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This Is How The IMF Just Lost Its Last Shred Of Credibility
On Tuesday we brought you what will likely be the first of many calls for so-called “Helicopter money”, whose advocates suppose that the reason printing trillions in fiat currency has not yet brought about the desired effects in terms of stoking aggregate demand and promoting robust economic growth is that central banks have yet to go the nuclear route by simply mailing out free money to everyone.
Here’s an excerpt from the Bloomberg View piece:
“Money isn’t a liability in the ordinary sense. Nothing is owed and nothing ever has to be paid back.”
As ridiculous as that sounds, it’s not exactly surprising in a debt-addicted world run by Keynesian central planners and indeed, it echoes recent calls by US lawmakers for the absolution of some $1.3 trillion in student debt.
Now, it appears the insanity has spread to the highest possible levels with none other than the IMF's deputy director of research suggesting that when governments are faced with too much debt, they should consider simply not worrying about it.
In a new research paper, the IMF's research department says that as long as countries can fund themselves at a reasonable cost via capital markets, they should consider simply “living with high debt”:
While some countries face debt sustainability constraints that leave them little choice, others are in the more comfortable position of being able to fund themselves at reasonable—even exceptionally low—interest rates. For these countries, there is a very real question of whether to live with high debt while allowing the debt ratio to decline organically through growth, or to pay it down deliberately to reduce the burden of the debt…
Next, the Fund says that if there’s still room to borrow, paying down debt makes no sense:
If fiscal space remains ample, policies to deliberately pay down debt are normatively undesirable…
It only gets better when the suggestion is made that contrary to reality, paying down debt actually increases countries' debt burden:
Distorting your economy to deliberately pay down the debt only adds to the burden of the debt, rather than reducing it.
But the real punchline comes when the team of economists moves to consider how heavily-indebted countries should respond to an exogenous debt shock:
With these preliminaries, we can turn to our question of interest: what happens if there is an exogenous increase in public debt?
It turns out that the optimal policy involves living with the debt forever.
The analytical framework implies that it is better to live with high debt than to pay it down.
Paging Greek PM Tsipras: may we suggest a new bargaining strategy in your negotiations with the IMF, because what we dubbed the Greek hell over the weekend, was really its heaven, at least according to the IMF.
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Christine LaGarde........brings to mind thoughts of Bruce/Caitlyn Jenner for some reason
Lets quit the bull shit (foreplay, that is QE). Lets just give everyone a million dollars.
For starters.
Lagarde and Jenner....A new era is of women who were guys, or guys in women's bodies?
Or is it, androgynous is the new "in thing".
What matters is dick size .
If "debt doesn't matter" and never needs to be repaid, then why carry the debt? By that I mean the IMF and central banks should be happy to simply Jubilee/write-off all of the debt they hold. Same as makes no difference. Oh, wait. They ain't-a-gonna do that, are they?
This is about the world becoming debts slave to do IMF bidding. Debt is the new crack. IMF is a dealer and the IMF is a puppet of its masters.
The chart clarifies things to even a layman - the IMF makes its money off of the backs of the governence of tax paying nation-states.
You ZH'er s are all the glass is 1/2 empty kinda people....you have to look at the bright side. 2049 is going to be a great year for Greece!!!
Slavery is freedom!
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-06-02/petrobras-pays-high-price-issui...
If debt does not matter, then why am I paying taxes?
A hundred up votes for making my day .. brilliant analysis
Lagarde's got big dirty balls swingin from wall to wall.
and the International Maid Fuckers never had any credibility to begin with.
Did laGarde also have an appendicktomy ?
Nah, HERMAPHRODITE will be the Next Thing.
It doubles you the odds of getting laid/paid in some circles, I hear.
If there is a Deity up there (Q, Ra, Elohim...) please douse this dog-vomit & bat excrement pile with the Mother of All CME's. Make sure you hit the US and EU hemisphere though.
Don't fight the IMF
They'll just need 2 million the next year. 4 the year after. 8 the year after that and so on.
Translated to realspeech :
"Better to live as a slave than to aspire to be free"
Well its not possible to pay down total credit market debt in a debt based monetary system without it destroying itself so if you want to keep the system we have, in a sense, she is right. Granted it will destroy itself anyway once that total debt outpaces the debtor's ability to repay it, which is a mathematical certainty. So if these ivory tower punks want to come up with a solution; how about develop a system that is sustainable and doesn't perpetually have to grow.
Exactly, if you pay off your debt, they can't make any money. That's the magic of compound interest! By the way, if you want to teach your kid something useful, teach them the rule of 72. Divide your interest payment into 72 and that's how many years it will take to double your initial loan. This is used in figuring out lots of things, like population growth. If you have a city of 1 million people, and projected growth is 3%, 3/72 = 24, or in 24 years your population or loan will double. I saved up and bought a house with cash. It took me 15 years, but It's paid for, no Vig. Of course, gold went up 5 times during that period =D
She is indeed correct. A low interest monetary policy is the dream of all debt creators to juice up the economies of the world with debt instruments. This is purely evil and they are completely unaware just how corrupt their policies are.
You give them too much credit by saying they are "unaware". We call it corruption, they call it "The Game".
They are quite aware. Just like the heroin dealer.
I disagree--I think they are ABSOLUTELY aware of how corrupt their policies are. Follow the money...
I think we're getting ready for ano ther up-leg in t he metals. Anyone looking out ten years from here would be well served to get into physical Silver; it's not going t o back up from here.
Captain , yes she is correct , you are right. All of our money comes into existance through loans and credit , if that gets paid down the economy will shrink at the same rate. Plus , there will be bigger losses because of the compounding interest. Just another reason for bitcoin , the solution , it is not loaned into existance and does not exist as debt anywhere on any balance sheet , a very elegant solution to this problem , plus it does not rely on infinite expansion because it's infinitely sub-divisible.
Bitcoin? If you bought one a year ago [at $667], you lost $422 dollars in value. That does not sound like an "elegant solution" to me.
I feel for anybody who bought and held at those prices but anybody using it as a fast world-wide medium of exchange would not have been affected whatever the price is.
Then inflation in $ is meaningless as well? Just spend it fast. Ha ha.
bitcoin price is very speculative , if there is high demand then price increases , when demand drops so does price. I expect demand to increase massively over the coming years due to increased functionality and uses of the underlying protocol. bitoin the currency is just the first 'app' for it's blockchain.
I don't mean it to sound nasty, but... You're so Old School (polite for 'gullible' or 'naive').
Why on earth would you still assume that they are in any way interested in anything "Sustainable"?
Hint: The Only damn thing they care about (and always have) is... WEALTH TRANSFER: From the Bottom 95% to the Top 5% (in general), and to the 0.1% specifically.
Unless a person just can't or refuses to get over their Old School paradigms, it's... NEOFEUDALISM. FEUDALISM 2.0, bitchez.
I must be like really old, because I remember when just "being" in debt was a bad sign. Save for a rainy day? Screw that!
yep - TPTB went after the predatory lenders in order to clear out this space and have no competition for what they do - they "lend to own" and now TPTB own 99% of Americans - the 99'ers are debt slaves (but possibly with a wonderful new car and college education but no job...)
So what, just do it. Lets not hide from it, and lets stop giving it to the banks. Just give it to everyone. Why should cheese dick Jamie Diamonds and his cronies get all of it. Lets just march on Congress and demand it. I am tired of Private equity, Hedge funds and bankers killing it. I want mine. Lets vote them out unless they give us cash.
I know it sounds just super, but you wouldn't like the consequences. Believe me, that isn't how you fix it. That is how people are duped into backing the Free Shit Army. You're doing it right now. And with DECADES of history behind the "Great Society" and the "War on Poverty" I have to ask if you think that has improved anyones' lives? If that didn't work why do you think this would work?
You can't print prosperity. You can't even print wealth equality. Printing free money has never solved anything. I would think that would be self-evident by now.
Printing free money has never solved anything.
... but never hasn't happened yet.
It would bring down the system, but the system is going down, and the longer it takes the worse it will be. I know damned well that a helo drop won't "fix" the system, and I say do it. Break the system.
We aren't going to like the current outcome. So, Why let the bankers. PE, and hedge funds guys have all the money. Give it to everyone. The outcome is going to be the same regardless. You are not naive to think they are going to change and fix the problems....they are not. So let me have mine. You don't want yours, I will take.
OK, I will talk to the world's central banks and ask them to give all of us a million dollars. That's more likely to happen than real reforms are at this point anyway.
I concede the point.
Zactly. Think of it as free gold/silver after you exchange the fiat for tangibles.
I'm living in a world where a working class family will not become totally dependent on charity and can continue to maintain a pretty fucking great lifestyle when the main breadwinner becomes infirm ... how many times in world history has that been true? Peons haven't ever had this good a piece of the pie. The economic structure which allows this to exist might not be sustainable, but resource wise we've sustained it for half a generation ... so to say it's unsustainable out of principle is pretty stupid IMO.
If social darwinism and a return to charity based social safety nets is the best alternative you guys have to offer me I'll applaud government for kicking this can as far as they can ... and when push comes to shove I'll vote for some fascist before I'll vote for you lot, most people with me ... that's why FDR did what he did, he saw the rising tide of fascism and the inability of a purely capitalist society to hold it back any more. Universal suffrage happened, the fatalist/classist peons of yesteryear aren't coming back.
Keep us happy or see what you get ...
A simple "thank you" would have sufficed.
Your revisionist history will not get you far on ZH.
So you have faith in your fellow citizens that they will vote for someone promising the invisible hand will save them in a crushing depression rather than some strong man?
I don't see this in history ... or current events.
Sadly, you correctly describe my fellow Americans.
The further the can is kicked, the greater the number of people who will become utterly dependent on the systems sustained by kicking the can. But the can cannot be kicked forever. Your choices are to pick a bad future for a lot of people and a worse future for a lot of people. Take your pick.
My low wage work no better prepares me for shit hitting the fan than wellfare ... a collapse of the economy as we know it isn't going to hit harder tomorrow than today.
Yes, it will. The more resources we consume, the less we have to fall back on to come up with a different way of life. The longer we wait, the more children who are born into this world will be adversely affected. The more debt that builds up, the more dependent on the system people will become due to the nature of interest payments sucking up all of their disposable income. The longer we wait to face reality, the more reality is going to want to rip our faces off.
Fuck you. YOU keep ME happy or see what YOU get. In case you don't understand:
FUCK YOU, PAY ME!
...that's why FDR did what he did, he saw the rising tide of fascism and the inability of a purely capitalist society to hold it back any more.
Lulz, FDR was a fascist!
Jesus, the know-nothings are thick around here tonight.
I cannot dispute you on it not fixing anything but at this point, what difference does it make? The system was terminal from inception. Whether they print or do not print only effects when it dies, not if.
This ship is going down. Do you want that with music or without?
This reminds me of the old joke: A guy is seriously ill so he has himself frozen until they find a cure. He hands all his wealth to a stock brokerage firm. When he wakes up after being cured 50 years later, he runs to the pay-phone and calls the firm. His original investment of $1 million he is told is now $100 million. Then the operator comes to the phone and says please deposit $1 million for the next 3 minutes.
Fuuny how the IMF is just now coming out with trial balloons too about how the government debt will never get paid back, get ready folks because at some point they will want to take a mulligan on all the debt on the books currently.
I'm guessing that will be AFTER they confiscate everyone's IRA and 401(k) money and replace it with T-bills, to "protect everyone's retirement".
This is how they really think about it in their alternate reality. I can see the light at the of the tunnel and I'm pretty sure its a nuclear detonation.....
I guess the imf researchers neglected to read another view on the subject..
"The rich ruleth over the poor, and the borrower is servant to the lender." Proverbs 22:7
But, apparently, even if it's already 8 inches deep and being pushed in at a rate of 1in/y, you can live with it.
As long as you don't move much, I presume.
Except that you cannot "fund yourself" with debt forever ... eventually the number will become so large that you simply won't be able to fund it ..... it may take years, maybe decades ... but eventually the pitchforks come out
can't wait for them to issue these:
http://www.magicmgmt.com/mdb/images/obama_sepia.jpg
But, if we give everyone a million dollars, won't the status just remain quo?
"Lets quit the bull shit (foreplay, that is QE). Lets just give everyone a million dollars. "
They already did....
but, you have to use averages, so for every BILLION Buffet got....it averages to a million dollars for 1,000 serfs.
a brilliant idea.. give money directly to the poeple NOT to the corrupt goverment officials....
But....that would imply that the bnaks wouldnt be getting the money. This will not do.
the money velocity that would create would truly turn the dollar into crap
LaGarde reminds me of a Simpsons character.
Right you are !.. Maybe Caitlyn will let LaGarde pet "her" junk.
More like Marie-Antoinette 2.0
"Let them eat Debt".
How goes it, LoP?... "Roll the MF'ing Guillotines!"
“Money isn’t a liability in the ordinary sense. Nothing is owed and nothing ever has to be paid back.”
Sweet Jesus! Quick somebody let the IRS in on that one!!
If the 2008 collapse was because of mortgage lending problems, then the US gov't could have paid off every mortgageoutstanding in the country since then and cured probllem for a fraction of what they have spent since.
The IMF still had credibility left?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NDFtoo4xdFU
ah gold ol' Christine... taking a page from the Bobby Knight Rape Survival Guide... "debt? just lay back and enjoy it"...
stupid bitch
Jim Willie calls it Christopher Lagarde, LOL.
"If fiscal space remains ample, policies to deliberately pay down debt are normatively undesirable…"
Translation: "We can suck more blood if the host doesn't remove us with tweezers or a match..."
Boom! My head just exploded. Like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pjnZO5ZgWE8
I'm not sure where this article is trying to lead us. the IMF is, in this context, right. it is possible to "live with high debt". in a way, that's what Japan is doing since a long while
but there are lots and lots of historical cases that are similar
further, all this barking against "Neo-Keynesian" kool-aid is not necessarily up the right tree, in the case of the IMF, the "good doctor that cuts off your leg and charges you for it... later"
but one thing above all: the title. the IMF does not need any shred of "credibility"
as a reminder, that word of the neo-financial vocabulary is reserved for central banks when they promise to keep the sweet spice flowing
the IMF? what did the IMF promise? they just gave an opinion, as usual, and want money back, again, as usual
Splitting hairs much for a living ?
Thats-a nice economy you gots there. Would-a be a shame if it got distorted.
Please don't break the debt ponzi scheme. Thousands of Bankers and their families are depending on it.
Thank You,
IMF
The IMF Eurocrats built their own kingdom where they live the good life off of other people's money.
Posh bankster parties and trips to Davos to hob-nob with the billionaires.
Huh? If you can't pay down your debt when your interest cost is only .05%, how the heck will you ever be able to afford to do so when the borrowing rate is 5% (or 15%)?
And the interest on that debt is a world tax to pay for global dominance, the murder of 2 million muslims, 465 thousand children, the invasion of Ukraine and so on.
Says the biggest debt pusher of all time
I've suspected that somebody somewhere benefits from all this debt for some time now.
Eureka!
Why live in the real world. Just keep borrowing and spending.
Fufuxsake...
DavidC
monetarist central planners...thank your Friedman.
Since 1990, the classical form of monetarism has been questioned because of events that many economists have interpreted as being inexplicable in monetarist terms, namely the unhinging of the money supply growth from inflation in the 1990s and the failure of pure monetary policy to stimulate the economy in the 2001–2003 period. Alan Greenspan, former chairman of the Federal Reserve System, argued that the 1990s decoupling was explained by a virtuous cycle of productivity andINVESTMENT on one hand, and a certain degree of "irrational exuberance" in the investment sector on the other.
There are also arguments linking monetarism and macroeconomics, and treat monetarism as a special case of Keynesian theory. The central test case over the validity of these theories would be the possibility of a liquidity trap, like that experienced by Japan. Ben Bernanke, Princeton professor and former chairman of the U.S. Federal Reserve, has argued that monetary policy could respond to zero interest rate conditions by direct expansion of the money supply. In his words, "We have the keys to the printing press, and we are not afraid to use them." Progressive economist Paul Krugman has advanced the counterargument that this would have a corresponding devaluationary effect, like the sustained low interest rates of 2001–2004 produced against world currencies.[citation needed]
These disagreements — along with the role of monetary policies in trade liberalisation, internationalINVESTMENT and central bank policy — remain lively topics of investigation and argument.
extract from : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monetarism
About the only intelligent comment on this thread.
Central planners are so far from Keynesian economics, the label is ridiculous.
We have been in a liquidity trap for years now.
About the only intelligent comment on this thread.
Central planners are so far from Keynesian economics, the label is ridiculous.
We have been in a liquidity trap for years now.
German taxpayers will never get their money back.
Give me $3 million and I am on board with this one.
Greece is using that in their bargaining strategy. It's what they'll benefit from if they pull a Grexit. But Troika can't afford Grexit becoming a success, otherwise other peripheral countries would exit too. So the Troika's strategy is to convince Greece to stay within bounds of Syriza's elected "mandate", which is to stick with the Euro.
Lagarde thinks she lives on a planet inhabited by banksters and unicorns. ..The unicorn shit provides every conceivable need mankind could want for.
Unicorn shit powers everything, feeds everyone, and backs the currencies of every nation on Earth.
Great descriptor. Unicorn Shit. Spreading transcendental fertilizer to grow forex currencies in a schizophrenic world. Fiat in direct competition with asset-based systems and creators and regulators of fiat also in charge of notional hard asset commodities exchanges. What possibly could go wrong?
Looks like the Greeks are on to something.
Eureka.
Unconfirmed reports based on a video release dated May 20, 2015 point to a massive and unprecedented bomb explosion in Yemen.
The reports suggest without corroborating evidence that the explosion could have been the result of a nuclear strike, using a tactical nuclear weapon. There is no evidence to that effect.
Whatever the nature of this explosion, it constitutes a crime against humanity.
While there is no concrete evidence that the US led alliance has used nukes against Yemen, the broader issue of nuclear war against the Middle is, nonetheless, of utmost relevance.
Washington’s nuclear agenda as defined by the 2001 Nuclear Posture Review (2001) consists in developing its tactical nuclear arsenal for use against non-nuclear States.
Since 2002, US-NATO tactical nuclear weapons targeting the Middle East are fully deployed.
Tactical nuclear weapons or so-called “mini-nukes” are bunker buster bombs equipped with a nuclear warhead. Their explosive capacity (e.g. the B61-11) varies between one third and six times a Hiroshima bomb.
http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-war-on-yemen-americas-plans-to-use-nucl...
Why can't Anonymous hack it, and reprogram the coordinates to places in the ME that would result in world peace?
http://www.forbes.com/sites/stancollender/2015/05/26/the-top-10-reasons-...
It would only be destructive in one of two ways:
1. Destructive of everything if applied along side the current monetary system.
2. Destructive of the current monetary system if applied to it.
Either way, the current system has to go.
I.....MF...that is how I read it every time.
The treaty invested, metastasized money system, GDR...reminds me of what woudl be hebrew for Gilder.
Nothing this vile agency does pass the smell test. All it has done is destroy through debt enslavement, as this shameful paper points out. Jamaica, excellent case in point, check out the documentary Life and Debt.
You treaty me right, I treaty you right....
I treaty my guitar right...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk1TSBW_368
What world do we live in right now? It's like I'm in some weird dream where up is down, left is right, lies are the truth, war is peace, debt is freedom and so on and so forth. We have no doubt reached peak insanity with those who are 'in charge' I'd say we have about 2 years left before it all comes crashing down but wouldn't be surprised if it happens tomorrow.
Debt is irrelevant if it's denominated in your own currency ... the trade and current account balances are all that matters.
“Money isn’t a liability in the ordinary sense. Nothing is owed and nothing ever has to be paid back.”
Prove it. Zero out all the balance sheets globally. Tell Greece they are off the hook for what they owe the IMF for starters if money isn't a liability since nothing is owed and nothing ever has to be paid back.
You should never have been asking for repayment then if it isn't owed since it doesn't have to be paid back.
Dude, they are after the interests ...
Who the fuck do we have running the world? This article demonstrates that either they are the stupidest fucking bunch of monkeys to roam the planet or they are lying scumbags.
It's better to live with debt than pay it off? Its better to just print the debt to pay your bills? Where do they get this shit? How about when you cannot pay the interest on the debt that was created from nothing? What do you do then? Greece is finding out right now. The bankers want their pound of flesh for their nothing that they gave you.
How about a study showing that better to have a system where you cannot create value out of nothing if you happen to be the right person in the correct office at the correct time. The reason that these people think that they are gods is that so far as I have heard god is the only other entity that created anything out of nothing.
Why not try to have a system in which debt is not created out of thin air and thrown away so that the populace can be enslaved through taxes which have to be raised to pay back the debt owed which was created out of nothing?
Keynes was a moron but these people aren't even his acolytes they are just thieves and rentiers. There is not enough debt for my new gulf stream. Start a new war! That will get the debt machine going. Liars and scum.
When the world bank takes over the money printing scheme from the US the system will be perfected. Jesus was right. Throw the money changers out of the temple.
Amen to that. But to be honest with yourself, you have to conclude that "they" are not to blame. WE are for letting them do it. You know the "fool me once" thing...
Just sayin'.
Jesus (Greek name for Yeshua) was naive. Throwing them out does nothing, as they'll just crawl back in, like the rats and cockroaches they are.
It is the Sanhedrin Priests and their Money Changers who should have been crucified, and left to rot. It's still not too late...
What you mistake for naivety was actually a demonstration of Jesus' LOVE, which is far superior to ours.
You see with temporal eyes, He with spiritual eyes.
All part of God's plan to redeem fallen humanity:
"Then He opened their minds to understand the Scriptures, and He said to them, "Thus it is written, that the Christ would suffer and rise again from the dead the third day, and that repentance for forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in His name to all the nations" - Luke 25:45-47
Jesus Christ is the Third Temple:
The 3rd Temple referred to in the Bible is Spiritual- it is represented by Jesus Christ:
"Finally two came forward and declared, “This fellow said, ‘I am able to destroy the temple of God and rebuild it in three days.’”- Matthew 26:61
Here Jesus was referring to Himself as the 3rd Temple, as after His death, He would be resurrected in 3 days- and the physical temple would be destroyed in 70AD, never to be rebuilt.
"Those who passed by hurled insults at him, shaking their heads and saying, “You who are going to destroy the temple and build it in three days, save yourself! Come down from the cross, if you are the Son of God!” In the same way the chief priests, the teachers of the law and the elders mocked him." - Matthew 27:39-41
"Those who passed by hurled insults at him, shaking their heads and saying, “So! You who are going to destroy the temple and build it in three days, come down from the cross and save yourself!” - Mark 15:29-30
Here, Jesus clearly stated that He- THE TEMPLE- would be resurrected in 3 days- even as He hung on the cross!
“We heard him say, ‘I will destroy this temple made with human hands and in three days will build another, not made with hands.’” - Mark 14:58
Here, Jesus clearly He told them- the 3rd Temple would be built- but not by human hands!
"The next day, the one after Preparation Day, the chief priests and the Pharisees went to Pilate. “Sir,” they said, “we remember that while he was still alive that deceiver said, ‘After three days I will rise again.’ So give the order for the tomb to be made secure until the third day." - Matthew 27:62-64
Here, Jesus clearly said He would rise again after 3 days- He is the rebuilt (the 3rd) Temple!
"The Jews then responded to him, “What sign can you show us to prove your authority to do all this?”Jesus answered them, “Destroy this temple, and I will raise it again in three days.”They replied, “It has taken forty-six years to build this temple, and you are going to raise it in three days?” But the temple he had spoken of was his body. After he was raised from the dead, his disciples recalled what he had said. Then they believed the scripture and the words that Jesus had spoken." - John 2:18-22
Here Jesus clearly said He is the 3rd Temple- that He would rise again after 3 days- He is the rebuilt (the 3rd) Temple!
"At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split" - Matthew 27:51
When Jesus Christ died- the veil, or curtain, between the "Holy" and the "Holy of Holies" was ripped open- signifying that He has replaced the Temple- He is the 3rd Temple. There is no need for a physical Temple anymore. The Temple provided a way for mankind to, through a priesthood in a Temple, come to God. But, through Jesus' sacrifice, there is no longer any need for physical sacrifices, no need for a physical Temple, because He replaced them with Himself. He is the way, the truth, and the light- the ONLY WAY to GOD.
If I was Greece and read this..no payment for you on Friday..you can live with my debt....idiots
The IMF just lost their last shred of credibility? I thought that went down the toilet a long time ago.
Debt does not obligate one person to another, except by mutual agreement. Now, one person cannot possibly consent to terms for every single individual in a country, so for countries, there IS no debt obligation, except by those who personally signed on for it.
Countries cannot go into debt because they don't have a mandate from everyone to take on that debt. The INDIVIDUALS who made the agreement have that debt, not all of the citizens of that country.
Fuck the IMF. They have no claim on anything that requires honoring.
Corporations are people, the Supreme Court said so.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corporate_personhood_debate
https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/28/3002
(14) “State” means any of the several States, the District of Columbia, the Commonwealth of Puerto Rico, the Commonwealth of the Northern Marianas, or any territory or possession of the United States.
(15) “United States” means—
(A) a Federal corporation;
So the United States is a corporation and in turn a person and therefore has a debt obligation according to the IMF's logic. An individual corporation is an individual person since it is a single entity.
The states on the other hand don't. Cut the Federal Government loose aka the Federal Corporate entity and stick it for the debt obligations then reorganize as a Confederacy.
I don't give a rat's ass what the SCOTUS says. They have NO credibility in my eyes. Linking to any of their decisions is a waste of time...Have you ever read one of Scalia's opinions? Wow...just wow...
It's all word-games. In one paper, Scalia spent several pages agonizing over what the word "projected" meant. Lot's of big words and clever argumentation were bandied about, intricate, convoluted webs of 'reasoning' were constructed, but in the end, Scalia managed to twist and torture the meaning HE wanted out of the thing...IF you bought his argument in the first place.
And of course that meaning was a little different from the standard dictionary meaning, because that is what our law code does. It obfuscates and confuses, twists and changes the meaning of words, so that no one really KNOWS the law anymore.
When you're hungry, don't eat. Eating something will just make you want to eat again in the future. So you're far better off just not eating.
here i bought you a sandwich and ate it. go pay the cashier.
Wait, it was ever considered credible?
This obviously rediculous nonsense from the IMF is clearly an attempt at perception control. If they repeat it enough times, the sheep will believe it.
But it's better to default on it than to live with it.
"...if there’s still room to borrow, paying down debt makes no sense:" Isn't this a line from a VISA TV commercial?
The International Monetary Fund must be on drugs IMHO. And the Greeks are getting the hangover. This is what happens when one climbs into bed with SATAN [Lloyd Blankfein] and Goldman Sachs.
God's work, eh, Lloyd?
Debt is good. Moar debt, moar debt. We're gonna party like it's 2057.
:)
Just file Chapter 13 , pay it off in 5 years and what you can't write it off, fuck the bond holders and send those deriviatives flying.
...and don't forget to "flip the finger to Germany", even if you don't owe them anyhting. ;o)
I like the idea. I think I'll just run up the shit out of all my credit cards - sit back and enjoy life for once - screw it all.
Default now...and In one year you can go back to the bond markets and the sheeple will eat it up.....they will buy all you can issue because you are clean now...lol...
debt IS good when you're the one creating the "money" out of thin air and issuing the debt
https://contrarianstraighttalker.wordpress.com/2015/06/03/even-the-imf-n...IMF to Citizens of Earth:
"Just stay in debt so we can own you forever and rehypothecate your debt to bear-trap other future slaves and, if you don't pay our rent, we shall insist on a new puppet regime in your country and make you chew your own legs off, like Greece, to escape."
Klaatu... Barada... Nikto
Klatuuu...Verita....Columbian Necktie?
IMF, Shop Smart...Shop S-Mart!
RIPS
Tyler ---
Very amateur hour article.... The foundation of what has been done to the eCONomy is that all of the Trillions printed would have been highly inflationary. All of this debt would magically disappear via compounded inflation Much to the chagrin of every central banker they have been unable to create meaningful inflation. Yet they continue to hope that it will magically kick in, and that these unpaid debts will be deflated out. Its that unrealistic argument that they continue to hold too.
What needs to be done is to reduce the money supply hence making it more valuable. This will increase commercial rates and get the money circulating and light off the inflation so hoped for.
Decrease the money supply hence ... and it's GONE!
at this point, seems legit actually. fuck it. debt is a lie anyway. the banks didnt actually have any skin in the game. they "loaned" something they never had to begin with. fuck it
hell.. if they had given all the bail out money directly to the people, we would have had a few good years of consumption, which may have actually turned some shit around
but they postioned their cronies first... so now they will do it, after this ship has already gone over the dge of the horizon.
iwatches for all! fuck it all! hookers and blow for the proles!
incidently, non of this was accidental or stupidity. no fucking way. this was the plan all along. clearly.
P < P + I
2 + 2 = 5.
According to the IMF, it equals 0
Mastersnark, master of Common Core Math.
Lets see here! Citi has a derivative loss on their books of $70 trillion and JPMorgan $69 trillion...is this the first step to absolution of debt for the very people that took the economy crashing down on the middle class and left them holding the bag and then introduced the legislation that would put that gambling debt squarly on the shoulders of the middle class and poor? And who does Lagarde work for?
The largest debt bubble in the history of the world is starting to collapse. Those that don't see it coming will be swallowed alive...
http://www.globaldeflationnews.com/anatomy-of-a-bubble-how-the-federal-r...
I challenge the Greek government to begin printing up US dollars to repay their debt and if called on it simply ask " if the US can create dollars from nothing, why cannot the people of Greece?"
Works for North Korea.
Indentured servitude was great (for one party anyway).
San Diego is a lot like Greece. they exist on the periphery, without an export economy, they rely on tourism and the military, they do have some high tech companies, but the money is diverted through Wall Street. There are a lot of rich people in San Diego but the city has been virtually broke for the last ten years. Their solution is to raise the tourist tax. They're always looking to build some visitor mecca, a convention center, cruise ship piers, sea world (source of consternation, sea world (BUDWEISER) gives a lot of money to local pols, but the PETA campaign to close the zoo for orcas and trained seals has real grassroots support.) the pols are always looking to raise money for these projects (the Charger stadium deal is an example, the city will lose a great great deal of prestige if the Chargers move to Carson. the skyboxes which are built in the newer stadiums are for business meetings. its where deals get made, its a huge draw for more rich people who want to move here - ticket prices go up, screw the people). the problems in Greece started when they accepted a bid for the Olympics. San Diego wants all this crap, a Super Bowl, a Breeders Cup, the more the better, but of course who pays for all this, you do it with debt, and the city affectionately known as Enron by the sea, will probably pour on a lot more in the years to come. the city barely has enough policemen to direct traffic at one of these mega events. their retention rate is the worst, so the quality of life goes down, while the signs of opulence just continue to grow. they tax the tourists of course, but as more and more cities play beggar my convention center its gets competitive, there are only so many tourist dollars. Greece will probably turn in a rocky goat inhabited island once more. San Diego is subject to bouts of fiscally conservative policy, so they might survive, or someday Tijuana will annex them. those people have a real economy
Nice rant, thanks. I visited TJ tourist area when I was in San Diego a few years ago, and I liked it better than San Diego. Of course, it was nothing like my visit in 1967, no donkey shows to be found.
San Diego used to be awesome. I still live here but am looking at options to take my company elswhere.
Maybe even out of the country.
RIPS
I'm new at this, so correct me if I'm wrong: "paying down the debt" has different mechanisms for individuals and sovereign countries though doesn't it? For individuals it just means paying the mortgage/loan installments, automatically shrinking the principal with every payment. For sovereign bond, don't coupon payments just cover the interest, but not shaving off the principal? If so, does "paying down the national debt" mean buying back treasuries in the open market and/or stop issuing new bonds?
"Nothing is owed and nothing ever has to be paid back.”
WHAT? What is "owed" is that this paper will be worth AT LEAST the same in 5, 10, 15 or 20 years as what it is worth today.
Here I printed up this imgainary money. Borrow it from me and be in debt to me forever. Its a great deal. Its totally kosher dude!!
Hilarious. And sinister.
Retards!
Here is a novel concept...why not call debt that doesn't need to be repaid a GRANT. Debt that needs to be repaid is called Repayable Debt. This article is sheer lunacy!!! Perhaps when the AIIB gets up and running and China backs the yuan with gold...the corruption and rot within the governments worldwide will stop. Or... when we all look like the Illinois pension system (underfunded by $130B) perhaps then....politicians will wake up.
Message: "Keep toiling and paying us, Zion, the usury, and get back to chewing your cud."
Liberty is a demand. Tyranny is submission..
So far this is the best reason not to have children, if you are an "everyday American".
Wonder where the US will find "tropps" when the oligarchs need force to exploit opportunities around the globe, or to protect their interests!
At the same time IMF to Greece: Pay what you owe on Friday, or die!
"Distorting your economy to deliberately pay down the debt only adds to the burden of the debt, rather than reducing it."
Up is down. Over is under. In is out.
Long live the Ponzi default scheme!