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Latest Greek Negotiations Fall Apart; Risk Slides After Greece Says "Won't Take Orders On Bailout"
UPDATE: *EU FINANCE MINISTERS' TALKS WITH GREECE OVER FOR TODAY, GREECE SAYS WON'T TAKE ORDERS ON BAILOUT
EU President Jeroen Dijsselbloem to explain just how far apart they are now...
* * *
Dijsselbloem headlines:
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS MINISTERS WERE DISAPPOINTED BY WEEKEND TALKS
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS BEST WOULD BE EXTENSION FOR GREEK PROGRAM
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS EXTENSION WOULD ALLOW FLEXIBILITY FOR GREECE
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS EXTENSION WOULD INVOLVE COMMITMENTS
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS WOULD NEED AGREEMENT TO ROLL BACK MEASURES
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS WE STAND READY TO CONTINUE DISCUSSIONS
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS IT'S UP TO GREECE TO DECIDE ON EXTENSION
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS COULD BE EXTRA EUROGROUP ON FRIDAY
- *DIJSSELBLOEM SAYS WE HAVE THIS WEEK, BUT THAT'S ABOUT IT
So the 10-day ultimatum was just extended by 40%? Clearly The EU is worried.
* * *
Well that didn't last long. It seems - just as earlier in the week - the ability for either side in this Euro-system death match game of chicken to find any common ground to even start negotiations remains lost:
- GREEK GOVT OFFICIAL SAYS THAT "IN THESE CIRCUMSTANCES, THERE CANNOT BE A DEAL TODAY"
- EUROGROUP DISCUSSED "UNREASONABLE", "UNACCEPTABLE" DRAFT TEXT INSISTING ON EXTENDING BAILOUT
Full statement (and rejected phrase) (h/t @EdConwaySky)
* * *
The reaction...
* * *
EURUSD is tumbling and S&P Futures are falling fast.
and Greek Bank Bonds had been hinting at problems all day...
Further comments:
- *GREEK GOVT OFFICIAL SAYS NO AGREEMENT POSSIBLE AT EUROGROUP
- *GREEK GOVT OFFICIAL SAYS EU PROPOSALS `ABSURD,' `UNACCEPTABLE'
Greek govt official says in e-mailed note that Eurogroup Chairman Jeroen Dijsselbloem’s proposals for the country to observe its existing bailout commitments are “absurd,” “unacceptable.”
#Greek govt says text presented at #eurogroup was a reversal of agreement @atsipras & @J_Dijsselbloem made last Thursday.
— Peter Spiegel (@SpiegelPeter) February 16, 2015
According 2 draft I got, #Eurogroup called for "best use of existing built-in flexibility in the current programme." Hence #Greece objection
— Peter Spiegel (@SpiegelPeter) February 16, 2015
A Greek government official said that a draft text presented to euro zone finance ministers meeting in Brussels on Monday spoke of Greece extending its current bailout package and as such was "unreasonable" and would not be accepted.
Without specifying who put forward the text to the meeting chaired by Dutch Finance Minister Jeroen Dijsselbloem, the official said: "Some people's insistence on the Greek government implementing the bailout is unreasonable and cannot be accepted.
"Those who keep returning to this issue are wasting their time. Under such circumstances, there cannot be a deal today."
* * *
So this is the next key event:
Over in Frankfurt, the ECB Governing Council will meet on Wednesday.
Close attention will be paid to any decision the governors take on Greece and its lenders' access to central-bank liquidity. Already, Greek banks, which have been hurt by an outflow of deposits due to the country's political and financial uncertainty over the last two months, can no longer use their government's bonds to get liquidity from the ECB, depending instead on more expensive emergency funding from their own central bank.
But of course that still leaves the uncomfortable post-Eurogroup press conference and statement which we suspect will be even more uncomfortable than last week's for Dijsselbloem.
"GREECE WILL NOT CROSS RED LINES IT HAS DRAWN" all board! pic.twitter.com/zWqhbqLAoT
— Mr. K. H&S (@ECantoni) February 16, 2015
Zee Germans are not happy and, as KeepTalkingGreece reports, are now suggesting Tsipras replace varoufakis at the negotiating table...
An SPD politician from Merkels’ social-democrat coalition suggested s that Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras should replaces Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis as he apparently creates lots of confusion, German politicians cannot understand.
SPD executive board member, Joachim Poß, wrote in an e-mail for his party colleagues:
“Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis has best demonstrated with his performance until now, that he is not up to the demands of such an office. In the interest of the Greek people and in view of the difficult situation, Prime Minister Tsipras should consider to replace Mr Varoufakis with a political experienced, realistic-efficient person.” (Handelsblatt)
I suppose Varoufakis is an overwhelming challenge for some petty-minded politicians. He is much more than they can take. Or they just want a Yes-Man.
* * *
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edited. mistakenly doubled.anyway...
Long Live Brave People of Greece!!!!!
S&P "Falling Fast !!!!" is down 1/3 of 1%.
Who let Chicken Little out inot the snow?
Gee, what is this katz-n-jammer shit show going to do next, and what is the world being distracted from now?
Moar importanlty, what is isreal doing?
Hummmm....
Israeli Spying: The Mother of all Scandals:
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/motherofallscandals.php
https://jhaines6.wordpress.com/2015/02/16/state-of-the-nation-historic-u...
http://www.vox.com/2015/2/16/8045747/netanyahu-us-iran
Only in zionist/satanic america do they call their enemies allies, and friends.
Only a stupid nation lets the wolf in to devour the country for the bankster evil they serve.
Only in america has money become god.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dMbxQAKdtXQ
"SPD executive board member, Jokin' P.O.S., wrote in an e-mail for his party colleagues:
“Greek Finance Minister Varoufakis has best demonstrated with his performance until now, that he is not up to the demands of such an office. In the interest of the Greek people and in view of the difficult situation, Prime Minister Tsipras should consider to replace Mr Varoufakis with a political experienced, realistic-efficient person.” (Handelsblatt)"
Pure terror!
These guys mean business.
The EU bankster game is either about to go into monetary/financial oppression warp-drive or is going to be over.
IF the ECB cuts off Greece it will have destroyed it's own credibility as the CB of ALL EU financial institutions.
The ECB CANNOT unilaterally allow or engineer the implosion of a group of member institutions via politically motivated action or innaction no matter the expressions of the government or corporations involved.
The ECB is either a fully subservient regulatory agency with responsibility for stability and crisis management and/or resolution -or it is not.
To abandon institutions simply because they reside within Greek national territory during a political struggle over Grek national fiscal management and debt restructuring would be a disaster.
exactly why greece is in the driver's seat. they are done with the political/ diplomatic bullshit and have plainly told the ecb to put up or shut up.
i think the response will be more dramatic because these euro/usa guys are madmen. it would be incredibly ironic if greece sparks the western spring uprising of the entire west in revolt of the bankster/oligopoly because nato rolls troops into greece to repossess the country for defaulting on their loans.
I wonder if George Papandreou is still sitiing on the 1/2 billion euro signing comission from Goldman in his mother's bank account.
Sweet I love these balsy greek bastards! Shame they may be dead soon of some strange suicide.
When the Greeks say....."We won't take orders on bailout" it gets translated into "we'll do whatever you say" to German taxpayers
Merkal can say "they tricked me" over and over and over
This is awfully remindful of the negociations with the Russians about the South Stream pipeline. The EU guys went something like five times to the negociating table WITH THE SAME unacceptable offer, only to be told "nyet" every time - and being "surprised" and "disappointed" every time.
And again... and again...
Only feasible resolution is:
Greece accepts terms dictated in secret arrangement, while dictators agree to give the appeance of yielding while not in way that will encourage democratic hopes in other nations drowning in debt.
Pure theater.
Aside from that intention Tsiras should not even be at the table with these people who have clearly indicated they feel little pressure to yield.
That the problem with talking with beauracrats it matters little to them what happens to others.-
Does this mean Greece is going to default? Back when they did this dog and pony show they used it to ramp the DOW 1,500 points.
Greece to the EU...like Charlie Brown and Lucy
"I'll hold the can while you kick it"
"... The lenders will now have to swallow the losses ..."
WRONG!!!!
The original lenders, banks, have sold their loans to gov., IMF etc.
Oh boy...
More meetings please.
We can expect a democratic junta of Colonels, who will usurp the power tomorrow, quite in a tradition....
Is there any other reason for the maneuvers of Russian navy in eastern med?
The way that this is going, the Colenels will be voted in with a landslide majority by the time the next elections roll around.
The colonels have an empty stomach and hungry children but they still have national pride.
If they move this time will be with the people.
The Colonels by definition move with their people.
Greece needs to default....It can't pay back the debts....ever....But the Troika and the banking cartel won't allow them....the consquences could set a tidal wave of financial implosions across the globe for these groups....The bailout is not about helping Greece its about helping themselves....Yanis needs to stay strong....I doubt he will...someone will get to him (it seems they always do)....
The Germans really should learn to cut their losses.
Appears the Greeks have.
Just sayin....
I vote for making "Hotel California" the new national anthem of Greece.
If I was the Greek PM, I would certainly consider giving the Chinese access to the miditerenean for $350 billion and then default.
If I was the Greek PM, I would certainly consider giving the Chinese access to the miditerenean for $350 billion and then default.
Greek dance music: http://youtu.be/IiZyuG1tOHk
such an ugly mess
Mr. Panos sys it again, & again, & again. Just one more time now..... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zvl9N9GdraQ
Hilarious!
Can anyone give an update on the status of the US western ports? Long Beach - or the port mentioned in the video below: Tacoma
http://youtu.be/0LhwKjAsSn0
Still there.
What's the reason for all this drama? If they're going to default, stop bullshitting and do it already.
Can the world do what planned parenthood does when someone makes a mistake and abort this baby?
You can't pay. You won't pay. You default.
You are DEBT-FREE !!!!!
They are getting their SUPRIME DESSERTS !!!!!
Nein - you VILL pay, do we make ourselves clear??
This shift pisses me off. I wanted to trade the results and now gotta wait another 2 or 4 days. Oh well, at least the Ukaraine agreement only lasted 3 hours and 17 minutes so maybe tooprrow lookiong at the S & P Futures chart:
http://finviz.com/futures_charts.ashx?t=ES&p=m5
Debt is so last-millenium.
That is, repayment is so last-millenium.
Printing is in!
Y'know what else that suggests - elimination of all taxes! I mean, why bother?
The negotiations should be televised live, not the load of rhubarb press conference.
I pooped today!
We defaulted some folks !
This isn't facebook
LOL !!! Thats about the size of it right there !!!
He didn't say when, where, or how many sheets of TP were used, did he?
No, this ain't facebook, for sure.
Here you find videos of QA with Varoufakis..calling their bluff. Well worth a listen!
http://tvnewsroom.consilium.europa.eu/event/eurogroup-meeting-february-2...
Thank you
Varoufakis really gets under the skin of the eurocrats
Perhaps “Just Us” will be attempting a false flag using alleged disenfranchised local(s) who will be murdered immediately after the operation.Charlie Ponzi get ready to meet John Exter and payback time for all the misery.
http://www.oneism.org/images/Elite_pyramid_web.jpg
https://paperempire.files.wordpress.com/2010/11/exters-pyramid.png
Be prepared and stack!
Put on your big boy pants and defautl already!!
We all know they have had practice.
The European Union is nothing but a protectionist trading bloc. Strip away all the lofty idealistic rhetoric and that is all it ever has been.
It is a profoundly anti-democratic institution that has been set up principally to protect its grossly inefficient farmers - simultaneously ripping off its consumers and impoverishing more efficient producers from outside the EU.
My one hope from this whole Greek-debt debacle is that it precipitates the overdue collapse of the entire EU and the freeloading mega-bureaucracy that supports it.
I've found the solution: The Greeks can pay the Europeans back with cow manure.
The process might take some time, but, hey, consider it a payment plan. Surely, the bankers will appreciate that.
sure-the EU /Ukraine can use it as a cheaper form of fuel for their homes! BIG WIN ON ALL SIDES!
sure-the EU /Ukraine can use it as a cheaper form of fuel for their homes! BIG WIN ON ALL SIDES!
That's a fair deal. Cow manure is a valuable commodity. It has all kinds of industrial and agricultural uses.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNHOUrYFj70
Best anti-NWO song out there. watch the F bombs tho.
Germany had an historic opportunity to assert its natural leadership over the European Continent, by means of peace. That opportunity is now dead.
Germans didn't manage to either get over their own shortsighted economical and geopolitical objectives, or the USA grip on their power structure, or both.
Either way, they blew it. They will remain the European economic power house, but with the status of the political midgets they are.
In time, after all the presente dust settles -if not a nuclear one, of course-, Russia will emerge as the new Leader, like it or not, for the better or for the worst. It's now a fait accompli.
sic transit gloria mundi
The truth is that the German people. need greece like they need a bole in their heads. The German government and German banks need Greece. Time for Germany to vote in new "leaders".
yes but the Germans are pussies-they had a chance to cut Greece loose and they panicked-hoping to kick the can again "Ve haf ways uf making you accept more uf our money!"
Oldie but a goodie!... Do you remember???!!!
Can't wait for Schaeuble to threaten the Greek Government with a Ben Shalom Bernanke threat, which of course will in all likelihood be far worse?!!!
It's always fun to remember important moments like this when the Chairman of a bank that has no Constitutional authority to call into question a request by the legislative that had just bailed out that Chairman's friends with the largest amount of money in it's history meets with Congress to threaten them and the Congressman for asking question(s) about the health of those institutions they just bailed out with the taxpayers money and doesn't even raise an eyebrow to that threat?...
Germany had an historic opportunity to assert its natural leadership over the European Continent, by means of peace. That opportunity is now dead. Germans didn't manage to either get over their own shortsighted economical and geopolitical objectives, or the USA grip on their power structure, or both. Either way, they blew it. They will remain the European economic power house, but with the status of the political midgets they are. In time, after all the presente dust settles -if not a nuclear one, of course-, Russia will emerge as the new Leader, like it or not, for the better or for the worst. It's now a fait accompli. sic transit gloria mundi
I agree. Germany blew it. The question on the table is how many other countries / trading partners is it going to piss off before the game is finally done.
Yes Much to the delights of US and China. Now EC ripe for the raids, controls and contests. A great global economic landscape re-shape.
Yes Much to the delights of US and China. Now EC ripe for the raids, controls and contests. A great global economic landscape re-shape.
http://postimg.org/image/mu8gf5e5l/
The technocratic, unelected EU apparatchiks just hate Varoufakis because he is smarter than they are, and he understands their own neo-liberal economic system better than they do. Plus he won't play the game. Varoufakis has been a libertarian socialist mole in the system his whole career, and spend decades understanding the system's theoretical and mathematical underpinning and describing how it functions. There is no one better suited for the job of destroying the neo-liberal hoax in Greece, and intellectual midgets like Dijsselbloem bring intellectual pocket knives to a gunfight with Varoufakis. Oh to be a fly on the wall to watch every bit of nonsense spewing from Dijsselbloem be utterly destroyed. They may well crush what's left of the Greek economy as revenge, but that will happen anyway under the bail-out conditions. Better to put up a fight and have a chance than to certainly die as slaves in your own country.
yep. They need to show some balls like now would be good. Perp walk? Public audits? Perhaps a leaked clean copy?
Well Greece and the ECB played chicken and the Bankers blinked......so will Greece announce tomorrow that they have exited the EU? stay tuned
THIS HAS TO BE THE END...no more can-kicking
greece never bothered to reform...the gov workers they fired from one department they rehired in another...they have thousands of islands they can sell..they owe the money, they can repay it, they just dont want to...fk em
Who doesn't owe money and who plans on paying it back? The game is "can we pay the interest on any debt" and as long as the answer is yes, the enslavement grows. Greece has got the Central Bankers in a scramble (caught them off-guard); this will call for drastic measures to save the broken EU; LORD willing it will crumble!! This may end up being the unforeseen catalyst the world needs to get the reset going, for the longer it takes the harder it will be and the more carnage will be in the wake.
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Expect the US bond market and equity markets and dollar begin to move upward as more bets will be placed. The Europeans Union is in deep trouble unless Greece tumbles and crumbles at the political level.
They "owe" it to criminal banksters. Joseph Stalin was trying to voluntarily obtain payments "owed" by Ukraine in the early 30's - they refused to cooperate and pay up. Stalin then shot and starved 8 million Ukranians. Were the dead Ukrainiuns wrong and Stalin right? Hell no - Fuck Stalin. Had the US any integity, we would have allied with Hitler to invade Bolshevik Russia.
The point is -the Greeks may "owe" the Banksters, pursuant to contracts and agreements signed by pro-bankster Greeks who in reality served the banksters - so Fuck the bankters and the EU - - the Greeks owe them nothing -The Italians, Portuguese, and Spaniards owe them NOTHING - the US citizens and all Americans owe them NOTHING -they are psychpathic criminals who are owed nothing other than a date with the hangman at the gallows.
They can get PayDay loans
So shall the USA hand over Hawaii to the chicoms under your logic apparently so.. After all they bought our bonds with money digitally created by our own Federal Reserve ( private corp)...
"...they have thousands of islands they can sell..they owe the money, they can repay it, they just dont want to...fk em"
This is what IMF want! If Greece off loads to Foreign banks, for what, stolen money? They will have no chance of earning anything. Their tourism will be in tatters as the best beaches will be owned by IMF Bankers?
Why weren't they allowed to 'leave' in 2010, as per the rules, because they were bankrupt then? Because the IMF want the beaches and the Islands.....dipstick!
Revert to Drachma and work off the debt that way, the only difficult bit is, valuing the 'new Drachma', they went in @ 365 to the euro, so come out @ same then devalue.
Perp walkin a banker gets public support on the global stage.
I hope the Greeks can't be bribed or suicided, for they are in the Catbird's seat. If the EU cave's in, then goodbye Portugal, Spain, Italy and then Germany and thus goes the EU. Think the Swiss already hedged that bet?
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If Greece leaves, then Russia happily steps in and we have a military presence right in the middle of NATO/Euro backyard.
That is the issue no one is talking about and the reason why the remote possibility of the US was mentioned and that may end up being the solution, for the US makes a sweet sounding deal, then sends in the Langley boys [AKA: ISIS, IS, ISIL] and they grease Greece through the rear end!!- puns intended!
Original draft is here: https://twitter.com/paulmasonnews/status/567461016582512640/photo/1
Unbelievable. They also could have started the text with 'We're the boss, you're nothing more than some employer and we decide what is done and how it is done. Sign or leave'
... so ... new all time highs for the us equitis tomorrow then?
Troika: Replace Varoufakris with a Goldman Sachs alum or we release the Kraken!
Fuck the Troika! Free the Drachma!
-Spoiler alert
Greece wins concessions.
SPY to 198 baby!!!
Why is there no run on banks in Greece? Greeks should be lining up to take their euros out.
At the base level.....
The EU cannot have or allow for a 'default' of any kind and Yanis know this.
A 'default' would cause a catastrophic wave of derivative payouts that would bring down the western banking system.
Better to have ANY kind of agreement with Greece and 'title' it however they have to in order to keep a 'default' from happening....
(Think Neville Chamberlain and "Peace for our Time")
or...extend and pretend long enough for Tsipara (et al) to have an unfortunate nail gun mishap.
We all may laugh and joke about the NSA/CIA/MIC 'interventions'.....but when it's their entire existence that is at stake where do you think they draw the line?
I maintain it is all kabuki theater
It is starting to look that way.
I guess we will know soon if Syriza is an empty suit like the fraudulent-ass Tea Party is.
+10000
Yeah cuz you two were out there whipping up granny to go get her gun and pass the ammo, right... Tea party was betrayed by the same polihacks that have screwed everyone else, boehnmconnmccainsnow.... etal....
Same old shit different day
"The Song Remains The Same" https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGvr-2THzNI
I had a dream. Crazy dream.Anything I wanted to know, any place I needed to go
Hear my song. People won't you listen now? Sing along.
You don't know what you're missing now.
Any little song that you know
Everything that's small has to grow.
And it has to grow!
California sunlight, sweet Calcutta rain
Honolulu Starbright - the song remains the same.
Sing out Hare Hare, dance the Hoochie Koo.
City lights are oh so bright, as we go sliding... sliding... sliding through.
This is what they SHOULD be saying to the ECB
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP9xMobANJM
lyrics
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/ledzeppelin/babeimgonnaleaveyou.html
Greece may default on what again? Toxic derivatives and collatorazided debt obligations, sold to previous crony Greek Administrations and corrupt political politicians by EU banks, essentially throwing all Greeks under the austerity bus? Default dammit! Just Default!
An SPD politician from Merkels’ social-democrat coalition suggested that Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras should replace Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis as he apparently creates lots of confusion, German politicians cannot understand.....
because those "anti-social-democratic idiots" would just love to blow up the remaining global economy with another wave of collateral debt obligations gone bad because some fool believed that you can finance your way out of Debt with ever more Debt.
NOOOO !! You Can NOT !!!!
This whole Debt on Debt financing system is fucked...based on fraudulent Loans via Goldman Sachs to Greece right from the start.
It is the system that's rotten to the core - you fucks!!!
why is that so hard to understand ?
NOOO means NOOO !!
If Greece has any sense they will Not pay any of the (stolen) IMF-ECB drug-money back unless the Greek want to be slaves for life.
the Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis is right !
World Central Banksters are like cheap whores -
they just don't understand the meaning of the word "NO" in any language !!
Those Idiots will be even more confused when all these Junk Bonds blow up in their stupid faces!
that will be the GFC continuation then....finally!
Bondmarkets will blow up world wide.
Fuck QE, fuck Central Banksters, and most of all fuck the IMF including NATO.
all this shit is just run out of the US anyway, to destabilize the World Economy as much as possible.
NOOO - Fuck all this Bullshit !
WR;)
Look like damge already done in shaking the confidence of markets. Even with a deal, market perceptions on the PIIGS have altered. It shall take more ECB gymnatics to maintain Soverign Debt prices.
Just adjust algos to capture volatility and momentum and enjoy the music of the Analysts, Economists, etc
Germans complaining not enough Goldman Sachs employees in Greek govt.
And WTF has Greece and its people to lose anyway.....they are totally fucked in everyway...so may as well take the path that might give them a chane of recovery one day....ie ex Euro.
the Germans are going to lose their 80 billion Euros - to pay for their guilt-ridden cognitive impairments.
that should make them happy for a few more months.
everyone else (including Banksters and Politicians) will remain on welfare...
same as it ever was.
If we run out of money,we just QE more....
party on Eurovision !
I just read a comment that said "Fuck off Greece". I would put it the other way around. Why is the new Greece government even talking to these Cold Pirates of the Cold North who do nothing but serve up toxic loans that do nothing but prop up their crony banks and card houses, false assuring them in their systemic recklessness?
There are others who will fund you and fairly. The looting must end.