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Utter Desperation: Chinese Police Vow To Arrest "Malicious Short Sellers"
In what can only be described as total and utter desperation, China's Public Security Ministry and China Securities Regulatory Commission are discussing a plan to take action against "hostile short sellers"... (via Google Translate)
[ Ministry of Public Security in conjunction with the recent Commission investigation of malicious short stock and stock index clues ] correspondent was informed on the 9th morning , Vice Minister of Public Security Meng Qingfeng led to the Commission , in conjunction with the recent Commission investigation of malicious short stock and stock index clues show regulatory authorities to the operation of heavy combat illegal activities .
Which in English means...
Special workforce to be led by Vice Public Security Minister who vows to soon nail down those who manipulate Chinese stocks, index futures
— George Chen (@george_chen) July 9, 2015
However, it appears thety are going to need to do more...
* * *
Just one question: Will the police also arrest the brokers who allowed their clients to lever up to extremes with no awareness of risk, encouraged by the government, buying the stocks of companies that make plastic umbrellas at x-thousand P/E multiples?
* * *
I didn't sell. I swear I didn't!!!! pic.twitter.com/jEi0hYrUkm
— Fed Porn (@FedPorn) July 9, 2015
"I shorted" pic.twitter.com/Q3FzGh7gVC
— zerohedge (@zerohedge) July 9, 2015
As we detailed earlier, China is a $hitshow again...
With more than half of Chinese stocks halted or suspended, traders are scrambling to hedge the potential vacuum under prices when (or if) they ever open again. With options limited to non-existent in China, ETFs around the world are under pressure (with significant discounts to NAV everywhere). The cost of protecting against significant downside is now at its highest on record and the skew (difference between optimists and pessimists) has never been higher... This 'protection' has seemingly relieved some of the vicious cycle selling as yet another round of financing to backfill liquidity holes in broker balance sheets, but Chinese stock futures are trading 2-3% lower in the pre-open (less than might be expected as much driven by margin hike forced unwinds as much as sentiment).
- *CHINA'S CSI 300 STOCK-INDEX FUTURES FALL 2.9% TO 3,363
- *CHINA'S SHANGHAI COMPOSITE INDEX SET TO OPEN 2.1% LOWER
Pushing CSI-300 Index into the red for 2015...
BREAKING: China's stock market opens over 2% lower, with over 400 stocks immediately down 10% ... and about 1400 stocks still in suspension
— George Chen (@george_chen) July 9, 2015
* * *
But have no fear...
Another day, another round of liquidity poured into the leverage black hole...
- *CHINA SEC. FINANCE AIMS TO OFFER LIQUIDITY TO FUND COS.: CSRC
- *PBOC TO INJECT 35B YUAN WITH 7-DAY REVERSE REPOS: TRADER
And the politburo is getting serious!!
- *CHINA CBRC SUPPORTS BANKS TO COOPERATION WITH CHINA SEC FIN
- *CBRC ENCOURAGES BANKS TO COOPERATE WITH CHINA SEC. FINANCE
- *CBRC ENCOURAGES BANKS TO OFFER FINANCING TO CHINA SEC. FINANCE
- *CHINA CBRC TO SUPPORT STABLE STOCK MARKET DEVELOPMENT
- *CBRC ENCOURAGES BANKS TO ADJUST LOANS TERMS WITH STK COLLATERAL
- *CHINA CBRC ENCOURAGES BANKS TO HELP FINANCE STK REPURCHASES
Next come the orders on pain of death!!??
And then there's this...
- *HAITONG SECURITIES SLUMPS 16.6% IN H.K. AFTER SHR BUYBACK PLAN
That's not what is supposed to happen!!!
But traders have been extremely active in their hedging...
Crash risk has never been more expensive...
While At-the-Money Vol has spiked to 4-year highs...
Overnight saw Flash Crash come to China...
Selling pressure is heavy on the ETFs with all major China ETFs trading well below their NAV (ASHR 4.6% below!!)
And if you thought it was time to BTFD... consider this...
Chinese stocks are still extremely rich relative to the rest of the world.
* * *
We have one simple question.
How do say "unleash the Bullard" in Chinese?
Charts: Bloomberg
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Last chance to buy some of those 1000 P/E chicom stocks folks
Last chance? Of course not!
They'll be even cheaper tomorrow...
I don't know why you guys are so excited, if you look at Chinese stock charts, they had bigger rise and falls just a few years ago. And nothing happened.
You're assuming the current 'fall' is over...
Sum ting wong.
"Unreash da Burrard!"
For years, I have been angry & depressed to see lying become such an easy & effective way to accumulate wealth…
I am truly grateful that, finally, everyone will come to see that lying is just as unprofitable as telling the truth!
This is China on the bottom of the world. The charts are upside down. EVERYTHING IS AWESOME
Chinese equity "markets" are about to lose another 30% over the next 6 to 8 weeks, and then cliff dive down 40% from there once Chinese Central Command realizes trying to stem the bleeding by freezing out sellers is doing more harm than good.
Mark it zero, like the quality of most shit made in China.
sooo, does this mean I won't be able to sell SPXS?
obviously this will happen here eventually
China has lost control. Prepare for the fecal matter to hit the rapidly spinning object.
If this was really about short-sellers they would simply have banned short-selling.
>With options limited to non-existent in China,< Somebody should tell the Chinese- it's easy to hedge!! Just buy US index futures- especially the ES- the fed's got your back!!! Kevin Henry could prop up a sick whore from falling off the piss pot!!
The Central Planners have never seen a "Market" that didn't need manipulating. Why can't they just leave it alone and let the free market work. The quickest and esiest way to get over it is just leave the market alone and let it clear.
When the time comes here, they will probably just ship’em down to Gitmo.
Everything is perfectly fine. Have some fried rice and calm down. China will be there tomorrow.
Will stop shorting for gold.
It will now be referred to as "sharting" the market.
carry on...
No, if we had free markets right now, millions of people would die in the streets. The government is not causing the bad economy, they are hiding it with endless debt and making it worse.
So essentially China wants to tell people what they can do with their property, not lease stocks and enter into a mutually agreed upon contract. It doesn’t sound like they are ready to be the next light on a shining hill to me, nor give up any control.
......nor give up any control.
Remember that China's government is still communist, even if sometimes they act like they aren't.
'They' are filling in my septic tanks as I write but they will never take my rapidly spinning objects.
(Tyhoon a comin')
I sharted.
Too funny.
Nice snapback rally for those "shadts."
In 1929 policy makers did nothing. Claiming "they tried everything and only fail" as it least wrong on this day.
When God bleeds, will anyone believe him anymore ? Lets ask Gorbachev.
Controlled equity locks failed in 31, they will fail today as it does nothing to halt the margin calls or an investor's reflexive outlook. China at best will burn through their cred, possibly most of their M1 FX reserves to buy months of stability, but at this point I doubt much faith exists in "uncle" Xi anymore without a scapegoat. Markets always require fresh capital and limited outflows beget liquidity shortages and limited inflow confidence.
The other thing is that Chinese history is rife with govt's who overextend, respond with police action, and subsequently lose the People's Mandate. At this point, given the dispersion of the PLA and how vested Army Oligarchs were in the markets, this could rapidly spiral into a Junta if the market route lasts into August (possible given Greece).
How do you say "Sell in May and Go Away" in Chinese?
Oh, never mind - Google says "W? yuè shòu ch? xi?osh?"
Brack Rendsday SUCKS!
"Bing Bong, this is your wake up call"
Let this be a wise lesson/wake up call for everyone still naive enough to believe that China will introduce honest money, like a gold-backed Yuan.
They won't!
Neither will any other Nation.
That is the reason we need to execute the World Bankers and REAL World Leaders...not just the Figureheads.
I agree. This is the wake up call to cast off your shackles and KILL THE BEAST and all of its minions.
Like you phone, you computer, your shit that you buy to your children even you car parts.
Everything Chinese.
so the way I understand it is the shorts are banned from putting a floor in so they are essentially removing the bidder of last resorts.
^^^^ hard to slow a falling sword if the shorts don't get to cover a a lower price by buying the shares to return the loan.
Always blaming the shorts when they need to thank them for taking out that old slow wildebeast thats lagging the herd leaving the remaining heathy and running as fast as can be. Weel they are like a pack of freakin hyenas but, Welcome to the Jungle.
I don't know what you guys are on about, short sellers are clearly nothing but vultures preying on the pain (and stupidity) of others.
Besides, short selling is stupid in itself: a stock can only drop to 0, while the price could rise all the way to the mooooonnnn!
"Vultures....preying on stupidity" guilty as charged. hope you don't mind if I don't you mind if I do a few more circles up here Squaaaaak.
+10 Cow. @ the former:
Yea the price can go to the moon, but when a short sells he's exposed all the way down to 0. IF he's got the money to cover. Both are needed. What's worse: a billionaire that buys a few thousands shares @ market each day for a week for a friend or a billionaire that sells them? Both have one reason to enter: GREED. Both have one reason to exit: FEAR. That is what makes true markets real.
You gotta be fucking kidding
There is only one possible explanation : you are a politician , or a central banker
Hear that whooshig sound? It's not an aeroplane, it's the ironic use of language, soaring over your heads. Maybe you don't hear it, it seems to be going well over your heads.
Zhers pride themselves on being a bunch of clever trousers, way sharper than the sheeple, but still, they need a /sarc tag to figure out what's actually being said.
By the way something brucyy, that's two (2) possible explanations.
Yep- the old Cliff Klaven beer philosophy!
I - Sharted
Sorry bro. I stole your thunder :-) (up above). I saw the word "septic" and had to dive in (figuratively speaking).
"Always blaming the shorts when they need to thank them for taking out that old slow wildebeast thats lagging the herd leaving the remaining heathy and running as fast as can be. Weel they are like a pack of freakin hyenas but, Welcome to the Jungle."
that's the "the market is supposed to work like the jungle theory". highly debatable, but I'm fine with it
the problem I have is when firepower, i.e. extreme leverage is given to the hyenas
remember that Master Of The Universe Hedgefund manager that was considering a 100x "bet" of unicorn size against the Bund? those guys risk... Plenty Of Other People's Money
it is, imho, a bit like giving the hyenas tanks, and listen how they laugh while they try to annihilate the wildebeasts
yes, a healthy market needs shorters. we only differ on how much, how many of them, how well armed
China seems to want none of this, at the moment, which is on the other extreme end of the spectrum (well, look at that pack of wildebeast, and note how lame it is)
well if you do not think that that Rhino's horn in the Chinese market this year was made without "some extreme leverage" your daft.
I do agree that it is debatable that that is how these markets have been operating lately, and if the shorts would have been allowed to do there job in the U>S markets for, oh, about the last 7 years instead of getting slaughtered with QE money and leverage, then we would not be standing here wondering why that blood is starting to trickle out our nose with the air feels a little thin when you breath wondering when you are going to hear the first scaffold board make the inevitable cracking sound. But to the moooooooooon right?
And your also right in some markets like comex gold and silver where you are limited to like 1500 buy contracts, but the shorts are unlimited in amounts they can buy. And you wonder why you get those piledrivng unstoppable drops. Its a fraud designed to never allow it to function correctly and be under constant price control taken at at will. Its not a market
What about all the buyers that have been locked out? Oh the humanity!
'Unrewash' da Kraken bitchez!! This fuzker Kraken is madder than a bull seeing red. It's been stuck in a bubble and pimped like a ho' to any market with $20. Let the circus ole' La' Kraken begin.
Herro, the malket is going clazy.
FUCK CHINA, bitchez
i hate control, controls, controllers, autority, rules, rulemakers, teachers and fucking the type that think they are superior.
the controllers are making matters worse and are too stupid to see their folly. now that is dumb and dumber, by dumb fucks(leaders)...
Go look up a chart and you'll see how stupid you were.
i might be wrong, but i think total market cap in china is much higher now than in '08. but i see what u mean with the shanghai composite index having a bigger drop in '08
Not to mention their GDP was growing at over 14% in 2007.
Now it's growing at less that half that rate, and their 'cooked-book' Ponzi financing is just beginning to be uncovered...
Dow, S&P, and NASDAQ are up tonight, so far.
They might be faking us out again for now.
http://www.sgxniftydowfutureslive.com/index_files/DOWFUTURES.htm
So the market is off 30% or so.
Ask yourself - what would it be off if the PBOC were not acting as buyer of last resort?
Ask yourself - what would it be off if half the companies had not halted trading of their shares?
Ask yourself - what would it be off if it pension funds were allowed to sell shares and it was not illegal to short the market?
If not for these measures this piece of dog shit would blow up in minutes.... because the whole pile of shit is based on nothing more than building of stuff that nobody wanted or needed.
China is insolvent.
(but one could say the same for the US --- because the Fed is loaning trillions to companies who buy back shares creative a false market)
Those were just for practice, the main event is coming soon.
We're gonna need more Kool-Aid
Bill?
Bill Clinton is that you?
RIP. The short but very sweet Chinese dabble in capitalism :(
As FireBrander said in other thread. A currency backed by China the world's reserve currency? my ass. Who would be stupid enough to trust those guys when things go awry?
If only China had their own Bernyanke
Free market totalitarianism in action. Why allow short selling if you don't want it to take place? It will probably be the next move here.
If central bankers can't steal everyone's money with stock markets what's the sense of having them.
Because at some point they'll start stealing from each other...and then everyone is toast.
"Black Flags Cometh."
People been talking about doing something about that...well maybe it's time someone did.
We can eliminate unemployment, want, violence...you name it...at a stroke of the pen right now.
Yet again "We Shall Wait and See"(tm)
How is that umbrella company doing by the way? Tyler?
Corrupt Chinese officials dumping. When they are done, run for the hills in China.
OK, I'm making the call . This is gonna jump the pond in a much bigger way in short order if the Chinese don't get a handle on this quickly.
As a side note, I think China's decision to hault trading in huge numbers of stocks is making their situation WORSE, not better. It's forcing people to exit positions they may not want to exit in order to make up for positions they CAN'T exit. Typical communist command-and-control bullshit. Shut off the main correction path and they all try to squeeze through smaller venues that were never designed to handle the load.
not only that, but it will prevent people from taking new positions. Who wants to take a large stake in something they may not be able to exit, ever. If you are a stock broker or hedge fund who was able to get money out, are you ever going to put it back in, knowing you may get locked into that position? probalby not. As you say, this will make it worse
Next time will be different!
There is not going to be another next time.
This is hideous... where's the fucking PPT? I can't even begin to imagine what the effects on the commercial banking sector are looking like right now but with even commodites taking it in the shorts these days it sure can't be good.
Contagion is now pretty much gauranteed.
Hold onto you seats and get something to barf into. Shit of all sorts will likely be happening real soon.
And that is why, as a rational neutral observer, you bet on the Squid banker, not the Shanghai banker.
The truth is, the Chinese have nothing on the Tribesmen, when it comes to the Magik of Money, honey.
Bet accordingly.
Kirk, I just don't know and can't be sure.
Yeah I am pretty much out of the market for a few years.
But I wonder how the Chinese got into Central Banking, Free Markets, Stock Exchanges so quickly...
Perhaps our US Bankers, our European Bankers with their high reputations moved into China and wondered about setting up shop their, experimenting on an accelerated market boom, tested the limits of bubble creation, and considered crashing the US Economy with Debt and Rejection of our Credit Rating... in a Pivot to live in Asia.
I think they can salvage a life and market in either USA, Europe, Scandinavia, or Asia.
I think Bankers can make it anywhere and that is what they believe. It is like a Creed or Salute or Code of Conduct for Bankers.
"forcing people to exit positions they may not want to exit in order to make up for positions they CAN'T exit"
Like dumping their NYSE positons?
If this boat goes down the captains have assured it goes down with all hands.
And how many trillions of US treasuries does China own? This could get interesting..
1.5 trillion above the table I believe. "above" that is...
Does it remind you of Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton, Rom Emanuel, Barack Obama, Nancy Pelosi, Harry Reid, Reid Harry, Jon Boner, Boener Jon, Mitch Kahn-Ill, John Son of Cain, With us or Against us Bush, Dick my Derick is in Halliburton Cheney...
Sorry lost my head.
Central Planning like Unread Legislation signed by US Congress for Obama Care and Fast Track for TPP et al?
The fact of signing Legislation written by Lobbyist... signals that we have had a "Coup".
What other Legislation has been signed for the benefit of the Wealthy and the Transnationals?
When did this practice begin? How long have we been doing Counter-Intelligence Operations against the US Stakeholders, US Children, US Voters, US Citizens, US Taxpayers?
Deregulation Plans, Transportation, Energy, Communication, Finance, Free Trade, Campaign Finance
1964 - Gulf of Tonkin, Congress gives up War Powers, Legislative Powers, and Budget Powers
1973 - War Powers Resolution (Allows 60 days combat/war without congressional declaration)
1974 - Federal Energy Administration Act of 1974 (R. Nixon)
1978 - Bankruptcy Reform Act of 1978,
1980 - Depository Institutions (J. Carter, followed by S&L Crisis, 5000 convictions, RTC)
1981 - Executive Order 12287, (R. Reagan, removed price controls on Petrol)
1984 - Caribbean Basin Initiative (Free Imports to USA)
1992 - Energy Policy Act (H.W. Bush)
1994 - NAFTA, Deregulation of Trade, 3 Nations (W. Clinton)
1995 - Community Reinvestment Act, the Clinton Admin urged flexibility,
1995 - HUD advocated greater involvement of state and local organizations
1996 - Energy (W. Clinton, followed by ENRON Scandal)
1996 - Telecommunications Act (W. Clinton, cross ownership)
1996 - Start of a Period of Accounting Fraud in USA which continues today
1997 - M2 Money Velocity Top
1998 - Clinton's Kosovo War (over 60 Days)
1998 - Brooksly Born Rejected on her concerns on OTC Derivatives
1998 - Derivatives expanded and were not regulated
1998 - Citicorp & Travelers Insurance Merger
1999 - Gramm–Leach–Bliley Act (Phil Gramm, W. Clinton, followed by 2008 Financial Crisis)
1999 - bombing campaign in Kosovo (W. Clinton, over 60 days)
2000 - Commodity Futures Modernization Act of 2000 (P. Gramm, W. Clinton, derivatives)
2002 - McCain–Feingold Act (G.W. Bush, Campaign Finance, soft money unlimited)
2005 - Energy Policy Act (G.W. Bush, subsidies, excluded clean air Water acts)
2005 - Bankruptcy Abuse Prevention and Consumer Protection Act of 2005 (BAPCPA).
2005 - CAFTA-DR Ratified, 2006 El Salvador, Honduras, Nicaragua, Guatemala
2008 - 2014 QE & LIRP/ZIRP (B. Bernanke, J. Yellen, B Obama)
2008 - 2012 H. Clinton Emails, known to Executive Branch (No Way Wasn't)(H. Clinton, B. Obama, Impeachable)
2009 - 2014 Continuing Resolutions in which Congress gives up Budget Powers
2010 - Citizens United v. Federal Election Commission (money is free speech for corps)
2011 - US combat in Libya (B Obama, over 60 days)
2014 - lift ban on crude oil exports (B Obama, Commodities Deregulation)
- (Laissez-faire economic policies)
Man, it's like the dot com bubble but ten times bigger.
Guarantee it will cross oceans and continents.
Agreed. I think we've finally found the next PROPER use for the "big C" word- Contagion.
Aye, C'pn
"These are Sovereigns now."
They include the ewe 'n mar this time
Hope is a strategy when it is all you have matey...
We all knew this day would come; the insolvent bankers and insurers passed all their crap into sovereign debt which is now plunging as people realize there’s no more places to hide all the fraud, greed, corruption, and bankrupt statuses, not only in China but worldwide including Barry’s “exceptional country” like USA and most of the EU nations.
GDPs are all tumbling and can not for a 1,000 years pay off all the debt. There's simply zero growth.
I’m very pessimistic seeing that almost no leaders have even attempted to tourniquet the massive hemorrhage.
That might be because if they did try they would find the wrong end of a Home Depot Nail-gun accident occuring.
It smells a lot like the hedge fund dumping in 2008-9: Hedgies getting their Greek $ out of China....if you can't sell what you want, you sell what you can.
Can't buy the dip if the dip keeps on dipping. I mean enough already.
I fucking love it, theres a new "Keynesian financial term" you just coined there Tyler...Crash Protection Costs...lol.
Clearly this falls to the "expense" line on the ole accounting ledger, a complete government write off ;-)
It falls under the SWPFI entry on the ledger. Serfs Will Pay For It.
Book the profits and socialize the losses.
The One Step-Two Step in Keynesian Economics, in one short lesson ;-)
Tax freedom day has inched up about 20 days in the last five years (wiping sweat from brow).
The day marking freedom from taxes? That's still in the year 2525, right?
Right and a big fuck you to all our "representatives" in DC. I don't believe in a Fundy's eternal hell, but more like Dante's hell....they should get one of the lower circles under the ice. Good luck with that morons.
Crash Protection Costs isn't insurance, it's a tax and each family will save $1,200 a year and they can keep their broker. I promise.
Once again you fools, there are no problems ANYWHERE. Comex gold says so. If gold isn't concerned about all that's going on in Greece and China, why should you be? In fact, gold will probably hit a new cyclical low at the first hint of any more good news...same with silver.
And looking at the prices now, it's obvious there has been so much good news in the last four months, we need to thank our leaders for all their hard work and wisdom. Especially our dear President and Ms. Yellen.
Thank you, we're not worthy.
There - do I do the MDB thing OK?
The 1909 Lincoln MDB looks to be heading to 50 maybe a hundred grand here...
with those newfangled 1000x optical magnifing glasses I could weld a dandy M and a D but the B now thats tough
S&P should be up at least 50 pts tomorrow on all of this wonderful news
There - do I do the MDB thing OK?
Not quite, since you managed to collect some down arrows. Congrats for having the balls not to use the sarc tag, although your final phrase still was a bit of a giveaway. You'll need to work on that.
But as far as PM's go: I wonder when their prices will finally reflect the true state of all things economic on this planet. It's like a bubble in reverse: ridiculously low prices of gold and silver, just waiting to be inflated to the level where they actually denote what is really going on, i.e. the death of fiat due to an insane build-up of debt on all levels.
When those prices start to rise for real, that's when you'll need to start paying attention to what's happening around you.
When no one on ZH is talking about gold, and even the stackers have stopped stacking, then you'll know the bottom is in.
1st Paragraph not so good. 2nd was much improved. Salutation dripped MDB.
MDB
Often imitated, never equaled.
If the Angel of Death has a broker, MDB would be it.
Here's another good index Tyler.
I can't wait to hear the bozo's bloviate on the blowhorn tomorrow morning. At least their ratings should improve from 100-200 airport lounge listeners.
FTSE China A50 11,235.62 11,603.28 11,095.74 -365.92 -3.15% 1:37:00We call this a 'puke'.
puke The act of vomiting, hurling, barfing, losing lunch, tossing cookies, ralfing, throwing up, yacking, retching, technicolour yawning, spewing, blowing chunks, and/or other forms of physical illness.The question becomes is this a mild case of food poisoning puke, or is this an ebola puke?
Technicolor Yawning...LMAO
You forgot bowing down and giving homage to the Porcelian God.
It's okay folks.
They will just revise the numbers.
It's a seasonal thang.
Although they might look like precogs, trying to squirm out before the derivatives unzip.
I'm going to try to take physical delivery of Frost.
http://commodityhq.com/2011/top-seven-strangest-commodity-futures/
I could corner the Frost Future market with very little crowd funding leverage.
Communist rationing and price controls, China style.
As nasty as this looks, it is really only unwinding a bubble that lasted less than a year. I can only imagine the carnage that will unfold when the multi-decade Japan and US Treasury bubbles pop.
Agreed. Reversion to the mean. See US housing bubble. Bonds (UST) about to go BOOM!
The market is only the outward manifestation of public sentiment. The real damage here has been the ham-fisted official response.
Forget the notion that China will ever become a key world financial center, much less rise to reserve currency status. That cake is baked.
If this was engineered by the nefarious you-know-who, all I can say is, well played gentlemen. I doubt that's the case though. When your enemy is intent on destroying himself, the best strategy is to just step back and let it happen.
It will be like China*10 in term of disastrous effect.
SSE 2% rally in ten minutes.
Bounce quite strongly today.
still way way way overvalued imo but then fundamentals don't have anything to do with it these days
2008-9: much of the subprime slime et al went down -70%.
that too was overvalued. mark it zero. so many zeros, so little time.
Someone please explain how the Hang Seng is now up 3.5% and counting
Our BLS is helping them with the numbers?
Ann... lee-shi... de... buu-lat... LOL
looks like the chins sent out a couple of thousand hit squads to "correct" any mentally unstable people that hit the sell button. its like a mental health clinic only faster. bullet to back of head.
Into the green as Reuters reports Chinese police are investigating short sellers.
http://news.forexlive.com/!/xinhua---china-police-to-investigate-malicious-short-selling-of-stocks-20150709
Sell and you will be arrested and shot. Thats one way to keep it green....
sorry but imo selling shares you don't own should be illegal everywhere
And on the same thought, buying shares with other peoples money (leverage) shouldn't be allowed either.
"selling shares you don't own should be illegal"
there is a difference between shorting and naked short-selling. Naked short selling is indeed dubious and should be illegal
Shorting is gambling on the destruction of capital. Not very productive when compared to investing in productive designs. Is a market for gambling or for efficiently investing capital in worthy and productive enterprises? It would seem that the more of the former then the less of the latter and that is not really good for anyone in the long run.
Its not that simple.
A politician would agree with you , because its all nice and makes sense , but the reality is another matter
Actual shares being sold at a loss because they were purchased under irrational exhuberance was a bigger gamble than all short positions in history combined , and central banks fucking up price discovery are adding systemic downside risks . Never in history a small group of elites was able to predict mass panic, This is no gamble when you know your risks , that is efficient capital allocation.
Most of the short money is used in derivatives anyway , hence have no influence on the underlying , mostly because the lack of liquidity is a problem even for shorts. You think this money could be better used for charity or a legitimate business of some sort ? Probably. That could happen the day CBs and politicians leave the price alone , and stop creating irrational returns for their elite friends with printed cash.
Markets will be free when / if humans as a group think about their general interests first , and leave markets doing what they do best : optimise returns
And its still gambling and the ultimate expression of people wanting something for nothing. With that in mind, what could possibly go wrong?
Other than initial IPO how does stock purchase enable any product design or development? I believe is simply another rationalization of the financial industry to allow their gambling addicted patrons to believe they are doing God's work, like horny men believing they are only having sex to please women. Eventually they all admit they are only pleasing themselves without questioning why. Only serving their "needs".
Crash protection? That's like buying a gate after the horses have left.
The farce is strong in this one.
henry kissinger talking about new world order and china
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jAxOOoRj2CU (1:09)
Oh you silly, that's all just a conspiracy theory. Nobody believes in those anymore.
I knew someday shorting would be illegal.
Arrest Soros, send special forces team
You know guys like Soros and Buffett are first in line for those immortality treatments. They need to be taken out before they evolve in omnipotence.
Issue the arrest warrants for Jamie Dimon and Lloyd Blankfein.
STFR= sell the fucking rip. Bitchez
I'd be shorting usd/jpy into London, with reasonable stops. (consolidation trade)
If central banks start losing even more control it would probably be a good idea the be short usd/jpy. These are pretty good levels to start averaging into usd/jpy longs. (Kyle Bass style)
This makes me believe that there is a serious battle going on between a well embedded force controllng the fiat machine and new kids on the block who are challenging their positions. It is too difficult to tell if Russia and China are part of a bigger game plan. It appears TPTB are trying to take down the Chinese financial system leading to a take down of their leadership.
IMO, shorting equities in the form of debt instruments is what led to non collateralized derivatives and naked shorting. Shorting stocks should be illegal in any market to avoid nefarious manipulations.
"Selling pressure is heavy on the ETFs"
Are these ETFs restricted to mainland china or do foreigners also have access to them?
Chinese traders caught shorting will then, in short order, find themselves sharting their shorts.
'How do you say "unleash the Bullard" in Chinese?'
Mao Zhuxi wansui!
The dead Mao bounce
Unreesh the Burrard!!
Pinyin please
ETA: Never mind.
All these charts are zoomed in on a short time frame. This benefits the doom and gloom writers. Look at this chart of the SSE composite Index for the last 10 years.
http://finance.yahoo.com/echarts?s=000001.SS+Interactive#{%22range%22:%22max%22,%22allowChartStacking%22:true}
The drop in 2007-2008 was much bigger. China did not collapse like the China bashers predicted.
If the current market drops to 2000 and takes a year to return to 3000, it will be right where it should be for a healthy growth rate.
Nothing to see here, folks. Move along.
The massive state interventions help fuel the gloom & doom scribes as well, which makes one wonder where true price discovery lies. That 10 year chart might not look so rosey if the chips were allowed to fall where they
may; much like the 'Murcan markets. However, the degree of Chinese interventions seem even more extreme.
then they were expanding at 10% GDP/ year growth. Now No so much.
Don't believe me ask Dr Copper and Herman Iron-Ore
Yes, deliberately ramping markets to suck in the muppets, only to see a sell off that wipes them out, is always sign of a healthy market....for those doing the ripping.
Please don't tell me that this is healthy. It simply transfers wealth from those who labored to earn it to the casino owners who are absolutely dependent upon the weak and emotional. We know why they put metal trays and coins in slot machines. Everything is designed as a lure to draw in their prey.
I'm so tired of those trying to live off of the labors of others as being in anyway "productive" for society. It would be more economic justice for us to provide theft training to local thugs to achieve greater success in breaking into their neighbors homes to enrich themselves while redistributing wealth.
Give me a fucking break.
Is anyone shorting their pants yet over the fiasco today!
Just wondering how many US hedgefunds are exposed to the " China syndrome"?
Heh, called it. I sold out at around 4000ish on the way up. Missed out on an extra 25% of profit I guess, but I booked a 200% gain as it was. People called me stupid, and yes, I felt some remorse as I saw it hit 5000. But, now I'm the one who get's to laugh. Everyone wants out and because of the 10% limits every day you miss out on that split second opportunity, you lose another 10%. If they want to stop the carnage they need to nuke the 10% down rule and allow for price discovery. It'll hurt but it'll stop the panic selling.
Nobody ever went broke taking a profit.....Bernard Baruch.
laomei,
Does the Shanghai Exchange have an Uptick Rule like the NYSE? If not, they should look into it quickly.
IIRC, many citizens (and foreigners now, if I heard the news sources correctly while at work) have been joining in the Market as Investors.
IMHO, Market/Exchange Safeguard Regs (many of which were evicerated in the USA) of other Markets should be heavily reviewed again (and the prudent (re)implemented), since this relatively new and open environment may leave openings for Program Trading/HFT by "Market Making/Foreign/5thColumn" Class Trading Entities and others who do Profit from SSE's Market Volatility/Instability (and yes, I include those who seek Political Advantage against CHN for whatever perverted reasons they may have; but it's been demonstrated against CHN for Centuries(e.g., Opium Trade, where the Drug Dealers and its support infrastructure primarily prevailed)).
Don't mean to be Paranoid; but after reading a good number of articles involving Market Manipulation, Dominance, and Currency/Economic/Trade Wars, I'm sure there will be a good number of Entities (e.g., the Five-Eyed Hegemony) who would like to see SSE/AIIB/BRICS-Bank continually beset with problems.
Rock on,
Amusing that the PBOC did exactly the opposite of what I said they should do a few days ago: Leave it alone. Let the market correct itself.
Every time a central bank starts to pull & push the levers to "do something" about the falling stock prices, the intervention screams no confidence in the underlying economic conditions in the markets. Surely they know it? This correction was a long time coming and it should have served as a great lesson for all concerned not to be leveraged beyond their capital and especially not to follow the stupid herd by listening to the msm.
If one follows trends in the markets after central bank interventions, the sad truth might be, in a few months time they may announce record highs in the indexes again and all those fund managers who didn't throw themselves off buildings could look like superstars for sticking with their punts. That's how stupid the world has become. All or nothing compulsive gamblers bailed out by the nanny state. I doubt it will be any different this time.
Everyone always does this. In the US, they fuck with it because literally EVERYTHING is tied to the markets, massive drops mean everyone gets fired and no one gets to retire. In China they fuck with it because the muppets who jump in last and eat the losses are the type to cry and whine and protest that they were scammed and demand "justice". Stepping in to intervene if anything gives them a chance to get out before they lose literally everything.
Chinese markets are NEVER rational. It's all a fad. Once the fad runs its course, the market crashes back to where it started. Remember beanie babies? It's like that.
Yep. When this tulip mania in china started I almost wanted to post that it looked uncannily like a "real" market should. It looked like a case study datamining model of herd behaviour. Totally prone to irrational trends with large movements that are predictably trackable with technical analysis. - As you say, prone to fads.
It's only been like 12-13 years for most Stock Exchanges in China.
In like 2002 I was commenting that insiders said the only good, rational market was the Shanghai Stock Market. Beijing was coming out with theirs and it was all about Emotions and Exuberance.
Not that I am a steady eddy in playing the markets.
But China seems to be a nation of gamblers and their markets were always going to crash like this. Probably the Jews and the Europeans, and the Americans told them this back in like 2002...
Maybe now they understand its just a giant wild-assed casino frequented by crooks.
They questions is, when will they work out that, that is a really bad thing, and that it should instead be the mechanism of stable continuous national investment and never treated as a casino again?
The US still hasn't figured that one out. Or at least CNBC and their perverse cohort still haven't. Or rather they have worked it out, and they are such spineless corrupt turds that they don't care to do anything about it - ever - and to hell with the USA from here.
Yes sir, that approach will work out just great ... within both countries.