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This Is What Happens To Gold In A Hyperinflationary Currency Crisis: Ukraine Edition

Tyler Durden's picture




 

As Ukraine's socio-economic situation goes from wost to worst-er, today's announcement by President Poroshenko that the government will take actions to stabilize the currency (which as we previously noted, appears to be heading for hyperinflation) has Ukrainians rushing for the exits into precious metals... with only one goal in mind - wealth preservation.

 

 

This is what gold does in a fiat-currency crisis. Now if only Ukraine actually still had some gold...

Furthermore, according to RIA, on Tuesday, Ukrainian television channel Ukraina announced that with the new exchange rate, the minimum wage in Ukraine stands at around $42.90 per month, which according to the channel, is lower than in Ghana or Zambia.

There are currently no plans to raise the minimum wage until December.

Behold hyperinflation:

"Food prices among producers rose 57.1 percent, with the price for grains and vegetables rising 91 percent from January 2014 to January 2015, while the official inflation rate over the period totaled 28.5 percent.

 

Meanwhile, Ukrainian consumers responded to economic difficulties by cutting their spending in hryvnias by 22.6 percent, which amounts to an almost 40 percent decrease in real consumption."

Nothing to fear though: we are sure all that hard-earned US taxpayer-lent money will be safe and sound.

 

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Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:24 | 5827824 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

Gold has dominated many currency as of late.  Euros, yen, rubles, the list goes on.

Gold bitchez

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:26 | 5827838 cigarEngineer
cigarEngineer's picture

Nothing beats leveraged IPOs. Start a company, borrow money, IPO it, cash out. Rise, repeat. Join the dark side.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:30 | 5827856 semperfi
semperfi's picture

the Dark Side is winning, hands down - Satan rules !

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:37 | 5827895 PartysOver
PartysOver's picture

Satan does not rule.  OK, maybe influences.

The BTFD'ers rule.  The morning US Stock Indices dip was right on schedule.  Step up and get ya some.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:05 | 5828025 Liberal
Liberal's picture

As a staunch liberal, I am staunchly against gold and silver and strongerly believe they should be outlawed.  The US does not need precious metals because our economy is just too strong.  TOO strong.  As in creating millions of new jobs every single day thanks to our Supreme Leader Obama.  Plus we can't track gold and silver which means our beloved government won't be able to collect taxes and redistribute it to its people who don't want to work.  Working is not a right.  But collecting welfare is a human right.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:07 | 5828036 SamAdams
SamAdams's picture

Textbook Weimar.  People have lost confidence in the government, revolution is on, here comes hyper-inflation.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:11 | 5828051 Vampyroteuthis ...
Vampyroteuthis infernalis's picture

Nothing to fear though: we are sure all that hard-earned US taxpayer-lent money will be safe and sound.

Never fear, the Fed will break out the printers and magically watch the loses vanish!

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:16 | 5828069 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Exactly 1 year after the USSA sponsored Kiev Coup:

-tens of thousands killed in a civil war

-currency destroyed

-unemployment more than doubled

-millions of Ukie refugees in Russia

-central bank is bankrupt

-fascist oligarchs get even richer while the poorest earn less than most africans

-fracking and rampant GMO production, ruining the best farmland in europe.

Mission Accomplished!

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:20 | 5828094 Four chan
Four chan's picture

paper vs gold is like bieber vs joe lewis.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:31 | 5828131 Nafets93
Nafets93's picture

Jesus Christ, imagine how gold's gonna pop when the world finnnnnally realizes what a ponzi scheme the petrodollar is!!

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:41 | 5828169 neidermeyer
neidermeyer's picture

I'm going to absolutely love buying a low mileage Lotus or Porsche for one eagle... and have the poor bastard kiss my ass for it. It might take 2 eagles to pay off that Jumbo mortgage though...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:49 | 5828211 General Decline
General Decline's picture

That graph is a barbarous relic.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:44 | 5828473 gold-is-not-dead
gold-is-not-dead's picture

im not dead i feel fine... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sh8mNjeuyV4

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:57 | 5828533 nailgunnin4you
nailgunnin4you's picture

Gold surges 400%!! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

(In Hryvnia)

 

Keep holding that bag of gold for Tyler zerohedgers! And go short!!

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:56 | 5828770 nailgunnin4you
nailgunnin4you's picture

Who the fuck down voted me?

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 20:12 | 5829181 Thirst Mutilator
Thirst Mutilator's picture

12 people [at last count]

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 22:14 | 5829733 palmdetroit
palmdetroit's picture

Yes this is what happens to some fiat which servers no purpose, unfortunately, if you do your maths in dollars, the exact opposite happens.. just like before, good thing we got cryptos

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 22:28 | 5829777 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

 

 

Unfortunately, won't happen here until the dollar loses its "cleanest dirty shirt" status.

But it's coming...

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 07:31 | 5830608 GetZeeGold
GetZeeGold's picture

 

 

Who the fuck down voted me?

 

I tried to up vote you....but I missed.

 

Sorry amigo...

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 10:19 | 5830995 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

The neighbors of Ukraine should batten down the hatches.  

 

People can move and will move....

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:00 | 5828784 pendragon
pendragon's picture

so it went from 15 to 40. it's still better quality toilet paper than the ruble

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:20 | 5828863 Never One Roach
Never One Roach's picture

"The Ukraine is not Zimbabwe!"

 

My guess is the politburo in Kiev never miss a 7-course dinner ....

 

 

 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:56 | 5829029 MagicHandPuppet
MagicHandPuppet's picture

But you can't eat it! Lol

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:28 | 5829123 bwh1214
bwh1214's picture

I'm a big fan of gold but the chart looks the same for the cross with the dollar and euro too.  I understand the point but the point was pounded home on here with the ruble drop. 

 

Interesting stuff on this article though: http://debtcrash.blogspot.com/2015/02/history-and-introduction.html  Great overview of how we got here. 

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 09:13 | 5830750 Max Steel
Max Steel's picture

WHAT A STUPID CUNT YOU ARE . PRESENT AMERICAN GENERATION .

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:51 | 5829013 John_Coltrane
John_Coltrane's picture

Graph wouldn't look very impressive if the y axis started at 0 as it should.  You can make any change look impressive if you plot over a narrow enough range.  That's why climate change alarmist always plot the "anomoly"  (difference from an arbitrary baseline) rather than the actual measured temperatures, where you wouldn't be able to detect any variation outside the noise through the last 100 years.

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 00:53 | 5830247 BarbaricRelic
BarbaricRelic's picture

BARBARIC!

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:10 | 5828595 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

It's gonna take 4 eagles to put gas in the car.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:38 | 5828706 90's Child
90's Child's picture

Anyone have an idea how "poor mans gold" is fairing in Ukraine?

Financial it's easier for me to obtain then gold.

But if there isn't a market in a hyper inflation world I may have to start saving more for gold.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:47 | 5828998 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

My belief is that Silver is performing wonderfully, being used as the Grey Market currency. Any Gold left in that Nation, at this point, is not being sold at any price in Ukraine.

 

(Why sell today when tomorrow's price will be higher?)

 

Now as to any Empirical Data...that would be nice to have.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:27 | 5829119 90's Child
90's Child's picture

Thanks Tom,

I like most here just wanna make sure I'm hedging wisely.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:05 | 5829453 Mentaliusanything
Mentaliusanything's picture

OR the world may have a huge problem with AAPL

http://www.news.com.au/technology/ccs-insight-report-predicts-apple-watc...

Holy snapping Butt jab Batman!!!

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:55 | 5828766 ATM
ATM's picture

That's not going to happen. 

It's called relativity. Gold will rise in price relative to a currency but so will other hard assets like a Lotus or Porsche.

What it doesn't do is rise in value. It retains value.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:54 | 5829023 Bro of the Sorr...
Bro of the Sorrowful Figure's picture

youre missing one thing. gold and silver have been profoundly manipulated downward for years, whereas the govt has inflated many other "hard assets" like cars and houses through subsisidies. gold, relative to these hard assets, is relatively (extremely) underpriced. the debt that props up the prices of houses, buildings, cars, college, food blah blah blah, once wiped out, will lead to a dramatic fall in the price of those things relative to gold.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:39 | 5829146 WTFMOFO
WTFMOFO's picture

You can say that shit again.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:55 | 5829024 Bro of the Sorr...
Bro of the Sorrowful Figure's picture

youre missing one thing. gold and silver have been profoundly manipulated downward for years, whereas the govt has inflated many other "hard assets" like cars and houses through subsisidies. gold, relative to these hard assets, is relatively (extremely) underpriced. the debt that props up the prices of houses, buildings, cars, college, food blah blah blah, once wiped out, will lead to a dramatic fall in the price of those things relative to gold.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:33 | 5829135 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

The upheaval cannot be put into words. It is beyond most anything of what the vast majorty of this audience has ever experienced and, as a result, way beyond their comprehension.

 

Famine will RETURN to America. There is no social collective memory of famine for most. It exists is some parts of the USA currently and will be widespread before this debacle is over. In fact if there was not EBT currently we would have widespread famine in America.

 

The resultant political and social upheaval will be revolutionary.

 

Be a Scout. Be prepared. Keep watch and prepare for the unexpected.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 20:17 | 5829276 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Here is the problem we are the source for most of the printed money credit, that means we have the ultimate seignorage and will enjoy the benefits the longest. We also have multiple carrier task groups and thousands of nukes.  The PTB in America do not seem to be preparing much maybe I am missing it but it looks like we have years on this path.  It will all go down no doubt but its probably years out..

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:06 | 5829407 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

It will all go down no doubt but its probably years out..

 

It already has been years out...Forty Four of them...

 

When the Dollar was decoupled from Gold that signed the Death Warrant of the currency and the empire.

 

The economy, our economy, is a structure. Yes the structure will fail, as all Human constructs do, in time. One cannot defy entropy.

 

The economy is somewhat like a Physical Bridge. A Bridge begins to fail before the construction is even completed. But it fails and it fails slowly over time.

 

Now when you watch the momentous collapse that is when most people will believe that the failure has happened. But the underlying truth is that it has been failing all along. The rate of failure can be expressed as an exponential function.

 

Likewise the economy is like an organism. It is after all an organized economy with such a degree of organization that we now can enjoy the fruits thereof. But like any organism it is subject to death.

 

The truth is that you have been dying ever since the day you were first conceived. The Death Genes are what caused your digits to form in your mother's womb. After you were born your growth rate exceeded the rate of dying by magnitudes of order. Eventually you stopped growing and then the rate of organ failure, the rate at which you are currently dying began to become the predominant factor.

 

Most people believe that it is when a person suffers from massive organ failure is the process called dying. Well organism death can also be expressed as an exponential function.

 

It is likewise with both our Empire and our Economy. And when it happens the collapse will be surprising to most.

 

As Ernest Hemingway said, and I paraphrase as I do not remember the exact quote, in a response to how he went bankrupt.

 

It started slowly at first and then it happened all at once.

 

And that is how our Economy and our Empire will perish.

 

And I am sorry that the prognosis is terminal. I am sorry that the Bridge is unsafe to cross and needs to be condemned.

 

WHILEST I TOTALLY AGREE THAT THE USA IS THE LAST DOMINO...

 

And there are so many instances of organ failure currently happening that I cannot project a long future for our economy. Thus we need best be getting our affairs in order and be prepared for the inevitable, dontcha think?

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:21 | 5829090 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Hard Goods really DEFLATE in VALUE during the resultant hunger from the famine and lack in a hyperinflation.. The are huge disruptions and imbalances which are created during a hyperinflationary inferno. There will be no stability in finances or politics, and there will be total and complete social upheaval. It is a Hell on Earth.

 

In Weimar Republic Germany there were Grand Pianos traded for a 50lbs sack of potatoes. An entire City Block of Prime Real Estate in downtown Berlin was purchased for ONE OUNCE OF GOLD....which a wealthy man had proffered as a tip to a Hotel Bellboy during the war.

 

There is a marked difference in PRICE and VALUE. A FOOL will know the PRICE of many things and knows the VALUE of NONE OF THEM. A wise man, on the other hand, knows the VALUE of most things and the price is rather of secondary concern.

 

Wise men KNOW this difference as they have the terms DIFFERENTIATED and WELL DEFINED.

 

So what is VALUE? Value means UTILITY. Personally if I cannot use it then it has absolutely no value to me. (However it may be valuable to someone else.) In like manner if nobody can use it then it lacks any value whatsoever.

 

You really need to read some HISTORY about hyperinflationary infernos before commenting. Although past performance does not in any way, shape, manner, or form, guarantee future performance it generally is a very accurate indicator of what happens.

 

You impress me as the FOOL as you believe that everything just simply adjusts in PRICE, at the same rate, without considering the VALUE of any item in question.

 

Gold is saved until the very end. It is USED in the aftermath, after the upheaval subsides, and after the currency fails. That is when the VALUE of the Gold is realized as it can be used to acquire PRODUCTIVE INCOME PRODUCING ASSETS.

 

(...and not a Lotus which is rather useless.)

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:40 | 5829149 KnightTakesKing
KnightTakesKing's picture

+100 Tall Tom

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:44 | 5829156 Thirst Mutilator
Thirst Mutilator's picture

+1 TT

 

The 'wise' man is more likely to be spending his EAGLE on a warehouse or farm equipment than a Lotus.

 

Actually ~ the 'wise man' is, as we speak, spending his fiats on both of those things in the hopes that he'll never have to arrive to the point where he is forced to spend his EAGLE.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:59 | 5829213 delacroix
delacroix's picture

the bellboy with the gold coin  bought the hotel he worked in.   the city block was purchased with what was described as a handful of gold coins.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 20:13 | 5829258 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Damn. My memory is that faulty too?

 

Time to read that book again.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 20:19 | 5829284 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Here is the Porsche of its time...  Apparently the guy cannot eat it..  Must be made of gold..

http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2011/02/18/article-1358483-0041617C000002...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 23:33 | 5830029 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

Thanks, Tom, that was perfect.  Both of my parents went through the depression as adults, having been born in 1907, and told me of the severe hunger among so many friends and neighbors, helping people here and there with a box of cereal or whatever they could spare. People have absolutely no idea...NO IDEA that all of this false financial facade will be ripped away to expose the brutal, harsh reality that lies beneath. Talk about welcome to the jungle, baby. 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:46 | 5828194 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Your comment and this chart...

Technically we are not seeing gold pop so much as we are seeing the death of fiat. Soon no number of fiatskis will buy gold. 

I have an add in my dohick for AnaJet printers. Looks like Analjet. It has an orange button that says START PRINTING TODAY. What should I make of that?

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:41 | 5828448 Thirst Mutilator
Thirst Mutilator's picture

Just imagine how people are gonna feel when they come to the realization that they're actually more stupid than Kim Kardashian.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:51 | 5829194 Thirst Mutilator
Thirst Mutilator's picture

 "paper vs gold is like bieber vs joe lewis."

 

Correction ~ paper vs gold is like Beiber vs. Joe Louis [with the Vegas line set at 1000-1], and Joe Louis taking a dive because Arnold Rothstein stuffed some cash in his shorts.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:53 | 5828223 tired1
tired1's picture

Sorry, it's not fiished. Kiev is just 'warmig up'.

I wonder what it'l look like in a year.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:15 | 5828320 MauritiusGold
MauritiusGold's picture

given Britain are officially sending troops to train the Ukrainian Army, I suspect it's gonna get rather ugly. Looks like The West need this war to cover their fiat crisis asses.

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 01:26 | 5830298 JuliaS
JuliaS's picture

Those advisers better bring their own food and warm blankets.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:53 | 5828515 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

list goes on:

- relations with its closest neighbour screwed

- gold from national treasury is safe and sound in vaults of London and New York

- oligarchs are cashing in on remainders of national wealth

- country to be split along ethnic lines

Accomplished indeed.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:16 | 5828632 cnmcdee
cnmcdee's picture

<*this*> is going to happen one day *very* soon in America and the rest of the developed nations.   During WWII a lady sold a grand piano for a bag of potatoes because *everybody* was starving.  

I cannot stress it enough above gold, and silver stockpile food, seeds, and guns, and ammo.  If you can build a off grid underground unit somewhere out in the bush it is the safest option..  If you never use it - no big beans. If you do need it hopefully you were smart enough to build it remote enough that you do not have to shoot starving idiots who refused to prepare and are trying to get your's via a gun..

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:57 | 5828773 TheAntiProgressive
TheAntiProgressive's picture

Don't forget alcohol, fundmental pharmas.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:01 | 5829115 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

During WWII a lady sold a grand piano for a bag of potatoes because *everybody* was starving.

 

NO...NOT TRUE.

 

It was in 1923, during the Weimar Republic Germany Hyperinflationary Event, documented in the book, "The Death of Money"

 

Edit...My memory is faulty sometimes also. delacroix corrected me above.

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 08:36 | 5830698 Lanka
Lanka's picture

We all "mis-remember" on occasion.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:16 | 5829503 Chauncey Gardener
Chauncey Gardener's picture

Well, that was uplifting...

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 00:39 | 5830219 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Awesome...Just awesome...Everything is awesome.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:45 | 5828732 cyclist
cyclist's picture

Just forgot one thing Latina,

-Steal the Ukrainian Gold

 

same plan, different day, different country  

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:36 | 5829595 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Good point,  Cyclist.  One of the first things to disappear after the coup was the Ukie CB gold.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:31 | 5828930 css1971
css1971's picture

Americans are hated for their freedoms.

 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:01 | 5829035 HardAssets
HardAssets's picture

I'll never forget that image of the poor grandma type who strangled to death.

This is the Hell that these insane neocons have brought into the world.

WE allow this.

More went to the war propaganda sniper film than were willing to protest the evil undertaken in their name.

Someday that may be our own grandmas.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:25 | 5828360 Antifaschistische
Antifaschistische's picture

yah...this could NEVER happen HERE!!!   :)

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:32 | 5828134 Greenskeeper_Carl
Greenskeeper_Carl's picture

I can't believe there is anyone in that country willing to part with gold for a free falling currency. Once that chart goes parabolic, you would think anyone with anything to sell in that country would want to hold it as long as possible, maybe close up shop for a little while. Those pieces of paper are going to be worth a lot less just the next day, can't imagine parting with an ounce for that toilet paper.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:43 | 5828179 neidermeyer
neidermeyer's picture

I noticed there was no "volume" data also ... the only gold changing hands is when you give it to someone that has a truck with enough fuel to get you the hell out of there...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:43 | 5828182 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

That isn't parabolic enough for you yet?  Not to worry, it will go parabolic-er in the next few months

You part with the gold and IMMEDIATELY spend the fiat cash.  That's how you survive in hyperinflation.  The currency holds it's role as a medium of exchange for quite some time after it's function as a store of value is lost.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:30 | 5828676 McCormick No. 9
McCormick No. 9's picture

Wait a minute here...

"Food prices among producers rose 57.1 percent, with the price for grains and vegetables rising 91 percent from January 2014 to January 2015, while the official inflation rate over the period totaled 28.5 percent.

 Meanwhile, Ukrainian consumers responded to economic difficulties by cutting their spending in hryvnias by 22.6 percent, which amounts to an almost 40 percent decrease in real consumption."

If Ukranians are CUTTING SPENDING during an inflation, something is all fucked up. A decrease in spending is a decrease in velocity. There has never been a hyperinflation without an accompanying rise in velocity, as people try to spend their money before it devalues.

Something's wrong with this picture, and why hasn't anyone on this site seen this? Maybe I'm crazy, but just what does one call a hyperinflation in which no-one spend any money? I'm just askin'.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:39 | 5829147 Billy the Poet
Billy the Poet's picture

Keep going. You're onto something.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 20:26 | 5829316 Calmyourself
Calmyourself's picture

Well enlighten us??  Producers will not take currency or foreign currency use is not measured or....

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 23:38 | 5830048 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

The answer is right there in front of you!

"Ukrainian consumers responded to economic difficulties by cutting their spending ***in hryvnias*** by 22.6 percent, which amounts to an almost 40 percent decrease in real consumption." 

 

They aren't spending in hryvnias.  Hryvnias are not being used to transact.  

No hryvnias transactions also probably means no tax collection.

Maybe hryvnias are only for paying down debts denominated in hryvnias?

What I think this statement indicates is that foreign currency ( Roubles, Dollars, Euros??? ), barter, or other de-facto currencies ( um, gold and silver, might be effective alternatives during a hyperinflationary/currency collapse episode ) are being used.

Black Market.  Revulsion of the currency.  Tax Revolt against the Junta.  

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:58 | 5828242 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

Which is why small gold coins and silver coins come in handy.  If you need food, you bust out your 1/10th oz. Maple or Kangaroo, or your snapping off a few one gram bars from your Valcambri and you buy what you need.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:32 | 5828405 Toronto Kid
Toronto Kid's picture

Allowing the other guy to see you have coins/bars could get you or yours shot as it means you might have more gold. Take the advice of that guy from Argentina - hold a few old pieces of gold jewellery that you can easily split up and sell or exchange.

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 00:45 | 5830232 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Trade in Silver and Copper and hide your Gold deep.

 

Gold will be useful only at the end.

 

I am already a dead man as far too many locals know. But I am old and gray anyway.

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 08:39 | 5830706 Lanka
Lanka's picture

We all know where you live.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:39 | 5828710 Took Red Pill
Took Red Pill's picture

was looking at some platinum today. It's cheaper than gold right now which is unusual. And it's hard to get especially the eagles.

http://www.mineweb.com/news/platinum-group-metals/platinum-price-puzzles/

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:10 | 5828807 mt paul
mt paul's picture

use to buy 100 oz bars of silver until a sign went up at the local assay shop

"all transactions over 4 thou $ must be reported to the IRS"

when silver went above 40 $ per   100 oz bars were problematic.

a problem for simple 1 oz gold coins could develop if gold went to 4 k .. 

fractional gold could help you stay "off the books "

bought kilos of silver off ebay last wk end for 580.$ per

kilo silver would need to be  >125 $ per oz to exceed the 4k reporting limit

just a thought from a zero hedge boating with bullion skipper.. 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:49 | 5829191 KnightTakesKing
KnightTakesKing's picture

With all due respect, I would never buy PMs from some guy on ebay. You're just asking to get ripped off.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:37 | 5829602 mt paul
mt paul's picture

all major bullion dealers 

sell on ebay..

never had any problems..

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 20:32 | 5829324 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

use to buy 100 oz bars of silver until a sign went up at the local assay shop

"all transactions over 4 thou $ must be reported to the IRS"

 

Find another dealer...seriously.

 

Can you imagine what will happen to the IRS because of their reporting rules if the USA suffers a period of massive Double Digit Price Inflation? (Not necessarily hyperinflation...)

 

They will be swamped with paperwork. INFORMATION OVERLOAD will cause that organization to grind to a screeching halt.

 

(That is the "bestest" time to mass mail them 1000's of Form 1040s, and Form 1099s with the names and addresses of people that you do not like. I know. That is absolutely evil...really it is. People who will do that deserve death by a thousand cuts while being crucified. But I could not resist the dark humor...)

 

Seriously...No. I am not too concerned about the reporting rules.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:41 | 5829618 mt paul
mt paul's picture

think i'll stick with

the local oxford assay shop ..

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:06 | 5828577 Hubbs
Hubbs's picture

Which is why I am stackin'...and I don't mean Aunt Jemima pancakes!

 

(although come to think of it, having pancake batter for food or barter  if the SHTF isn't a bad idea either)

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:18 | 5828862 mt paul
mt paul's picture

don't forget a case or 2 of dehydrated eggs

to keep them flapjacks fluffy ...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:09 | 5829469 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

Good idea. I need add that to the candles which I need to buy. Thanks.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:54 | 5829022 Chupacabra-322
Chupacabra-322's picture

@ Greenskeeper,

Just one problem with that strategy. The Crimunal UNITED STATES, CORP. INC. IMF, BIS & World Bank has already stolen Ukraines Gold.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:28 | 5828650 ThroxxOfVron
ThroxxOfVron's picture

"People have lost confidence in the government, revolution is on, here comes hyper-inflation. "

Indeed.  The chart indicates that the Hyvernia is collapsing in value due to extreme political instability/civil war, not that Gold is skyrocketing.

A similar chart showing the spot price of US Dollars would show the US Dollar more than tripling in value against the Hyvernia, and yet no reasoned person would exclaim that the value of the US Dollar had gone up 330%+ in the last year.

It sad to see the Ukrainians bankrupted and assailed from without and from within.

It is also sad to see confused and inaccurate observations being blithely posted and ignorantly discussed on the venerable Zero Hedge.  Gold has not gone parabolic.  

The assholes who have been destroying Ukraine have done a fine job of devaluing the currency and impoverishing the citizenry.  The lot should be hung: the former government, the present government, and many people from foreign lands that had a hand in this pitiful debacle.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:44 | 5828727 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

Well, apparently since 2001, the Secret Master Plan of the USSA has been to destroy stable nations and create vast unstable geographical areas all over the Planet Red Shield, allowing Barbarous Relics to be rescued from the instability!

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 07:23 | 5830601 Mountainview
Mountainview's picture

The war in the East serves them to obsure complete economic mismanagement.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:14 | 5828070 zaphod
zaphod's picture

You say this like you are joking, but FDR did exactly this and outlawed gold for two generations.

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 05:06 | 5830512 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

No. FDR outlawed DOMESTIC OWNERSHIP of Gold.. Americans could own Gold offshore...until Jack Kennedy outlawed that in 1962.

 

On December 31, 1974, one dozen years later, Americans could legally own Gold again both domestically and offshore. But, by then, a major devaluation of the US Dollar had happened and it was far too late for Americans to protect themselves from that initial devaluation as a result of the DEFAULT of August 15, 1971.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:18 | 5828083 Banker Buster
Banker Buster's picture

LOL these posts are always funny.  Can I get in on the fun...

If the Republicans, who seem to hate non-white poor people, would just get out of the way and let Obama see to it that immigrants come into this country freely, like the wind blows, and get citizenship.  The fed would then be at it's target 2% inflation rate because more people would be in the country to spend.  It's common sense people.  Oh and the market isn't that difficult for all those who are over thinking this thing.  All you have to do is when the market opens BTFD and then BTFATH, we can then all make money in the market, yes that means everyone.  Hey look there goes a unicorn and he is throwing up a rainbow, nice but not unusual.  

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:39 | 5828703 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

As great as our Beloved Imam Blowbama has been, I cannot wait for the Bush/Clinton (or Clinton/Bush) ticket to win the game and eliminate the need for jobs, work, and such. Just think of the Big Cars we'll all have- plus Mexican drivers and free gas!
***
"If elected, Jeb and I will be president/vp on even-odd days!
And, did I mention the free stuff? Vote for me, Hillrary- and me, Jeb- in the next election!!"

 

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 10:39 | 5831076 neuronius
neuronius's picture

Because remember, Hillary said:

“Don’t let anybody tell you that it’s corporations and businesses that create jobs. You know that old theory, trickle-down economics. That has been tried, that has failed. It has failed rather spectacularly. One of the things my husband says when people say, ‘What did you bring to Washington?’ He says, ‘I brought arithmetic.’

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:18 | 5828081 Nafets93
Nafets93's picture

good idea! 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:22 | 5828102 armageddon addahere
armageddon addahere's picture

God rules in Heaven, money on earth. In this world even the devil dances for gold.

         - old Swiss saying

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:39 | 5827912 Consuelo
Consuelo's picture

"...Now, you will experience the Full Power of the Dark Side - Fsssshsswwhhhssswrrrrrsshhhh...!!!"

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:53 | 5827969 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

"...I am your Father, Janet. The Emporer is pleased."

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:00 | 5828003 Handful of Dust
Handful of Dust's picture

The second inning of the Currency Wars.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:56 | 5828233 WhoIsJohnGaltCoin
WhoIsJohnGaltCoin's picture

you forgot step the last step... Bro Down.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:27 | 5828911 The central planners
The central planners's picture

Barrys' dad is black and mom is white but he chose the dark side.

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 07:38 | 5830618 sidney sloth
sidney sloth's picture

This is fact. This happens on a truly massive scale. However, you don't just rinse and repeat. After the IPO, you get into M&A: merger and acquisition. The startling thing is that the company need not even make a product for the cycle to run. As long as new investors can be found to fund the leveraged merger, the company can grow totally made up book value and please everyone.

I have advised a multinational company which existed for 20 years without ever having a product for sale. After their IPO, they merged 6 times in 18 years. Each time their debt, book value (of IP) and capitalization grew.

After 20 years, they finally put product to market. It did not earn close to enough to service the debt, so various governments were called in to save jobs and keep it afloat by paying way above market value for both product and also shares: a stake in the grand enterprise.

This is the "free market" of global business, far more than people know.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:59 | 5827997 Stoploss
Stoploss's picture

.     .

  0

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:04 | 5828021 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Shocked.... shocked, I tells ya.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:51 | 5828214 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

What a cute Obama cartoon!

Instead of Mr. Bill, you made Mr. Barack.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:16 | 5829505 Tall Tom
Tall Tom's picture

It reminded me of that painting, Edvard Munch's, "The Scream"

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:11 | 5828301 Hayabusa
Hayabusa's picture

It happened so suddenly... one day I was happily spending fiat and getting what I wanted and the next I was carting it around in a wheel barrow trying to use it to get a stick of gum.  At this point the only sane thing to do is initiate QE on a global basis, not in the billions, trillions, or quadrillions, Quintillions... but in the Sextillions!  I'm not sure what comes after that but I'm sure we will eventually find out.  Just think, one day even those on public assistance programs will be millionaires... it just won't mean much anymore. 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:27 | 5828376 richiebaby
richiebaby's picture

It's a good thing the Uks gave us their gold for safe keeping

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 19:08 | 5829059 WernerHeisenberg
WernerHeisenberg's picture

However, please note that gold has not saved anyone from the Judeo-Bandera thugs, who for the past year have been running amok raping, robbing, murdering, and even burning people alive.  One also needs a "bug out" plan, friends, and lead bullion.

Below an English subtitled video interview of two mature men from Kiev who bugged out and joined the militia in Donbass.  As they describe, their 60 year old colleague was captured by thugs and tortured for an hour and a half, fingernails pulled out with pliers.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nlzgi3BCLuA

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 21:03 | 5829446 BrerRabbit
BrerRabbit's picture

Walter Sobchak: This is what happens when you fuck a stranger in the ass!

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 03:42 | 5830434 NuckingFuts
NuckingFuts's picture

Do you see Larry what happens?

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:24 | 5827825 NotApplicable
NotApplicable's picture

This should end well.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:24 | 5827827 semperfi
semperfi's picture

what is their spot silver doing ?

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:15 | 5828068 quasimodo
quasimodo's picture

Just sitting there, like the barbaric relic that it is.

 

"Sit buffy, sit! Good boy!"

 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:53 | 5828225 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

Did you mean:

"Sit Spot, sit! Good boy!"

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:09 | 5828282 Johnny Fiat and...
Johnny Fiat and The Contangos's picture

"what is their spot silver doing ?"

Hiding, bro.  They heard what happened to their cousins, The Bullion family and how they just fucking vanished...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:22 | 5828884 mt paul
mt paul's picture

"what is their spot silver doing ?"

 

seeking asylum

at my house...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:26 | 5827837 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

i implore u all to follow the daily trade in the phony paper Gold and Silver markets just so u can bear witness to how London and the Comex on a daily basis wipe away all the gains mounted in the Asian markets...

it cant be more obvious...

http://www.livecharts.co.uk/MarketCharts/silver.php

http://www.livecharts.co.uk/MarketCharts/gold.php

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:27 | 5827844 cigarEngineer
cigarEngineer's picture

If true, this is a gift from the heavens. Buy Asia open, reverse position on close. Repeat every day with 2% of your account at risk.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:46 | 5827943 Kaiser Sousa
Kaiser Sousa's picture

i buy no matter what...

but that aint the point...

the "fixing" at the behest of the Fed and bullion banks is...

 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:52 | 5827966 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

Au went below 1200USD. I had to buy moar...

Standing by for the next slamdown.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:28 | 5827852 czarangelus
czarangelus's picture

Yet another nation the Anglo-Zionist Axis has turned into a tire fire... Gods, will we ever get to see them get theirs?

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:38 | 5827898 Againstthelie
Againstthelie's picture

The world had it's chance and that ended in May 1945.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:28 | 5828671 pendragon
pendragon's picture

roll up, roll up - we got putin fluffers and we got hitler fluffers.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:29 | 5827854 Smuckers
Smuckers's picture

When this becomes the trendy thing to do, maybe the US will follow.

 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:51 | 5827899 i_fly_me
i_fly_me's picture

It has been the trendy thing to do for a bit now, and we are leading, not following.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:33 | 5827875 Rikeska
Rikeska's picture

We collapsed some folks.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:34 | 5827880 disabledvet
disabledvet's picture

"Sanctions regime."

 

The West blew up their own ally.

 

Word on ISIS is that they have over a hundred million followers.  They could launch a preemptive strike..on multiple fronts and in many directions.

 

"One jihadi to rule them."

 

I think they actually have an American as their spokesperson now actually.

 

Apparently Minnesota and Prairie Home Companion are on the hit list.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:41 | 5827920 FrankDieter
FrankDieter's picture

How much for a BJ in dollars ?

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:55 | 5827971 Dr. Richard Head
Dr. Richard Head's picture

Who cares so long as it increases GDP...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:10 | 5828050 rejected
rejected's picture

Exactly what is the product?   oh!   never mind.....

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:44 | 5828734 Rikeska
Rikeska's picture

One jar of Nutella

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:43 | 5827923 FrankDieter
FrankDieter's picture

We fucked over some folks.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:45 | 5827928 astoriajoe
astoriajoe's picture

deleted dumb comment.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:45 | 5827936 yogibear
yogibear's picture

It's why the Zimbabwe stock market went crazy.

Same for the US stock market. 

US cash is trash. The Federal Reserve is telling you that.

 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:24 | 5828895 mt paul
mt paul's picture

will trade fiat

for picnic baskets...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:45 | 5827937 Max Steel
Max Steel's picture

 

Well Done Poroshenko... Ukraine is now officially poorer than Africa

                   

http://sputniknews.com/europe/20150225/1018727638.html 

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:59 | 5827999 f16hoser
f16hoser's picture

Proof Positive that any/every thing the US Guberment/CIA touches turns to SHIT!

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:06 | 5828029 rejected
rejected's picture

404       Page does not exist.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:14 | 5828067 Max Steel
Max Steel's picture

lol yeah . earlier it was there , see even russians got scared of hyperinflation . they have experienced it already .

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 14:57 | 5827938 Max Steel
Max Steel's picture

 

Tweetplomacy: US Rep in Ukraine Spends All Day Bashing Russia on Twitter

Read more: http://sputniknews.com/politics/20150225/1018737862.html#ixzz3SmiA3ZRv

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:00 | 5827994 dearth vader
dearth vader's picture

Wait for the new batch of Hryvnia notes. All Ukies will become millionaires overnight.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 15:18 | 5828087 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

You mean Billionaires, err ah, Trillionaires?

At least Hrynia notes will be cheaper to burn than wood, or cheaper than toilet paper.

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:51 | 5828758 pendragon
pendragon's picture

democracy comes at a price. schadenfreude for the soviets...ruble already plunged and they're still stuck with the commie dinosaur putin

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 18:44 | 5828980 Latina Lover
Latina Lover's picture

Just in case your missed my earlier post:

Exactly 1 year after the USSA sponsored Kiev Coup:

-tens of thousands killed in a civil war

-currency destroyed

-unemployment more than doubled

-millions of Ukie refugees in Russia

-central bank is bankrupt

-fascist oligarchs get even richer while the poorest earn less than most africans

-fracking and rampant GMO production, ruining the best farmland in europe.

Mission Accomplished!

As for Democracy: between Lustration, Private Nazi Armies, Martial Law, War and Forced Conscription, I suspect that there are few democrats left to kill.

i'll bet there are more than a few Ukies who would happily prefer the commie dinosaur Putin over the current Ukie cast of criminal clowns, puppets of the USSA.  BTW, is that your idea of democracy, to be controlled by the USSA?

 

Finally, I could also add that nothing really changed, other than Maidan replaced criminal thieving Oligarchs with criminal, thieving, murderous Oligarchs, but even a maidendummy like yourself will never admit they were punked.  Idiots like you will chanting Slava Ukrainia to the bitter end,  as the barrier troops send you charging toward russia, to face certain death.

 

Thu, 02/26/2015 - 09:53 | 5830889 Max Steel
Max Steel's picture

CUNT NEVER GO FULL RETARD .

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 16:48 | 5828489 saltedGold
saltedGold's picture

"Wait for the new batch of Hryvnia notes. All Ukies will become millionaires overnight."

I look forward to the new notes so I can add them to my collection of failed fiat currencies...

Wed, 02/25/2015 - 17:16 | 5828627 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

Gononomics, a solution straight out of Africa.

 

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