This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.

China Scrambles To Enforce Capital Controls (Which Is Great News For Bitcoin)

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Officially, China has maintained quasi capital controls for years: on paper no individual is allowed to move more than $50,000 out of the country in any given year while Chinese companies can exchange yuan for foreign currencies only for approved purposes.

Unofficially, China's capital controls had been skirted for years, leading to massive capital outflow from the nation over the past decade, leading to such aberrations as massive luxury housing bubbles in places such as Vancouver, London, New York and San Francisco, and seemingly middle-class Chinese politicians and oligarchs sporting Swiss bank accounts funded in the hundreds of millions (or billions).

Just last March, we explained the schematic of how easy it is to avoid Chinese limitation on outflows, using nothing more than a UnionPay credit card and a trip to Macau. Here are the highlights:

China's underground money is flowing across the border into the gambling hub of Macau, a former Portuguese colony that like Hong Kong is an autonomous region of China. And the conduit for the cash is the Chinese government-supported payment card network, China UnionPay.

 

In a warren of gritty streets around Macau's ritzy casino resorts, hundreds of neon-lit jewellery, watch and pawn shops are doing a brisk business giving mainland Chinese customers cash by allowing them to use UnionPay cards to make fake purchases - a way of evading China's strict currency-export controls.

 

On a recent day at the Choi Seng Jewellery and Watches company, a middle-aged woman strode to the counter past dusty shelves of watches. She handed the clerk her UnionPay card and received HK$300,000 ($50,000) in cash. She signed a credit card receipt describing the transaction as a "general sale", stuffed the cash into her handbag and strolled over to the Ponte 16 casino next door.

 

The withdrawal far exceeded the daily limit of 20,000 yuan, or $3,200, in cash that individual Chinese can legally move out of the mainland. "Don't worry," said a store clerk when asked about the legality of the transaction. "Everyone does this."

 

The practice violates China's anti-money-laundering regulations as well as restrictions on currency exports. Chinese authorities also fear the UnionPay conduit is being used by corrupt officials and business people to send money out of the country.

The practice was so popular it had promptly gained epidemic proportions: "In Macau, UnionPay card transactions reached 130 billion Macau patacas ($16.77 billion) in just the first four months of 2012, up from 88.1 billion patacas in all of 2011, according to a confidential report by Macau's banking regulator, the Macau Monetary Authority reviewed by Reuters. Around 90 percent of those transactions were "highly concentrated in jewellery, ornament and luxury watch sales", the report said.

If that rate persisted for the full year, UnionPay sales in Macau for all of 2012 would have reached nearly $50 billion - nearly $45 billion of it for jewellery-related sales, a figure exceeding even Macau's total gambling revenues that year.

 

"Are these actual transactions? Where does this money come from?" the deputy head of the Monetary Authority, Wan Sin Long, asked in the document.

The answer, of course, is no. Also, the question is not where the money came from - the answer is some of the $22 trillion in deposits accumulated legally and/or illegally on the mainland, the question is where it is going after it was cashed out in Macau (for the answer look at soaring real estate prices in the ultra luxury segment in developed countries), and also why was China allowing this - after all none of this was a secret to either Chinese citizens, regulators or politicians?

To wit: "It's unclear why the central bank, the Peoples Bank of China (PBOC), hasn't cracked down harder on the practice, although the documents Reuters reviewed show the bank was aware it had become a growing problem."

The answer to the second is for years, many top Chinese politicians were themselves using this pathway to bypass the capital controls, leading to hundreds of billions of funds linked to China's most "respected" politicians to find its way into offshore bank accounts.

To be sure, this practice was greattly limited when Xi Jinping came in power and enacted substantial reforms which limited much of this grotesquely open flaunting of Chinese capital account rules. Indirectly, this has led to the recent collapse in Macau GDP - whose businesses no longer booked billions in fake "transactions" - as shown in the chart below:

 

However, judging by what remains the best downstream indicator of Chinese capital outflows, namely the ongoing appreciation of luxury real estate in the US, Canada (see "Chinese buyers spike Vancouver's luxury home market by 79%"), and the UK, while the Macau "money laundering channel" may have been plugged many others, both known and unknown remain.

And now that China has officially commenced a regime of currency devaluation, and has been forced to liquidate as much as an estimated $200 billion in reserves in just the past month to maintain the value of the Renminbi, capital flight has become the biggest and most direct threat to the Chinese regime and the economy.

The reason is that while China may succeed in maintaining an orderly pace of FX depreciation, if the local population is concerned it will lose substantial purchasing power in the coming months and years, it will accelerate the capital flight from the country, forcing even greater reserve liquidation as the government finds itself defending not only the capital but also the current account, not to mention the sheer capital flight panic resulting from the crashing stock market.

This is why as the WSJ reports overnight, "China is imposing fresh controls to prevent too much money from leaving the country, in an effort to keep badly needed funds at home to battle a deepening slowdown in the world’s No. 2 economy."

Specifically, the PBOC said Tuesday that it would make it "more expensive for investors to pressure the yuan to weaken against the U.S. dollar by adding conditions to futures contracts."

Some of the country’s largest lenders, including Bank of China Ltd. and China Citic Bank Corp., are beefing up their internal checks on large amounts of foreign-exchange conversions by their corporate clients, according to Chinese banking executives. Meanwhile, financial regulators, together with the country’s security forces, are stepping up efforts to rein in illegal money-transfer agents who make a living by helping people move money out of China.

The reason, as explained above, is that "China—long a catch basin for the world’s money—is starting to see that money trickle out. A weaker currency generally prompts investors to look elsewhere to put their cash and would complicate the government’s efforts to generate spending and bolster economic growth."

The WSJ correctly points that while it is impossible to accurately quantify just how much capital flows out of the mainland, one can venture a guess: "economists point to indications that money is leaving. China’s foreign-exchange reserves, which last year nearly reached $4 trillion, have shrunk by more than $341 billion since then."

Others look the simplest, and most transparent indicator available - offshore real estate investments: "Property-services firm CBRE recently estimated that Chinese investment in overseas commercial properties, which is a proxy for outbound residential investment, totaled $6.5 billion in the first half of this year, putting it in position to surpass 2014’s total of $10.5 billion."

For now, the administration is seeking to keep the calm at all costs: after all, what better way to spark a capital exodus than with very vocal, and very effective capital controls. Just look at Greece:

PBOC officials have struck a more sanguine note. In recent days, they have echoed comments last month from top central-bank official Yi Gang, who said capital flows in and out of the country had remained “normal,” though he pledged to increase monitoring of cross-border money movements.

 

Outflows don’t appear to have reached alarming levels, and Beijing has plenty of firepower to curtail them. For example, its huge foreign-exchange reserves give it ample room to support the yuan’s value and make it attractive for investors.

Others point to the PBOC's most direct approach when dealing with speculation: any attempts to short the currency from outside will be met with aggressive currency intervention to burn the speculators, as has happened for years.

Longer term, some investors are betting Beijing will continue to open its vast capital markets to the outside world, making its currency more attractive. “It would be dangerous for investors to be shorting the yuan given the stated intention to open up the domestic capital markets over time,” said Andy Seaman, a portfolio manager at London-based investment firm Stratton Street.

Well, no: shorting the yuan in a regime of devaluation is precisely what investors should do, however it is the dramatic intervention by the PBOC in the open market that has driven the relaxed fixing from 6.41 back to 6.36 in a week, that is what is most concerning to shorts. However, as we have explained over the past month, such intervention is costing the PBOC hundreds of billions in liquidated reserves, read sold Treasurys. With every incremental intervention, Chinese reserves drop, and may continue to do so until such time as they reach precarious levels. At this point China would invite the truly big speculators to short its currency a la Soros and the Bank of England. And since China has a very finite supply of reserves to draw from, it will (or should) be very careful how it engages the speculators.

This is also why having launched the devaluation as official policy marked a sea change for China, as Deutsche Bank recently commented, one which most likely will not have a happy ending.

But the reason why China has to scramble is that while historic capital outflows have been moderate, it is the recent devaluation that has sparked a sea change in perceptions about currency stability:

Outflows could worsen in coming months should China’s currency weaken further or its economy show new signs of faltering. Recent negative economic data has called into question China’s ability to meet its 2015 annual growth target of about 7%. “Capital outflows could get worse in the third quarter because of the deprecation expectations for renminbi,” said Zhang Ming, a senior economist at the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, a government think tank, using an alternative name for the yuan.

Indeed, it's all about expectations: and since China needs to boost exports and stimulate its economy - which is the fundamental reason why it proceeded with devaluation in the first place - any stop gap measures to halt the devaluation are doomed to fail.

Which is why the most recent escalation in capital controls will only get worse. It also includes such gimmicks as a "blacklist" of people with a track record of capital outflow wrongdoing. “Banks [that] fail to spot those on the blacklist or turn a blind eye on it will be punished and fined by the regulator as well,” an official at Citic said.

This war with capital flight also explains yesterday's surprising announcement which we documented previously, to require a 20% margin on all currency forwards:

The new rule instituted by the PBOC starts Oct. 15. It will require banks use a type of financial contract, known as currency forwards, to buy dollars while selling yuan to set aside reserves with the central bank. Under the new requirement, a bank that has sold a total of $100 of the so-called currency forwards over the course of a month must deposit $20 at the central bank. The reserves will be held at zero interest for a year.

 

The reserve requirement is aimed at “fending off macro-financial risks,” the PBOC notice said.

And while some investors saw the move as a way to help the yuan, such as Tommy Ong, head of wealth-management solutions, treasury and markets for Greater China at DBS Bank in Hong Kong, who noted that "The central bank wants to dampen short-term speculation of renminbi selling,” said Tommy Ong, the truth is that such enforcement which reduces market liquidity will hurt first the markets, then the economy.

WSJ admitted as much when it said that "traders Tuesday said they were struggling to give clients quotes for how many yuan a dollar buys onshore on forward contracts, as the cost of holding reserves under the new rules remained unclear."

Additionally capital account crackdowns are taking place domestically:

At home, Chinese officials have intensified a crackdown on what are known in China as underground banks, which Chinese nationals often use to shift money in and out of the country despite tight capital controls. Meng Qingfeng, vice minister of public security, said late in August that those money-transfer agents remained “rampant” despite repeated crackdowns on them, according to the official Xinhua News Agency. Mr. Meng also urged police around the country to better coordinate with the central bank in the campaign, which will run through the end of November.

In summary: while China is doing everything in its power to not give the impression that it is panicking, the truth is that it is one viral capital outflow report away from an outright scramble to enforce the most draconian capital controls in its history, which - as every Cypriot and Greek knows by now - is a self-defeating exercise and assures an ever accelerating decline in the currency, which authorities are trying to both keep stable while also devaluing at a pace of their choosing. Said pace never quite works out.

So what happens then: well, China's propensity for gold is well-known. We would not be surprised to see a surge of gold imports into China, only instead of going to the traditional Commodity Financing Deals we have written extensively about before, where gold is merely a commodity used to fund domestic carry trades, it ends up in domestic households. However,

while gold has historically been the best store of value in history and has outlasted every currency known to man, it is problematic when it comes to transferring funds in and out of a nation - it tends to show up quite distinctly on X-rays.

Which is why we would not be surprised to see another push higher in the value of bitcoin: it was earlier this summer when the digital currency, which can bypass capital controls and national borders with the click of a button, surged on Grexit concerns and fears a Drachma return would crush the savings of an entire nation. Since then, BTC has dropped (in no small part as a result of the previously documented "forking" with Bitcoin XT), however if a few hundred million Chinese decide that the time has come to use bitcoin as the capital controls bypassing currency of choice, and decide to invest even a tiny fraction of the $22 trillion in Chinese deposits... 

... in bitcoin (whose total market cap at last check was just over $3 billion), sit back and watch as we witness the second coming of the bitcoin bubble, one which could make the previous all time highs in the digital currency, seems like a low print.

We bring all this up in case there is any confusion why Bloomberg just carried a huge centerfold piece explaining why CDS-inventor Blythe Masters has suddenly become the digital currency's most vocal pitchman and is betting it all on bitcoin, in "Blythe Masters Tells Banks the Blockchain Changes Everything."

Yes, bitcoin may be slowly but surely leaving the domain of the libertarian fringe, but in exchange it is about to be embraced as the most lucrative and commercial "blockchained" way to capitalize on what may soon become the largest capital outflow in history, with "pioneers" such as Blythe front and center to capitalize on each and every outflowing Bityuan.

 

- advertisements -

Comment viewing options

Select your preferred way to display the comments and click "Save settings" to activate your changes.
Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:13 | 6499899 Headbanger
Headbanger's picture

NOOOOOOOO!

Fonerats is a Tyler now!!??

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:15 | 6499911 FinalEvent
FinalEvent's picture

Oh my god, somebody mentioned bitcoin which I don't understand.

Quick, downvote everything related!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:17 | 6499919 Buckaroo Banzai
Buckaroo Banzai's picture

Paging Mr. Fonestar...will Mr. Fonestar pick up the white courtesy phone please.

Not the red courtesy phone, the white one.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:23 | 6499938 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

At home, Chinese officials have intensified a crackdown on
what are known in China as underground banks, which Chinese nationals
often use to shift money in and out of the country despite tight capital
controls. 

Speaking of tight and cracks and capital controls...History shows the smart people owned Tolas (with nice rounded edges) to stick it up their ass.

"The size of the 10-tola bar enables it to be easily concealed -- specially designed smugglers' vests hold around 100 bars in 20 or more pockets. It has smooth, rounded edges so that it can be inserted inside a smuggler's body -- up to eight bars in the rectum. Another important feature is that the bar has no serial number, unlike almost all other cast bars available on the international market. That made the ten-tola bar the gold currency of choice, especially from 1947-1992 when India strictly regulated gold imports, giving rise to a massive black market. "

 

http://www.gold-eagle.com/article/indias-love-gold-2

Form follows function.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:24 | 6499959 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

Send Blythe over, we can have some fun with that...

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:30 | 6499995 tmosley
tmosley's picture

For her I prefer the Jivaro method, myself.  http://jcp.bmj.com/content/56/2/157.full

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:43 | 6500033 Creepy A. Cracker
Creepy A. Cracker's picture

She has a pretty big Adams apple.  Did she used to go by the name of Bruce?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:43 | 6500066 coinhead
coinhead's picture

OMFNGODHEAD IT'S BITCOIN!!!!!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:46 | 6500084 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

She has a pretty big Adams apple.  Did she used to go by the name of Bruce?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:51 | 6500131 CheapBastard
CheapBastard's picture

She looks like some of the softball players around here.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:57 | 6500173 coinhead
coinhead's picture

In one of his most recent interviews, Peter Schiff says that "Bitcoin will not work and will head lower... because it has no intrinsic value".  Guess what Peter,  Bitcoin IS working!  Yesterday, today and tomorrow!  To argue otherwise is to admit you are delusional.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:58 | 6500185 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

I want so bad to like bitcoin. I like the idea of it, I just don't like it for large sums of money.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:06 | 6500239 coinhead
coinhead's picture

fukken hell... can we get this XT bullshit out of teh way so Bitcoin can rally again?  With everything going on right now BTC should be +$1000 USD.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:18 | 6500316 froze25
froze25's picture

Bit coin works the same as FRN's simply because people accept them in exchange for a good/service.  Just like FRN's they have no value except what people choose to give them.  Unlike FRN's only a fixed number of them will ever exist.  So yes bit coin is FIAT but it isn't in the traditional sense because of a limited potential supply of them.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:23 | 6500345 coinhead
coinhead's picture

If Bitcoin is "Fiat" please explain what government entity is forcing you to accept Bitcoins?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:54 | 6500547 ForTheWorld
ForTheWorld's picture

Just because one entity isn't forcing another to accept Bitcoin as payment doesn't mean it's not a Fiat currency.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:59 | 6500567 coinhead
coinhead's picture

No you dumb fucking idiots... you just described exactly what FIAT is!  Fiat means order, force you to use something by decree!  And FYI.. forget Bitcoin because ZeroBrains don't even see the point in having radio comms during SHTF (maybe they are all cooked during an EMP in their fantasy-addled brains)  Lol... you guys are beyond clueless!  Learn some *basic* terminology, sorry... you don't get to reinvent what words mean to suit your choosing!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:29 | 6500727 ForTheWorld
ForTheWorld's picture

From here: http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=fiat

1630s, "authoritative sanction," from Latin fiat "let it be done" (used in the opening of Medieval Latin proclamations and commands), third person singular present subjunctive of fieri be done, become, come into existence," used as passive of facere "to make, do" (see factitious). Meaning "a decree, command, order" is from 1750. In English the word also sometimes is a reference to fiat lux "let there be light" in Gen. i:3.

Emphasis mine.

The decree meaning originates after the original of "come into existence", which is what happens with Bitcoin. Satoshi says "let Bitcoins come into existence", and they exist.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:34 | 6500751 coinhead
coinhead's picture

Nice attempted spin.  Satoshi does not "let coins come into existence", miners work in agreement to mine coins.  And nobody forces or decrees the use of Bitcoin in transactions... as far as we can see, anywhere on planet Earth.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:45 | 6500830 Creepy A. Cracker
Creepy A. Cracker's picture

Calling people "dumb fucking idiots" has always been the best way to convince them that you are correct and they are incorrect.

Thu, 09/03/2015 - 00:29 | 6503159 Pseudonymous
Pseudonymous's picture

Maybe not, however, in my opinion this particular case is one of the rare cases when it's not really reproachable either. These guys actively refuse to accept a word's established meaning in the context of money and insist on their own, conflicting meaning. They've demonstrated zero respect for language itself. At that point no sensible communication is possible, is it?

It's like cursing an animal - it has absolutely no effect on the animal.

If there's a chance to get the message across that you will not even attempt any more communication, then it may be worth it. I don't know if it's worth it in this case.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:53 | 6500879 ForTheWorld
ForTheWorld's picture

Just like your redirections, right?

Without Satoshi, there would be no Bitcoin. He took a theory he had, wrote the code, and now "miners" work in agreement to "mine" coins. Or, said another way, they have to join a pool to have ANY chance of getting ANY fraction of a Bitcoin, because the centralisation of processing power into a few hands has meant small time operators have no chance. Sounds a little forced to me.

Like this - the top 10 contributors account for 61% of all shares in this pool: http://eligius.st/~wizkid057/newstats/topcontributors.php

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:26 | 6501081 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

Bitcoins have suffered too many scandals and imitators in its short lifetime to ever attain credibility.

Where are the "bit mines" located, from which these coins are made, anyway ???

If it was invented, it can be manipulated and corrupted. It's value and authenticity is at the whims of the bitcoin digital warehousemen,

who are nameless, historyless, qualificationless vapors.

Thu, 09/03/2015 - 00:36 | 6503176 Pseudonymous
Pseudonymous's picture

They don't even know how this basic protocol called language works. How do you expect them to understand the more advanced protocols in the world, like Bitcoin?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:19 | 6500671 coinhead
coinhead's picture

"So yes bit coin is FIAT but it isn't in the traditional sense because of a limited potential supply of them."

For the umpteenth time "fiat" and "digital" are two different things entirely.  They have nothing to do with one another, whatsoever in any way, shape or form.  In fact, we can prove this conclusively because as a matter of historical record there was no such word or concept in latin as "digital" when the term "fiat" was created.  If you want to say digital... say digital but don't try to impress people using words you do not understand.  Especially in technical discussions... very bad form.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:55 | 6500893 tmosley
tmosley's picture

You don't know what the word "fiat" means.

By your definition, gold is fiat too, which it isn't.

Fiat money is a form of currency that can be issued by a central authority at much lower cost than the cost of buying one on the open market, IE it costs 4 cents to print a hundred dollar bill.  On the other hand, the cost of mining a bitcoin is pretty close to the price of one on the open market. Same as gold.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 16:51 | 6501554 boogerbently
boogerbently's picture

"Mining a Bitcoin" ?????

 

I was just kidding. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:13 | 6500989 Hankster
Hankster's picture

You should stop using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

The concept you're meaning is elastic vs inelastic currency.  FRN's are elastic (infinite supply, just print more). Bitcoin and gold are (relatively) inelastic.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:55 | 6500895 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

Nothing has intrinsic value.  

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:58 | 6501260 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

All value is subjective.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:59 | 6500180 whotookmyalias
whotookmyalias's picture

.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:59 | 6500190 coinhead
coinhead's picture

coinhead bashes his head into a block and a drink of cryptosium comes out... takes it back in one shot and is granted super spamtoshi powers on Zerohedge!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:16 | 6500294 Fuku Ben
Fuku Ben's picture

When she goes to shave her legs does she start at her neck?

And why are her pupils so dilated in these photos?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 16:21 | 6501396 scattergun
scattergun's picture

She looks like the short guy on the "Top Gear" TV series.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:29 | 6499986 mademesmile
mademesmile's picture

Form follows function

That made me LOl!

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:40 | 6500050 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

Gold anal beads?  JFC, why not just cast them like suppositories?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:59 | 6500189 Lady Jessica
Lady Jessica's picture

Would I make it through an airport scanner with gold in my rectum?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:06 | 6500223 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

In the USA, where you are likely to encounter airport scanners, you don't need to stick gold up your ass, if you are carrying one ounce maple leafs, which are clearly marked as $50 coins.  You can carry up to $10,000 face value of US or foreign cash without a problem.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:08 | 6500251 coinhead
coinhead's picture

yeah good luck getting your g0LD coin past border security when all hell is breaking loose... I'm sure they are going to be following the law to a "T".  "Oh that is $50 legal tender?  Carry on then..."

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:13 | 6500268 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

Before all hell breaks loose...

U.S. law does provide is that if you transport into or out of the U.S. more than $10,000 in currency you must report that transaction to CBP using Fin Cen Form 105. Failure to comply with this provision may result in seizure and forfeiture of the cash as well as a fine of up to $500,000 and/or 10 years in federal prison.

After all hell breaks loose...

Captain, here is a one ounce gold coin for each of my family members to gurantee our safe pasage on your ship to _________, and there is an additional coin for each of us when we arrive.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:16 | 6500295 centerline
centerline's picture

+1.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:34 | 6500434 Beam Me Up Scotty
Beam Me Up Scotty's picture

I think the Captain is more apt to tell you that you can keep one ounce of gold per person and he will take all the rest.  If you are lucky that is.  Or he could just take it all and make you walk the plank.....

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:57 | 6500564 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

Do you think the Captain is more apt to take bitcoin?  If you are lucky that
is.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 17:30 | 6501687 crazytechnician
crazytechnician's picture

Captain won't be able to take your bitcoin because it's already waiting for you when you get there. In fact no need for captain in the first place because you can just book an airline ticket , pay with bitcoin and walk straight through security without setting off any metal detectors or x-ray machines. Will you Flat Earth Cave Dwellers ever get this ?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:22 | 6500695 Harry Balzak
Harry Balzak's picture

Au or Pb--captain's choice

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:22 | 6500326 Skateboarder
Skateboarder's picture

Before "AHBL", you do need to pay duty on the other side for anything more than a few oz. Really doubt you can pull off taking 200oz on a plane because it's "worth $10K" lol.

I remember that coin belt you once posted. Badass.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:26 | 6500365 coinhead
coinhead's picture

.....that is one possible outcome yes.  Teh other one being they just shoot you and take your gold coins.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 16:16 | 6501355 A Nanny Moose
A Nanny Moose's picture

You are confnusing how government thugs, who have the monopoly priviledge on the initiation of force act now, with the possible actions of private parties attempting to voluntarily exchange value in a competitive marketplace. SHTF, and even the government thugs will need to eat, without the aid of government guns. They will have to adjust their tolerance for risk. Beyond that....

A) Word travels fast. If the captain is known to murder and steal from his passengers, who would bother seeking out his services? Cannot steal from nonexistent passengers.

B) If this is your view of humans, then you need to be investing in lead, a couple of dogs, and some tactical training.

 

Thu, 09/03/2015 - 00:18 | 6503144 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

The captain won't be known to murder and steal from his passengers if he dumps them in the ocean a couple hundred miles out.  There is a huge asymmetry of information between a smuggler captain and some desperate refugees.  Which is what we will be someday, as surely as the Syrians are today.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:24 | 6500350 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

You're a dumbfuck. I've taken plenty of gold and silver across borders and on planes. No issues whatsoever. Even told them what it was and how much it was worth.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:27 | 6500377 coinhead
coinhead's picture

You've taken plenty of gold and silver across borders during teh largest currency crisis in recorded history?  Okay, when was that?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:55 | 6501243 Son of Loki
Son of Loki's picture

I have not tried it but experts going to coin shows overseas declare their entire batch with their carry on and it has to be way over $10,000. Collectors need to attend some of these big international coin fairs. Ask someone at Gainsville Coins or APMEX or whomever is your fav store how they do it.

Thu, 09/03/2015 - 00:19 | 6503148 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

Holy shit, dude, you mean ASK SOMEONE WHO DOES IT HOW TO DO IT?  You win the Internet today for the largest dollop of common sense I've seen on line all week.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:58 | 6500906 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Right, no problem getting money out of Cyprus either. Just a silly conspiracy theory.

It's easy to move it until it isn't. Then you get civil asset forfeitured and maybe thrown in prison for all your preparation.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:10 | 6500262 Lady Jessica
Lady Jessica's picture

Thanks HH for the reply. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:10 | 6500622 hedgeless_horseman
hedgeless_horseman's picture

 

 

You are welcome, my Lady. 

You may also consider spray painting them metallic silver, as the numismatic knowledge of the people working the borders is very low.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:18 | 6500318 Haole
Haole's picture

"... which are clearly marked as $50 coins.  You can carry up to $10,000 face value of US or foreign cash without a problem."

 

Bullshit.  "Face value" is irrelevant with regards to customs reporting of PM transport but I triple dare you to try.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 16:37 | 6501484 bluskyes
bluskyes's picture

What would the IRS say, If you took a $50 gold coin, and purchased a $1300 item for $50 using said coin? Huge capital loss. (on paper.)

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:26 | 6500373 mtl4
mtl4's picture

What do you do when they pull you into a backroom to be seacrhed and you emerge later without them?

 

If you want to move alot of gold around, buy a big boat and pour the keel using gold then sail it to the port of your choice world wide.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:40 | 6501168 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

I read that Neal Stephenson novel too and it was pretty good.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:47 | 6500508 bluskyes
bluskyes's picture

They will sieze them, and when a judge finally orders that you be re-imbursed, you will be handed $50 bills

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:06 | 6500241 bluskyes
bluskyes's picture

Gives new meaning to the term: shitting bricks.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:26 | 6499976 shovelhead
shovelhead's picture

The red courtesy phone was a direct line to Mt. Gox.

It's out of service.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:44 | 6500074 coinhead
coinhead's picture

"Paging Mr. Fonestar...will Mr. Fonestar pick up the white courtesy phone please.

Not the red courtesy phone, the white one."

 

fonestar is with you!  And also with you!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:16 | 6500290 Bangin7GramRocks
Bangin7GramRocks's picture

Hooray! More free money for the CIA. They will be able to imcrease the killing and torturing of brown and tan people to historic levels with all this new funding. Line up suckers!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:17 | 6499920 semperfidelis
semperfidelis's picture

I guess the best way to promote BTC to drug traffickers is to have Blythe promote it.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:54 | 6500147 Sudden Debt
Sudden Debt's picture

I wonder how those Chinese will react when the Chinese government blocks every website that even mentions bitcoins.

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:39 | 6500468 coinhead
coinhead's picture

...let them try, it will be amusing to watch.  No government or bank on Earth can do anything to stop or control Bitcoin.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:19 | 6499933 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

if you understand bitcoin so much they why dont you understand its psyop NSA tracked trap? There is noting private about bitcoin transactions. The all seeing eye just wants you to believe what you do.  

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:24 | 6499962 FinalEvent
FinalEvent's picture

Don't forget to downvote!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:41 | 6500053 Creepy A. Cracker
Creepy A. Cracker's picture

PLEASE!...  My SuperMegaBlasterCoin is WAY better than BitCoin.  I developed my algorithm on my Android phone and am willing to sell coin numbers to miners for $1000 each.  All you have to do is send me your worthless U.S. dollars.

 

SuperMegaBlasterCoin RULES!!!!

(Don't forget to downvote!)

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:33 | 6500105 Creepy A. Cracker
Creepy A. Cracker's picture

Ahhh, yes...  The anti-digital currency Luddites are down-voting already.

 

 

SuperMegaBlasterCoin RULES!!!!

Send your worthless U.S. dollars to me now...

(Don't forget to downvote!)

(/s in case you didn't pick it up)

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:42 | 6500061 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

no down vote nesecarry, your own reckoning will come soon enough to the mindfucking you have subjected yourself to.  

Thu, 09/03/2015 - 00:21 | 6503152 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

BEEP BOOP, I AM THE INTERNET AND I REJECT YOUR COMMENT FOR REASONS OF FOOLISHNESS AND PETTIFOGGERY

PLEASE HANG UP AND CALL AGAIN LATER

THANK YOU

 

BOOP

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:17 | 6499918 Oh regional Indian
Oh regional Indian's picture

Digital, baby get digital...

Leeet's get digital...

Bitcoin might absorb gold's expected rise....

Heaven forbid....eh? In fact, I fear that is what common man might experience, soaring bitcoin and relatively stagnent gold...

Meanwhile...not muzak...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cvsqR27kxrU

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:20 | 6499941 Ataxic Press
Ataxic Press's picture

01000110 01110101 01100011 01101011 00101100 00100000 01111001 01100101 01100001 01101000 00100001

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:23 | 6499956 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Because there are only 10 kinds of people in this world, those who understand binary and those who don't, let me be clear:  "Fuck, yeah!"

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:49 | 6500116 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

great you understand binary. That doesnt help you understand psyops. The bits move freelly but its all traced. Right now they are only keeping an eye on the large inflows of $ into the bitcoin system.

Sheep to the slaughter.  

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:05 | 6500230 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

I was just translating the binary.  My real opinion of bitcoin is that it is an interesting idea that, at best, will get hijacked by the government and bankers. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:12 | 6500274 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

The funny thing about your comment is that you sound so convinced you are right. Lol. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:16 | 6500278 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:26 | 6499974 roadhazard
roadhazard's picture

"Don't you feel Rich already" !

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:11 | 6500266 Nostradumbass
Nostradumbass's picture

So - would rectum gold be considered 'digital' currency since that is how you would have to retrieve it?

Enquiring minds want to know.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:46 | 6500090 coinhead
coinhead's picture

"NOOOOOOOO!

Fonerats is a Tyler now!!??"

 

You are an idiot, your comments are boring.  You see someone getting ganged up on and you try and join in.  There is nothing interesting about you Headbanger.

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:08 | 6500249 williambanzai7
williambanzai7's picture

BLYTHE MASTERS BACK ON THE SEAT

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:14 | 6499903 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Blythe needs to wash her face.  It's got "BITCH" written all over it.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:48 | 6500100 coinhead
coinhead's picture

How is your "nose for false flags" doing?  Looks like you were wrong about the two reporters being shot, the media is in full damage control over it as her real boyfriend is exposed online (via Facebook) and her father is exposed as a crisis actor as well.  Better luck next time with that nose of yours...

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:02 | 6500197 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

You're the guy who took a photo from one of his journalism stories and expressed doubt that it was real because you thought he was posing with the gun that he used.  Your ability to sift through facts is lacking. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:12 | 6500277 coinhead
coinhead's picture

But it is not just that though... he is wearing a blue shirt in the shooting.  The camera falls, does not capture an image of him... but then an image is retrieved (six minutes before the shooting) and he is wearing a black shirt and pants.  And now the real boyfriend's profile is exposed on Facebook at the same time her father is also exposed and the media is trying to shove this down the memory hole.  It is your facts that are lacking.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:21 | 6500329 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

LOL, you were watching different videos of the shooting than I was, because the cameraman did get a shot of him as it fell.  Just because you didn't see it doesn't mean it wasn't there. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:36 | 6500450 coinhead
coinhead's picture

No it was not captured in teh video, have slowed it down 10X and watched it weself.  Too bad shill, your latest hoax shooting is being torn apart all over teh internet as we type and millions of people are asking "okay, so who is this guy now?"

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:46 | 6500499 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

You're smoking crack, because it was in the video. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:56 | 6500160 Implied Violins
Implied Violins's picture

Unfortunately, that will only come off with her face. I suggest using either 40 grade sandpaper, a cheese grater, sulfuric acid, direct application of flame, a baseball bat, sandblaster, or wood chipper. Or any combination thereof.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:14 | 6499905 davidalan1
davidalan1's picture

"Submerging markets"

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:15 | 6499907 lehmen_sisters
lehmen_sisters's picture

Good to see China is accepting capitalist ideas like capital controls to fix things. </sarc>

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:15 | 6499910 jomama
jomama's picture

Somewhere out there, Fonestar is riding a rocket.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:18 | 6499929 Headbanger
Headbanger's picture

Good!

Hope it crashes into the Sun!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:31 | 6500004 Sages wife
Sages wife's picture

Likely his 'rocket' is reaching critical temp. Spontaneous combustion imminent.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:52 | 6500137 CheapBastard
CheapBastard's picture

All China has to do is raise interest rates and let their market work. Strong, stable currencies [associated with stable gubmints] attract lots of loot. Look at Switzerland.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:52 | 6500134 coinhead
coinhead's picture

fonestar is never far from you!  fonestar is teh supreme devotee of Satoshi Nakamoto and shall never leave him!

https://localbitcoins.com/accounts/profile/Fonestar/sell-bitcoins-online/

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:23 | 6500346 Rock On Roger
Rock On Roger's picture

Behold!

The new fonestar.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:30 | 6500401 coinhead
coinhead's picture

"Behold!

The new fonestar."

Between virtual reincarnations on ZH, fonestar had a chance to look down at teh virtual world and see millions and millions of shining nodes in the cryptosphere.  It was amazing and inspiring!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:15 | 6499912 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

fonestar.. you have a pinup girl now!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:53 | 6500146 coinhead
coinhead's picture

Nope fonestar has had a girl for years and years.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:16 | 6499917 KnuckleDragger-X
KnuckleDragger-X's picture

Well tsk, Cali hasn't sold all their overpriced real estate yet. "Buy your new shack with Bitcoin"......

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:18 | 6499930 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture

Can you not sew the barbarous relic in your underwear and take your flight to freedom?

How about a goldcoin backed by real gold that you can pick up in many cities of this world?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:54 | 6500155 coinhead
coinhead's picture

Being "backed" by something IS centralization.  Bitcoin is decentralized and it is backed by math.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:01 | 6500207 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

...and useful, well, so long as the powergrid and internet remain on anyway...

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:29 | 6500387 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

"so long as the powergrid and internet remain on"

To end bitcoin the power would need to go off everywhere in the world, and stay off forever. If that happened, we'd have bigger problems, like vandals of all sorts, and gold or silver would be a liability in many respects.

The vast majority of bitcoin owners don't own just bitcoin. Bitcoin owners are relatively aware of economics and also own gold and silver. I personally don't know any bitcoin folks that don't also own at least some silver. 

It's worth a couple grand just in case it is a huge thing.  

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:42 | 6500477 PTR
PTR's picture

Bitcoin, meet your new neighbors, Mr. EMP and Mr. Cyberwarfare.  

 

 

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:10 | 6500264 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Grade A contradiction there, champ!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:19 | 6500319 coinhead
coinhead's picture

...being backed by something PHYSICAL is centralization.  Forgot that you need to explain everything in very, slow, simple terminology here.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:23 | 6500344 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

You're an idiot.  Everybody else knows that, phoney, and it's time that you get with the program and figure it out yourself. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:43 | 6500485 ThirdWorldDude
ThirdWorldDude's picture

No shithead, centralization is when the greatest chunk of that 'something' (physical or imaginary) is concentrated in the hands of few. Much easier to achieve when you are "mining" on a PC...

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:53 | 6500541 coinhead
coinhead's picture

So you think that because you can't touch something it is "imaginary"?  Does that also apply to hydrogen, oxygen, helium, ozone?  Those are all imaginary just like math right you dumb fucking idiot?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:22 | 6500627 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Actually, you can touch hydrogen, oxygen, helium and ozone, dumbass.  They aren't imaginary, they are gasses at room temperature.  Every time you feel a breeze, you are feeling oxygen and other not-so-imaginary gasses, such as nitrogen, CO2, traces of, yes, helium, and other trace gasses. 

 

Math, on the other hand, is an abstract set of concepts that happen to be useful for describing the world around us.  It is a language. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:25 | 6500703 coinhead
coinhead's picture

Teh we does not like "dollars" or teh Federal Reserve System.  But as a simple matter of objective fact, that does not allow me to say that dollars "do not exist" or the dollar-system, Federal Reserve System "is not real".  Because you do not like something does not suddenly stop it from existing!

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:37 | 6500776 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

Step away from the computer and take your meds.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:20 | 6500681 ForTheWorld
ForTheWorld's picture

Nice redirection there. There was no allusion to anything being imaginary in his post.

Seeing as though you're banging on about Maths being the backer of Bitcoin... to quote the Wiki: "Math is the study of topics such as quantity, structure, space and change...Mathematicians seek out patterns and use them to formulate new conjectures."

What part of that backs Bitcoin?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 17:03 | 6501595 overqualified
overqualified's picture

not since they pass you trough metal detectors and other satanic devices "because terrorism, you know". Good luck trying to travel anywhere with >10K$ equivalent of undeclared PM.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:20 | 6499936 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

How Blythe Masters avoided being arrested and sent to prison is beyond the pale.

Where the fuck is the FBI anyway?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:23 | 6499953 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Having sex with 11 year old male prostitutes provided by Blythe, of course.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:47 | 6500094 Random_Robert
Random_Robert's picture

The FBI?   Blythe Masters works for the CIA.   The FBI won't touch that.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:58 | 6500165 silverserfer
silverserfer's picture

blythe is an agent for the banks. she helped  smash silver and now shes pimping bitcoin. Its part of their agenda. They want bitcoin to appear to be some underground "outside the system" hipstercoin.

Its not.

 The FBI doesnt investigate mechanisms that are created by and benefit thier master the federal reserve bank.  

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:22 | 6499951 ultraticum
ultraticum's picture

Blythe and all her corrupt bankster co-horts refuse to say the word "Bitcoin".  They prefer the more PC-sounding "blockchain".  

She openly admits that she's not at all interested in the challenge Bitcoin may pose to the centrally controlled status quo:  "blockchain" is only about faster settlement if you're a true money-jobber.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:26 | 6499975 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Which is funny, since the blockchain is a bigger threat to the status quo than Bitcoin ever was.  You can encode pretty much all the transactions you want (including transfer of deeds, recording of contracts, including marriages and wills, etc, and it can all be done publically or privately (ie without or with ecryption, respectively).

It basically makes moot all of the non-aggressive functions of government.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:00 | 6500578 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

The challenge of designing and launching a blockchain is the threats from malicious people and retaining a decentralized concensus. In other words, there are two options, a private blockchain or a public blockchain. A public blockchain will get attacked and a private blockchain is corruptible like the current system. Any effort to launch a new blockchain of any size will be frought with trouble.

There is Proof of Stake, which basically is a concensus mechanism where miners pass around the privilege of mining blocks. This could be the type that Blythe is going for, but it'll still be vulnerable to ddos and other attacks. And requires a "stake" or an amount of coin to be locked in to get you place in the miner line. 

They'd have to shut it down so tight that it'd be little better than the current status quo. Bitcoin is a special thing in history, it's blockchain was able to grow in relative anonymity for a long time before being exposed to malicious hackers. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:52 | 6500133 Bunga Bunga
Bunga Bunga's picture

Her fast settlement idea is useless without using bitcoin. Sure, you can transfer the ownership of title,rights ecetera worldwide within an hour, but when using fiat it's not much more effcient. You still have to wait days and/or pay high fees until it clears for cash. 

Thu, 09/03/2015 - 03:37 | 6503354 JustUsChickensHere
JustUsChickensHere's picture

Inaccurate. Watch the whole interview - She explictly mentions Bitcoin, but in the context of an open, permissionless blockchain.

Her interest, is in using a blockchain to solve settlement issues in the finance world - that would be a permissioned blockchain.

She aknowledges, and indeed highlights, that both approachs to using the blockchain technology are valid, but apply in differing use cases. And happliy admits that Bitcoin is the major blockchain for the situations where a permissionless environment is needed.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:24 | 6499963 bshirley1968
bshirley1968's picture

How anyone can imagine that a "digital" whatever currency that can be "created out of thin air" is the answer to a fiat system that is corrupt because it is backed by nothing and can be "created out of thin air" is completely ridiculous to me.  So Bitcoin people are for a cashless society as well?  How easy would it be for the gov to take control of Bitcoin (since they already are)?  How easy would it be for the gov to confiscate your Bitcoin account....anywhere in the world.....anytime day or night?  Can someone please tell me just how Bitcoin offers ANY freedom.  Fulfills the proverbial, "out of the frying pan and into the fire".

Bitcoin has totalitarianism written all over it.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:29 | 6499985 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

Please read even a basic primer about bitcoin before you decide to post nonsense about it and make a fool of yourself.  Thank you!

 

THIS HAS BEEN A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT FROM THE INTERNET

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:35 | 6500018 centerline
centerline's picture

Governments dont like competition, especially when it comes to avoidance of taxes.  Bitcoin more likely than not lives only because it serves a greater purpose, or already is covert op.  Cashless society is a governments wet dream.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:37 | 6500779 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

I see your reasoning. What tripped me up for a long time is that I believed the government can't do anything better than the free market (true), while at the same time believing that they were all powerful to control us (false). That doesn't make any sense if you think about it. The gov is put together with scotch tape. They control MSM and WMD but that's about it. The gov is slow and stupid with only a few weapons. They have not been able to stop pirating on the Internet, they haven't been able to stop drug use, they haven't been able to ban guns. They can't stop bitcoin. 

As a side note: with the advent of Uber and Airbnb decentralized is the rage in SiliconValley. You aren't cool if you are an anarchist and working on a disruptive project at least in your spare time. It's coming.  

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:36 | 6500027 bshirley1968
bshirley1968's picture

You, of course, stated nothing that refutes my "nonsense"......thereby making you a bigger "fool" by far.

Take you public service and shove it.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:58 | 6500907 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

You failed to educate yourself before posting, thereby making you an even bigger fool!

THIS HAS BEEN A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT FROM THE INTERNET WHICH HAS NOW BEEN IN MY ASS LIKE 10 KG OF CHINESE GOLD BARS

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:16 | 6501015 atomicwasted
atomicwasted's picture

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:56 | 6500161 froze25
froze25's picture

Bit coin can be stored on someone else's server (not that secure possible Mt. Gox issues) on your phone known as a digital wallet (not that secure for most people) on a CD (very secure) printed on a piece of paper (very secure).  You can move it from one location to another when you with to use it.  For example if you wish to make a purchase with it you may have to enter the info from the piece of paper into your phone and make the purchase and then after wards print it and remove it from your phone.  Its not the answer to everything but it has its utility.  You also screw the banks from taking their slice of the pie through their over priced transaction fees.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:26 | 6500705 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

That is valid, but there are lots of the smartest guys in Silicon Valley and garages everywhere working on better solutions.

Check out case wallet: https://choosecase.com. They use multisig, where you need 2 of 3 digital signatures to send. One is on the devise, one is your fingerprint (encrypted on the devise before sent), and a backup in the their cloud. 

Ledger wallet: https://www.ledgerwallet.com. It's a hardware chip that doesn't share your digital signature. It creates the transaction in a secure environment on the chip and them broadcasts the completed transaction to the network. They also have extensions for mobiles. 

And the granddaddy hardware wallet Trezor:https://www.bitcointrezor.com. Which is cumbersome but very secure. 

ThThose are just 3 of the many solutions out there currently , with more features and products coming out monthly. It's a super innovative space. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 14:54 | 6500889 TheFutureReset
TheFutureReset's picture

Bitcoin is more secure than gold or silver. Ask eGold how that worked. Or people during the confiscation. On top of that governments own most of the gold.  

As to your point about bitcoin being able to be stolen at any time anywhere, I'll say this. It is financially impractical to steal bitcoin if you even take minor security steps. Just like if you encrypt your email it  can eventually be decrypted and read, but 99.9999% of people won't have to worry about that, bc it's financially impractical to go after everyone. In bitcoin, they could hack your keys, but it'd take so much effort (years or decades) to get one key (and you could move it in the meantime) that they won't do it. Also, bitcoin's code is open source, thousands of the brightest engineers have examined every line. It's legit. 

The best hackers in the world don't exploit weaknesses in systems, they exploit weaknesses in people. Phishing and social engineering are the best tools. Technology is just a tool. 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:26 | 6499968 Grandad Grumps
Grandad Grumps's picture

So, the rumors that JPM is behind Bitcoin and holds the patents are most likely true.

Yes, Blythe is no longer at JPM, but that does not mean that she is not doing their work. Does a rattlesnake change its spots (err diamonds)?

"but in exchange it is about to be embraced as the most lucrative and commercial "blockchained" way to capitalize on what may soon become the largest capital outflow in history, with "pioneers" such as Blythe front and center to capitalize on each and every outflowing Bityuan."

And now apparently Blythe and JPM are intentionally undermining the Chinese government and the Chinese economy.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:48 | 6500102 general ambivalent
general ambivalent's picture

That and her psyop name. Kind/Gentle/Gay Masters. I'm sure she has no connection to the tribe, General Breedlove, Wolf Blitzer, and all the others with names digitally traded for connections to the Anunnaki.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:01 | 6500204 froze25
froze25's picture

Those patents would be public info so I don't have too much confidence in the rumors.  They may have a patented way of processing a bit coin transaction but that would be only internal to their use and not be really affect the regular joe from using it without their interference.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:26 | 6499970 adr
adr's picture

If Bitcoin can be used as a stable money transfer system instead of an idiotic momo chasing get rich quick scheme, then I'm all for it.

This is nothing more than a pimp job trying to get morons to chase each other into buying up the most Bitcoin first in an attempt to create another parabolic bubble for insiders to cash out.

Bitcoin was, is, and always will be a pyramid scam.

100 million Chinese using Bitcoin? Never going to happen.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:34 | 6500017 tmosley
tmosley's picture

"100 million Chinese using Bitcoin?"

About as likely at 13 million Zimbabweans using gold, I'd say. When the government monetary scam collapses, you use what you can to survive. In the case of bitcoin, it can be used to thrive.  Of course, the Chinese have gold as well. Both will find use in commerce.

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 13:46 | 6500044 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Yep, it IS a pyramid scheme.

The ONLY way to "cash out" is to find other suckers willing to BUY your bitcoin for hard currency (exchanges).  The only liquidity in the system is people buying more bitcoin. 

It's a hot potato, and the last one stuck with it gets burned. 

All the miners are getting bitcoins for "free", meaning they didn't have to put any capital into the system, means there is a capital deficit.  Same with all the bitcoins that were bought at less than the current price. 

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 15:34 | 6501138 T-NUTZ
T-NUTZ's picture

sounds like stocks market

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 16:39 | 6501499 overqualified
overqualified's picture

if they can mine "for free" why is not everybody doing it?

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:29 | 6499989 Glass Seagull
Glass Seagull's picture

 

 

"I lost $2M USD gambling at Macau.  Oh, and that $2M USD condo that just showed up in my name in Vancouver was just given to me by a friend shortly after I left Macau, penniless.  Now who do I have to human centipede with to get a Canadian investor visa?"

 

 

Wed, 09/02/2015 - 12:31 | 6499998 q99x2
q99x2's picture

She's starting to get fat.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!