This page has been archived and commenting is disabled.
How Much Would A Bernie Sanders Presidency Cost? Spoiler Alert: A Lot
Earlier today in "How The GOP Establishment Hopes To Crush The Donald's Presidential Run," we explained what Trump’s remarkable poll numbers really mean:
What is most amazing is that the "expert" punditry still has not realized that a vote for Trump is not a "vote for Trump" but a vote of protest against the broken system.
If the current election cycle has taught us anything, it’s that voters may have finally woken up to the fact that a choice between alternating members of America’s political aristocracy is really no choice at all, and when you throw in the influence of powerful donors and lobbyists, a picture quickly emerges of a democracy that’s not truly a democracy.
It’s this system - or, more accurately, it's America’s growing detestation of the system - that’s translated into a commanding lead for Trump over the GOP field.
Trump isn’t the only person running who’s benefiting from America’s unwillingness to concede that the choice will once again be between a Bush and a Clinton. There’s also Bernie Sanders, the socialist Senator from Vermont whose unexpected ability to draw big crowds and appeal to large swaths of Democratic voters has blindsided Hillary Clinton who is now running dead even (or close to it) with Sanders in Iowa and New Hampshire.
But as is the case with a Trump presidency, a Sanders administration would look radically different from what Americans are used to seeing and although, as discussed above, the desire for real (as opposed to Obama-brand) “change” is what’s driving Trump and Sanders’ poll numbers, there’s an undeniable voice (sponsored by the political status quo) in America’s collective conscience whispering “be careful what you wish for.” In that context we present WSJ’s analysis of how much a Bernie Sanders presidency would cost. Spoiler alert: it’s a whole lot.
Sen. Bernie Sanders, whose liberal call to action has propelled his long-shot presidential campaign, is proposing an array of new programs that would amount to the largest peacetime expansion of government in modern American history.
In all, he backs at least $18 trillion in new spending over a decade, according to a tally by The Wall Street Journal, a sum that alarms conservatives and gives even many Democrats pause. Mr. Sanders sees the money as going to essential government services at a time of increasing strain on the middle class.
His agenda includes an estimated $15 trillion for a government-run health-care program that covers every American, plus large sums to rebuild roads and bridges, expand Social Security and make tuition free at public colleges.
To pay for it, Mr. Sanders, a Vermont independent running for the Democratic nomination, has so far detailed tax increases that could bring in as much as $6.5 trillion over 10 years, according to his staff.
A campaign aide said additional tax proposals would be offered to offset the cost of some, and possibly all, of his health program. A Democratic proposal for such a “single-payer” health plan, now in Congress, would be funded in part through a new payroll tax on employers and workers, with the trade-off being that employers would no longer have to pay for or arrange their workers’ insurance.
For many years, government spending has equaled about 20% of gross domestic product annually; his proposals would increase that to about 30% in their first year. As a share of the economy, that would represent a bigger increase in government spending than the New Deal or Great Society and is surpassed in modern history only by the World War II military buildup.
By way of comparison, the 2009 economic stimulus program was estimated at $787 billion when it passed Congress, and President George W. Bush’s 2001 tax cuts were estimated to cost the federal treasury $1.35 trillion over 10 years.
In other words, when it comes to government spending, this would be (literally) without peacetime precedent, so if voters excited about a Sanders presidency want something "different", this certainly qualifies.
But as the Journal goes on to note, "enacting his program would be difficult, if not impossible" considering political dynamics in Congress and indeed, it's not entirely clear that Sanders' proposals - when taken together - are realistic even if he could secure sufficient support from lawmakers. Of course the same can be said for some of what Donald Trump has proposed.
The takeaway, it would seem, is that if voters are serious about overturning the status quo in The White House, they need to be prepared to face the reality that both Trump and Sanders are set to push hard for agendas that will forever alter the country. The question is whether an American public that has for years been trained to accept a broken system in exchange for relative stability, will actually be able to muster the courage to vote for candidates that promise real change. And if voters can summon that courage, the next question is this: will Americans then be prepared to push for an overhaul of a legislative branch whose sheer inability to actually legislate anything will, in the absence of a public outcry, invariably serve to nullify whatever decision Americans make at the polls by making it impossible for the new President (be it a Trump or a Sanders) to fulfill his election mandate?
- 31065 reads
- Printer-friendly version
- Send to friend
- advertisements -



lol.
The problem with idiots like Sanders is they mix in a little good spending with a lot of stuff for the FSA.
The problem with idiots like Sanders is that he is simply a mindless socialist who tells the low information underclass that he is going to make everyone "equal", but doesn't tell them tha they will all be "equally poor".
Everybody wants free shit, from QE & ZIRP to EBT cards. Reality will be a bitch when it all crumbles.
"The problem with idiots like Sanders is that he is simply a mindless socialist who tells the low information underclass that he is going to make everyone "equal", but doesn't tell them tha they will all be "equally poor"."
Does not matter. All he needs is the votes. There are over 93 Million americans no longer in the workforce, and it will probably rise by another 2 or 3 million by November 2016. Pluse we have about 60% of the american population, recieving gov't subsidies, wealth fare, healthcare, or work for the gov't directly (gov't employee) or indirectly (contractor). Chevez was a mindless socialist and won by a landslide in Venzuela. Odds favor Bernie will be the DNC nominee or very close to it. Perhaps the only reason why he won't be the nominee, is that someone even more leftist will get it.
I don't see Trump making it. I am pretty sure is womanizing past will catch up to him. All he needs is a couple of women to step forward and declare abuse and he's all done (Doesn't matter if is true) My guess the DNC will wait until May OR June 2016 so that the GOP is left with a hole too close to the election for to drum up support for another GOP candidate. Considering Trump has been a lifelong democracy and a long time Hilary supporter, I doubt even if he wins he would "make america great again".
That said, there is also the possiblity there will be no 2016 election. We have a budget debate coming up. If Congress fails to past a debt increase, I think Barry will act and use his special emergency powers to cancel elections indefinately. We also have a flood of ISIS militants (aka Syrian refugees) heading to the US. which will likely result in more domestic terrorism, also enabling Barry's Special emergency powers.
As long as someone's rich, I'm happy. Doesn't have to be me.
It wont be AP, "competition is a sin" will make sure of that. Be Happy. /sarc
Scrap the corporate system. (Public and Private Cronyism)
The common good must be above corporate "persons".
Scrappy
I am comming around on single payer..... I am tired of paying over a grand a month for a CRAPPY family plan that covers nothing when the Giverment Unions and the FSA get better care and pay nothing. If everybody is in on Single payer from CONgress to the supremes, then fuck it, I am too. I am tired of pulling I want to ride for a while.
I am tired of pulling I want to ride for a while.
Rest easy, here..*twists cap*..have a beer.
Moral hazards be damned, time to turn off the taps to the top and bottom feeders.
Mark,
Couldnt agree with you more, but I dont see any of them doing it. Sanders might hit the top and finish off the country in doing so. The republicans might shake an angry finger at the bottom and finish off the country in doing so.
By my eye the thing is already in collapse, except for the ponzi'd stock market.
Feel the same Gator and Mark.
Sitting this one out b/c it has reached the sociological concept known as "legitimacy." http://sociologydictionary.org/legitimacy/
I am running away to join a real circus.
Been voting for a LONG time too.
I will reengage when appropriate.
Buh-bye.
"I am tired of paying over a grand a month for a CRAPPY family plan that covers nothing "
Then you'll love the new single payer system.! Guarentee to double your costs and taxes overnight. Then comes the dreaded "Denied" medical services, tests and procedures. You think the Payroll tax is high, just wait until the single payer system is implemented. You end up paying for the gov't plan, which will still cover nothing,and you have to pay out of your own pocket for any treatment you need.
Really we already have a single payer system. You just pay premiums to gov't controlled healhcare companies. The difference is that when a single payer system, they just tax your income, and probably implement a VAT/national sales tax to pay for it. Read my lips "many new taxes coming!"
Bernie wants to turn America into another socialist paradise like Cuba, Venezuela, North Korea or the old Soviet Union.
Fuckin Jews never learn how really stupid their ideas are.
This is from Lars Larson here in Portland Oregon...sums it up pretty good.
.
" Everyone loves Santa Claus. Vermont Senator and Democrat Presidential candidate Bernie Sanders confirmed that this weekend when he drew a crowd of around 28-thousand to Portland’s Moda Center. Compare that to a few dozen rich folks Hillary Clinton attracted last week to a fancy Dunthorpe house party. The self proclaimed socialist promises free stuff for everyone. Sanders wants free college for all, at a price of 70 billion. He wants a 15 dollar minimum wage. 12 weeks of paid leave for both mothers and fathers. He wants higher taxes on corporations. The list of freebies is so long I can’t get into all of them here. And the best part is, Sanders doesn’t have ANY idea who will pay the bill for all this free stuff. And the fans who came to see him last night loved every minute of it. I’m sure most of these folks no longer believe in the Easter Bunny or the Tooth Fairy but they sure believe in Senator BS. 28-thousand, mostly twenty something’s, heard everything they wanted to hear at last night’s rally. The saving grace of course is that 85 percent of folks that age don’t bother to cast ballots at election time; THANK GOD!"
Fuck Sanders
Well Trump will forsure changed the USA and give the Jeremy Springer show new meaning.
Fuck the bloviating Trump too
WWJD = What Would Jeb Do.... I dont think he would be much different. Obama care is only going to be expanded, I dont see it abolihed under any of the candidates, except for carson, and possibly trump.
All we need is another nigger in the white house.
Let the grandkids figure out how to pay for it.
Guys the purple elephants are on my porch again!
At this point so much as been robbed the only sensible solution is to un-rob the people and put money back in their pockets.
Pensions? Well, we ought to know there won't be any at all.
May as well go Sanders or go emigrate
Wow, is this going to be a cluster...
I envision a Sanders administration like a circle of bums. Every time a bum puts a dollar in his pocket, the bum behind him picks his pocket, and they just go 'round and 'round in an infinite loop.
yeah, and welcome to the echo chamber. too cute for words.
He voted against the Patriot Act. That's got to count for something.
He voted for Obamacare. That also counts.
$18 trillion... Lol, the bankers are gonna love this guy.
LOL@the Sanders supporters that are posting here. That's your boy.
Not really a Sanders fan, but atleast with Sanders he unabashedly stands by his principles whether you agree with him or not. You can atleast have an intellectual debate with him on the merits of socialism instead of just speaking in platitudes and generalities like most other politicians.
Definitely.
Of one thing you can be sure the Israeli shareholders of the FED love this guy. Hes an Israel Firster!
RIPS
Socialism has no merits in the long run.
Socialism has loopholes not merits. Even if all forced into it shared the same values the means of employing them undermines the cause. The decisions of a tyrant, enforced by brutality remove any benifit at all.
I am glad I am not the only one noticing this.
I know what you're thinking.....and yes, people are really this stupid.
rebuilding roads, bridges and infrastructure has to be done. its way overdue: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pducRLyDmiY
Didn't Obama already allocate a shit ton of money for 'shovel ready' infrastructure jobs?
Yep, I still have pictures of the Obama propaganda construction signs to prove it.
we know that was bullshit from the beginning because he's a fucking liar and that's not the point. someone, has to address this problem.
Soooo... the next liberal statist gets elected and makes promises he can't keep and does the same? Rinse, repeat. Great plan.
Wait a minute. Didn't we do that when Obunga became president?
It was called the "stumulus".
So, now we're going to stimulate the stimulus?
Why not just have a free market economy, and let those who want useless government built "infrastructure" move to China and build more ghost cities?
Talks like a terrorist.
useless government built infrastructure? !!! WTF, dude?!! You livin out back in a cave, or what?
No, he probably lives next to another useless shovel ready project like I do.
We got planted islands in the median of US 50 in Terrace Park, Ohio.
Sure is pretty. Doesnt improve traffic flow or save wear and tear on my car. The road is still full of potholes next to the railroad overpass.
But with Bernie will be different, right?
Speaking of . . .
Can you thank of any possible use for the $100 billion California High Speed Rail?
If you haven't died of over-taxation by the year 2040, you will be able to ride from San Francisco to Los Angeles -- or vice versa -- in twice the time it takes to fly at twice the price of an airline ticket.
But most likely, most people will be riding in self-driving cars, speeding bumper to bumper on dedicated high speed roadways, which will take them to ANY place they want to go to in California, not just sanctuary cities like Los Angeles and San Francisco.
"The takeaway, it would seem, is that if voters are serious about overturning the status quo in The White House, they need to be prepared to face the reality that both Trump and Sanders are set to push hard for agendas that will forever alter the country"
What part about "fundamentally transforming America" doesn't the author get? America is already fucked.
America was done in 1913.
Yeah, yeah, blah, blah. From this point forward I'll make sure I qualify every statement with the obligatory fuck the fed.
and in 1942 Wickard v. Filburn nailed it shut.
America was done in 1861.
1776!!!
http://www.lawfulpath.com/ref/13th-amend.shtml
One "tiny thing" is wrong with the above article, as is in all disinformation. Just a small % folks, don't worry...
(See Paper Money)
Don't forget that counterfeiting was done by banker agents in 1776, 1812, 1861, (1871) US Inc. 1913, 1933, UCC, Emergency Bankruptcy under Admiralty law , 1971, and today of course. (Not worth a Continental, sure it was DILUTED on purpose, gold backed does the same in private hands.) Do we have public or private currency??? That's part of the problem.
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/allwarsarebankerwars.php
The United States fought the American Revolution primarily over King George III's Currency act, which forced the colonists to conduct their business only using printed bank notes borrowed from the Bank of England at interest.
Benjamin Franklin, acting as the colonies' representative to Britain, argued against this move in 1763.
The following year, King George III passed the Currency act which outlawed all forms of money in the colonies, forcing them to conduct all commerce using bank notes borrowed at interest from the Bank of England!
We must review EVERYTHING to restore legitimacy and confidence.
NONE of these "candidates" will.
To be fair, if one assumes $15 trillion in socialized health care costs, one should try to calculate the savings in private medical insurance to offset it, right?
Not that the WSJ has any intention of being rational.
First you need to accept that the $15 trillion is treally "only" $15 trillion.
When have the estimates made by anyone in Washington DC ever been accurate?
It's only fiat.
As I am prepping to leave the US soon, my goal was always to come back for my parents sake. This election is starting to inspire me to find a better spot and talk them into coming to me.
As I am prepping to leave the US soon
Where to? I have a nasty feeling that Americans abroad are not going to be welcomed in a foreign land.
Goldman likes Bernie now
They like Hillary more; and she'll run up the "costs" 1000x's more than Bernie when she starts WWIII vs Russia over Ukraine.
Yes you are correct. I should vote instead for Hillary Clinton or Jeb Bush.
Everything is free! College, housing, immigration, food, services! Nobody has to work and nobody has to pay! Vote for me, the Socialist. Everybody else will do everything and you will be free to pursue art, basket weaving and drugs. Free drugs for everyone! A Bote for Vernie is a vote for free love and drugs, and pechulli, and flowers in your hair, and under your girl's arms. vote bernie.
wrong.
this assumes the cost is spread over 300MM Americans. in reality, it's spread across 10-15MM Americans. the cost 20X higher bc most are recipients.....only a few will pay.
Oh, those 10-15 MM that run everything? I'm sure they'll just eat that cost and say, thank you sir, may I have another.
Or, they'll shove it down the other 290 MM of us' throats, because you know, power.
newsflash: you are probably part of that 15MM.
A true socialist. A bankers delight.
Is that all? I think it's a good investment. Where will the money come from?
Fidel Sanders has jumped the shark
Fidel Sanders=worth logging in for
The only difference is Bernie will never deliver a nine-hour speech because he's the type to sit down when someone takes over the podium.
The Sanders plan = The Robinhood plan
This guy spends other people's money better than my wife.
my wife still has him beat
Finances don't work that way with a global regime of interlinking economic corporations and organizations. The US, Japan, the EU, Australia and so on all are combined into one system. The United States of America does not exist militarily, economically or politically in the way it once did. The Federal government is an occupying branch of fascist regime. Only idiots think there is a US budget that will cost taxpayers.
This is why I could never support the likeable old fart. His mind is living in a pre-1971 fantasy world.
I think it would be next to impossible to find a progressive that is mindful of the problems the nation faces and where those problems actually originate from.
If you are going this far why not go all the way and make it better? Free "basics" for everyone. Free healthcare, food, clothing, internet, cable TV, college, house, cars, electricity, water, cell, all insurance policies, etc. All Bernie has to do is get everyone to work for free and he can pull it off. Get to work Bernie, for free.
FEMA camp + ?
I'm no fan of Bernie's but just think if he had run and been elected 7 years ago he would have spent the same amount of money as Barack only the people might have something to show for it instead of Wallstreet/Goldman and MIC reaping all of it. Just a thought.
Your mind is playing tricks on you.
Whereas Obama is incompetent, Bernie is likely a competent socialist, which means that things would have been worse.
Taxes will be put back to Eisenhower levels....91% on anything over $100,000.
what level is it where they don't tax anything? Is that like $12,000?
I'm not saying I'm in favor of this program. But everyone is already spending money on this stuff now. It's always presented as if spending like this would be all-new, on top of what is already spent. Not so. People tend to do this with Healthcare, in particular. And there's no way to spend more money with worse results than we do now on Healthcare in America.
Knock a zero off the war-machine budget and all this is affordable, with money left over, and we'd still be among the biggest military spenders on the planet. Stop incarcerating a higher proportion of our citizens than anyone else in the world, and it's still more affordable.
We're not spending money on college now? Healthcare? Childcare? Retirement? There's no cost to our deteriorating infrastructure? Youth unemployment is consequence-free? Our antiquated lack of decent family leave policies doesn't harm both employers and employees? Bullshit. If anything, our overall costs should go down if these things were coherently managed.
Aye, there's the rub.
If I hadn't seen 49 years worth of America's growing corruption, I'd be in favor of this wholeheartedly. But I'm sure the Elites would come up with a way to divert all this money into their pockets, leaving the rest of us worse-off than we are now.
"And there's no way to spend more money with worse results than we do now on Healthcare in America."
Sure there is, more of the same. Consolidation in healthcare IS the problem, and a single payer is the ultimate consolidation.
Central planners DON'T coherently manage, genius. That's the point. Power corrupst and absolute power corrupts absolutely. Put the choice - and consequence - back in the hands of the people, and watch them fight to lower their own costs.
Give me your list of government programs that are managed efficiently and effectively.
Don't put too much effort - just give me 5 examples - or 3 or even 1.
Yeah, he'd get the spending, but not the tax increases (like all his predecessors). And the money would flow to the oligarchs. Can you say "trillionaire?"
Right.
Sounds like the average American voter wants a UK type socialist system. Since voters now apparently love to pay taxes in exchange for shitty government services, why not tack on a 30% VAT just for shits and giggles.The voters will love it!
I'm so glad Americans are so insightful when it comes to identifying moral hazzards in their actions, and really vetting their political candidates on the grounds of their actions and feasibility of their policies. Really makes me proud to be surrounded by such a caring, gererous and informed citizentry. Why, with these wonderful socialist programs, a planned economy run by the central bank, government education and militarized police to keep us safe, it's up, up and away for the people. Brighter days are ahead!
That last paragraph was all sarc. Fuck the people that support Bernie. I'm so tired of these dipshits. WOULD THE FUCKIN SYSTEM JUST CRASH ALREADY!!!
The 'gimmie-gimmies' don't care one bit so long as it is "someone elses" money.
"The question is whether an American public that has for years been trained to accept a broken system in exchange for relative stability, will actually be able to muster the courage to vote for candidates that promise real change"
no, the real question is are we at least going to attempt to manage the change which is inevitable as a result of decades of gridlock-induced "relative stability" or just let nature take its course? at some point we've got to turn the wheel HARD to the right, left or we plow into the iceberg & fight over the scarce lifeboats (& there's an event horizon beyond which turning all the way in either direction doesn't change the outcome)...
I would be very concerned about our children's future if he were to win. This spending proposal makes Obama look like a libertarian. I live in Portland Oregon and I see Bernie bumper stickers everyday when I drive. Granted I live in the hipster progressive kingdom but it is worrisome nonetheless. The uninformed base that supports him have no idea how the economic world works...all they see is more free shit. They don't care to know or understand the long-term consequences of bankrupting a nation.
"The uninformed base that supports him"--
You've got that backwards. It's those who write him off as a spendthrift socialist who have no idea what they are talking about-- and even less regarding the socialism for the crony capitalist .01%.
why not just add this on to the middle classes 'tab' - what a bunch of fucking horseshit
He is a poor man indeed who knows the cost of everything and the value of nothing.
The value of nothing is...well, nothing.
Yes because Bernie is the only socialist. I was talking to a very intelligent person the other day and she said she would vote for Hillary. I asked what about Bernie, she repeated the same old mass media mantra that he's a socialist. My reply was that EVERY politician is a socialist. She admitted that Hillary fucked up the private email thing but was still going to vote for her (OK maybe shes not that intelligent). So I asked her who funds the MIC? Who funds SOCIAL security? Government pensions? Public education? The Healthcare system? Where would Walmart be without ebt cards? Where would the banks be without 3 trillion in QE? How bout all those landlords receiving section 8 payments. Which by the way is in large part how "The Donald's" father made most of his money that "The Donald" then inherited. "The Donald's" real estate and wealth might have had something to do with government handouts, and is directly in response to the NY FED pumping money into NY and NY real estate.
The idea that a democratic or republican administration will all of a sudden start paying down the debt makes me laugh. Hasn't happened in my life time.they'll all spend yours, your children's and their children's money until a massive default happens. Its really quite that simple. They all add to the debt its just a question of who gets the graft.
If you pay taxes you live in a socialist society, if you receive more than you put in ,you live in socialist society. If you pay real estate taxes you live in a socialist society. If you pay for endless wars against terrorists, drugs, poverty, ect ect you live in a socialist society.
you got it wrong.
EVERY politician is selfish,
except for Bernie Sanders who is perhaps the only true socialist with the experience to make a difference.
that is, if you believe it's even possible to effect real change within the existing system of government.
or perhaps, it will take a real Mr. Robot.
Sanders response to WSJ:
"We will be responding to "The Wall Street Journal" on that.
I think most of the expense that they put in there, the expenditures have to do with the single payer health care system. They significantly exaggerated the cost of that and they forgot to tell the American people in that article that that means eliminating the costs that you incur with private health insurance.
The truth of the matter is right now, as a nation, we spend far, far more on health care per person than do the people of any other nation and yet we continue to have about 30 million people who have no health insurance, many more who are underinsured and we pay, again, by far the highest prices in the world for prescription drugs.
No question to my mind that moving toward a Medicare for all single payer program is the most cost-effective way to provide health care to all of our people.
Second point, which they really didn't get into, is we are going to demand that the wealthiest people and the largest corporations in this country do start paying their fair share of taxes.
When we have massive income and wealth inequality, when 58 percent of all new income is going to the top 1 percent, when you have major corporations in a given year paying zero in federal income taxes, yes, we need real tax reform to bring in substantially more revenue so in fact that we can make sure that every kid in this country who has the ability can go to college, because we are going to make public colleges and universities tuition-free."
^^^^^^what a pathetic sack of shit^^^^^
I can't up arrow and down arrow you and while I agree on the idea that wealth inequity is a major problem and that if fiat is to truly work it needs to be put in the hands of people who'll spend it, the idea that every child should go to college is a joke. We don't need any more useless degrees in this country. Everyone is not college material. The world does need ditch diggers. Unless your degree is in medice or science, the rest can be learned through traning. You noticed how I left lawyers off the list because the last thing we need in this country are more lawyers. I know a lot of people that are as dumb as a box of rocks that have college degrees. I know a lot of people that have no college degree and are highly intelligent, highly functioning people. The reason why college cost so much is because everyone with a pulse can get a loan, and it has been drumed into their head that a degree is a must have in this world. 50% of people that get degrees either don't go into the field they majored in or their job they are currently in you don't need a degree.
'If you want to get laid, go to college. If you want an education,go to the library.' Frank Zappa
Thank you for the Frank Zappa quote, now thats who we need in the white house!
No question to my mind that moving toward a Medicare for all single payer program is the most cost-effective way to provide health care to all of our people.
Why of course. Because government has proven beyond all doubt it knows how to manage money. After 50 years of trying every imaginable reform, this is the only one they missed. What could go wrong?
Second point, which they really didn't get into, is we are going to demand that the wealthiest people and the largest corporations in this country do start paying their fair share of taxes.
That's what ever politician since Roosevelt has been promising.
Give it up Spooz. The political system is far beyond any chance of redemption. When a tree starts to fall, the best you can do is get out of the way. If you stay where you are, you're going to get crushed.
Instead of the Bald Eagle on the U.S. Presidential Seal, we should have a skittle shitting Unicorn sitting next to a banana tree.
Looks like Sanders becomes Krugman's best friend. Winning!
I've seen Sander's commercials on T.V.
Still trying to figure out what fried chicken has to do with the economy.
Salmonella. (It's a Krugman thing)
Sweden can do it so why can't we? Oh wait, Sweden's gdp is 570 B ours 17.4 t Sweden's population 9.8 m ours 321m.
Sometimes I hate being a hater
If your figures are correct our GDP should be 18.7 trillion to be as prosperous on a per capita basis as Sweden.
North of 22 trillion actually. You forgot the fluff in US GDP that serves no economic purpose.
single payer? YES!
Social security stronger and expanded? YES!
Stop mass immigration? YES!
I just read that as "Stop mass migration? YES!"As in every person that can, trys to get the hell out of Dodge!
You're not taking into account the Skittle-shitting unicorn he's got in his back pocket.
On the same day Clinton PAC goes negative.hmmmmmm
You really have to ask yourself why after all these years we get 2 candidates who actually speak the truth? Because the titanic is going down and it doesn't fuckin matter who's president OR either one will do the bankster bidding anyway. US voters are suckers for these politicians every time. I plan to ignore ALL candidates until the ship's gone down and something actually changes in a real way.
Jeremy Corbyn is UK version of Bernie Sanders. I keep looking around for a new government run chicken stand. It must be in a work in progress status.
He's not a democrat. He can barely get on the ticket. Even if he does, he's not getting super-delegates in the DNC. He's fucked. Poll or no poll, you win the DNC by taking the super-delegates. Ask Obummer who won the popular vote with Hillary. Bernie's not even worth discussing, like him or not.
Don't underestimate the sheeple's willingness to pull a lever in a voting booth when that lever promises lots of free stuff. Sheep don't care where the money comes from for their stuff. If Sanders sells himself right to these people, he can easily make it into the White House.
Sanders will tax us into prosperity!!!!
The founders, like them or not, gave us a republic, not a democracy. And they did so because they knew democracy would doom the country.
Would anyone care to argue they were wrong?
France has Hollande who is a socialist. How's that working out for them?
You're missing the savings part of that chart.
Thanks for the link. Come on Tyler's this is what the mainstream media does. If you're going to show part of the graph show it all. Its all make believe anyways.
This article is misleading since the first item, Medicare for everyone, would have a lot of its cost offset by not having to pay medical insurance premiums. Corporations should be all for this.
Exactly. It's all about whose expenses (and profits) will go up or down, and it's a rigged analysis if taxes and insurance premiums, private and government debt, corporate and government spending are treated as somehow different kinds of money coming from a different pot.
Also, it's fair to compare the cost of Bernie's program with the cost in lost wages and production of leaving the money in the hands of people who are just sitting on it and won't or can't reinvest it in the real economy.
The exceptional free shit army is amassing.
read this
https://theintercept.com/2015/09/15/wall-street-journals-scary-bernie-sa...
Solution to the spending. Whoever votes/wants for a governement program pays for 1% of the aggregate of all the costs payable in monthy installments. Working class stiffs like me can pay the rest, but only upon receipt of payment!
$18T, that number sounds familiar, isn't that how much we just spent on socialism for the 1%?
A WSJ analysis...
REALLY Tyler?
You don't have to read a word to know where the WSJ is going with their "analysis".
I'm sure the WSJ would be unhappy, but OK with an affable Vice-President stepping up to give us more years of Obummer.
"What the Wall Street Journal won’t tell you is that $15 trillion in national health spending over 10 years would represent a massive savings for the United States. Right now we spend at twice that rate for health care. According to the Congressional Budget Office, in fiscal year 2013 alone, the U.S. spent $2.8 trillion on total health expenditures, not including the $250 billion tax break employers get for providing health insurance to their workers.
Accounting for cost inflation in health care and extending that out for 10 years, on our current trajectory we would spend more than $30 trillion, compared to the $15 trillion of a single-payer plan, which would totally supplant it.
"If he says $17 trillion it really means $170 trillion.
My favorite part is the little quip about raising taxes to bring in an extra $6 trillion. The IRS brings in $2 trillion now, and we spend almost $4 trillion a year. The extra tax money won't even cover the yearly deficit, so all of Bernie's plan goes straight to debt.
There is no paying for it.
How about instead of trying to mask it, just come out and say he will make everything free. That is the communist ideal right?
Free homes, free cars, free food, free school, free health care.
I've been to China and know people from communist Russia. I know what the government provided free stuff looks like. It isn't a Mercedes and a house in the Hamptons.
Shit, if Bernie gets in office I can quit my job and join the Free Shit Army
Nice thought, but you might not belong to the "proper" ethnic group.
Better to just get rid of money.
Close. The plan is to get rid of money - - from those who make it and give to those who don't.
The real power of money is not to buy "stuff" for those who earn it but to buy "votes" from those who don't.
Maybe I was too busy working to pay much attention to politics in the past. Did the previous presidential elections start the media hype 18+ months ahead ? Were there debates prior to 9/15/2011 ?
If it's a PROPOSED $18T plan, you can bet the actual cost will be at least double.
(Name any government spending plan that has come in under or even AT budget.)
"...a legislative branch whose sheer inability to actually legislate anything..."
Bullshit. The system creates thousands of pages of shit legislation annually. "Gridlock" is nothing more than a red herring for "catastrophic dysfunction".
The problem is they are self-serving sociopaths surrounded by 'yes' men who only get a measure of their productivity by proccessing shitloads of paper. There are no feedback loops that provide a legitimate evaluation of legislative performance. Legislators aren't interested in "governing", but instead "manipulating sentiments" so they win the popularity contest.
Goes back to a fundemental point--governments are inherently evil and dysfunctional. An ideal governing system would pass a couple single-page laws a year that have definitive expiration dates. The rest of the time would be spent reviewing and eliminating past laws to see if they are working, and if not, then letting them expire.
Most governing should be done at the local level. Fed governing should not extend beyond consideration of constitutional principles. If there aren't enough constitutional principles requiring consideration, then the shitbags should go home.
I understand this will never happen. Failure is certain.
For me as an outsider this race is already beautiful. Game of the Year if you ask me. Graphics are great, top notch hair simulation abound, fireworks, server problems, bad language back and forth. It's truly like any other big AAA game release. Copy pasted cardboard cutout gangsters monologuing shitty bombastic one liners? Check. Great opening act, repetitive middle and disappointing finale? Check. Spoilerific trailers? Check. If you were wondering when GTA 6 was gonna hit shelves? Here ya go! The greatest video game in the world, The American Elections 16XHD-2: Zero Inquisition in 4K blandscreen straight into your living room for you to record, stream, rewind and watch back in glorious slow-motion and ultimately press X when the screen and radio voice tell you to.
I'm beginning to suspect Trump is being directed by none other than Hideo Kojima himself. Trump Tower houses Metal Gear DON, I'm sure of it.
If Sanders can convince a "majority" to vote for and support him, the following quotation may become significant in future legislative actions.
"Democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where 51% of the people may take away the rights of the other 49%."
The only thing stopping that from happening is the fact that we live in a "Representative Republic" and NOT a pure democracy.
Nothing in this program that every other developed country in the world doesn't already provide. And yes, it will require higher taxes on the rich, which ever other developed country in the world already imposes. And that OUR country imposed from 1945-1980, without destroying the economy -- in fact, that corresponds to the fabled "Post-War Boom".
Many of these pricetags would be recouped by lowering the current social costs of the system. For instance, a well-managed single-payer healthcare system would cut the costs of American healthcare overall by roughly 50%. That means, we shift the cost from our current insurance plan to the government, and pay 50 cents on the dollar that we are paying now. That's a good deal for everyone except insurance company executives. The same thing with college costs -- shift to public payment, cut the banking profit centers out of the loop, and reduce costs by 50-100% overall. That's money that will go back into the pockets of Average Joe's, which will be spent on consumer goods and stimulate the economy.
Fundamentally, there is nothing in this list that we aren't going to pay for one way or another. The question is WHO pays, and HOW MUCH we pay. In the current system, we ALL pay, and we all pay TOP DOLLAR. With a more "socialist" system, many of the currently rich "pay" by losing their ability to fleece the rest of us, and as a result, we pay MUCH LESS for a BETTER PRODUCT. That's because crony capitalism is not efficient, not effective, and not benign for anyone except the cronies collecting rents.
There 200 people that own half the world's wealth. Kill em, take their stuff, problem solved.
So, $15 trillion over 10 years to provide Medicare for All? That comes to $1.5 trillion a year. Currently we are paying a total of about $3 trillion a year for health care in the US. So, basically, Bernie is going to provide everybody with health care for half the cost. That would put us closer to what the rest of the developed world spends per capita. What is WRONG with that?
Typical propaganda from oligarch Rupert Murdoch's Wall Street Journal.