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Greece To Tax Bank Transactions, Says IMF "Won't Get Any Money" On June 5
On Monday we got still more bad news for Greece. Around one-third of Angela Merkel’s Christian Democratic bloc opposes further aid for Athens meaning the Chancellor faces an uphill battle in convincing German lawmakers to keep Greece on life support. Meanwhile, a new report from the Hellenic Confederation of Commerce and Enterprises suggests that each day without a deal costs the Greek economy €22.3 million.
Not to put too fine a point on it, but Tuesday’s headlines are even worse.
First, up is parliamentary speaker Nikos Filis confirming what the IMF leaked on Saturday: without a deal, Greece will default on June 5.
Via Reuters:
Greece will not be able to make a payment to the International Monetary Fund that falls due on June 5 without a deal with its international lenders, the government's parliamentary speaker said on Wednesday.
Athens faces several payments totalling about 1.5 billion euros (1 billion pounds) to the IMF next month and is in talks with the European Union and the International Monetary Fund to clinch a cash-for-reforms deal before it runs out of money.
"Now is the moment that negotiations are coming to a head. Now is the moment of truth, on June 5," parliamentary speaker Nikos Filis, from the ruling Syriza party, told ANT1 television.
While everyone should by now be desensitized to the sheer ridiculousness inherent in this circular funding scheme, as you can see from the following, the absurdity never ceases to amaze:
"If there is no deal by then that will address the current funding problem, they won't get any money. There is no money for the foreign (lenders) when they have not given us any funds for a year,” Filis said.
Basically, it’s not clear to Filis why these “foreign lenders” expect to get their money back when they haven’t sent Greece the money to repay them.
Varoufakis is still confused about a few things himself, notably that his superior intellect never seems to trump Schaeuble’s de facto status as EU paymaster when the two discuss billion-euro bailouts for Greece.
Via Bloomberg:
German Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble wrongly views previous Greek govts as “reflecting the character of all Greeks,” German weekly Die Zeit quotes Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis as saying in interview.
Asked if Schaeuble making mistakes in his analysis of Greece, Varoufakis says yes: Zeit
Varoufakis says regrettable that “relative power” trumps arguments when he and Schaeuble talk: Zeit
While Greek officials leisurely ponder such things, the central bank is begging for another increase in the ELA ceiling...
- GREEK CENTRAL BANK SAID TO REQUEST EU1.1B INCREASE IN ELA
...while the banks themselves mull the imposition of a levy on all transactions above €500…
Via Kathimerini:
Athens is promoting the idea of a special levy on banking transactions at a rate of 0.1-0.2 percent, while the government’s proposal for a two-tier value-added tax – depending on whether the payment is in cash or by card – has met with strong opposition from the country’s creditors.
A senior government official told Kathimerini that among the proposals discussed with the eurozone and the International Monetary Fund is the imposition of a levy on bank transactions, whose exact rate will depend on the exemptions that would apply. The aim is to collect 300-600 million euros on a yearly basis.
Fee won’t include ATM withdrawals, transactions up to EU500; in this case Greek govt projects EU300m-EU600m annual revenue from measure.
It looks like things are about to get a lot worse for Greeks as capital controls may be just around the corner. We wonder if the next shoe to drop will be a good old fashioned 'Cyprus'ing' for depositors.
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When can we see a photo of Greek Finance Minister Yanis Varoufakis teabagging Wolfgang Schaeuble
If the banks get their way and ban cash and the people allow it thinking it is just progress, aka I only use my credit card anyway. They will quickly realize the freedom from the banking system cash allowed and how it kept the banks in line.
If we can't learn from the lessons of history, we should become aware of what is going on presently and the risk it poses to our liberty, ie Cyprus bail in and this example in Greece.
I can just hear it now "I never use cash so what's the difference if they get rid of it?"-John Q Public
If Angie's right wing fails -- she'll just use the SPD to pass a 4th, 5th or 6th bailout. Shoot, the SPD would vote for Greek annexation if it was "for the protection of the Euro"
When is the rest of Europe gonna realize that the only beneficiary of Greek membership in the EU is the bankers?
Greece has been skullfucked poor and the rest of the EU peasantry get to pay for the bad loans the Greeks default on with all the banks.
Moral of the story: The people are screwed again by "their" Government and it's financial enablers.
I have a vision as to the initial implementation of the Georgia Guidestones
"No Money To The IMF???
They Already Raided The Pension Funds And Muni Accounts...? WTF, Where Is This Greek Peoples Money Now, Where???
TYLER (Or Whoever)... Your Promoting The Wrong Stories To The Top!
I've Noticed This For THe Last Few Months.
WTF Is Going On At ZH?
For Me This Greek Default Is Much More Significant That The HK Tycoon.
Get Whoever Used To Make The Selections BACK.
He Was GOOD, The Current Is NOT...
Let's not forget that it's not only Greece that is broke. Italy, Spain, Ireland, portugal..... the battlefront is now in Greece, soon to be shifted to the next domino. The Euro is doomed.
33% Greece bailout funds came from Italy + Spain, 29% from Germany
Throw those pathetic Greeks out of Europe already.
"Basically, it’s not clear to Filis why these “foreign lenders” expect to get their money back when they haven’t sent Greece the money to repay them.
Varoufakis is still confused about a few things himself, notably that his superior intellect never seems to trump Schaeuble’s de facto status as EU paymaster"
Just Beautiful...
Calmyourself, go back and read what Varoufakis was saying and writing a year ago. He's crystal clear about the score and the nature of the game. The Banksters have been lending out money not just to Greece but to many countries where ultimately repayment is a mathematical impossibility. The game is making their owners richer and they want to keep it going - and settle up with privatization of public property at the end.
Syriza is setting a higher price for keeping their game going. So you can perhaps take Varoufakis' words not as naivete but as a taunt.
Never mind our public, private, and unfunded debt, we can always set up more domino's.
Merkel would order that every fit healthy citizen has to sell a kidney (EUR proceeds to Greece), if that holds the EUR-zone (and her United States of Europe dream) alive.
The (further) risk to Germany only goes away once she is removed from power, and she is (still) very popular...
Watson
We'll see what happens. I find the timing of the AfD's split interesting.
Just like any leader of a party, Lucke wants power. Its what drives the world forward while driving all men mad.
This, much like Marie la Pen expelling her father, could just be a good cover story. Marie la Pen needs to go after the moderate UMP voters for 2017, but they would never support Fronte National with her father still there.
Lucke knows he cannot get more than 5-10% of the vote while supporting some of these further right ideologies in Germany. However, he also knows that any anti-EUR party, up to this point in Germany is quickly labeled "Nazis" -- & if it catches on -- is the death knell politically. Thus, he needs another more mainstream anti-EUR party to "run interference" for him in Germany's political landscape.
I see this as the AfD (or perhaps its better to preference it as the AfD'S ideas) jettisoning 2% of the vote to go after 20% of the vote. The timing is perfect as Greece is going to need another few bailouts over the next 6-10 quarters (time before the next German elections). If there is another party in the race which keeps the Left wing occupied and is a magnet for the right -- then Lucke can squeeze in between a dying FDP & the Union's right wing which is becoming ever more disenchanted with Frau Merkel and her "Greece must stay in the EURO at all costs" attitude.
Up to this point, the EUR has benefited greatly from the average German voter not realizing (or caring to realize) how much they lose every year with the EUR. However, this financial ignorance in the German population could also spell the downfall of the EUR.
If Lucke/AfD's ideas can convince enough Germans that Greece is a small country, and it defaulting and leaving wouldn't be that big of a deal (when in fact it is), a German decision not to grant Greece another bailout and essentially force a default will start a domino effect, the size of which no one can guess. I can promise you this -- whenever you hear someone say a GREXIT would be contained, they have no idea what they are talking about, or are just flat lying.
Will be interesting to watch.
Reminds me of the old chap with the moustache: "WOLLT IHR DEN TOTALLEN KRIEG?"
Bis zum bitteren Ende...
Germans love to force things until they reach "all-or-nothing"-proportions. Twice now. Last time with bombs & bullets. This time with Euros & Bonds. Right so. I will keep REAL bullets in my closet, should push come to shove!
They can't pay back the old loans without any new loans. No problem there.
Everyone knows that Greece is fucked.
It just takes a bit longer for everyone to get it that whoever lent them the money is ALSO fucked.
Greece should sell the pipeline thing to Russia, take the funds and buy CDS on themselves and burn the fucker to the ground by defaulting.
Then take the winnings, pay of Russia, and watch as the rest of Europe burns.
Come on, hasn't anyone in Greece thought this one up yet?
pods
Whoever loaned them that money just created it out of thin air by typing some numbers into a computer display , so they don't really give a fuck , getting it back would just be a bonus , the whole thing is just a fucking charade.
As long as the debt remains, the money supply doesn't shrink.
The biggest problem facing today's money supply is default.
It can be argued that the "loans" to Greece came out of excess government capital (Ghordius would know) as opposed to freshly minted bonds, but the bigger issue is keeping those Euros from going *poof* because that can start a deflationary implosion. (see the US in 2008 and what the FED did to the tune of around $26 TRILLION)
pods
Agreed , if the loans were paid off completely then the circulating money supply would shrink by that amount. That is not wanted in an inflationary system , which has technically now come to the end of it's useful life cycle. Deflation will soon be the norm , and that requires negative rates , which will bring with it a whole new shitstorm.
Bitcoin , BTChezzz ...
They should sell some of those Germen subs they got to North Korea. Accept some phony dollars for them and convert them and pay the bills. It's all funny money anyway, so why not?
They don't want it back. They want a steady stream of interest income like all the other vsampires out there.
You won't get that from me. You'll have to go to Business Insider for that.
Now they might be "getting" it. Only the greeks can fix greece. Start by keeping Greece's wealth in greece.
Fuck all those bullshit paper promises from the IMF, there is no real collateral behind them anyway.
Agreed. If you're going to default, do it BEFORE you've been bled dry.
Oh, but the promises are so sweet, and the music so inviting.
At some point it will be a massive CYA event.
And alast...
that appeared to be months ago eh?
Maybe the US can recover its offshore wealth and tax it ?
Any malaka at this point with actual money in a Greek bank account is beyond help, and should just line up in the chute like a good sheep.
Money is not wealth. Especially in modern finance.
Bullshit , it is now possible to create true value through the nozzle of a printer .
Pity the businesses too large to have switched to cash box finance?
Bingo.
Exactly. No bussiness should ever become too big to fail!!
So just who will be deciding that a business has become "too big to fail" and that something must be done about that?
A real market that allows for true price discovery. FYI - on a long enough time line...
evolve or die motherfucker.
same as it ever was.
Does not really matter who could, they will be met with a fierce resistance to the status quo who will claim majority rule as the their best and only solution.
What kind of idiot would still have his money in a Greek bank?
This actually isn't about stock, it's about flow.
And most of the flow isn't actually economic value-adding transactions or even small dollar transactions generally. Most of the flow is high dollar paper pimping and net settlement between financial institutions.
Looks like the Greeks finally applied Sutton's Law to German demands for increased tax collection.
Thank you Captain Obvious.
Make the banks pay for their own bailouts.
it's about flow...
If it's the way you describe, it would seem to be an equitable solution. But I would still have to believe the pension benefits and other gov't payments made are still in large part occurring to individuals by way of cb connected institutions, so reductions in these cypher account amounts can occur as a "tax" in lieu of an outright "reduction" and will be a juicier option.
He who makes the rules, gets the gold.
The devil is in the details (are Target2 payments excluded?) but at least they are finally looking under the correct rock, instead of trying to get blood from a stone.
http://www.bankofgreece.gr/Pages/en/PaymentsSystems/default.aspx
It will never be enough, just as the IMF and ECB never have enough blood from the little people.
Parasites are not self-sufficient producers, they need a host.
^^^this. In addition, we have far too many overcompensated useless fucking paper-pushers stuck between the printer/computer (money creation) and the producer/consumer in the real economy.
Fuck em. Time to cut out the middlemen.
Throw the money changers out of the temple.
It's a slow-motion train wreck. It's awful, but you just can't look away.
Damn near 102 years and going. I hope my great great great grandkids will get to see how this ends. Then they can unthaw me and pull all of the Gold out of my ass.
This is actually mercifully short compared to Japan. That's one for the grand kids.
And you shouldn't give away where you hide your gold in an open forum.
Hey Phil! I got a shower and a bar of soap for ya!
Capital controls? come on! these people don't even pay taxes for Christ sakes what makes you think they have money in a Bank to control.
The smart money left in 2010, all that.s left is peasants and steerage.
Bingo!!!
Im sure those new Russian/Chinese-Navy Docking fees in Athens will help...
After all the multi-multi-multi billion euro loans and fake repayments, it's going to a be a meagre 1.5 billion amount that sinks the ship.
Like any hostage/deadbeat and their loanshark, it's always the little things that fuck it all up in the end.
I'm beginning to believe the Greeks will simply not pay anything.
Then what? Those Germans will get pretty mad. I wonder what they'll say?
Obviously they should just lend them some more so they can get paid back. That's how it's supposed to work, right?
The EU countries need their banks to receive payments via Greece or they will have to just bail them out directly. As with most banks today living in their central banking utopia, many are over extended and essentially insolvent, the gov's cannot have a Lehman.
Deduct it from the reparations, bitchez
"without a deal, Greece will default on June 5"
If I had a drachma for everytime I heard "this is the final deadline"...
But wait until they start printing the good drachma.
The Greek drama, the mother of all foreplay.
The IMF is a global malignant tumor on the world.
"Be advised: keeping your money in the bank for 12 hours after this announcement is considered a 'transaction.' Thank you for your cooperation."
It is never a good idea to use credit cards to pay your debts, unless you are a bankrupt PIIGS
Max out a card , max another one to pay that off , max another one to pay that off , max another one to pay that off , max another out to pay that off ,
Otherwise known as Fractional Reserve.
Bitcoin , BTChezzzz.
Greece is our loveable, wastrel, fun-loving uncle. The Fed needs to send him some fiat aid - rather than ungrateful Israhell.
As a revenue measure, Greece should start by enacting tariffs on imported goods that are manufactured, in whole or in part, in Germany.
Just as Detroit should impose a tariff on components Made in China
Greek leadership are stand up guys?
Greek leadership are pupets?
It was me that went for the 'stand up guys'...simply because I don't know what a 'pupet' is??
More can kicking ahead
This time is different...LOL. The fix is in. Its ALWAYS in. I hear the Clinton Foundation just went long Greek bonds after Tsipras invited Slick Willie to give one of his $500,000 speeches on the success of the Greek Recovery. He'll shortly be oozing ouzo and chasing little Greek girls as he and Hillary rake in the chips.
Fate the Magnificent
"Push the Button, Max"
If Greece has really decided to default, then whoever said of requesting any money from the IMF?
Why would IMF even bother to ever consider lending further money to a party that has already decided it is not going to need any because it has decided to default?
Man, this IMF and Greece are contradicting each other.
I say again, there will be NO GREXIT ever.
The US decides on IMF lending and Ukraine defaults in June
Greece will exit and join BRICS, then print new money backed by Chinese gold. Likewise, Germany shortly thereafter. The door is open.
Cutting off the IMF is the first step toward Greek independence from the banksters.
I am VERY eager to see how well the greek society, economy and government function, what entitlement programs they have, what the retirement age and pensions are, etc etc
when they have to live on what they actually earn and tax vs what they steal and defraud from others :-))
Can you imagine how small the government and free shit army would be if they had to actually pay as they went. Everybody has a price they say. The problem seems to me there is enough money around to pay all those willing to sell out.
dup
"Without A Deal, Greece Will Default on June 5"
So, ‘Now finally the monkey shows it’s ugly head from the sleeve’ :Dutch Proverb http://www.crackingthewalnut.nl/wp-content/uploads/2014/12/De-aap-komt-u...
Like said: GREECE – WE CAN DO THE MATH NOW, GREEK DEFAULT BY EARLY JUNE/LATE JULY! http://forum.prisonplanet.com/index.php?topic=210616.msg1513335#msg1513335
So asking for money from the IMF or they default on paying the IMF. We have now reached the Mel Brooks Blazing Saddles level of absurd.
Greece should just default, after storing up a bunch of food and any other needed supplies to take care of their people. Then ride it out as best they can. They have beautiful weather, abundant fishing and agriculture, right? Everyone can live off olives and feta cheese for six months, if that is what it takes to be free of these parasites.
Absolutely correct. The sea is greener, the sun is warmer and the financial minister is more clever than his German colleague - okay let us compromise: he can better ride the motor bike. Without repaying the approx. 350 billion debt life will be much better. And after the GREXIT the farmers could again export to Russia and earn some real money instead of begging in Bruxelles. There is nothing more than to gain independence and responsibility. That is the most important pre-condition for future success.
*sigh*
Why don't the Greeks just tell the Troika to go ahead and set up the whole "Loan Greece money to pay existing loans" game on their own, and cut Greece out altogether?
Tell them that since they are obviously only 'laundering' bank bailout money THROUGH Greece, to just cut out the middleman, pay the banks directly, and everybody goes their own way. Tell 'em they'll sign anything they have to, whatever the Troika feels it needs to paper over the problem with their banks and derivatives, as long as they agree to go the fuck away and never darken Greece's doorstep again.
Then they can just bail out their own fucking banks without running the funds through Greece first. They can figure out how to 'sell' this to their people themselves...the whole monetary union was THEIR idea in the first place. So go ahead Troika, TELL the citizens of Europe how GREAT this idea was...
Greece is sucking up far less fiat than Israhell ever has !
The IMF reminds me of that hooker that is luring the Greece to have one more fuck...the poor Greece is limp, has swallowed the last Viagra and is and the brink of passing out...and yet, one, ONE MORE, LAST FUCK is still in his mind!
Pathetic.
that was then. this is now.
2 years ago, Russia lost out to the EU and the accounts of Russian depositors were shamefully raided by the EU/ Cyprus authorities, and the IMF Gang.
Are the tables turned today? Is there an unsuspected relationship between Russia (and Russia's pal, China) and the new Greek government? Where the quid pro quo would be military -- naval, army and missile bases in the Eastern Mediterranean, at the mouth of the passage to the Black Sea.
A year and a half after Obama, Brennan, Rasmussen, and Nuland backed the ouster of the democratically elected president of Ukraine.
Would Putin move into Greece in such a way? Of course, he would.
That is the very reason he is hated so in the West. And by the US/UK/NATO trolls here at ZH.
If the EU sanctions are extended at the end of June, the world can look forward to Chinese and Russian bases in Greece.
Not to mention the Cossacks Dance all over the world's $150 billion ISS. (I assume you have all been reading about all the trouble the Russian's have been having with their rockets since Pork master was made president of Ukraine.
recess is over, kindergarteners... from the West favoring Moscow Times:
So on the eve of the extension of the West's sanctimonious sanctions against Russia, Greece's decision how to proceed with it's bankruptcy and debt restructuring, and politicians from European countries like France, Germany, Italy, Slovakia, Hungary, Czech Republic, etc. arguing not to extend the sanctions when they expire in July, is anybody with a brain surprised that Mr. P has finally declared his rockets trump and will probably run the table (metaphor mix) with them.
appear weak when your are strong; and all warfare is deception
http://www.themoscowtimes.com/article/521787.html