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Police Abduct 10 Children From A Family In Kentucky Because Of Their "Off The Grid" Lifestyle
Submitted by Michael Snyder via The End of The American Dream blog,
If the government does not like the way that you are raising your kids, they will come in and grab them at any time without giving any warning whatsoever. Of course this is completely and totally unlawful, but it has been happening all over America. The most recent example of this that has made national headlines is particularly egregious. Joe and Nicole Naugler of Breckinridge County, Kentucky just had their 10 children brutally ripped away from them just because the government does not approve of how they are living their lives and how they are educating their young ones.
Let’s be very clear about this – Joe and Nicole had done nothing to violate the law whatsoever. All of their kids were happy, healthy and very intelligent. But because the control freaks running things in Kentucky got wind of their “off the grid lifestyle”, they have now had all of their children unlawfully abducted from them.
A lot of readers also lead “off the grid” lifestyles similar to what the Nauglers had been enjoying. The Nauglers own 26 acres in a remote area of Breckinridge County, and their family has been described as “extremely happy”. But despite never giving them a single warning or a single indication that anything was ever wrong, Kentucky police raided their home on May 6th. The following is how the raid was described on a website dedicated to this case…
On May 6th, 2015, Breckinridge Co. Sheriff’s officers came to their home, acting on an anonymous tip, and entered their property and home without a warrant and without probable cause. Nicole was at home with the two oldest children, while Joe was away with the others. When the officers left the home, they attempted to block the access road to the family property. Nicole and the two boys got in their car to leave the family property. The got only a short way down the road before the officers pulled Nicole over.
During this stop, sheriffs deputies took their two oldest boys from Nicole’s custody, providing her no justification or documentation to support their action. Nicole was able to contact Joe briefly by telephone, but only for a short period of time, because she needed to use her phone to record the events.
At that point, Nicole had been taken into custody for disorderly conduct (for not passively allowing the Sheriff to take her boys) and resisting arrest. Even though she is 5 months pregnant, she was slammed belly first into the cop car and bruised and scraped on both arms.
And people wonder why there is such an uproar about police brutality in this country…
How in the world can a police officer ever justify treating a pregnant woman like that? The police officer that treated Nicole like that should immediately resign. Talk about an utter disgrace. You do not ever treat a pregnant woman like that.
But this is America, where we are turning a little bit more into Nazi Germany every single day.
You can listen to audio of Nicole’s shocking arrest right here.
When Joe arrived on the scene, the police continued to act like Gestapo thugs…
Joe was able to arrange transportation to meet his wife where the stop had taken place. Joe attempted to get out of the car to speak with the officers and his wife, and to recover the vehicle Nicole had been driving. The Sheriff, with his hand on his sidearm, ordered Joe back into the car. Joe complied with that request. The sheriff informed Joe that he had every intention of making this as difficult as possible for them and that their car would be impounded, despite the fact that Joe was there onsite to recover it.
A friend, who had driven Joe to the location, got out of the car to speak with the Sheriff. She was able to convince the Sheriff to let Joe recover the vehicle. Joe also recovered Nicole’s cell phone, which had been recording audio the entire time.
The Sheriff ordered Joe to turn the remaining eight children over to Breckinridge County Sheriff’s deputies by 10:00 a.m., and threatened him with felony charges if he does not comply.
Joe did comply with the Sheriff’s order, and now their kids have been scattered by CPS among families in four separate counties…
As of now, officials have placed the children with four families in four different counties, and as of Friday morning, the parents had not spoken with them. The four families are families that CPS chose – families the Nauglers don’t know.
Shame on you Kentucky. You are supposed to be better than this.
One of the most disturbing elements of this entire incident is that Child Protective Services never visited the Nauglers a single time and never gave them any indication that anything was wrong. The following comes from Off The Grid News…
Child Protective Services never visited the home, said Ellsworth, who believes the arrests took place because of the parents’ choice of “unschooling” for their children, and because of their simple way of life that some would call backwards. The family’s Facebook page calls it a “back to basics life.” They have a garden and raise animals. Deputies apparently were concerned about whether the children’s needs were being met, but friends say they personally have no concerns — and that the children are blessed to have Joe and Nicole as their parents.
How would you like it if government thugs raided your home and took your children away because they considered your lifestyle to be “backwards”?
What in the world is happening to this country?
Like I said earlier, what happened to the Nauglers is not an isolated incident. These kinds of things are happening all over the nation. For example, just consider the abuse that one homeschooling family received in New Jersey…
Meanwhile, in New Jersey, a WND report highlights how parents were interrogated by a CPS caseworker who questioned Christopher Zimmer and his wife Nicole, “on everything from their son’s homeschool education to questions about vaccines and guns in the house.”
Michelle Marchese aggressively demanded to enter the property after asserting Christopher Zimmer Jr. was not getting a “proper education.” Police subsequently arrived and allowed Marchese to enter the home before conducting a warrantless search.
The Zimmers are now suing the CPS for $60 million in a case before the U.S. District Court in Trenton.
I very much hope that the Zimmers win that case and collect a huge monetary award.
All over the nation, CPS officials are running around acting like little dictators and trampling the law. They need the courts to send them a clear message that this is a nation where the rule of law still applies.
If we do not stand with families like the Nauglers, control freak bureaucrats will continue to harass families that have chosen to live a “basic” lifestyle all over the nation. So let’s stand with them and make this case viral all over the Internet.
And Kentucky, get your act together and send those kids back home. You are supposed to be so much better than this.
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Hey CPS, you made the list! Enjoy your stay in the lake of fire.
9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, 10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
1 Timothy 1 King James Bible
Blessed be those that don't sign up for a social security number, for they will inherit the kingdom of redneckville
1st book of Pastafarian - Our lord the Flying Spaghetti Monster. Bless his name.
Contracting your kids into a system that is broke and from which they will never benefit is perfectly logical.
Bullshit! There are more than 3,000,000 laws in the FSA (Free Shit America), that way no one is able to escape farting daily without breaking some insane law. FSA isn't the same thing as FA. FA died.
Not Sees slam a pregnant woman to the ground? The reporting Tyler must be jewish.
By the way, 'Hellstorm' is here in movie format; https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GMCOKNCwHmQ
A lot said about water. It is quite common in this area of Kentucky to not have water on your homesite. You would be surpised I guess to see how many pickup trucks have giant water tanks in the bed or towed to haul water home. I've seen some pretty nice houses that don't have their own water source. Most have a cistern for storing the water they haul in.
Due to geology of the area, it is a crap shoot that you mostly lose if you try to drill a well.
Find yourself a good Tri-wall refrigerator box. and a viaduct near a Wifi signal. Thats livin
Someone must have ratted them out.
Remember , they couldn't find the Unabomber for years.
Not to quibble, but THEY didn't find him, his brother ratted out the Al Gore-esque psychopath.
I read into it a little; the photos of the family do not suggest feral kids or Pop; they look pretty bright-eyed and bushy tailed to me; much happier than most kids I know.
One report says CPS have visited site and were very happy with conditions
20 acres is plenty land to live off.
They are not shut off from the outer world with an internet connection, only thing I dodn't see was whether they were taking state support, foodstamps, whatever. They certainly could afford marshmallows and that takes cash in most worlds.
I guess they could steal ém, but as far as I could make out, they weren't being arrested for the Great Kentucky Marshmallow Heist.
This would all stop tomorrow if one of the parents had the balls to go shoot the pigs in the heads......after flaying the pig who gave the orders, chopping him up into taco meat, and donating it to a local illegal alien food bank.......
maybe all of you complainers could stop being such whiners and do something about it?
That's what I thought......
It's a god damn shame it may come down to that.... again.
Why is there no mention of allegations of theft, illegal transportation, fleeing the law, threatening neighbors with death and child neglect?
If you gonna post the story, post the full story, not just part of it.
You forgot the AK-47 hidden in the waistband of the infant daughter's diaper.
LOL,,, you managed some humor in a not so funny story....
Why stop at the lightweight glorification of the alleged "crimes", why not just accuse accuse this trailer park trash of possessing WMD? If you took enough samples from the composting toilet you could find an ammonia compound with the correct concentration to qualify as a WEAPON OF MASS DESTRUCTION under existing USSA statutory and administrative law.
Much MOAR SEXY than accusations of driving on with an expired license, registration or insurance... Or using your neighbors garden hose without permission... Or adults using stupid words in an argument.
Because those are packs of lies.
overbreeding...hey stop it aleady with the kiddie factory!
Yes, from your imbecilic post hopefully your parents agreed.
Oh I know. Only niggers and sandniggers are supposed to be breeding like rabbits. White people who believe in God and follow His commandment to be fruitful and multiply must be stopped at all costs.
The people who live at the margin of the System, threatens it. So must be destroyed.
Unless a critical number is reached, they'll always win.
It depends on how much you know about the law. I'd own their fucking houses for it. This family law sharade is equity, not law. A non party to a trust relation can't make any claims and these courts lack jurisdiction without cause (injury to a party). Anonymous tipsters don't cut it in law either, that's just made up bullshit that can't be cross examined. Probable cause insn't cause, it's a statutory substitution. Then there's little tidbit they'd love you not to know, concerning the origial Kentucky constitution:
it is expressly declared, "that every thing in that article is excepted out of the general powers of government, and shall forever remain inviolate; and that all laws contrary thereto, or contrary to the constitution, shall be void."
It is talking about the inalienable right, and natural rights of the people. Like raising your children the way you see fit. Your ignorance stands in the way between you and freedom. I've used this knowledge against government entities with great success. They don't the law either, including their idiot lawyers, until it is place before them. Then they shit.
Now we see the real reason for "schooling," which is control. Can't build an empire with a bunch of diverse people running around and thinking for themselves. I believe it started in Massachusettes in the mid-19th century and there was rebellion at the time.
I'm not defending this because I don't believe in the "nanny state" where CPS can take children away from biological parents based on an anonymous tip without any proof of risk of harm or endangerment, but why weren't these children either in school or being taught according to an approved home-schooling plan?
This happens everywhere and Kentucky, like most other states, requires a probable cause hearing within 72 hours. The proof of endangerment has to be by clear and convincing evidence.
And CPS was involved in this case and there was an anonymous tip.
http://www.inquisitr.com/2075629/why-did-this-off-the-grid-homeschooling...
Waffle, waffle, waffle.
You contradict yourself.
The state has no right to demand children be brainwashed in state run institutions, or by state sanctioned and "approved home-schooling plan".
Period.
Thank you. That is sooooo hard to get through to these Neo Nazi's
Another Constitutional Amendment taken down by the feral government years ago,,, and no one cared.
"In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense."
And just like the beatings, robbery, rapes, and killings,,, this is just the beginning. Say the wrong thing, the man come and take you away...
EDIT: I did not down vote you. Your post was too repugnant to warrant the effort.
Rand Shrugged....
I'll hide and watch to see if Rand Paul raises hell. The governor should be removed as quickly as were the kids.
Counterpunch, you are an authoritarian, what type of job description do you hold?
Must be that freedom I hear Americans going on about all the time.
I'm proouud to be an amurukan cuz a least I know I can't flee.
"For the first time in my adult life I'm proud of my country." Michael osamabumarama, aka the wookie
-- "We have absolute immunity. We can fuck up your life. There is nothing you can do. We will not lose our jobs even if you prove intentional malice in a lawsuit. In fact, lawsuits only encourage us to fuck you up worse the next time."
The mother is lucky to be alive as well as the father. The author stated the 'officer' should resign for slamming a pregnant woman on the car belly first,,, you have to be kidding! The officer thug (the correct term) probably did the high fives with his officer thug buddies at the local pub celebrating the family take down.
The new officer thugs have no conscious. They are trained in the art of pain and enjoy the power rush. It is my hope the children remember this disgusting act of terrorism and maybe return the favor to the terroristic powers once grown.
The whole thing is so vile and disgusting that I cannot continue. I am so ashamed of this now depraved nation of soulless zombies.
They didn't conform. Simple. Arrest them and throw their kids into dangerous foster care.
The STATE hates independence of any kind and will not be tolerated.
The CPS complaint is bullshit supreme. Bureaucrats need to be drowned in a pool of truth.
Doesn't suprise me one bit about Kentucky, whose legal system, filled with incompetent judges, slimeball lawyers and political cronyism all of whom spill over into ruining families/careers. Sparks, Roark, Huddleston, VanZant , Hadley, Keeler, Seldomridge, Birdwhistle, Mobley, Depregliasco, Spencer, Gudgel, Harris, Guethline, Faulkner, Glazer, Jasmin, the secret KY Bar Tribunal, ..the list goes on. The whole fucking lot of them.
BTW. Michael Synder has had a stream of timely hard hitting spot on articles.
Sounds like this KY family is far ahead of the rest of us, in so far as they may be better prepared to handle the coming malestrom.
Nailed it.
I know who every one of those slimey fuckers are.
But...but...aren't they all Kentucky Colonels? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kentucky_colonel
Reminds me of Ruby Ridge !
Where does she dance?
OVERREACT! TERROR MUST BE MAINTAINED!!
Just keeping the serfs in line.
OVERREACT! TERROR MUST BE MAINTAINED!!
Bullshit article
Bullshit article
So I hope more of you are putting your money where your mouth is. If you believe that the government is your friend, forsake a peacefull existance and join the millitary - do it for your country. If you believe that your government is the oppressor, send your money to Kentucky to this family, or go visit them and donate your time.
The story you are using is not accurate. Link to full story http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3074746/Surrounded-garbage-kept-...
Surely, this is an un-biased report.
Another child that was taken by the baby snatchers and died in foster care. I think we can all remember how many Native American children that were seized by the government/churches and were never seen again. This may lead one to the not so shocking conclusion that governments are not good stewards of the lives of children.
Happy Mothers Day, The Government
http://www.opposingviews.com/i/health/child-protective-service-investigating-death-6-month-old-foster-care
If they had CPS in the 1800's, nobody would have been able to leave Kentucky.
"You're taking your children in a covered wagon WHERE?"
Legal age in Kentucky used to be 14 to fuck and get married.
CPS isn’t the problem.
Perhaps the Amish will be next because of their abnormal simple lifestyle. Some lawyers will get even richer because of this when the lawsuit succeeds.
If your kids aren't receiving the proper Government indoctrination, they wIll be taken from you. After all, if you signed their birth certificate, you have signed them over to the Government. They are the owners, you are the care taker. These kids would have turned out to be too smart for their peers, the Government system ensures that at the end of High School kids are useless to society, they won't know a thing about money, politics, practical skills, how to think for themselves, health and most importantly God their creator.
So god does all the fucking and not the kids parents?
Silly people...it doesn't take a village to rasie a chile. It takes the Federal Gubbamint!
Wow. Just wow.
at least things are starting to look up for the family.
the mother is out of jail and back home and the children should not be to far behind....
Also, CPS visited the family’s home on Friday morning and issued a good report on the living conditions, Ellsworth said. The Naugler’s attorney – considered by the family the best in the county – was present.
“CPS was very kind. They OK’d just about everything,” Ellsworth said.
so it seems when CPS finally did get involved they found nothing wrong or dangerous about the children's living conditions.
what is disturbing to me is the fact that the cops took the kids and ripped this family apart without the involvement of the proper authorities (CPS) in the first place. Police are not trained to ascertain whether or not living conditions as a whole are suitable for children, they have no legal authority to judge whether or not a home environment presents an immediate threat to the safety of the children unless that threat is clearly and blatantly obvious and present. examples such as drugs in plain site, sings of clear and recent neglect or abuse or witnessing the same, malnutrition, starvation, injuries or illness of an apparent serious nature going untreated, ect.
but by the CPS report none of these conditions exist at the home so the police taking the children was not routed in any legal or even moral judgement but instead was yet another example of the thug, gangster, nazi mentality the various law enforcement agencies have developed and cultivated.
the Sheriff did not have to do this to the family, he could have called in CPS first and then taken action based on their recommendation. in which case, based on the results of there inspection this poor family would have been spared this whole ugly, traumatic and completely unnecessary experience.
welcome to the UFSA.
buy the way since when did ZH grow such large population of fascist, authoritarian boot lickers?
for a minute there reading many of the comments I thought I was on MSNBC or some such, what the hell happened?
anyways here's hoping the kids are back home soon and the state has to pick up the tab...
Having dealt with Ky law enforcement personally, I can tell you from experience that there's nothing they hate more than a citizen who understands their rights under the law.
The sherrif absolutely violated their rights and should lose his badge, but that will never happen in that backward ass county.
Lose his badge? I've got a toolshed full of useful equipment for debriding tyranny following unlawful acts of violating unalienable rights.
Both Ruby Ridge and Waco and confronation with Montana Freemen . were set up as examples to others what happens when SOMEONE decides your life OR YOUR BELIEFS are a threat to the state or status quo.. the couple with the 10 kids got turned in by someone who saw a FACEBOOOK post about their off the grid lifestyle.. which is a warning to anyone who thinks FB is benign .. they can memory hole you . take every silly bit of information you put up . most of it used for marketing but also by government or snitches who are not happy unless they are bringing someone down . or forcing them to live as THEY think life should be lived. thsi USSA . .. if Kentucky still had a backbone . it would not be sitting still for this .. and as for Rand Paul .. FORGET IT . if he lifted a finger I would be totally shocked. he is running for president .. and defending those without voice.. not his job . or so he thinks.. ..Randy Weaver lost family members .. he was a real odd ball . but did not deserve the entire wrath of the federal govt. down on him .. he eventually wone a 3 million dollar settlement from the government .. he died last year.. .. the hearings in Cnogress re WEaver .. were revealing .. indicating govt. lying and covering up as they did with WACO .. all govt has to do is find a sacrificial lamb . one group or family . and it sends a message.. if you are too different .. we are coming for you . or your kids... This from a study done at Georgia State University .. more children are likely to be abused or die or drugged up by CPS than their own fmailies...
In this report, I have focused mainly on the Georgia Department of Family and Children Services (DFCS). However, I believe Child Protective Services nationwide has become corrupt and that the entire system is broken beyond repair. I am convinced parents and families should be warned of the dangers.
The Department of Child Protective Services, known as the Department of Family and Children Services (DFCS) in Georgia and other titles in other states, has become a “protected empire” built on taking children and separating families. This is not to say that there are not those children who do need to be removed from wretched situations and need protection. http://www.parentalrights.org/index.asp?SEC={5433EE7C-6775-4D17-A2A1-CE4686AE1697}
This story actually makes me "Hate" the system even more. I look forward to Revolution 2.0
Don't hold ur breath.
The way things are going, I'm pretty confident we'll reach the criticality required for . . . an infection point.
Another kind of kidnapping goes on with the tacit approval of parents. Public schools teach children to suspect and turn in their parents (when necessary) for being in conflict with the dictates of the state. The Jesuits were correct about controling the early education of children..."Let us have a child until he be five, and we will have him for life." The Soviets had the Young Pioneers. Formenting generational distrust is important business for Statists of all sorts.
+100
If the government does not like the way that you are raising your kids...."
Silly Wabbit, they're not YOUR kids, they never were. You registered them when they were born, they're government chattel. Once you admit your mistake then you can have an intelligent discussion about "kids".
"
Mchael Snyder needs to be on Zoloft
In a nation where over 1 Million unborn babies are ripped out of the womb and murdered annually....
In a nation where, from birth, they are force-fed and injected with brain destroying toxins....
In a nation where most children spend the majority of their time in front of a glowing screen....
In a nation where children are fed substance that hardly qualifies as food....
In a nation where nearly half of all families split and the children and used as pawns in divorce.....
....I find it difficult to believe these deputies were "concerned" about whether the children's needs were being met. What a stained nation this is.
You can help the family by donating .. http://www.gofundme.com/tz4xng Its up to 36K . .. they are going to need it to fight this .......
Georgia State Senate ..
that poor parents very often are targeted to lose their children because they do not have the where-with-all to hire lawyers and fight the system. Being poor does not mean you are not a good parent or that you do not love your child, or that your child should be removed and placed with strangers;
· that all parents are capable of making mistakes and that making a mistake does not mean your children are to be removed from the home. Even if the home is not perfect, it is home; and that’s where a child is the safest and where he or she wants to be, with family;
· that parenting classes, anger management classes, counseling referrals, therapy classes and on and on are demanded of parents with no compassion by the system even while the parents are at work and while their children are separated from them. (some times parents are required to pay for the programs) This can take months or even years and it emotionally devastates both children and parents. Parents are victimized by “the system” that makes a profit for holding children longer and “bonuses” for not returning children to their parents;
· that caseworkers and social workers are very often guilty of fraud. They withhold and destroy evidence. They fabricate evidence and they seek to terminate parental rights unnecessarily. However, when charges are made against Child Protective Services, the charges are ignored;
· that the separation of families and the “snatching of children” is growing as a business because local governments have grown accustomed to having these taxpayer dollars to balance their ever-expanding budgets;
· that Child Protective Services and Juvenile Court can always hide behind a confidentiality clause in order to protect their decisions and keep the funds flowing. There should be open records and “court watches”! Look who is being paid! There are state employees, lawyers, court investigators, guardian ad litems, court personnel, and judges. There are psychologists, and psychiatrists, counselors, caseworkers, therapists, foster parents, adoptive parents, and on and on. All are looking to the children in state custody to provide job security. Parents do not realize that the social workers are the glue that hold “the system” together that funds the court, funds the court appointed attorneys, and the multiple other jobs including the “system’s” psychiatrists, therapists, their own attorneys and others.
Did you hear about the Kentucky off-the-grid homesteaders who allegedly had their ten children taken away because they were homeschooling? If not, you’ll probably hear about it soon, it’s rapidly going viral.
As the outrage machine kicks into high gear, here are seven important things you should know.
1. Homeschooling is legalAs with every other state, homeschooling is legal in Kentucky. The only requirements are that parents notify the school board of their intent to homeschool, and that they provide 185 days of instruction in the same subject areas as the local public schools. There are no assessment requirements, no curriculum requirements, no requirements that the children be working near grade level. Parents can meet the subject requirements any way that they see fit—including through unschooling, as Joseph and Nicole Naugler state they were doing.
Noncompliance with Kentucky law can result in truancy charges, but CPS doesn’t take children away for noncompliance, and they certainly don’t take children away if the parents are in compliance with Kentucky’s lax homeschool regulations.
Remember, child protection proceedings are not open to the public, so we have no way of verifying what the Nauglers are claiming is actually true. Just because they claim the children were taken away because of homeschooling doesn’t mean that’s why the police were called or why CPS got involved.
2. The CPS ComplaintNicole Naugler posted the following photograph of the CPS report in a private Facebook group. As you can see, unlike what the Nauglers are stating publicly, the children were not removed because they were homeschooling—the accusation that the children were not enrolled in school is one small portion of a lengthy complaint.
Here’s the clearer version of the photo.
Notice that the allegations include the father threatening a neighbor with a weapon, that the property includes numerous piles of garbage, scattered broken glass and nails, and mention of the family residing in makeshift tents. The photos posted on the Nauglers’ Facebook page and blog back up those allegations.
The following comments were posted either on Nicole Naugler’s personal facebook page or on the family page by people claiming to know the Nauglers. I cannot verify the veracity of the claims, but they certainly present a different narrative than the one presented by the Nauglers. (Note: these posts have since been deleted by the Nauglers)
Posts by another homeschool mom:
And, a comment left by an off-the-grid homeschool mom on the Relationship Homeschooling page.
3. Living ConditionsThe Nauglers have extensively documented their lives online, and the picture they paint on their blogs and social media is of a family living in conditions that are quite troubling.
Before I continue, let me make it clear that I have zero problem with living off-the-grid. It’s probably not something I would do because I like my air conditioning a little too much, but I’ve got no objection to sustainable off-the-grid homesteading with children, so long as living conditions are safe and basic needs are met.
The Naugler’s “cabin” is a three-walled shanty, where they claim they put up some sort of 4th wall in the winter. They’re living in this shack with ten children, including infants and toddlers.
As you can see from the comments on this photo just posted to their facebook page, some people are confused as to whether this is even the cabin.
Here’s another photo, and again, remember that there are twelve people living in this shack, including small children.
And the inside of the “cabin.” As you can see, there are only three walls, and while they claim that they had a fourth wall up during the winter, we’re going to have to take their word for it. In searching all of the pictures on the family Facebook page, I was unable to find any photos of the “cabin” taken during winter that are anything other than close-ups of the children in bed.
The platform along the back wall is where the whole family of twelve sleeps.
Again, I have no problem with off-the-grid living, but this isn’t a cabin or even a tent, it’s a glorified lean-to with little protection from the elements.
You can see the rest of the photos here.
The Nauglers did have a prefab building placed on the property originally, which, despite being essentially a large, uninsulated shed, at least had four walls and sturdy construction. For reasons that aren’t explained, in August of 2014 they decided to return the prefab building and build what you see here. Again, this is how they weathered the winter of 2014/2015, one of the snowiest winters on record across much of the US.
4. This was not their first contact with CPSIn her November 12, 2013 blog post Nicole Naugler wrote that they were contacted by CPS just eleven days after moving into their prefab building on the property.
To be clear, just because you’ve had CPS called on you does not necessarily mean that you’ve done anything wrong. However, this does mean that they were on the child protective services radar over questions about their living conditions long before this allegedly vindictive call was made (if one even was made, again, we’re going by their version of events).
5. Possible identification abuseOn her personal facebook page, Nicole Naugler states that several of her children don’t have birth certificates or other forms of ID. Homeschooling Alumni Reaching Out defines identity abuse as, “one’s parent, guardian or primary caretaker “not providing you with, withholding, or destroying any of your identification documents: driver’s license, social security card, etc.”
As the Naugler children are still minors, this isn’t as severe a problem as if they were adults whose identification was withheld, but it is a troubling sign none the less. This will make it more difficult for them to establish their identity as adults, as the stories of Alecia Pennington, Cynthia Jeub, and Eleanor Skelton demonstrate.
6. Previous run-ins with the lawJoseph Naugler has multiple arrests, including for passing bad checks and for driving without registration or proof of insurance, and for failure to appear in court on those charges.
7. The audio recordingsThe Nauglers posted the audio of their interactions with the police online. I’ve mirrored it on Soundcloud because their hosting is overloaded. I encourage you to listen for yourself. During the course of the conversation, Nicole Naugler told the officer that she wouldn’t report a neighbor for abuse even if the child was bloodied from beatings. The recordings also include Nicole Naugler refusing to answer in the negative when asked by the sheriff’s officer about whether they would use weapons against law enforcement.
It’s quite disturbing and the exchange raises the specter of another Ruby Ridge scenario. That’s not to say that the Nauglers would start a fire fight that involved their children, but listening to the audio on the ground, Nicole Naugler certainly did nothing to dispel the concern that the children were in imminent danger if police didn’t act to remove them from the situation.
In conclusionDo these seven things justify the removal of the Naugler children? Ultimately, I don’t think we know enough about what is going on to make such judgments. The lack of proper housing is certainly disconcerting and would seem to justify the removal, but the Nauglers are not being forthright of about whether they are or are not staying at this property and in which part. What these things do demonstrate, at the very least, is that this family desperately needs help and they ought not be lifted up by homeschoolers as martyrs for the movement.
Here Are 7 Surprising Things You Need to Know About Joe and Nicole NauglerDid you hear about the Kentucky off-the-grid homesteaders who allegedly had their ten children taken away because they were homeschooling? If not, you’ll probably hear about it soon, it’s rapidly going viral.
As the outrage machine kicks into high gear, here are seven important things you should know.
1. Homeschooling is legalAs with every other state, homeschooling is legal in Kentucky. The only requirements are that parents notify the school board of their intent to homeschool, and that they provide 185 days of instruction in the same subject areas as the local public schools. There are no assessment requirements, no curriculum requirements, no requirements that the children be working near grade level. Parents can meet the subject requirements any way that they see fit—including through unschooling, as Joseph and Nicole Naugler state they were doing.
Noncompliance with Kentucky law can result in truancy charges, but CPS doesn’t take children away for noncompliance, and they certainly don’t take children away if the parents are in compliance with Kentucky’s lax homeschool regulations.
Remember, child protection proceedings are not open to the public, so we have no way of verifying what the Nauglers are claiming is actually true. Just because they claim the children were taken away because of homeschooling doesn’t mean that’s why the police were called or why CPS got involved.
2. The CPS ComplaintNicole Naugler posted the following photograph of the CPS report in a private Facebook group. As you can see, unlike what the Nauglers are stating publicly, the children were not removed because they were homeschooling—the accusation that the children were not enrolled in school is one small portion of a lengthy complaint.
Here’s the clearer version of the photo.
Notice that the allegations include the father threatening a neighbor with a weapon, that the property includes numerous piles of garbage, scattered broken glass and nails, and mention of the family residing in makeshift tents. The photos posted on the Nauglers’ Facebook page and blog back up those allegations.
The following comments were posted either on Nicole Naugler’s personal facebook page or on the family page by people claiming to know the Nauglers. I cannot verify the veracity of the claims, but they certainly present a different narrative than the one presented by the Nauglers. (Note: these posts have since been deleted by the Nauglers)
Posts by another homeschool mom:
And, a comment left by an off-the-grid homeschool mom on the Relationship Homeschooling page.
3. Living ConditionsThe Nauglers have extensively documented their lives online, and the picture they paint on their blogs and social media is of a family living in conditions that are quite troubling.
Before I continue, let me make it clear that I have zero problem with living off-the-grid. It’s probably not something I would do because I like my air conditioning a little too much, but I’ve got no objection to sustainable off-the-grid homesteading with children, so long as living conditions are safe and basic needs are met.
The Naugler’s “cabin” is a three-walled shanty, where they claim they put up some sort of 4th wall in the winter. They’re living in this shack with ten children, including infants and toddlers.
As you can see from the comments on this photo just posted to their facebook page, some people are confused as to whether this is even the cabin.
Here’s another photo, and again, remember that there are twelve people living in this shack, including small children.
And the inside of the “cabin.” As you can see, there are only three walls, and while they claim that they had a fourth wall up during the winter, we’re going to have to take their word for it. In searching all of the pictures on the family Facebook page, I was unable to find any photos of the “cabin” taken during winter that are anything other than close-ups of the children in bed.
The platform along the back wall is where the whole family of twelve sleeps.
Again, I have no problem with off-the-grid living, but this isn’t a cabin or even a tent, it’s a glorified lean-to with little protection from the elements.
You can see the rest of the photos here.
The Nauglers did have a prefab building placed on the property originally, which, despite being essentially a large, uninsulated shed, at least had four walls and sturdy construction. For reasons that aren’t explained, in August of 2014 they decided to return the prefab building and build what you see here. Again, this is how they weathered the winter of 2014/2015, one of the snowiest winters on record across much of the US.
4. This was not their first contact with CPSIn her November 12, 2013 blog post Nicole Naugler wrote that they were contacted by CPS just eleven days after moving into their prefab building on the property.
To be clear, just because you’ve had CPS called on you does not necessarily mean that you’ve done anything wrong. However, this does mean that they were on the child protective services radar over questions about their living conditions long before this allegedly vindictive call was made (if one even was made, again, we’re going by their version of events).
5. Possible identification abuseOn her personal facebook page, Nicole Naugler states that several of her children don’t have birth certificates or other forms of ID. Homeschooling Alumni Reaching Out defines identity abuse as, “one’s parent, guardian or primary caretaker “not providing you with, withholding, or destroying any of your identification documents: driver’s license, social security card, etc.”
As the Naugler children are still minors, this isn’t as severe a problem as if they were adults whose identification was withheld, but it is a troubling sign none the less. This will make it more difficult for them to establish their identity as adults, as the stories of Alecia Pennington, Cynthia Jeub, and Eleanor Skelton demonstrate.
6. Previous run-ins with the lawJoseph Naugler has multiple arrests, including for passing bad checks and for driving without registration or proof of insurance, and for failure to appear in court on those charges.
7. The audio recordingsThe Nauglers posted the audio of their interactions with the police online. I’ve mirrored it on Soundcloud because their hosting is overloaded. I encourage you to listen for yourself. During the course of the conversation, Nicole Naugler told the officer that she wouldn’t report a neighbor for abuse even if the child was bloodied from beatings. The recordings also include Nicole Naugler refusing to answer in the negative when asked by the sheriff’s officer about whether they would use weapons against law enforcement.
It’s quite disturbing and the exchange raises the specter of another Ruby Ridge scenario. That’s not to say that the Nauglers would start a fire fight that involved their children, but listening to the audio on the ground, Nicole Naugler certainly did nothing to dispel the concern that the children were in imminent danger if police didn’t act to remove them from the situation.
In conclusionDo these seven things justify the removal of the Naugler children? Ultimately, I don’t think we know enough about what is going on to make such judgments. The lack of proper housing is certainly disconcerting and would seem to justify the removal, but the Nauglers are not being forthright of about whether they are or are not staying at this property and in which part. What these things do demonstrate, at the very least, is that this family desperately needs help and they ought not be lifted up by homeschoolers as martyrs for the movement.
" I don’t think we know enough about what is going on to make such judgments."
Based on the facts adduced in your post I'd say you're correct. Hold off on the outrage and even more on the donations until the situation becomes clearer. Certainly Michael Snyder's account was - I'm being charitable here - one-sided.
I think living off the grid is fine if you do it right and know how to recycle everything, including your own trash and shit.
It takes money, education and hard work.
This seems more the case of shacking out and strewing garbage all over the place after you've overbread and now cannot afford it.
There are plenty of examples of that in Africa, although I think I would give Africans more credit given their situation.
i think its dangerous thinking to make something symbolic out of this. the police are in the middle between social services and the DA, i mean they dont go out in their patrol cars looking for off the grid truants. on teh other hand it seems that THEY think of this symbolically, and that troubles me the most.
Looks like the Gubmint wants to control every aspect of merikans' life including how to raise your kids.
What in the fuck is wrong with us? Look at the first pic in the article on Infowars. THE BABY IS CRYING. SEIZE THEM! SEIZE THEM ALL!!!
If these jackass terrorists aren't on their way to Gitmo by next week for some good old fashioned getting fucked by hookers wearing devil goat masks covered in blood, I'm personally going to send a sharply worded email to Zero and Shotgun Joe.
POLICE SEIZE 10 CHILDREN FROM ‘OFF-GRID’ HOMESCHOOL FAMILY Authorities targeting Americans with traditional, rural lifestylesWTH. I just looked at their Facebook page. BOWTIES? MULTI-COLOR BOWTIES? Don't they know that orange is the new red for Spring '15? They should have been raided by the fashion police long ago. Trying to sell accessories. Fuck them.
Under any normalcy of government, the male children would be prime candidates for our elite military units and three letter organizations.
Come on, cops. As soon as she pulled out her cell phone that can record the event (and be bugged/eavesdropped) it should have been obvious that this family isn't really that far "Off the Grid."
What blatant disregard for the truth.
No one was was "abducted."
The children were taken away because they were endangered, plain and simple.
An anonymous tip IS probable cause, Zero Hedge illiterates.
A sworn statement is probable cause to go take a look (not probable cause to remove anybody). An anonymous "tip" is pure fucking bullshit.
The Child Protection Racket needs to be wiped off the map. Even if these people are bad parents, there should have to be probable cause for charges to be filed, and then after arrest of the accused abusers, then a judge can call a hearing to remove the kids as long as the parents have an attorney in the court arguing their side to keep the kids at home. No ex parte meetings, no custody orders without representation of all parties. No such thing as these farcical "emergency" orders to seize kids. Either the kid is in grave danger and in this emergency situation you need to jail the perp for criminal mistreatment, or else there is no imminent danger, no arrest, and any attempt to seize custody must a long and careful process while the kids remain at home. It should be impossible to relieve someone of custody administratively without a trial. And the trial decision needs to be based on evidence of abuse, not on capricous opinions of how kids should be raised or what their needs are. There should be a politically and judicially powerless family services department that does nothing more than answer to the court providing services, which can neither petition the court nor initiate action against a family. Oh, and "anonymous" reports are hearsay and need to be thrown in the trash without any investigation. If a kid is removed from a home, it must be based on no less than a sworn statement.
"Kentucky" is just a place on a map. It is neither "good" nor "bad" nor can it be expected to be "better than this". Kentucky, as such, cannot act.