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The Situation That Smoldered For Decades Is Now Exploding
Submitted by James H Kunstler via Kunstler.com,
The desperate wish in what is loosely called the West to at least appear morally correct is unfortunately over-matched by the desperation of people fleeing unstable, overpopulated places outside the West, and it is a fiasco beyond even the events of the moment.
The refugee / immigrant crisis around the Mediterranean is a preview of a horror show to which there is no end in sight, and is certain to escalate. So anyone who indulges in fantasies about organizing an orderly, rational distribution of displaced persons for the current wave, is badly missing the point. Wave beyond wave awaits after the this one. And then what will the well-intentioned sentimentalists say? We wanted to do the right thing… we meant well… we cried when we saw the little boy dead on the beach….
Yes, the tragic intrusions of the US military in Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Syria, and elsewhere have been reckless and stupid. But that is not the whole story. The desert nations of the Middle East and North Africa (MENA) have populations abnormally swollen by a century of oil-and-gas-based agriculture, really by the benefits of Modernity in general. Now that the oil age is chugging to an unruly crack-up, and Modernity with it, and the earth’s climate is doing wonky things, and the rich nations to the north have faked their finances to the point of bankruptcy, well, circumstances have changed.
In the years ahead, populations will be fleeing and shifting from many more unfavorable corners of the world. The pressures are mounting all over. Alas, the richer nations in which the fleeing poor aspire to gain a foothold, will also be contending with the disabling effects of a universal economic contraction — the winding down of the techno-industrial system and the global economy with it. That process has the potential to shatter political unions, overthrow established social orders, and provoke wars between the demoralized countries who still possess dangerous military hardware. At the least, it will produce economic conditions in Europe and North America probably worse than the Great Depression of the 1930s.
So, the idea that the nations currently bethinking themselves “rich” can take in, shelter, and employ the masses fleeing MENA (and elsewhere) is absurd. Somehow the people in charge, plus the intellectual classes who shape opinion and consensus, are going to have to arrive at some clear notion of limits and boundaries. It is actually happening in parts of Europe right now, extempore, where the immediate crisis is worst, for the moment in Italy, Greece, and Hungary — which first interned the refugees and then let them loose on the road to Vienna, probably only a way-station to Germany. Soon all nations across Europe will be agonizing, shucking, jiving, or improvising some sort of desperate response.
Among other confusions of policy and intention, the public “debate” so far does not make any distinction between true political refugees fleeing for their lives or economic migrants seeking to improve their prospects elsewhere. It is surely easy to empathize with both categories of persons, but that doesn’t mean you give up the control of your borders just to make yourself feel better. That is pretty much what has happened in the USA, where the Left, for political expediency, has deemed it indecent to call “illegal” immigrants what they are, and the Right has just been pusillanimous and hypocritical about it. Hence the unfiltered persona of Trump who, for all his titanic shortcomings, has at least managed to make his rivals look like the craven midgets they are.
Likewise, the rise of Marine LePen in France, Geert Wilders in Holland, and other parties seeking limits to immigration, perhaps even deportations. Personally, I reject the idea that it’s “racist” to want to preserve one’s national culture and character (especially in language), or to favor bona fide citizens for gainful employment. Europe has the additional obvious problem of an immigrant Islamic population overtly hostile to European culture and tradition. Why is it morally imperative for Europeans to countenance what amounts to low-grade warfare?
The situation that smoldered for decades is now exploding. Don’t expect to see any end to desperation and instability in MENA, but do expect new demographic crises out of other regions: Indonesia, Ukraine, Pakistan, West Africa, and Brazil, with its cratering economy. It’s not inconceivable that China might bust apart politically, with centrifugal consequences. The global economy is contracting. We have indeed attained the limits to growth. Cheap oil is bygone and the capital infrastructure we have won’t run on expensive oil — including the oil industry itself. New technology or further central bank legerdemain is not going to fix that. We’re in population overshoot and a scramble is underway to bail on the places that just can’t support the people who live there. National boundaries will be defended. Sentimentalists will have to step aside. History is not a bedtime story about bunnies and kittens.
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Actions have consequences.... no further comment necessary...
History may not "a bedtime story about bunnies and kittens". But it is a daytime official government data story about unicorns and rainbows.
President Obozo and Little Timmy Geithner told me so. Jack Lew agrees, so what they say must be untrue.
I like the bedtime story "Butchers and the banker". The ending is a real cut up.
Order out of Chaos: After destroying several nation states in the MENA, the USSA has created the worlds worst refugee crisis. While millions die, the MIC and banksters feast upon their misery.
.
The playbook of the protocols is playing out like a dog eared horrorshow AGAIN.
And again, well meaning people prove power-less. So far anyways...
There has got to be some way out of here...
Said the joker to the fool....
" The idea that the nations currently bethinking themselves “rich” can take in, shelter, and employ the masses fleeing MENA (and elsewhere) is absurd."
It is absurd. Yet it will be undertaken anyway.
Why?
The USSA had help of the willing and the reluctant through bribery.
Good thing this sort of thing could never happen in the USA.
The laws of Nature and physics always win and the demographics of the planet are what they are...
same as it ever was...
Yep... It's fucking entropy at it again..
Yep, and civilization is sinking to its lowest rest state quickly, but the energy it's giving off in the process is starting a big fire....
" population overshoot" ???
gimme a break.
..but I am confident that the unelected Fascist EU Technocrat tyrants will follow Rahm Emanuel’s sage political advice and will not let “a serious crisis to go to waste”.
The population control weenies aren't fussy when it is done Their way.
And sold as new refit parts.
Population is self correcting...one way or another......
I'm glad I saw Europe when I did. I really like the train system, but now I suppose it's impossible to get a seat on a westbound train.
talk about yer "dark ages"
Yep - sitting out on the barbarian invasion issue never ends well. Ask the Romans.
"My greatest flaw. I surround myself with idiots."
- Victor von Doom
" Ask the Romans."
The ancient Egyptians would also have something to say regarding unchecked immigration and the use of immigrants as laborers and mercenaries. If only they were still around to ask.
Same as it ever was. Civilizations rise and fall based on demographics.
Well it sounded good at the time......
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed, to me:
I lift my lamp beside the golden door.” Wait, wait, wait, what?
The french wrote that and gave it to us as a burden.
So I could devalue the value of labor and work them in my factories for pennys. The only problem is the factories moved to China.
This can work, but assimilation to American culture must happen. If the tired and huddled masses want to be Americans, I welcome them with open arms. If they just want to use America for their profit or gain while tearing down the culture of America, then they can stay in their own hell hole. And illegal immigration is still illegal.
double post
The Cook, The Thief. his Wife and her Lover
Uh, that all depends on how you slice it.
The West interferance has caused the biggest FUBAR................when it comes to population
With 8b peeps it will not take long before there is 16B.............then 32B etc.....................but like any hockey stick.............it cannot last
Won't get to 16b.
There must be something you don't understand about FUBARs. When it gets real bad the problem self corrects. And usually not in anyones favor.
Time to secure the U.S./Mex border.
Better a few decades late than never, I always say.
The DHS’s own legal department says there are laws against that sort of behavior. The Border Patrol which is now under DHS is punishing its own for effectively patrolling the border. … I can make up wacky stuff but, I swear, I can’t make up stuff that FUBAR without doing hard drugs.
Anyone here want to teach me to snort glue? …. Beer just doesn’t get my creative juices flowing properly and I have field reports to write up and make sound newspeak creditable.
~ DC
Correction: Ms Creature says you don’t snort glue,…you huff it.
She sounded kinda huffy when she said it, too. …WUWT?
I guess recently an AZ chapter of the Minutemen went to speak at University on the importance of border integrity and controlled immigration. Keep in mind these guys are volunteers that mostly do border scouting and informing the border patrol of activity, they are basically just visable extra bodies. They ended up being completely flash mobbed and run off with pell grant wielding immigrants and liberal students screaming.... GO HOME RACISTS! SCREW YOU NAZIS!
It was a really sad sight.
I think we need to put up the border fence and put our political leaders on the other side......
And Canada better secure their border too.
Can we have like a drive through window for LaBatt's or would that push the budget out of control?
Way too late. Canadian PTB wanted low-wage workers around the same time those in US did.
For anybody that has watched the show Canadian Border Patrol, they'll know that one of the biggest problems is keeping illegal AMERICANS from working in Canada.
"Time to secure the U.S./Mex border. "
At Panama
"My greatest flaw. I surround myself with idiots."
- Victor von Doom
The consequences of US Foreign Policy (State), protracted wars, war on terror, Obama's equality without responsibility (here and abroad, same as the Pope's), has driven the world into a crazed phase. Toss that into the economic abyss we just entered and get ready for blast-off. It is gonna get real ugly for lots of people.
It wasn't Russia or China (not this time) that we paint as the bad guys, it was US intervention that created this monster.
It will be interesting to see if the EU leans a little more east to avoid this US baggage?
The USA is basically following European socialism, except of course we do it even more insanely. The EU is going to find out that the mean old realists were right, too bad they'll figure it out standing in the ruins.....
"Actions have consequences"
Does it ever occur to these refugees that it might be a good idea to hold off on the family making for a few years, like maybe for fucking ever? It's not like these area have been suddenly thrown into choas overnight. I'm seeing newborns, 1 & 2 year olds in the mix. Really? Get a clue ....
The infant mortality rates in most of these countries make the value of human life in their minds much less than what Westerners are used to count. More babies means more chances for survival to these people. And dead Westerner's lives don't count too much either.
Infant mortality, insane religion, and corrupt regional politcs have given them-----NO VALUE FOR A HUMAN LIFE, other than their own.
"Things and actions are what they are, and the consequences of them will be what they will be: why then should we desire to be deceived?"
Joseph Butler
Perhaps Hillary (or the plethora of Republicon candidates!) should be asked that question.
Sure LOOKS Like it....
Let's not forget that when it comes to Europe, we are talking about the indigenous land of the European race, not just some "western nation" per se.
The ethnic and cultural identity of each European nation is tied with it's indigenous population. And sooner or later, they'll defend what is rightfully theirs.
Too late. Had we taken oil from MENA totally by force, and not with bribes, populations would not have increased as they did.
All that money allowed huge population increases to happen.
The same with medical assistance in these areas.
All that "helping" has come home to roost.
Wur fukd.
@J Jason Djfmam
CONCUR
@ JJason...so you are the new resident agent provocateur? A recent visitor to these parts.
What a warped point of view if you aren't a troll...
No.
The Nazis are mostly dead.
Europeans are all globalists, now.
Paris, Berlin, London, and Oslo will all look like Gaza before you know it.
All that can happen is an epic slaughter. Us or them.
I agree, to a point. I think once the shit truly hits the fan with refugees taking more and more social services, the local populations will, in fact, rise up. It won't necessarily be hand to hand fighting with the refugees, but it will come in the form of progressively more right wing governments being put into place. The politicians will promise stricter (read harsher) treatment of the refugees, all so the populace won't feel that it has to get their hands dirty.
I heard on the news this morning that Germany has promised to take 800,000 of the refugees and spend something like 6.5 billion Euros to house and feed them. I can see the residents of Germany patting themselves on the back for a while for being generous. But I think they'll stop that back-patting when the next 800,000, and the 800,000 after that arrive.
I also think it won't be long before the U.S. Offers to take in a whole slew of these people. Probably not until after November, 2016, though.
The Nazis are mostly dead.
dont think so.
the hands needed to elect a new hitler elsewhere in europe are all ready and waiting for their chance.
6 months of proper indoctrination, some cruel bombings and the phenix will rise again.
someone to speak with the main populations voice in favour of the lowlevel common sense
Trump, as a tragic cat's paw, would do the trick.
I don't dislike the guy (though I do detest global corporations) but that might be his fate nevertheless.
agreed, jimmy
nazis are not so far away, nor even underground
the bush crime family has a long and sordid involvement in naziism that has been extensively researched and documented
prescott bush aided hitler's rise to power:
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2004/sep/25/usa.secondworldwar
http://www.rense.com/general40/bushfamilyfundedhitler.htm
you can find a good deal more info out in the open just by googling it
dave emory has done extensive radio talk shows chronicling gwb and also ghwb's involvement in attempting to bring forth what he calls the "fourth reich", his evidence is compelling
http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/5128/france-no-go-zones
"sooner or later, they'll defend what is rightfully theirs"
you don't seem to understand how powerful a force political correctness truly is
Yes, put an end to Schengen now, and close borders before it's too late.
cheap oil bygone? da fuck are you talking?
I think he meant "transitory". You know, like inflation.
No, he meant that cheap oil is over, and has been over for 15 years. Global oil demand will continue to grow into roughly 2045 (from 93mb/day today to around 120mb/day at global peak demand). Net global cost to extract oil, against demand growth, will continue to rise at roughly 6% y-o-y. But this number is hard to predict, for reasons Kuntsler describes. The cost of oil, and the global GDP, is one of the most intertwined complex relationships in global economics.
But, won't we all be fried by global warming by 2045?
Not fried so much as starved.
The tight oil boom (tar sands, fracking) is headed for an even more spectacular bust, after which oil prices will return to "normal," i.e., more than most Americans can afford.
Cheap oil ended around 1999. Maybe you weren't paying attention. After 1999, the net global cost to extract oil was no longer steady-state. From 2000-2008, oil jumped 14% per year, y-o-y. From 2008-2014, it jumped 8% per year, y-o-y. Perhap's you've been lulled into submission by the recent artificial oil price manipulation / collusion. You're forgiven.
"Personally, I reject the idea that it’s “racist” to want to preserve one’s national culture and character (especially in language), or to favor bona fide citizens for gainful employment."
I always held that belief. Even before The Donald made it popular.
And how much did you pay for Your rock 'n' roll T-shirt That proves you were there, that you heard of them first?
Cake
40 years working and all I got was this shitty pension.
Yes, the tragic intrusions of the US military in Iraq, Libya, Somalia, Syria, and elsewhere have been reckless and stupid
Whitewashing the fact that US wars in Iraq, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Libya, Somalia, Syria, and Yemen have killed at least 4.5 million and created well over 10 million refugees. But then Kunstler has always been a neocon so expect no condemnation of Neocon wars that target Muslims.
Kunstler’s work is permeated by a blanket faith in the good intentions of the U.S. in its actions in the world. The U.S., taken as a whole, could, in his view, never engage in criminal, rapacious conduct as a matter of policy. The gulf between "us" (perhaps including our brethren in Western Europe, and, maybe even those in, say, Japan) and all of the various rogues of this world is total. THEY can and do act in a criminal and rapacious fashion. WE never do; we can't, in fact. It's against our nature.
http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&add...
I regard the 9/11 conspiracy theories as a fantasy and a distraction from the real problems we face. Kunstler
Forward - to more lies and more wars. And more whitewashing from Kunstler.
When he drops his guard, he's a cheerleader for Killing Gazan Palis.
Agreed. Kunstler has some good data now and then, but quickly enters into unhealhty / unsupported idology.
I'll go out on a limb here and guess that your real beef with Kunstler is that for all his clarity he doesn't adhere to the very narrow meme that 9/11 was a US/Isreali joint operation.
JO, kunstler is no neocon, from the few articles of his i've read - either you're mis-reading him or you have some other agenda to try to put him down.
neocons don't criticize military incursions into the middle east, they champion them, they want an increase.
if you want to paint kuntsler as a neocon, you're going to have to do a much better job than that.
When the number of migrants is sufficient, it is THEY who determine the immigration policy.
It is they who decide whether your border is to be breached or respected.
They will the decide to close it because they are realists. Look at Turkey - they don't want any migrants. Many of those coming to Europe now are migrants who were safe and sound in Turkey, but they were hated by the Turks themselves. So they moved on.
Turkey is playing a big part in destabalizing Syria, causing the refugees in the first place.
Interesting thought. When you have a few transients you are in charge and when you have many they are in charge. Kind of like when you owe the bank a little versus when you owe the bank a lot. Or when you have a few germs and when you have a lot. Must be a law of thermodynamics involved here somewhere or fluid dynamics turning chaotic.
It's combustion. Rising immigration sets fire to everything. You can control the burn of a single candle or a few, but not a thousand. When there is a thousand candles burning they create their own rising wind and then suddenly everything become fuel.
Oh, so you've been to California!
In the Valley it's the South Asians that are the majority. In SoCal, well, we all know that's been taken back by a mix of Mexico, and parts of Asia.
"As of 2010, in the world, except for the respective home countries, Los Angeles County has the largest populations of Burmese, Cambodian, Chinese, Filipino, Indonesian, Korean, Sri Lankan, and Thai people"
So I'd say it's a little late for CA, but there's always Iowa!
California is lost. Oregon and Washington are in the process. When China empties in a serious way bringing all that hot money, you'll see what I mean.
I think America as we know it today eventually retreats east beyond the Rockie Mnts never again to know the western sea.
Europe is in for a rude awakening. I have nothing against the people fleeing their terrible circumstances, but once you start accepting people it's a message to all others to come on in. The media and those who are pushing the acceptance of those migrants are going to regret their decision.
Yeah. That's the positive feedback that turns it chaotic. Unless they add some compensating negative feedback - fences, deportations, closed borders - they are toast.
MENA is the Titanic. Soon everyone there will see that they are either going down, or getting off. Getting off means going to Europe, it's really simple.
Europe is simply doomed. They didn't stop the Turks the last time and won't stop them this time either.
"No good here in Hungary. No good,” said their leader Muhammad. “They try and lock us up. But we want Germany, there it is good. We have to worry about nothing there. They give us food and house and job."
It's on like Donkey Kong.
http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/09/06/the-new-face-of-eu...
cause and effect like crime and punishment.
And the media will make all that refuse to take immigrants evil.
The hand-wringer feel-good media (and doomer bullshit bloggers like Kuntsler) are out of control nwewn, they are selling us all down the river on emotional over-reactions to relatively minor and entirely manageable events. This crisis would be abbreviated rather quickly with a bunch or red-coats with bayonets and orders to hold the borders inviolate. But no one wants to be seen to grow some balls and impose the orderliness and lawfulness that is clearly required in the situation. And certainly Merkel is totally out of her depth, completely useless, a liability. The sooner she's booted aside the better for Europe as her use-by date is clearly well past its 'best-by' period.
Result = EU falls apart
And when that occurs it's going to be a failure measured in rotten corpses over a decade.
You write that Europe will be rotting corpses in a decade.
And refer to Kunstler as a doomer bullshit blogger.
Might want to change your meds? Just a suggestion.
Kuntsler is a doomer, he oozes it from every pore, he's also a whining bitch that revels in hysteria and hyperbole. He has a well-established history of doing that and it's why his stuff gets posted in zh, to sate the doomer lust for doomism.
I am not a doomer, I'm a realist. If things do not change smartly and Europe, and they do not grow a spine, and get rid of the deadwood political class, then they are facing a quite obvious prospect of political break up and much civil on state conflict. It is entirely possible that over the next ten years this will result and large numbers of dead people in Europe. I don't think that is at all an unrealistic suggestion as the anger is observably over flowing already, it just isn't being shown--almost at all--on mainstream European TV channels.
If you think that's unrealistic, that's your problem. You can back to reading Kunstler.
Your overall projection sounds perfectly sound and quite realistic. And you would not be the first to make such.
I have read JK for a long time (and Michael Greer and Nichol Foss and a host of others) and believe it or not you are painting a picture they would mostly agree with.
The "doomer" label is unnecessary. We are mostly realists now. It's 60 years of oil-mediated harmony itself that is doomed, but there's nothing much can be done now regarding that.
No, the label is in fact necessary, and it fits.
The difference between a doomer and a realist, is the realist knows it is not the end of the world, nor even un-recoverable, nor un-manageable - it is always manageable and always viable, without even resorting to optimism.
But doomers are mentally week, they are cowards, defeated, already given up, and are always busy justifying why they have already given up, and get busy telling everyone why they also should just give up, and to do it whine incessantly about things that are entirely manageable, and pretend they are not, they are certain one-way streets to doom.
Me - I understand the limits of things, but I also know that if you give yourself a fighting chance and actually fight for that chance to be expressed, there is a better than even chance things will turn out pretty well most of the time-- well, at least until you cark at some point.
And I'm perfectly Ok with that too. I'd have a problem if I wasn't. As a favourite writer of mine likes to say, "I just hate seeing a perfectly good civilisation going to waste."
And that's what we have in Europe and USA.
[quote]
Son, we live in a world that has walls, and those walls have to be guarded by men
with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinburg? I have a greater responsibility
than you could possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago, and you curse the Marines.
You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know. That Santiago's
death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and
incomprehensible to you, saves lives. You don't want the truth because deep down in
places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall, you need me on
that wall. We use words like honor, code, loyalty. We use these words as the backbone
of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punchline. I have neither
the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under
the blanket of the very freedom that I provide, and then questions the manner in
which I provide it. I would rather you just said thank you, and went on your way,
Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon, and stand a post. Either way, I don't
give a damn what you think you are entitled to.
[/quote] -- Colonel Jessop
I think Howard is also disguising a defense of Israel's policy towards this refugee crisis here. The Jews are some of the smartest people in the world (love em or hate em) but God played a cruel joke on them by making their homeland the eye of the worlds biggest shit storm
They made it the world's biggest shit storm...by being Jews.
"My greatest flaw. I surround myself with idiots."
- Victor von Doom
Bollocks.
Their so called 'Homeland' is in the eye of the worlds biggest shit storm because THEY made it that way. Them, and their little bitches U.S.gov, are responsible for 'said' shit storm.
Oh, and as for 'love em or hate em?
Hate em.
God made Israel a stumbling block.
LIBERALS ARE FUCKING PIECES OF GARBAGE AND THEY KNOW IT
wut?
"All I need to know about life I learned in Kindergarten." Unfortunately, for Socialist-Progressives, LIFE IS NOT FAIR!
If Russia is going to Syria to raise themselves up as a Great Power while protecting their "people" in Ukraineistan
.
they must have a seriously good idea that includes them changing the world for the better
.
I would like it if the west no longer stands alone with a single vision of common sense that works, because it doesn't really sometimes and the media shining on "taxpayers" about their world glory only goes so far in blood and money. The world is a dangerous place and we need people with vision.
Oh boy I can rent a part of the floor in my bedroom out to a cannibal refugee.
What a load of nonsense. Sometimes what gets written here on ZH is a crock of bollocks. But I suppose fear sells clicks. But really. Does anybody really think there is a collapse that close? Really? What like that Michael whatever guy who ended up commiting suicide rather than admit he was wrong about the collapse being close. The things people do rather than admit they are wrong.
"The situation is now... exploding". What? What fucking planet are you on? We can keep this game on the road for considerably longer than this my friend. We are way way off 'exploding. You've been reading too many doomsday blogs. And don't be giving me that nonsense about climate either. The climate is doing just fine. You've also been reading too many so-caalled studies linking CO2 to increases in temperature right? Shame on you.
Challenges remain.
Keep calm and carry on.
We have indeed attained the limits to growth. Cheap oil is bygone and the capital infrastructure we have won’t run on expensive oil — including the oil industry itself.
The collapse is not only close ... it is overdue. But it has nothing to do with "limits to growth". It has nothing to do with "expensive oil".
It does have to do with a badly gamed "capital infrastructure" which won't run much longer under prevailing unnatural manipulation and opportunists.
The oil industry is, far and away, the most efficient and effective industry every created and sustained. If the political component can be excised; if the capitalist opportunist element can be excised; if a properly managed MOE process can be adopted; all will be well in paradise.
But we do need to concentrate on the real emerging problem:
How do we gain access to, and enjoy, the leisure we have all gained through that component of our jobs which is "find a way to be more efficient"? Our reward for designing and building ourselves out of work should not be poverty.
Unfortuantely not all our jobs have that "be more efficient" component. The political class certainly has no concern for efficientcy ... but that not withstanding...
So let me see if I have this right: All we have to do is get rid of some shadowy manipulators and we can all retire in leisure? We allow the oil companies to continue to do exactly as they want where they want -- including a war-for-oil in Iraq -- taking all profit and socialising all cost, and it's solved.
Ok seems really simple. Let's do it.
Meh, "The surface of a planet is NOT the correct place for an expanding, technological civilization." (R.A. Wilson)
The universe is a really large place, time to leave the cradle!
I very much agree Stycho, or as I put it, extend the human niche. We have moved it on to all continents, proven out capacity to adapt beyond all limits, an now it is time to get out knickers hitched up, and go do it elsewhere, also.
We won't get there via doomer-ism's philosophy, and policies of stagnation, now will we? As I said above, we need to give ourselves a fighting chance and then fight to make it happen. Weak minded people wanting to stop and self-doubt are a dead weight.
It is up to THEM to adjust their minds and outlooks to what is needed to extend the niche.
Buy a plane ticket to Mytilini or Kos. If you're in the US it'll cost you 2-3 grand roundtrip maximum. It's a cheap price to pay in order to reconnect with reality and it will serve you you well for the rest of your life.
"You've also been reading too many so-caalled studies linking CO2 to increases in temperature right?" = Obama
AND
"Challenges remain." = Obama working on it
EQUAL
Contradiction. Obviously you have more faith in the people in charge that caused the mess to fix the mess than I do. Does increasing debt to fix a solvency crisis ring a bell?
How about making it a 'per bomb dropped/fired' quota?
For example, if Nation A drops 1 bomb on MENA nation B then nation A has to take in 10,000 immigrants.
That seems fair to me.
It wouldn't be long before those Euro-wanking-lapdogs stopped following the U.S. terrorists into every neo-con, evil, greedy, piss-flap fucking, banksters war they embark on.
Oh, that includes Israel and Gaza aswell, and perhaps there could be terms set out that the immigrants automatically get a vote/citizenship/passport and a nice piece of chocolate cake on arrival.
"Finite World" economists are good comedy because their central thesis - that things get used up rather than increased in price until new supplies become available or a replacement is found - is contradicted by the central thesis of economics...supply and demand.
"Finite World" economists apparently hold mutually exclusive ideas simultaneously.
Can't have a "Finite World" idea and an economics one simultaneously.
And, in point of fact, until we learn to actually destroy matter, we don't have a Finite world, merely one where resources continually change state.
Funny also that these "Finite World" folks are predominately University educated while essentially denying a central concept of science...the Conservation of Energy.
Essentially they are babbling primitives with a grossly enlarged ego.
Your key phrase "supply and demand". Reduce demand, problem solved. Easy, the world has the megatonnage for the job.
Increase supply. Problem solved.
Mass sterilization, problem also solved.
Mass sterilization, problem also solved.
Hmmm. Thought I knew what problem we were addressing. I guess I didn't.
"And, in point of fact, until we learn to actually destroy matter, we don't have a Finite world, merely one where resources continually change state."
LOL, true, except that once the state is changed the resource becomes unusable. This is essentially a reductio as absurdum argument.
Not to mention that what we're doing is not exhausting current resources, but exhausting both current and future resources sumultaneously through debt and leverage. Future resources are already claimed.
Exactly right. Supply and demand economics solves resource problems.
And then there is matter destruction: http://protonboron.com/portal/
So we will never run out of anything ever forever.
Got it.
There is something to be gained politically from this. So I guess the new world order will mandate 8 children per family.
Sentimentalists can never step aside -- Westerm mankind harbors the inculcated death-gene of altruism and is destined for displacement and extinction.
Was that the same altruism gene that pushed the redskins off the continent of North America?
The oldest skeletal remains and structures in N. America date from as early as 7000 BC, and they are NOT Amerind/Mongoloid in nature.
See: Spirit Cave Mummy - Nevada, Kennewick Man - Washington, Fork Rock Cave - Oregon, The red-haired "Si-Te-Cah" of Lovelock Cave and Humboldt Lake bed, Wizards Beach Man - Nevada, Penon Woman - Mexico City, (European style) Megaliths - Massachusetts and New Hampshire, various Ironworking sites - Ohio
Your noble "redskin" savages pushed the original inhabitants off the continent. They evidently took time off from slaughtering each other to do so. The so-called "native" Americans... weren't. They came from elsewhere just like everyone else. Grow up.
Well that was certainly convincing.
Expensive oil = cheap blood
Don't worry, theres plenty of land and resources in the western nations to go around. With socialized medicine, housing and food benefits in Western Europe, and the Affordable Care Act, Section 8 and SNAP in the USA, immigrants will enjoy the benefits of a first world lifestyle. How can we let these poor children live int he horrible conditions in their own countries, while we have the resources to help them? Saudi Arabia, the ME and N. Africa can't be expected to take care of their own refugees, so it falls on the Western countries to do so.
THAT article nails it. WASF.
The brown skinned savageds the world over are looking for freebies and payback for colonialism...warranted or not...and are here for plenty of both.
I've said for years: IF WE DO NOT FIGHT FOR WHAT IS OURS, IT WILL NOT LONG BE OURS.
We have the military power to stop the Mexitrash Invasion, and if we do not, we will wind up like South Africa...communists running the country in the ground, brown skinned savages raping and murering as they please, and all the rich people living in shining walled cities. The rest of us will live in the garbage dump outside the walls.
Just watch the movie D9 to see the lifestyle we will have to become accustomed to. Hint: we are the prawns.
People giving me thumbs down must be delusional or idiots.
I think you overlooked the real possibility that the destabilizing invasion will be southern California invading northern California in their angry millions, And rich China buying (in cash) all of Oregon and Washington and most of western Canada. Canadians are worried about being invaded by impoverished mid-western families in the collapse of Big Ag and the inexorable rise of the super tornado. People in the North East will have to leave when super storm after storm buries that region in snow measured in yards for months at a time.
So fight all you want to, haul out your artillery, but the ones on the other end of you rifle will likely by white people speaking English, or rich Chinese paying cash. Oh, and you might be Canadian by the time you do.
So Kunstler rejects "the idea that it’s “racist to want to preserve one’s national culture and character (especially in language), or to favor bona fide citizens for gainful employment. Europe has the additional obvious problem of an immigrant Islamic population overtly hostile to European culture and tradition." Just what is the national character and culture that Kunstler wants to preserve? The one that declared that any European nation that "discovers" another part of the world owns it (as in, indigenous peoples in the Western Hemisphere do not own the land)? The one that permits the enlightened "west" to install dictators and sell arms and promote war all over the world (i.e.: high-grade warfare)? When the West stops selling arms and destroys its nuclear arsenals, installs trade agreements that are fair to developing countries, and genuinely considers that human rights are universal and not limited to some notion of national citizenship, then and only then can we talk about preserving whatever "national character and culture" that Kunstler thinks is worth preserving. In the meantime, we reap what we sow, and we (including Kunstler) sow racism. White folks, and English, are in the minority. Get used to it Kunstler and adapt because it is our future more than ever before.
So... you hate Western countries, culture and values eh? The same values that allow you to hate them, created the industrial revolution, outlawed slavery, created the prosperity we enjoy today and went to the Moon.
I guess you prefer the values of the Muslims... who are exterminating Christians, Condone rape of 9 year old girls, will kill you if you disagree with them, have conquered half the world by invasion, slaughetred more Hindus than famine, condone slavery in their religious texts, have places in Saudi Arabia where it is ILLEGAL for Christians to go, and were the arbiters of the slave trade?
"In the meantime, we reap what we sow"
who is this we you're talking about kemosabe
"White folks, and English, are in the minority."
Hardly. English is problably the most widely-spoken language on the planet. Now that we are in the globalist end-game, it will probably remain that way indefinitely.
Also, Whites have been a numerical minority for centuries. Apparently that doesn't matter. What matters is power, not numbers, and there's no sign of white power declining significantly, despite the recent sickness of political correctness that has plagued us since 70s -- but which is at it's peak.
The pendulum is about to swing the other way. Whites have begun en masse to reject the premise of the P.C. worldview -- to wit, that minority grievances are paramount (where "minority" refers to economic/power minority, and means "not white, European, or western.") The bewildering (to the chattering classes and K-street) popularity of Donald Trump is one indicator of this backlash.
FYI, more people speak Chinese than any other language (Dey's mo' of dem!)
I don't think you have read many history books. The Mongols were a minority, and didn't really have their own advanced language. Now, how much power did they have?? A shit-ton of power over a lot of people and land. How about the Persians? How about the Ottomans? Egytians?
People like you crack me up; you think WHITE people invented imperialism? You actually think white people invented invasions, slavery, aggression, colonialism. You really do.
Are Greeks white? They didn't speak English? How about Romans? Were they "white"?
While we're at it, do you think the Japanese (hint, they are NOT white), have any problem with preserving their national culture and ethnicity? You want to live in a developed, "1st world" country, but you don't want to admit to yourself what it took to get to the standard of living you enjoy and whine about. It took brutality, and "discovery" of other, less-developed peoples and the explotation of those resources, and a whole lot of other bad stuff like warfare.
Here's where you give away your complete clulesness:
"installs trade agreements that are fair to developing countries"
Really? You want a fair trade agreement? Who gets to say it's "fair"? Obama? The U.N.?
Most intelligent people of any country want a trade agreeement that is agreeable to both sides. There is no "fairness" you idiot.
You keep waiting for Unicorns and Rainbows, and people like Obama will keep promising them to you. Meanwhile, the realities of human nature, physics and fate will determine our history as usual, and it will NOT be much different than it has been since "civilization" was born.
We have achieved the limits to growth with current technology. But the limits are economical not physical. What are we in fact faced with? The same thing that faced us in the 1930s. Over production. And what does that mean? Low profits.
It is an economic problem not a physical resource or technology problem. We can make what we need with a lot fewer workers. Just like the 30s.
Evidently my down voter knows nothing of Kondratieff cycles.
It also means low prices and abundance.
Whatcha tryin' ta do, scare all the Banksters with deflation?
Screw the bankers, they are mould on everyone's bread and butter.
"We have achieved the limits to growth with current technology."
Wait 5 minutes. Technology does not stand still. In fact, it is accelerating.
The real problem is not that growth is slowing. The real problem is that our economies are premised on growth to begin with. This problem will not be alleviated until the relationship between wages and labor is broken -- and that will happen over the next 50-200 years as production becomes fully automated.
Yes. Our technology is improving. But it takes time to deploy in economically significant quantities. And that is our current limit. We are in fact at the cusp of the next great upcycle. Will it materialize in one year? Or twenty? Prediction is hard.
Yes, and the solution to the 1930s was to dive into a humdinger of Total War and kill off 75 million people. That set the population crisis back by maybe 20 years total.
the beginning sequence of scarface comes to my mind....
criminal cubans extradited to usa, amongst them some crazy psychos.
isis will be more than happy to inject some sleepers in the constant stream of refugees.
additionally all those maybe sleepers can stress test the borders on the routes
for the next wave bringing the materials needed.
another thing:
why and how did ~1million start to think about going north in the same week?
there are wars and refugees for decades now, and just yesterday all that exploded internally?
there are some active agents under the screen down there round the mediterranean
This time Vienna there will be no Jan III Sobieski coming to your defense. The church on Kahlenberg hill will soon be a mosque and your daughters will be the sex slaves of your new masters.
They are not coming to assimilate, they are coming to subjugate.
Some of the most densely populated countries are in Europe, and yet they enjoy a high standard of living. Examples would be Belgium, The Netherlands and Britain. They import a lot of their food, and survive in prosperity due to current economic arrangements - offering commerce, manufacturing and services. Their decline will be very gradual, unless there is total economic collapse. In the Middle East and North Africa, on the other hand, they are almost entirely dependent for their prosperity on the depleting petroleum resource, and they are already at the limit of their carrying capacity. Epidemic diseases no longer control their population growth, and their anachronistic culture and religious beliefs stymie family planning.
It is natural for individual nations to want to preserve their culture and values, but we have to accept that these will inevitably change over time even without immigration from outside. In the case of the US, the massive migrations of Irish and Germans in the mid 1800's, and the migrations of Italians and Jews at the end of that century were more voluminous in terms of the existing population than the current entry of Hispanics. All eventually were absorbed into the American culture while the latter was itself changing.
Birth rates are declining in the ME. Iran's Total Fertility Rate is 1.6. Replacement rate is 2.1. What is happening is that they all want a war while they still have enough youth to kill.
Curious however, that German, Gaelic, Italian, etc. are not languages that are ever heard much around the USA, yet Spanish is...Ya wanna stay in America? Then learn to speak English! After all, if Mexican/South American culture is so great, then WHY did you leave?