This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
"The Collateral Has Run Out" - JPM Warns ECB Will Use Greek "Nuclear Option" If No Monday Deal
In Athens on Friday, the ATM lines began to form in earnest.
(via Corriere)
Although estimates vary, Kathimerini, citing Greek banking officials, puts Friday’s deposit outflow at €1.7 billion. If true, that would mark a serious step up from the estimated €1.2 billion that left the banking system on Thursday and serves to underscore just how critical the ECB’s emergency decision to lift the ELA cap by €1.8 billion truly was. “Banks expressed relief following Frankfurt’s reaction, acknowledging that Friday could have ended very differently without a new cash injection,” the Greek daily said, adding that the ECB’s expectation of “a positive outcome in Monday’s meeting”, suggests ELA could be frozen if the stalemate remains after leaders convene the ad hoc summit. Bloomberg has more on the summit:
Dorothea Lambros stood outside an HSBC branch in central Athens on Friday afternoon, an envelope stuffed with cash in one hand and a 38,000 euro ($43,000) cashier’s check in the other.
She was a few minutes too late to make her deposit at the London-based bank. She was too scared to take her life-savings back to her Greek bank. She worried it wouldn’t survive the weekend.
“I don’t know what happens on Monday,” said Lambros, a 58-year-old government employee.
Nobody does. Every shifting deadline, every last-gasp effort has built up to this: a nation that went to sleep on Friday not knowing what Monday will bring. A deal, or more brinkmanship. Shuttered banks and empty cash machines, or a few more days of euros in their pockets and drachmas in their past - - and maybe their future.
For Greeks, the fear is that Monday will be deja vu, a return to a past not that distant. Before the euro replaced the drachma in 2002, the Greeks were already a European bête noire, their currency mostly trapped inside their nation, where cash was king and checks a novelty.
Everything comes together on Monday. Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras, back from a visit with Vladimir Putin in St. Petersburg, will spend his weekend coming up with a proposal to take to a Monday showdown with euro-area leaders.
A deal there is key. The bailout agreement that’s kept Greece from defaulting expires June 30. That’s the day Greece owes about 1.5 billion euros to the International Monetary Fund.
Without at least an understanding among the political chiefs, Greek banks will reach the limits of their available collateral for more ECB aid.
Indeed, JP Morgan suggests that the central bank may have already shown some leniency in terms of how it treats Greek collateral. Further, analyst Nikolaos Panigirtzoglou and team estimate, based on offshore money market flows, that some €6 billion left Greek banks last week.
If no agreement is struck on Monday evening that paves the way for further ELA hikes, the ECB may do exactly what we warned on Monday. That is, resort to the "nuclear option" which would, as JPM puts it, make capital controls are “almost inevitable.” Here’s more:
The escalation of the Greek crisis over the past week has caused an acceleration of Greek bank deposit outflows which in turn increased the likelihood of Greece introducing capital controls as soon as next week if Monday's Eurozone leaders' summit on Greece brings no deal. Indeed, our proxy of Greek bank deposit outflows, i.e. the purchases of offshore money market funds by Greek citizens is pointing to a material acceleration this week vs. the previous week.
The €147m invested into offshore money market funds during the first four days of this week is equivalent to €5bn of deposit outflows based on the relationship between the two metrics during April (during April, around €155m was invested in offshore money market funds, which was accompanied by deposit outflows of around €5bn). Assuming a similar outflow pace for Friday brings the estimated deposit outflow for the full week to €6bn. In the previous week (i.e. the week commencing June 8th) around €40m was invested into offshore money market funds, which is equivalent to around €1.6bn of deposit outflows. So this week’s deposit outflows almost quadrupled relative to the previous week. Month-to-date €8bn of deposits has likely left the Greek banking system on our estimates, following €5bn in May and €5bn in April. As a result, the level of household and corporate deposits currently stands at just above €120bn.
As mentioned above this acceleration in the pace of deposit outflows is raising the chance that the Greek government will be forced to impose restrictions on the withdrawal of deposits if no deal is reached at the Eurozone summit on Monday. This is because Greek banks' borrowing from the ECB has moved above the €121bn maximum we had previously estimated based on available collateral (€38bn using EFSF as collateral, €8bn using government securities as collateral & €75bn using credit claims as collateral). In particular, by assuming that Greek banks operate at c €1-2bn below the ELA limit as a buffer, we estimate that their current borrowing is €125bn. This is based on the ECB raising its ELA limit to €86bn on Friday this week from €84bn on Wednesday.
Here is the punchline: when the ECB hiked Greek ELA by €1.8 bilion in its Friday emergency meeting (an amount that was promptly soaked up by the €1,7 billion in Greek bank runs on Friday), it may have done so in breach of the Greek "borrowing base" because, according to JPM, with total ECB borrowings of €125, this means that Greece is now €4 billion above its maximum eligible collateral. The ECB surely knows this, and has breached its own borrowing base calculation for one of two reasons: because it knows the breach will be promptly limited or reversed on Monday, or there will be a deal. In other words, Greece is now officially living on borrowed time:
This €125bn of borrowing from the ECB is €4bn above our estimated maximum borrowing of €121bn, suggesting that the ECB has already showed flexibility with respect to the collateral constraints Greek banks are facing. We argued before that the ECB has the flexibility to adjust haircuts to allow Greek banks to borrow more from the Bank of Greece for a given amount of collateral. It can also start accepting government guaranteed bank bonds as collateral despite the ECB having rejected these bonds before as a source of acceptable collateral. Greek banks have been rolling over government guaranteed bank paper since March. For example Greek banks rolled over €33bn of government guaranteed bank debt over the past three months. However, we doubt the ECB will ever accept large amounts of government guaranteed bank debt, effectively of what it considers as collateral made “out of thin air”. And if no agreement is reached on Monday, then the ECB will have little reason to show further flexibility and it will likely freeze its ELA limit on Greek banks. As a result capital controls will become almost inevitable after Monday.
All of this is now moot: as we explained previously, for the Greek banks it is now game over (really, the culmination of a 5 year process whose outcome was clear to all involved) and the only question is what brings the Greek financial system down: whether it is a liquidity implosion as a result of a bank run which one fails to see how even a "last minute deal", or capital controls for that matter, can halt, or a slow burning solvency hit as Greek non-performing loans are now greater than those of Cyrpus were at the time when the Cypriot capital controls were imposed. As Bloomberg calculated last week, just the NPL losses are big enough now to wipe out the Big 4 Greek banks tangible capital.

JPM, for now, focuses on the liquidity aspect:
The deposit outflows from Greek banks show how dramatic the reversal of Greece's liquidity position has been over the past six months. The €8bn that left the Greek banking system month-to-date has brought the cumulative deposit withdrawal to €44bn since last December. This €44bn has more than reversed the €14bn that had entered the Greek banking system between June 2012 and November 2014 (Figure 2). The €117bn of deposits lost cumulatively since the end of 2009 has brought the bank deposit to GDP ratio for Greece to 66%. This is well below the Eurozone average of 94%.
And with more than three-quarters of the nearly €500 billion in outstanding foreign claims on Greece concentrated among foreign official institutions, any "contagion" will come will come not from the financial impact of Grexit, but from the psychological impact as the ECB's countless lies of "political capital" and "irreversible union" crash like the European house of cards.
Would a Greek exit make the Eurozone look "healthier" as problem countries that do not obey rules are ousted? Or would markets rather question the ability of the Eurozone to cope with a bigger problem/country in the future if they cannot deal with a small problem/country such as Greece? Would a Greek exit make the Eurozone more stable by fostering more fiscal integration and debt mutualization over time? Or would the large losses from a Greek exit rather make creditor nations even more reluctant to proceed with much needed debt mutualization and fiscal transfers in the future? Would a Greece exit, and the punishment of Syriza as an unconventional political party, reduce the popularity of euroskeptic and unconventional political forces in Europe, as Greece becomes an example for other populations to avoid? Or would a Greek exit and the punishment of a country that refused to succumb to neverending austerity rather demonstrate the lack of flexibility, solidarity and cooperation giving more ground to euroskeptic parties across Europe?
Again we see that the entire world is now wise to the game the troika is playing. This isn't about Greece, it's about Spain and Italy or any other "bigger" problem countries whose voters elect "euroskeptic" politicians. As a reminder, if and when the Greek problem shifts to other PIIG nations, then it will be truly a time to panic:
So much as US-Russian relations are, to quote Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov, "sacrificed on the altar of election campaigns", so too are relations between Greece and its European "partners" sacrificed for political aims. In the end, the entire Greek tragicomedy comes back to the simple fact that a currency union with no fiscal union is no union at all and will likely be nearly impossible to sustain. We'll leave you with the following quote from Alexandre Lamfalussy, BIS veteran, first President of the EMI (the ECB before the ECB existed), and the "Father of the Euro":
"It would seem to me very strange if we did not insist on the need to make appropriate arrangements that would allow for the the gradual emergence and the full operation once the EMU is completed of a community-wide macroeconomic fiscal policy which would be the natural compliment to the common monetary policy of the community."
- 137805 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -







Turn your windshield wipers on.
Tomorrow Never Knows
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tV0l62RZ80
A message from the elite: "Give us money soon or there will be no honeymoon."
Throw those pathetic Greek deadbeats out of Europe already.
23 % VAT? god damn. Coming soon to an America near you, I suppose. I just wish this would hurry up and crash. Anyone with half a brain can see its inevitable. The sooner you stop kicking the can the sooner you can start over, preferably with a lot less government, which is the primary cause of this problem, anyway. The longer they keep kicking the can, the worse its going to be.
Plus, I got my beer and popcorn available, and am looking forward to seeing darwin vindicated in a theatrical fashion, since the aftermath of collapse is as predictable as the collapse itself.
Have you noticed…
The more certain Greece’s default becomes, the less the major media outlets say about it?
If you listen real hard, you can hear the sound of hundreds of thousands of TPTB fervently crossing their fingers, praying the house of cards can hold together just a little longer…
DON'T SPEND MORE THAN YOU TAKE IN (yes, same to the U.S.). Nobody forced the Greece gubmint to borrow and spend like mad.
Nuke 'em. And NEVER lend to them again.
"The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher
"Greece, the land that gave birth to democracy and whose ancient culture laid the foundation for Western civilization, is now a nation for sale. Having fought heroically in World War II against both Mussolini's and Hitler's armies (inspiring Winston Churchill to say that "until now, we knew that Greeks were fighting like heroes; from now on we shall say that the heroes fight like Greeks"), contemporary Greece has lost its sovereignty under peacetime conditions, courtesy of a German-led EU and its own obsequious, servile, cowardly and oleaginous political leaders."
http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/25244-greece-a-nation-for-sale-and-th...
The probelm with quoting churchill is you're lending credibility to a war crinimal and a mass murderer.
greece will stiff the eu, run to the brics, the idiot rand slaves will cheerlead us into the imf permanent prison and cheer our national currency as we lose reserve status and all face devaluation plus. Domino monday ahead.
Surely it would not have been coat and jacket weather in Greece on Friday
JPM says monday is june 22, a lovely masonic number for collapse.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/personalfinance/investing/11686199/It...
< physical silver
< physical cash
Greece to EU: The louder your whiney-ass temper tantrums get, the funnier your un-loaded gun looks. Have a nice weekend. We are sure your losing positions are appropriatly hedged.
EU to Greese: "ditto"
Can Greece exit the EU? Seems like they can...but it will be a convoluted mess just like the rest of the EU. The EU has pretty much broken it's own treaties so much that of course there really is no rule of law that can't be twisted, stretched or broken with these fucking corrupt bankster and political scumbags. Just like everywhere else.
Here's an interesting write-up from 3 years ago regarding the subject that tries to cover all the options and scenarios that could take place to make it happen.
Is There No Escape from the Euro?https://mises.org/library/there-no-escape-euro
Personally, I think Greece really should tell the EU to fuck off and pivot towards Russia and see how it goes with them. Can't be much worse than it's been with the EU. In fact, it may be the best thing they could do at this point. Russia can bail them out and get them back on their feet by doing the gas pipeline deal. They would also let Russia use their ports for a price and if no one else likes it, well fuck 'em.
If they had no debt, leaving would be trivial ... since they do and they have stacked on huge amounts extra of it in recent months, not so much.
Northern Europeons paid for 10 years of massive wealth increases for Greece, we gave them a 50% haircut, we've paid for every Greek ATM withdrawl and bank transfer for months now too ... the buck fucking stops here, if they want to go with Russia after all that, I say fine ... close the borders and let's see if Russia wants to put up with their shit and eat their shitty gyros. We have enough other vacation destinations.
Not that the US doesn’t have bubbles but this stock bubble in China is a doozie. Its going to be ugly over there in the aftermath.
Many think it is a given that China is going to take the US to the woodshed in the upcoming monetary shift. I’m not so sure.
.
So this is the start of NIRP here in the usa?
I drank 2 big Poweraides and 11 bottles of water today and I didn't pee all day. True story.
So I'm not sure I'll be able to hang with you guys for long tonight.
+1 ROFL.
Good to know!
Be careful - hyponatremia (too much water, not enough salt) will make you sick and might even kill you.
thank you
- its also absurd to blame the Germans.
Its like hitting your brother up for 20 bucks, and after the 3rd or 4th time they say "hey, you know what, no - get your own shit together" - and then complaining that you're broke because your brother won't give you MOAR free shit.
It is absolute Krugmanian horseshit.
...notwithstanding the excellent phrase "Can you help a brother out?"
no problem bro, but first get on your knees.
there is always a price, some just don't want to pay...
The Delicate Genius, I think it's more like a group of banksters gave backroom favors to politicians and businessmen in order that they see to it that Greece take on loans that it could never pay back, thus forcing Greece to turn over it's freedom, oh and it's resources for pennies on the dollar.
The creditors weren't doing Greece a favor out of good will. This was a scam from the beginning.
balanced,
I agree with what you are saying about what happened *after* the debt became unpayable.
I think the argument is "Who borrowed the money in the first place?".
Everyone agrees (I think) that Greece cannot pay back the debt. To do so would ruin their economy.
But to pretend thay they are victims of German agression when the Germans just want them to pay their damn bills is overwrought hysteria.
By the way, almost alone, I think they would be better off paying off their loans.
It is the hard and bitter lessons in life which really teach the sublime transformative lessons.
I know I have taken both the easy roads and the hard roads and the hard roads taught me a lot more about what makes life worth living even while making life seem much less livable.
Paradox.
"...But to pretend thay they are victims of German agression when the Germans just want them to pay their damn bills is overwrought hysteria..."
Why are German citizens even responsible for the bad loans of their government? How many Germans got to vote to loan ANY money to Greece even back when they did have some supposed ability to repay them? Fuck the German bankers and politicians - the German people have no responsibility to make good on their bad Greek loans. German citizens will simply be forced to make good on them by the very bankers and politicians who illegally and immorally handed the money to Greece to begin with.
What German REALLY thinks Greece will ever be able to repay them? It's not even a question of will. It is financially and mathematically impossible for the Greeks to ever repay - they have not economy and no legitimate government. You can't squeeze blood out of a rock. Impoverishing every Greek right this minute means you MIGHT get another few years of payments on time, and then nothing. I sympathize with German citizens because they are the ones getting screwed, but to blame individual Greek citizens while mindlessly letting German bankers and politicians (and Greek ones) walk away with a nod and wink is the height of insanity.
Iceland is one of the few rational places on earth today - they punished the facilitators (bankers and politicians) rather than let every last citizen of Iceland get ass-raped for their bankers and politicians bad decisions. Where's the German outrage? I can only hope for some Greek outrage, but their track record leaves me wondering.
Good point re Iceland, but they differ from most other European nations in that they are still mostly homogenous and share similar values through a common culture. Thus they were able to close ranks and fight back.
The Hungarians are somewhat the same, and instinctively sense that the EU does not have their best interests in mind, so they will gradually loosen some EU ties and sever others. Both nations will fare better than the other Euro-puppets. The rest are being diluted into NWO politically correct cultural cesspools leaving them all socially disoriented and open to NWO predators.
Germany was absolutely bludgeoned into submission after WW1 and again after WW2 when they defied the NWO. They might have a vague idea as to who they are--or maybe once were--but they are NWO pawns now. They have a new identity as permanent baddies and must pay for it unto eternty. Lest anyone balk about fairness or fakery, there are draconian laws to utterly destroy any independent thinkers who might question the NWO. So reat assured that they will go along with the EU scam.
The Greeks have managed to pull off what was otherwise impossible for 3,000 years--they have destroyed themselves in one century by rotting from within. They have made the ancient Greek mythical figures come to life and finish them off--the Trojan Horse, the Minotaur, the Sirens. They have made the worst of their own myths come true.
?
Awesome
People throw around that "war criminal" label at anyone these days. You flunked history huh?
I dont know but didnt Churchhill make a deal with the US, which allowed them to fire bomb Dresden to hell-a non manufacturing city full of innocents
Yeah. Damn that dirty Churchill for not rolling over and stroking the nazi cock the way you would have. Who does that Churchhill think he is?
The probelm with quoting churchill is you're lending credibility to a war crinimal and a mass murderer.
Churchill would have cut your nuts off and fed them to ISIS Nutjobs in Sudan.
Screw you and the fat poney you ride.
Churchill was a scumbag of the highest order, dude sure could turn a prase though.
1. "Greece" did not give birth to democracy.
2. Greece laid no foundation for a "Western civilization".
3. The Greek army surrendered to the German army after just 2 weeks of war.
4. Todays Greeks have nothing to do with the population living on the same piece of land 2500 years ago.
what has this to do with anything.
go back to your original one liner, numbnuts lol
hey today's Jews have nothing to do with the small band of Canaanite monotheists who escaped out of egypt with a shitload of silver and gold all those years ago
But if you keep saying you're "returning" enough - or simply live now where an ancient people once did - well, the average bear isn't going to trouble himself to overthink the matter.
i thought the same thing when i read the line about the modern greeks having nothing to do with the ones from the golden age.
You sound like a disgruntled muslim historian in denial.
Wolferl, now you are confusing me - are these your actual views?
Do you simply suffer from HELLENOPHOBIA?
(I honestly thought that your repeated aphorism was a subtler propaganda ploy)
you piece of lying,bastard, sack of pig shit! I would really like to spit in your face!
1. Yes they did
2. Yes they did
3. Greece was first invaded by Italy in October 1940 then Germany , in April while it had most of its troops in the Albanian front fighting the Italians and defeating them - the first major allies victory in ww2. The only country to be simultaneously invaded by 4 countries (Italy Bulgaria Germany Albania ) . There were forts on the metaxas line which never fell to the German invasion . 8000 Of the most elite German troops were killed or injured in the battle of Crete a battle which lasted 2 weeks on its own and a battle which caused hitler to never use an airborne invasion again. From beginning to end (October to June ) Greece lasted the longest over any country something many historians credit partially to Germany losing the war . But after Greece "fell" in June after under assault for 8 months the battle was just getting started as Greece put up one of the fiercest and most effective resistances of the war tying down many German troops and never allowing Germany to gain North Africa (especially down in Crete ) you have no idea what you're talking about
4) yes they do and what's your point
I always wondered how the Italian apple could fall so far from the tree of once great Rome.
Or how the mighty Greek warriors of old could so utterly betray the heritage of Athens by beoming a group of lazy socialized dick tasters with their hand eternally out for a German bailout.
Now I have lived to see, in realtime, my beloved America fall from a land of personal liberty and freedom to a tyranical regime of chicken shit group thinkers run by that fuckstick Obama and his millions of federal minions feasting at the dying corpse of this once great land.
I am still not sure I believe my lying eyes.
You "beloved America" was NEVER the land of "freedom and democracy", just a place using land stolen from the Indians and using slave laborers forcibly taken from Africa. If you ever believed USA was the land of "freedom and deomocracy" fo just one second you have been more deluded than anyone can and there is no hope for you whatsoever.
+1 for oleaginous, AlaricBalth. How did such a wonderfully descriptive word for politicians escape me for this long? English is my first language, but I'm a slow learner...
o·le·ag·i·nous
adjective
1. rich in, covered with, or producing oil; oily or greasy.
2. exaggeratedly and distastefully complimentary; obsequious.
"candidates made the usual oleaginous speeches in the debate"
Try "unctuous" and "smarmy", too. Lots of politicians fit these descriptors.
>>> "The trouble with Socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money" — Margaret Thatcher
The wicked witch was wrong about that as it was about so many things.
In Socialism there is no such thing as "other people's money", it simply does not exist. It failed fundamentally to understand simple things about the nature of Socialism instead listening to propaganda.
Idiot
or shit for brains, and brainwashed too. wash didn't clean the shit...
Na just your typical brain dead citizen. It is because of fucks like HenryHall that this world is in the shape it is in. Hey Henry I think there are some Kardashian reruns coming on you better get in front of your TV.
Let me translate, other people's hard labor.
Just as long as they are not Greeks.
I would want them to go out of the Union: goes back to the Drachma, print and spend like no tomorrow and enjoy the benefit of socialism in a Venezuela hyperinflation style...
If they haven't spend and borrowed like that, they wouldn't be in trouble with the banskter in the first place (same shit for other countries in a similar situation)...
Sometimes lessons need to be learned hard...
Goldman Sachs helped corrupt politicians hide their true debt level so they could pile more debt onto the Greek people.
They are the true criminals.
BTW, anyone who thinks Thatcher was anything but an evil fucking witch has absolutely no clue.
only chance for drachama is setting a ratio to olive oil. 100/liter or god forbid, gold or silver, ha dreaming about a future with hope...
Exactly how my mother was paid in the late 30s/40s in Greece with rampant inflation. Her wage was based on the price of so many cans of olive oil. Plus ça change.....
@CreepyCracker,
While the statement is true, politicians ALWAYS say what you want to hear.
For you to canonize that blackmailed/bought & paid for slut, who was smack dab in the middle of & covered for the sick MF'g pedo's, either displays your lack of knowledge or your condoning of such behavior.
Creepy cracker, you remind me of the guest chick on Bloomberg that I heard on the way to work this past week. She was gushing about how 2015 is the first time in (I don't recall exact date) but a long time that the economy is exibiting real improvement/ growth. Guess what her metric was?..........
That new debt is surpassing retired debt!
Sad
It wasn't just the gubmint. It was the people too. Borrowing like that pervert on the movie armageddon.
And don't try to preach that old school conservative notion of living within your means to these neo millenial douche nozzles.
They will just junk you. Halfwit asshats.
Nailed it Creepy...makes me proud to be in America where we don't have problems like debt/gdp ratios. whew...good things all these problems are contained on the other side of the ocean.
That's virtually impossible using fiat, it's built to inflate. The fact is the fiat capital they use will ALWAYS end up forcing them into a position to over spend. That's just how the math works while using an inflationary medium of exchange. The real problem is people honestly believe they should be paid back when lending people over 200% of their annual GDP. And in Europe, that's every country that borrows money against an inflationary fiat currency that are supposedly backed with PM's that have never kept pace with inflation. Even Germany is screwed.
Soon it'll be Germany begging creditors to let them out. Inch by inch, Germany will end up in the central bankers pocket permanently. The people that once ran it will just get locked out of all decision making just like is happening in the USA and already in Canada. Because that's how a shadow takeover happens. No one ever notices the bodies getting swapped out. The headlines will read "New appointment" with the usual self righteous drivel that comes with it. Rinse and repeat dozens of times a week, the people that once were 'partners' get locked out of their own caucus. Nothing sadder than a washed up politician, but process above, that's exactly how it always happens. No matter who believes they are calling the shots at the time.
You, Sir, DO NOT comprehend the debt based monetary system. Greeks were ABSOLUTELY FORCED TO BORROW ANY MONEY THEY HAD IN EXISTENCE (excepting specie - which is a negligible factor).
They ABSOLUTELY WERE, AND ARE, FORCED TO BORROW MONEY INTO EXISTENCE!
This is because the supranational Debt-Money Monopoly has set up Debt-Money Monopolist Fascism in much of the world - AND THE MASSES DON'T EVEN KNOW IT!. It has been done covertly.
“In our time, the curse is monetary illiteracy, just as inability to read plain print was the curse of earlier centuries.”
? Ezra Pound
Since the Greeks are debt-money illiterate, they didn't comprehend the consequences of their buying spree.
The Debt-Money Monopolist predators prey upon the nescient and ignorant.
The Debt-Money Monopoly rooked Germany, too. Their corporate front banking debts were transferred to the ECB and the German pension funds were set up as collateral. The Debt-Money Monopoly screwed you and now they are trying to pin the r*pe charge on a bunch of nescient and ignorant Greeks.
BTW, everyone's politicians are financed into power by... The Debt-Money Monopoly.
BLAME THE RIGHT INDIVIDUAL PEOPLE! IF WE CAN'T DO THAT, WE ARE SCREWED EVEN WORSE.
Which Monday?
Ha Ha, Captcha.
I agree, which Monday?. This has been coming for a long, long time, and still I have to assume they will find a way to kick the can again. They always seem to. It's hard to follow the game when the players change the rules as desired. Except for the withdrawals (I can't believe anyone would feel comfortable with their life saving in one of these banks) I expect a agreement to be announced Monday, saving Greece from having to leave the EU.
Guys, tell me. Since when do they announce odd things from happening. So much for the odds...
Ya, i heard about it before, but then SOMETHING HAPPENED that now takes up every goddamn second on every news channel. As I type this, the queen of the thundercunts herself is pontificating on it the teevee. But no one in the US is going to pay any attention to rioting greeks, or think to themselves that the same thing greece is going through is being done to us as well. Nope, they will all be thinking about race and racism, and (the smart ones, anyway) thinking about maybe getting some more leador perhaps a new lead delivery device or two before all the gun control talk starts( I know I made a purchase yesterday...) This is the perfect time to pull the rug out from under them, no doubt, since no one but us is paying attention, and no one cares what we think anyway since we are all crazy people
times 100 there Carl
good on knock, knock. some are no owner, some not. some are lake locked, some are here. summer is here too...
^^^^^^^^Prophet^^^^^^^^
Tco6rtw. It's so quiet, you can hear a pin drop on carpet.
The saying down in Georgia used to be " it's so quiet you can hear a rat piss on cotton".
Squeaky BUM Time!
25% VAT in the cleptocratic paradise of Sweden.
Can't you start a business and let if flow through?
Speaking of Sweden, America is right on track with Sweden. If you want to know where we are going watch this.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3KSJY0c8QWw
I know you would prefer girls gone wild but settle for Immigration and socialism gone absolutely bat shit fucking crazy instead.
WARNING: If your bullshit meter is already overloaded don't watch cause your head just may explode. Thats no shit.
The worst thing is that this Balkan kid is 100% correct regarding Sweden, its so extreme that it cant be made up... To that no one in Sweden has a freakin clue whats going on in the world, we as Swedes have become so Kardashianed its unbearable to hear people talk. It was really refreshing to hear En Arg Blatte, funnily enough my childrens grandfather is also from the Balkans and trust me he shares this guys views, he came to Sweden -65 when Sweden imported labor due to demand.
The worst thing is that this Balkan kid is 100% correct regarding Sweden, its so extreme that it cant be made up... To that no one in Sweden has a freakin clue whats going on in the world, we as Swedes have become so Kardashianed its unbearable to hear people talk. It was really refreshing to hear En Arg Blatte, funnily enough my childrens grandfather is also from the Balkans and trust me he shares this guys views, he came to Sweden -65 when Sweden imported labor due to demand.
Multiculturalism is the divide and conquer strategy of today.
Where is little Eirik???
RedIce hits the nail on the head. Sad, very sad.
I'm surprised they've not had the plug pulled for challenging the 6mil.
VAT is a bitch slap of a tax. It hurts the bottom who must spend all their income just to get through the month. The well off invest and defer the VAT on most of their income. Sweden's VAT is refundable or not payable by people on tourist visas , like me.
What if the VAT tax was not applicable on essential items, such as food, rent or medical expenses?...then we'd hear how he VAT would hurt the economy because it deters rich people from spending.
It isn't applicable to food(except restaurants) or clothing.
Its not an across the board tax, at least in the UK,at all.
I believe the same type of excemptions apply in Holland, France, and Italy.
don't know about the rest.
what value is added? bloated gov.org? surely I see no value...
misnomer
Food, books and children's clothing is VAT exempt IIRC, fat boys like me pay the tax on our wardrobe though.
"...then we'd hear how he VAT would hurt the economy because it deters rich people from spending."
If Samoans owned the media, you would expect to hear a lot about Samoan issues. If Brazilians owned the media, you would expect to hear a lot about Brazilian issues. As it is in the US, we hear a lot about the concerns of rich people. Res ipsa loquitur.
Fuck that. Tax wealth by taxing lobbying instead.
maybe there is some sanity
tax all political contributions
public and private...
"The Collateral Has Run Out"
Not to worry, the collateral will be topped off once all the short sellers have been appropriately fleeced in the coming days/weeks ahead.
This time it will not be any different, it will be the same as always, and the slow trickle down path to wealth destruction will continue instead of a Big Bang collapse.
They may get the last tranche with some lip service reforms that nobody can audit on. Sure, the Germans may just be so stupid to throw another 7 billion of good money after bad. Someone will tell them it makes sense.
However, the math still doesn't add up. Greece needs more, lots more and they need debt forgiveness.
They ran out of OPM and the creditors ran out of road to kick the can further.
Crunchtime ahead. But it won't be a massive desaster. Short term volatility. Debt can't be forgiven or else the rest of Club Med and France will line-up.
No hope for the Greeks but it needs to happen.
Come on man you know damn well they are gonna toss them another loan. They have to. Absolutely poso-fucking-tively have to. This shit will fill our screens for another few weeks then, voila problem solved. We will see photo after photo of joyous pols kissing, hugging, sucking each other's dicks with captions like: "last minute deal saves the day," "all problems solved, EU stronger than ever," and of course the inevitable "(name the politician) led the way for all European people with a ground breaking plan that will pay all former debts and open new lines of credit for all parties." Stock markets across the globe will reach new record highs and PM's will drop and this shit will go on and on till it ends... Suddenly!
Starting over will include less government *only* because there will also be fewer people.
Debt reset will necessarily entail a population reset. The longer they kick the can, the worse it will be in that *more* people will have to be eliminated.
The real NUCLEAR OPTION will come sometime after the economic crash
probably around the time when Russia decides it has had enough of the neo-nazis in Ukraine and Washington
Unfortunately, the big government forces are already massed at the economic border. We are far more likely to have Socialism than Capitalism.
Throw those pathetic bankster deadbeats out of humanity already.
I welcome the death of DEBT-MONEY....
.....viva la frances_sawyer
Tyler, throw that pathetic Wolferl out of ZH already.
let him have his say.........better to bring back Mako, trav7777, francis and the others who have been banned for speaking the truth
Prolly would if he could.
I heard last week they were going to make blog sites liable for politically incorrect comments.
Who has the power in the captured govs to pass such laws?
hmmm
+1. I didn't agree with a single thing those anti semite eggheads had to say, but they god damned well had the right to say whatever they felt like saying.
Even low grade morons like me, occasionally, through sheer dumb luck, stumble on a gem once in a while.
One of the side effects of the technology behind bitcoin (OMG, he said bitcoin. Junk him! JUNK HIM!) is the ability to have an internet domain, like zerohedge.com, that cannot be seized by Obumbler and his fascists ilk controlling ICANN.
I am curious to see how this plays out in the arena of free speech as the American commie crowd continue to try and police speech but lose control over the ability to shut down certain kinds of top level domains.
And once again - Europe is a continent. You want to throw Greeks off the continent?
Do Germans want to move to to Greece because their own country is being overrun by human trash from 3rd world shitholes?
You still have no clue about Europe. `Murican? Oh no, ´Muricans don´t exist, since these are continents, not countries.
u r such an *sshole lmao
a real one trick pony
Can we please bring back the "I made 6k working from home" posts back to replace the "Throw the deadbeats out of Greece" posts? The working from home posts always had a nice story...these Greece shill posts do not.
To be honest the ECB and all of them were encouraging the bank runs.
If I was a huge central bank, I'd probably let this default happen so that it can be another piece for a looming war. I'd probably get some sick satisfaction from Greece being like a chess piece, the knight, ever notice it moves like the Greek Key?
After all, I lent them all the money, and I know my shit!
a deal will be struck.... markets will set new er highs.... banksters will pop the Dom... how do i know? i never learn.... i'm short the biotech sector and russell 2000 in size
"Monday morning you look so fine
Friday I got travelin on my mind
First you love me then you say it's wrong
I can't go on believing for long
But you know it's true
You only want me when I get over you"
- Fleetwood Mac
A hard rain is gonna fall
Omg, just leave us alone here. Build the pipeline and let us go back to our business...stop screwing us around over oil and gas.
at some point, ultra complacent investors and markets will figure out this isn't 2012 all over again, likely after they watch the markets go limit down for a week,
past time for the greeks to print up the drachma.
If they really wanted to fuck the ECB they would start coining drachma in Ag.
Ass wipers
Everybody saw this coming for YEARS. This will be the first epic disaster where everyone thought they could avoid and decided to pick up pennies in front of the economic steam roller.
I am thinking things are getting really pretty fucked up just about now. Once D-Bank collapses, then things will get interesting.
Dorothea Lambros just advertised to every burglar and robber in Greece that there she has 34K euro in cash at her home over the weekend.
These satanic fucking bankers all need to hang.
Well hung. Musollini style. To take stock before meeting their Maker.
I find it absolutely hilarious that capital controls are the "nuclear option." Talk about a Bankster Paradise.
"Here's your five euro for the week...don't spend it all at once."
Seriously...the "nuclear option" is Greece going back to the Drachma and all the rest of Europe following suit.
"Congratulations we ha e debt jubilee!"
That's the nuclear option.
Can someone please explain to me why wouldn't the Greek central bank and/or government decide to just start printing euro banknotes at their printing facility the same way Ireland did in early 2011? Back then the ECB said "It's OK, so long as we are notified".
Because the Greek government is not in control of the Greek national bank, BoG. The ECB is in control.
Don't the Greek commercial banks have a large influence on what the BoG does? Now it looks like the ECB's support for the Greek banks is in question. Wouldn't they now have to turn to someone else? It seems to me that in the Irish case the commercial banks' needs were more important than the ECB's interests.
Furthermore, how strong would ECB's actual control be in an extreme situation? Wouldn't the government resort to desperate measures, such as taking physical control over the printing facility, by force if needed, (this kind of stuff is in the basic nature of governments, after all) and ordering it to print? How would the ECB and everyone else outside Greece react?
If someone in Greece prints a single Euro without the ECB´s consent it´s a crime of fogery and those bank notes are worthless. If the Bank of Greece or the Greek government does this it´s a reason to exclude Greece from the Euro and the EU. The Euro is just like a foreign currency for Greece, they have no control whatsoever.
Here's the thing though. Right now what do the guys in the Greek government and banks have to lose in the short term when they don't have the cash to keep the things going the way they are used to. By far the most important priority for them is to get cash now. And they may well find out that counterfeiting euro bills could satisfy that need for a long time. It's a huge currency area - monetizing one small country's debts won't even create the same inflationary pressures that monetizing debts with a small national currency would create (and countries have resorted to that countless times regardless). So they don't have much to lose.
They can print euro banknotes that are completely indistinguishable from the ones printed at all the other 20 or so printing facilities throughout Europe so they would be far from worthless on the market. I'm sure they are capable of running an effective counterfeiting enterprise.
Don´t you think the ECB will learn about this operation pretty fast and stop it? Don´t you think there are a lot of non Greeks involved in the production of banknotes who will not hessitate to report this to the ECB?
What can the ECB do to stop it? I don't know of anything short of occupying the country militarily. Am I missing something?
Introduce new Euro notes the Greeks are unable to print and declare all old notes without value unless proven no fake.
Yes, that's one measure against counterfeiting that has been used in other cases. However, it has been slow to implement, very inconvenient for the users of the currency and ultimately only a damage control measure. They can't prevent counterfeits entering circulation. When the banknotes are 100% identical it's impossible to prove which ones are "fake" and which ones are "no fake". The counterfeiters would have a window of opportunity to create a huge amount of seigniorage (profit from the creation of new money) before the party is over. Perhaps enough to run the Greek government and banks for many years. For all we know, the BoG may have already printed euros and hidden them "just in case".
I think central bankers would rather not attract any attention lest people start thinking critically about fiat money. They'd rather negotiate. Or perhaps they'd support anti-cash propaganda which can help them with the counterfeiting issue.
The Jackals would show up and make those that made such decisions very... uncomfortable.
There is more than one way to skin a Greek.
Breaking News
All time high in mattress sales !
& ATM repairs
It must be cold in Greece this summer.
They all have their coats on.
Global warming, er, climate change.
you are an idiot.
http://www.weather.gr/en/greece/epirus/weather-Papigko-5468
Thanks for the objective information. Downvotes must be for your commentary?
Hey, you lying sack of shit. Thats the weather report for one of the highest altitude villages in Greece. Whts your fuckin agenda asshole?
We are sweating our asses off right now. Bs pictures. Not a single person at our ATM machine at our bar.
Since cash is involved, they are all carrying their long guns.
Europe, we don't walk around with guns all the time.
And that's why Europe blows goats. A continent full of deracinated she-males.
And then there's the upside - you don't risk getting shot every time you meet a cop.
Also, European cops don't look like they've just arrived from a "Predator" filming set...
Sheep live safe, pleasant, obedient lives that don't require much thought.
They are well cared for so long as the shepherd prefers lots of wool to a little bit of mutton.
+1 POTD
Says the Americunt faggot, land of faggots and obese men whose tits are bigger than most women.
Don't tell Juris butt boy.
Yea Lord knows there are no homosexuals in Netherlands Dutch punk. You better get on down to the bar and suck up some Heineken or a few Amstels before your Muslim overlords shut down all the bars.
Buckaroo Bozo. Most of you Americunt men haven't seen their own peckers in 30 years ., At least European cops still have 32 inch waists and treat people with respect. Your are a shit for brains asswipe who has never been outside of his trailer park.