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The Untold Story Of A Ukrainian Sniper Who Took Part In The Maidan Massacre
One of the biggest mysteries surrounding the February 2014 US-staged coup in Ukraine and the violent overthrow of then president Yanukovich, is "who started shooting first" by which we, of course, refer to the lethal shooting escalation between the government's police force and random snipers who conducted target practice with various citizens and officials of the law during the crackdown at the Euro Maidan square protests, which eventually escalated into all out violence whose culmination was the overthrow of the president.
In order to preserve the western narrative that the entire event was not one staged, massive, and very deadly false flag event, protest organisers have always denied any involvement. Which is why stories such as the one we wrote in March, which revealed that "Behind The Kiev Snipers It Was Somebody From The New Coalition" - A Stunning New Leak Released" got precisely zero traction in the western press.
But now, for the first time, one man has spoken up and told the BBC a different story. The story of "Sergei" does not answer all the questions, or even most of them. But it does shine a light on what else happened, what has not been reported in the western media until now, and why the events played out as they did.
It goes without saying, that since this is a story about Ukraine, one sourced by an anonymous Ukraine resident, and one which has been filtered by the establishment media, that everything below should be taken with a huge grain of salt.
The untold story of the Maidan massacre
A day of bloodshed on Kiev's main square, nearly a year ago, marked the end of a winter of protest against the government of president Viktor Yanukovych, who soon afterwards fled the country. More than 50 protesters and three policemen died. But how did the shooting begin?
It's early in the morning, 20 February, 2014. Kiev's Maidan square is divided - on one side the riot police, the protesters on the other.
This has been going on for more than two months now. But events are about to come to a head. By the end of the day, more than 50 people will be dead, many of them gunned down in the street by security forces.
The violence will lead to the downfall of Ukraine's pro-Russian president, Viktor Yanukovych. Moscow will call 20 February an armed coup, and use it to justify the annexation of Crimea and support for separatists in Eastern Ukraine.
The protest leaders, some of whom now hold positions of power in the new Ukraine, insist full responsibility for the shootings lies with the security forces, acting on behalf of the previous government.
But one year on, some witnesses are beginning to paint a different picture.
"I was shooting downwards at their feet," says a man we will call Sergei, who tells me he took up position in the Kiev Conservatory, a music academy on the south-west corner of the square.
"Of course, I could have hit them in the arm or anywhere. But I didn't shoot to kill."
Sergei says he had been a regular protester on the Maidan for more than a month, and that his shots at police on the square and on the roof of an underground shopping mall, caused them to retreat.
There had been shooting two days earlier, on 18 February. The 19th, a Wednesday, had been quieter, but in the evening, Sergei says, he was put in contact with a man who offered him two guns: one a 12-gauge shotgun, the other a hunting rifle, a Saiga that fired high-velocity rounds.
He chose the latter, he says, and stashed it in the Post Office building, a few yards from the Conservatory. Both buildings were under the control of the protesters.
When the shooting started early on the morning of the 20th, Sergei says, he was escorted to the Conservatory, and spent some 20 minutes before 07:00 firing on police, alongside a second gunman.
His account is partially corroborated by other witnesses. That morning, Andriy Shevchenko, then an opposition MP and part of the Maidan movement, had received a phone call from the head of the riot police on the square.
"He calls me and says, 'Andriy, somebody is shooting at my guys.' And he said that the shooting was from the Conservatory."
Shevchenko contacted the man in charge of security for the protesters, Andriy Parubiy, known as the Commandant of the Maidan.
"I sent a group of my best men to go through the entire Conservatory building and determine whether there were any firing positions," Parubiy says.
Meanwhile the MP, Andriy Shevchenko, was getting increasingly panicked phone calls.
"I kept getting calls from the police officer, who said: 'I have three people wounded, I have five people wounded, I have one person dead.' And at some point he says, 'I am pulling out.' And he says, 'Andriy I do not know what will be next.' But I clearly felt that something really bad was about to happen."
Andriy Parubiy, now deputy speaker of the Ukrainian parliament, says his men found no gunmen in the Conservatory building.
But a photographer who gained access to the Conservatory later in the morning - shortly after 08:00 - took pictures there of men with guns, although he did not see them fire.
Sergei's account also differs from Parubiy's.
"I was just reloading," he told me. "They ran up to me and one put his foot on top of me, and said, 'They want a word with you, everything is OK, but stop doing what you're doing.'"
Sergei says he is convinced the men who dragged him away were from Parubiy's security unit, though he didn't recognise their faces. He was escorted out of the Conservatory building, taken out of Kiev by car, and left to make his own way home.
By that time three policemen had been fatally wounded and the mass killings of protesters had begun.
Kiev's official investigation has focused on what happened afterwards - after the riot police began to retreat from the square. In video footage, they are clearly seen firing towards protesters as they pull back.
Only three people have been arrested, all of them members of a special unit of riot police. And of these three, only two - the lower-ranking officers - remain in custody. The unit's commanding officer, Dmitry Sadovnik, was granted bail and has now disappeared.
The three policemen are accused of causing 39 deaths. But at least a further dozen protestors were killed - and the three policemen who died of their wounds.
Some of the dead were almost certainly shot by snipers, who seemed to be shooting from some of the taller buildings surrounding the square.
Lawyers for the victims and sources in the general prosecutor's office have told the BBC that when it comes to investigating deaths that could not have been caused by the riot police, they have found their efforts blocked by the courts.
"If you think of Yanukovych's time, it was like a Bermuda triangle: the prosecutor's office, the police and the courts," says Andriy Shevchenko. "Everyone knew that they co-operated, they covered each other and that was the basis of the massive corruption in the country. Those connections still exists."
* * *
Ukraine's Prosecutor General, Vitaly Yarema, was dismissed this week, amid harsh criticism of his handling of the investigation.
Meanwhile, conspiracy theories flourish.
"I'm certain that the shootings of the 20th were carried out by snipers who arrived from Russia and who were controlled by Russia," says Andriy Parubiy, the former Commandant of the Maidan.
"The shooters were aiming to orchestrate a bloodbath on Maidan."
This is a widely-held belief in Ukraine. In Russia, many believe the opposite - that the revolt on Maidan was a Western conspiracy, a CIA-inspired coup designed to pull Ukraine out of Moscow's orbit. Neither side offers convincing evidence for its assertion.
The overwhelming majority of the protesters on Maidan were peaceful, unarmed citizens, who braved months of bitter cold to demand a change to their corrupt government. As far as is known, all the protesters killed on 20 February were unarmed.
The leaders of the Maidan have always maintained they did their best to keep guns away from the square.
"We knew that our strength was not to use force, and our weakness would be if we start shooting," says Andriy Shevchenko.
Parubiy says it is possible that a handful of protesters with weapons may have come to the Maidan as part of a spontaneous, unorganised response to violence from the security forces in the days running up to 20 February.
"I did hear that, after the shootings on 18 February, there were guys who came to Maidan with hunting rifles. I was told that sometimes they were the relatives or parents of those people who were killed on the 18th. So I concede that it's possible there were people with hunting rifles on Maidan. When the snipers began to kill our guys, one after another, I can imagine that those with the hunting rifles returned fire."
Sergei, again, tells a different story. He says he was recruited as a potential shooter in late-January, by a man he describes only as a retired military officer. Sergei himself was a former soldier.
"We got chatting, and he took me under his wing. He saw something in me that he liked. Officers are like psychologists, they can see who is capable. He kept me close."
The former officer dissuaded him from joining any of the more militant groups active on the Maidan.
"'Your time will come,' he said."
Was he being prepared, psychologically, to take up arms?
"Not that we sat down and worked out a plan. But we talked about it privately and he prepared me for it."
It is not clear who the man who apparently recruited Sergei was, or whether he belonged to any of the recognised groups active on the Maidan.
And there is much else that we still do not know, such as who fired the first shots on 20 February.
As for conspiracy theories, it is possible that Sergei was manipulated, played like a pawn in a bigger game. But that is not the way he sees it. He was a simple protester, he says, who took up arms in self-defence.
"I didn't want to shoot anyone or kill anyone. But that was the situation. I don't feel like some kind of hero. The opposite: I have trouble sleeping, bad premonitions. I'm trying to control myself. But I just get nervous all the time. I have nothing to be proud of. It's easy to shoot. Living afterwards, that's the hard thing. But you have to defend your country."
* * *
Full BBC clip here
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Whatch here for more info about what is happening in Ukraine on the ground. Many materials in RUS but some in ENG and context you could understand:
https://www.youtube.com/user/babylon13ua/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/SobiratelNet/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/ATOinUkraine/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/arutv2/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqUYRa-nvPV9oYlFhCVWzIQ/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtj7qT-lvSoAFSAV78sTvtw/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwES6Bw4RYTcNqR_XZvMu8A/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/OmelchukTV/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/hardComedy1/videos
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCsnOQIMhAdgq6D3HK-W9XDg/videos
https://www.youtube.com/user/akomarofff/videos
Sins of the Father are visited to the second and third generations.
A nice touch by the BBC:
But one year on, some witnesses are beginning to paint a different picture.
Suggesting that until now, no one has suggested otherwise.
Since day one, the activity of non-Ukrainian, non-Russian actors has been presented. But that isn't the story they want to tell, is it?
The USSA narrative was BS from day 1, when someone (LOL) released recordings of Victoria (fuck the EU) Nuland telling us who was going to be the next leaders of the Ukraine. It was an obvious coup launched by the USSA state department using the typical color revolution tactics.
NATO & Israeli snipers were apparently present in Kiev shooting both sides.
DYODD.
Typical USSA color revolution tactics, straight out of the CiA playbook. Unfortunately, everything started to go wrong with the loss of Crimea. Instead a of world class NATO port, perfect for threatening Russia, the USSA ended up with a shitty rump state, useless except for producing GMO and fascist zombies..
During the 1939 Winter War one Finnish sniper killed over 1000 Russians. Ukes are wimps. Stop bragging.
hahahaha! I'm sure. A fisherman went to the front lines and sniped the entire brigade....seems like a good movie Clint should direct.
It's all about the timing. The shooter was willing, but not able until his helper came along to help with the gun and position to shoot. He had the will, but not the means. The "Helper" had the means, but not the balls. So, who was the bad guy, the shooter or the helper? Sounds like both of um? But one was "Just Protecting His Country" (I might add here, just like any of YOU in your country) and the other was looking for a scape goat. So, now you have another piece of the puzzle Maybe this one just doesn't fit "YOUR" puzzle.
Maybe ?
it's all about patsies and layers of plausible deniability
'Fuck the EU' isn't in the realm of conjecture
@ Ob1knob
Make that 500 kills, not 1000.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_H%C3%A4yh%C3%A4
It goes without saying, that since this is a story about Ukraine, one sourced by an anonymous Ukraine resident, and one which has been filtered by the establishment media, that everything below should be taken with a huge grain of salt.
ahem... think that says it alllI would just like to know how much money he got from Noodleman.
And for the doubter..
OK then, how about just how many cookies?
BBC airs Maidan fighter admitting he fired on police before Kiev massacre
have you seen his cheek, not surprising he was accurate, his face is an integrated bipod.
no, its a true story.
Simo Häyhä
505 confirmed kills with a sniper version mosin nagant. He was an experienced hunter and a member of the Finnish militia.
Well they said he didnt use a scope, he felt he would expose himself too much with it. Preferred normal iron sights. With all all white background of snow it must of been pretty easy to pick off people.
Killing people from an ambush is not the main problem for a sniper, but getting away with it without getting killed.
I bought a Mosin Nagant last year for about 150 USD. I wish it could talk.
Not a fisherman - a farmer. A 105-lb soaking wet kind of guy, named Simo Hayha - the Russians knew him as "The White Death." His total kill count for his ~100 day participation in that war was something just north of 700, with 500 of those being with open-sight antiquated rifles (the rest in closer quarters with a Suomi machine gun). He probably would have scored dramatically more, but he was wounded and spent the rest of the war in a coma (I guess Hades was getting overloaded at the border). He eschewed the use of a scope because it had been how he had spotted and killed a handful of Russian snipers who were sent to kill him. To this day, the Finnish are a force to be reckoned with in the realm of long-range shooting competition.
Beware the man with one rifle - he probably knows how to use it.
i read it was 10,000
like you read fed is ok economy is great usa is fine ?
take a break.
it was 500 you muppet
It goes without saying, that since this is a story about Ukraine, one sourced by an anonymous Ukraine resident, and one which has been filtered by the establishment media, that everything below should be taken with a huge grain of salt.
Then why should anyone spend his time on this?
The Washington leadership has put aside non-proliferation programmes and devoted its energies and resources to driving the country to war by extraordinary deceit, then trying to manage the catastrophe it created.
Noam Chomsky
"Of course, I could have hit them in the arm or anywhere. But I didn't shoot to kill."
-- Brian Williams
lol..."You know, when I was up there shooting down into the square with Sergei, that time in Iraq came flooding back into my thoughts, about them letting me fly the Chinook to a hard landing on the LZ, hand to hand combat, fighting our out way to safety through a brigade of Republican Guards and staring down a hundred tubes of RPG's that had just been fired at me. Yep." - Brian Willams
Fixed it for you...
You know, when I was up there shooting down into the square with Sergei, then that time in the 'Nam came flooding back into my thoughts, we were heading for Pleiku, the LZ was hot... I steered my Huey to a hard landing on the LZ, hand to hand combat, fighting our way out to safety through a company of VC, taking the fight to Charlie. No need for a body count.
This trip was no different... hit the hot tarmac at Bagram, jumped in my waiting Black Hawk... system check - all good, plenty of ammo and fuel for the run up to the Ukraine. Take off... dust devils in my prop wash... suddenly out of nowhere... incoming incoming, bank left bank left, fired flares. Damn that was close. Nothing to get the adrenalin going like staring down a hundred tubes of RPG's that had just been fired at me. Yep. - Brian Williams
This news stuff is easy.
http://news.yahoo.com/brian-williams--seal-team-6-stories-are-the-latest-to-come-under-fire-210753237.html
It practically writes itself doesn't it, especially when truth or facts don't matter.
So now Brian has gotten himself embedded with Seal Team Six...lol...and one of its members gave him a piece of the chopper they blew up in the Bin Hidin raid, cuz, ya know, they always take the time to go around and pick up keep sakes & souvenirs that they think Brian might like to have.
Self centered narcissistic assholes at their very finest for fame, fun & profit, whether by Jackie Coakley & Lena Dunham or Sir Brian of Williams (what the hell, lets just go ahead and knight him).
And the truth is the very first casualty.
Not following.
Why would the US need a Crimean port to threaten Russia?
Firstly most of Russia is land-locked.
Secondly, the US already has naval access to bases throughout the Pacific, Atlantic, North Sea, and the Med. Shortly, they can already get to all of Russia's sea coast. What would the US get from Crimea?
It's not that they want the Crimea. it's that they wanted to take Crimea away from Russia, who does need it. Not surprisingly, the Russians were not going to allow that to happen, and did not.
Anyone on the US side of this who did not see exactly what the Russians were going to do in this scenario beforehand was a moron or delusional or both. The Russians behaved exactly as anyone with any interest in Russian history would have expected them to act.
This is regardless of leadership, by the way. This has zero to do with Putin. NO Russian leadership would allow the loss of Crimea. Just ain't gonna happen.
American foreign policy is all about denial, literally. It's about denying their enemies things that America cannot have. Iraq, Syria, Libya, Yemen, and now the Ukraine. Note the pattern.
Washington is also about denial as well. "We do not torture." "We are not spying on your phone calls."
Deny. Deny. Deny.
Control. Control. Control.
" Russia still has large coastal line to defend . Now what will you claim next ? US navy can destroy them in 24 hours . Isn't it ?
No, they can't.
Russia's coastline is 37,600 km and its land borders are 20,200 km - a far way from 'mostly land-locked'. I suspect you may be thinking of Utah.
>>>the USSA ended up with a shitty rump state
If VVP plays his cards right, the AngloZionist Rump will get considerably smaller.
Right now, it still looks too big in that dress.
That explains Putin's statement about ensuring the territorial integrity of the Ukraine. He doesn't want to foot the bill, and why should he? So, he's not going to want more territory, if he wants any of it at all. Dingbats in Kiev made the mess and they should damned well be the ones to clean it up.
I agree with Saker on the point of Russia can literally just take what it wants of the Ukraine and NATO can't do a damned thing about it. NATO is just like the schoolyard bully. Will pick on the small kids (Serbia, Libya, Afghanistan) but won't go after the bigger kids they know can strike back and give them a bloody nose.
How stupid is hal10000?
It is Russia which has military forces in Crimea and eastern Ukraine.
The school yard bully is obviously Puutie and Russia will seffer under his leadership.
We did get their 42 tons of gold.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-03-10/was-price-ukraines-liberation-h...
Pinto Currency = Paid by Puutie.
Whenever a sniper attack would benefit US foreign policy, somehow a sniper attack happens. Now, should we not consider it possible that the secret forces Obama commands could not just go to Kiev and do what needed to be done.
Most people don't know that Obama commands a special presidential Kill Team. Special Forces who operate as killers, and follow only Obama's direct orders to them. Why does the preident need a personal kill team. And what wouldn't they do.
I say the US used East European agents from former Yugoslavia and brought them in to make th hits under CIA and US Special Forces command, then, as videos prove.
Latina Lover,
Your post is typical for a befuddled beaner. Always support a strongman ruler who will send you some payment, as Puutie is now.
Nuland was supporting the removal of a corrupt totalitarian ruler, despite the EU love of the type. It seems that you also have a great love of the Yatso type government. It was not a coup launched by the US. It was a justified call for government change. Just because you cannot concieve of any liberty allowed by a government does not mean that others cannot.
If Nuland wanted to support the removal of a corrupt totalitarian ruler she should have started with Obama !!!
I am awaiting the response for a justified call for government change in the US !
Ukrainians are tough, they can handle their own shit, we should mind our own fucking business and do the same !!!!!!
There was government change in the US. Unfortunately it was Obama who fooled the people, TWICE.
He will be out in two more years. Impeachment would be nice but he will get little more accomplished in his time left. At least there is a Republican opposition in the legislative bodies to apply some restraint.
Thanks for buying that ocean front property in Arizona.
Perhaps would you be interested in this bridge to Hawaii? Red pill/blue pill. Oh just make it purple pill for Augustus.
"At least there is a Republican opposition in the legislative bodies to apply some restraint."
LOLOL, what planet are you living on?
There is no opposition. Two sides of the same coin...Remember Obamacare?
-
pinto,
A blank post is better than your others. I'll green vote that one.
We have been affirming that it was the Maidan people themselves who opened fire on the protestors and police that morning. People laughed - called us Kremlin apologists. Now, a year later, the BBC finally begins to tell the truth.
Are Washington/London going to slap sanctions on Kiev?
No. We are beyond the point where the western government needs the sheeple to believe its lies.
Crimes by our friends are not crimes at all. Kiev can blow the shit up with artillery and bombers from the sky, but the moment an Eastern Ukrainian shoots back, it's unacceptable.
They guy claims that he was a sniper. He does not have any knowledge of which faction hired him or authoriaed the operation.
Idiot the only faction who was stirring the pot was usa backed putsch maidan . Update your facts sheep .
the truth has become the enemy of the state
Has?
A little late. It always was and will be.
Das Jude.
Hey Freedom123, shouldn't you be fighting and dying like the rest of the Ukie fascist losers in the Debaltsevo cauldron, instead of pasting and copying useless propaganda?
Of course there was an armed coup against Yanukovich led by the USSA,....who ever heard of a President running away from protestors to another country unless his life was threatened?
Donetsk looks more like Minsk 1941 by the day, Miraopul more like Leningrad.
Nothing wrong with taking sides in a Civil War since every side is a loser in it.
I think we're beyond "getting ugly" here. This is a war in the East...and while I'm no expert on Russia certainly there are more than just Russians there.
Kolomoyskyi, the insane Czar of Dnipropetrovsk, founded his own private thug army - the Dnipro volunteer batallion. He also funds the other sixteen volunteer batallions of Ukraine militia - which sort of come under the Ukraine National Guard for legitimacy - but they're not really direclty under command of the Ukraine Army or the Ministry of Defense. At best, they coordinated their activities with the UAF.
Right Sector and assorted Nazis have their own militia. They are sort of granted legitimacy because their leader, Dmitry Yarosh (Hitler's Mini-Me), is in charge of the Interior Ministry and Stazi troops. Well, he's actually #2. The other Nazis - CIA's Svaboda - had their leader appointed to run state security. Yarosh is a bigger butcher and far more powerful of the two, so the CIA has failed another Stazi-stuffing yet again.
So you have the Ukraine Armed Forces, whose military commanders reported to the Ministry of Defense. Then you had a bunch of private militias operating semi-independently under the guise of the Ukrainian National Guard. Then you had the Nazi militias reporting to their leaders in the Interior Ministry (the Ukraine DHS). Yes, of course this sounds completely fucked up. You have a half-finished Jewish Mafia war masquerading as a fully-completed coup.
Kolomoyskyi goes with the flow and is on whoever's side is winning (and most profitable for him). At one time, he was on the Gas Witch's side. Then he switched to Yanukovych. Then he switched to the Yats - Porky comedy hour and built the militias. Now, he's switched to the Nazis. Well, not him actually. His 17 battalions of kinda-National-Guard guys just decided that they should really be commanded by Yarosh, unofficial leader of the Stazi. All together, the Nazis NOW have far more soldiers and power than the crumbling mostly-conscript Ukraine Army.
Oh yeah, Yarosh doesn't like ANY Russians and doesn't care much for Porky and Yats. The U.S. isn't going to send heavy arms to his Stazi thugs, though - only the 'official' Ukrainian Army. Why the sudden rush to get heavy arms to them? Because the only reason Yarosh has let the Ukrainian Army exist is to get money and arms from American. If they can't get any arms, then Yarosh will kill the UAF. If the UAF does get arms, Yarosh will take them for his army and then kill the UAF. I guess the U.S. figured the UAF would survive if they got bigger toys than the Stazi right away. The U.S. wasn't expecting over half the forces to essentially 'quit' the UAF and join the Stazi troops like they just did.
I don't know if Yarosh actually wants to run Ukraine. He just wants to head his fantasy unit: 14th Waffen Grenadier Division of the SS (1st Galician) and kill people. He absolutely loves to do that, especially if they're Russian. Kolomoyskyi may have handed over all the volunteer battalions to secure his place in the new government. That would be the Nazi government that replaces the failed CIA/State Department puppet government. I don't know if that means Kolomoyskyi wants to be president, PM or Queen of New Galicia. He just wants to matter (small penis syndrome no doubt).
Screw the ceasefire and 'Western Leader' bullshit. Putin doesn't care because he knows Yarosh and Kolomoyskiy are in charge and they didn't agree to ANY ceasefire. The U.S. - as usual - is completely oblivious to the approaching shit-storm. They really think Porky and Yats are going to be in power in a month or two and their government matters.
Watching the latest failed U.S. attempt at regime change is like watching "Ow, My Balls" reruns over and over again. The pain just never ends.
Excellent Analysis, Paveway IV. It is ZH'ers like yourself that keep me reading comments despite the endless deluge of drivel spewed by robotic Ukie Trolls.
I would add that Kolomoyskiy will likely try to cut a deal with Putin, when it becomes obvious that the Ukraine is a failed state, when every last hrvynia of profit is squeezed out of a mordibund economy and no more money will be forthcoming fromthe western useful idiots.
Yarosh, I don't know, but I suspect he would be happy to rule Galicia, a strategically and economically worthless piece of real estate.
I'm looking for work and hoping to find something at Stratfor or maybe The Brookings Institution. Do you think I should have left off the "Ow My Balls" reference?
For the geographically challenged (me), the former Kingdom of Galicia was here.
Please do not confuse this with the Galicia state of beautiful NW Spain. They prefer Galizian and they will kick your ass. That's all I know about them.
This is from the BBC. Why is my HorseShit meter going off? They are state media. Obfuscation imminent.
This BBC (i.e. vetted) piece is mildly encouraging; the "West" may be laying the PR groundwork for a pivot away from the Nazis.
The BBC plays a dual role. They also broke the news that the 'evidence' that Colin Powell presented in the UNSC on the chemical weapons in Iraq was based on some things that a Iraqi asylum seeker said when he applied for asylum in Germany. They want to present themselves as fair and unbiased.
Gotta give the BBC credit for being ahead of the curve on that WTC7 thingy...
What are the odds that the BBC would erroneously report live on air that WTC7 had collapsed 22 minutes before it was actually demolished?
There are no odds for that. The odds are zero.
A steel building had never collapsed in that way due to fire and has not since, and yet they knew 22 minutes in advance that it would collapse.
The BBC is owned by the Rothschild syndicate. Go figure.
Think about it. Lay off the fluoride for a few days and think about it again. They think we are all too toopid to objectively look at the world they have us all living in.
Lol, there was about 800 pounds of sarc in my post.
Here's what a skyscraper looks like on fire. At least the one's Larry Silverstein doesn't own...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=65Qg_-89Zr8
(not my down vote, btw)
BBC also reported after the MH17 fiasco in Ukraine that eyewitnesses saw at least one fighter jet tailing the aircraft before it went down. That report promptly got tossed down the memory hole.
To be fair, the media does such a sloppy job in their rush to be first. They end up getting taken way too easily and it's been a long-standing problem. The media is just too easily manipulated. Kuwaiti baby incubators, the Racak massacre, Rwanda, Qaddaffi's use of rape and Viagra in Libya, on through the whole Maidan debacle and so on. The 2003 Iraq War was not some single "oops" moment for the media, but just the cresecendo of a long-established trend. And since the birth of Internet, it just accelerated. For a humours but illustrative example, https://www.popehat.com/2014/12/20/the-curious-case-of-the-t-v-attorney-...
I've said it many times that it's not the case we believe RT or Russian media, it's that we are wise enough now to not bellieve our own Western media at all.
Journalists are whorenalists. See what is going on with the disgraced NB reporter. Amanpour's career took off in Bosnia (and she is married to Albright's sidekick Rubin who set Yugoslavia up to be bombed to pieces because they made YU an offer they could not accept).
There is no honest investigative reporting anymore as Seymour Hersch said some time ago. They write what their owners/handlers want to hear or else they don't get other assignments/pay. A lot of journalists are in the pockets of secret agencies and get rewarded for their 'cooperation'.
OF COURSE the locals were responsible...... no outside involvement AT ALL.....the US would NEVER interfere in the affaairs of a sovreign state, would NEVER push the overthrow of a 'hostile' government, no matter what...... and the US would NEVER align itself with a bunch of fascists no matter what the stakes......
see... the truth eventually comes out... now move on.. nothing more to see
Latino Licker,
Shouldn't you be over there volunteering your services as the lav cleaner to make sure that Puuties' invaders have clean asses? The shit you post here must come straight from Puutie anyway. Reduce the expense of transport and get a pay raise.
Maybe your buddies supported by Puutie will let you fire the next rocket taking down a civilian plane.
Of course Yatso thought his life was threatened. He knew that he was a criminal carrying out the Puutie plan. He had pillaged enough to live as a successful mini-oligarch and needed Russian protection. Did Puutie use any protection when he made you so very happy?
It's a matter of TRUST.
Hang in there ZH'rs.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RaOZ3Gkoruw
Ukie propaganda. Nothing to see, move on.
I keep telling: you and others are part of a troll brigade to 'enlighten' us misguided souls on ZH on 'what is really going on in Ukraine and Russia'. You can recognize them when you look at their bio: a few weeks on ZH. As far as I am concerned everybody is free to what he or she wants to write on ZH but trolls should just fuck off.
Yeah, an extension of Cass Sunstein's "Cognitive Infiltration".
Found this interview with author Douglas Valentine this AM that speaks right to this.
How do we know you're not a troll?
Cause I have been here for 3 years and 32 weeks and have commented on all sorts of things, not only on some current geopolitical situation.
4 years and 27 weeks, but more than 5+ since I just browsed when I found ZH. The user base from the .RU crowd has increased
dramatically over the years due to concerted efforts of the Russian propaganda machine to "influence public opinion" on social media websites in the US and Europe. Not only that, I do believe the multiple faces of "Tyler Durden" include many from that area of the world.
I don't care who the biggest faction is. They need to fuck off. They can go and join the social sites of the MSM (that have journalists that work for governments). Alternative media should be clean from these bozos.
I agree, but these ZH users, or trolls, are paid to visit social media websites in the US and elsewhere to influence public opinion on Russia's behalf. Unfortunately, it is their job.
I have a friend who manages a website for XYZ social media website who tells me about all the new accounts created from areas east of Poland. Then, he tells me that suddenly gets new accounts created from users in Spain ad Italy. Why? The trolls using proxy servers in those countries to hide their tracks.
Like the proof of Russian soldiers in east Ukraine, I've yet to see any evidence that Russia has been doing this. Another one of those big internet myths Snopes will eventually get around to debunking. It isn't just people like Bush who are adherents to blind faith. What we do know is that the UK government has been reported to have created a Facebook brigade.
I'd gladly spread the truth and if the Russians pay me, even better. lol
Why do people continue to act as though the US doesn't have its very own online propaganda army?
"DARPA seeks to develop tools to help identify misinformation or deception campaigns and counter them with truthful information, reducing adversaries' ability to manipulate events."
http://www.darpa.mil/Our_Work/I2O/Programs/Social_Media_in_Strategic_Com...
Persona management was probably just one of the hydra threads that got Michael Hastings whacked
http://www.globalresearch.ca/connections-between-michael-hastings-edward...
Sock Puppets and Other Tricks
Other clues as to what ProjectPM-related material may have led the FBI to investigate Michael Hastings can be found in his published work.
Endgame Systems CEO Nathaniel Fick. Formerly of the Center for a New American Security, Fick took over for Endgame in November 2012.
In a May 18, 2012, article on propaganda efforts by the State Department, Hastings referred to a “program being developed by the Pentagon [that] would design software to create “sock puppets” on social media outlets.” The HBGary emails are littered with references to this type of “persona management” technology.
Principal among these was a June 2010 United States Air Force (USAF) contract from the 6thContracting Squadron at MacDill Air Force Base in Florida. It sought providers of “persona management software” that would allow 50 users to control up to 500 fictional personae.
These sock puppets were required to be “replete with background, history, supporting details, and cyber presences that are technically, culturally, and geographically consistent.” In other words, avatars so convincing they could fool the people with whom they were interacting into believing they were real.
MacDill Air Force Base is home to the United States Special Operations Command (USSOCOM), the section of the military that oversees and coordinates all special-forces activity globally. USSOCOM lists under its “core activities” the employment of psychological operations (PSYOPS) and information operations (IO)—exactly the type of activity this “sockpuppeting” technology would be employed in.
With the NSA providing the ostensible proxy masks one could presume.
Yup, and although I think the above story claim is a complete stinker, people here, and all over the internet, and mass media, in fact seem to have forgotten one very inconvenient fact:
1 March: Russia's parliament approves President Vladimir Putin's request to use force in Ukraine to protect Russian interests.
Russian parliament approves troop deployment in Ukraine - March 1st 2014
"oh ... bu!! ... but!! ... he was ... like, ... totally tricked into doing that man!!!"
Yeah, and I'm the fucking tooth fairy. And there's no armed invasion, nor direct Russian troop involvements in Ukraine either, right?
Denial, denial, denial, on and on it goes, this laughable juvenile Putin-fanboy lunatic jabbering and knee-jerking. This is the resulting level of imaginary reality and optional facts we have, in the resulting crippled mutilated 'discussion', that revolves entirely around pet propaganda narratives and nothing else.
Which was the intent of the pro-Russia-bot clique.
Though I do (apparently completely and wildly unrealistically!) expect zh, and its commentators, to be a whole lot smarter than this stupid racid muck.
Standards have slipped, plunged off the cliff even.
I don't doubt that Russia is supplying the rebels. I don't doubt either that there are Russian troops on the ground there in East Ukraine although nobody is presenting proof of that. Cause it would have impossible for the rebels to be reverse the cause of the war and make this progress without foreign help. Like it would not have been possible for Ukrainian opposition to have their coup d'etat without foreign help. Cookies don't cut it.
Putin was certainly not tricked. He just used the occassion presented to him. Did NATO war planners not foresee that he would take Crimea and support the rebels? Hard to imagine. They took a decision based on information they had and decided to take a gamble perhaps. This situation of course also works in NATO's favor in that sense that they now have the 'excuse' to put NATO basis and troops in Eastern Europe, right on Vlad's doorstep.
Cause this fight is essentially part of a bigger conflict and chess games are played one pawn at a time. But the players are Putin and NATO (and the financial sector they represent. Obama is merely a golf player). And Europe/EU is just a pawn. But hey, I live in Europe. Can WWIII be fought somewhere else this time? Or rather, not be fought at all. The planet has more important problems to worry about.
One point, the armed rebel fight basically didn't exist prior to Putin's taking Crimea. They were thoroughly opportunistic in their break away, seeing Ukraine was economically totally ruined, and the IMF making it worse still, while seeing Crimea getting the Russian candy and bribes, and thinking, hmm, ... you know what? I'd rather get Moscow's bribes and candy, and some power in my own little pro-Moscow fiefdom would be lovely too.
Noes!! ... daes iz reel paytriots!!
edit: One last point, UK and France are not strategic pawns, they have nukes and people with nukes can at a minimum EMP other states (even a major ally) to oblivion. So treating them as an expendable pawn would be suicidal for the simple fact that you can not push a credible nuclear power into a corner and expect to come away a winner and grinner. So I would not presume Europe is a pawn (as many do). It wasn't a pawn in the cold war (but it was the initial conventional engagement battle zone), and it isn't an expendable strategic pawn now. Those US B-61s distributed in European hardened aircraft shelters, within theater strike range of the tactical fighters that will deliver them is to make sure that any massed attack on Europe would surely fail, while the territorial aggressor itself is being obliterated. MAD, huh?
Thanks for this. I always appreciate your intelligent contributions although perhaps I don't always agree with them.
The problem with the 'initial conventional engagement battle zone' as you called it (can it be somewhere else for a change? Or better, nowhere at all) is that a conventional engagement can go out of control really fast. During the cold war there were whole scenarios about how to conduct and what to do during a 'limited' chemical, biological or tactical nuclear attack. Biological and chemical weapons are banned but I am sure some stacks are lying around somewhere 'just in case'. And Vlad has many tactical nuclear weapons and they have that in their military doctrine. When confronted and threatened with massive conventional forces their doctrine OKs the use of them. And then all bets are off. All it takes is a nervous commander losing his cool or an accident that is interpreted wrongly.
America might respect Europe but as long as we play along (Remember "fuck the EU"?). America during the Yugoslav war wanted to show Europe who really can control the continent.
Sure, Britain and France have nuclear weapons but they are nothing compared to the US and Russia. Using them would be certain suicide.
I wish Ukranians well but that place should have been treated as a buffer zone and not by both players to get into their sphere of influence. A major part of that country is ethnic Russian and there are millions of mixed marriages. If you think that Yugoslavia was a disaster just wait and see if something big would start in Ukraine. And it already is big. Some German newspaper was quoting German secret services saying that the death count in Ukraine already stands at 50,000. At that pace is already more than in Bosnia.
But never let a good crisis go to waste. NATO will bring troops and basis closer to Russia. And perhaps nuclear weapons whoselaunches will give only Russia ten minutes to detect and respond. In turn Russia will put nuclear weapons in Kalinigrad.
It is very very dangerous to put that sort of powerful military hardware and troops in close proximity. It is waiting for an accident to happen.
Europe is used as a pawn by both Russia and the US in their quest for dominance over Eurasia.
You're welcome. I hope you do disagree with me, I can't think of anything more pointless than popularity, reputation or consensus-building. It's why I make sure I'm rarely nice to people in discussions. It's about content. Some people I just respect, others, well, you can probably tell the difference.
I wish Central Europe would get over its ardor for world war, like the head of the IMF, it's always got to be a fricken European.
Yeah? ... and it's different for USA and Russia how? It still means the US can't and won't dare to treat them as pawns, and they likewise will insist that wider Europe isn't treated as a pawn either.
Russia really blew that last year, they could have put the US on the mat and got precisely that. I can scarcely believe how badly Putin's blown it. Once Putin's finally flushed from Russian political system it's clear Russia will have a far better shot at finally approaching that. Going to take 15 to 20 years minimum, from here, even if things started improving immediately
The head of the WB always has to be a fricken American. Except for the last one. He has dual nationality....I guess that makes it different. The WB was originally founded to reconstruct Europe after WWII but the European Bank for reconstruction was used instead.
That division of jobs was established when WB and IMF came out of Bretton Woods. They are also referred to as the 'Washington consensus'. In development circles and poor countries the IMF (with its Structural Adjument Programmes) is seen as a drug pusher (the drug here is money) and debt collector for the international financial sector while the WB is seen as financier of projects for which Western companies get the bid and deliver the goods and hardware (such as an infamous case where a deal was struck with a dictator to build a nuclear powerplant to be built by Westinghouse in an earthquake area near an active volcano. I kid you not). The WB provides grants but also a lot of loans that need to be paid back. With interest of course.
Yeah, the other day you wrote how Putin blew it. I am not so sure about that. We need to see how that will develop.
I am not a Putin fan as some are. I prefer the Western society over Russia and China anytime. I just think that you cannot have freedom without truth. And I don't like being played by the people that should 'represent' me.
This is just the result of geopolitical games that are being played. I don't take personally and try to look from it from the same perspective as I look at the ancient world. Same games are being played except the weapons have become much more powerful.
You know, I'm not even anti-Putin (and certainly not anti-Russian), I'm just sick of the totally pathetic crap coming from the Putin jizz-bots in here, so play a bit of devil's advocate. But I do think he made astounding mistakes.
I like the way you put it there, looking at ancients with nukes - apt.
The human race has not evolved much. Maybe were are not hardwired to do so.
Btw, in another post you say you are not American. Might I ask where you are from then?
Australian.
We are super-adaptable though.
Dutch, but have been outside for quite some time.
"We are super-adaptable though"
Yes, but our niche is getting smaller. Ranges and conditions for human operation are getting narrower. Plenty of environmental threats.
The niche has not physically got smaller, in fact it is still slowly expanding. Ranges and conditions for human life and function have never been greater than now. Populations in many countries demographically setting up for declines. Resources still abundant, not going to decline in the foreseeable. I'm a geo by trade, we have hundreds of years of living high on the hog left to go. The earth and the West in particular has spectacular primary industries capacity, and resources potential remaining, including energy.
'Environmental threats' are imagined fictions, potentialities, nothing more. The sun might blow up too. This is not to say hazard levels don't vary in time and space, but humanity is not going to be sitting around fretting about it, like some minority neurotics want us to. The majority are not going to respond in that way.
The question then is, what will we do?
Same as before, just better-er.
I'm more than OK with that. As apes go, we definitely have our shit together.
Should an ape really be expected to acheive this much?
Or more?
We're doin' OK ... so far.
BTW, monkey to monkey, what country are you residing in now?
Yeah, we have come a long way since the Serengeti. But it could be better if we wouldn't be stuck in geopolitical and oil&gas games. Humans have a good talent to find solutions to problems (even the ones we caused ourselves). It is just that politicians often stand in the way. All our energy problems could be solved if we would direct massive amounts of money towards it.
I agree on the way humans have populated this place even in the most inhospitable places but I disagree on the resource base. Raw material for fertilizers are getting scarcer or more difficult to obtain for instance. Air, water and soil pollution are in some places -even in my country- serious concerns. People are getting serious diseases at a younger age but we also got better at diagnosing and treating them. There is still though plenty enough to eat in the world. The white elephant in the room is overpopulation in combination with development. If everybody wants (and who doesn't) to live like us in the West then the world cannot provide enough resources.
Stationed in Bosnia for now.
We are getting better at that stuff all the time.
As for fertilizer, Australia is lousy with phosphates. Never and I mean never is humanity going to run out of phosphates. One of the best fertilizers in the world is ground up mafic igneous rocks. The worlds surface is more the 2/3rds covered in mafic extrusives. We won't ever run out of that. Plus the moon's crust and already powdered soil is also mafic rock.
Earth's air is also 78 % nitrogen, not going to run short of that. Go for a bike ride on the sea shore and a seagull will crap on you - terrific fertilizer!
Soil comes from rocks and organic matter. We make it for market gardens. We can purify water by distillation and we do have the energy and tech to do that in large volumes virtually indefinitely.
You're going to get cold there next week. Good chat, have fun Joe.
Thanks and thanks for the info. Phospates can be recycled out of sewage even but not necessary then. Potassium perhaps bigger problem. And nitrogen no problem at all as you said.
It is all a matter of will.
Was cold already last week with plenty of snow. I love winter so no problem there.
Cheers.
Potassium is one of the most common constituents of Earth. When you study geology it eventually dawns on you that earth is a giant ball of solidified crystaline fertilizer, that also just happens to contain the water necessary to break it down to more accessible components and solutes.
We apes won the cosmic jackpot there mate. ;-)
We apes won the cosmic jackpot there mate. ;-)
We just don't appreciate it enough.
Cheers!
The user base from the .RU crowd has increased dramatically over the years due to concerted efforts of the Russian propaganda machine to "influence public opinion" on social media websites in the US and Europe. How do you mr.nsa ? Because Forbes posted an article over it ? or simply truth isn't by your nation's coup side in Ukraine . last time we saw it was Uk plaaning to roll its 77th twitter troll brigade in april . Ignorance is Bliss .
Dude, Network Security is my domain. :-)
Could be a long term deep state troll
Yes, a long term deep state troll volunteer, to be precise.
Yeah, I was recruited during a Bohemian Grove orgy.
When a newbie shows up 9 seconds after an article appears with 36 links in his pocket, it may not be "proof" but it is suspicious.
We know what we know because we do our own due dilligence and thinking.
Its a side effect of the success of ZH.
We just have to try and ignore them.
Hell, if I see anyone post that many links I am not clickin any of them.
Granted, it is cause I am an asshole, but it does protect me nonetheless.
Well, I would click a bunch from Flak, but it was actually fun to argue with him/her.
pods
I watched a few for shits and giggles. Most were in Russian and don't provide any useful info. Total waste of time.
How do we know he's not a troll?
For one thing, he's been a member for longer than 14 weeks. His profile description, unlike freedom123's, isn't written in broken english and doesn't say:
"I am writing mainly about Russia and Putin regime. Because I see that ZH is not in balance with information about what's actually happening in Russia and what crimes Putin regime does to it's people and other nations. I understand both English & Russian - so I think it's my duty to serve English speaking world to spread truth about Putin regime to Western world."
Something else I'm noticing about some of the fascist ukies here is that their avatar icons look fairly similar - some abstract quad-symmetcial (swastika-like) emblem. Maybe that's how they identify eachother.
You are correct, I call them KTAs (Kremlin Troll Army) maggots. They also use multiple user names on ZH.
Russian Propaganda Machine is making "USEFUL IDIOTS" out of my US social media websites targeting not only ZH but others on the far left (Kremlin apologists) and far right.
I don't care if they are pro-Kiev or pro-Moscow. They just need to fuck off. They can troll on BI or other MSM news site but don't waste bits and bytes on ZH.
Forbes article on the Kremlin Troll Army:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulroderickgregory/2014/05/11/inside-putins...
Russia is winning the propaganda war on the Ukraine.
Like I said, pro-Kiev or pro-Moscow: they need to fuck off. And Forbes and other MSM are the media oulets for people with an agenda.
Russia winning the propaganda war on Ukraine? You'd be surprised how many people have their heads in their arses believing anything that comes out of State subsidized media in the West.
Telling these people that this whole conflict is more than just control over Ukraine goes beyond their mental capacities. And they get edgy because of that because they get a nagging feeling in their heads that they are being played as sheep and that upsets their worldview and view of themselves. In order to make that nagging feeling go away they will direct their anger at you. Cause a lot of people like being sheep. It is safe they think.
Well said, Joe A. I am open to counter arguments, but reading the mindless drivel aka state department talking points spewed by the Uie trolls gets rather tiresome.
Where ignorance is bliss
'Tis folly to be wise
Thomas Gray
Try making a sane argument next time.
Hint: A sane argument is not one based wishful thinking that gives US leaders far more credit as to their intelligence than is deserved. Your Amerika uber alles argument is rooted in fantasy, not fact.
Forbes article on the Kremlin Troll Army:
http://www.forbes.com/sites/paulroderickgregory/2014/05/11/inside-putins...
The surest way to know that there is an state-organised conspiracy against you is when large numbers of negative comments are posted to your opinion pieces.
Looks like Forbes really should suppress all comments to their forign policy articles. Problem solved.
It's just speculation on the author's part.
Russia doesn't need to pay anyone at all. Just have to sit back and watch as the public in the west continually gets demoralized and disconnected from their governments and let nature take it's course. Putin doesn't need anyone to defend Russia and most people on these boards are lashing out at the ineptitude and criminal negligence of our own leadership as they continue to show themselves to be lairs and thieves.
The only downside is that you see a lot of comments making out Putin to be the un-Obama. Putin is out to defend himself and his national interest and they just marginally coincide with our own here at this time but make no mistake, Putin will turn on anyone just as surely as Obama does.
Excellent post. There truly is no "clean shirt" on any side of any of these issues (Ukraine, MENA, etc, etc, etc).
Forbes along with other mainstream media liars, is not used to the pushback by knowledgeable readers who can think for themselves. The politically correct Maidan narrative, for example, is a complete joke. When did a President of any country 'run' away from protestors, unless they were in imminent danger of their lives. Since there was no due process for impeaching the President, it is obvious that the process was illegal, resulting in a putsch or coup. It was this illegality that provoked Crimea to leave the Ukraine, and for Donbass to rebel and declare independence. Even if you hated Yanukovich, and he was a real piece of shit, still the Ukraine would be a unitary state today if due process had been followed.
We are now coming up on 1 year since the "Deal" was reached to end the protests, and get Ukraine on the road to unity and prosperity. As reported by the BBC.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26289318
Some of the comments by the dear leaders sound so positive.
"
Polish Foreign Minister Radoslaw Sikorski tweeted that the deal was a "good compromise for Ukraine" which would open the way "to reform and to Europe".
Mr Sikorski told reporters on his return to Warsaw that Russia had played a constructive role in reaching the agreement.
The White House has welcomed Friday's deal, praising "the courageous opposition leaders who recognised the need for compromise".
President Barack Obama is due to speak to his Russian counterpart, Vladimir Putin, later on Friday.
UK Prime Minister David Cameron also welcomed the agreement and called on all sides in Ukraine to "get behind this deal and deliver it according to the timetable set out".
What could possibly go wrong?
His national interest? Was the winter olympics or the world cup in the national interest? or was it in the interest of his KGB Mafia brothers? over $100B has been given to projects with no fucking use.... but no we will just call that in the nations interest.
Putin only gives one fuck about himself....period.
Putin is more corrupt than other leader in the world, how is he the richest man in the world but only earns a modest wage being the president? Is that fucking good at blackjack?
Russia is winning the war in Ukraine, this truth prevails in the alternative media such as ZH.
To say "Russia is winning the propaganda war on the Ukraine" is propaganda in itself.
Joe A:
". . . As far as I am concerned everybody is free to what he or she wants to write on ZH but trolls should just fuck off."
Heh, Joe
Don't worry about posting a forewarding address.
Here I have one for you and the trolls over here:
http://lerry123.company.frbiz.com/i95486273-660liter-plastic-outdoor-gar...
Troll, freedom123: FUCK OFF!
Hannibal,
Why don't you Puutie loves gather on some Russian language web site to practice fucking each other?
When Puutie calls you can be prepared.
Please pull your head out of your ass.
We all are tired of watching you embarrass yourself. . No worries though. The world also needs idiots and morons.
Please pull your head out of your ass.
We all are tired of watching you embarrass yourself.. No worries though. The world also needs idiots and morons.
Did it hurt when they grafted the marionnete strings into your body?
Here are your terrorists, viedorklis_goatfucker123_lv:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LXnLb376PMk
You lowlife scum piece of filth.
About "freedom123":
"I am writing mainly about Russia and Putin regime. Because I see that ZH is not in balance with information".
This says it all. This Nazi-asshole perceives himself as educator of the ZH crowd.
giovanni_f,
The complete ignorance of many of the ZH crowd is readily evident.
Even when presented with evidence, the Puutie lovers quickly respond to the dog whistle to accuse someone of being a Nazzi or, even worse, a Jew who love Nazis.
That says it all.
Who benefitted? A much easier outcome to calculate.
The Romans understood that equation 2000 years ago.
As in most crimes, follow the money.
Indeed,
froze25!
Regarding all the supreme crimes,
follow the money to its SOURCE!
The biggest gangsters are the banksters, that can legally counterfeit the public "money" supply out of nothing as debts, while everyone is forced to accept that fraud, including even the government itself that enforces those frauds, because the best organized gangs of criminals were able to apply the methods of organized crime to the political processes, in order to effectively control governments to privatize public powers, like control over the public "money" supply.
The struggle for control over resources becomes the struggle to control the financial accounting systems, which have become almost totally enforced frauds, in which situation there is practically nothing but organized crime, surrounded by controlled opposition, that includes governments as the biggest form of organized crime, controlled by the best organized gangs of criminals, which enables there to be public schools and mass media that put on elections as puppet shows for the masses of muppets ... If that fake democracy's fake education fails, then those established systems shift gears, such as happened in the Ukraine.
ALL the significant political events are skirmishes between the different organized crime gangs, with the supreme prize continuing to be the control over the monetary system, which then controls everything else, including the ability to pay for the murder system. While the basic prize is control over resources, the effective social control over those resources is control of the monetary system. Hence, the history of backing up lies with violence has become systems of enforced frauds.
The Zero Hedge story above is a tiny, tiny keyhole into the background that everything was based on organized lies operating robberies. There are deeper levels with respect to the truism: "As in most crimes, follow the money." Namely, follow that "money" to its SOURCE to understand the supreme crimes.
MONEY IS MEASUREMENT BACKED BY MURDER. False flag murders are one of the mainstays of the history of militarism. The deeper levels of those facts are that thousands of years of the history of backing up lies with violence, becoming systems of legalized lies, backed by legalized violence, have created fundamentally fraudulent financial accounting systems, which are controlling civilization to behave in criminally insane ways, that have always been getting worse at an exponentially accelerating rate for thousands of years, but which tragic trajectory is now requiring doublings of such magnitude as to become mind boggling.
The Ukrainian situation is the international banksters attempting to consolidate their global hegemony of ENFORCING FRAUDS, despite that seriously risking starting a war that could result in out of control uses of weapons of mass destruction. There has been a history of murders on an exponential rate. Single acts of assassination created consequences that could result in mass murders later ... When one follows the money to its SOURCE the unavoidable conclusion is that civilization has become terminally crazy, and thus, the paradox is final failure from too much "success."
What is unfolding in the Ukraine is an extension of the same pattern of historical events as were described by the historian Carroll Quigley:
"powers of financial capitalism
had another far-reaching goal,
nothing less than to create a
world system of financial
control in private hands
able to dominate the
political system of
each country and
the economy of
the world as
a whole ..."
However, those are not adequately described with the phrase "powers of financial capitalism." There are no good labels, that are widely understood, to discuss the political situations that exist when governments are the biggest forms of organized crime, controlled by the best organized gangs of criminals. The situation in the Ukraine was one of the historical tipping points, where one of the previously dominant organized crime gangs were supplanted by another organized crime gang, which was thereby able to proclaim itself to be the "government."
My general view is that we should stop using false fundamental dichotomies, and the related impossible ideals, to discuss political events. Rather, we should attempt to use more unitary mechanisms to develop better political science.
Money is always measurement backed by murder. Sniper assassinations take place inside of that context. However, those systems, which were sufficiently successful for thousands of years, are now being pumped up and UP by the development of electronics and atomic energy. Since those advances in science and technology are still being channeled through social pyramid systems based on backing up lies with violence, we are witnesses to the emerging Peak Insanities, spiraling through almost infinite tunnels of deceits.
Symbolically speaking, it may be considered significant that the Chernobyl disaster took place in the Ukraine.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chernobyl_disaster
Mikhail Gorbachev has previously stated his view that the destruction of the Soviet Union symbolically began with the Chernobyl disaster. Today, the paradoxical ways that electronic and atomic energy are being developed through social pyramid systems whose basic structure is based on being able to back up lies with violence (whose most important forms are the ways that financial frauds are enforced), results in us being able to read on Zero Hedge information communicated to us through electronic means, about the increasingly severe MADNESSES of the previously biggest and best organized gangs of criminals, (who control NATO countries) attempting to consolidate their global hegemony through combined monetary/military systems, despite that risking out of control deployment of atomic power!
E.g.:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-01-09/mikhail-gorbachev-warns-major-nuclear-war-europe-over-ukraine
Mikhail Gorbachev Warns of Major (Nuclear) War In Europe Over Ukraine
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-01-09/road-war-russia
The Road To War With Russia
Former US Secretary of State Henry Kissinger has givena chilling assessment of a new geopolitical situation taking shape amid the Ukrainian crisis, warning of a possible new Cold War and calling the West’s approach to the crisis a “fatal mistake. ...”
The overwhelming vast majority of people do NOT WANT to follow the money to its SOURCE, because they would then have to face the facts that the public "money" supply, that they rely upon, was based on backing up measurements with murders. To more fully face those facts requires comprehending that there is almost nothing but organized crime and controlled opposition.
Snipers are matches which could light the world on fire, because the world has become a tinderbox of inflammable materials ... due to thousands of years of human history being based on backing up lies with violence being amplified to astronomical sizes by progress in science and technology, while NOTHING like that has happened in political science, because such progress in political science would require eschewing the standard reliance upon false DUALITIES.
All human beings and human civilizations operate as entropic pumps of energy flows, which have been misunderstood in the maximum backward ways possible, because the biggest bullies, who are currently the banksters, have been able to promote their bullshit social stories. In that context, it is practically impossible to have any genuine "peace processes," because everyone participating is doing so as professional liars and immaculate hypocrites, because the natural languages that they speak, and the basic philosophy of science that they presume, are BACKWARDS!
Human realities are always organized lies operating robberies, in which the most extreme form of robbery is murder. Governments are always the biggest form of organized crime, controlled by the best organized gangs of criminals. Those are the real context in which the events in the Ukraine, and everywhere else, are playing through. The chronic political problems inherent in the nature of life are being resolved by the people who are the best at being dishonest, and backing that up with violence, competing with each other, in ways which are due to morbid psychological and political habits, which have been developing for thousands of years.
In that context, false flag snipers murdering people is nothing new. The only thing which is "new" is that now there is electronics and atomic energy, while nothing else is "new" in politics. The deeper issues are whether or not the human species will be able to survive through to develop some superior political science, which is consistent with the progress in physical sciences. However, at the present time, there are almost no indications that is possible ... Rather, we are still on the path of individual murders heading towards provoking mass murders. A better theory and practice of death controls is possible ... however, that continues to look practically impossible at the present time.
Fuck the EU! - Victoria Nuland - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CL_GShyGv3o
If we listen to it, that "fuck the EU" part is the most unnatural excerpt of the entire conversation. Almost as if it were faked. The last part being discussed were the Russians before that outburst. Weird way for it to come out like that. Not that it matters, but i wanted to mention it.
I think the link posted above doesn't lead to the real conversation. This version really is edited, this is the real one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5n8UbJ8jsk
That video, as it details in the details, was an excerpt and was edited for brvity. The entire telephone conversation is indeed available and Fuch the EU was as natural in the course of conversation, as was the midwiving the regime change throug NATO parts of the conversation.
Well spoken, Sir. In the real conversation, she says "Fuck the EU" really naturally, without a doubt.
Thanks. Too bad I can't spell...
I'll second that vote. Hard to believe the us would sound like a callous imperial killing machine
Nail gun on ailse 8!
Two months after the change of regime in Kiev, the Polish press has disclosed the role of Donald Tusk’s government in preparing the coup. The new revelations belie Western discourse and demonstrate that the current interim government of Oleksandr Tourtchynov was imposed by NATO in violation of international law.
http://www.voltairenet.org/article183373.html
Why are Poles ALWAYS such Useful Sluts?
(shaking head in incredulity and rolling eyes)
They hate Russia.
The curious part is currently more so than they hate Ukies...anyone familiar with the history has to chuckle when Poland and Lithuania are organizing to help Ukraine against Russia.
The Poles and Lithuanians were once the joint overlords of West-Central Ukraine.
The involvement of Poland and Lithuania in the current mess is almost funny, as they are pretending to be one of two lions (the other being Russia) now fighting over the carcass of Ukraine. On its own, the best Poland can be is a hyena, and even that gives them too much credit.
Poles : Earth's biggest cry baby c**ts.