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Greeks Turn To Bitcoin To Dodge Capital Controls
There is at least one legal way to get your euros out of Greece these days, to guard against the prospect that they might be devalued into drachmas: convert them into bitcoin. As Reuters reports, although absolute figures are hard to come by, Greek interest has surged in the online "cryptocurrency", as new customers depositing at least 50 euros with BTCGreece, the only Greece-based bitcoin exchange, open only to Greeks, rose by 400% between May and June.
Using bitcoin could allow Greeks to do one of the things that capital controls were put in place this week to prevent: transfer money out of their bank accounts and, if they wish, out of the country.
"When people are trying to move money out of the country and the state is stopping that from taking place, bitcoin is the only way to move any value," said Adam Vaziri, a board member of the UK Digital Currency Association.
"There aren't any other options unless you buy diamonds, and that's very difficult to move."
But Marinos said the bitcoin buyers' main aim was to shield their money against the prospect that Greece might leave the euro zone and convert all the deposits in Greek banks into a greatly devalued national currency. If voters reject the demands of international creditors in a referendum on Sunday, this becomes much more likely.
"A lot of people are keeping all the bitcoins they buy on our platform, until they understand what to do with them," Marinos said. "In their eyes, now they have bitcoins, they're safe."
* * *
With Bitcoin having surged from $238 to $268 in the last few days since Greek PM Tsipras announced Greferendum, it is clear it's not just the Greeks that are losing faith in faith-based fiat currencies.
Ironically, on June 20, Greece got its first bitcoin "ATM", in a family-run bookstore in Acharnes on the outskirts of Athens.
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What is value then?
Define and explain the difference between direct and indirect value.
If you store something in another medium than what it started as it is an indirect store. If you store it in the same that is a surplus/excess or direct store. Now explain how gold is a direct store of anything but gold.
AUD/USD
http://www.xe.com/currencycharts/?from=AUD&to=USD
No need to cut if this keeps up, and looking at the data ... oh dear ;-)
And let's suppose a stack of Chinese hot-money gets pulled away from Australian RE spending and prices quickly develop a softer floor.
Bitcon doesn't get your Euros out of Greece, all it does is trade them with someone in Greece for Bitcoins, the Euros you trade remain in Greece in the hands of whoever you just sold them to. It's just an illusion.
No , it does not get your Euro's out of Greece , it will allow you to transfer value across a border , by purchasing bitcoins on one side of the border with your Euro's and then purchasing Euros back on the other side of the border. Thus avoiding capital controls. You really don't understand that ?
http://shitco.in/2015/07/02/underlying-fomo-creative-thinking-ltc-pump/
If this really added buying pressure to Bitcoin it certainly didn't add much compared to other times bitcoin went up.
Wait till the whole fucking world piles in tryimg to get out of their (insert favorite) currency.
Too bad one can not use PayPal to buy Bitcoin. I mean, if you are 'linking a bank', and you already have a PayPal account...never mind. Do the Bitcoin machines, give you a 'coin' with your wallet address imbedded in it?
Just one to have. It's not like the current rate is going to break anyone for just one 'to have'. That's like living in Oregon and still scared to smoke marijuana, at home. I made up a 'skit'.
911: This is 911 emergency, is this an emergency?
Caller: YES!! I SMELL MARIJUANA SMOKE!!!
911: Hello? Are you in Portland??
Caller: YES, I AM IN PORTLAND!
911: Hello? If you are in Portland, marijuana is legal to use at home now.
Caller: YES, ISN'T IT NICE!!
Try that with Gold sorry I have nothing against PM's it's apart of my basket.
Anyway, try to evade your money from government control or pass it through those imaginary line on the map without getting stolen by Govt.
You can't do that with physical money with digital one it's easy as breathing...
Digital fiat! .....as good as (paper)....gold....that'll work for sure.
Bitcoin is not FIAT!
"DEFINITION of 'Fiat Money' Currency that a government has declared to be legal tender, but is not backed by a physical commodity."
Bitcoin is a new form of money.
GOD the serfs are still out in crowds celebrating Gay Marraige, here in my town-too bad when the dream shatters
For the few ZH retards who are not completely hopeless, recommended reading:
http://unenumerated.blogspot.com/2015/07/the-greek-financial-mess-and-so...
Blythe Masters and her previous employer the Morgue are manipulating the bitcoin price apparently. It has flatlined just like gold.
The difference is that bitcoin has the thing called blockchain, which is transparent and uncorruptible. Price manipulation is unsustainable if the demand grows and coin distribution improves. People only have to buy small fractions of a btc to reach that.
It's more absolute than gold will ever be.
The price only reflects the growing pains of the ecosystem while it's being built, if anything it flatlined because the people don't know what is bitcoin and why it's good for them, hence most don't diversify into it.
The price only reflects the growing pains of the ecosystem while it's being built,
No it doesn't. The price (changes) reflect the imbalance between supply and demand for the Bitcoins themselves. They don't reflect the price of the objects being exchanged. They don't reflect the value of the reference Medium of Exchange (MOE ... e.g. dollars or euros or gold or pork bellies). This is why Bitcoins are obviously "not" money.
Money enables simple barter over time and space. Money is "a promise to complete a trade". It is created by traders making and certifying promises. It is destroyed by traders delivering on those promises. DEFAULTed promise certificates are immediately recovered through INTEREST collections. Supply and demand for a properly managed MOE are always in perfect balance ... it's the nature of a trade.
Since Bitcoins have a well known built-in limit, they can never balance supply and demand for themselves. Thus, there is no way Bitcoins can serve as a properly managed MOE, governed by the relation: INFLATION = DEFAULT - INTEREST = zero.
Bitcoins can only DEFLATE ... unless confronted by competition from a properly managed MOE. In that case, they quickly INFLATE to infinity "as the ecosystem recognizes the hoax and matures".
Waiting to see your MOE, bro.
Waiting to see your MOE, bro.
Anyone (group) can create an MOE ... just like anyone (group) can create an insurance company. The "mutual" insurance company is a near perfect model.
But first, everyone must come to understand what money really is, always has been, and always will be: "a certified promise to complete a trade". Anything else is just masquerading as money and is a hoax.
Yay another shitcoin article to feed the fonestar trolls
fonestar is with you!
The value of Bitcoin doesn’t change. The value of Bitcoin is static.
The value of the dollar is what you see changing as reflected in Bitcoin.
new customers depositing at least 50 euros with BTCGreece, the only Greece-based bitcoin exchange, open only to Greeks, rose by 400% between May and June. With Bitcoin having surged from $238 to $268 in the last few days since Greek PM Tsipras announced Greferendum, it is clear it's not just the Greeks that are losing faith in faith-based fiat currencies.
This is proof positive that Bitcoins "are not money". Money, "certified trading promises" created by traders, aways perfectly balances supply and demand ... it's the nature of a trade. Here we have an example of something (Bitcoin) that claims to be a new kind of money. But we see supply and demand are not in perfect balance. The measurement is against dollars in this reference ... not anything Greek. If Bitcoins were money, they would not be changing their value in the face of this Greek incident. We're not seeing a devaluation of the dollar here ... we're seeing a scramble to protect wealth from theft.
And this isn't about so-called "faith based fiat currencies". It's about proper management of a Medium of Exchange (MOE). No one talks about "faith based risk coverage" or "fiat insurance policies" when they talk about insurance. The process of insuring risk is well known and totally open. There are public and private implementations which coexist (well, actually the private version is advanced fascism ... but needn't be). It's an actuarial process. Proper management of any MOE is no different. INTEREST is to PREMIUMs as DEFAULTs are to CLAIMS.
The dollar is "not" a properly managed MOE. The Euro is "not" a properly managed MOE. The Fed is "not" a proper MOE manager. The ECB is "not" a proper MOE manager. The IMF does not exhibit proper MOE management behavior. The EMI does not exhibit proper MOE management behavior. All are tools of the international bankers' farming operation.
The governing relation of a properly managed MOE is:
INFLATION = DEFAULT - INTEREST = zero
Install a properly managed MOE (it can coexist with our current improper one) and all mismanaged MOEs (and their governments) will wilt on the vine.