoken physicians opposing the efficacy and safety of vaccines. She is the founder and lead medical practitioner of the Tenpenny Integrative Medical Center in Strongsville, Ohio.
She has authored several books on vaccines including, “Fowl: Bird Flu, It is Not What You Think” and “Saying No to Vaccines: A Resource Guide for All Ages”, and her recent DVD – “Flu and Flu Vaccines: What’s Coming Through That Needle” is an invaluable resource for educating people on influenza and the flu vaccines. Her websites are DrTenpenny.com and TenpennyIMC.com
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THURSDAY, FEBRUARY 5, 2015 FULL SHOW | HEADLINES
Inside the Vaccine War: Measles Outbreak Rekindles Debate on Autism, Parental Choice & Public Health
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http://www.democracynow.org/2015/2/5/inside_the_vaccine_war_measles_outb...
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So many words, so much rubbish.
Vaccination has been shown to almost (and actually) eradicate many types of disease.
Vaccinations need to be given to a very high percentage of the population to work and stop any outbreak from spreading.
In the UK there has been an MMR scare and people stopped having their children vaccinated.
There are now regular outbreaks of measles in schools.
Polio was particularly nasty but has been eradicated by vaccination.
and smallpox ..............
hilarity ensues.
Hilarity ensues when ZH posts BS like this article. Oh, I've seen over the horizon, and I'll tell you... it's funny. Next will be Homey Boo Boo's corner on healthy eating. Or Bundy rancher explains quantum physics: "was the Copenhagen conference a conspiracy by liberal Europeans to makes us lose our faith in a God that plays dice? Or was it a miscalculation by Tralfamadorians in their support of the pilot-wave model?"
Hey why not show is the timeline of measles # of measles deaths vs. # of people vaccinated? Start before 1953. Do this in an isolated room so that when your head explodes no one will be harmed.
Oh I've seen BS in Zerohedge but this tops the records. If that guy still has an MD, someone should call his association quick. And BTW:
"If you believe absolutely in the benefit and protective value of vaccination, why does it matter what others do? Or don’t do?"
It matters because there are people who can't be vaccinated. There are people with suppressed immune systems, for example. And when those who can't get vaccinated are surrounded by potential disease vectors (i.e. un-vaccinated idiots who carry disease which vaccination would simply eradicate), they're fucked. Period.
You might believe what you want. And you might fudge the numbers, find correlations like global warming and pirate acts and stuff. But the reality is simple. Take polio for example. Or good old smallpox. Those weren't eradicated through "vitamins", homeopathy, witch doctors or praying.
And BTW, if you take medical advice from a loony at WND, you're an idiot. You all should go and live in an island of yourselves. Then you wouldn't be a potential risk for a lot of people (and chirrun too, specially, if you might), and in the best of cases an outbreak of an easily preventable disease would wipe you all off the face of the Earth. Poetic justice that'd be.
Again. I've seen stupidity here. But this is just too much. ZH, you're touching the bottom now.
I'm skeptical.
Sacrifice the many for the good of the few?
or risk the sanctity of the many fit
for the systemic monetary profits
of the few select?
Or be a stupid idiot, become infected by an easily preventable disease, infect children, old people and those immune suppressed and die all together. Or just fucking take the vaccine and none of that'll happen. How's that?
All I Have To Do Is Dream - Everly Brothers
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tbU3zdAgiX8
You're a fucking carrier whether you are vaccinated or not. JFC! Holy fuck. Another paranoid fucking freak that doesn't know the facts. Like any virus - it can be carried and transferred between those who have established immunity and those that have not. Vaccines do not eliminate - at all- the problem that ANYBODY can be a carrier. And they do little to erradicate the disease in general. They are a poor low probability serums that may enhance some resistance - but viruses are mutating - CONSTANTLY and the rate at which that mutation occurs is increasing.
Eat a bag of dicks champ. Until your science can demonstrate unequivocally 100% universality in health benefit from vaccines then STFU because the benefit of the many do not outweigh the loss of the few. More utilitarian bullshit that justifies that the ends outweigh the means. Its people like you that make this a miserable place to live - and provide further ammunition that the individual doesn't fucking matter.
Fuck that philosophy has turned out well.
"Until your science can demonstrate unequivocally 100% universality in health benefit from vaccines then STFU"
Hmm, taking science advice from a guy who expects science to demonstrate ANYTHING universally at a 100% rate. That's not science dude, that's religion. Ever heard of Karl Popper? Guess not.
Anybody can be a carrier... not so sure. Viruses need to insert themselves on cells to actually become infectious. If you're immune that process will be greatly reduced. If mass vaccination didn't stop the spread of infectious disease, then the immune suppressed population would just be dead. It isn't.
"And they do little to erradicate the disease in general"
Ahem, polio.
"but viruses are mutating - CONSTANTLY and the rate at which that mutation occurs is increasing"
Yeah, let's stop doing anything against them. Let's pray them away. That's no excuse for inaction. "Bankster fraud methodologies keep mutating at an ever increasing rate. Let's DO NOTHING.. buuhhh, give me a corner so I can cry a river"
"the benefit of the many do not outweigh the loss of the few. More utilitarian bullshit that justifies that the ends outweigh the means. Its people like you that make this a miserable place to live"
Ibuprofen and its alikes can trigger an allergic reaction that will make your skin fall in pieces as if it was leper. Let's BURN IT AT THE STAKE! LET'S BURN ALL ANALGESICS! YEAH! That's the rational thing to do, right? Mass vaccination helps the few who can't get vaccinated. Mass vaccination helped eradicate maladies such as polio. Oh those damn statists! Give me my polio back!
While you decry science as NOT being the best way we have to understand nature (even while you read this on a device that no prayer could have ever developed), eat yourself a bag of mummified baby dicks. They say it's good for measles, cancer of the crotch, and rectal HPV.
Achtung - show me ONE double blind study of flu vaccine. I double dog dare you.
Is this your appointed trolling place this this week?
Oh lemme guess: flu vaccine has no double bind study, therefore ALL vaccines have no double bind study thus vaccination BAD, ILLUMINATI PLOT, STATISM ON STEROIDS blah blah blah, right? No. No fallacies of composition, please. Specially for a vaccine that is not generally mandatory, which only works for short times and for a limited at-risk population. But then I guess I should do my homework. What about this:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10493337
or
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19796721?dopt=Abstract
"but viruses are mutating - CONSTANTLY and the rate at which that mutation occurs is increasing."
Seriously the anti-vas actually post the best reasons to get vaccinated!!!!!! Your statement is correct, and it is due to falling vaccination rates. Less vaccinated people = more virus carriers
More virus carriers = more virus mutations
Virus mutations is purely a numbers game, thus why flu vaccinations are so problematic to get right, there is so large quantities of the virus (due to it's high level of contagion) that it mutates too quickly for effective vaccinations.
As you claim to be big on "facts" then you realise your statement about viruses spreading between vax and un-vax is well....wrong.
Please go to the doctor and ask for a high speed injection of inner-cranium lead immediately.
Hey you hitlerian shithead. If the vaccines aren't 100% effective should the poor bastards with compromised immune systems go about there merry way as if there is no risk? If they shouldn't, why the hell should my risk be increased, and my rights violated, when doing so doesn't actually benefit those poor bastards you so cheerfully use to make an emotional, and irrational argument? You are one dumb bastard and the sad things isn't that you don't realize it - the sad things is you think you are pretty sharp.
Get Help! Your anger is getting the best of you and it is founded on flawed data. While Smallpox is one bright ligh for vaccination, it cannot justify the mass vaccination for so many diseases that were on their way out all on their own -- no magic powder necessary, thank you very much! The truth is just so much simpler -- as a civilization, we in the western world had learned how to remove the incubators for disease through improved diet, hygiene and lifestyle and these deadly diseases were on their way out due to the buildup of natural immunity which lasts a lifetime and does not need "booster shots" periodically, like vaccines.
Absorb these charts and the powerful message they contain. They are the tip of the iceberg for the student willing to be weaned of propaganda and think for themselves.
http://truth11.com/2012/11/08/real-history-vaccines-not-responsible-for-...
Interesting to note the appearance of down arrow despots showing up recently on ZH. I think you guys have more than just caught the propagandist's eye. Good work ZH.
As far as vaccinations are concerned: The Government chose to make the US Citizen their enemies through the NDAA...legalizing propaganda to be used agaist citizens and so on. They know the financial system is going to break. They are putting up a system around the US to control populations through microwe--basically a cooking technology for humans not to cook with but to be cooked by. Anyhow no need to go on, everyone knows at this point. So, I would have to say the vaccinations are a pre-emptive weapon to be used by the NWO to 1) either start a revolution or 2) to put something into the population that will render them defenseless during the coming economic collapse. One thing is absolutly certain at this point is that the Government is not here to help you. If I have to get vaccinations to go to college then I will probably choosee to join in the uprising against them, or I'll quit and leave the country. I certainly have no ties to this spot on this planet. Down with vaccinations. Long live the Q99X2.
I find the smallpox defense amusing. Natural prevention for smallpox is milking cows. No milk maiden ever got smallpox b/c they would get cowpox on their hands and would become immune to smallpox.
The smallpox vaccine however, was devastating to people, or should I say children, wiith eczema. Children with Eczema often died from smallpox vaccination. Yet, the shoot my kids up with 40+antigens croud loves to parade the smallpox vaccine as some huge success.
An arrogant crowd the "medical community" is and always shall be. Taking credit for wiping out childhood diseases.
ALL of these childhood diseases were in rapid decline due to modern sanitation, hygene, and knowledge of how these viruses worked. This resulted in effective forms of common sense prevention.
More to the point. A recent study at the Kobe University in Japan, which you can read by Googling Kobe University Antigen Study; revealed that more than 7 antigens and PERMANENT DNA damage occurs; EVERY TIME! And worse still, that additional antigens after 7 increased the damage exponentially.
The icing on the cake for me though is the Keep your laws off my body left want to put laws on my body and my children's body.
OMG your stupidity is on a whole new level......you just quoted the origins of vaccines as your reasoning behind your anti-vac post. That is hillarious, you can't even make up that kinda stupid. By the way my 3 month old son really struggles with milking cows, i'm 40 and have never milked a cow. I buy milk from the shop, and i'm not alone in this habit.
That smallpox crap we pro-vacs keep harping on about, is because in the 19th century 300-500 million people died of the disease, and yet in the 21st century it was declared eradicated.
"Children with Eczema often died from smallpox vaccination" Sadly true but a death rate (in that era) of between 14 and 52 people per 1 million vaccinated experienced potentially life-threatening reactions, including eczema vaccinatum, progressive vaccinia (or vaccinia necrosum) Is better odds then not vaccinating!
Cowpox is an infectious disease caused by the cowpox virus. The virus, part of the orthopoxvirus family, is so closely related to the vacciniavirus that the two are often spoken of interchangeably[citation needed]. The virus is zoonotic, meaning that it is transferable between species, such as from animal to human. The transferral of the disease was first observed in dairymaids who touched the udders of infected cows and consequently developed the signature pustules on their hands.[1] Cowpox is more commonly found in animals other than bovines, such as rodents. Cowpox is similar to, but much milder than, the highly contagious and often deadly smallpox disease.[1] Its close resemblance to the mild form of smallpox inspired the first smallpox vaccine, created and administered by English physician Edward Jenner.[2]
The word “vaccination,” coined by Jenner in 1796[2], is derived from the Latin root vaccinus, meaning of or from the cow.[3] Once vaccinated, a patient develops antibodies that make him/her immune to cowpox, but they also develop immunity to the smallpox virus, or Variola virus. The cowpox vaccinations and later incarnations proved so successful that in 1980, the World Health Organization announced that smallpox was the first disease to be eradicated by vaccination efforts worldwide.[3] Other orthopox viruses remain prevalent in certain communities, such as thecowpox virus (CPXV) in Europe, vaccinia in Brazil, monkeypox virus, and continue to infect humans.
One question for you?
Why does the benevolent Rockefellor's and Bill Gates of the world push vaccination programs that regularly maime, and cause the very deseases they claim to be trying to eradicate?
http://vactruth.com/2013/11/26/vaccine-associated-polio/
Eugenics that is why. THEY ARE TRYING TO KILL AND MAIME YOU!
John 8:3232 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
Soon to follow will be having active RFID chips implanted in your neck so The State will know your whereabouts at all times. It will be an offence to mask the RFID transmission. Of course it's all in the collective interest to fight crime and to locate you in an emergency or if you get lost. And just to make sure The State knows who is committing crime, DNA samples will be mandated at birth. You know it makes sense.
Think of the children and little old ladys who will "feel" safer.
/s
HA!
No need for all that when everyone is willing to carry a cell phone that does that and so much more.
DNA samples HAVE been mandated at birth. You can not opt out. Your baby's blood will be taken at birth. No consent needed.
NEWBORN SCREENING SAVES LIVES REAUTHORIZATION ACT
The Newborn Screening Saves Lives Reauthorization Act will renew federal programs that provide support for state efforts to ensure that every newborn is tested for at least 31 conditions present at birth which, if undetected and untreated, can lead to serious disability or death.
http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/newborn-screening-saves-lives-re...
This has not yet been implemented in the UK.
In the US, if the only reason for screening newborns is to detect medical conditions which need early treatment, there can be zero good reasons not to destroy the samples after the tests. But this will not be done of course which immediately confirms there are more sinister motives in play.
Like all political discourse, this is no more than a "property dispute".
Who owns your body? Is it you, or the "collective".
That's the only question.
The effectiveness of the vaccines is not relevant to that question.
If this isn't enough to make you fight, then you deserve everything you are going to get.
BTW ... watch "Utopia", Series One, from Channel 4. OK, it's fiction, but spell-binding. (don't bother with Series Two ... it's shite)
Ok, some vaccinations and the amount of them that people receive (especially in the US) is questionable but do you really want your children to run the risk of contracting polio?
My Brother now 54 caught polio from the vaccine!
Do you know how polio is even caused?
It is lack of personal Hygeine that caused polio (contact with feces). It was in decline due to indor plumbing and hygeine and began to spike when the vaccines began to be administored.
They caught polio from the vaccine.
http://www.whale.to/vaccines/polio.html
http://nsnbc.me/2013/05/08/bill-gates-polio-vaccine-program-caused-47500...
http://www.scidev.net/global/health/news/polio-vaccine-sparked-disease-o...
My Brother now 54 caught polio from the vaccine!
Do you know how polio is even caused?
It is lack of personal Hygeine that caused polio (contact with feces). It was in decline due to indor plumbing and hygeine and began to spike when the vaccines began to be administored.
They caught polio from the vaccine.
http://www.whale.to/vaccines/polio.html
http://nsnbc.me/2013/05/08/bill-gates-polio-vaccine-program-caused-47500...
http://www.scidev.net/global/health/news/polio-vaccine-sparked-disease-o...
I am sorry to hear about your brother :-(
The problem with the polio vaccine as I remember is that the orally administered vaccine contains the live virus. I never, ever let my child be vaccinated with a live virus. I live in a place where they mostly work non-living vaccines. And I do agree to not to administer vaccines for everything. The flu vaccines is BS, does not work in most cases. I also think a close watch should be kept on the WHO, on Bill Gates and his foundation and on anybody claiming that we should vaccinate for everything right now.
Another problem with a TRIVIALLY SIMPLE SOLUTION:
No one should be forced to get vaccinated,
BUT
those who choose to NOT get vaccinated must be expelled to protect the health of others.
You do NOT have any right to infect me with YOUR disease.
But if you ARE vaccinated, why do you fear to get infected?
I would rather say that, if a person decides not to get vaccinated, s/he should not claim to have her/his health costs refunded by the government.
Those who do not get vaccinated are reservoirs for diseases
AND
Their diseases can infect those whose immune systems are compromised, eg cancer patients undergoing chemo treatments.
I have ZERO tolerance for all you anarchy wackos - I would have the NSA trolling the web for you and recycle or expell all of you.
You make too much sense to be on this board.
You do realize, don't you, that "infecting you with a disease" is exaclty what the vacine does?
Read the Austrian Baxter HealthCare Labratory situation from 2009. Read the relationship between David Rockefeller and Bill Gates Sr. running around the world promoting to various elites the elimination of 80% of the human population and the vehicle of vaccination.
Obama the Usurper, and his minions and handlers, true statists anf haters of freedom, created this problem in order to "solve" it. They brought the diseases here with illegal aliens and stashed them all around the country-- little timebombs of disease. Where do you think this is coming from? That is how they roll,l these Marxist "progressives". Obama 's presence in the Whitehouse is the final straw, the deathknell of America-- the NWO has achieved more than they could have hoped.
Hm. Diseases that weren't in existence in the US due to mass vaccination, sprouting again carried by peoples from countries where there isn't mass vaccination, infecting people in the US who in their sheer ignorance stopped vaccinating. And it's all OBAMAS FAULT! Damn you Obomba!
Obama and his minions and handlers knew what allowing thousands from non mass vaccinated countries just to walk into the US would do. Now they get to " solve" the problem they created.
And the problem was exactly which one? That people in sheer ignorance lost their immunity putting thousands at risk? Or... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=768h3Tz4Qik
If the "executor of the laws" ignores the law, and allows thousands of illegal alien childen into the country, stashing them in all corners, then he has created the problem. He and his handlers knew exactly what they were doing. Now they want to blame "tea partiers" and Anti-vaxers"--- that's what they do.
Yeah might be. But the "blame the immigrant" argument seems always way too easy an expiation for all problems, doesn't it? And while yeah, as for the letter of the law there might be issues with immigration (which I doubt started with Obomba), the truth of the crumbling cookie is that those diseases you decry are most probably the same which are easily preventable by the most regular and used vaccination schemes around the world. And for them to spread in the US just means there's a portion of the population which should be immune but isn't because of sheer stupidity and ignorance. Yeah, immigrants BWAAD. But in the end anti vaccers are to blame here. There'll always be illegal immigration as long as the US seems a better place to reside than countries where these people come from. So to prevent getting infected from diseases for which there are no immunization schemes in those countries of origins, and considering that it's pretty much impossible to avoid illegal immigration without the type of crazy control freakingness y'all decry as STATISM ON STEROIDS; then just fucking (edit) get the fucking vaccine, and problem solved. Easy, huh?
Misinformation. Vaccination rates are just as high or higher in countries where illegals come from. CDC doctors believe the virus most likely came to the US from someone who traveled abroad:
"There's been on ongoing outbreak of measles in the Philippines, but no imported U.S. cases have been linked to the Philippines this year, Schuchat said. Genetic tests of the virus affecting Americans are similar to strains seen in Indonesia, Qatar, Azerbaijan and Dubai."
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/measles-outbreak/disney-measles-outbrea...
Hysterical Obama haters decide to suspend critical thinking and allow wackos to tell them he is responsible for EVERYTHING bad. The guy is a tool, a bankster buddy, but he's not responsible for MEASLES, idiot.
Yes he is, and he and his handlers planned it that way OBOT. 85% in Guatemala is not herd insolated.
90,000 undocumented, unvaccinated children recently entered the country via Mexico and were spread across the US. And no one is talking about the infectious diseases these children may have been carrying when they entered the US. The government wants to blame parents and not the program that has allowed these diseases into the country.
Exaactly, not ine word from the media where this came from. But of course the "media: are the propagandists and courtiers of the Usurper regime-- the useful idiots.
Does not matter.
I held the same opinion about anti-vaxxers before. 2002.
It was simply a matter of time before an outbreak occurred.
That's called science, germ theory, and logic. Topics all anti-vaxxers have zero awareness.
What is your scientific explanation for the mortality rate from measles approaching 0 a decade before the licensing of the vaccine? Clearly, you have no familiarity with the facts - just the taste of the boots you lick.
Infectious diseases which spread because ignorant muricans stopped vaccinating?
Reported MMR vaccination rate in Mexico (99) and in Central America (lowest is Nicaragua or Honduras at 93) is all higher than the current rate in the US (91). Try again. US has among the lowest rates in the world right now.
BS
Don't let facts get in your way, dolt.
"But since 2000, the vaccination rates of Central American countries have been largely on par with or have exceeded that of the United States.
According to the World Health Organization, the United States in 2013 had a measles vaccination rate for 1-year-olds of 91 percent. Though Mexico’s rate dropped to 89 percent in 2013, it had been at 95 percent or higher for every other year since 2000. Guatemala’s 2013 rate was 85 percent, down from 93 percent the previous year. Honduras also had a coverage rate of 89 percent, down from above 90 percent in previous years. El Salvador’s rate was 94 percent in 2013."
http://www.factcheck.org/2015/02/false-narrative-on-measles-outbreak/
Factcheck? Annenbergs? All Obama Toadies. Fiercely defending the Usurper from any criticism. Even IF the VAX rate in those South and Central American countries were over 90%, what makes you think that those poor children, abandoned by their parents, were part of that 90%. It only takes 10 out of the thousands. Liars figure and figures lie. How does it feel to be a bootlicker of the Usurper?
Below 90% is not herd insolated, and many of those children traveled through the countries less than 90%. Obama and his minions are attempting to destry the border, and refuse to apply the law.
Factcheck????? HAHAHAHAHA. Why don't you just reference WIKI? Use GOOGLE and you find all of these Obama defence articles--- Mozilla , and you will not, try it.
"Factcheck? Annenbergs?"
WND? alt-market? Drudge? HAHAHAHAHA
Nice statistic. Too bad it's incomplete and totally misleading as it pertains to the topic at hand. Mexico and the rest of the Cenral American countries do not vaccinate for MMR, Pertussis or Pneumococcal so the vaccination rate for Measles, Mumps and Rubella, Pneumonia and Whooping Cough is 0%. To underscore the point for you, immigrants illegally crossing the border from Central America have a vaccination rate for these diseases of 0%.
Feel free to verify the data for yourself:
http://www.unicef.org/infobycountry/latinamerica.html
How vaccine hysteria could save millions of lives
There fixed the headline for you.
Fucking muppet
If we reasoned by the absurd and pushed your main argument to its limits :
A guy with Ebola can walk the streets and say to everyone on the subway : My body is my kingdom, fuck off if you think I'm going to quarantine myself in a sterile room in some lousy government lab/mouse trap for dying people!
So the community is now held at ransom by a man who spreads the Plague?
Like I said, we have to draw the line somewhere between collective good and individual rights.
And that line can only be drawn by an elected person who represents the collective will.
Right or wrong we call that government.
Who can vaccinate the human family against the most pestilent, the most virulent pathogen on earth? The only cure against pox amerikana available is from Dr. Putin himself. Will the sick and dying in Merca allow themselves to be healed by rejecting the Wall St bankster Pentacon quacks that have turned Merca and its global killing fields into a morgue?
This is such a woefully embarrassing post including on the issue of current legal state of informed consent in the US, the current state of vaccinations, and filled with all kinds of junk science. Yes there are a lot of valid reasons to possibly not get a flu vaccination annually to the limited efficacy of the flu vaccine depending upon the strain, severity of the predicted flu, etc. Ditto the BCG vaccine for TB.
Not getting the MMR vaccine is ridiculous given its reported efficacy of 99%+, the highly contagious nature of measles, mumps, and rubella, and the complications that each of these diseases if occurred. A pregnant women who gets rubella has about a 10-20% chance of having a child born with congenital defects. A male who is past puberty has a chance (not quantified) of becomng sterile if they get mumps.
DID YOU READ THE ARTICLE?
Vaccinations are designed to great a cash stream for the multinationals and keep you in fear as government is always there to tell you what is best for you!
Vaccines are not effective against the diesease they claim to prevent, Again DID YOU READ!
It didn't remotely say that and it listed a bunch of articles, cherry-picked a small portions of each one of these studies including the Lancet piece, and produced a ton of BS including about current state of informed consent. There isn't a single study n this list or another that would question the efficacy or effectiveness of the MMR vaccine.
This thread rings out like a conscious stream of stupidity.
Please expain what got rid of smallpox???? I'm dying to hear your informed answer.
Please read the following.
http://www.whale.to/vaccine/scotttebb_chapter3.html
Does truth just bounce off of you?
Are you aware that the Rockefellor's own modern medicine in all its wickedness: Chemotherapy and Vaccination programs!
This is about Eugenics!
The article you linked to, basically suggests that overcrowding (living in large cities) and poor sanitation are key factors in smallpox rates. No shit sherlock, of course this reduced the spread of disease, but it certainly doesn't elimate it. Ergo lies two main problems in your arguement. we have mass overcrowding, and shocking sanitation in countries such as india, large parts of China, and pretty much Africa. Yet still no smallpox.
Even in the lowest of the figures in this chart (your link) at 83 people per 100,000 this would equate to over 5 million deaths a year from smallpox in todays population of 7 billion people. Actual deaths of smallpox = 0 - Because vaccination works!!!!!
London.—Average annual death-rates per 100,000 living at six different periods, from 1629-1835.1
All causes. Small-pox.2 Fever.
1629-35 ... ... 5,000 189 636
1660-79 .................. 8,000 417 785
1728-57 ...................... 5,200 426 785
1771-80 ... ... 5,000 502 621
1801-10 ... ... 2,920 204 264
1831-35 ............. 3,200 83 111
Yes there are problems with vaccinations, sadly to make them affordable and long enough shelf life to no cost squillions of dollars they need preservatives and other crap added. Vaccinations don't work on all viruses, i'm not one for taking the flu vaccine, as I believe it is too contagious and mutates too quickly to be truely effective. However arguing that it didn't wipe out small pox, polio and is effective against horrible diseases like mumps, rubella, measles is plain stupid. The stats are irrefutable!
Just reading a bunch of misinformation doesn't make it true, dolt. Big PHARMA is guilty of a lot, particularly in the psychopharmaceutical sphere, where they DO harm innocent children. But measles vaccines have been proven to reduce deaths.
"During this century, there has been a dramatic decrease in measles epidemics. Prior to the development of the measles vaccine, 5.7 million people died each year from measles. (Some historians have suggested that measles might have contributed to the decline of the Roman Empire.)
In 1920, the United States had 469,924 measles cases and 7,575 deaths due to measles. From 1958 to 1962, the United States had an average of 503,282 cases and 432 deaths each year. (Measles reporting began in 1912; prior to this time, no statistics are available.) In large cities, epidemics often occurred every two to five years.
When the measles vaccine came on the market in 1963, measles began a steady decline worldwide. By 1995, measles deaths had fallen 95 percent worldwide and 99 percent in Latin America. In the United States, the incidence of measles hit an all-time low in 1998, with 89 cases and no deaths reported.
There have been several epidemics in the United States since 1963: from 1970 to 1972, 1976 to 1978, and 1989 to 1991. The epidemic of 1989-1991 claimed 120 deaths out of a total of 55,000 cases reported. Over half of the deaths occurred in young children"
https://science.education.nih.gov/supplements/nih1/diseases/activities/a...
WRONG! The decline began long before the introduction of the vaccine and the number of annual deaths had been much less than 1000 for well over a decade prior to the introduction of the vaccine. As you can see on the chart linked here, the vast majority of the mortality decline was pre-vaccine.
http://truth11.com/2012/11/08/real-history-vaccines-not-responsible-for-...
Given the still declining mortality rate at the time of the vaccine introduction, it is less than clear that the vaccine is the explanation behind the continued decline in mortality. If it were, then why have we continued to have outbreakc/"epidemics" of measles every few years if vaccination is so widespread?
Getting an MMR vaccine is what is ridiculous. The diseases themselves are not particularly scary. Getting the disease gives you lifetime immunity versus declining immunity. The complications rate from the vaccines approaches, if not exceeds, the complications rate from the disease itself. Moreover, the mortality for measles was damn near zero a decade before the damn vaccine was introduced.
Bingo!
http://truth11.com/2012/11/08/real-history-vaccines-not-responsible-for-...
And forget the Small Pox vaccanition also! To much intrusion. Don't worry white eyes we will bring you some nice warm Magic Indian blakets to keep you safe.
Vitamin A & D possible prevent highly communicable diseases such as measles, mumps, and rubella? JC. That is all you need is to encourage someone to take large amounts of a fat soluble vitamin especially for their children. It isn't a water soluble vitamin (vitamin C) where taking massive doses has no real side effects.
I fine with people not getting vaccinated if then health insurers don't have to be reasonsible for paying any of the claims submitted for an entirely permissible disease. Same with folks who don't want to hear helmets while riding motorcycles and then head up with a brain injury which was preventable if they had a health that was one and demand all kinds of resources from the state including medical and disability.
Or allow insurers to charge higher premiums for people who don't vaccinate, to track the increased risk of illness.
Why does the benevolent Rockefellor's and Bill Gates of the world push vaccination programs that regularly maime, and cause the very deseases they claim to be trying to eradicate?
http://vactruth.com/2013/11/26/vaccine-associated-polio/
Eugenics that is why. THEY ARE TRYING TO KILL AND MAIME YOU!
John 8:32
32 And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
Sadly you are possibly correct in the vaccine programs in the third world countries, and at least one example where the U.S govt overtly used vaccine program in Pakistan in the search for Osama Bin Laden (large scale genetic profiling). I don't think Bill Gates is on an evil plan to wipe out millions of people, however third world countries are very difficult to do large scale vaccinations effectively. The odds of getting a person to come to all 3-4 vaccinations needed for immunity is unlikely, and I do believe there are associated risks in live virus in a country where extremely poor hygiene and overcrowding exists.
A person is considered to be fully immunized if he or she has received a primary series of at least three doses of inactivated poliovirus vaccine (IPV), live oral poliovirus vaccine (OPV), or four doses of any combination of IPV and OPV. Until recently, the benefits of OPV use (i.e. intestinal immunity, secondary spread) outweighed the risk for vaccine-associated paralytic poliomyelitis (VAPP) which occurred in one child out of every 2.4 million OPV doses distributed. To eliminate the risk of vaccine-associated paralytic poliomyelitis (VAPP), as of January 1, 2000, OPV was no longer recommended for routine immunization in the United States. However, OPV continues to be used in the countries where polio is endemic or the risk of importation and transmission is high. OPV is recommended for global polio eradication activities in polio-endemic countries due to its advantages over IPV in providing intestinal immunity and providing secondary spread of the vaccine to unprotected contacts.
By the way if you want to kill millions of people and reduce overcrowding - the best way to do it would be convince people vaccines dont work - you will achieve the goal of killing millions or hundres of millions.....hmmm interesting thought
Bilble thumping nut jobs like you aren't capable of critical thinking.
Where'd you find that line? From snopes?
Wildly stupid!
I have never heard of any government in the U.S. forcibly vaccinating anyone. The only time I have ever heard of such a notion is on this site. Where do you people get this stuff?
Also, regarding language, government does not have "rights", government has "powers". People have "rights".
Where do you think this industry was pressured to cause mandidtory vaccinations: media and government.
Have you been living under a rock; states all over this nation have mandatory laws for vaccination records just to go to school and 32 states do have exemptions that are in effect.
Daycare Chain Forces Employees to Get Measles Shotshttp://www.newsmaxhealth.com/Health-News/KinderCare-measles-vaccination-...
Apparently you have never been in the military either; you are forced to take the vaccinations yo require under penalty.
QUIT TROLLLING
You're the loony tune living under a rock. Why shouldn't a private employer have the right to enforce standards that the majority of its customers would insist on? You seem to think private employers should have no rights to screen employees in an effort to protect the innocent children who are placed in their care. Should pedophiles get a pass too?
States require you to vaccinate your children in order to take advantage of public schools, but you are not required to send your kids to public schools. At least thousands of children are home schooled, and because they are home schooled, their parents can choose not to have them vaccinated (one of the main reasons children are home schooled, by the way). Regarding the military, you are not forced to join the military, but if you do join the military, you are required to be vaccinated. Again, it's your choice. KinderCare is not "forcing" employees to get vaccinated. KinderCare is telling them that if they choose (as in their choice) to work at KinderCare they must get vaccinated. This talk of "forcible" vaccination is ridiculous!
I'm fine with that if I can stop being taxed to pay for the shitty public schools
If you wish to be irrational, non-reality based, and pre-scientific, you have that Right.
Before the vaccination, ~250 to 2000 children died each year in the USA from Measles. Usually infants and toddlers. It's why moms lined up to get their kids jabbed in the mid-1960's - they all knew people that had a newborn die and did not want that to happen. Fairly simple concept for those of us with scientific attitudes to understand.
Deaths were far worse in the decades pre-1963, but improved sanitation reduced the numbers from the tens of thousands.
However, and this is not-debatable it is clear fact, when the vaccine was introduced in the 1960's, I was one of those kids in 1966 that lined up in the school cafeteria for the combo-pneumatic-circle of needles DPT booster, the number of deaths dropped from 250-2000, to a literal handful. 5, 6, 11.
All from side effects from the vaccination. 5 is smaller than 250, but this point is lost on you. Still, want to repeat it.
Since the vaccination WORKED and was SUCCESSFUL, you don't know anyone who had a child die from Measles. Since you see no deaths from the disease, your mind locks onto the 11 annual deaths.
Why?
You cannot understand that there is not a third path.
Choices:
1) Vaccinate and 11 die per annum
2) Not vaccinate and over time deaths will exceed that 11 and approach the level of 1963. 250 to 2000.
3) Mythical choice of not vaccinate and zero deaths and zero risk
Choice 3 does not exist. We are experiencing Choice 2 because of your Darwin self-selection out of the gene pool. I experienced Choice 1 when people were sane and smart.
You can not vaccinate. Yep.
However if your child contracts this epidemiologically proven eradicatable disease and my child gets sick, or I lose a sick day due to same, I get sick, or ANYTHING EVER HAPPENS TO ME OR MINE...I will sue your pre-scientific attitudes to beyond the orbit of Europa.
Maybe THAT will get you to update your values to ones that accept the germ theory of medicine.
Do NOT rely on government statistics to make your point (see my earlier post on that subject)
Show me the double blind studies that show efficacy, for every vaccine you propose
And please explain why pharmaceutical companies needed to be exempted from any possible lawsuit
Because as I see it,
pharmaceutical companies are under no compunction to prove in any scientific fashion that their vaccines even work
AND
are exempt from any legal liability for their vaccines
THEREFORE
I respectfully decline your proposed vaccinations
(Oh and by the way I don't accept the germ theory of medecine either - though the Rockafellers did make it a point to back only medical schools that did early in the 20th century, and shut down via government edict all other schools of medecine)
What about the problem of human over-population? Death by measles could be an important part of reducing the costs of programs like EBT and HUD. Think about the tons of carbon emissions saved via every measles death.
And there it is, folks, the monkey's banana. Gitcher gitcher hate on.
I don't think you are a liar - just an enthusiastic guzzler of propaganda. In the old days, parents used to send their kids to get infected with measles. Got it over with and developed their immunity. It wasn't near the scurge you seem to think it was. Virtually everythinbg you have stated is false. WHy don't you go back and post the incidence, mortality and vaccination rates from 1950 to wnaytime after 1968. The vaccination had very little to do with the reduction in measles.
Your experience notwithstanding, hard data is far more meaningful than anecdotal evidence. Here is the actual data of measles deaths before and after the introduction of the measles vaccine.
http://truth11.com/2012/11/08/real-history-vaccines-not-responsible-for-...
As you can see, for at least a decade before the introduction of the vaccine, measles deaths had been less than 0.3 per 100,000 and the trend had been declining. If we assume a national population of 200 million, that equates to 600 or less deaths per year nationwide. Look carefully at that chart. Are you really going to try to make a reasoned argument that measles went away because of the vaccine?? Or will you open your mind to the very real probability that there were other factors at work that dropped the mortality of the disease from 13 deaths per 100,000 to 0.3 deaths per 100,000 BEFORE the first measles vaccine was ever introduced?
Now, as to your belief in the efficacy of vaccines -- if you are so sure that they are responsible for keeping these infectuous diseases (like measles) at bay, why are you so concerned about what someone else chooses to do? As you so clearly point out, you were fully vaccinated. And I'm sure you practice what you preach, so all your family members are fully vaccinated, so there is no risk that an unvaccinated individual could possibly infect you or a member of your family. So why exactly do you feel the need to issue threats that are the last bastion of the small-minded bully? Are you not capable of seeing he logical fallacy here?
'standing up to this'???????
A good start would be to begin shooting members of the socialist hebrew media, the tools of the hebrew bankster cartel. Of couse stringing up some hebrew banksters would send the message quicker.
there is no good reason why 2% of the U.S. population should control 90% of the media and 85% of the FED member banks.
Until these liars and theives are held accountable with their lives, nothing will change.
Harsh, but true.
One of the most worthless, non logical articles I have ever read on ZH.
What made it more depressing was the level of comments here.
It reminds me of the minimum wage debates while the country burns.....
I tried to inject (pun intended) some sense into this place last night but it has become too overrun with nutjobs.
The anti-government rheotric is spilling over into every facet of these people's existence. It's sad
Governments have contributed far more to public health and saved more lives through mandatory vaccination than through schemes like Obamacare.
You want totalitarian? Fine. When I am king the first child of a fuckwitted hippy cow killed or maimed because she refused to vaccinate them against completely preventable diseases will be her last. She loses them all and goes to jail for manslaughter---and has her tubes tied.
You sir are an agent provacatur and a troll.
so how much is .gov paying you to be here posting today
Margaret Sanger must be your hero?
So true. If it weren't for the CIA working closely with the Gates Foundation in Pakistan, there would NEVER have been that DNA-drive to ID bin Ladin masquerading as free vaccinations. Remember home-gamers, the government is LOVE.
And when you are King my first job will be to see your head on a pike.
Ignorance and Arrogance -- what a toxic combination! Better to be thought a fool than open your mouth and remove all doubt as you've just done. Allow me to provide you with just a tiny bit of actual information as an antidote to that ignorance.
http://truth11.com/2012/11/08/real-history-vaccines-not-responsible-for-...
Reconcile that data against your statement about the government contributions of mandatory vaccinations
It would be much easier just to shoot me than stick a needle in my arm.
OK - The gene pool thanks you
Darwin was right.
I would personally choose to be vaccinated for MMR, etc. HOWEVER, .gov can get bent at the point it believes it can force me to do so. I suspect it's all about protecting the wetbacks, with a side of crony vaccine capitalism and support for the ever-expanding State power.
Fucking moron. Take away his medical license because he seems to not understand even the basics.
Where did you do your residency?
So i only read the first point in Dr. Heib's analysis. I think the difference between a womans right to decide whether or not to give birth and whether or not to get vaccinated is this:
If a woman gets pregnant there is no chance that she will get other people pregnant by being a "carrier" of pregnancy. There is no risk of a pregnancy pandemic.
FUCK! I only read the first paragraph and if this is the level of analysis why bother with the rest.
If Dr. Heib didnt go to Med school she would probably be an advocate for blood-letting.
All you morons out there need to get your nasty kids vaccinated so I don't catch their grubby germs.
Why? If you and your spawn all got vaccinated like good little soldiers you have nothing to worry about -- you're protected, right? Why the vitriol directed at anyone that might deign to actually think for themselves and make an independent decision based on information you aren't privvy to?
Does having other people act in opposition to your world view threaten you that severely that you have to stoop to being nasty?
Just one more disaster du jour to shift the focus away from the creator of the disaster du jour list.
I want some more baby boomer monkey juice.
Mine didn't take. I'm still alive.
Everything I got in me has gone to hell, but I'm still kicking. The bad part is that now the only time I get a boner is when I see a banana.
+100 bwahahaha
I stopped reading when it say "don't vaccinate"
We definitely need another financial crisis, these types of posts are boring!
You are well trained. It is SO dangerous to be exposed to ideas your masters don't want you to hear or to examine the data yourself to see if the strange argument has merit. I'm sure there is not enough time n the day in between your duties as the islamic party goat and the bootlicker.
Who's exactly is my master? Agreeing to vaccinate preventable deadly illnesses doesn't make me a neo-con centerally planned robot you arrogant hillbilly jackass.
Is it really correct
to conflate "our bodies"(adults) with those of our children? ? ?
No matter who makes the decision, children will be subject
to the decisions of others.
Are children the "property" of parents,
property to freely dispense with however the parent may choose?
Children do not get to choose parents who will properly care and nurture them.
On the other hand, what is to prevent government/society/corporations from making unreasonable/harmful choices and demands regarding children?
Little, except and unless the parents collectively demand reasonable and transparent institutions, government and private, in the society.
Certainly are alot of .gov trolls here on this thread. I guess it struck a nerve.
What a load of shit.
If you will not have your child vaccinated, that is your choice; however, you must follow through by not allowing them into public or contact with other children. Walk the walk, or shut the fuck up.
This is just weird. When I was growing up every kid, extremely rich or extremely poor, got the same dosage of the same quality medications at the same time in their life. What has changed is the distrust, not unfounded, of government influence in people's lives. Shows what can happen when the government is viewed as totally corrupt.
Anyone who has a kid that has chicken pox of COURSE wouldn't send them to school. Just like they wouldn't if they were sick for anyother reason.
Common sense man. (and no, you can't legislate common sense anymore than you can morals)
Which is what any consderate person would do when they have a contagious child. Now, totalitarian assholes would like to force you to stay in your house, or get a shot of whatever bullshit they demand, based upon ther fear or pavlovian reflex to do whatever they are told.
Isn't it interesting how third world lack of access to vaccines can interscect with the emerging 'third world (In the first world) I-know-better-than-to-have-my-child-vaccinated point of view.
So what new vaccines is the government trying to "force" on anyone? You are not going to vaccinate against polio or measles?
"Promote the general welfare."
We've been doing this (mandatory vaccinations) for a long time. It has not suddenly become a harbinger for dictatorship. Now, if there is scientific proof there is something other than disease vaccine in these injections then that is different. But there is no such evidence.
I think that energy companies should be allowed to dump nuclear waste into drinking reservoirs, chemical companies should be able to dump waste into rivers, and hospitals should just toss their waste into the street, because Fuck You Big Government telling us how to live!