This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
The Mood On The Ground In Greece: "Some Have Raised The Prospect Of Civil War"
Earlier today, John O'Connell, CEO of Davis Rea, spoke to Canada's BNN from what may be Greece's top tourist attraction, the island of Santorini, to give a sense of the "mood on the ground." Not surprisingly, his feedback was that, at least as far as tourists are concerned, nobody is worried. After all, it is not their funds that are capital constrained plus should the Drachma return as the local currency, the purchasing power of foreigners will skyrocket.
What he did point out, however, that was quite notable is the diametrically opposing views between old and young Greeks when it comes to Grexit. According to O'Connell, "the old people want to vote for Europe cause they have a lot to lose, they have their pensions, but the younger population - they are already poor, they are already unemployed - and they don't have much to lose. Their attitude is it's going to be tough, it's already tough, and so why not just move on go back to the Drachma, and they're ok with that. Their attitude is in 5 to 10 years I'll be better off. They believe there's a lot of misinformation. They believe they're being pressured by European countries particularly Germany that are holding them to very difficult terms."
He continues: "whatever the polls may way, the young population is going to vote to leave the Euro and deal with the problems long-term."
Finally, his take on capital controls and tourism: "You are going to see a big, big drop off in tourism because people are not going to want to come here. People are going to worry that if people do come here with a lot of Euro, are they going to be allowed to leave with those Euros. It's going to have a dramatic impact on the Greek economy at some point, a lot of the people that live here are underestimating how bad it could get in the short term."
The punchline:
There have been some people that worry that the military may actually get involved. It wouldn't surprise me - there are some people in Greece that have raised the whole prospect of potential civil war.
Who would benefit the most from a Greek civil war? Why the biggest exporter of weapons in the world, of course: the United States.
So dear Greeks: please avoid Kiev-style, CIA-inspired "Maidan type" provocations. The US military industrial complex is wealthy enough without your help.
Full video after the jump.
»
- 95055 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -
Did you have to put jews and blacks together? just askin
Some may have noticed I'm less involved here. I read articles, but the cavalcade of hate and blame lessens the message. It puts readers off.
I agree with other posters who say this seems like invitation for a coup and control by MIC CIA et al.
Since when has pointing out the perps - who are wilfully destroying the planet - been a "cavalcade of hate"?
Methinks thou doeth protest too much.
We KNOW what the "real info" is.
So don't go trying to confuse the issue by throwing "blacks" - as you call them - into the mix and conflating them with bankers!
You didnt seriously think you could get away with that one, did you?
Why don't you contribute .... that which your missing .... instead of whining ?
" there are some people in Greece that have raised the whole prospect of potential civil war."
And there are more than "some" people in Greece, that are certain you are a dumb fuck ass licking cia agent cunthole.
BNN is that thee Bullshit News Network. Soon to carry the same theme by the CIA News Network and National Pentagon Radio
These insidious stories are psy ops plants to foam the runway for a military coup to "preserve order "
Younger folks should read up on the Greeks vs the NAZIs in WW2, ELAM/ELAS, the communist resistance, Churchill wanted the King back on the throne; it was an OSS/SOE playground with a lot of dead Greeks and Krauts.
This civil war stuff is no joking matter.
Stalin and Churchill divided up spheres of influence...Stalin got the entire southeastern (Bulgaria, Yugoslavia, Czechoslovakia) part of Europe and Churchill got Greece.
It is not only a civil war between young and old -- when the debt bomb blows up the war will be global - between those that take and those that give. We are not far from it now -- and the people paying taxes will no longer outnumber those collecting benefits. THAT will be the real war.
Civil war my a$$ between young people and pensioners. More sensationalist nonsense. The reason you haven't seen more unrest though by the youth especially those under 30 is that those that had any kind of prospects aboard have left whether for several places on the continent (may Germany and the UK) but also Canada, US, and Australia since '08 in large numbers. Nothing new in Greek history including since the end of WW2.
Well, in a previous article, GS already showed their hand when they said (About the future of Greece), "likely involving a realignment of domestic politics in Greece and potentially a new government."
Interesting also that Greece has actually been increasing military spending during the entire debt crisis. I can't admit to understanding what seems on the surface like batshit crazy policies from, well, EVERY government involved, especially the US State Dept., whose zionist/neocon Vicky Nuland must be rubbing her hands in glee at the prospect of unleashing her zionazis in Athens again, but the prospect of a coup to oust Tsipras was widely discussed ever since he was elected and started opening his mouth to shock the global bankster establishment.
Eat their young .... no, the young will eat the old .... stew meat, mostly !
Ehow do you pronounce Soylent Green in Greek?
Just because the Colonels will come back to power, this does not necessarily mean that their will be a civil war.
Time to put Costa Gravaz' Z in my Netflix queue
I was just talking with my neighbor over the back fence, and he commented about this situation. He said: "Every last one of those fucking Greek bums have never worked a day in their lives and they deserve every last fucking thing thats comin' to em! Every last fucking one of those lazy bastards.'"
So I asked him... 'Wait a minute. Are you talking shit about Greece, or somewhere else?"
so
Does anybody actually know how much the CIA has invested in the Greek military?
What a scabby shoddy bit of propaganda.
From a CEO of course.
He contradicts himself blatantly.
First
'should the Drachma return as the local currency, the purchasing power of foreigners will skyrocket.'
Then
'You are going to see a big, big drop off in tourism because people are not going to want to come here.
How did this creep ever get to run a company?.
If foreign cash is going to skyroclet = so will the people spending it.
Greece will become a tourist paradise.
It will also attract those who want to help it get on its feet - I know family and friends positively planning to go and holiday if there is grexit.
Civil war? Bah. With what weapons?
civil war
That's called a "cavalry is coming" rumor, designed to keep the losers in their positions for a few more days.
FIRE FIRE FIRE!
(as shouted in a crowded theatre)
"It wouldn't surprise me - there are some people in Greece that have raised the whole prospect of potential civil war."
FU
single track mind
investment counselor.
since when do people like this know what is going on
they're too busy trying to *uck their clients
"opposing views between old and young Greeks"
"It wouldn't surprise me - there are some people in Greece that have raised the whole prospect of potential civil war"
"Who would benefit the most from a Greek civil war? Why the biggest exporter of weapons in the world, of course: the United States.
So dear Greeks: please avoid Kiev-style, CIA-inspired "Maidan type" provocations. The US military industrial complex is wealthy enough without your help."
Who would fight in this "civil war"? Old people with young people?! And US would supply weapons to old people?
That is completely lunatic message from ZH side but that is what putin regime propaganda is about - lunatic view on world. So that reality would look false and idiotic lunatic view would look real. Many of those who lived under putin regime propaganda including those who follow ZH seriously - are thinking in lunatic way.
They can't differentiate reality from complete nonsense.
Once again ZH has proved to be putin regime propaganda channel.
yes every alternate news media reporting facts and truth is putin propaganda channel . nnow go fuck yourself asylum seeker . CIA should feel lucky in completely balkanizing lowlife baltic scums like you . hahaha . fuck off kike !
And that is all you little putin puppy are capable of? That just pathetic.
Now bark you puppy! BARK!
:D HA HA HA
The US already has a civil war.
As Warren Buffett has said "His class has gone to war and they are winning"
Thought I don't rate the chances of the the 0.01% against the 99.99% in the long term.
There is nothing civil about civil war in my mind.
I smell bullshit
Jesus..who writes this shite? Military coup takeover civil war favours US weapons dealers? Are you farging kidding me? On whose credit will General Zorba by anything with, you stoopid fack. Editors edit!
Jesus..who writes this shite? Military coup takeover civil war favours US weapons dealers? Are you farging kidding me? On whose credit will General Zorba by anything with, you stoopid fack. Editors edit!
That what happen man when putin regime propaganda is working.
Complete idiocy.
Dear "viedoklis_lv":
Why do you twist and turn to drag Putin into the Greek chaos? He is not responsible for it and has not been involved in it. He is merely a bystander.
putin regime didn't made Greek debt crisis, but putin regime propaganda sure is using it to create more lies and manipulation in order to discredit EU and it's allies. And does it in lunatic way like:
"there will be civil war", "young people VS old people", "US will supply weapons", "EURO is collapsing" etc.
Complete idiocy - but that is what putin regime does in it's propaganda. Just count articles in ZH. There is no neutrality and objectivity. Majority is about how US, EU, NATO is "collapsing" and putin regime and Russia rising. When in reality RUB is crashing, regions in Russia are running out of money, fascism is rising in Russia, corruption is rising in Russia, civil rights is removed in Russia, etc.
So according to you "John O'Connell, CEO of Davis Rea" is a Russian propagandist. Good luck with that line of debate.
As for ZH, it represents a particular thread of Western opinion, a thread which I fully support since it supports free markets, less government, personal freedom and all that good stuff which I know is the only way to success and prosperity. In my experience it aims to inform readers of what is really going on in the world, that's different to the lies and propaganda that spews out of our Western MSM channels 24x7.
Your view of Putin is not new, I am sure that ZH readers know very well that Putin is no angel. But the part you choose to ignore is that our Western leaders are just as bad, often far worse. The West is now being run by criminal elites, fraudsters and assorted corporate oligarchs. IOW: Fascists. It's exactly as I predicted in the early 1990s.
You ought to wise up and read a few essays from Brandon Smith over on http://www.alt-market.com/. He represents my views perfectly: a true libertarian thinker.
Have A Nice Day
Where are your posts when putin regime lies and manipulates it's citizens using it's full control over major main stream media in Russia?
Ridiculous lie on Russian TV: a child was crucified in Ukraine.
Ukrainian “punishers” are fighting to get slaves, - new portion of bullshit from Russian TV.As you can see - above - putin regime propaganda invents lies materials in most bizzard way. No facts, no proof - nothing - simply to generate hatred against Ukranians and to manipulate with viewers. These are only some examples. But such are common everyday in Russia.
But if you understand russian you would understand this:
https://youtu.be/iOdZLc-ulHs
https://youtu.be/p4-__Sb4DIc
Where are your posts when putin regime corrupt elite steals money from russian citizens?
https://news.vice.com/article/russia-awards-lucrative-crimea-bridge-cont...
You and ZH are blind to putin regime lies, crimes, aggresion, corruption. Post some idiotic, mainly invented, twisted topics to please putin regime propaganda. And that is reality.
P.S. I dodn't see John O'Connell saying that in Ukraine was CIA coup or that US would be interested in civil war in Greece in order to supply weapons. But ZH owners is producing that lie & manipulation propaganda.
"Where are your posts when putin regime lies and manipulates it's citizens using it's full control over major main stream media in Russia?"
I don't make such posts. Either I don't know about the incidents you refer to or they're nothing to do with me anyway. Generally, I do not see it as the role of the West to intervene (or meddle more likely) in the domestic affairs of other nations on fake pretexts of bringing democracy. The Libyan Colonel Ghadaffi was an asshole but who gave the West/NATO the authority to bomb him and his country to pieces and kill him? That has left Libya in civil war.
Meddling in the affairs of other nations rarely ends well.
As I said previously, I do not take the view that Putin is some sort of angel but it's not my business, it's for Russian people. What MY government does IS my business. There's the difference.
You would do well to leave Russia/Putin alone. If a hot war breaks out, Latvia will be high on the list of countries that disappears.
Right now Latvia is being used as a forward position by the West as it was used by the USSR. What's the difference?
When putin regime turns Russia as Hitler turned Germany into fascist state where is produced hate against other nations as Georgia, Ukraine etc. where than Russian citizens lived under this hate and war propaganda join terrorist groups and start invading other countries like it's now in Ukraine - its not anymore only Russia internal issue. Isn't it?
BTW Russia as member of UN Security Council did NOT veto Resolution 1973 which led to attack on Libya.
zh needs to nan your ip address latvian troll . Scum like you are suffering from rusdophobia : once you get infected , it becomes incurable . Your brain is similar to a maghots brain . You should consider yourself lucky douchebag that tyler hasnt banned your fourth profile . Keep on blabbering troll no one gives a damn fuck on us coa propaganda . Suck it idiot dumbfuckon !
Ahhh my trusty slimy putins puppie is here. How are you little feller? Did you pissed your self again? Wanted to make some bark? Well!? What are you waiting for?
BARK! I said: BARK! just like those other putin puppie like stoogie etc.
Don't just stand there and shit your self but BARK!
:D you are so predictable
ha ha ha
You really have no idea what the hell is going on in the finacial world on a global scale do you. There is a all out finacial war starting up, if not already in full swing, and you think they are just calling each other names? Right now the good ole USA is in the fight for its finacial suvival. This Greece thing is just one shot in a large battle. So while you may think the headlines are drama....really...not so much.
Surely the older people are the ones that remember that they weren't so badly off before they joined the EU?
I remember too. Loads of jobs, wages with real purchasing power, affordable homes, affordable cars, affordable food, affordable drink, affordable smokes, affordable water, affordable electricity, affordable fuel. No criminally insane petty tyrant wannabe's getting in everyone's face either.
With such high unemployment among the young, who is looking after them?
Why older people, of course. Parents, grandparents, uncles, aunts. Who are the People in the Greek Military? Why Greek family members, of course!
No matter how old you are, no matter where you live, no matter what you do for a living, at least 85% of the people in your Country aren't the problem. The ones that are the problem are turning the 85%+ against each other, in the attempt to protect their own asses.
Well I for one think the mileage in that sort of nonsense, has just run out, and Greece is important in that, because it is one of the canaries in the coal mine, and ALL of them are tweeting as they fall off the perch. If the People of Greece can't clearly see the iron fist in the velvet glove by now, they need to wake TFU! If all the People outside of Greece can't clearly see that iron fist in the velvet glove as well, and that it's attention will be turned on them as soon as it has finished with Greece, then they need to wake TFU too.
We either hang together, or we will surely hang apart.
Civil war? Ha! That's rich. These are the same people that didn't get off their asses and prepare when they had notice months in advance.
New John Carpenter movie: Escape from Athens.
it's good to read articles like this at ZH - I tend to respect you too much and this keeps me in check.
excusive me civil war against whom ?
Tsipras said he is ready to leave if people vote in support of Troika austerity
If people vote against Troike then it is not civil war but war for independence from greece creditors that would break out
erm. Methinks he refers to the huge split in Greek society between generations. Older Greeks want to stick with the EU & EZ but dump austerity. Younger Greeks want to dump the whole lot and return to Greek sovereignty. Fat chance under the political regime in Greece.
That said, I doubt it will result in actual civil war. Grannies with Glocks and AR15s just doesn't ring it for me.
"Your Banker Needs You! Do Your Part! Recover The Debt!
"Sign Up for - or Sponsor* - Lloyd Blankfein 's Expeditionary Brigade To Greece Today!"
(*Easy Term (39.275% APR) Financing Available. )
It was the EU that wanted to curb Greece's defence budget, not Tsipras. If anything they will align with the government.
So it's gonna be "Greek Grannies vs "Greek Yobbos".
The worrying thing missing from the Greek debate is that one of the major reasons Greeks voted to become part of the EU is because they were sick and tired of the country being run by criminal political elites who have long had their hands in the till. Socialists like Venizelos et al.
Today, we see older people wanting to stick with the EU because they know what it was like before, whereas inexperienced young people essentially want to exit the EU and return to those halcyon days of national sovereignty. ho-ho.
But unless they retake control of their political system and purge it of the corruption, things will unlikely get much better. Greece will simply return to an isolated country run by criminals and oligarchs.
Egypt was an example of that. After civil unrest leading to the dumping of Mubarek, they voted in Morsi, who turned out to be no better, perhaps worse and he has had to be dumped.
Civil war?!? Just cull the right people! You know, the Satanically evil, hooked nose, beanie wearing ones behind it all!
Fuck the BIS, IMF, ECB, FED.
Instead of cutting lagardes, bernakes, yellens and fisher heads, strip them of clothings and put them in a zoo!
Beware children, its a bankster. Make sure their greedy hands dont get you if you get too close.
EWWWW I dont want to see any of them naked....but I agree iwth the first sentence.
Sorry but I don't get it. Why coutries like Bulgaria, Romania, Czech, Slovakia, Poland, Lithuania etc. can have average salary on the level ~800 EUR, while Greece retirements are abt. 1500 EUR, salaries have plenty of additional benefits, 13-th salary, 14th salary and they can get additional help each year without paying taxes (most Greeks don't pay at all... see their buildings, they are not finished in majority to avoid paying any property tax). No recepits when coming to hotels. Time for "siesta" each day. I really don't get it.
Kick them out of EU, then they will be able to start to live on their own, not on permanent help. This will be better either for them (finally they will live according to their work quality, and be able to pay their debts in predictable time horizon) and for the rest (paying for country that want to remain status quo is very annoying for the rest that receives nothing...)
LIAR!
Nowhere near 1500 the Greek pensions,greek workers and public servants are paying taxes 'cause the can not hide their incomes.
Private sector is tax evading.The Greek debt is result of greek polititians worked together with european corrupted polititians and corrupted europeanand us weapon selling companies.
The fault is not of the Greek people,we are no sovereign country every damn polititian and partie is puppet of Germany and US.
Actually, you are the liar here. The Greek debt has come from profligate SPENDING. Greek government employees saw their salaries DOUBLE after the first bailout. No meaningful reforms or attempts to become productive people have come about in over five years. So, what have the Greek people done? They elected communist rabble rousers to try and weasel out of their debts, instead of rolling up their sleaves to work toward buildng a better country. Greeks deserve nothing but SHAME.
I bet that you live in Greece like me and you have your info direct from the source and not the western media.
My income was reduced from about 21.000 euros to 16.000
And i do not wright BS like all you accusers of Greek people, HERE are the facts proved not BS writing
from Panhellenic Federation of Public Hospital Workers,on the left pre austerity salaries.on the right austerity salaries
The salaries are REDUCED for college and university graduate workers about 340 euros.
http://www.poedhn.gr/anakoinoseis/item/download/521_10ad5ab1b750eb0d53c6...
And for the military personel,left column is before right column is after,1st column on the left are the ranks (with yellow second lieutenant).
http://www.bloko.gr/enoples-dynameis/aytoi-einai-oi-neoi-basikoi-misthoi...
The amounts are GROSS.
There are greek people in every european country and every other continent,i guess they are not working and you pay them for free,thats what greeks do isn't it?
Be my guest LIAR!!!!
I can see it now.
NATO warplanes attacking suspected Greek rebel strongholds.
After all, an attack on one NATO natio is an attack on all.
The whole EU project is ego driven... no different to every war (hot, cold or financial) that has ever been fought... what amazes me is how the bullshit continues on in this Fiat currency, nothing is as it seems, upside down world.. Maybe the whole thing is a game/matrix of deception and the people are in a deeper sleep that we on ZH realise.
Regardless, I believe I woke from that sleep a year ago, got an alternative education on ZH and consequently got into gold bullion and now I want to give something back.
For those of you not actually in the physical metal .. I can highly recommend it.. because no matter what goes on in the EU Punch and Judy show... my stress levels reduced 90% knowing I have some bullion.
You might think I'm just spamming, but I'm not... I'm deadly serious! I got involved in a German company called Karatbars International who produce Gold Bullion in small weights and boy am I glad on so many levels.
They developed an incredibly lucrative affiliate marketing system to get their product to market... Its free to join at the basic level although if you decided to go all in to earn the highest commissions the buy in price is essentially peanuts... FFS my day job Personal Indemnity insurance costs more per month!!
The downside is it's more a mass education programme than marketing,,, because aside from ZeroHedgers the financial IQ out there is well down the trickle down economic cascade and those people need to be educated to get some AU!
I know there are lots of you out there that would love to get your hands on bullion and get the money to acquire it from actually helping some of the lambs lined up for the slaughter - We could actually be doing something worthwhile.
Check out my website www.teamramgold.com its only a simple website to give a snapshot of the programme, but feel free to get in contact with me and I'll show you an incredible system. It could be the most lucrative email you will ever write..
And yes OK I am pitching (a bit) but if you get the programme you will understand why.. I'm a capitalist but with a social conscience.
www.teamramgold.com
While I agree with your stand on physical metal....you are in fact spamming.
SWEET LOVE OF JESUS...that may be one of the biggest loads of crap I have read in a long long time. Really? The U.S. government is going to make all this huge cash by selling weapons to the Greeks? hahahahahhahahahhahaha THEY HAVE NO MONEY A-HOLE....
However, I do agree with the younger folks. Greece needs to default and get out of the Euro ASAP. In the long term, heck even in the short term, they will be better off. The old folks will still get their pensions, they will just be paid in Drachma instead of Euros. Times are going to be tough either way. So why suffer under the whip of the EU for the next 50 years at least? Regain your soveriegnty and restart your economy. I suspect the pain will be no worse than the other route and will certainly last for a much shorter time. But if nothing else, you get to decide your own pain. Not some idiot in Germany who does not care if you starve in the streets.
The US taxpayers give money to the Greek government who buy weapons from the US Military Industrial Complex. Then the Greek government are encouraged to kill their own people with the bought weapons. Same as always. Try and keep up.
I was on holiday last week in Greece. Apart from some shops closed and people complaining that the tourists are not coming, you could not notice much from the crisis. Terraces full of people. Young Greek enjoying a Friday night downtown. But there were more military exercises than usual I thought. They always have routine exercises and patrols but the ones I saw were prolonged. Fighter jets patrolling the sky in combination with Apache helicopters flying over the shores and bays. But this time they also flew over the villages and I thought it was unusual. People complained about it. Is it just flexing muscles to show to Turkey that Greece's military is not weak? (although where I was was nowhere close to Turkey). Or the military warning the government? Military men and women are conservative and think they are the defenders of the motherland.
Anyway, the Greek should be careful of any form of incident involving a minority which might render 'humanitarian intervention'.
We need a Civil War here in Michigan too, damn! I cn't wait.
Be ruthless, people.
I expect the opposite is true. Greece out of the Euro will become a tourist magnet. It will be THE destination in Europe for a cheap vacation. Goods imported into Greece will be more expensive, e.g. BMWs. There will be a demand for goods produced in Greece as opposed to imported goods which will be positive. There will be an economic expansion caused by the explosion of the tourist industry. The young people are correct.
And I thought the statement in the article was somewhat crazy about the tourist might be afraid about not being able to leave with their Euros. I thought the whole idea of the local population was not to let any tourist visiting anywhere leave with that extra dime if possible.
BS current generations are smarter than the ones who fought each other in the '46 civil war.
Now we know who the enemy is,the BANKSTERS.
Drop off in tourism?? Maybe. But the Chinese and Russia are very smart at picking debrits in bargain bin price. Watch this space.
The elder Grecian Folks have millstones around the necks of their children.
“they have their pensions, but the younger population - they are already poor, they are already unemployed”.
A young Grecian probably has to work and pay into "The Fund" years to pay for one used hip replacement on an elder Grecian.
This has been the work of Dr.Evil.
After coming up with a dozen or so plans that have failed,
this final plan will become known as "Grecian Formula 16".
Muahaha-hahaha!
A civil war would be a nightmare scenario for EMU and EU. Their orchestrating a military coup would explode unrest in the rest of the Southern flank with much more severe implications than gains would be. Letting the leftists to win is similarly a dead end with Greece cutting ties with EU and leaving NATO.
It is now a catch 22.
When the choice is civil war or get looted by a mob, the war has already begun.
For the US weapon's makers to actually profit from a Greek civil war, they must have some reasonable expectation of being PAID. Wars are expensive, Greeks are broke and don't repay their debts.
"Revolutionaries" don't pay for their stuff; it's all donated by the government that is supporting them, after said government buys it from the arms makers.
Civil War lol. Get real people.
The U.S. has a bunch of stars n' bars flags laying around from the civil war.
Lately they have become unpopular with certain populations.
We could sell them to one side or the other in Greece and attach new hatreds
to the flags thereby eliminating racism in America once and for all.
Killing two birds with one stone.
Pay for the pensions with taxes? Greeks would be better off eliminating taxes which can't be collected because every transaction is prefered in cash. The old people need to take one for the team.
Fire up the ovens! Soaps and Lampshades for everyone!