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Greece Faces Moment Of Truth: Troika To Present Final Offer On Wednesday
Tuesday was an interesting day for negotiations between Athens and creditors. Recall that after venting his frustrations in a lengthy op-ed over the weekend, Greek PM Alexis Tsipras submitted what he called a “realistic plan for an agreement” ahead of an emergency meeting in Berlin between French President Francois Hollande, German Chancellor Angela Merkel, ECB chief Mario Draghi, and European Commission President Jean-Claude Juncker.
That meeting ended without any indication of concrete progress suggesting the group was either not impressed with what Tsipras had proposed or simply didn’t care and spent their time discussing a final, take it or leave it deal to send to Athens.
By Tuesday morning it was clear that the troika was well on the way to drafting their own proposal. Fed up with Greece, the institutions had apparently decided to simply draft an agreement on their terms and place on X on the line where Tsipras needed to sign if he wanted to avert a default in three days.
The troika acknowledged that the deal they were crafting would be a tough sell to the radical members of Syriza and thus would be difficult for Tsipras to get through parliament, setting up what we have predicted all along: an imminent government reshuffle.
The fact that the draft deal will contain language that forces Tsipras to concede at least a portion of Syriza’s campaign promises was later confirmed when Eurogroup President Jeroen Dijsselbloem was quoted as saying creditors would “not meet Greece halfway.”
Reuters is out with the latest, which serves as further confirmation that Tsipras will now be forced into concessions and the troika will have succeeded in using financial leverage to effect what will almost invariably be a government shakeup in Athens.
Via Reuters:
Greece's creditors on Tuesday drafted the broad lines of an agreement to put to the leftist government in Athens in a bid to conclude four months of acrimonious negotiations and release aid before the cash-strapped country runs out of money…
"It covers all key policy areas and reflects the discussions of recent weeks. It will be discussed with (Greek Prime Minister Alexis) Tsipras tomorrow," a senior EU official said.
Another official said German Chancellor Angela Merkel and French President Francois Hollande would put the plan to Tsipras by telephone within hours to try to secure his acceptance…
Tsipras, who has vowed not to surrender to more austerity, tried to pre-empt a take-it-or-leave-it offer by the creditors, sending what he called a comprehensive reform proposal to Brussels on Monday before they could complete their version.
Euro zone officials branded the Greek text insufficient and said it was not formally on the table.
The Greek leader faces a backlash from his own supporters if he has to accept cuts in pensions and job protection to avert a default and keep Greece in the euro zone.
Despite defiant rhetoric and face-saving efforts, he seems likely to have to swallow painful pension and labor reforms, facing the choice between putting them to parliament at the risk of a revolt in his Syriza party, or calling a snap referendum.
Reuters also suggests that Greece will likely not make a €300 million payment due to the IMF on Friday if Tsipras does not accept the proposal:
A Greek government official said Athens would make a 300 million euro ($329.58 million) repayment to the IMF on Friday as due if there was an agreement with the creditors, hinting it might otherwise withhold the money without saying so explicitly.
"If we judge that a deal has been sealed, then we will make the June 5 payment normally," the official said, adding that the money would be transferred even if a preliminary agreement had not yet been approved by Eurogroup finance ministers.
It appears we will know within the next 48 hours the extent to which Tsipras was forced by creditors to abandon Greek voters in order to save them from economic catastrophe.
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Ground Hog Day.
Final offer. Pfft.
< DEAL
< NO DEAL
If Greece leaves, the EU and the NWO are dead. Tsipras should demand 0 debt repayment and a free 500 B euros to stay.
The EU had their chance. Just Default aleady!
Greece has the 2 smartest men in the world working for them (3 if you count RM.)
Relax and watch this again: V for Varoufakis https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Afl9WFGJE0M
Ok we really mean it this time. Pay up Greeks or you're grounded.
the world has become a sad ass fucking joke, based on lies, fake money and a bunch of minions carrying water for the brute fuckheads that fucked everybody over on their way to power. i say fuckem and ignore the charade and carry on my wayward son...
I am starting to think this (or a future) "deal" will be enforced on Greece whether they like it or not. "We tried to negotiate, but apparently you don't know what's best for you...., Love Schauble...."
Deal will be made. S&P to new all time highs. Deal will be denied.
Greece has been facing that moment of truth for years. Yet nothing ever changes.
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Throw those pathetic Greeks out of Europe already.
Wolferl, good morning to you, too! (btw, I still maintain that "pathetic" is a tad unnecessarily insulting)
Insulting people like the Greeks is more than necessary to get them moving. And calling them just "pathetic" is much too friendly actually.
Wolfer - are you from East Germany?
you exhibit all the symptoms of growing up in a cave .... seriously ... educate yourself man ...
here is a start, no insult intended, just trying to help a fellow man; i realize is not yours or your familly faults, it is the ones who put and kept you in chains
https://video.search.yahoo.com/video/play?p=Plato+allegory+of+the+cave+v...
Your post shows you have no clue whatsoever. Crawl back in your cave, my Greek friend.
pathetic is the culture that permeates the public system i agree...this mafia minority shames all the Greeks internationaly and holds the country hostage to its blackmail... and dont worry .. nothing insults these low lifes for as long as the monthly wage and pansion are coming in
You nailed it.
On the right hand side, we have Greeks, notorious sweet-talking bullshitters since the dawn of time.
On the left hand side, we have the Creditors, notorious can-kickers since the dawn of time.
Yawn.
Yeah right, and Goldman Sachs helped cook the books to get Greece in and the EU sat there and KNEW and STILL let Greece in. It takes two hands to clap.
DavidC
HA!
Good joke :)
It'll be "An Offer he can't refuse"
Double SECRET Probation.
Don't you mean Final final 0ffer?
I think it is now the final final final final offer of the last final offer.
As long as there remains road to kick the can on, that is what will be done. No one wants their name in the history books as the person who reversed the process of European integration.
Aaaargh!!
DavidC
Our final offer is for you to bend over, spread your ass cheeks and get ready to have your shit pushed in.
for the 200th time.....
shit breath? ha, i get it...
Kaitlyn Jenner anyone ?
Is there one of you - ZH readers - who would loan them a dime?
They are the worst credit risk in the history of the planet. If you would, please explain why you would "loan them" even a penny?
As long as "Europe" remains their Banker sure does look like "healthcare with leeches."
As long as Greece keeps saying "yeah, this might work!"...who are any of us to be the judge that this is wrong?
that is not the right question...
real Q is if escape these terrible "helpers", are there others to work with result in mutual benefit?
OK I'll explain.
Because they just type a fucking number into a deposit account for Greece that doesn't even cost them a penny in deposits or reserves or anything and in exchange they get to suck any remaining juice out the Greek economy until it dies and then they get all the assets and land for free.
It's called BANKING.... and yes I'm serious...
Bank of England Quarterly Bulletin 2014 Q1 - qb14q1prereleasemoneycreation.pdf
What your failing to realize is that they are taking payment in the same electrons they gave it back in. If they were taking payment in Olive oil, feta, or yogurt then you would be right.
Point well taken. And it's technically "not for free" either since in the creation of the new shizz money they dilute the existing currency base so that anyone holding cash or deposits or bonds/debt gets their money stolen indirectly through monetary inflation.
Thanks for posting this. I tried explaining to a friend (who was an econ major and thinks he knows something) how money is created. He wouldn't have it. "Banks lend from existing deposits and money is primarily created by the fed buying/selling t-notes." I printed this for him and will see if he believes it when it comes straight from the BOE.
And I was a finance major who thought he knew it all... graduated top of class back in the day if you can believe that. (I can't)
Fractional reserve banking system my ass... as if that wasn't bad enough already. The commercial banks merely balance the net of their institutional obligations to each other through cheap interbank lending (like LIBOR) or failing that from a handy yet slightly more expensive Central Bank like the Fed or BOE, ECB etc. And the Central Banks themselves? Well they just print...
Same info is available from the St. Louis Federal Reserve Bank in case he pulls a tantrum...
.
"please explain why you would "loan them" even a penny?"
To then have them become debt donkeys and then steal their resources and soverignity.
jldpc
don't be misled,
any never-to-be-repaid"loans"
(unless to seize Greek assets)
are only "loans" to be used to pay off past "loans"
to the TBTF TROIKA banksters.
A copper penny that I earned ? Absolutely not, but as a banker, what I would do is create money on a computer that would transfer to them, they would consume it, by transferring to other computers. Keep in mind cost me nothing to produce, then when they could not pay back I would take, land, ships, virgins heck anything of real physical value. Good question!!
Does it count if I am willing to gift them, say, $100?
I would gift them that just for the show they put up if I knew where to send the money. I am willing to make it $1000 if they default on all their external debt and exit the euro.
Why has there been nothing said about Goldman Sachs' role in this latest Greek debacle? You'd think Greece would have rushed to point fingers from the get-go, or sued GS for bad advice or *some*thing.
Greece has defaulted half a dozen times in the last 125+ years; why are they so anguished over this one?
SPQR753
Do you mean today?
do a search for ZH articles "Greece Goldman"
e.g.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-04-08/odious-debt-has-finally-arrived...
there are hunderds of other articles where ZH states ... Germany throws up, greece manages to sneak in, today the message is: "instituations are fed up with greece ... " really ...thats MSM line even lower
Kick that can bitches!!! Fuck ya!! Like a good swift kick in the nut sack!!
Ultimate failure of liberal economics: no military force (i.e. as in repo Crete) to back up the terms
Big Q (& with Putin looming): will the Euro putzes get it (??)
so this greek final deal is head down band over
but i know MSM will make me lol like the last time when greek pay to the imf. journalist say Good news, greek pay
I'm still working on the article from yesterday. In theory, his "game theory" argument makes sense.
There's just too many variables. If the Husband wants to get laid, he'll go to the RomCom movie with wife. [3,1]
If hubby want's to watch porn, he'll trick wife with action movie. [2,2] then offer up Rom Com [1,3].
Anyways, I think you can see where I'm going with this. It's a nice read into the human psyche though.
It's ALL BULLSHIT! No way they let Greece default. A derivative nuke just waiting on it.
WILL NOT HAPPEN! I'll bet you $1 fiat dollar worth 3 cents.
Is this the Final final final offer, or just the final offer?
Rumour has it that it's the final penultimate final offer pending preparation of an absolute final offer.
Just a precursor to the penulitmate final offer in preparation.
Geez, This is interesting. I wonder if Greece is going to default. Their first final offer was 3 1/2 years ago.
Greece will default (for the seventh time since 1827 mind you). Some peeps will never learn.
This is bullllllllllshit!!!! That's all.......
Doesn't matter.
Greece wil agree to anything and implement nothing.
Doesn't matter.
Greece wil agree to anything and implement nothing.
Greece will only sign eat it and take it deal.
"Troika To Present Final Offer On Wednesday"
Is this the penultimate final offer or the really nearly almost final offer?
I'm sure there's still a few more miles to go on this one...
It's either going to be "Burn my master's house down" or "Bound hand and foot". Or both, politicians bound while citizenry burning everything associated with "masters", including the above politicians...
it's going to be "burn my master's house down while I'm inside it bound hand and foot"...
This is just a final offer before the 'final offers.'
Greece, just remember Iceland and do likewise.
"Final Offer".....certainly. And when rejected we wait for the next "final offer" within a couple of days....
Citation: "A Greek government official said Athens would make a 300 million euro ($329.58 million) repayment to the IMF on Friday as due if there was an agreement with the creditors,hinting it might otherwise withhold the money without saying so explicitly....
"If we judge that a deal has been sealed, then we will make the June 5 payment normally," the official said, adding that...if....if....if......bla bla bla..."
And this way until 2054 (...if not bundled the next 50-years-running-after-money-bailout package his summer....) ???
final offer #539 take 6
EU will give Greecs money to use to pay them back. The destruction of European Union and derivative markets are far worse.
Troika To Present Final Offer On Wednesday
It wiil come and go with another IOU
OK...so what's the fucking bottom line here?
This Wednesday is Greece's final, very last, definitely the finale, the conclusion, the stopping point, the end of all ends offer.
Until next week.....or the next day, or the day after that......
Greece has had so many moments of truth that reading about them has become like Chinese Water torture! We all await the next plink on our heads, meaning the next "Greece moment of thruth story". Extend and pretend is now a high art form, and there is always another extend tatic just at hand. On and on it goes. Greece 340 billion in debt, debt that is impossible to pay or even service, still we hear of solutions. More loans to cover debt service costs, extend the payment periods, lower the short end of the curve on interest costs, blah! blah! blah! Greece is fucked, the EU is a whore house run by Germany and the main puppet master in Washington DC. EU is in decay, not in expanison. Though they are loath to admit even the slightest sign of failure.
You quite bitchy
SYRIZA cadres say Greece will not accept 'ultimatum'
Tues, Jun 2
SYRIZA parliamentary spokesman Nikos Filis said that the government would not sign an agreement that was incompatible with its anti-austerity program, becoming the third leftist party official to say that a take-it-or-leave-it deal with the country's international creditors will not necessarily pass muster in the party's ranks on Tuesday.
"If we're talking about an ultimatum... which is not within the framework of the popular mandate, it is obvious that the government cannot co-sign and accept it," the usually outspoken Filis told Antenna TV.
...
Deputy Prime Minister Yiannis Dragasakis, who is known for his usually moderate tone, said the Greek government will not accept "any ultimatums" from the European Commission, European Central Bank and International Monetary Fund.
http://ekathimerini.com/4dcgi/_w_articles_wsite1_1_02/06/2015_550577
Meanwhile the ECB just loaned Greece another 500 million Euros by extending its ELA program limit because over One Billion Euros had been withdrawn by Greek depositors last week (Hmmm...., enough cash to cover a 300mil euro payment due Friday?).
Oh for fuks sake do something. Are you an inney or and outey, for God's sake, make a decision. This is getting boring.
When Greece misses their payment Friday, no one will call it a default. Watch them come up with some kind of made up, cutesy name to keep the bots calm and buying the dip.
"Unexpected Payment Aberration" gets my vote. :)
Delay of Gratification.
But there will not be a default. That cannot be allowed...ever.
But Greece will agree to the terms, take the money, and not follow through with the conditions until the EU refuses to extend them anymore credit.
The EU knows that it is throwing "Good Money" after Bad Money. But a Default brings destruction to both Greece and the EU...TOTAL DESTRUCTION.
The EU has much more to lose.
Thus this theater is maintained to please the plebes in the Creditor Nations that somehow they are doing "something". Apparently it has worked for the past three years. They will continue this charade until Mr. Market sniffs it out and then it does not.
Everything's beginning to infuriate me. Greece being scapegoated and sitting around the table with a bunch of much bigger Welfare Queens ready to dispose at the stroke of a pen several hundred thousand folks.
Yes fucking Germany too their DEBT is the Biggest as witness Deutsche Banks Derivative's Book.
It ALL LIES.
Where is Mr. Panos when you really need him ???
Greece should agree to the final offer, take the $7B, buy gold with it, and then default anyway.
Unfortunately I don't think they actually get to see that 7B. It just gets reshuffled from one lender to another while they ratchet up Greece's total debt.
Exactly just a booking entry
I wonder who will be pressing the button this time for that?
Sryzas must go
Troika: "Do you feel lucky? Well, do ya, punk?"
Tsipras: "Do YOU?"
Over! Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor . . . ?
R.I.P.JB
Pearl Harbor....Germans????
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8lT1o0sDwI
The Germans put the Japs up to it.
I was at a trivia quiz a few weeks ago and one of the questions was to list the top six countries with the most debt, according the motley fool website. If I remember correctly those countries in order were: USA, Germany, UK, France, Luxembourg, Japan. The rest of the top ten were european countries, Spain, Italy, Netherlands and Ireland.
Pardon me. But isn't it Greece that should be presenting "final offers"?
Just say no.
Let the EU go up in flames. Print your own drachmas, take the Russian money, build the pipeline and take your sovereignty back. For yourselves, for us.
It seems to be an opportune moment for a market top.
http://forayintothemarket.com/?p=108
We need more debt to pay our debt.
Will this be the third bailout? The absolutely final final offer? Lost count long ago.
Draghi, "gonna make you an offer you can't refuse"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ap41J6-Bg8I
Won't sound so good.
Stuffing the French and German banks that stupidly lent the Greeks money, has nothing to do with Greece "staying in" the Euro zone.
Cheers!
If the Greeks stay with troika they will become serfs/slaves as the banks get richer. The banks expect the Greeks to collapse and maybe they will. This is their last chance to get free before the banking systm of the West destroys them and then crashes itself. There is no easy way out.
Problem for the EU is that Greece may promise and once the cheque is cashed refuse to follow through (yet again) . Or they have another election and the new governmeent tears up the agreement and everyone goes on retiring at 40. Best Greece can do right now is make agreements for a golden goodbye with the EU, get help with the set up of the new currency and some transitional support, maybe some favourable trading agreements. And they definitely need to sign up to Turkish Stream, that's a long term investment and secures their own energy needs for decades.
Sorry.... meant goodbye with the EURO, there's no reason for them to come out of the EU.
Look Tsipras, only bankers get un-conditional bailouts.
Longer than a Kabuki opera, more painful than a tooth extraction and less satisfying than a flat chested hooker with a john thomas.
Greece Faces Moment Of Truth: Troika To Present Final Offer On Wednesday
Nope, will not happen !
1 greecce will not leave EU, cause Obama says so....NATO.
2 ECB lost the pokergame with syriza:
The Greek government started/allowed/('failed' to control capital) a bankrun some months ago. Result: about 100 Billion Euro's moved from Greek banking system to EU banking system ( Germany, UK, France, Holland,...)
In German:
"Bei näherem Hinsehen wird klar, als hätten die Euro-Spieler ihre Gegner Tispras und seinen Finanzminister Yanis Varoufakis unterschätzt. Mehr noch: Offenbar hat die griechische Regierung die Euro-Retter regelrecht vorgeführt. Denn der Bank-Run schadete der griechischen Regierung nicht – im Gegenteil: Sie hat ihn bewusst gewähren lassen, weil die Rechnung für den Bank-Run mit oder ohne Crash niemand anders bezahlen wird als die anderen Euro-Zonen-Staaten.Wir verdanken diese Erkenntnis einem sehr lesenswerten Artikel von Hans-Werner Sinn für das Project Syndicate. Sinn erklärt das Geschehen sehr einleuchtend: Wenn die Griechen Geld von der Bank holen, entziehen sie das Geld der Bank. Die Bank muss, um nicht in die Knie zu gehen, neue Kredite aufnehmen. Die griechischen Banken tun dies über die Notfall-Kredite der EZB (ELA). "
(...)
"Auf diese Weise hätten die Griechen laut Sinn in den vergangenen drei Monaten neue Schulden in der Höhe von 99 Milliarden Euro bei den anderen Euro-Staaten gemacht. "
In sort:
Thanks to a bankrun, money flowed into other european banks. Greek banks can be saved because they have the right to get help from other EU states via "Notfall-Kredite der EZB (ELA)" 'or target-2 money'.
"Im Fall einer Staatspleite wäre also zusätzlich zu den bereits gewährten 240 Milliarden Euro der Gläubiger nun auch noch 99 Milliarden Euro weg, die die Griechen in den vergangenen Monaten von der Bank geholt haben und die die griechischen Banken, weil selbst längst illiquide, bei den Euro-Staaten haben anschreiben lassen."
In case Greece would go broke, the EU would not only have lost 240 Billion but also 100 billion as an extra. EU banks would suffer while greeks would have saved their accounts, 100 billion.
German source:
http://deutsche-wirtschafts-nachrichten.de/2015/06/02/der-grosse-bluff-mit-dem-bank-run-griechen-ueberlisten-euro-retter/
(You might want to use google translation)
To speak with Paul Graig Roberts about our leaders: They are suckers and have no idea what they are doing.
Oh. Greece is facing another final offer moment of truth. YAWWWWWWN. How interesting.
You may be very wrong when you say that Greece has no options. I would suggest you start learning some Russian. This would help you to coneive things much better: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OuGUCWc0Nqo
I would advise the Austrian vice-chancellor NOT to go to Sarajevo right now.