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Paying In A Broken World
Submitted by Tom Chatham via Project Chesapeake,
It is a common reaction to ask, how much is that, when we see something we want or need. The question is answered with some monetary figure that people will recognize and use to determine if they can afford it. But what happens when the monetary system we know becomes so dysfunctional that common monetary values mean little.
This could happen due to massive inflation, currency collapse or a frozen banking system that prevents you from accessing your funds. If you have no way to pay for something, it does not matter how much or little it costs. It will be out of your reach unless you have some means to pay.
Some people keep cash on hand for just such a problem. They know they will be able to pay cash when everything else stops working. That will work for a time but eventually paper currency will be looked on as a diminishing asset as physical goods become more valuable to those that need them. Paper currency is not much different than a check you write on your account. If the account is empty your check is no good.
The same can be said for those entities that issue paper money. If they are bankrupt or shut down, the value of their printed certificates will be worth the same as the bad check. Nobody will want to accept it after they realize it may not be honored for the value it supposedly holds. While a local store may accept it out of habit, eventually businesses will figure out the truth.
In times like this alternative forms of money may become more viable to local individuals such as gold and silver. But, that may take some time and most people will not own any of these precious metals for trade. Some may resort to direct barter with some of the things they have amassed over the years to get the necessities they need and under these circumstances values will be variable and disconnected from reality at times.
Some people have stored barter items for this eventuality rather than precious metals and there is nothing wrong with that if it gives them the feeling of safety they desire. One of the reasons they desire goods instead of metals is the fear that governments will call in precious metals as they did in 1933 and that is a legitimate fear but must be taken with some reflection on the facts.
In 1933, gold and silver coinage was the circulating currency in the nation meaning most people had some in their possession. That is not the reality today as very few people have any knowledge of the value of metals and do not have them in their possession. The fact that the government can call in metals does not mean they will be able to relieve you of them.
In 1933, on the river where I grew up, there was a store on the bank of the river that did a good business with all of the ships that came by. When the gold was called in in 1933, the store owner did not want to turn it in so he kept it hidden away. At the time he had a small chest full of gold coins. He kept that chest of coins until the 1970’s when gold was legal to own again and then he sold it for a good profit. This is a true story and just one example of how hard it would be for the government to call in all of the metals in private hands.
It does not matter what you hold your savings in only that it will retain value when conventional paper currencies become a despised possession. When that happens you need the ability to buy the things you need with what you physically have on hand. The question you must answer is what will you have on hand when that day comes.
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In 1933 FDR did the bidding of the you-know-who's and went on to help make the world safe for Kleptocracy.
"How much is it?"
You got a purdy mouth, boy.
my roomate's sister-in-law makes $72 every hour on the laptop . She has been unemployed for nine months but last month her pay was $12384 just working on the laptop for a few hours. find out here... www.earnmore9.com
I remember visitng Europe in the 1960s. No-one wanted American dollars in some of the countries we visited. They would take them very reluctantly at a huge premium. We had been warned and our entire group had brought rolls of Kennedy half dollar coins. 90% silver. These were eagerly accepted at much more than face value.
Marc Faber on gold and the 'colossal systemic risk in markets'
http://www.planbeconomics.com/2015/07/marc-faber-warns-of-colossal-syste...
Hmm, in a world in which banks and therefore the rule of law have become near worthless, do i want to be holding a chest of gold or a hundred tonns of wheat? With the former i supposedly don't have to worry about hunger, but so with the latter (and certainly), nor do i have to find someone to exchange it with, or worry about thieves. I just have to sit on my property, gun in hand, and wait for others to brave the wild to bring me THEIR gold!
This article show it clearly: being a goldbug is not being a prepper, but being the greedy guy sitting on his chest of gold hoping it will appreciate. The same kind of greedy guy who doesn't give a shit for the country as long he makes a profit and sits in some neat office in a bank across the state.
So you'd rather have a hundred tons of wheat instead of a small box of gold? Let me introduce you to Executive Order 13603. Pay close attention to Part II Section 201 where it says that the Secretary of Agriculture can confiscate any Food Resources.
Personally, I'd choose the gold. If they tried to confiscate it you could always bury it deep in a box and leave the treasure map to your kids.
Scooby gave his chest of gold to the two young men Perry Cohen and Austin Stephanos and with it a treasure map of the Bahama islands. On the map an 'X' marked the spot where I instructed the young lads to bury my chest of gold to keep it from the cluches of the evil American oligarchs and their rehypothication schemes.
Where's Scooby's Gold, the board game available for $19.99 in the ZH swag store today.
You must have a big family if you think you're going to eat all that wheat before it rots away.
Or do you plan on tossing the old and renewing your hundred tons of wheat every year or two while waiting for the collapse?
Also, what's your plan when the pavement apes see 100 tons of wheat sitting there and decide to help themselves? You better have a whole lot of bodies to man your "gun in hand."
"...in a world in which banks and therefore the rule of law have become near worthless"
When banks do become "worthless," that will mean that the rule of law has been restored.
Like they would know what wheat was, in the first place. If someone told them what it was theyd still have no use for it.
Just like in the Walking Dead, do you want to try to get your hand on some prison land that is way out in the country? They like to build some of the facilities out in the hinterlands and maybe they have nice tillable soil within the perimeter. Seem like they usually are surrounded by farm land in my area. Hopefully all the inmates are dimwitted enough to see freedom within grasp and flock back to the cities to rape and pillage there. Might be able to get a nice fairly easy place to protect all the crops. Siege mentality to commence.
And here I thought I WAS the oldphart!
Even today, 62 Kennedy half dollars are worth $32.00.
"just working on the laptop for a few hours"
More like working on the lap for a few hours. She must give the worst head.
It was your mother the other week, you are starting to run out of comrads warrior.
It is just smart to keep some CA$H around in case things get rough. Cash will be accepted as THE most liquid currency at the beginning of anything really bad. Perhaps 3 months worth of cash if you can manage to do that.
And, of course, hold physical gold. Perhaps some silver too (but SILVER has NOT been used in recent hyperinflations -- people spend the local currency, and spend it FAST). 5% - 10% in gold is enough, that puts anyone in the 1% of gold owners...
Bitcoin is an interesting speculation, but I would not (and do not) hold more than 1% tops. BTC is a Lotto ticket. But, probably useful as a quiet way of transferring wealth very quietly if you leave the country...........
Damn that's funny TD!
Three weeks after gold confiscation act, the sollar was devalued 40%. Befoe, gold was $20.64ish. After $35. It's just math folks.
Let's see . . . in a world where paper money is worthless and law doesn't exist,
what would be good to have on hand?
Guns and ammo on the list?
In the 1930's there was no digital. What records were kept was on paper and difficult to sort. Today is different. Mr. Digital can sort and give a list of who has what. Now you may have sold some or given some away but they know where every ounce is thats been purchased in the last 20 years.
Buy on the internet? Go back and check your account. It will show everything you purchased and that is probably stored on some spooks computer system.
That's why I am stacking scotch faster than I drink it.
Got a shelf life and not everyone drinks. Just sayin
I'll have to drink it?
The tragedy..the sad tragedy of having to drink all o' that.
Just...just...just brings a tear to me eye...
And setting aside a pipe, some pipe tobacco, and some cigars. Oh the humanity.
I've been buying bulk tobacco, joint papers, filters and cigarette tubes with hand machines to fill them...I plan on baggies of one ounce of tobacco with ten joint papers or five filters and cigarette tubes. (I call them joint papers, but their really rolling papers, but the younger crowd has no clue.) Tobacco, one silver dollar, papers or cigarette paraphanallia 3 silver dollars.
Hundred pound of tobacco is a pain in the ass to store, luckily it's infood grade plastic wrap adn none of it will mean shit when SHTF and smokers run out of Marlboro's. (I'm a Marlboro smoker, too)
Between tobacco and Tampex, I'm a Pirate King.
I don't have anything else, really, nothing but tobacco and tampex.
Respect.
Used to smoke American Spirit pouches and I've recently bought some organically grown leaves from LeafOnly - they have been good. Roll my own smokes in traditional cone style. Not an expert roller but a worthy contender to the best. Definitely will be stocking up on tobacco and papers. Lots and lots of papers. And lighters too, don't forget lighters. My rolly smokes will go for a premium if purchased. They usually only get gifted.
1973, was sent north to my Uncle in Myer's Flat, California...a speck on the backwoods trail to such amizing cities like Yrika and Ureka.
Ok, so my Uncle is an alternative, hippe sort of guy, back in the 70's [He died last year, just so you know this is a quasi-memorial (that means remove you're fuckin hats, you morons) of the hippie mind-set. I am not making up anything I'm about to tell you.
Uncle Jay initially didn't farm pot, he went out, bought it from various farms, brought it back home and tried to entreprenalize weed in a fully rolled, ready to smoke, fashion. The world wasn't ready for him. In the meantime, he brewed some of the best beer a 13 yar old had ever tasted [at 13 I actually was jaded on beer, I'd spent the summer digging a trench from the well to the pig-pen, five to three feet down, five hundred feet long, with a four inch wide spade, in 120* temp. I left Lucky Lager bottle tops every ince of the way. Deciding that ability to figure out the bottle top rebus was a certain sign of intoxication.]
At Uncle Jay's trailer {ahem, mobile home, no, a fuckin' trailer that a '59 volkwagen would haul over the Rockies without a hiccup.}Worse, there's four people liiving there, add my Mom Dropped Me Here ass in an you have five [Cousin Toottie, however, was pretty hot at sixteen or whatever teenage year she was in!) people in a shit hole trying to survive. Aunt Beaula, full blood Amerikan Indian, was nice but demanded self support, at 13 that seemed pretty daunting.
To Beaula and any other woman that married into my family...and stayed...I especally admire you...you HAD to have a sense of humor so strong that you actually had to enjoy the total bullshit thrown at you by your spouse and his brothers. I'm the King of Bullshit due to my lineage. I can make shit up at the drop of a hat, and people will enjoy hearing my explanation (I think that's the Irish in me.).
Anyway, mom sends me to Uncle Jay, his son, my cousin, is made quarapalegic due to a dope fueled truck accident. My mom has trained me in CPR, resucitation, nursing and a shitload of other common sense things...(she was the first fucking Nurse Practitioner in the Nation, and a Senior Chief Master Sergeant of the US Air Farce...has her own humanitarian award and supreme court ruling, do NOT fuck with her as a 13 year old, or any year old, she'll eat your balls and laugh at the lack of size,,she's a tough woman even today[yes, my mother actually DID wear combat boots <my devastating reply to the taunt was "Yes, she does." "What does your mom wear?").> (It was the 60's, so it was much more effective)
Anyway, mom takes sisters to Iowa for the summer, I'm condemned to take dried leaves of summer and grind them through a metal calander, by hand, After what seems like a ton of pot through the calendar, I am to help roll joints in zig-zag papers.
I get good at it. I get damned good at it. I start taking 6 zigzags and glueing them toghether and roll a pot cigar. I put nine together and I've got the Nanci Pelosi special (she wasn't around then, but still...) I could roll four joijts at a time, two in each hand, I mastered that shit. Didn't smoke a one until I went with Jay and Bealah to visit my cousin, still recovering from his horrible accident. Pushed his ass out into the parking lot and lit his joint. Sat and watched traffic go by and smoked a cig. Pot wasn't and isn't my taste, those that like it are welcomed to it. I just don't like it, tried it, inhaled it, don't like it, haven't done it in god knows how many years.
So we're in this parking lot and he finishes his joint and says what he really wants is a great, big, mother-fucking cigar joint. I happened to have on in my shirt pocket. It was about 1/2 inch thick and six inches long, about four times the size of my dick with old people's viagra. He took four puffs off it, leaned back in the wheelchair, and handed it back to me in a peer-pressure moment. I took one hit and handed it back. I pushed his wheelchair up the sidewalk, the the sidewalk went 90* to the right. I knew immediately that I was fucked up, the weight in the chair didn't change, nothing else had changed...only my world was tilted 90* to the right.
Got his ass reasonably close to his room and sat down to clear my head. Left that evening, toldmy Uncle I had to water the pigs, hitchhiking from Myer's Flat to Bakersfield, then to Barstow and walking back to Lucerne Valley. Mom , sisters and another Uncle had gone to Iowas for the summer, so I had about 35 miles walk or hitchhike through the desert.
At about ten miles, I thought to myself...you know, if you light up a cigarette it's guarantee mom will immediately show up to bitch your ass into toddlerhood. I'm ten miles into absolutely nothing but nothing of desert, minimum 25 miles to go jsut ot hit town, let alone another five miles to home,..I've hi9tchhiked, unannounced, unplanned, alone, 13 years old, some 500 or 600 miles...so I light up a cigarette. Over the rise comes mom and Uncle Troy.
A true story.
Just proves you can't hitch hike in california, and you never could.
My brave kids will never make it past wi-fi coverage... seriously.
We would glue papers together and called the result Jefferson Starships.
Now that theres a POST! If you can string a few more together OldPhart, I'd buy the damn book!
"bitched your ass into toddlerhood"...I'm gonna use that one if I may...with full credit to you if asked..
OP, I've read your stories about your childhood trip to CA - this is a cherry on the top. Thank you for sharing that classic tale. Mama always shows up at the right time. :-)
FF, shelf life of booze: "Whiskey is one of the most popular liquors and, similarly to vodka, has an almost indefinite shelf life – when stored properly".
I keep 24 1.75 liter bottles on hand at all times. For me, that's about 6 months.
http://www.doesitgobad.com/does-whiskey-go-bad/
Vodka also makes a great antiseptic in a pinch.
I store all my liquor in my liver. Apparently, it doesnt last as long there.
Now you have gone and done it.
We will have to suffer through a bunch of boating accident posts....
Accident? Hell after the last take down I just threw 48 Troy gold , 4 Platinum , one Paladium and 3000 troy silver into the atlantic.
It's ok
I found it.
By "They" I assume you are referring to the .gov?
Which in the kind of meltdown everyone is prepping for, will have absolutely no ability, manpower, logistics, or political will to be going house to house, searching for hard assets!!!
You think the .govs of the Ukraine, Libya, Argentina, Venezuela, etc are in any position today, to be doing anything other then clinging to
Power??
You think America will be any better when the U.S. Dollar has the value of toilet paper????
We will have to contend with the heavily armed and absolutely clueless period (about ten years) where the military/quasi-governmental enforcement (IRS, DHS, FBI, USPS< etc) has room to expend something like three billion rounds of hollow points, usually in the early morning hours of 3 to 5, by tens of militarized police and swat teams invading a house for excess water/power/internet usage complete with baby-burning flashbangs, tear gas, and bean bag shots to the guts for all in the home as they exit screaming in terror.
Size, organization, communication and unity has supremacy over any single individual. They have a target, they organize, they plan, they pull in resources, they coordinate, they arm, they stage, they look at logistics. The target mows his lawn, drinks a beer, dozes, and in the middle of fucking his wife, everything goes to hell for no fathomable reason.
He'd be lucky to come out of it alive.
10 years? Try about 2 weeks after the paychecks stop, or can't be cashed. 2 weeks is your window for how long people will continue to show up for work without pay.
Most of their shit will rot before it can be used. A SHTF scenario means no economy...how do you pay these guys? They will quickly realize the currency is or will soon be worthless. Within a month half of your security forces will have bugged out and gone back home to their families...Because of the money, and because it suddenly occurs to them that another security unit might be doing the same things to THEIR communities, THEIR families as they're doing to someone else's right now...(That's the big problem with your domestic-type unrest...your soldiers and their families often LIVE on the battlefields-these aren't foreign invaders they are being set against, it's their neighbors.)
That big scary military complex doesn't work well without a lot of people minding all the moving parts. And it stops working altogether with no money for your soldiers. Order will unwind surprisingly quickly when the money stops. It took decades, disciplined and ample manpower, and a well-functioning economy to build and maintain that huge military. If it all goes to pieces, they will not be able to restore it in those conditions, ever. Shit will be knocked back to the local militia level. And all those departing soldiers will be bringing whatever they could grab back home with them, so most will be pretty well-armed.
But central authority will go bye-bye...
Mr. Digital may THINK that he knows everything all that he wants.
How much Gold and Silver have you purchased privately, where there is no paper trail or digital trail?
The Gold Market is currently a Grey Market...hopefully soon to be a Black Market...and that means that i want it to be traded as an illegal substance.
Most people that I know will CURRENTLY shy away from ANY DEALER who keeps any records of any kind...just like in the illegal drug trade.
Where does on find a private dealer who doesn't charge a huge markup for silver and gold coins? I think this record-keeping concern is what some private dealers base their large premiums on.
Anyone know anything about this?
Personally speaking, if it gets so bad that they have to go door to door, I plan on going down with the ship. In one hand a mug of bourbon, the other a hog leg.
Shit, if it gets that bad, just shoot the mother at the door, because there's no effective government anymore and you are on your own.
Of course if you are wrong about anything, it 's get treated as you would treat others so, see ya, don't to be ya, SUCKER!
I have a hand in managing my company's contact database management. It's not hard to accidentally bloat a database to 5x it's size with crap entries, or to accidentally rearrange thousands of people with a bad query
I also knew one of the healthcare.gov developers, though he made me swear to never divulge his name because no one wanted that boondoggle on their resume. In his case, it was nothing short of a nightmare to get a handful of federal databases to talk to each other.
Finally, I do some contracting for federal agency reporting (NSF/research related), and here again, my experiences with government databases so far is that they're a hodgepodge of one-off projects. It's near impossible to find anything meaningful, and since reporting requirements change at least annually, who knows what the quality of the databases are after years of changes and dictates.
No guarantees of safety by incompetence, obviously, but at minimum I expect some people to get away while plenty of 'innocent' sheep get caught up in the meat grinder because the gold owner lived in his apartment 15 years ago.
I agree that the digital trail of our purchases has been watched by the all seeing eye of Sauron. The success of dispatching the orcs to retrieve what has been lost or traded in the ensuing chaos is another matter.
Well, since I almost always buy resale/second hand, they must be wondering about me..."Hey, look at this! This woman has not purchased a pair of shoes in over 40 years! And Jesus, the last winter coat she bought was back in High School, a fucking half a century! And she lives in the northeast...Look at this...no pants, blouses...She has NEVER purchased furniture, books, CD's, jewelry...nothing...And she's got 11.76 in her checking account. WTF!?"
Except for food, meds, gas, and a few recurring bills, my purchase history of over a half-century is a closed book to them. No records, no trail, no indication of what I DID with all the money I made. And no way around that fact for the nosey-Parkers...
This includes all my stacking...There is no record anywhere of ANY of my PM purchases, and I've been at it awhile. All they've got there are my few sales a few years ago when it went high and I wanted a quick few bucks. They don't know WHAT I've got, just what I occasionally sell, but by then, it's gone...Then I go, "Ooops, sorry, that was the last of it!"
One of the greatest frauds perpetuated is the belief that pension schemes are safe and that they also return an amount greater than inflation over a long period of time.
I say BULL.
If you think that you will live to age 80 after retiring then you need to save almost one third of your income in one form or another to live out that remainding period.
Returns at best simply keep pace with inflation.
The next question is of course, WHAT to save in?
The answer by far is gold and silver for at least 30% of that saving because of its portability, universal acceptability and inability to be produced by a printing press or a computer.
Here is another thought, Do something you like to do and make some income. Then do that as long as you can, just don't retire.
There is much truth in what you say but there are very few things one can do till age 80 and still make an income. How many George Burns can there be?
Mind you, watching the participation rate of those 65 and over go through the roof in recent years makes it look like a necessity rather than a past time.
My Dad just turned 80.
He's building a fence line, with a post hole driller, manually, using railroad ties and barbed wire.
{son of a bitch didn't even let me know he might need help.)
He's fenced about thirty acres of his five. No one in China has ever come to check their properties.
Adverse Selection rules.
don't worry, they shall drain all of our savings first to make us totally controlable.
Well, maybe not all of us. ;-)
Absolute control is a psychopath's ultimate wet dream but difficult to pull off. There is always the unforeseen random element.
Miffed;-)
Time is usually not on the side of the psychopathic dictators. They always push too far.
(It's nice being back here, Miffed)
I am not a long timer Mr Dochen but I missed your wisdom and your dry wit. But if this takes away from family time then be gone again. But if it helps keep you sane then stay and help keep me sane.
^
ANYONE who is nice to me gets green.
v
I'm not nice to anyone.
I'm cordial to all.
Say what you want, say what you mean. I'll try to understand, but may reject it and think you're a fellow idjit.
Keep sending those personal emails of your family and life, I read them and cheer for you, DoChen. You're a family man doing what you gotta do the best you can. That has all my respect.
Well then let me be the first to give you a hearty welcome back! I guess anonymity is prudent in this situation so I will contain my curiosity. I have been saddened by the rash of bannings that have recently taken place ( if this is what has happened). They do seem unfounded on a forum espousing open free thought and discussion.
I hope at this time I won't be banned. I am recovering from surgery and am bed bound for two weeks. I am hoping Zh will keep my mind stimulated and less focused on the pain. Yahoo and huffpo are poor substitutes. I think I would just catch up on my reading if it should happen, nothing else being of much interest.
Miffed;-)
You are not going to be banned. For what?
I am far more likely to be banned than you.
I am still here. So are you. We are still welcome GUESTS.
Just remember it is unwise to disrespect your hosts.
They will give you the boot out the door quick if you were in somebody's physical home and disrespected your hosts.
Why would it be any different here?
We are just guests and nothing more than that.
In someone else's castle you waive your rights. I was taught, at a very early age, that once I crossed over that US-Mexican Border into Tijuana then I had voluntarily waived all rights and that I was a guest of the Nation State of Mexico.
This space belongs to Tyler and ZH. I do not pay the bills. Do you?
It is his castle. He built it.
Heal up soon. Hopefully this will relieve you of the pain totally. My prayers are with you.
how can your prayers be with anyone else?
do they magically teleport?
do you have any other supernatural powers you'd like to share?
How do you know who's been banned? I don't know how to check that...
Hope your surgery went well and whatever it was is cured. (My last surgery, in the neck for excruciating pain in hands and arms, didn't work [pardon the typosl but fingers are numb and don't do what I tell tehm anymore]
For what it's worth Miffed, I find your post thoughtful and stimulating. And when they're down your alley, like Ebola, I consider you the truth-teller. (Anything else you post is similar to the same bullshit that I post however)
I also appreciate a woman's sense of what's what here on ZH. I've been marred for so long I have to acknowledge that. Strong women are sexy. You are a strong woman. You make statements, argue them, and generally bitch with the rest of us. I admire that.
[those other strong wimmen in the ZH background...come out of the closet, be who you are...be your inner-bitchl,] no one here gives a shit. But, from time to time, you may have something to say that we all need to hear.
When you do...
I'd like a roast beef sammich, please.
Thanks for the laugh OP and Tom, though doing so does come with a painful cost! Lets just say I try to be authentic to who I am and what I believe. It really doesn't matter what others think of you. I'm glad when I am challenged here and it is nice to find like minded friends but I'd certainly rather have a quiet Ebola-less time ahead of us! Microbes are not to be messed with on a large scale!
I went in for a scar revision for surgery I had 2 years ago. Looked pretty straight forward. Cut out the 6 inch long 2 inch wide scar that had been bothering me. Put in a drain line and in 2 weeks good to go. Turned out to be far more involved when he found there was just not enough tissue to resuture. I'm looking at a 6 week recovery now. At least no muscle was cut but I'm in far more pain then before and I must stay in bed for at least two weeks. Poor mr has his hands full but when I'm better, he will be treated in the royal way he is accustomed!
Thanks for the call to the other ZH women! I've been trying to prod a few to come out of the closet. So far no takers!
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=FQ5YU_spBw0
Miffed;-)
Wish you well, Miffed
As an overall concept, yes, but I wonder if that's how it will play out in practice.
Personally, if I was to pull such a stunt, I would "temporarily" block access to everyone's funds. This would keep them hanging on for a long time in hopes of regaining all or part of their funds before they go pirating off into the wild blue yonder.
Wipe everyone out-- instant revolution.
Keep their funds but hold out hope of eventually getting back to normal--unhappy compliance but compliance nonetheless.
For a nice real-world example of this, visit the holders of halted issues on the Shanghai and Shenzen exchanges.
And, on a personal note, unless I win the Mega-Millions drawing or stumble over the equivalent of Australia's "Welcome Stranger", I am supremely insulated against anybody coming after my savings.
when banks are heavily leveraged and paying savers practically ZERO in interest, why would you put any cash in a bank? It is better to just have physical cash. There clearly is no safety in a bank in times of stress as this has been made very clear in the case of Greece. What happens to Europe comes home to the US to roost. You are forewarned.
Useless space-filler.
Don't forget guns, ammo and several cases of good booze. Naked pix of Hillary... Oh yeah... lots of TP.
I'll pass on the nekkid pics of Hillary,
Took a peek at Germany's Hitlery. http://i.imgur.com/DBt1Gdp.jpg
While not bad, not particularly global porn star quality. Nor is Hillary in her prime.
I have to assume that Merkel is left handed, zee bush is gardened to the right in a tight nazi fashion, but the left grows wild.
Now that's "financial doom porn"!
Couple of points about the 1933 call-in.
1) Silver coins never ceased to be minted or to circulate (until 1965).
2) Numismatic gold (coin collection-grade) was exempt from the call-in.
3) Mining of gold and silver remained perfectly legal (temporarily suspended during the War Emergency)
For those who assume that the government will model future actions on the setting of an earlier precedent, invest in legal tender collectible-grade coinage and get yourself a patented mining claim.
You raise good points there tarabel.
US $5.00 gold pieces in decent (say "XF") condition are some 25% of a premium over gold spot price (common date). Buying some US gold coins from the 1800s (not as expensive as one would think) is diversification within gold...
Only 1% - 2% of Americans own physical investment gold.
You can be in the "1%" if you have 5% in gold. Not even banksters nor stockbrokers would argue that. More gold is even better, but 10% - 15%, IMO, is plenty.
"Buy as much gold as you understand."
Who's going to come on my land to check whether my gold coins are numismatic or not? Gimme a break. That is just a technicality, and no one will risk invading private property over that disinction. Either own some gold or don't, but if you own it, make sure you HOLD it.
^^^What this asshole said.
You either have it or don't, and wished shit secrets out your hands for it.
I'm working on getting my gold stock to one pound. Silver to fifty pounds.
Almost there, but watching gold take a shit for the lst month.
Unless we return to a gold standard in which the government declares it will surrender gold for currency, it is more likely it will confiscate pensions and savings accounts rather than gold. Those it can easily seize. Gold it would have to physically locate even if it knew the owners.
Far easier to 'buy' gold with new currency. It would be with a willing seller.
think they will confisct, but through a windfall tax if it goes nut. Much easier to do
Windfall US taxes do not apply in other countries.
Windfall profit? Only if you convert it back into FRNs.
My gold is already in dollars. The amount of dollars it is worth is stamped on the back of the coin by the US Treasury. They decided it was worth $50, not me.
So don't ever convert it back. Just "spend" it.
Only a moron would pay a windfall profits tax. If that happens, the smart people will conduct any transactions using gold on the black market, away from government hands.
I know the common concern is that pension funds and savings accounts will be confiscated, but why would the central planners want to tick off the legions of retirees when the simplest solution is to have the FED mouse click a few trillion to the insolvent funds?
Collapse of the currency is the more likely outcome.
We have to buy shares in Netflix to save our society.
His Netflix is F*cked Up - YouTube
Don't be like some ignorant beetle-browed Russkie, or east Asian worker drone. Invest in Netflix, Google and JPM... and leave a legacy of dynastic wealth that lift your decendents to the ionosphere, and beyond! Amurica... Fuck Yeah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Remember: ""They work, we think."`
(whoops... wrong thread)
oops, double post. Time to blow away NSA advertisers.
Stop being concerned that your little scams will be discoversd. All the laws are bogus and we just need to get used to living above them. We have all gotten away with something. Felt good didn't it?
Ask Bruce Jenner if he felt good after duct tapping his penis. What a sick world we live in.
Gold jewelry was never confiscated.
The Hell you say
http://www.guardian.co.tt/news/2015-03-30/hours-after-warning-mom-man-killed-gold-chain
Diversification within the asset class is also a decent strategy.
While Jewelry is not as liquid, it still retains much of the value and is worth as much as 90% of Melt Value, that is, 90% of the value of the percentage of Gold present, as it is Karat Gold, in most cases.
(Perhaps one can garner more but I am writing about small quantities and the General Public.)
It is wise to have some Bullion, some Numismatic, some Fine Jewelry, and some refined Flour Gold (not melted) as it becomes easy to conceal.
(Can you believe that we even have to consider this as there exists a probablity that the Government will move to steal it? That really is demonstrative as to the degree of the degeneration of the current Social Structure in the USA.)
+ 5
Common date US $5.00 gold pieces in XF/AU condition from the 1800s are a lot cheaper than people might expect. They contain almost 1/4 oz of gold.
And who's going to take away NUMISMATIC coin collections?
Retracted.
They allowed you to keep your wedding ring, and that was it.
And Indian women have always known this. Which is why so many Indian families wealth is in the form of women's jewelry. It is used just like money, or to get 'gold loans' from their bank to start a business, etc.
Here in the West it's more likely to be the man who keeps coins or bars in a safe...MUCH more likely to be confiscated by authorities. Your wife can walk around like Mr. T and they're not going to take that jewelry off of her. The most they'll do is try to appeal to patriotism so she'll turn it in voluntarily, or try to forbid her from selling it. But they'll demand the stuff in your safe.
back in those days, the 1930's, it was easier to keep some coins hidden away, there was more respect for the rights of the individual and private property, now...not so much
Just harder to track back then. Society had respect for property, today, not so much.
The free shit crowd has been taught they are victims and deserve what is yours.
Thanks Tel Aviv. We'll send you another check for 750 billion so you can fuck 15 year old females and have anal sex with boys under the Talmud laws.
Fuck you Zionist cunts. Start funding your own war. Your're considered pack of traveling gypsies. Hope your passport gets revoked.
Zionist scumbags, do you remember the art students canvassing neighborhoods prior to 9/11?
Don't wanna invest in gold? Don't. Keep 9 grand or so in a foreign bank account. I keep silver cause it's worth 1/50th the gold it was during the gold standard, but my old man yells at me while drinking a lot of beer about how it's not gonna be worth anything. He predicts stuff better tan you, just don't cross our property line. I been mowing to keep it nice and wide... But anyway know that it's an inflationary depression. $20 trillion to expand the monetary base by 10%, and they'll do it many umptine times over. Putin would say "If it goes up, gold will be worth the 50% risk at a fraction of the cost". However, it's nice to have some whiskey, ammo, and nicotine on hand.
the community gave me a bunghole psychyatrist, don't know if they're letting me post. Lol snoopy!
....whiskey, ammo, and coffee. You think smokers are going to last long, whether the SHTF or not? Good luck with that.
Some nice chickens would kick butt. Rabbits? Some means of producing anything of value. Soap. A spinning wheel and assorted tools maybe a loom. A few miles of good thread like 20.
Things that must have value added before they are ready for trade. Five hundred bucks could buy you a pile of producer shit. Then you can trade like mad.
In a mad max deal I might be the hose clamp guy. Among other things. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q1FyLsCa-58
I've been thinking like this a few years. Collapse means new opportunity, if you are ready for it. Almost like that's the plan, when I think about it. Wonder what plans the tribal bankers have for getting rich out of it?
Woke up in a cold sweat from a bad dream last night. Collapse, the kids were starving to death in front of my eyes. Fucking horrible. Worst thing you could have to endure, watching your kids starve. That's what makes me take this shit so seriously. If it was just me....fuck it, life is short, I'll get by. When young kids need to be fed, it's a different equation. So I keep reading my doom porn, and getting ideas. One thing on my agenda is to buy an old diesel bus, people will need transport when their cars stop running, and if I can't get diesel for it I can always use it as a living space.
Up to about a hundred birds this year, chickens, turkeys, ducks. Sounds a lot....but with 5 mouths to feed that meat will go fast. Eggs are where it's at. If you want chickens, make sure it is a good laying breed. Also one that likes to sit on its eggs, most don't nowadays, its been bred out of them. Heritage turkeys are good for that,
INDICTMENT
Americans are criminals because Americans violate the Constitution of the United States of America.
The U.S. President Obama, the entire U.S. Congress, the CIA, the FBI, the U.S. Military, and the entire Police Force of these United States SWORE to protect, serve and uphold the U.S. Constitution.
The U.S. Constitution forbids usage of debt as money (referred to as 'notes') and stipulates that only gold and silver can be used as money.
Yet,
Americans commit or support and condone the murder and torture of human beings throughout planet earth in the name of democracy and freedom, all for the sake of acquiring Constitutionally fraudulent and illegal Federal Reserve Notes a.k.a (counterfeit) U.S. Dollars.
Since the United States is a democracy and Americans only elect Democrats and Republicans who perpetuate this unlawfulness,
Americans are indicted criminals according to the United States Constitution.
Spread the word.
Thats some twisted logic right there boys. A mental tripple lindy.
The reality? If the paper fiat system collapses, most people will just die. If the grocery store has no food, they have no way of feeding themselves. If some self-sufficient person has a garden, it will be raided. In the first days ....
Everyone just REALLY needs to believe in the Status Quo; I have a theory, there are three classes of people. People that think, people that emote, and the third class, the majority, people who just live on the surface. The latter class neither thinks nor emotes; they just live on some surface plane and go along to get along.
Those people are actually the scariest .... they have no thoughts at all. And this IS the majority.
Their daily thoughts are 'I want free shit - give me yours'
The ones that only want "free shit" are easily appeased.
It's the ones who want YOUR SHIT that you need to worry about. Cost is not the issue with them. They don't care what it IS, or if they even need or want it, they just want to TAKE it from you. Just to show you who's boss. Folks like that are not welfare recipients. They CREATE and RUN the programs like welfare. You elect them every few years...you know, that group.
Enough, I hear what you are saying but if you look at Argentina, Weimar and Zimbabwe you see populations that muddles through. This guy has lived through it: http://ferfal.blogspot.com/
His suggestions on guns, gold and situational awareness are on point.
Argentine is a failed state, but it still has relatively low margin trade routes with non failed states. The ability of gold to hold value (relative to say, canned food) in such a scenario is not going to be the same as in a global SHTF scenario.
The 1000 bic lighter meme is closer to what would happen in my opinion. Gold and silver might become currency again, but massively deflated relative to non perishable consumer goods.
Lighters have a limited shelf life, in my unfortunate experience. Don't depend on them.
Matches are so old school eh, but they fucking work. You can still buy them if you look.
Gold ONLY holds value if a collapse is LOCAL. It has value in other parts of the world.
If a collapse is worldwide, then gold will be nearly worthless. Hard goods and needed basic services will be the currency of the day.
my garden is my trap, my shotgun will have me well stocked in long pork in such a scenario.
Great job Miffed and get well soon!! I've read every one of your posts for years, and as a young man (on this forum), I have learned much. Thank you and please keep us posted on the latest in SoCal. I hate to say it, but any fire in the SW will start with a spark near you, and I'm not talking about wildfires. Take care.
I've become wary of buying eagle-anything, Au or Ag. Since they have a face value and are US legal tender I fear Owebomba or one of his fanboys will move against those, first.
I hope the fanboys have excellent scuba skills and the uncanny ability to find small items on the seabed.
Victor Sperandeo thinks Eagles will be the only safe haven re: bullion, since it's illegal for govt to confiscate currency. (Search "Victor Sperandeo the Coming Hyperinflation - a video)
I'm not convinced that Eagles are the only thing to hold and something being "illegal" has never stopped the govt before, but there you have it - from Trader Vic.
Thanks for pointing that out, I appreciate hearing another side.
I stand corrected.
Yes, when you come to barter your last Krugerrand for a sack of potatoes to feed your starving family the question of change will be a knotty problem.
Not really
90% silver dimes, quarter, halves and silver dollars
1, 5, 10 ounce silver bars
1/10 1/4 1/2 and 1 ounce gold pieces.
If you graduate up with your stash you have the ability to scale your purchases
It's the sellers that set the price and value of what you have to trade.
You think your 1oz gold coin is worth $1,000? I'll give you 100 lb of potatoes and even throw in a chicken for it.
Price isn't "set" by either buyer or seller. It is negotiated between the two...Something our economy, and many people in it, have forgotten.
When you reduce it to someone 'winning' and someone 'losing', or one party having some kind of 'upper hand' you make it a competition between the two. Which is exactly what is wrong with the way we do our business. It's supposed to be a MUTUALLY BENEFICIAL thing.
This kind of thinking in everything is completely fucking everything up.
Actually, I can envision a situation where I'd make that trade and take the food. Eggs from the chicken and 100 lb of potatoes can go a looooong way. If they're organic, I can use them as seed spuds and grow more.
Precisely the reason that I hold gold (and silver) (and cash). Get to know the farmers in your area, and if possible, MOVE closer to them.
There won't be any change from a Krugerrand.
Don't like the price? Go by somewhere else.
WD-40, duct tape, seeds, tools, a stable of stank-less hos, soap, filter masks,canned and dried goods, can opener, underwear, water filters...
Many things of need and pleasure will store value greater than gold
...a stable of stank-less hos...
SHTF Pimpin'! I think there's a TV series here...
It is too late for me to get by on good looks and personality.
Good thing I have the wife to overcome my short comings.
They're not going to confiscate gold. We were on a gold standard when that happened in the 1930's. They could place heavy taxes on gold trade which would discourage its use and lower the value, they could make it illegal to trade which would have the same effect, but as far as going to your house and trying to take your gold that isnt going to happen. It's simply too difficult and wouldn't be worth the cost. They never did that in 1933, they simply issued the order to "turn in your gold"...some did, many did not.
As far as what your going to trade with in a hypothetical "moneyless" world....it would likely be barter. But whatever you have will eventually run out, and if you have a whole lot of it theres a good chance it can be stolen. You need to have the ability to MAKE goods and that is a power that most Americans sorely lack ( and some would say that is no accident ). The ability to make goods requires three key elements 1. Knowledge ( know-how ) 2. Capital ( land, material, tools, livestock ) 3. labor ( work ).
Even in today's world with it's faux economy, those three elements are the fundamental building blocks of wealth. Whether you want to prepare for an econonmically collapsed world or simply increase your chances in this one here's some good ideas;
1. Knowledge - Investing in your abilities will pay dividends the rest of your life and knowledge cannot be stolen from you. Learn a little or alot about Bushcraft, gardening, animal husbandry, soil science, welding, mechanics, carpentry, emergency medical care, plumbing, herbal remedies, chemistry, weapon making, hunting, processing game, and self defense.
2. Capital - Have the tools to go along with your new skills. The tools to build and maintain real goods, this is wealth and it is the basis of true, free capitalism and life as we know it. Own good, useful LAND, tractors, farming implements, chainsaws, garden tools, mechanics tools, plumbing tools, knives, shovels, hoes, hardware, excess FUEL, livestock, seeds. Etc. ( going back to the knowledge portion...learn how to care for and maintain these things ).
3. Labor- Stay in shape, have like minded, capable friends and family. Raise children ( nature's work force ) to be hands-on, capable adults. Find out who needs work and be willing to employ them in wealth building enterprises. You don't want to be isolated. Build a network of people around you..."many hands make light work" and people bring there own bodies of knowledge and abilities to the table which can benefit you.
There you go, advice from a farmer. Good as gold.
Grow weed next to your vegetables. No other crop returns more on it's paltry input needs. They don't call it weed for no reason.
You won't get 2k+ lb. for greenbeans. Very handy for barter too. Turning cornmeal into shine is too much work.
Spices will be great for bartering too. Dried they ship very well. Light and compressable with a decent shelf life.
Hops for making beer would be an economic keystone. If one had the knowhow and start up stuff.
Just a good shed and the right start up stuff could be the best plan B ever. 2K now, priceless in mad max world.
The mother tools. Forge,lathe,mill,spinning wheel,loom,foot powerd pottery wheel,glass blowing set. Most can be picked up cheap these days used.
Bartering is way better if you can continue to produce. Bartering stockpiles is only a short term thing.
Might want to think about how well your power tools and farm implements will run in a world without power and gas. Financial collapse leads swiftly to commercial collapse which immediately stops the gas tankers running. Grid goes down shortly after.
If you are used to growing large scale with its attendant power requirements, you are in for a shock. Better get the kitchen garden going now.
I worry about firewood without chainsaws. Lot of fucking work in cutting rounds off logs by hand.
Nonsense. During WWII there were almost a million cars, trucks, tractors, busses, trains, and even ships that ran on woodgas when there was no oil.
Small engines like chainsaws run exceptionally well on alcohol, and any type of oil can be used as a lubricatnt, even vegetable based oils. They just don't last very long.
You are far too limited in your thinking.
Woodgas to build a F/T plant and off we go. Mine the landfills for everything we ever wasted.
Mig welding wire might be a better store of value than gold. Properly stored it has some insane upside potential. With almost zero downside risk. That stuff aint getting any cheaper no matter what happens.
Are you tooled up ready to convert post-collapse?
If you aren't, it may be a bit more difficult than you expect. No runs down to the local hardware store for that missing washer.
I'd be buiding that wood-gas tractor now, not waiting.
As far as what your going to trade with in a hypothetical "moneyless" world....it would likely be barter.
In any world ... money or moneyless ... you barter. In a monied world, the money ("a certified real promise to complete a trade") becomes the most valued object of barter.
In a non-monied world, a leaf of tobacco has been known to serve that function. Of course myriad other objects perform the function varying with the period and the locale.
In a monied world, the crucial issue is "how is the money created" and "how is the money destroyed". In every monied world those two issues have been handled improperly and the result has been non-zero inflation and ultimate reset.
Why? Because governments need inflation to survive. People resist paying taxes. People really really "don't want government and won't pay for it voluntarily".
Share it, Brother Brushhog! I'm a Kubota and Husqy man myself.
as I understand it the 33 gold grab was done b/c private gold holdings were constraining the govt's ability to expand $ supply under the gold standard. since that ship's long sailed that motivator's gone w/it. I'm certainly not saying the govt wouldn't do it again but it woould have to be for a different motive & I can't think of one even in the ballpark as strong as that one was (note: not saying I agree w/fdr, just that it was a compelling argument). the best I can come up w/is either tax compliance (pm/barter tends not to pay much attention) or treasury (hey, china & saudia arabia won't accept dead trees anymore so you're taking one for the team - sux to be you!). of course, in 2015 & beyond it likely wouldn't take any more than blankfein or dimon picking up the phone & telling hillary: "there's plebs w/gold & silver out there & I want it!"...
Nothing is free and Windows ten makes that point
emphatically.
He kept that chest of coins until the 1970’s when gold was legal to own again and then he sold it for a good profit.
An illusion ... brought to you by non-zero inflation.
Jack Daniels Whiskey will be my currency in trade for almost anything I will need.
PM's and btc plus some paper money (3 month supply only) plus popular caliber ammo for trade. Spread around real estate for income and small off the grid business also.