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Bitcoin Soars By 10%: Does Someone Know Something?
Despite the exuberance in US and European equity markets, it appears Bitcoin is sending a different (avoid the looming capital controls) message... Does someone know something?
Bitcoin is soaring on heavy volume...
This is the highest level in 4 months...
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Digital numbers are nothing. If you cant stand in front of it with a gun a defend it, you dont own it. Ann Barndhart
RIPS
The last run up to $1000 started with Cyprus.......
Where did it end up?
The end isn't here yet.
Bitcoin certainly has some big questions hanging over it, but you shouldn’t ignore its reaction to crises as explained here. Especially if you think there are bigger crises to come. I think a small allocation is warranted.
Exactly! 2% here.
Well, now more like 2.5%.
JPM can't corner the market on it, that's why
It may be digital,ONLY when you transfer them. "BitCoins"
But I have MINE out of the system and in cold storage, you can even store your BitCoins in your head if you want to, many many people are so CLUELESS on how you can hold your BitCoins. There are even many Sheeple on zerohedge.
ONE WORD.........DIVERSIFICATION
HELLO SHEEPLE !
"If you can't stand virtually in front of it and encrypt with SHA256 you don't own it!"
~ Ann Bithart
Peer to peer currency have made Gold and Silver obsolete.
Eh, teh we thinks gold and silver will always have a place as a localized store of value.
It means the wealthy control Bitcoin too, duh...
http://galeinnes.blogspot.com/2015/07/economics-for-serfs.html
I wonder who is the better advocate for bitcoin here on zerohedge. Is it Waylon with his humorous take, the technoliterates nullifying the tired criticisms of the technotards, or is it the technotards themselves with their fear-inducing assertion that bitcoin won't work without electricity.(BOO!)
Do they eschew TVs and indoor lighting for this reason? Your computers won't work without electricity either please stop posting.
Bitcoin is the only honest banking system these days, that's fucking valuable.
very fucking valuable.
Lets see you spend your shitcoins in most of the world where they do not even know WTF it is let alone they prefer the heft and weight of tangible metal. That sherpa at your base camp will laugh at you. Guess who gets the guide? He who has gold coins or shitcoins?
LOL Silly boys, you can't own electrons.
Gold! Everywhere you want to be! (TM)
What's a sherpa and why would I be buying one?
I do know, however, that I can buy server hosting, any type of computer appliance, gold and silver, quality software programming, etc., etc., and have flowers shipped to my mum, all from the comfort of my sofa using bitcoin.
In the town where you live, does any grocery store accept gold bullion? Any gas station or book store?
Where I live, in Los Angeles, most places do not accept $100 bills. I have had multiple locations tell me to write IOU's when I said I had nothing smaller. Really, how useful is cash right now, at least from what I have seen??? BTC is interesting to follow. Mined it a few years ago to see what it was about. If BTC can't be used the world has bigger issues.
Guess what, before 2012 almost nobody accepted it. The number of bitcoin accepting merchants are steadily growing worldwide since then.
Bitcoin is not a finished product pushed by corporations but a new ecosystem built by people like you and me.
And none of those merchants will ever accept gold and silver, try mail it using the USPS! LOL. Or try accepting it using the USPS, good luck!
Bitcoin is the way to go IF computers are around in the future , if they are not then gold and silver are the way to go.
Doesn't need to. It can corner law makers. I suppose that means something....to um....someone.
We mother made 23.7 BTC last month shitting out Bitbabies. Find out how you can work from home and make this virtual dream happen for you too!
https://btc-e.com
Few will be able to afford batteries for their phones after the crash. Bye, bye, BitCoin.
You won't be able to afford anything if you don't have ....
Water, seeds, livestock, shiny, and guns guns guns!
TP
booze
And duct tape/jb weld.
The Stuff of Life and the right friends in the right places.
A group is stronger than an individual, and a network is better than a supply line.
There’s going to be a monetary overhaul, yes, but that doesn’t mean everything will be left in rubble. Monetary shifts have happened, 1913, 1945, 1971, and sometimes they can be pretty ugly, 1933, but the world doesn’t fall apart. Many will lose alot but it is not the end of the world. The one thing that has been constant throughout those shifts is the banks and govt get stronger, hopefully that doesn't happen this time, but that's the trend.
blockchain tech can play a vital roll in minimizing the influence of banks and governments
you could google Decentralized autonomous communities (DAC)
this is a fun example
http://getgems.org/
Did you ever consider the fact that Bitcoiners will just be able to move to a country with power, running water, hot chicks? Not filled with ignorant technophobes? Just a thought....
Yeah, those virtual chicks are hot. Until you put the moves on them and they turn into Waylon Smithers.
Teh we always does an incremental backup of his Bitbabes and puts them in cold storage.
Dont know ............. not at the "end" yet
http://s9.postimg.org/4onyz7r33/valuefiatgoldbitcoin.jpg
With me making a lot of extra cash by selling into the run up. It was obviously a bubble in Bitcoin, I had a few and jumped to sell at that inflated price. But mind you, some people bought them, and lost their asses.
It's like saying that people who bought gold above $1200 "lost their asses".
If you don't sell lower than you bought then you didn't lost anything yet.
Bitcoin is a long game, where we are going, selling bitcoin does not make sense.
Also, it's a constantly evolving ecosystem with its own growing pains.
"Bitcoin is a long game, where we are going, selling bitcoin does not make sense."
Gold has intrinsic value. Bits on a computer do not. You bitcoin people are fools. Do you really think government will let you subvert their control? No one is going to accept bitcoins in a back alley when it is made illegal.
Intristic value is a huge fallacy and does not make sense. The word you're looking for is faith. Even gold lacks intristic value. Valuation solely depends on supply and demand in a free (functional) market.
Bitcoin is being attacked continously since it got some attention. They would have crushed it if they had the means (perfectly organized global effort). The bigger it gets the harder it is to attack it.
With arguments like yours, maybe you should head up the Fed. FYI, gold and silver in fact do have intrinsic value. It will always be useful and will always have value. Your bits will not.
Gold only has value because we assign it value. It is after all a metal that's freely found in the ground. How is something free worth anything? Because it takes energy to extract it. Same with bitcoin. It takes energy to get it. The only difference is one is electronic and the other is metal. Both have value.
Gold has value because it has properties that make it fantastic as a monetary commodity, as well as numerous other uses.
Bitcoin has value because it has properties that make it almost a pure monetary commodity, even purer than gold as a monetary commodity.
Neither has inherent value, neither has value that is "assigned" by humans. Both have properties that are valued highly by humans for accomplishing specific tasks, namely a freely accessed, used and linked worldwide ledger of exchanged value.
The usefulness is highly subjective so your whole argument is moot.
The usefulness of gold is subjective, has been since the beginning of time, that hasn't changed the fact that humanity has consistently regarded gold as money for thousands of years.
Whether gold has "intrinsic" value is debateable. Whether water, shelter, arable land, food, tools, and community have intrinsic value, is not.
These are the areas you want your heaviest investments IMHO.
Intrinsic value implies pre-monetary origin - being a valuabel commodity first and then becoming a unit of exchange later having not sacrificed any of its qualities in the process. Gold is a commodity. It is precious due to its natural rarity and useful physical properties. It is widely use in semiconductor, space exploration and medical fields. It is virtually indestructible.
A bitcon a synthetic unit of exchange and nothing else. It is fiat, minus the paper. It has no other uses. It's network and electricity dependent. Each individual unit can only be verified against all other units, unlike a commodity that can be validated simply through its properties.
To check whether your bitcoin data is real and unique, you have to complare it against all all other bitcoins. To check a piece of gold, you don't need to have access to all the gold in the world. In fact, if you're familiar with physics, you don't need to have any gold on hand at all.
That's what is meant by "intrinsic value". An array of uses and properties that make validation of value possible by a single individual.
Hey, teh he we gots bit babies, not logic.
"An array of uses and properties that make validation of value possible by a single individual."
A.K.A. The Blockchain. With bitcoin's blockchain you need no 3rd party to validate the authenticity of incoming funds. All other bitcoins are right there in the database for nearly instant inspection, backed by military grade digital signatures and a phenomenal amount of spent electricity (bitcoin mining). Unique uses and properties of BTC that differentiate it from gold are: It passes invisibly through metal detectors, crosses borders effortlessly, can be transferred directly to other trading partners anywhere across the globe quickly, securely, and cheaply without needing to ask permission from any 3rd party (such as customs officials or pony express). Nobody said it would be easy to create or understand a scarce, non-counterfitable, durable system that is also intangible but for the past 6 years bitcoin has been doing exactly that.
Down votes on the above, shut the fuck up or bring up your points. Inquiring minds want to know.
Do you really know anything at all about bitcoin? Bitcoin's "intrinsic value" is its worldwide immutable public ledger. If you don't agree with that, then you'd argue that the Internet has no intrinsic value?
Really? That's why no one buys drugs or engages in prostitution because the government made it illegal?
"Gold has intrinsic value."
Beyond perhaps sunshine, fresh water, nothing has intrinsic value. ALL value is SUBJECTIVE. Everything else is a bet on the arbitrage.
ALL value is subjective.... even sunshine is not valuable (actively dangerous too) to some forms of life.
For humans, we automatically assign value to air, water, food and shelter, because those things are essential to our survival.. other life forms on our planet (extremophiles) would value a different set of things if they were sentient.
Formally, these basics are the Physiological level of Maslow's Heirachacy of needs (check the Wikipedia page: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow%27s_hierarchy_of_needs )
So the value of sunshine, and fresh water is not intrinsic in them, it is subjective and comes from us. That 'value' for us is utterly pervasive, because these items are directly connected to our survival.
And you think a government cannot declare gold ownership illegal? Already happened once in US.
zactly, jus like you not late 'tils you gets to whey you goin'...
it was at $30 before cyprus and eventually hit a low of $160
pretty good investment in my book
Bitcoin haters love to talk about the decline from $1,000, but continue to ignore that is was valued at less than a dollar 5 years ago. I remember the first "bubble" in Bitcoin, when it went over $20 just several weeks after reaching parity with the US Dollar. That was back in 2011. There were a lot of experts trumpeting Bitcoin's demise when it pulled back to a few dollars and stayed there until 2013. The next bubble was in April of 2013....at $143. Then later that year at >$1,000. Because it's a new technology, it will always move explosively and speculatively. But the technology of the blockchain is going to transform payments and destroy the middle men of finance that we all hate. If you like freedom, you need to learn about Bitcoin and blockchain-based technologies. Period.
Why anyone here would reject a revolutionary alternative to the legacy financial system is beyond me. It demonstrates ignorance of the implications of the technology, because if you grasped it, you'd have hope for the free people of earth. Bitcoin may not be the final form....but blockchains are going to save us all. I know y'all are still stuck on the NASDAQ tanking back in 2000, but not all new technologies are frivolities.
"Where did it end up?"
About 16 times higher than an ounce of silver.
cryptocrurrencies have been pretty good hedges, if you get out in time. Like any hedge fund hotel, there most definitely is a certain amount of risk here (especially if the grid goes down...).
...and the right time to get out, will be when I buy in. I will keep you all posted.
With the off-grid power capabilities available to people, self-assembling and self-regulating mesh-networks built from $30 netgear routers, Bitcoin may be here to stay. No country thus far has been able to completely shut off internet in their own country, and many tried during the "Arab spring". Mesh networks make shutting down internet networks basically impossible. Even major disasters have trouble shutting down all networking in an area.
You should read more and post a lot less.
http://www.dailydot.com/technology/broken-cable-internet-island/
While many people are figuratively cutting the cord and ridding themselves of standard cable and land lines, one country took it a little too literally and found themselves without Internet.
Citizens of the Commonwealth of the Northern Mariana Islands (CNMI), a U.S. territory in the western Pacific Oceans, have been without Internet for over 48 hours after an underwater fiber-optic cable was cut.
This was also postulated in Neil Stephenson's book Cryptonomicon.
Standard Disclaimer: The Internet is far more vulnerable than you think. And the below is from random googling...
http://hackaday.com/2012/12/06/25-gpus-brute-force-348-billion-hashes-pe...
lol, I should read more?
From your hackaday link:
"An eight character NTLM password will fall in 5.5 hours, while a 14 character LM hash makes it only about six minutes before the solution is discovered."
When someone starts forcing me to use 8-character key seeds, then maybe I'll be afraid. Until then, I'll feel quite safe. With ECDSA keys, you'd have to get through 2^160 key generations (on average). Presuming you're using that system in the hackaday link, you'll get 348 billion keys per second which amounts to 3.48 x 10^9 per second. That amounts to about 2^32 keys per second, leaving you having to guess for an average of 2^128 seconds, which is about 3.4 X 10^38 seconds, which is about 1.0790 X 10^31 years which is twenty orders of magnitude longer than the current age of the universe.
I think I feel safe.
Your broken internet cable link is about an island nation. If I live in an island nation, presumably I'm enjoying life a little much to care about finance.
Cryptocurrencies also have much shorter cycles than stocks and precious metals. Even if you pick a piss poor entry point, as long as you don't panic sell your stash, worst case scenario is you're stuck bagholding for a couple years until the price rebounds.
Fundamentalists think in simple, static positions.
Entrepreneurs and Innovators think in more complex or dynamic terms.
Opportunity is where you find it, or make it.
Plan and act accordingly -- if you can or if you dare.
Personally, I care not to speculate in it or hold a significant amount at inflated prices, but... I will admit that it's a brilliant Medium Of Exchange -- that serves the trodden masses, and takes the Banksters out now the loop of the Parallel Economy.
But it isn't a brilliant medium of exchange. It is extremely cumbersome to get real money in and out of Bitcoin.
Once you have a Bitcoin wallet it is easy to exchange Bitcoin using conversion systems, but using it as a speculative tool to turn dollars into more dollars is terrible. One of the reasons why so many Bitcoin exchanges went down is because when the price started to fall and people wanted to cash out, they found out that their money wasn't going to show up for weeks.
Coinbase is fully insured and funded, and a US company. They existed before the spike, and still exist now. They are the real deal.
100% misinformation and FUD.
Get off the msm coolaid.
well, in europe at least we have bitcoin debit cards so there is nothing you can't buy with btc over here.
you can also just go to an atm and make a cash withdrawal with it
Every single transaction which is made on the blockchain instead of ScamFiat, weakens the influence of the central planners.
Sun Tzu said that the best defense is to remain formless. Gold can be stolen out of your safe. Hard to steal bitcoins from a properly secured offline wallet.
Until the power goes out. D'oh...
The vast majority of fiat commerce is conducted digitally. D'oh...
i love it.
the last argument left against crypto, comedy gold
Lets be honest, if the power goes out we're all basically effed. No lights. No freezers. No food distribution. The only people that will be doing ok are those in farming communities...until a bad harvest or mobs and/or govt shows up. Fortunately, solar power is free and is making the grid less centralized.
Lets be honest, if the power goes out we're all basically effed. No lights. No freezers. No food distribution. The only people that will be doing ok are those in farming communities...until a bad harvest or mobs and/or govt shows up. Fortunately, solar power is free and is making the grid less centralized.
If that extremely unlikely event happens -- right after there's an Alien Invasion (from Space), or a Zombie Apocalypse -- you'll have more basic problems than BTC or Gold.
These people arguing that power and network requirements mean ultimate death for crypto have never heard of solar panels or mesh networks. The world is changing in ways you haven't yet seen.
Got it. So no electrical devices, whatsoever! Guess that means you're done posting at ZH!
OK I've been convinced! Should I contact anyone in particular at Mt. Gox to place my order?
Mt. Gox was neither secure nor offline, so you're really only supporting his argument. Similar to gold, anyone that lets someone else hold all their bitcoin is a fool. Buying bitcoin and holding it offline is the same as buying physical gold and putting it in a safe.
Mt. Gox was neither secure nor offline, so you're really only supporting his argument. Similar to gold, anyone that lets someone else hold all their bitcoin is a fool. Buying bitcoin and holding it offline is the same as buying physical gold and putting it in a safe.
Bitcoin is a lot more than digital numbers. https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf
Get out of your cave, imbecile.
Learn what a scam is moron.
Bitcoin is soaring because those who think people who will never buy a Bitcoin will buy Bitcoin. It is the classic insider set up.
Bitcoin crashed because like Beanie Babies and Tulip bulbs the only buyers left were speculators that weren't actually using Bitcoin for commerce. All of a sudden a whole group of people thinking they were going to sell to a greater fool, found out they were the greatest fool.
The same thing is coming to real estate markets all around the world. What happens to the price of something when there is no longer any buyers left?
You have no idea.
Bitcoin will eat your world. ;)
Let them count their gold and silver coins ... 1,2,3,4 ... and it's gone...
It requires Internet access and power. Even cash doesn't have that ball and chain combo.
It's like an early retard arguing that the first cars required fuel, compared to horses which functioned using water and grass.
Do you seriously think that we'll fall back to the dark ages and won't ever have electricity again if the SHTF? :)
Bad analagy. Good thing you threw in that "retard" to make your argument sound legitimate.
It is a good analogy, actually. Good thing you threw in that remark about making it sound legitimate to make your post funny.
yes he does and has probably been prepping for it to
Fonestar! I thought you flung yourself off a cliff last time bitcoin took a dump.
yes, you keep telling yourself that.
all the way to $10.000 this time round
Because that $1234.56 number on you CapitalOne/ING account is something you can defend with a gun, right?
Physical BTC is the future.
Prices for Precious Metals remain flat. If something was afoot, than PM's would also be up 10% or more.
In my opinion, there will be a dash to cash over the next 4 to 6 months as Market volitility and bond haircuts make waves. People will head for the exits and hold cash, and perhap US treasuries.
Something is afoot .... but with naked shorts in the GLD and SLV paper casino, PM's (or at least the paper version) will not move price at all.
No markets any more - except the crypto exchanges. Yes there is manipulation in those exchanges - old style. Whales, insider trading, pump and dump schemes, outright theft ..... lots.
But currently, no intervention by Central Banks's
Digital numbers are nothing says the person defending his argument via computer comments. "If you can't stand in front of it with a gun and defend it, you don't own it."
So given that logic, do billion dollar tech companies not own their websites? Do banks control the money supply which is based on database transactions? What about movie makers? Guns are great, I love them too, but guns can't solve the same problems as technology can. "Trust" in trade/money can't always involve guns. Otherwise we'd all be pointing a gun at the grocery store cashier to make sure he didn't overcharge us for our bacon and pudding.
You could have just asked how many people in here hold physical stock certificates. I attempted to get these when Google IPO'd.
Digital numbers are nothing says the person defending his argument via computer comments. "If you can't stand in front of it with a gun and defend it, you don't own it."
So given that logic, do billion dollar tech companies not own their websites? Do banks control the money supply which is based on database transactions? What about movie makers? Guns are great, I love them too, but guns can't solve the same problems as technology can. "Trust" in trade/money can't always involve guns. Otherwise we'd all be pointing a gun at the grocery store cashier to make sure he didn't overcharge us for our bacon and pudding.
You can defend your bitcoins with a gun. But you can also defend it with much less than that.
I should've bought a Kruggerand with it when it was at $1,200!
Silly Meat Hammer
Who cares about digital fiat?
GOLD 2.0!!!!!
comparing it to gold is a bit of an insult for bitcoin
"GOLD 2.0!!!!!"
More like "Fiat 2.0" its not a tangible asset and requires a working Internet to be useful. if gov't start pulling the plug on the internet, the grid goes down, bitcoin reverts to its intrinic value: ZERO. Maybe "Zero 2.0"!
goverments are not known for killing themselves and pulling the plug on the internet would be just that.
not that it is possible anyway
A government could very easily block or at least hinder Bitcoin access. I can think of a number of methods just off the top of my head. Block port 8333, or deep packet inspection, or block blockchain.info, or simply prohibit US companies from transacting in Bitcoin, or about a bazillion other ways.
No government has yet been able to completely remove internet access from its population, and many tried during the Arab spring.
Hey, now you look stupid twice... Congrats...
http://www.dailydot.com/technology/broken-cable-internet-island/
I would almost bet Chinese buying.
They never learn.
Or the chinese markets are exploding and bitcoin functions as a safeheavan outside of the influence of cnetral planners. :)
If you can't sell stocks, because the government can simply ban it, why would you buy stocks ever again? Government can't control bitcoin and Chinese will figure that out very quickly.
"If you can't sell stocks, because the government can simply ban it, why would you buy stocks ever again? Government can't control bitcoin and Chinese will figure that out very quickly."
Sure they can. The can simply turn off the internet. if anything Chinese are going to stock on PM's as they have been doing for thousands of years. China is been the biggest importer of Gold for many years.
If they turn off the internet, a little bit more than bitcoin is gone.
So short attention spans will disappear? Where's the plug?
Check out fiatleak.com. Real time bitcoin buying map. When bitcoin first jumped to 1000+, it was a major flow into china with everything else being negligible. Now it's 2:1 US/China. Interesting.
I know something - electroncs are pretty ethereal.
Only that US banks like the Vampire Squid and the Morgue and Shitibank cannot short it
They're probably buying it.
you can short it with upto 50x leverage
You can short bitcoin on most of the larger exchanges. But I don't know anywhere that allows naked shorting of bitcoin and thus, banksters ain't interested. Hopefully any exchange that implements naked shorting finds all their clients up and leave the next day.
Bitcoin is the only asset in the world that is properly pricing in risk right now
It's a free market bitchez!
TPTB aren't worried enough to monkey hammer it, yet.
Why should they be? Bitcoin's market capitalization is like a few days of the federal budget, it's peanuts.
I'm at a loss...and not the first time. But if Greece has no power, how do you convert bitcoin again..
If the infrastructure will be down for prolonged periods then you'll have a lot more on your mind than money.
If it's restored then the bitcoin network can continue as if nothing happened.
Does the bitcoin network have battery backup? Are they Tesla batteries?
It's a network distributed all over the planet. to kill or severely affect it you would require a global, prolonged shutdown of electricity and the internet.
A system that is highly redundant can't be killed.
The network is: whoever happens to be connected to it, soon to include dedicated orbital satellites. No permission needed and no ID checks. We even assume everybody else on the network is lying. That's how the system works and survives. Everyone is constantly backing up to disk, some of that shielded from EMPs. Horribly inefficient but very robust to protect against localized disaster or government interference.
Does the bitcoin network have battery backup? Are they Tesla batteries?
That's the backup: http://sustainableems.com/images/Lighting.jpg
The Spartans will lash the Athenians to a giant treadmill that will power the electric generating plant.
You do what you would do anyways. Leave that shithole for someplace with power, and cash out your BTC into local currency and/or PMs. Easy peasy. No chance of confiscation at the border, either.
carrington even bla bla
the only way we go of grid is after a meteor hits us and we all die.
If the grid is your only argument against it then you should go and buy some
Don't be daft nomo. Bitcoin is EASY to kill and it doesn't have to be a meteor. Government makes bitcoin illegal. Done. I don't EVER see back-alley transactions happening in bitcoin. Gold, yes. Barter, yes. Bitcoin, no.
You are an absolute fool if you think Bitcoin is out of reach of government control.
They could only push it underground if they banned it in their jurisdiction.
If you knew what bitcoin is and how it works, then you wouldn't comment such ignorant nonsense.
LOL, yes it would go underground, but NO ONE is going to accept bitcoin if it is made illegal. Not your back alley drug dealer. Not your under the table plumber. NO ONE.
You are ignoring reality. I know how bitcoin works.
You won't have back alley deals for cans of chicken soup in bitcoin, but the more tech savvy money launderers could very easily transmit large sums of cash across borders anywhere two parties have an internet connection. That's powerful and in and of itself a reason it won't go away.
You have to be able to convert it back into something non virtual on the other side of the border. Good luck with that.
The darknet markets are booming. Your opinion is invalid.
Yeah, like remember when they decide to crack down on illegal drugs? </sarc>
China did ban bitcoin, guess what, Chinese people still buy and use bitcoin.
Governments have also banned private gold ownership, guess what, people still held and transacted in gold.
Bitcoin is unstoppable just as filesharing over torrents are unstoppable.
Government is not God.
Solar.
Why is "Bitcoin" the only digital currency that ever gets discussed? Hmm? The idea that some digital computer read out can be a way to "fight the fiat" controllers is hilarious to me. It makes no sense. Whatever meme those in control want, they get. They crushed this dangerous little case out of the public eye and the public record. It was just too hot. And was too stinking honest about Fiat and fractional reserve. http://www.thetruthaboutthelaw.com/banks-lend-money-they-create-out-of-t...
... Calm before the storm.
@".. Does Someone Know Something?" B...
negative.
Somebody knows it's a free market unlike this shit we're trading.
I know that bitcoin is fucking awesome. :)
fonestar hit the lottery?