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Amid Escalating Violence In Turkey, Erdogan Says Putin Ready To "Give Up On Assad"

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Last week, it became abundantly clear that Turkey’s newfound zeal for accelerating the demise of Islamic State is motivated chiefly by President Recep Tayyip Erdogan’s desire to nullify a ballot box victory by the pro-Kurdish HDP, which grabbed 13% of the vote and won party representation last month in an election that also saw AKP lose its absolute majority for the first time in over a decade.

Now, Erdogan looks set to call for new elections as "efforts" to build a coalition government have largely failed. As WSJ noted last week, Erdogan needs but a two percentage-point swing to restore AKP’s absolute majority, which would in turn make "concessions demanded by its potential coalition partners on press freedom, corruption prosecutions and foreign policy unnecessary." It would also "allow Erdogan to proceed with controversial plans to turn Turkey into a presidential republic and solidify his personal power."

The first step here is obviously to undermine the coalition building process and indeed, Erdogan has now been accused of doing exactly that. Here’s Reuters:

Turkey's main opposition leader has accused President Tayyip Erdogan of blocking efforts to form a coalition government and warned him against taking the country to new elections through "blood politics" by reopening conflict with Kurdish militants. "I say this with all sincerity: Prime Minister (Ahmet) Davutoglu really is willing to sit down and form a coalition and save the country from its problems," CHP leader Kemal Kilicdaroglu told Haberturk TV late on Sunday.

 

"But the person sitting in the post of presidency is not allowing it," he told the Turkish broadcaster in an interview.

 

Erdogan's opponents accuse him of launching military action against the PKK to rally nationalist support and undermine the pro-Kurdish opposition, whose strong showing in the June election helped deprive the AKP of its majority.

 

The government says the campaign against the PKK, which has left a peace process on the brink of collapse, was launched in response to a series of killings of military and police officers blamed on the Kurdish militants.

Indeed it was launched "in response to a series of killings", but what’s left out here is that those killings were themselves a response to a suicide bombing in Suruc that killed 32 people. That incident was pinned on ISIS sympathizers. The issue is that the PKK (and they aren’t alone) suspects Ankara itself of being an ISIS sympathizer, which makes the entire series of events leading up to the current outbreak of violence look remarkably convenient for Erdogan.

That is, Erdogan may have known that given YPG's fight with ISIS and given the PKK's suspicions regarding Ankara's connections with Islamic State, all it would take is one ISIS-linked suicide attack to set off a chain of events that would culminate in NATO backing a renewed Turkish offensive against the Kurds, which would in turn help Erdogan undermine HDP's popularity ahead of new elections.

And that is exactly how things have played out. Turkey is essentially using a mock campaign against Islamic State to justify a renewed conflict with the PKK which Ankara will promptly cite as evidence of why voters should not back HDP when elections are held again in a few months. 

Predictably, reports of PKK "terror" attacks have begun. On Sunday, the PKK was blamed for a suicide bombing that killed three Turkish soldiers. BBC has more:

Two Turkish soldiers have been killed and 31 wounded in a suicide attack by Kurdish PKK militants, the Turkish military says.

 

A tractor laden with explosives was driven at a military police station, a statement said. The attack happened early on Sunday near the town of Dogubayezit in Agri province, near the border with Iran.

 

Since 24 July, Turkey has carried out hundreds of air raids on PKK bases on both sides of the Iraq-Turkey border.

 

A Turkish state news agency, Anadolu, said the tractor was carrying two tons of explosives that were detonated by a suicide bomber.

 

Turkey's army said in a statement that "long-range guns" were also found. Four of the injured were in a serious condition.

 

 

And the Erdogan regime is stepping up the anti-HDP rhetoric as the violence esclates. "HDP deserves to be shut down 1,000 times," Burhan Kuzu, an Erdogan adviser told Haberturk on Monday. "A chance to form a one-piece government has to be given to the people again," he added, noting that he is "allergic to coalitions." 

Finally, in case anyone had forgotten why Turkey is suspected of cooperating with ISIS in the first place, and hence why Ankara will seek to limit the damage the militant group incurs during the supposed "offensive", here's AFP with a reminder:

Russian President Vladimir Putin is having a change of heart on the Kremlin's wholehearted support for Syrian leader Bashar al-Assad and may "give up on him" in the future, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan was quoted as saying Monday.

 

When asked if Putin could be persuaded not to support Assad, Erdogan said he saw his counterpart as "more positive" during a face-to-face meeting in the Azerbaijani capital of Baku in June and in subsequent telephone talks.

 

"Putin's current attitude toward Syria is more encouraging than before," Erdogan told a group of journalists on his presidential jet as he returned from a trip to Asia.

 

"He is no longer of the opinion that Russia will support Assad to the end. I believe he can give up Assad," he was quoted as saying by the Daily Sabah and Sabah dailies.

 

Turkey and Russia stand on opposing sides over the crisis in Syria, with Ankara one of the fiercest critics of Assad.

 

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Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:08 | 6385231 Chuck Knoblauch
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Assad or Syria?

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:13 | 6385253 Stumpy4516
Stumpy4516's picture

Both.

And what is this about whole hearted support?  Putin has watched Syria be destroyed.  Putin has refused to honor the contract to sell Syria missiles (just as he has with Iran).

Syria is just another in a long line of countries who thought they were allies with russia only to find they never were.

Iran will be no different. 

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:23 | 6385289 rejected
rejected's picture

And if President Putin did step in all amerikans, including many here that claim they're against destroying Syria and the ME,  would demand the destruction of evil Russia.

The president of Russia has one major goal,,, the safety and preservation of Russia, not the world the u.f.s.a is destroying piece by piece. He has done a great job of throwing in road blocks and slowing the destruction but is not yet ready to face off with pure evil as yet.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:31 | 6385326 knukles
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If Putin's "really" ready to give up on Assad, you can bet he's already got a deal with Greece.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:46 | 6385414 tarabel
tarabel's picture

 

 

I think he already has what he needs in Cyprus and has perhaps dealt away Assad to Turkey in return for something additional. Straight gain to Russia since Syria is a losing hand anyhow, might as well sell them out while they can still get something back on their soon-to-be-liquidated asset.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:58 | 6385455 SWRichmond
SWRichmond's picture

A false-flag terror event which is really state-sponsored terror?

You've got to be shitting me!

And since when does a western puppet like Erdogan speak for Putin?

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:01 | 6385475 Four chan
Mon, 08/03/2015 - 15:05 | 6386065 HowdyDoody
HowdyDoody's picture

The WSJ has the straight dope on Putin's intentions? Give me a break.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 16:11 | 6386447 tdag
tdag's picture

Putin will give up on Assad (and Syria) and open up Iran's flank? What is this guy smoking?

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:07 | 6385502 balanced
balanced's picture

I have to say, all of the "Putin plays chess" shit that I really bought into is now coming into question in my opinion. First he fails to bring Greece into the BRICS realm of influence, leaving it to look like he was somehow handled by Germany. Now he is backing away from Syria - a country which he said he would defend.

Whether it's "Assad or Syria" doesn't really matter. After seemingly abandoning Tsipras and Assad, what "leader" in their right mind would move to Putin's side? He's supposed to be a bad ass, but more and more he's looking like the west's bitch. This is painful to watch. Toughen the fuck up Putin.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:24 | 6385827 ConfederateH
ConfederateH's picture

First the Kaiser and then Hitler failed to prevent Germany being drawn into a war with America.  A reason for Nato to kick the shit out ouf Russia is clearly what the ZOG wants,

Besides, Putin is playing a chess game he inherited where the ZOG had already stripped Russia of the Warsaw pact and all its provinces.  This is like jumping into a chess game with your rooks and knights already missing.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 15:25 | 6386174 Stumpy4516
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You are saying Russia is very, very, very weak.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 17:43 | 6386906 Bingo Hammer
Bingo Hammer's picture

Chess is a game where, in order to win, you must have a mindset that is prepared to strategically relinquish any and nearly all peices if it will gain you mastery of your opponent and win the game.

Putin, like many world leaders, is playing multi-dimensional chess; a game of such complexity and global consequence that most of us mere spectators have no idea about and thus will easily misjudge a "master" players moves.

And let's not forget that Putin is also a black belt martial artist and many of his moves reflect the "judo" fighting philosphy.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 17:00 | 6386730 Perseus son of Zeus
Perseus son of Zeus's picture

terabel the hottie joo always gets eviscerated by the neocon downvote crew.

Why does this happen on a neocon phishing website? Friendly fire I guess.....

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:53 | 6385701 123dobryden
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not ready, because he did not extracted enough wealth from his fellow citizens completely denying them the oil income. He is fighting major superpower in decline instead quitely wait as chineese do to get rich first by trading with them then fighting them later when more ready and more powerful

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:27 | 6385310 Chuck Knoblauch
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Putin is more concerned about the BRICS bank right now.

It should be online by year end.

That's the real threat to the west.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:08 | 6385458 The Delicate Genius
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this is an interesting anti-Putin propaganda tactic.

The only problem is the assumption Russia could engage the US/NATO in Syria AND Ukraine and deal with the additional sanctions.

Putin has done what he can but Russia is looking out for Russia first.

Some tit for tat as to eastern ukraine and/or crimea and Syria might be contemplated - what's Russia going to do - go to the mat over a takfiri-infested Syria?

Iran is likely a different story - it can be rearmed and supported much more easily and is along russias southern belly and a valuable ally against US/Israeli sponsored terrorists.

In fact, Putin has tried to placate western aggression by withholding - officially - certain defensive missiles, but in fact, with the agreement, Russia IS providing Iran with upgraded s300 missiles. Syria's problem hasnt been one where anti-air missiles would help.

Russia basically arranged to stop a USinvasion by outfoxing kerry. he also worked hard to discredit the bullshit gas attack stuff that was to be the "redline" pretext for another Libya. I *thought* after the nuke deal Russia said that certain systems like he s400 would be delivered but I'm not sure and too lazy to look it up [feel free to correct me].

What's amazing is the way in which defensive, anti-air systems have been spun as aggressive when Iran or Syria has them.

How dare those Muslims try to defend themselves!!!

I think you're trying to find a cute new way to malign Putin, which is fine, but your theory seems to neglect limited Russian options against a multifactorial US/NATO threat.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:18 | 6385793 Stumpy4516
Stumpy4516's picture

Oh how the story changes.  Before the Putin fan club claimed Putin would never let Syria fall, he would stand and fight, THIS is his red line.  Do not poke the mighty bear.

Now, they say Syria is worthless so why fight for it.  It is master chess playing to betray Syria.  That Russia is too weak to fight for Syria.  And of course they now are saying the same BS about Iran being the red line.

Summary, even Putin's fans agree that he will betray any "friend" if offered something of value.  That Russia is too weak to even defend Syria.  That Putin has done all that Russia is capable of in Syria (what does that tell you?).

Remember:  Putin has NOT delivered an S 300 missiles to Syria or Iran.  Syria is bombed from the air while Russia watches and S 300 missiles would have been a huge help to Syria.  (Unless the missiles are not as modern and people think.)

Someone mentined Cyprus.  Putin has nothing in Cyprus.  He is allowed to dock a few ships at a commercial port, that is all. 

The new motto, that I did not coin:

With Friends Like Putin/Russia Who Needs Enemies?!!!

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 16:16 | 6386485 HowdyDoody
HowdyDoody's picture

If Putin gives up on Assad, then he can say goodbye to the naval base at Tartus. That would be a bad trade-off.

Russian media report that the US and Russia disagree over Syria. Russia has pointed out that most of the so-called 'moderates' the US was training were actually extremists.

https://z5h64q92x9.net/proxy_u/ru-en.en/tvzvezda.ru/news/vstrane_i_mire/...

Regarding the S-300s, Russia has not committed to a date up to now because of sanctions imposed against iran by the US. Russia is working on an updated S-300 system to suit Iranian specifications.

https://z5h64q92x9.net/proxy_u/ru-en.en/www.e-news.su/news/68834-kozhin-...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 18:08 | 6386989 Stumpy4516
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That is a poorly made up excuse for not abiding by a fully signed contract.  The contract predates the sanctions - and Putin/Russia gave consent for the sanctions against Iran.  In fact Irans leader stated that Russia was making itself the enemy of Iran.

Iran even sued Russia in international court, but the court wanted to avoid the issue and shelved the lawsuit.

The missiles should have been in Syria and Iran many many years ago.

 

Tue, 08/04/2015 - 00:23 | 6388255 bid the soldier...
bid the soldiers shoot's picture

Still maintaining the fiction that you know all the qualifications and clauses of the supposed contract.

You don't even know if the purported contract ever existed or was signed by the parties to it, OR WHETHER IT ONLY EXISTED IN THE MSM TO MAKE IDIOTS LIKE YOU NERVOUS.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 20:26 | 6387449 bid the soldier...
bid the soldiers shoot's picture

wait

the Putin fan club claimed Putin would never let Syria fall,

Was that before the CIA Invented ISIL?  Or trained both moderate and murderous rebels?

I'm stumped Stumpy that Obama hasn't nuked Syria and all its citizens.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:15 | 6385536 SilvertonguedAngel
SilvertonguedAngel's picture

Putin stopped the attack on Syria. Assads position has strengthened, you are dead wrong in all of your assessments.

 

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/middle-east/2015/06/29/Russia-s-Put...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:10 | 6385235 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

What is this, high school?  Hey, I heard Putin and Assad aren't friends anymore because Assad wouldn't let Putin sit on his handlebars and get a ride home from school, so he had to wait for the bus and it was really hot outside.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:26 | 6385305 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

More to the point, what did Erdogan give Putin to get a change of heart on Assad.

Must be something very good to sacrifice a bishop.

We will find out, eventually. I understand Stumpy's frustration, but we aren't seeing a tenth of the

wheeler dealering going on.Even those that are involved are on a strictly need to know basis.

Like elephants mating...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:38 | 6385366 Meat Hammer
Meat Hammer's picture

I see it as Erdogan trying to corner Putin into taking a position...confirming or denying the assertion.  I don't think it will work.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:18 | 6385551 SilvertonguedAngel
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It is Erdogan who is in trouble with Putin, not Assad.

Just a month ago Putin reiterated his full support of Assad.

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/News/middle-east/2015/06/29/Russia-s-Put...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 15:07 | 6386078 HowdyDoody
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It is amazing how many ZH'ers believe what appears in the WSJ. The conditioning must run very deep.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 20:09 | 6387388 TheFourthStooge-ing
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Funny how the WSJ avoids mentioning that Russia set up a recent meeting in Riyadh between the head of the Syrian office of home security and the Saudi deputy crown prince.

The significance of this extremely historic meeting is enormous. It has the potential to be pivotal in whatever happens from this point on. It is very important to note at least the following ramifications, corollaries and conclusions :
1) It confirms that the original anti-Syrian coalition has capitulated.
2) It is a recognition of Syria’s upper hand on the situation on the ground.
3) It implies an admission of failure on the part of Saudi Arabia.
4) It further reconfirms Russia’s role and commitment towards Syria.
5) It is a further proof that the US is disengaging in the Levant.
6) In trying to reach a deal between Saudi Arabia and Syria, the only remaining obstinate foe of Syria, Turkey, will be left out alone in the cold. In any future negotiations, Turkey will have to strike a deal of its own without the support of any partners to count on. This will prove very difficult if and when the intended safety zone plan in the north of Syria fails.

http://www.globalresearch.ca/russian-brokered-high-level-syria-saudi-ara...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 16:39 | 6386619 BorisTheBlade
BorisTheBlade's picture

Wishful thinking on the part of Erdogan, Emir of Qatar, Saudi Royalti and US oligarchy, Vlad didn't yeild when he was pressured about Assad even during wildest accusations of chemical attacks and can certainly see through the game, which is becoming increasingly obvious and desperate. I think he realizes they his opponents are running against the clock and they will make inevitable mistakes should he choose to deny what they want so badly, even if that makes them furious and upset, or rather, especially if it makes them furious and upset.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:29 | 6385320 kralizec
kralizec's picture

Apparently so.

I mean if Erdogan says so...

/

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:10 | 6385236 NoWayJose
NoWayJose's picture

The last sentence tells all - Turkey is a major critic of Assad. This is like asking Hannity what he thinks of Hillary as President -- you already know the answer!

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:11 | 6385238 The Delicate Genius
The Delicate Genius's picture

If you haven't heard, somehow, of the Oded Yinon plan - you don't know what the Zionist-Occupied-Government of the United States is doing.

It is most certainly not about Qatari pipelines [though preventing the Iran-Iraq-Syria pipeline was a bonus]

read up

The Unfolding of Yinon’s “Zionist Plan for the Middle East”: The Crisis in Iraq and the Centrality of the National Interest of Israel

http://mycatbirdseat.com/2014/07/the-unfolding-of-yinons-zionist-plan-fo...

“Greater Israel”: The Zionist Plan for the Middle East
The Infamous "Oded Yinon Plan". Introduction by Michel Chossudovsky
http://www.globalresearch.ca/greater-israel-the-zionist-plan-for-the-mid...

The Jewish Plan For The Middle East and Beyond
http://www.gilad.co.uk/writings/the-jewish-plan-for-the-middle-east-and-...

Is the US Waging Israel’s Wars?
http://www.counterpunch.org/2006/04/25/is-the-us-waging-israel-s-wars/

http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=western_support_for_islam...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:37 | 6385359 Winston Churchill
Winston Churchill's picture

They need to secure water.They should have already run out from the studies I saw in the 60's.

They knew it was a major issue back then.They live in a reclaimed desert and have heavy ag. water

demand.

Just google up then, and now, photos of the river Jordan, and you will see that they have a

serious problem.Then think in terms of water,not energy per se, and all will become clear..

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:44 | 6385391 The Delicate Genius
The Delicate Genius's picture

big part of it, aye. water and gas.

the jews were trying to get Lebanon to the Litani since before ww1.

Some claimed it was part of an ancient jewish kingdom - which was absolutely false - the petty kingdoms of the jews were always quite small, never the regional power the bible claimed {at least every other regional power left a lot of artifacts - the "united kingdom" - almost nothing}

but water [and arable land] was a big part.

This will continue.

if it takes having an agent launch a harmless rocket into a field to provide the pretext to bomb and invade and kill thousands, that is what the Jews will do, and they can rely on a hevily Jewish press in the US and UK to tow the line...

of course, while most media might be owned by non-jews, in a country that is 97.5% non jewish - you dont see anyone covering the jewish settler crimes much or the occupation much or israeli spying because of Jewish Power and Privilege.

That privilege cotinues to rob this country of blood, treasure, and a full and fair understanding of the I/P conflict.

http://www.foreignpolicyjournal.com/2010/06/17/top-ten-myths-about-the-i...

__________________
OT fromt he Saker

France’s CRIF-run {Jewish Lobby} regime has unleashed a vicious persecutions campaign against dissidents

http://thesaker.is/frances-crif-run-regime-has-unleashed-a-vicious-perse...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:18 | 6385242 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture
Erdogan Says Putin Ready To "Give Up On Assad"

Erdogan has any credibility on Syria?  He is at war with Syria.  Not that he has any credibility on any other topic.

Turkey Expands Military Campaign in Syria and Iraq

Global Research, August 02, 2015

http://www.globalresearch.ca/turkey-expands-military-campaign-in-syria-a...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:30 | 6385603 TheFourthStooge-ing
TheFourthStooge-ing's picture

Erdogan almost makes the Latvian potato troll newsoutlet seem credible in comparison.

Almost.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:14 | 6385254 BandGap
BandGap's picture

Just a way to divert attention. Pay no attention to the "good" guys, the "bad" guys are over there.

 

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:44 | 6385660 rejected
rejected's picture

that's the problem,,, no one can figure out who the good guys are and who the bad guys are. Good guy one day,,, bad the next! Everyone is fighting everyone and no one is sure why. It's a big cluster Fk.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:15 | 6385257 rejected
rejected's picture

Someone might want to ask President Putin his take on this....

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:15 | 6385259 Ms No
Ms No's picture

I'll believe it when I see it.  "All war is based on deception."  Tsu

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:16 | 6385262 moneylover3
moneylover3's picture

Kurds 1,Tukey 0

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:16 | 6385264 Omega_Man
Omega_Man's picture

At some point Russia and China are going to have to stand and face the bullys and give them a huge bully beat down...One they won't forget. If not here, then it going to come at some point soon - cause Bully USA doesn't stop

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:17 | 6385267 DutchBoy2015
DutchBoy2015's picture

The USA will support ISIS to kill Assad and his WHITE British Christian wife and kids.

After all Doctors are evil people and Assad is a doctor who is only trying to protect his country from terrorists.

The real terrorists are the USA/Israel.

After Assad is gone, the USA will look the other way while ISIS takes over Syria.  Then the next goal is for ISIS to go into Iran where the USA will say ''we have to fight ISIS in Iran''.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:28 | 6385314 Mike Honcho
Mike Honcho's picture

The propaganda coverage will end after Assad, just like Libya.  Other's in that region should be nervous, because this to-do list doesn't end there.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:29 | 6385318 Chuck Knoblauch
Chuck Knoblauch's picture

WHY NO STORIES ABOUT THE BRICS BANK.

SHOULD PROVIDE SOME COMPETITION TO THE CABAL.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:42 | 6385390 tarabel
tarabel's picture

 

 

Probably because Brazil, Russia, China and South Africa are all in financial trouble and India is barely treading water. Any project they finance will be a flashy show piece that ultimately benefits the financing entites far more than it helps the alleged beneficiaries.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:48 | 6385409 Chuck Knoblauch
Chuck Knoblauch's picture

You'd think nothing else after being brainwashed by Zero Hedge articles.

ra ra western cabal ra ra usa!

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:55 | 6385448 tarabel
tarabel's picture

 

 

I like living in the USA.

I like reading ZH, as well as many other sources to see what all the political salesmen everywhere are selling.

And I like having my own opinion not subject to the social pressure of others. Judging by this thread, it is not I that is singing in the ZH chorus, but you.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:40 | 6385651 rejected
rejected's picture

and I suppose the usa is a shining star of financial stability and promoter of the free market!     okayyyyyy

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:32 | 6385337 Mike Honcho
Mike Honcho's picture

We need a photo of Michael Obama holding a sign #BringBackOurWars

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:33 | 6385343 The Delicate Genius
The Delicate Genius's picture

here's something to consider: When Assad is gone, the fighting will continue for years, with the US, Saudis, Turks, Israelis, and others arming and funding terrorists. To the extent Iran helps the Alawites defend themselves {as they have helped the Shia Lebanese, who are far less "terrorist" than the Jewish State that periodically bombs and invades Lebanon} such action will be described as supporting "terror" - just as alleged Russian support for NovoRussians, which would not even be as morally questionable as US and US proxy action, is sanctioned - while Israel gets diplomatic cover and billions of dollars from Uncle Sugar.

What's the end game?

As noted above - for the Likudniks/neocons it is Greater Israel per the Oded Yinon plan. I think their role and influence in the U.S. is difficult to overstate. But they aren't the only militarists and hyperinterventionists - from the R2P neoliberal hypocrite idiots, to the Militant "Realists" like Zbig who are really nothing more than megalomaniacs.

And then there are the private central bankers... a group which overlaps with the Zionists and the other/Anglo militarists.

This is a fuzzy description, and I'm not holding it out as perfect, but it's a rough sketch. The Saker refers to the Anglo Zionist Empire - and that might be about as good/accurate as we can be.

I don't think there's only one "ISIS" either. I think its become a combination golem and Emmanuel Goldstein for agencies from different governments.

Does anyone think the Israelis aren't involved in Syria in a way that doesn't perfectly line up with Turkey?

Does anyone think Nuland was distributing carbohydrates to street nazis while managing to arrange the installation of a wildly disproportionately Jewish Kiev leadership because she's got the same goal as Zbigniew?

That's the problem with talking about the NWO or even the ZOG or MIC - **who** are we talking about?

I think we could add to this militarist think tanks - mostly Zionist in Washington - which may well act on their own. McCain worked with terrorists in Syria and remains unprosecuted. It seems that several Jewish neocons from pnac may have, with or without Agency help, worked with terrorists in Chechnya -some of whom have ended up in Ukraine.

ISIS et al are often painted as "Muslim extremists" and no doubt some are {with 1.2 billion muslims, many from countries the us or israel have killed thousands or tens of housands of people in, this is no surprise} but they are better thought of as PAID MERCS - proxies.

Turkey and Saudi are involved for their own selfish - government-centric reasons. a large chunk of both populations would LOVE to rebel.

But what we largely have is a disproportionately Jewish, but not entirely, "Anglo-Zionist Banking and Warfare Empire."

Let's assume that there are a 300 most important individuals - largely behind the scenes, but also "thought leaders" - media moguls, think tank leaders, oligarchs, billionaires.

Well, it seems to me that as long as these people are fat, and happy, and feel safe in their beds - hundreds of thousands of our fellow human beings will be killed and maimed for absolutely nothing but their greed and megalomania.

Just sayin'.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:53 | 6386005 kwatinhu
kwatinhu's picture

So if I buy into your whole Jewish/Anglo NWO theory where does BAthHouse Barry fit in?

He's certainly no friend of Israel, or the military for that matter.
I think personally he's just a cosmic fuck up who is going to leave the ME into a bigger smouldering mess than it already was, and walk away into the sunset.

I think most government entities are peopled with such idiots, an all knowing sinister master mind behind the whole thing is absurd, people being the selfish, short sighted morons most are.

Sorry I don't buy it. 

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 16:27 | 6386490 maxwellsdemon
maxwellsdemon's picture

Of course Barry's a puppet of Wallstreet and the banks.  Why do you think they gave him double the contributions they gave McCain in 2008?  Barry went on a publicized trip to Israel to bow down to Netanyahu in order to be annointed the next public relations speaker, I mean president, of the ZOG here in the US. 

 

He has all the qualificatiosn that Bill and Hitlery have too: greed,no morals, wilfillness to sell out their country...etc.  And better yet, who would suspect a half black youth from Hawaii with a Muslim stepfather of being a banker/CIA stooge?  Of course his dad and step dad both came from third world countries on the same CIA funded scholarships at the University of Hawaii.   And his maternal dad, a furniture salesman in Hawaii but former member of Army intelligence, can be seen greeting Obama's dad at a miitary base upon his arrival:

http://www.henrymakow.com/is_obama_a_roosevelt.html

 

http://exopolitics.blogs.com/exopolitics/2012/01/hidden-story-behind-jesse-ventura-piers-morgans-cnn-clash-over-obama-cia-ties.html

 

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:39 | 6385365 tarabel
tarabel's picture

 

 

Russia has steadfastly backed its long time client state against all comers.

Its clear-eyed assessment that said client state is now likely to fall leads it to undertake several actions:

1) For the maintenance of its Great Power reputation, it must continue to back Syria but will slowly scale back its financial commitment to a losing cause.

2) Russia is casting about for a new client to back in the post-Assad period of struggle for primacy.

3) These two objectives need to be carefully balanced since Assad holds many embarrassing details of the Syria-Russia relationship in his grasp. He and his fellow diehards will be offered financial and personal sanctuary even as Russia selects and starts to back a successor.

Certain people made a big fuss about Ukrainian gold. Let's see where Syria's ends up.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:38 | 6385370 Omega_Man
Omega_Man's picture

US (run by puppets)  to allow Israel to run the middle east. Soon Israel will have all the oil fields.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:47 | 6385418 The Delicate Genius
The Delicate Genius's picture

we had better hope that Israel's dwindling moderates and secular humanists do something to stop Likud and Shas et al.

Clearly, the ZOG is going to continue in power and to continue bombing and killing throughout the world because no force will oppose them here.

Sooner or later, however, most of the consequences engendered by the "Jewish" State are going to be of the unintended kind.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:56 | 6385434 tarabel
tarabel's picture

 

 

Does it make any difference to the end user which one of these alleged competitive interests collects the payment for its arrival in the gas tank? 

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:45 | 6385405 Jstanley011
Jstanley011's picture

What's Erdogan's problem? Why isn't he rigging the elections? Has Latin America taught the world nothing?

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:56 | 6385449 BlussMann
BlussMann's picture

You mean the USSA don't you ? They just have revolutions and coups in South American, North Americans don't have that much energy.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:52 | 6385438 Joe A
Joe A's picture

Putin giving up on Assad = realization of Turkish Stream.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:58 | 6385461 tarabel
tarabel's picture

 

 

If the transmission on your car is starting to go bad, you sell it, trade it in, or fix it.

Putin has apparently given up on fixing his '59 Damascoid Special Deluxe Coupe.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:02 | 6385479 Joe A
Joe A's picture

Plus Erdogan can live his wet dream of restoring the Ottoman Empire. Chaos in Syria will continue in order to block gas from Qatar flowing to Europe. Iran can also enter the energy market but will need to keep Turkey happy in order to allow flow of Iranian oil. Everybody -including Europe- will need to keep Turkey happy. But they can also find themselves with increased interest of the US and her abc agencies.

Exiting times ahead! </sarc>

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:37 | 6385636 Jorgen
Jorgen's picture

"Putin giving up on Assad = realization of Turkish Stream."

Yes, Turks will collect fees from both, the Turkish (Russian) Stream and "Gulf (Qatari) Stream"

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 20:18 | 6387423 conscious being
conscious being's picture

Here's another aproach. Ukraine will collapse and be brought back into the Russian sphere of influence before 2015 is out. No more need for pipelines to bypass Ukraine. Turk Stream with the uncooperative Erdogan will be moot. Russia can deal more decisively with Turkey for past crimes like helping to burn down Chechnya.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 12:59 | 6385467 The Delicate Genius
The Delicate Genius's picture

Nine Armed U.S. Soldiers Detained En Route To Ukraine

http://warmonitor.net/news/2015/07/30/nine-armed-u-s-soldiers-detained-e...

Who will sanction the US for deploying aggressive military forces nowhere near its shores?

Oh yeah - no one.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:04 | 6385491 large_wooden_badger
large_wooden_badger's picture

Others like Erdogan can say what they want to fit their own narrative, but Russia will only back away from Syria very carefully so as not to lower the value of it's word to other suitor nations. That much you can count on. But I don't care anymore. I only want to take a nap on the beach.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:09 | 6385508 smacker
smacker's picture

If Putin really is preparing to give up on Assad, perhaps Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov's visit to Qatar today for a gas-gas-gas has something to do with it.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:32 | 6385618 SilvertonguedAngel
SilvertonguedAngel's picture

The western press never tells the truth.

 

Erdogan has been cornered.

 

http://www.globalresearch.ca/russian-brokered-high-level-syria-saudi-ara...

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:43 | 6385945 NubianSundance
NubianSundance's picture

One of the reasons I check out ZH is because of links like that, interesting other side take on a relentless propaganda war.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 16:44 | 6386449 maxwellsdemon
maxwellsdemon's picture

hey Nubian, check this out.  The Chesed Gomel cemetary incident:

Andras Szekely, a former IDF soldier, overhead Israelis talking about carrying out plans for planes to hit the towers months before 911.  The FBI questioned him, but refuses to release their file

http://911blogger.com/news/2007-04-04/follow-%E2%80%9Cprior-knowledge-911-attacks-overheard-hebrew%E2%80%9D-story-fbi-looks-documents-where-they-cannot-be-found

.

Explosive found at the WTC:

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUwmBsvrTQg

 

Want easy physics proof that the WTC were destroyed by bombs? This video at 1:17 shows the center of the WTC 1 rubble pile to be at street level.  A few scraggily walls bend outward.  Where is the concrete of the 15 by 20 foot mast of reinforced concrete that was 1200 feet tall.  Both towers had them, a first in high rise design, to dampen swaying, and had more concrete than the floors.  The Sears towers has it.  All buildings over 1000 feet have incorporated an internal mast design too located directly in the center of the footprint and extending upwards throughout the height of the building.  Where did all this concrete go as it was directly over the center of the foot print of WTC 1 and 2.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPJUP-Ry7d0

 

A pancake or gravity collapse has a rubble pile shaped like a hill, about 1 foot per floor high.  WTC 7 had  a 40 foot deep basement and a 60 foot high rubble pile at the center, while the towers had a 60 foot basement but were nearly twice as tall as WTC 7 yet the center of their rubble pile is at street level.   The only explanation for the bowl shaped or crater shaped rubble pile of the towers is because they were exploded from the inside.    WTC 7 was imploded normally by the criminals and not blasted outward.  The towers were exploded outward to prevent damage and the risk of flooding to the 16 acre 'concrete bathtub' and because cleanup of asbestos rubble was problematic and would have taken months.  So the towers were turned to dust.

 

And if you go back to the 1993 WTC bombing, you can see that the bomb was built by the FBI informant Emad Salem.  The FBI knew of the bomb because their man had built it.  They let it go off apparently to trigger an Iraqi war in 1993, but Emad's tapes were turned over to the defense attourneys.  The judge released only 2 of them as transcripts but the audio version of one of them was leaked out:

 

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/wtcbomb.html

 

look at 5:19 especially

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0Y4Qaap6SM

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 20:23 | 6387440 conscious being
conscious being's picture

Proof? Who needs proof when we have 24/7 news channels telling us all we need to know?

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 16:14 | 6386468 maxwellsdemon
maxwellsdemon's picture

Very interesting.  Thanks

Tue, 08/04/2015 - 05:47 | 6388597 datura
datura's picture

Here is new leaked information from Russian newspapers (but I am not sure, if it is true, there are already too much rumours around). But it is in total contrast with what Erdogan says.

 

The Russian president Vladimir Putin broke the accepted diplomatic protocols and has personally summoned the Turkish ambassador to Moscow. The Russian president purportedly went into a long diatribe criticizing the Turkish foreign policy and its malevolent role in Syria, Iraq and Yemen by supporting terrorists, which escalated the conversation with the Turkish ambassador to a fierce polemic. Russian president allegedly said to the Turkish ambassador: "Tell your dictator President he can go to hell along with his ISIS terrorists, I will make Syria a 'Big Stalingrad' for him!"

 

If you think this outburst would be uncharacteristic for Putin, you are wrong. He is famous for his very sharp outbursts (especially in connection with radical islamists, but on other occasions as well), once he got furious and threatened a stupid French journalist to have him castrated, if he intends to defend radical muslims:-)  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ftTeIVFqZ-g

 

And even if this information is not true, interestingly, the talks about the Turkish stream were suspended. And it is already clear that Erdogan lied and that Russia does not intend to stop their weapons supply to Assad. 

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:23 | 6385578 SmittyinLA
SmittyinLA's picture

Erdogan is a looting lying POS ZMS (Zionist Mullah Stooge) nothing but  a2 bit criminal dictator, he'll be fragged by his own jihadists soon enough

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:43 | 6385659 CheapBastard
CheapBastard's picture

Whatever happens, the average Turk is pretty punked by his decision as they bear the brunt of all this blowback.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:21 | 6385808 123dobryden
123dobryden's picture

there will be the elections, mate, will see if avg trk is punked or not very soon

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 13:50 | 6385686 Chad_the_short_...
Chad_the_short_seller's picture

First of all, I never knew Russia was helping Syria or Assad. Looks to me like the entire country was destroyed to pieces by the USA ISIS guys. But if he did "give up" Assad then would oil skyrocket? I still believe that the oil crash is to bankrupt Russia.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:13 | 6385770 DutchBoy2015
Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:33 | 6385887 sagitarius
sagitarius's picture

if the "leader" has troubles in the country, he invents the enemy abroad.
See Ukraine. See the same in Turkey and a wet dream of fascist islamist in power.

Russian President Vladimir Putin is having a change of heart on the Kremlin's wholehearted support for Syrian leader Bashar al-Assad and may "give up on him" in the future, Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan was quoted as saying Monday.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 14:35 | 6385898 robertocarlos
robertocarlos's picture

Maybe Putin is doing all he can for Assad short of WWIII.

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 15:17 | 6386133 dsty
dsty's picture

Russia has a long plan

It is called the "End Game"

Do not let current circumstances fool you.

The short term goals are in flux,

never leaving site of the end game.

USA tries to block that of course.

So perhaps Putin is looking 3-4 moves ahead, eh?

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 16:08 | 6386425 datura
datura's picture

This is a stupid anti-Russia propaganda from Erdogan.

But Sergey Lavrov said today: "This statement is absolutely false, Russia's stance on Syria remains unchanged. We will keep providing military-technical assistance to the Syrian government." It ís obvious that Russia is not willing to get involved militarily (as this could be another Aghanistan like for USSR), but they will do anything to make it cost Turkey a lot by providing modern weapons to Assad. 

Also, interestingly, since the USA convinced Turkey to help, Russia now seems to be trying to convince Saudis and Quatar to get on their side, but this could be too difficult to achieve. We shall see.

However, it is not true that Putin is "doing nothing". I think he is doing all he can without hurting Russia too much. You must remember, what he is really fighting against! Russia does not have a magical printing press (and they do not want one), but this means they cannot just print money to finance any war anywhere, they simply have to do with what they have like in the old times, which is a huge disadvantage in the short term. And Putin also cares about his own country unlike the USA politicians, so he will always tread much more carefully than the USA neocons, he will not just send his precious soldiers to die in lost wars. He even said this openly: "We will try to refrain from letting ourselves be dragged militarily into any global conflicts, if possible. We remember Afghanistan and what it did to USSR. We will try to find other ways." 

Mon, 08/03/2015 - 21:21 | 6387669 bid the soldier...
bid the soldiers shoot's picture

Everybody has to make a guess.  

Who released these tapes before Turkey's election March 30, 2014?

Flee or Resign, Turkey Opposition Tells Erdogan Over Tape  and February 25, 2014

Feb. 26 (Bloomberg) -- Turkey’s opposition urged Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan to quit and protests broke out in several cities after the release of an audio tape purportedly of Erdogan discussing how to dispose of hidden funds.

Erdogan said the tape published on YouTube was a fabrication intended to undermine his party before next month’s local elections. Kemal Kilicdaroglu, head of the Republican People’s Party, said Erdogan should step down, and police broke up anti-government demonstrations in Istanbul, Ankara and other cities yesterday.

The recording marks an escalation of the graft scandal that broke in December, roiling financial markets and driving three ministers out of the cabinet. Erdogan and his allies blame U.S.- based cleric Fethullah Gulen. They say Gulen’s followers inside Turkey’s police and judiciary pursued the probe to weaken the government, as well as carrying out illegal surveillance, including wiretaps and bugging, and producing faked tapes.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2014-02-24/erdogan-resignation-de...

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/feb/25/leaked-tapes-calls-erdogan-...

Okay, so who put these tapes on the internet?  You have 2 choices:  The CIA or the FSB.

( Mossad counts as the CIA)

In addition to putting "False Flag" fron and center in the American vocabulary, the Negro wants America to return to being the "False Friend" of some nations.

Erdogan latest

Turkey denies new deal reached to open airbases to US in fight against Isis Prime minister’s office says talks are continuing on the subject, in comments that run contrary to US defence officials’ state

But Turkish officials insisted that no decision had been taken on Incirlik.

 

So you can believe everything Erdogan says, but I'm going to wait to see if  Erdogan was telling the truth or doing a favor for Putin.

Sun Tzu Deception.  


Mon, 08/03/2015 - 21:22 | 6387670 bid the soldier...
bid the soldiers shoot's picture

Sun Tzu Deception.  


Mon, 08/03/2015 - 23:09 | 6388053 cowdogg
cowdogg's picture

Wow. Do you people actually believe all the propaganda coming out of the Wall Street Journal? It is nothing but an Israeli mouthpiece.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!