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Fiat Faith Falters As Bitcoin Surges 7% Post-Greferendum Decision

Tyler Durden's picture




 

The faith in fiat currencies is faltering...

 

 

Source: BitcoinWisdom

 

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Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:22 | 6248582 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

The bitcoin miners/servers at JPM and Goldman Sachs could not be happier...

out of the frying pan and...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:26 | 6248594 freet0pian
freet0pian's picture

Yup, makes sense, playing with dimes at JPM and GS. :roll_eyes:

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:38 | 6248617 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Let me be clear, there are lots of cryptocurrency choices out there.  They are great hedges in the absence of any real honest market short (VIX etc.) but they are not backed by anything fucking real, period, and therefore not without risk.

Wake me the western governments start accepting tax payments in bitcoin and their soldiers are happy to accept bitcoin payments.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:40 | 6248635 Arnold
Arnold's picture

Same argument for paper currencies.

 

 

(Full Faith and Trust)

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:47 | 6248666 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Really?  Last time I checked, there were some sizable military forces standing behind that paper.

The paper is of course being fully devalued.  Once the soldiers figure that out, then, and only then, will all hell break loose.  in the meantime it it not theirs to ask why but only to do and to die.

Not all paper is created equal, what is standing behind the yuan, that is the most important question for you to ponder.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:57 | 6248696 THE 4th Quadrant
THE 4th Quadrant's picture

Yes. I like the concept of Bitcoin but the filthy joos are the ones who created it, not some Japanese genius.

Have you seen the code? Perfectly written and with comments galore. Who the fuck writes code like that?

I'll tell you who. The people who the filthy joos hired to write it.

The joos did all the early mining before anyone had a chance and they cornered all the 'free' coins. Now they throw some small change to the goy miners. They say that there is a limit on coins but that is false too. Early on they mined so many that they will always have control of it.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:09 | 6248790 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Forget about "backing" and be more concerned with counterparty RISK!!!!!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:24 | 6248882 Theosebes Goodfellow
Theosebes Goodfellow's picture

~"Forget about "backing" and be more concerned with counterparty RISK!!!!!"~

Say, speaking of which, would someone please reach over a poke gold and silver in the ribs? It seems as if they are sleeping through this here Grexit and Puerto Rican tent-folding. .

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:32 | 6248927 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

They aren't sleeping--they get clubbed  as soon as they sit up.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:36 | 6248967 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

SATOSHI WE LOVE YOU!!!!!!!!!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:37 | 6249312 InjectTheVenom
InjectTheVenom's picture

SUCK IT SATOSHI 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:52 | 6249057 CPL
CPL's picture

Yeah, that's because of the ETN/ETF sphere of investment's of paper fronted gold and silver.  The ETF's are highlighting what a PM reserve backed currency would function like in a world market.  Except they are a tiny microcosm of financial instrumentation only used by a couple of million people.  Just imagine how fucked up it would get if billions were doing the same thing.  Doubt it would last a week.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:20 | 6249235 funthea
funthea's picture

You forget that in this paper market, the asset is decoupled from reality in that it has been sold hundreds of times with hundreds beliving they own the underlining asset. This market is not what it would look like it the asset were only allowed to be traded ONCE.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:34 | 6249293 CPL
CPL's picture

Nope, didn't forget that at all.  If people honestly believe that it'll be different people managing the gold standard before and after.  I got news for them.  All that happens in that situation is the people managing the gold and silver price action today get to sit right next to your stack of PM's instead of having that thick insulation of paper.  Just inviting the fox into the hen house. 

Then again maybe that's not such a bad thing, it would help speed this bullshit up.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:32 | 6248932 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

What? But gold is up two bucks and silver three cents!

Seriously, this fuckan farce is hard to comprehend anymore...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:36 | 6248960 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

FUCK YEAH BITCOIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:59 | 6249696 Zorrohodge
Zorrohodge's picture

Lol I found Fonestar!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:46 | 6249027 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Why, my ounces have not changed at all!!!  That is the fucking point!  Yes, thanks for helping!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:37 | 6248970 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

Bitcoin has no counterparty risk!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:48 | 6249033 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Bullshit, it can and has lost value, oddly enough, I have never seen an ounce dissappear in my safe.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:34 | 6249289 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

Um, how did it "lose value" if it was less than $1, five short years ago?  Stop making shit up!!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:03 | 6249436 Lex_Luthor
Lex_Luthor's picture

Yes, because bitcoin is a fucking bubble and nothing more. It was created out of nothing, it produces nothing, it exchanges nothing, it does not possess military. It's a fucking fiction that dissapears as soon as the internet is shut down. Blockchain is a joke and so are the bitcoin speculators who don't really give a shit about freedom and all the other Max Kaiser and DaVinci bullshit. It's all about a fucking GREED for $$$ and you've all been duped by the promotors and now you promote it further to find enough fools to hold the bag for you. Tic-tac for bitcoin and all the moronic bitcoin johnny-come-lately community. BC Max Keiser&Co. pushers are LONG gone @$1,200!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:46 | 6249358 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Price risk isn't the same as counterparty risk.

Seriously, stop talking.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:30 | 6249273 CPL
CPL's picture

The idea of counterparty risk is a red herring it Does not exist...and it's an old lie.  It's the same lie every gambler tells themselves when they'll get luckier if they double down.  Guess what, the house of math always wins the game.

In the current situation all 'risk' has been managed, mitigated, packaged, lied about and ignored since the 1980's with the Savings and Loans scandals.  That's why none of the traditional activities to allow the market to correct itself should happen are happening.  It's why the market will never heal or repair itself under the conditions with the given tools.  Even the tools to repair this mess aren't useful.  The tools have also been 'managed' which means trying to fix a broken economy with broken tools just makes it worse.  Again, there is no counterparty risk in the old system.  Sometimes things break and can never be repaired, as kid's everyone is taught that lesson at least once. Even go so far to learn nursery ryhme's on the subject based on a kingdom's nest egg.

Humpty Dumpty sat on a wall,
Humpty Dumpty had a great fall.
All the king's horses and all the king's men
Couldn't put Humpty together again.

The counterparty risk and tools were systemically removed over the course of 30 years.  To get to this point, it was little changes over time, completely disregarded as a problem because people were making "money".  Add up all those little changes = big problem.  It's why PM's are worthless at the counterparty risk they once were.  It's why property has been rendered worthless as counterparty risk.  It's why even running a business is no no longer a hedge against counterparty risk.  What is being highlighted is the currencies all these assets trade in are the risk.

There is no stopping this from collapsing, mathematically and socially it's a guarantee.  Only functioning economy on the planet right now with any real growth at the moment is BitCoin.  It's either the wild west of BTC, or sit and watch "elite" idiots attempt to put humpty dumpty back together again.  There aren't many options in the situation.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:37 | 6248973 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

Bitcoin is the greatest thing since digitally sliced bread!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 13:40 | 6250229 Pseudonymous
Pseudonymous's picture

Why are you complaining about free software?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 15:02 | 6250681 commander gruze?
commander gruze?'s picture

Have you seen the code? Perfectly written and with comments galore. Who the fuck writes code like that?

But have you *actually* seen the code of its first release, version 0.1? It's an unholy mess, riddled with security flaws. I'm in awe what has the free software cummunity turned the code into. And since you ask, I do write code like that and so do people in my team.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:54 | 6248978 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

Bitcoin has no needs for military men backing it.  Because when it comes down to it, strength in numbers overwhelms strength in guns.

Don't believe me?  Put 100 armed men up against 1,000,0000 with clubs!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:02 | 6249442 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

In the future, wars will be fought on the internet. Bitcoin has an army for that. We are legion. 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:04 | 6249146 PaperWillBurn
PaperWillBurn's picture

The codes been re-written over time. The limit cant be changed without a hard fork that nobody will agree to run.

 

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:49 | 6249373 CPL
CPL's picture

Correct, that's why the decimal point goes to the right and inversely transaction speed quickens as adoption happens with node strength improving.  Originally BTC was seven zeros after the decimal place, now it's nine.  The more people use it, more decimal places get added on.  The top end limit is 21 million in total.  Total amount of ounces of coin/bar gold used as currency in circulation is 21 million.  That is not a mistake btw.  The crypto is built to be a 1:1 ratio, 1 BTC to 1 Ounce of Gold, if gold is ever backed into it.  Since PM price action and optics are severely damaged, it is doubtful the PM market will ever adjust properly to compensate.

21000000.000000000---> decimal point slides to the right.  BTC is built to scale to a world economy and be backed with 21 million of 'whatever'.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:43 | 6249338 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

So my investment options are Faith & Trust, or Coercion?

I will take physical assest TYVM

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:06 | 6249461 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

So will the govt. They will take your physical assets. 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:58 | 6248725 ZH Snob
ZH Snob's picture

crypto currencies are accepted by the system because the NSA has the master key to all of them. 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:16 | 6248833 commander gruze?
commander gruze?'s picture

<insert-captain-pickard-facepalm-meme-image-here>

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:41 | 6248996 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

No they don't have any "master key".  They do have backdoor hardware access which is troubling....

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:06 | 6248774 Fun Facts
Fun Facts's picture

The CME needs to start a bitcoin futures market so the FED can control the price.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:51 | 6248682 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Gold isn't backed by anything real.

Wake me when western governments start accepting tax payments in gold and their soldiers are happy to accept gold payments.

Don't let the actions or opinions or the idiots in charge, or the sheep in wolf's clothing in the military sway your judgement.  Especially avoid doublethink, which is the sum total of all pro-gold anti-bitcoin arguments. They are the same asset class.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:02 | 6248744 ZH Snob
ZH Snob's picture

it's amazing to me that the millenials are so far from recognizing real value they do not understand that gold is backed by itself, that it is the ultimate value and reserve of all other currencies.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:04 | 6248763 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Gold isn't backed by itself. That's stupid.  By that logic, dollars are back by themselves.

You guys really REALLY need to learn what money is.  It could save your life one day.

Here's a hint: if it costs almost as much to issue a new unit of it as the unit itself is worth--it's probably money.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:08 | 6248784 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

Trying to explain bitcoin to Flat Earther's is extremely difficult.

You have to do is slooooowly , try to imagine explaining what an electric light is to a retard and they may finally 'get-it'

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:12 | 6248801 e_goldstein
e_goldstein's picture

 try to imagine explaining what an electric light is to a retard and they may finally 'get-it'

 tungsten?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 12:30 | 6249825 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

No, indium-gallim nitride, or something like that.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:40 | 6248987 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

Seems like a fundamental problem, no?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:10 | 6249488 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

CrazyTech +1, thank you for that. Lmao

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:02 | 6249118 Bush Baby
Bush Baby's picture

BitGold --- The ability to make and receive payment with physical.

https://www.bitgold.com/?gclid=CjwKEAjw2cOsBRD3xNbRp5eQxzYSJADZGYbzANrPX...

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:09 | 6248785 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Forget "backing" and think counterparty risk.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:35 | 6248957 ZH Snob
ZH Snob's picture

backed by itself is a facetious and sarcastic descript to drive home the point that it stands on its own, and has no counterparty risk.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:14 | 6248816 Al Capowned
Al Capowned's picture

Millenials are smart enough to know that in the absence of intrinsic value, it is the utility of the underlying network that provides the Bitcoin tokens with its value.

The potenital utility of Bitcoin is almost limitless, there will be a million uses for it, all of which will require Bitcoin.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:41 | 6248977 ZH Snob
ZH Snob's picture

I would agree with that, Al.  bc is certainly liquid and useable.  and its value is in its network.

did you know that networking, particularly the internet was created by DARPA?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:03 | 6248746 Arnold
Arnold's picture

The gold in my 'wallet' is not in the same asset class as Bitcoin in my 'wallet'.

Your wishful thinking  is enlightening, though.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:07 | 6248777 tmosley
tmosley's picture

They are both liquidity money. With the 24/7 worldwide bitcoin network vs coin and pawn shops, bitcoin might even be more liquid than gold for small players.

You really should sit and think for literally 5 minutes before you decide to hate something.  Also helps to actually do a little research.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 12:32 | 6249844 Urban Roman
Urban Roman's picture

By the way, did you escape Mintpal with all your stash intact?

(I lost a few blackcoins ... )

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:08 | 6248755 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

"They are the same asset class."  -- Really?  How much gold versus how much bitcoin is held in Fort Knox?

Take the tin foil hat off already. 

I already said bitcoin, as well as other cryptocurrencies have been great ways to hedge,  but hedging is still risky.

You are nuts to think they are the same asset on a balance sheet or in a vault, again, who is the conspiracy nut now?

LOL!!!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:09 | 6248788 tmosley
tmosley's picture

The same amount.  In fact, the .gov at this point probably holds more bitcoin than gold, due to its seizure of the Silk Road assets.

Also, nice total non-sequitur ad hominem there. You think asset classification is a conspiracy theory? Did someone hit you in the head with a hammer recently?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:14 | 6248800 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

LOL!!!!  Bitcoin and other crypto currencies can go down just as fast as they go up.  Whereas an ounce is an ounce is an ounce.  Forget about "backing" and be concerned with counterparty RISK!

Again LMAFO!!!

I will take the profits on my bitcoin and buy more physical ounces, thank very much.  What happened to that "house full of silver"?  Looks like like someone hit you on the head, not me.  YOU were the mouthpiece for physical, what the fuck happened?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:17 | 6248837 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Go up and down in terms of what? Dollars? Gold does that too.

Bitcoin doesn't have counterparty risk.  You are a complete ignoramus on the subject, and would do well to remain silent.

And what kind of moron thinks you can't own PMs AND bitcoin? Apparently the kind right in front of me.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:52 | 6249074 ersatz007
ersatz007's picture

i thought they cancelled each other out? 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:48 | 6249364 tmosley
tmosley's picture

With an earth shattering KABOOM, like matter and antimatter, I guess.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:22 | 6248867 Pool Shark
Pool Shark's picture

 

 

Profits from Bitcoin?

 

What profits?

Bitcoin has lost 57% in just the last year...

Bitcoin has lost 78% from its all-time high a mere 18 months ago.

Even FRN's kick Bitcoin's A** for preservation of purchasing power...

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:05 | 6249149 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

Actually bitcoin has gone up around 5,000,000% in the last 5.5 years.

Did you know that the first transaction was 10,000 bitcoins for 1 Pizza ?

You can choose time lines to fit any theory.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:09 | 6249186 Haole
Haole's picture

By that same logic FRN's kick Gold and Silver's A**es for preservation of purchasing power...

You can cherry pick your data and timeline but careful not to destroy your own argument next time.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:16 | 6248829 ultraticum
ultraticum's picture

Fort Knox:  Gold = $0.  At least that is the only reasonable presumption when faced with decades of rabid resistance to a count that I could perform myself in one weekend.

A solid balance sheet has gold (in physical possession) and Bitcoin - and a little fiat to pay your city, county, state, and federal protection rackets.  Oh, and when handled properly, I hear Bitcoin can be TSA-proof, and bail-in proof, and bankster Holiday proof.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:16 | 6248830 ultraticum
ultraticum's picture

Fort Knox:  Gold = $0.  At least that is the only reasonable presumption when faced with decades of rabid resistance to a count that I could perform myself in one weekend.

A solid balance sheet has gold (in physical possession) and Bitcoin - and a little fiat to pay your city, county, state, and federal protection rackets.  Oh, and when handled properly, I hear Bitcoin can be TSA-proof, and bail-in proof, and bankster Holiday proof.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:08 | 6248783 Fun Facts
Fun Facts's picture

Gold represents a debt that has already been paid.

The time, expense, resources, energy and man hours required to obtain it is all right there in the gold you hold.

All of the CB's warez are IOU's, redeemable only for more IOU's.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:13 | 6248805 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Yes, and bitcoin is the same. Contrary to popular belief, it isn't easy to create a bitcoin.  It costs quite a bit in terms of electricity and capital. Really more than the coin itself is worth currently, which is why mining rig sales have flatlined.

On the contrary, a $100 bill costs 4 cents to print.

Anyone who can't see the difference needs to keep their money in a piggy bank--they aren't qualified to be using financial instruments of any description. Like cattle trying to operate the slaughterhouse. The results will be messy, and just plain bad for all involved.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:20 | 6248842 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

LOL!!!  And when the power goes out and the government shuts down the internet how does one access those "bits".  Yes, the government would love to see the cashless online cryptocurrency come to pass.  What happened to that "house full of silver" Tmosley?!?!?!?

I think I will sell some some bitcoin and buy a bit more physical, thank you very much.  I can always access that, regardless of the state of the powergrid or internet.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:34 | 6248945 commander gruze?
commander gruze?'s picture

Here's the problem with you people believing that "one needs to be able to access those bits floating somewhere on the internet".

No. This is not how Bitcoin network works, but I'm sick and tired trying to educate you, so just remember this: In Bitcoin, if you don't hold it*, you don't own it. Stunned yet?

* - the private keys to unlock your bitcoins.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:19 | 6248845 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

NSA would love for everyone to use cryptocurrencies...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:20 | 6248858 Fun Facts
Fun Facts's picture

"Yes, and bitcoin is the same. Contrary to popular belief, it isn't easy to create a bitcoin. It costs quite a bit in terms of electricity and capital. Really more than the coin itself is worth currently, which is why mining rig sales have flatlined."

This is true. It is the virtual equivalent of gold mining, which is why it's called bitcoin mining. A bitcoin has a production cost.

That said, bitcoin suffers from a variety of potential issues and is reliant on a working blockchain.

Gold however has no counterparty risk and cannot be hacked or disappeared.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:23 | 6248877 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

YES!!  Tmosley is back.  The question is why has this long time loudmouth asshat for physical metals suddenly having a change of heart and going all in on crypotocurrency or digital fiat?  Yes, the government would love to see eveyone putting all their wealth into digital form and would love nothing more than all commerce to be conducted in the digital world...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:05 | 6249127 Haole
Haole's picture

It is continually astounding that the staunch ZH anti-BTC league naturally assumes that anyone who holds/uses/trades Bitcoin has either no PM exposure as a rule or has sold it all to go "all in" on BTC.

It's fascinating psychology really and exposes a virtually crippling bias in such thought processes.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:51 | 6249386 tmosley
tmosley's picture

You must have a brain the size of a walnut to think that you can't own both.

My entire crypto portfolio is less than 2% of my wealth, just the same as it was two years ago.

And stop making the government out to be a God. They aren't all powerful. They're not even VERY powerful when it comes to new domains like the blockchain.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 15:07 | 6250718 malek
malek's picture

Dancing around the elephant exercises.

I am not letting the gov decide for me what to personally think.
Wake me when the average pal on the street accepts bitcoin payments, but not gold payments.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:04 | 6248757 itchy166
itchy166's picture

I paid my (Canadian) income tax bill with Bitcoin using this service: www.bylls.com .. 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:07 | 6248780 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Precisely, the bankers/financiers behind bitcoin and governments would love to see this "cashless" society become reality...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:40 | 6248985 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

There's a lot of cryptocurrencies out there.  There's only one Bitcoin!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:53 | 6249397 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

We are legion. 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:42 | 6249000 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

JPM and GS HATE Bitcoin!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:54 | 6248695 ZH Snob
ZH Snob's picture

somewhere, fonestar is satisfied and smug.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:40 | 6248990 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

fonestar is with you!  And also with you!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:14 | 6248812 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

Their nickname for Bitcoin over at JPM and GS is "Ethercoin" - just don't tell the faithful.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:42 | 6249005 Waylon Bits
Waylon Bits's picture

Why would they be happy?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:23 | 6248584 Haus-Targaryen
Haus-Targaryen's picture

*Finally* I can start unloading all these old graphics cards I've been sitting on.  

$932 for my ATI Radeon R260R.  

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:36 | 6248624 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

There you go, buy low and sell high...

same as it ever was...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:20 | 6248857 ebworthen
ebworthen's picture

LOL!  I hear you, raises hand.

A positive use is using those graphics cards to solve protein folding to help find drugs and cures for common diseases:  http://folding.stanford.edu/

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:23 | 6248585 Quintus
Quintus's picture

Just as well someone's keeping the gold/silver prices neatly capped.  Nothing to see here.

 

Only surprised they haven't been smashed to show how under control everything is.  Yet.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:44 | 6248651 chubbar
chubbar's picture

It'll be interesting to see what rabbit they pull out of their hat to unwind the open interest in Silver going into first notice later this week. They may have a timing issue with this Greek default thingy. Would love to see some shorts get it stuck up their ass finally.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:24 | 6248588 shitco.in
shitco.in's picture

Where were you, the day fiat died? http://fiatobituaries.com

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:27 | 6248598 freet0pian
freet0pian's picture

freekun Goat here D:

 

:p

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:24 | 6248590 Brazen Heist
Brazen Heist's picture

I remember how Bitcoin surged after the Cyprus fiasco...

Greece could adopt Bitcoins and write history. I believe they also have very large gold holdings that could come in handy.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:25 | 6248593 Bill of Rights
Bill of Rights's picture

Ben Bernanke: (December 2010) “I wish I'd been omniscient and seen the crisis coming.”

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:26 | 6248596 RyeWhiskey
RyeWhiskey's picture

Bitconn is a trap.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:30 | 6248608 JenkinsLane
JenkinsLane's picture

Binary fiat.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:27 | 6248599 fiftybagger
fiftybagger's picture

Just shorted the EUR/USD.  This rally is getting ridiculous now.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:27 | 6248601 franzpick
franzpick's picture

The Danse Macabre of the currencies has begun, again.  Stocks and bonds are approaching the dance floor.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:32 | 6248611 Latitude25
Latitude25's picture

Bitcoin is a bankster approved alternative so it's up.  PMs are not so they go nowhere.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:35 | 6248618 nomofiat
nomofiat's picture

may i complement you on your pretty tin foil hat

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:37 | 6248626 Latitude25
Latitude25's picture

And the fact that Blythe Masters is into btc doesn't tell you anything?  Stooge.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:53 | 6248692 tmosley
tmosley's picture

She was into gold and silver too, friend.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:56 | 6248709 Latitude25
Latitude25's picture

Yea the word is manipulation.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:19 | 6248854 Nobodys Safe
Nobodys Safe's picture

And the list of "Corporations" that are accepting it grows and grows and grows. Corporations, Corporations, Corporations been reading about Corporations some where recently, can't really remember the site because I'm blinded from all this shiny Bitcoin in my invisible hand.

Think, your brain will like it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:41 | 6248993 JustUsChickensHere
JustUsChickensHere's picture

Blythe Masters may be a crook (or not?)  ... but she is definitely smart - you do not have to like her to realise she can make a good call on future opportunities. She clearly thinks that secure blockchain based services is a major opportunity. And the most secure blockchain, by far, is Bitcoin

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:33 | 6248612 mijev
mijev's picture

BTC isn't as manipulated as gold and silver. Yet. But it gives a small indication of what would/should have happened to the PMs if fed wasn't intervening. Janet will need new CTL and P keys installed after the last couple of days. 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:34 | 6248615 sudzee
sudzee's picture

If gold is leveraged 10x on paper there could be a million tonns dumped on the market as counterparties disintegrate. You'll know when SHTF when gold takes a monster dive. 

PM certificates will be wallpaper very soon.

Physical is for holding not trading.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:35 | 6248616 all in capital
all in capital's picture

yeah what about that yellow metal? - its moment is here and pffft

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:37 | 6248625 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Physical or paper gold?  Big fucking difference.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:38 | 6248628 Quintus
Quintus's picture

And does that not tell you something about the state of the 'Market' in these metals?

Keeping the PM prices low is as important to maintaining the facade as keeping interest rates low.  Only when the Central Banks lose control completely will gold and silver react in a 'Normal' fashion to market forces. 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:39 | 6248633 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

yes, and central banks around the world, but especially in Asia are accumulating physical like crazy. do as the do, ignore what they say...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:49 | 6248674 all in capital
all in capital's picture

again it's moment is here staring it straight in the face and can only muster $10? while I believe it has a place in one's portfolio (either physical or paper) this is the kind of day/wk that it should really be shining - pun intended. 

 

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:08 | 6249178 Quintus
Quintus's picture

If the fact that gold and silver alone out of all asset classes have done NOTHING today, in the face of all that's happened, does not tell you all you need to know about how their prices are set then I don't know what will.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:39 | 6248632 dcau1
dcau1's picture

Bitcoin is fiat!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:54 | 6248701 tmosley
tmosley's picture

What central authority issues it at no cost?

None?

Then it isn't fiat, idiot.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:11 | 6248796 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

bitcoin has none of the attributes or a fiat currency.

Good luck down there wallowing in your own ignorance, I hope you manage to wake up one day.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:42 | 6248949 Haole
Haole's picture

ZH comment sections on Bitcoin threads at ZH are laughing stocks with regards to anything Bitcoin, always have been, likely always will be.

Gold is Fiat.

Gold is a Ponzi scheme.

There, I think that's a farly straightforward representation of how utterly drooling-on-one's-self retarded one looks when calling Bitcoin Fiat or a Ponzi.

BTC, BTChez.

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:39 | 6248634 FreeShitter
FreeShitter's picture

WHat's it going to take for Gold to skyrocket, daed bankers?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:55 | 6248705 Quintus
Quintus's picture

Dead Banks.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:49 | 6248671 belgtrader
belgtrader's picture

 

 

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:52 | 6248686 Latitude25
Latitude25's picture

All you BTC lovers can join this bitch in her pursuit of failure.

http://www.coindesk.com/former-jp-morgan-exec-blythe-masters-swaps-wall-...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:07 | 6248688 TheHound73
TheHound73's picture

Banks closed in Greece.  Western Union closed in Greece.  Bitcoin still works.  

Unfortunately, Bitcoin breaks if more than 5/1000th of 1% of the world actually uses it per day.  The goombahs in central control of the source code won't increase the capacity of the network.  This means it only takes 2 dudes on reddit to clog the network up.  One more little half-ass pump and then it is Selling Time!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:51 | 6249061 JustUsChickensHere
JustUsChickensHere's picture

Scaling up can and will be done ... and central control of the source code is a myth. Anyone can create full node software if they have the skillset..  You can even take the existing reference code as a starting point to roll your own.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:17 | 6249225 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

Sorry but that is incorrect.

Currently MAX_BLOCK_SIZE = 1MB , that means around 7 TPS (Transactions Per Second) , my nodes have MAX_BLOCK_SIZE=20MB , that means my nodes can handle 120 TPS , I am ready to run 1200 TPS in the near future , as the transaction volume increses , the majority of nodes will increase MAX_BLOCK_SIZE to allow for the increased transaction rate.

It won't be long before 1000 TB hard drives cost 50 bucks , if you don't beleive me ask somebody who paid 50k for a 1MB hard drive in 1979 , the size of a washing machine and required 3KW of electriciry to run it.

BTW the source code could be re-written by anybody , in fact there are already several different versions of bitcoin all written by independant programmers , as long as the code is compatible with the bitcoin blockchain then anybody can write code for it. There is no central authority.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:08 | 6249477 TheHound73
TheHound73's picture

I'll believe > 1 MB blocks when I see it.  Don't hold your breath.  The majority of the mining pools have stated they'll only feed off of what the Core Committee serves up.  Your 7 transactions per second is under ideal circumstances with the smallest transaction data size imaginable.  Real life ain't like that, more like 3 TPS tops.  Anyways 7 TPS is a still a joke of a transacation system.  

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 12:50 | 6249869 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

Yeah and I will believe modem speeds can go above 2600 baud , and computers doing graphics on my TV set in colour , when I see it. Yawn.

Wed, 07/01/2015 - 08:46 | 6248702 teutonicate
teutonicate's picture

Don't be suckered by the Bitcoin scam.  This is just another fiat, only this one is controlled by the same people that brought you Facebook, Google, etal.  You know, the companies that act as both data collection and dissemination vehicles for the cabal, and are the biggest screaming shorts on Wall Street.  Use your noodle.

If Bitcoin had a future, I wonder why Russia and China are buying up all the gold and silver - gee I guess they must not "understand" it either.

The problem with Bitcoin is not a technical one, it has to do with people's desire to have a portable and concentrated store of value that represents scarcity and utility (gold and silver are commodities that have economic value in industry as well as monetary value).  Even if Bitcoin could provide this, the world-wide acknowledgement of the portable intrinsic value that Gold and Silver represent that is NOT technologically dependent is exactly what people are seeking now.

I am not a “gold bug”.   However, I can see the forest for the trees.  World-wide, our cabalist controlled central banking systems are failing, and until confidence is restored, stores of value that have the characteristics of gold and silver are what the public (and increasingly governments world-wide) are demanding.  When confidence is restored, I may change my tune.

Bitcoin is doing exactly what PM's would be doing if they weren't being artificially suppressed by the cabal - and if you think they can continue to do it under the pressures that we are about to experience, you are probably either a cabalist yourself or delusional.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:55 | 6248703 thinkmoretalkless
thinkmoretalkless's picture

Turned on CNBC to check data and they are interviewing some Jazz artist who is pissed because he isn't getting enough of his cut. What next Miss America going tranny?

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:11 | 6248797 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

You would first have to get past the local Miss America pagaents -- but I could see some radical state organization passing a tranny throughm-- especially with Trump having a hand in pagaents!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 08:55 | 6248704 samsara
samsara's picture

Running from one Electronic currency to another.

An internet access to Bitcoin is an ATM by another name.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:10 | 6248792 Arnold
Arnold's picture

Less fungible.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:39 | 6248983 commander gruze?
commander gruze?'s picture

Fun fact #275: Bitcoin does not need the Internet to operate. Bitcoin transaction can go peer-to-peer over bluetooth, NFC, or be scribbled on the papper if needs be.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 15:11 | 6250742 malek
malek's picture

And the verification (by the buyer) that the same bitcoin hasn't already been spent then goes by... sifting through piles of scribbled paper pieces?

Tue, 06/30/2015 - 03:49 | 6253121 commander gruze?
commander gruze?'s picture

If you can exchange the backlog of blocks via bluetooth, there is no need to verify them on the network. Just re-do the hashing on your own and see if hash matches the block. Then you can trust the blockchain as it's proovably correct.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:03 | 6248752 jimfcarroll
jimfcarroll's picture

This is just speculators betting on another Cyprus like surge.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:04 | 6248759 meistergedanken
meistergedanken's picture

Anyone know what happened to that douchebag Fonestar?   I bet he is creaming his panties today.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:08 | 6248781 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

BitCoin needs to be regulated -- let's put it under COMEX just like the barbarous relic....

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:14 | 6248810 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

It was tough finding 90% last week -- it is even worse this week.  Premiums in the high $3 to over $4 an ounce, and lots of stuff marked as out of stock.  Its either hard to find (the buy prices suck out there), or the dealers are hanging on in hopes of a Greek price pop.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:15 | 6248819 The Shodge
The Shodge's picture

Don't trust digital buttcoin, ALWAYS ask for physical BTC. If they can't deliver with whatever BS excuse: fuck 'm.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 12:40 | 6249887 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

buttcoin ? Sounds like another dodgy Alt Coin to me , steer clear..

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:17 | 6248840 Ms No
Ms No's picture

Bitcoin is fiat but it is interesting to watch because it behaves differently than gold at times which is a tell in itself.  The kitco bitcoin boards are a mess to read.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:02 | 6249437 ultraticum
ultraticum's picture

Definition of fiat is below, FYI.  Sad, the pathetic level of understanding of Bitcoin displayed by otherwise usually coherent posters on this thread.  Open source, competitive, deflationary, trust-less, ALTERNATIVE to fiat is more like it.  The originators of Bitcoin were unequivocally hard money and anti-fiat; and that is the overwhelming philosophy of most of the present-day users and supporters of Bitcoin.  If the State begins to try to get its mitts on Bitcoin, believe me, a free-market fork will take over.  Even the goon squad knows this, which is why they haven't (really) tried to ban it outright yet.

fi·at ?f??t,?f??ät/ noun noun: fiat; plural noun: fiats
  1. a formal authorization or proposition; a decree.


    "adopting a legislative review program, rather than trying to regulate by fiat"

    synonyms: decree, edict, order, command, commandment, injunction, proclamation, mandate, dictum, diktat

    "a political union imposed through imperial fiat"

    • an arbitrary order.


      "the appraisal dropped the value from $75,000 to $15,000, rendering it worthless by bureaucratic fiat"

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 09:22 | 6248871 GoldSilverBitcoinBug
GoldSilverBitcoinBug's picture

A lot of people know nothing about BTC, money and even PM's in this thread, what a mess...

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:28 | 6249262 IndianaJohn
IndianaJohn's picture

At first glance, I thought that Fiat had introduced a new model.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:28 | 6249264 q99x2
q99x2's picture

Bringing in the thieves. Bringing in the thieves. We will come rejoicing bringing in the thieves.

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 10:59 | 6249420 Lex_Luthor
Lex_Luthor's picture

Yes, because bitcoin is a fucking bubble and nothing more. It was created out of nothing, it produces nothing, it exchanges nothing, it does not possess military. It's a fucking fiction that dissapears as soon as the internet is shut down. Blockchain is a joke and so are the bitcoin speculators who don't really give a shit about freedom and all the other Max Kaiser and DaVinci bullshit. It's all about a fucking GREED for $$$ and you've all been duped by the promotors and now you promote it further to find enough fools to hold the bag for you. Tic-tac for bitcoin and all the moronic bitcoin johnny-come-lately community. BC Max Keiser&Co. pushers are LONG gone @$1,200!

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 13:01 | 6250013 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

1200 will look really cheap in a couple of years time....

Mon, 06/29/2015 - 11:52 | 6249673 Zorrohodge
Zorrohodge's picture

Bitcoin discounters:

If you could take the worlds 500 fastest and most powerful supercomputers and combine their power, then multiply that by 10 would it be worth something?

Well that's how powerful the Bitcoin decentralised network of nerds joining their processing power is.

That fact changed my skepticism.

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