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A Very European Episode
Submitted by Erico Matias Tavares of Sinclair & Co.
A Very European Episode
The ongoing financial saga in Greece and all the related disagreements reminds us of a curious episode going back to our Masters Degree in Sweden, many years ago.
The program had students from all over Europe and it was really exciting to meet, study and interact with them. However, for some it was not always fun.
One day our Dutch friend looked desperate. When asked why, he said he was in the “study group from hell”; everyone’s cooperation was needed to accomplish a very tough assignment but they could barely understand and work with each other.
Apparently in that group was one of the very few Swedish students who did not speak English (for the most part Swedes speak it fluently, even in those days). So he would communicate with her in broken Swedish, picking up on the commonalities with his native Dutch.
And that was a breeze compared to the rest of the group. Together with them were a Spaniard from Catalonia, who could also not speak any English, and an Italian. The Spaniard would communicate in Catalan with the Italian, who could kind of imagine what he was saying. He would then communicate in broken English with the Dutch, who would finally translate it for the Swede.
And that’s how the communication flow went back and forth for weeks. To compound their woes, the Italian and the Spaniard preferred to work late at night while the Dutch and the Swede early in the morning. Pretty soon they were ganging up on each other, hurling insults in their own languages (at that point it was probably a good thing that they could not understand each other).
Needless to say, when the deadline arrived they were hopelessly behind schedule. Fortunately, Socialist Sweden did not like flunking students and so they all got a pass. But the experience was so strenuous and unpleasant that they never spoke to each other ever again.
These days European politicians can communicate with each other directly, or via interpreters if need be. But very deep cultural differences persist. Just imagine a Finn, coming from a country where in many places people pay for services in full without having any supervision, explaining the need for austerity to a Greek, who may actually think that not paying taxes is morally justifiable.
As such, it is not hard to extrapolate the experience of that “study group from hell” to the wider European political landscape. It is indeed a thing of wonder when Eurocrats can actually achieve something meaningful together.
It is not so much that Greece and other nations are facing severe financial difficulties. At the end of the day, most man-made problems are solvable, especially in finance. What truly worries us is that this widely diverse group is required to come up with robust solutions to very sensitive political and economic problems, with wide reaching implications.
Accordingly, this Greek saga has been going on for five years, and we are now deeply in the realm of unpalatable solutions – if indeed one can actually be found.
It seems that someone might actually flunk this time around. Big time.
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The Euro is the modern version of the Tower of Babel story.
'Socialist Sweden'?
Some joke, Sweden is so far up the US ass, it has come out the other side. Look at the recent supposed Russian sub bullshit for example. It is run by the same sort on psychos that have been installed (sorry selected, no elected damn it) in all major western countries.
Anyone else weary of these ostensible discussions of policies and solutions while the system is essentially an organized crime syndicate?
The super class is busy mining the very worst of human corruption/tendencies for profit and is, and will, stomp on the plebes when and where they deem it expedient. Here in the US it is becoming clearer every day that we are hardly a higher order of peasant.
We started paying 30 year E-bonds in 08, talk about failure.
The European alliance is over.
The EU has Greece, but we have Illinois which will be much bigger when it falls apart. Power and politics demand outcomes that cannot exist in the real world, but they are going to try their hardest to shove down our throats.....
I love the juxtaposition of Greece and Chicago.
Big +
Huh? They're still socialist.
Yup, and Obama is a socialist too!
Socialist sounds better than dictator wannabe......
Well, Obama is certainly no wannabe dicktaster.
“Most man made problems can be solved”, is that true zerohedge? The solve the following problem.
There are ten people and resources to feed only nine. What happens to the tenth and why? O’ Humanity, Why are you running and for what? Is anyone on this planet trying to solve this problem?
http://just-a-thought-from-thinair.blogspot.com/
oh the difference is that there is plenty enough resources to feed us all.
The problem is that the biggest part of the population will be not be allowed to use any of the land. They will not be allowed to produce any food or other products. They will not be allowed to build a house on their own.
In what way is that not a manmade problem? Anyways, overpopulation is not a nice thing neighter, but as far as I know the western population has been shrinking for quite a while. You might wonder why the politicians are so eager to fill up our lands with muslims. Certainly not for us, the peoples sake.
“Most man made problems can be solved”, is that true zerohedge? The solve the following problem.
There are ten people and resources to feed only nine. What happens to the tenth and why? O’ Humanity, Why are you running and for what? Is anyone on this planet trying to solve this problem?
http://just-a-thought-from-thinair.blogspot.com/
we are in the babel world, the Bible wasn't a past story but future
Throw those pathetic Greeks out of Europe already. Problem solved.
So you can replace them with Turks. We know.
The "money" created out of thin air which was lent to Greece and all the member countries took NO EFFORT to create. To pay it back requires a lot of effort by the common man in the street. The people did not choose to overspend the freshly created fiat. Their corrupt politicians, who were bribed by the EU MAFIA, chose to overspend.
The rulers who are behind the EU (the EU and all governments are just a front for the real owners) have devised a plan to use money created out of thin air to purchase assets and infrastructure (buy an entire COUNTRY/ CONTINENT) which can not be created out of thin air. This goes under the guise of "PRIVATIZATION".
Now do you understand the BIG PICTURE?!?!?!
And you might add that not only is counterfeit required to facilitate the scheme of underwriting the bonds but equally as important the collateral of the bonds is the direct tax on the people. The scheme is a double pincer movement. Not only is the counterfeit used to steal directly from the economy of productive work but then the same people who are being thieved are then commanded to pay off the the counterfeit-underwritten-theft-of-themselves by working harder to meet their tax "obligations."
So, there are at least two possible remedies:
1. stop the counterfeiting.
2. stop the debt collateralized by any sort of direct tax on the people.
what benefit is there from public infrastructure run by the government mafia...? only mismanagement, corruption, higher prices for the consumer is the end result.. we have seen the play at work
Collapse Deutschbanke.
Let the Credit Default Swaps come through. Destroy the Derivatives Market. Hell...DB is the World's largest holderof those anyway.
Let Germany starve as it financially collapses. That is the consequence of throwing Greece out.
You must really hate Germany.
So yes I agree.
You´re clueless. Besides the fact that Deutsche Bank is an investment bank in the City of London, nobody in Germany needs Deutsche Bank for anything. DB just can go to hell and everybody in Germany will be happy. Germany is not part of the bankster empire of the UK and the US, we earn our money by selling good products, not by stealing and looting others through banks like the Anglo-Saxons.
Looking forward to the collapse of Germany.
You are deluded. I wil be laughing as Germsn cities are turned into rubble...from the internal riots. Looking forward to the whole damned Western World collapse.
I will love it when Bundesbanke, who holds most reserves in the World Reserve Currency, the US Dollar, becomes INSOLVENT.
Nothing will please memore than to watch your socialist system and the European Union disintegrate.
All that your Nation, you fascist nation, your National Socialist nation, has been built upon is corruption.
Jew?
Nope. Fuck Zion and fuck the Mossad.
I am a Lone Wolf.
I want to watch your destruction. You deserve it because of your own personal corruption.
I CELEBRATE the destruction of the corrupt.
I dance at the thought of that.
The Mossad is corrupt and so is the Zionist. And when the West falls so will they as a direct consequence.
But to those who wish harm upon others let harm come to them...myself included as I am Hellbound!!!
Let it burn. Burn baby burn.
You are completely off your rocker.
I m just here to say
that a person under the name Haus-Targaryen
replied you are completely off you rocker, to someone that said that the corrupt should burn.
This totally surprises me :D
Hahaha
Touché.
Tbf - wishing the destruction of an entire country is just horrible. Pray to God its political system collapses to bring about change -- that's fine. Wishing the nation to turn to rubble -- sorry that's too much.
Did you ever watch the end of Fight Club?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytjN6Qa-Igg
You are completely off your rocker.
Really?
WATCH THIS. Understand what this website is about...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ytjN6Qa-Igg
You defend CORRUPTION as you are personally corrupt. You are invested into FRAUD as you are dishonest.
I baited you into this. You exposed yourself and your FLAWED CHARACTER. You are the Eurotrash of which I write.
Furthermore you have no conscience as you are a psychopath.
Nazi?
To the other Eurotrash detractors...
Please demonstrate that Germany is not corrupt. Please demonstrate why Germany needs to be spared the consequences of their actions.
Enslaving people in other nations...anywhere...is despicable. That is why the USA deserves this collapse as well.
But you cannot demostrate jack shit. That is the reason you resort to downarrows.
You cannot even begin to formulate any viable argument in order to justify Germany's malevolent actions toward others.
You junk the post as you are personally corrupted.
You thrive on, live upon, and celebrate your own personal corruption. I just wonder how you can gaze at yourself in the bathroom mirror in the morning.
I will celebrate your destruction as I celebrate the destruction of the corrupt. We need the final cleansing.
Wait -- Germany bails out a bankrupt nation and they are malevolent?
What planet do you live on?
Germany has been burned to the ground financially 5x I. The last 100 years. It will most definitely burn to the ground again. However if history is a good guidebook to the future -- Germany will comeback stronger next time.
The ussa is going to be fighting the libertarian right and the thugs in the hood for the next decade.
you are not well informed my friend.... Germany bailed out its big banks and itself NOT Greece..... the money you lent presumably to Greece were shifted immidiately to payments to your banks.. Greece took up more debt to save one big German and one big French bank that would collapse otherwise... Our crooked politicians loaded yet more debt onto the crushed shoulders of an already bankrupt country in order to allow one large French bank and one German bank – no names please – to offload much of their €25bn combined exposure onto EMU taxpayers...
The IMF’s Original Sin in Greece was to let Dominique Strauss-Kahn hijack the institution to save Europe's banks and the euro when the crisis erupted, dooming Greece to disaster....What in fact happened was six years of depression, a deflationary spiral, a 26pc fall in GDP, 60pc youth unemployment, mass exodus of the young and the brightest, chronic hysteresis that will blight Greece’s prospects for a decade to come, and to cap it all the debt ratio exploded because of the mathematical – and predictable – denominator effect of shrinking nominal GDP.
It is a public policy scandal of the first order.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11654639/IMF-has-betrayed-i...
you my friend totally desreve my upvote
Yes. You are correct.
You're misallocating blame though. It's not Germanys fault -- as the euro has been devastating for Germany as well. The problem lies with the complete psychopaths who are attempting to create a one world government. A new world order so to speak. They will throw everyone under the bus to achieve this. Germany included. Greece is under the rear wheels right now and Germany is hog tied staring at this thing coming at it at full speed.
Blame those in charge. Not a nation, who like Greece is filled with people having to foot the bill for this insanity.
so what, 70 years ago hitler was still on the party, i do not give a fucking fuck of a fucking particule size to germany, ppl alive today who supported in war time their nazi nation, nope, sorry, i just cannot talk to any german before at least 50 years more, just to be sure every body alive from this period will be dust again.
same for any nation who took nazis like food in walmart's cart to increase their power, such usa with braun to override russia, because it's the most visible of 'em...
Well, Germany promised and delivered arms to Saudi Arabia in return for support in getting the World Cup. But I guess you see a peaceful and non-corrupt nation there. Yeah...
You clearly have no idea what you are talking about.
Germans don't riot. We have paid left wing schrills that burn police cars, but rioting. Please.
We leave that to the #blacklivesmatter bullshit as they copy Rodney king.
Hey, 'Big Brains', the Anglo-Saxons were a Germanic people to start with...
Now leave your Dad's laptop alone and go and finish your homework, you've got school in the morning.
The Saxons and the Angles are German people, but todays Anglo-Saxon are not. They just speak a Germanic language. Most of them are from kind of funny pre-Hallstatt British islands descend. Or they are from India or Africa. Get some education.
AHAHAHHAAAAHAHAHAHHAHA
I guess that why Siemens had to pay that huge bribery fine to the Greeks!!!!!!
Wolferl you are full of shit.
Don't you get tired of posting the same old shit, we get tired of reading it.
Get back to stomping the skulls of immigrants with the rest of your skinhead buddies...
Spot on, Greece is a corrupt country to the core, they have no right to be in Europe.
so , Siemens is a greek company ?
or a German Company ?
Why does it still exist , when it is proved that they use bribery ?
Why do the Germans tolerate that ?
Because bribery is not happening in Germany ?
Siege Siemens Assets in Greece , and see what happens next
Companies have no nationalities. Greek people of the Greek Siemens branch in Greece bribed other Greeks in Greece. So, tell me what has Germany to do with this? Germany has no jurisdiction over Greek people. It´s a 100% Greek problem.
so , Siemens is a greek company ?
or a German Company ?
Why does it still exist , when it is proved that they use bribery ?
Why do the Germans tolerate that ?
Because bribery is not happening in Germany ?
Siege Siemens Assets in Greece , and see what happens next
TRUE STORY
IN ABOUT 2010 DB HAD A FOREX OFFICE IN NY. I HAD ABOUT $3K IN THE ACCOUNT WHEN they closed. I did not switch to the other Forex company they assigned their clients to in time and I was never able to recover my funds. I called every Douchebank office I could find and they all said 'We'll get back to you.'
Banks once had and were respected for being fiduciaries and taking it seriously. Now they seem to behave like any other sleezy corporation (or worse.)
Spomewhere on the books of DB is a bunch of money they can't account for. If these were accounts in my medical practice my accounts person would come to me and say: cut this guy a check and let's get it off the books. Someone at DB looked at it and said: 'fuck 'em, just show it as income and let the poor bastard try to get it back'.
...and that is just one more reason why people hate banks and bankers....
Not quite, what are we going to do with your sorry ass??
Laugh at him while Germany is shredded from within.
The solution is happening while everyone is wondering what the solution is.
"Russians forward deploy nukes across entire frontier and in particular a Europe which is not a threat" is a language all of Europe speaks.
Unfortunately.
"Putin is insane." Move along.
"McCain and Soros are insane..........there, I fixed it for you......now go back to your MSM source.....
He's a disabled vet, for God's sake. How could you be so cruel?
/s
Must be a head injury.
NUKE EM ALL!!!
GIT'R DONE!
And c'mon massive comet strike!
And super volcanoes!
That should do it..
Wolferl, have you got to your thirteenth birthday already? Did your mom buy you your first lipstick at last?
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1TFnowRN0fgThe very word Palestininians .... comes from the Hebrew word "Plishtim" .... which means .... invaders .... just like the women libbers .... who can't come up with a new word for "womb man" and "fe male" .... the Palestinians borrow from the Hebrew .... their very identity !
No, I'm not a Hebrew scholar .... nor, a journalism major .... I saw that over at barenakedislam.com ! (oops ! Palestinians )
It means inhabitants, which is what they've been the whole time. The current jewish state are the invaders by kicking the inhabitants out. Zionism (radical judism) just like Wahabism (radical Islam) or Crusaders (radical christians) are a cancer spreading through the world.
Here let me make something up. Israel, broken down means destroyer of worlds in their belief that they're somehow god's chosen ones.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philistines
I went down on a Greek chick once..........once
How was it .... a hint of the anchovy ?
And when you go down on a Jewish chick, does it taste like Gefilte fish?
A 'Grecian' is like a Brazilian except it includes the whole back and ears.
I think that most people can find a way to get the point across regardless of language skills. I believe that its not just a language and culture barrier that is making the EU so dysfunctional, there are other problems that run far deeper.
I must admit though, in my efforts to express myself, I have sometimes abused English rather mercilessly. I guess i could sometimes have done better, apologies to those who have suffered trough it :)
The only way two or more nations can live together in peace in a single country is to restrict all but one of the nations to the part of the country beginning six feet under the ground.
Don't forget the airspace .... inside the crematoriums .... and under the gallows !
As Sir Winston Leonard Spencer-Churchill said: "Just bomb Germany every 50 years. Problem solved. And if you dont know why to do that, they do".
How sweet it is .... to annoy the Muslim filth ! LOL
How sweet it is to gas zionist filth. Sadly many innocent jewish people paid the price. Though I doubt it was 6 million.
Nice avatar of you having anal sex with your boyfriend, Monetas.
many anglophiles speak only one language and often only manage that rather poorly.
This limits their understanding of themselves, of others and the real world environment.
By looking outward, they see others as dysfunctional, when it really is their own world,
that is falling apart.
WR;)
There are areas where I agree with the Greeks ...
"not paying taxes is morally justifiable."
>>> "not paying taxes is morally justifiable."
Society must be financed in some way.
Sewers must be built, sewage systems must be operated otherwise we shall all die early deaths of cholera. That's just one example.
So someone must build sewers, and who better than government? Government needs money and the only real alternative to taxes is publically owned profitable businesses. So it is taxes or communism, those are the only two alternatives. And neither solves the problem of corrupt government that is bought by the "plantation owners" who then dictate what the government must do and must not do.
American government - the very best form of government that money has bought.
You are going to live the "Greek Experiment" too in your country. This was just the beginning. So I hope you like having to pay 15.000 euro taxes in order to work legaly and gain 10.000 euro per year. Or being unempolyed and have to pay 6.000 euro taxes per year just for being a citizen. And dont cry tomorrow because after Greece guess whose turn it will be next ...
"Society must be financed in some way"
So then it is not a big deal that everyone loses his/her freedom ?
Its normal then that one doesn't has the right to private property, ownership even over ones own life ?
While voluntary contributions would be a better system, more effective. Its proven.
If everybody understand that some problems must be collectively solved, then it will happen.
You really do not need a government with too much power and have a prosperous society.
People are capable to organise themselves voluntary. You see it in sports... referees
but also in teamsports.
Charity organisations are an other exemple. All USA universities were once started by (rich) people, serving the community.
Hospitals ... the same.
Banks... you don't need governmental regulations but free markets. Banks are not free, just a part of central bank.
Yes taxes are immoral. Taxation comes with force and has no respect for private property, one could loose all.
The moral justification for Greeks not paying their taxes has a long history beggining with the creation of the Greek nation in 1821 after liberation from the Ottoman Empire. Greek culture was seeded with state corruption due to the workings of the empire (that does not mean that Greeks themselves are innocent of allowing the corruption to propagate). Unfortunately, the Greek state pretty much NEVER observed the rule of law, everything concerning politics was fraud with corruption and a Darwinian perspective and this trickled down to the rest of society. A good piece to read to understand the problem: http://www.pappaspost.com/why-cant-greece-shake-its-corruption-problem/
At the end of the day, most man-made problems are solvable, especially in finance.
Yup...just print moar. One more zero...problem solved.
Europe... a collection of sad defeated peoples squatting on the ruins of once-great civilizations.
Say what you want about America, it's not a once-great civilization until the fat lady sings.
No but she can be heard warming up!
Looks like a typical nation run by banksters
You know, I was wondering at the sudden tsunami of Nazi Kook posts and then it hit me.
It's the first of the month and they finally got their EBT cards filled back up. Which means that they don't have to go all the way down to the library to spew.
To imagine that these satanic morons would actually be celebrating the genocidal polices of Der Fuhrer on the anniversary of D-Day is a very sad commentary on the uselessness of their parents and the evils inflicted by our captured educational system.
But, never fear, we (meaning not you) will gain the inevitable triumph, so help us God.
The EU will break up !
Simple.
And then we could make the next step.
"while the Dutch and the Swede early in the morning."
That is a brilliant little catch! Indeed, I am 2nd generation Swedish-American, what I have always found in Northern Europe is a desire to tackle hard work or hard study first thing in the morning. Why? Well as a former language teacher told me, "in the mornings you are rested and your mind is clear, a sort of blank slate. You may not feel sharp, but you brain is sharp. You are not overloaded with the days business." It is then that she asks her language students to do their vocabulary and comprehension drills. I followed her advice, and she is 100% right. Anything I learned first thing in the morning is set and done. I find this hold true for any work. When I had difficult electronic trouble shooting problems, I always set them aside for first thing in the morning. And I found my solutions much faster. Nothern europeans like to work hard in the mornings, and coast in the afternoons. DOing late night study is a fucking waste, in one tired ear, out the other.
Paying taxes is not morally justifiable.