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Architects of Iraq War ADMIT It Was Illegal
The chief American prosecutor for the Nuremberg war crime trials – Robert H. Jackson – stated:
To initiate a war of aggression, therefore, is not only an international crime; it is the supreme international crime differing only from other war crimes in that it contains within itself the accumulated evil of the whole.
Forget third-hand allegations … the architects of the Iraq war admit that they initiated a war of aggression, not a war to defend America from imminent attack.
Influential Pentagon hawk Richard Perle conceded in 2003 that the invasion of Iraq had been illegal:
“International law … would have required us to leave Saddam Hussein alone“, and this would have been morally unacceptable.
Indeed, U.S. government officials have admitted that everyone knew that Iraq didn’t have weapons of mass destruction.
A top Bush administration adviser – Philip Zelikow said that the Iraq war was launched to protect Israel.
And the following Bush officials admitted that the Iraq war was launched for oil:
- George W. Bush
- Key war architect – and Under Secretary of State – John Bolton
- Former Bush speechwriter David Frum (referring to Dick Cheney)
- A high-level National Security Council officer
- 4 Star General John Abizaid, the former commander of CENTCOM, with responsibility for Iraq
- Many others
Of course, this is "old news" (#15) ... except that the U.S. did the same thing in Libya, and is now doing the same thing in Ukraine, Syria and elsewhere.
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What about that arsehole BLIAR. Why no inclusion in the list?
Nuremberg was only put in place because Stalin wanted to execute the entire German Officer Corps - 50,000 - Spencer-Churchill agreed but Truman needed the fig-leaf of legal legitimacy so they put together a War Trial inviting Andrei Vyshinsky of the Stalinist Show Trials as a Prosecutor. He immediately charged Germany with Katyn.
The hanging of Keitel merits the hanging of Blair and Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld and Perle etc. It will not happen. The US does not recognise International Courts it is Exceptional and accountable to noone. Until the US is defeated militarily the US populace is too repressed to hold its Executive to account and operates as a Captive Electorate bound by Media and Political Elites into a drone-like existence of Subservience.
After defeat in war and the loss of carrier groups - if a French sub can take out Theodore Roosevelt and its escorts then I am sure Russian and Chinese can eradicate the rest, then perhaps Americans will be free to hold their ruling elites to account
Such a military defeat would enable the people to eradicate the DeepState in America. Hopefully it won't come to that and the - to my mind inevitable - collapse of the economy will be enough to galvanize the masses.
I don't understand much of what Sandman said above.
But was thinking if the plan is to control 5 countries in the Middle East, then we need 20 more years of Exponential Federal Budget Spending. Then what? Some other Anglo-American country becomes the new super power? Or an Anglo-American state rises through treaty agreements?
Iraq, … Syria, Lebanon, Libya, Somalia, Sudan and Iran
Perhaps the goal is all of these countries become greater Israel and Israel becomes the new Super Power in 20 years or when the USA Collapses from Money Printing.
How much Gold Does Israel Have?
What is Israel's Strength other than Alliances with the USA and Wealthy Patrons that are the richest in the world?
Maybe Israel has great organizational skills like Germany?
Katyn may refer to: Katyn massacre, a mass execution of Polish citizens in 1940; Katy? (film), a 2007 Polish film about the Katy? massacre directed by Andrzej ..
"The Execution of Nazi War Criminals"
Karl-Heinz Keitel (eldest son) ... Keitel, signing the ratified surrender terms for the German Army in Berlin, 8/9 May 1945 .... Instead, he was executed by hanging.
On 1 October 1946, the International Military Tribunal at Nuremberg delivered its verdicts, after 216 court sessions. Of the original twenty-four defendants, twelve (including Martin Bormann, tried in absentia) were sentenced to death by hanging.
Field Marshall Keitel, who was immediately behind Von Ribbentrop in the order of executions, was the first military leader to be executed under the new concept of international law - the principle that professional soldiers cannot escape punishment for waging aggressive wars and permitting crimes against humanity with the claim they were dutifully carrying out orders of superiors.
So who's going to be locked up first, sombody who hacks the US Government and exposes the documents for the Bush's for all their War Crimes or the Bush's for committing the actual war crimes.
I'm gonna go with the former...
Would you agree that even though we have an illegal and unconstitutional
Federal reserve that each president had to do the best with what they have. And with that you have the competing ideologies that battle within that framework and do battle.
With that backdrop their are deep state battles that aren't what they are sold to the public because if it was most of us would do what we think is best which is pull our money out of the system.
I don't like it and I'm sure you're not a fan of this. IMHO I think most world leaders know where the monetary situation is and know that it will reset at a certain time but politicians and world leaders take advantage of these known quantities and play chess accordingly.
Damn Tyler's give me my own post and see what I can do for you huh?
I'm not disagreeing with you, but haven't ALL wars since WWII been illegal in that none have been declared wars by congress as is the intent of the constitution?
Which is likely why the founders didn't want it left to a KING, or DICTATOR which is what we seem to be doing nowdays.
1812 and Mexican war also were not too Kosher..WW I ?? fishy to say the least. Didn't Tonkin give some authorization? Hell who knows...as Offspring says, shit is fucked up.
Official status on Tonkin is that it never happend. I guess Korea is legit. Granada is of course legit - cannot have such a lovely place with nice ladies come under control of some weirdo. ;)
It's the "Federal Reserve" of death and destruction with impunity.
Quantitative Death "Infinity"!
And I guarantee you that each of the quotes above with names attached will keep doing it until each of them are cut into four pieces and sent to the four corners of this Nation!
To prove my point here a link to your own post about how Bush's biggest regret was the Iraq war.
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2008/dec/02/george-bush-iraq-interview
"The biggest regret of all the presidency has to have been the intelligence failure in Iraq," Bush told ABC television in an interview scheduled for broadcast last night. "I wish the intelligence had been different, I guess."
The exit interview found Bush in an unusually reflective mood for a president who has famously refused in the past to admit any mistakes. He did not go so far as to say he would not have gone to war if the intelligence had been correct.
This is what I mean by you are disingenuous. Get it?
I dare you. Debate me fact for fact. Your links to articles only point to small quotes without the broader context of the discussion. Come on you gutless coward. You won't because you can't. Just like the global warming idiots who don't want to here anything other than what fits their preconceived notion. And they call themselves diverse and open to ideas. Yeah fucking right.
I'll be ready and waiting anytime you want and I'll even use your own quotes to articles you use to make your points.
And you obviously didn't recognize the "Tombstone" quotes to illustrate the similar situation that Wyatt Earp smacks down the Pharaoh dealer who is all talk and heel.
Nothing is beyond our reach!
If hasn't become obvious by now it should be that this GW character is trolling fraud. Ask for clarification on his assertions and what do you get? Snarky comments and no debate.
I will make it my mission to haunt and hound you GW because you stand for everything that goes against the truth and debate which is why most of came here to fight club. Now it's pussy Putin club where any criticism of ol Vlady is met with down arrows galore no matter what. If when your right you get down arrowed.
Game on!!!
"I will make it my mission to haunt and hound you GW..."
Because that is what sane, reasonable people do.
Poaster- because reasonable sane people tell partial truths to push a dishonest agenda that goes against the point of fight club.
Yes I'm sooooo insane to dare challenge and question the motives of those who get posting privileges to push lies. Top notch.
Nice technique number 1, soldier.
yep, so obvious, not even funny anymore. can we all agree to skip reading/voting on Shitgum? Personally i would like to give him an other chance if Gum comes with constructed reply rather than general accusations of slander/propaganda etc.
Needless to say, this does not mean I or anyone else must agree on what GW has to say.
We are an exceptional nation.
Laws pertain to everybody equally, except for us.
Such exceptionalism, indeed, comes from an excess of will unaccompanied by awareness of the necessity for self-restraint.
GW- I find your articles to be rather disingenuous because you lea out certain makes to make your case and hide behind the avatar of one of Americas greatest patriot. The first paragraph alone of this New York Times stroke yours the lie to the "Saddam didn't have weapons of mass destruction" garbage. And yes I'm well aware of the fact that bush didn't clarify this enough and state the facts surrounding what we all knew.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/07/07/world/africa/07iht-iraq.4.14301928.htm...
BAGHDAD — American and Iraqi officials have completed nearly the last chapter in dismantling Saddam Hussein's nuclear program with the removal of hundreds of tons of natural uranium from the country's main nuclear site.
The uranium, which was removed several weeks ago, arrived in Canada over the weekend, according to officials. The removal was first reported by The Associated Press.
Although the material could not be used in its current form for a nuclear weapon or even a so-called dirty bomb, officials decided that in Iraq's unstable environment, it was important to make sure that it did not fall into the wrong hands.
BTW- if the uranium was not even able to make a dirty bomb then why the concern of getting into the wrong hands. I want the truth like the rest of you but you all know that there are things that can't be told because of the larger implications involved, especially if it meant that we had to engage two or more major nuclear powers which would lead to TEOTWAWKI.
Little tired of the agendas here other than conspiracy facts.
lets go invade north korea then...., or Israel, or south africa (oh no, they've given up on nukes), or Pakistan, or India or in fact Ukraine, Kazakhstan etc...
Thus far I see only one argument against GW: 'because the officials say Hussain was a risk". Even though most (former) officials now rebutt/revoke that assertion.
"Little tired of the agendas here other than conspiracy facts.". Yes most of us are too, it just depends on which side of the 'conspiracy' you are.
What are your conspiracy facts? Using officials to decide is using authority as an argument. What do you define as a WMD? What is your argument, when you object to GW's identity? What are your larger implications that lead to TEOTWAWKI?
Reaper- i was referring to critics of ZH who say all we do is pump conspiracy theories when the Tyler's have been proven right with conspiracy facts. I was not referring to GW. I was saying the reason why we come here is to get the unbridled info that used to tell it straight.
But this blatant propaganda, especially since the Tyler's sold it, has been unbearable. And as far as my definition of WMD, just look at my posts above and notice the DEAFENING SILENCE!
I've challenged him in no uncertain terms and he won't do it. That should tell you something. And something about the current Tyler's.
You know what it tells me? It tells me you are a maroon who doesn't deserve the response, a maroon who swallows...propaganda. You didn't define a WMD. You said Iraq had uranium. Please clarify to us why any country doesn't have the right to uranium? EVERY country has the right to have uranium or plutonium or any other fucking thing they want to have. Who put the UN in charge of who can hold what, besides the UN? That's like saying the Bible is true because it says it is. It's circular logic. Fuck the UN. 1) Countries have the right to nuclear power, 2) countries have the right build nukes. Please don't argue that N Korea or Iran or Iraq shouldn't be allowed to have nukes because they are rogue. You want an example of a rogue nation with nukes? Do I really need to point it out?
Keep swallowing shitgum.
Joker- if you'd read the NYT article it states that Iraq had a nuclear program and that the uranium was not at the time able to be used. It could be reconstituted to become weapons grade. Read my friend. It's your salvation.
And he does owe me a response when I call him out on his own bullshit. He's a coward and won't respond with facts to dismiss my criticism. He is a shill and a troll.
Happy St. Patty's Day
Chemically speaking almost all nuclear material can be used or enriched to create some sort of effective WMD. There are however several major issues, inclusing cost and technology, that makes an *effective* weapon a whole other matter. Dirty devices are not that hard and I dare to state that most large criminal organisations and or terrorist organisation (whatever that may be). can gain materials, technology and deliver it to a place of it's choosing. Yield will be probably be too low relative to cost/effort I suppose.
The point being, even if intel was right, there are law to abide to and there was in no way an imminent threat to conus other than the general threat i suggested above (criminals etc). This is not a reason to invade a country and if it is, better enlage your army 100x since there are an awful lot of countries that have similar capabilities to Irak back in the day...
Now assume for a second that the intel was wrong or presented in such a way that it seemd right, but was actually wrong. Like lying with ommission. Let's assume that the origins of the war were wrong. Can the US bring back 1.5 million people from the dead, hunger and mayhem?
Once again turn to the 'they were right' scenario. Hussain a weirdo? Maybe yes, maybe no. It is irrelevant since there was no threat to conus. Perhaps Hussain was creating more stability being surrounded by serious enemies Iran, the Saudi's and to a lesser extend Israel.
As history as thought us.... Take away the man and see what a mess it has left. I'm sure the people of the middle east are greatful to the MSM Believers in the US.
Take yer Smoke Detector...er..Have the homeless dumpster divers collect them for you.
Find zee strips with the Americium-241 Ceramic Beads.
Crush the beads. Grind them up with a Mortar and Pistle.
Go to yer local WallyWorld produce section.
Throw that dust onto the fresh produce.
Anyone can wage Nuclear War on a small scale. Anyone.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Americium
If consumed, americium is excreted within a few days and only 0.05% is absorbed in the blood. From there, roughly 45% of it goes to the liver and 45% to the bones, and the remaining 10% is excreted. The uptake to the liver depends on the individual and increases with age. In the bones, americium is first deposited over cortical and trabecular surfaces and slowly redistributes over the bone with time. The biological half-life of 241Am is 50 years in the bones and 20 years in the liver, whereas in the gonads (testicles and ovaries) it remains permanently; in all these organs, americium promotes formation of cancer cells as a result of its radioactivity
But you didn't respond to my criticism. Who the fuck says Iraq can't have a nuke? Who gave them the authority?
Do you think Iraq, Syria, and Lybia and millions of people would have been destroyed if they had nukes?
Have you seen the pictures of what the US and it's WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION did to the people? Take a look and tell me again about the hypocritic authority.
The US exists to protect Israel....it has no other function than to be the Mother Ship, the Galactic Battlestar
You get "tired" quickly:
Only someone who has no argument and doesn't address the criticism I have about you would do something as pathetic as go to someone's time in service here.
Like I said you are disingenuous because you only providethings to make your point toward your agenda. How do u know that I haven't had 5 avatars for a few years or that i didn't post for quite sometime because I realized that I was not knowledgable enough make statements?
You don't. You are like HH who doesn't address criticism he just attacks you or goes to some other inane "fact". Come on man, answer the criticism by proving me wrong. And no I'm not tired. Not by a long shot. However your propaganda is tiring and transparent.
Happy St. Patty's Day
Nice logo, soldier: http://www.cnet.com/news/us-surveillance-satellites-logo-octopus-encircling-the-world/
Your logo:
The logo of the spy agency, the U.S. National Reconaissnce Office:
They're identical. Motto:
Nothing Is Beyond Our Reach
nah, he cannot be that stupid right?
I'd like to see an explanation of the Avatar/ Logo similarity please.
Thank you. I made it a t-shirt with the caption; "Captured"
And like I don't know what my own avatar is.
Like I said only someone who has no argument resorts to criticizing time in service or resort to alinsky tactics as to antagonize your opponent.
You are an empty name with no facts. I find it hilarious that YOU are calling me a troll. Talk about the pot and the fucking kettle.
Throw down boy. Pull that smoke wagon and see what happens! I guess all your going to do is bleed like the COWARD YOU ARE!!!
"except that the U.S. did the same thing in Libya, and is now doing the same thing in Ukraine, Syria and elsewhere."
with impunity ...
Arrest bush cheney obama biden bohner mc connel reed and pilosi to start unbelievable chicken shit criminals. The hand writing on the wall ww3 comming soon to a country near you brought to you by the USSA
Irish Folk Music Revival - Documentary (90mins)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=39D0J8SzQMA
.
"rural, marginalized by artists too." ...
Related:
wolfowitz is off by years but we get the idea
Bush...regrets...
HA HA HA HA!
Yeah. Next we'll hear that Pappy regrets his part in having Kennedy offed.
We have reached Peak Hans Gruber.
Anyone else more concerned with right vs wrong than legal vs illegal??
'We should never forget that everything Adolf Hitler did in Germany was "legal" and everything the Hungarian freedom fighters did in Hungary was "illegal."' MLK Jr
Of course right vs. wrong is the more important category but it's not possible to institute legal process against anyone within that framework. When I was young three-quarters of a century ago, there were canons of right and wrong; but in today's relativistic society, right and wrong are merely lifestyle choices. If you don't molest children or murder people (police exempted, of course), you can do pretty much what you want to in the "west" these days. So whatever you or I may think of the right vs. wrong dichotomy, it's rather passé these days.
On the other hand, America is a legalistic society; that's how it avoids the right vs. wrong dichotomy. Though I wouldn't hold my breath until these criminals are indicted, Americans can and do understand criminal liability. Perhaps noting the criminal acts of the last four administrations can have an impact on how Americans see their government from the perspective of legal vs. illegal dichotomy.
"...but it's not possible to institute legal process against anyone within that framework."
This is the problem though, isn't it? When legality and the courts are wholly owned subsidiares of the plutocracy, then right and wrong cannot be proxied by legal and illegal. Maybe it was always a bad idea to suborn right and wrong into a legal framework.
“Why of course the people don’t want war … But after all it is the
leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it is always a
simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a
fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship …
Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of
the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are
being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and
exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.”
– Hermann Goering, Nazi leader.
Those that think they own us
want us at each other's throats
instead of united at theirs....
See http://ponerology.com/psychopaths_1.html