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U.S. Rejected Offers by Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and Syria to Surrender … and Proceeded to Wage War
The Daily Mail reported last year:
A self-selected group of former top military officers, CIA insiders and think-tankers, declared Tuesday in Washington that a seven-month review of the deadly 2012 terrorist attack has determined that [Gaddafi offered to abdicate as leader of Libya.]
‘Gaddafi wasn’t a good guy, but he was being marginalized,’ [Retired Rear Admiral Chuck ] Kubic recalled. ‘Gaddafi actually offered to abdicate’ shortly after the beginning of a 2011 rebellion.
‘But the U.S. ignored his calls for a truce,’ the commission wrote, ultimately backing the horse that would later help kill a U.S. ambassador.
Kubic said that the effort at truce talks fell apart when the White House declined to let the Pentagon pursue it seriously.
‘We had a leader who had won the Nobel Peace Prize,’ Kubic said, ‘but who was unwilling to give peace a chance for 72 hours.’
The Washington Times wrote in January:
“I have been contacted by an intermediary in Libya who has indicated that President Muammar Gadhafi is willing to negotiate an end to the conflict under conditions which would seem to favor Administration policy,” [former U.S. Congressman Dennis] Kucinich wrote on Aug. 24.
***
Mrs. Clinton ordered a general within the Pentagon to refuse to take a call with Gadhafi’s son Seif and other high-level members within the regime, to help negotiate a resolution, the secret recordings reveal.
A day later, on March 18, Gadhafi called for a cease-fire, another action the administration dismissed.
***
“Everything I am getting from the State Department is that they do not care about being part of this. Secretary Clinton does not want to negotiate at all,” the Pentagon intelligence asset told Seif Gadhafi and his adviser on the recordings.
Communication was so torn between the Libyan regime and the State Department that they had no point of contact within the department to even communicate whether they were willing to accept the U.N.’s mandates, former Libyan officials said.
***
“The decision to invade [Libya] had already been made, so everything coming out of the State Department at that time was to reinforce that decision,” the official explained, speaking only on the condition of anonymity for fear of retribution.
***
“The Libyans would stop all combat operations and withdraw all military forces to the outskirts of the cities and assume a defensive posture. Then to insure the credibility with the international community, the Libyans would accept recipients from the African Union to make sure the truce was honored,” Mr. Kubic said, describing the offers.
“[Gadhafi] came back and said he was willing to step down and permit a transition government, but he had two conditions,” Mr. Kubic said. “First was to insure there was a military force left over after he left Libya capable to go after al Qaeda. Secondly, he wanted to have the sanctions against him and his family and those loyal to him lifted and free passage. At that point in time, everybody thought that was reasonable.”
But not the State Department.
Gen. Ham was ordered to stand down two days after the negotiation began, Mr. Kubic said. The orders were given at the behest of the State Department, according to those familiar with the plan in the Pentagon. Gen. Ham declined to comment when questioned by The Times.
“If their goal was to get Gadhafi out of power, then why not give a 72-hour truce a try?” Mr. Kubic asked. “It wasn’t enough to get him out of power; they wanted him dead.”
Similarly, Saddam Hussein allegedly offered to let weapons inspectors in the country and to hold new elections. As the Guardian reported in 2003:
In the few weeks before its fall, Iraq’s Ba’athist regime made a series of increasingly desperate peace offers to Washington, promising to hold elections and even to allow US troops to search for banned weapons. But the advances were all rejected by the Bush administration, according to intermediaries involved in the talks.
Moreover, Saddam allegedly offered to leave Iraq:
“Fearing defeat, Saddam was prepared to go peacefully in return for £500million ($1billion)”.
“The extraordinary offer was revealed yesterday in a transcript of talks in February 2003 between George Bush and the then Spanish Prime Minister Jose Maria Aznar at the President’s Texas ranch.”
“The White House refused to comment on the report last night. But, if verified, it is certain to raise questions in Washington and London over whether the costly four-year war could have been averted.”
According to the tapes, Bush told Aznar that whether Saddam was still in Iraq or not, “We’ll be in Baghdad by the end of March.” See also this and this.
Susan Lindauer (after reading an earlier version of this essay by Washington’s Blog) wrote:
That’s absolutely true about Saddam’s frantic officers to retire to a Villa in Tikrit before the invasion. Except he never demanded $1 BILLION (or $500 MILLION). He only asked for a private brigade of the Iraqi National Guard, which he compared to President Clinton’s Secret Service detail for life throughout retirement. I know that for a fact, because I myself was the back channel to the Iraqi Embassy at the U.N. in New York, who carried the message to Washington AND the United Nations General Assembly and Security Council. Kofi Annan was very much aware of it. So was Spain’s President Asnar. Those historical details were redacted from the history books when George Bush ordered my arrest on the Patriot Act as an “Iraqi Agent”– a political farce with no supporting evidence, except my passionate anti-war activism and urgent warnings that War in Iraq would uncover no WMDs, would fire up a violent and bloody counter-insurgency, and would result in Iran’s rise as a regional power. In 2007, the Senate Intelligence Committee hailed my warnings in Jan. 2003 (as the Chief Human Intelligence covering Iraq at the U.N.) to be one of the only bright spots in Pre-War Intelligence. Nevertheless, in 2005 and again in 2008, I was declared “incompetent to stand trial,” and threatened with “indefinite detention up to 10 years” on Carswell Air Force Base, in order to protect the cover up of Iraqi Pre-War Intelligence.
(The New York Times has covered Lindauer at least 5 times, including here and here.)
On October 14, 2001, the Taliban offered to hand over Osama bin Laden to a neutral country if the US halted bombing if the Taliban were given evidence of Bin Laden’s involvement in 9/11.
Specifically, the Guardian noted in 2001:
Returning to the White House after a weekend at Camp David, the president said the bombing would not stop, unless the ruling Taliban “turn [bin Laden] over, turn his cohorts over, turn any hostages they hold over.” He added, “There’s no need to discuss innocence or guilt. We know he’s guilty” …
Afghanistan’s deputy prime minister, Haji Abdul Kabir, told reporters that the Taliban would require evidence that Bin Laden was behind the September 11 terrorist attacks in the US.
“If the Taliban is given evidence that Osama bin Laden is involved” and the bombing campaign stopped, “we would be ready to hand him over to a third country”, Mr Kabir added.
However, as the Guardian subsequently pointed out:
A senior Taliban minister has offered a last-minute deal to hand over Osama bin Laden during a secret visit to Islamabad, senior sources in Pakistan told the Guardian last night.
For the first time, the Taliban offered to hand over Bin Laden for trial in a country other than the US without asking to see evidence first in return for a halt to the bombing, a source close to Pakistan’s military leadership said.
And the Guardian reports today:
Russia proposed more than three years ago that Syria’s president, Bashar al-Assad, could step down as part of a peace deal, according to a senior negotiator involved in back-channel discussions at the time.
Former Finnish president and Nobel peace prize laureate Martti Ahtisaari said western powers failed to seize on the proposal. Since it was made, in 2012, tens of thousands of people have been killed and millions uprooted, causing the world’s gravest refugee crisis since the second world war.
Ahtisaari held talks with envoys from the five permanent members of the UN security council in February 2012. He said that during those discussions, the Russian ambassador, Vitaly Churkin, laid out a three-point plan, which included a proposal for Assad to cede power at some point after peace talks had started between the regime and the opposition.
But he said that the US, Britain and France were so convinced that the Syrian dictator was about to fall, they ignored the proposal.
***
“There was no question because I went back and asked him a second time,” he said, noting that Churkin had just returned from a trip to Moscow and there seemed little doubt he was raising the proposal on behalf of the Kremlin.
Ahtisaari said he passed on the message to the American, British and French missions at the UN, but he said: “Nothing happened because I think all these, and many others, were convinced that Assad would be thrown out of office in a few weeks so there was no need to do anything.”
Similarly, Bloomberg reported in 2012:
As Syria slides toward civil war, Russia is signaling that it no longer views President Bashar al-Assad’s position as tenable and is working with the U.S. to seek an orderly transition.
***
After meeting with French President Francois Hollande, among the most adamant of Western leaders demanding Assad’s departure, Putin said Russia was not invested in Assad staying.
***
“We aren’t for Assad or for his opponents,” Putin told reporters in Paris on June 1. “We want to achieve a situation in which violence ends and a full-scale civil war is avoided.”
And yet, as with Gaddaffi, Saddam Hussein and Bin Laden, the U.S. turned down the offer and has instead prosecuted war. See this and this.
Postscript: An offer by Russia for Assad to leave is not the same as an offer by Assad himself. However, because the Syrian government would have long ago fallen without Russia’s help, the distinction is not really that meaningful.
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Published on Jun 23, 2015On this week’s episode of Behind the Headlines, we spoke with a couple who witnessed first-hand the so-called ‘Libyan Revolution’ in 2011. James and JoAnne Moriarty were working in Libya’s oil industry when NATO’s massive bombardment began. Coupled with the arrival of hundreds of thousands of ‘rebels’ and Western Special Forces, Libya literally went up in flames.
Being present in the country at the time, James and JoAnn were invited by an international NGO to participate in a fact-finding mission. Trusted by Libyan political and business leaders, the Moriartys travelled throughout the country for months, observing and documenting events, and personally witnessing numerous unspeakable atrocities.
After barely escaping with their lives when the ‘rebels’ placed them on a kill-list, the Moriartys finally made it back to the US with bodies and evidence intact… only to discover that their troubles had barely begun.
In this show you will learn the truth about what happened in Libya, untold anywhere in the mainstream media, including: The truth about life under Ghaddafi The true scale of the death and destruction in Libya The truth about what happened to US ambassador Chris Stevens at the Benghazi ‘consulate’, and why the US government is covering it up
You can find extensive documentation for the Moriartys’ claims on their website, where you can also purchase their DVD ‘Escape from Al Qaeda’.
Show page: http://www.blogtalkradio.com/sottradi...
Gaddafi had loaned Unicredito multiple billions in 2009 and they didn't feel like paying it back. Follow the money.
We don't trust elections in our client states. When the Iraqis had their first election after the fall of Saddam, they elected some mullah we didn't like so we made them hold another election. "Do it again until you do it right!"
There's no profit in peace. Or not nearly as much I should say. A little dribble just won't cut it, steal the whole fucking enchilada at once. Get to test weapons. Get to play with cool toys like drones. See people get blown to pieces for the sick-minded. Move closer to world domination, etc. All ideas of crazy people. The only problem is, since this is human nature, if the US wasn't doing it or preventing others, would others step in with the same crazy ass plan? I would venture to guess yes.
I don't think anyone at point really believes anything except MENA instability has been and continues to be the goal.
Whatever is of benefit to peaceful citizens is not profitable to the financial sociopaths. Hence, fighting increases. Your real enemy hides in financial institutions, surrounded by minions and voracious lawyers.
Do you think the white collar crime of Wall Steet and the Federal Reserve is bad ?
For more crimes against humanity go to www.firecrusade.com and see Free Document page and click link A Crime Against Humanity
The very gov agencies that are supposed to be protecting the public from dangers of fire and hazardous products, CPSC and NFPA as well as the non gov testing facility UL which often tests products on the governments behalf, have been covering up a deadly conspiracy to commit fraud that has resulted in the deaths of 10's of 1000's and horrible, often times, disfiguring injuries of 100's of 1000's of unsuspecting consumers over last 5 decades.
These agencies have all been in the back pocket of ionized alarm manufactures for over 50 years , which was exposed back in 1976 by a Fire Protection Engineer, Richard Patton. Mr. Patton revealed that the government funded Dunes Test which tested smoke alarms, was not only rigged so ionized alarms would pass the smoldering smoke stage of test but the data was falsified so that ionized detectors could keep the UL stamp of approval, while the superior, safer and more reliable heat detector technologies were deliberately set up to fail the tests.
With each day that passes and the CSPC fails to make a mandatory recall of ion alarms , many more victims will either be killed and or suffer serious injuries as the ionized alarm manufactures flooded the market with ion alarms and it is estimated that over 90% of all homes and habitable structures have these deadly devices, providing the public with a false sense of security.
Buyer beware ! These deaths and injuries have been and are preventable, as the safer more reliable photoelectric / heat smoke alarms have been available for over 40 years. The ion manufactures are fully aware of the problem and have been sued multiple times and paid $10's of millions in damages and the UL has been sued as well. Manufactures, in one lawsuit back in 2001 were ordered to provide disclosure on ion alarm packaging which ended up being a watered down disclosure / recommendation to use both photoelectric and ionized alarms. Being ion alarms are less expensive and majority of consumers do not read fine print on packaging which omits the actual dangers / death / injury factors, consumers assume a smoke detector is a smoke detector, and most people still opt to buy the less expensive and dangerous ion alarms.
Most everyone you know is at risk and should be made aware of these deadly devices as the government agencies will continue to cover up the fraud from the public until such a time a civil lawsuit and verdict is reached to force CPSC to execute a mandatory recall which could take several years. Please post this message on your facebook and twitter sites and forward to as many others as possible. More information and 60 minutes segment / news videos that have covered this issue can be found on www.smokealarmwarning.org
He needed killing.
THIS IS ON US. We do nothing while our psychopathic murdering, elected, "leaders" destroy everything they can. THIS IS ON US.
I fear that future historians will agree with you. The American empire will be known for its psycopathic end more than for anything else.
Not exactly, we don't elect our leaders puppetmasters.
All wars are banker's wars.
It's still on us. Most of us won't care until it's our turn.
I believe gw more than I do .gov
You don't have to believe GW, he quotes credible sources. The pattern is quite clear. Just add on Hillary's "We came, we saw, he died. Hahahahahs!" for color.
I always visualize her licking his blood on the floor next to his dead body, just before she spoke those words.....
and in Ukraine,
Poroshenko (the elected guy who didn't want the IMF-NATO offer for Ukraine),
had agreed in a EU brokered deal to hold early elections and step down.
Guess who said "Fuck the EU" and instead backed a coup by jackbooted jingoists?
nor should we forget the US-led attack on Yugoslavia,
in complete violation of the UN charter,
a devastating bombing campaign destroying the civilian infrastructure,
done with the hypocritical alleged motive to prevent "human rights violations".
In that case, Yugoslavia's refusal to accept a non-negotiable ultimatum
to surrender sovereignty of its territory (Kosovo) to the Mafia-run KLA
was falsely depicted as Yugoslavia's refusal to negotiate.
http://www.iacenter.org/warcrime/22_rambo.htm
http://iacenter.org/warcrime/2_kla.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Kosovo
Now Turkey destabilises Western Europe by funnelling refugees into the EU in an invasion force. Germany takes in 1,000,000 in 2015 which exceeds its own birth rate. Won't be long before Europe disintegrates into civil war and regional conflicts like so much of its history. Soon the US will have created global chaos and it will not be able to restore order anywhere because it dare not put "boots on the ground" and it will need 4-5 million soldiers to restore order the way things are going. When the Ukrainian refugees start towards Western Europe it should be clear the EU has destroyed peace in Europe for generations
If you read the link Usurious posted, you realize this was intended.
To the neocons, Germany cannot be allowed to ally with Russia. That would endanger the whole continent. Since it is impossible to conquer and occupy everything, the plan is to create chaos all around Germany and Russia. This gives them bigger problems to worry about.
1 million refugees in Germany weakens them for decades. Meanwhile, Russia is busy keeping Assad in power and preventing Ukraine from going west. Meanwhile, China is on the verge of economic meltdown. A few fed rate increases will keep that pot boiling for decades.
The real question is are the neocons crazy or right? History shows psychopaths come to power and seek empires for themselves. Better to have small skirmishes keeping that in check, rather than all out wars every 20-50 years. Seems like a pragmatic, if cold blooded, solution.
It seems that the US "leaders" have made it a game to violate every law of the Geneva conventions.
All those kids who were taking, like, loads of drugs in the '70's, those kids are now running US foreign policy - and still taking the drugs.
the "kids" who Turned On went into music, computing, design, family, travel, and more ...
but yeah, those alcoholic kids did go on to run foreign policy, i give you that ...
...coke heads too, but less likely the potheads...
Psychopathic Players and Cynical Moves
Guarantee a Future of Perpetual War “From the Black Sea to the Baltic” Explosive Presentation Hosted by the Chicago Council on Global Affairs Reveals
What No Government Official, No Political Representative, No NGO Executive
and No Think Tank Director Has Ever Said Before in Public
http://stateofthenation2012.com/?p=22223
When will the American people demand that Cheney, Bush Hillary and Obama face justice for war crimes committed against humanity. Hopefully in 2016 Americans remember the crimes these people have committed and vote for somehing with not such a past.
Are you Dreaming Amigo? Los Gringos will Never admit what they Refuse to Believe! Bush and Cheney will go to their graves as Heroes in their eyes! Otherwise Intelligent Peoples Refuse to Entertain what They Consider to be "Treasonous" Notions. I have Three Brother-in-Laws that work in Govt Related Fields. I get along with them all just fine now that I have learned what Topics to Avoid in Conversation!
Buen Suenos, Amigo
http://libyasos.blogspot.de/p/gaddafi.html
With the discovery of oil in Libya in 1959, a very poor desert countrybecame a very rich little western protectorate. US and European companies had huge stakes in the extremely lucrative petroleum and banking sectors, but these were soon nationalized by Gaddafi. Thus Libya overnightjoined the list of US 'enemy' or 'rogue' states that sought autonomy and self-determination outside the expanding sphere of western Empire. Further cementing western hatred of the new regime, Libya played a leading role of the 1973 oil embargo against the US and maintained cooperative relations with the Soviet Union. Gaddafi also reportedly channeled early oil wealth into national free health care and education.
Life in Libya with Leader Gaddafi: 1. Electricity for household use is free, 2. interest-free loans3. during the study, governmant give to every student 2 300 dolars/month 4. receives the average salary for this profession if you do not find a jobafter graduation, 5. the state has paid for to work in the profession, 6. every unemployed person receives social assistance 15,000 $/year, 7. for marriage state pays first apartment or house (150m2), 8. buying cars at factory prices, 9. LIBYA not owe anyone a cent, 10. free higher education abroad, 11. 25% of highly educated, 12. 40 loaves of bread costs $ 0.15, 13. water in the middle of the desert, drinking water, 14. 8 dinars per liter of oil (0.08 EUR), 15. 6% poor people, 16. for each infant, the couple received $ 5,000 for their needs.
...
etc.
etc.
"9. LIBYA not owe anyone a cent,"
That's the problem right there...
and i didn't see any mention of the golden Squid in the article, so more obfuscation still ....
Just more evidence that Bush, Cheney, Hillary, and Obozo need to be tried for war crimes, treason and crimes against humanity. Why do we continue to put up with this shit?
Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Karl Rove, Paul Wolfowitz, Bill Kristol, and Condoleeza Rice among many others all need to spend a better portion of their earthly existence in an 8x8 cell watching the rest of us enjoying their sudden departure.
That's a rather incomplete list, but it's a start.
You could have duplicate posted that 48 more times... and i would still have upVoted you every time...
Dick Cheney, Donald Rumsfeld, Karl Rove, Paul Wolfowitz, Bill Kristol, and Condoleeza Rice among many others all need to spend a better portion of their earthly existence in an 8x8 cell watching the rest of us enjoying their sudden departure.
At least 2 of those people are now immune from any war crime trials, just in case you haven't been paying attention.
Is there an international statute of limitations for war crimes, the ultimate crime against humanity? 80-90 year old alleged Nazis are still being dragged before the courts.
Israeli Exceptionalism ?
Don't forget Blair...
Roanoke Shooting 'Survivor' Vicki Gardner Rolled Out for Farcical Fox News Interview
http://winteractionables.com/?p=25169
What's that? The UK and their US and NATO puppets weren't at all interested in peaceful solutions to the middle-east conflicts? It's almost exactly like the way Israel targetted assasinations against the moderate Palistinian politicians for the express purpose of making the radicals powerful, meaning that no peace would be possible.
One would think that the aim has been to kill as many people as possible, and not regime change at all.
Indeed so, Motasaurus: "the aim has been to kill as many people as possible." It is difficult to come to terms with the degree to which the most psychopathic people are controlling civilization, while the vast majority act like incompetent political idiots. Of course, that is a situation which evolved for thousands of years, at nearly an exponential rate.
The ways that those things were always developing exponentially makes it even harder to comprehend what is going on! There are MATCHING bookends between the people who adapted to become the best at being dishonest, and backing that up with violence, as well as the people who adapted to be ignorant and afraid, given that they were on the receiving end of the lies backed by violence. On a more profound level, there is almost nothing but a central core of organized crime, surrounded by layers of controlled opposition groups. I recently went into a more detailed analysis of that, and the role of George Washington's style of articles, in my comments upon:
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-12/unmasking-isis
Unmasking ISIS
The underlying issues are that human artificial selection systems developed INSIDE natural selection systems, and were driven to develop through the history of warfare based on backing up deceits with destruction, becoming the basis for political economy based upon governments enforcing frauds. Money is measurement backed by murder, within the context that the debt controls are backed by the death controls, within the context that all private property is based upon backing up claims with coercions.
The death controls are central to the evolution of life, after that life exist. Similarly, the human death controls are central to civilization, with the murder systems being the most extreme forms of those, which then in turn back up the money systems, which pay for those murder systems in return. THE DEEPER ISSUES ARE THAT THERE MUST BE SOME DEATH CONTROL SYSTEMS.
The ways that the human systems developed through the history of warfare were due to their successfulness being based upon deceits and treacheries. Hence, civilization is based upon a central core of organized crime, because that is what actually was selected to become the surviving systems. Around those developed layers of controlled opposition groups, who operate within the same frame of reference, and therefore, are profoundly dishonest about the death control systems too. Indeed, all of the world's dominate religions and ideologies tended to be various forms of controlled opposition groups, who were co-opted and compromised to work WITHIN the systems originally made and maintained by the best organized gangs of criminals.
Throughout the whole domain of the combined money/murder systems, there are professional liars and immaculate hypocrites, lying about everything as much as possible while also being as willfully blind and deliberately ignorant as possible. The results are that the most important things that human civilization MUST do, which are operate the death control systems, ended up being driven by natural selection pressures to develop on the basis of manifesting the maximum possible deceits, which then includes the same sort of bullshit promoted by those in the layers of controlled opposition groups, as within the core organized crime groups.
Since human civilization is based upon the maximum possible deceits and frauds, which had good reasons to develop, due to natural selection pressures, driving chronic political problems to get resolved in the most expedient ways, pretty well everyone in both the core organized crime gangs (namely the governments which are the biggest forms of organized crime, as well as the best organized gangsters, which are now the banksters and the corporations that grew up around their banks), it is politically impossible to have any rational debates about the death controls, that back up the debt controls, within the existing combined money/murder systems.
The existing systems were driven to become based upon the maximum possible deceits and frauds, in ways which makes it politically impossible to have any rational debates about the central issues regarding the human death controls, or murder systems, which must and do exist, and which must and do direct how everything else works (or, at least did, before those developing to become globalized electronic frauds, backed by the threat of the force of atomic bombs, which NOBODY now fully understands.)
The overall & underlying issues have been progress in physical science, which enabled the series of industrial revolutions, which ended up being channeled through social pyramid systems based upon backing up lies with violence, within which there were MATCHING groups of controlled opposition, spouting the same bullshit social stories that the core groups of organized crime originally promoted. Hence, all of the currently dominate religions and ideologies are profoundly based upon bullshit, because they were selected to be the only kind of public opposition that could co-exist with the biggest gangs of criminals controlling civilization.
Of course, there has never been allowed to develop any progress in political science which surpassed that achieved in physical science for the reasons I just outlined. Instead, the industrial revolutions enabled the planet's natural resources to be strip-mined at an exponential rate. That was done by governments enforcing frauds by privately controlled banks to create the public "money" supply out of nothing as debts, in order to "pay" for strip-mining the planet. That enabled the exponential growth of the overall human population and total of all human activities, ALL OF WHICH WERE BASED UPON THE EXPONENTIAL GROWTH OF STRIP-MINING A FINITE PLANET.
At the present time, we are just beginning to reach the turning or tipping points, where the ability to exponentially increase the strip-mining of the planet's natural resources is running into globalized limits of diminishing returns from being able to do that. Of course, while that was done, through civilization operating on the basis of fundamentally fraudulent financial accounting systems, that strip-mining, while actually running on debt engine treadmills, was presented as "good things" to do. That was possible because economics was always actually a subset of warfare, and therefore, economics was actually based upon the maximum possible frauds, operated by the best organized gangs of criminals, the same as warfare was based upon the maximum possible deceits, but which were simultaneously the most socially successful strategies, in those times and places.
I REPEAT, that was selected to develop for by natural selection pressures, which were inherently necessary. However, there simultaneously developed social systems that became Wonderland Matrix Bizarro Worlds, due to the the most socially successful people being the best professional liars and immaculate hypocrites, throughout all the sociopolitical layers, from the controlled opposition groups, down to the core organized crime gangs. Different human beings, for generation after generation, tended to both cultural and genetically develop within those basic social groups, within the social pyramid systems.
Those were the overall reasons how and why we have ended up with the human death control systems being operated through the maximum possible deceits, as well as how and why the dominate religions and ideologies also MATCH that bullshit world view. In that context, as we approach the exponential growth of the total of the human population and activities reaching the tipping, turning points of diminishing returns upon the planet as a whole, we are entering the situation of OVERSHOOT.
It is politically impossible to have any any relatively rational discussions about those problems, in order to negotiate better death control systems, in order to develop better integrated human, industrial and natural ecologies. Instead, civilization is controlled by the most psychopathic people, while their controlled opposition spout basically the same bullshit world view too. But nevertheless, it is absolutely impossible for the total human population to keep on doubling and doubling forever. By definition, what will stop that from happening are the death control systems.
The only ways that our current civilization can operate its artificial selection systems are through the maximum possible deceits and frauds, through the existing combined money/murder systems. It is politically impossible to do anything better, because of the ways that there are now almost nothing but a core of organized crime, surrounded by controlled opposition groups. Therefore, we are headed towards civilization endeavouring to cope with running into the limits of being able to exponentially strip-mine the planet in ways which require the vast majority of the human population to be miserably murdered.
Tragically, it would take a series of technological miracles, surpassed by even more prodigious political miracles, for the human artificial selection systems to not continue being operated through the maximum possible deceits and frauds, in the most psychotic ways. The essential problems are how to operate the human murder systems after the development of weapons of mass destruction. While there are theoretically possible creative alternatives, those all appear to be politically impossible, due to the established systems being based upon the combined money/murder systems, operated through the maximum possible frauds and deceits, by layer after layer of professional liars and immaculate hypocrites.
As I attempted to explain, in my comments under the article I already linked above, Unmasking ISIS, as well as under many similar articles in the series which have been republished on Zero Hedge, the controlled opposition groups tend to NEVER promote better death control systems, but rather promote the impossible ideals that there should be no death control systems, or none that human beings are consciously aware of operating. Therefore, given that the actually existing death controls are based upon the maximum possible deceits, while their controlled opposition groups promote impossible ideals that always backfire badly, and cause the opposite to happen in the real world, we are rushing faster and faster towards those tipping, turning points where the exponential growth of everything that was previously based upon having a fresh planet for industrialization to strip-mine are now approaching various limits, as diminishing returns, after we have high-graded ourselves to hell, by running as fast as we could upon debt engine treadmills, operating economic systems based upon organized crime, which got away with presenting themselves as doing the opposite of what they were really doing.
The overall issues are that the total of the human population and activities have been growing at an exponential rate on a finite planet. That has been driving us towards overshooting. However, there are no rational ways for society to admit and address those problems, due to the existing artificial selection systems having already been driven by natural selection pressures to become based upon the maximum possible frauds and deceits, through combined money/murder system that are based upon the maximum possible bullshit, which is spouted by MATCHING BOOKENDS OF BOTH THE CORE ORGANIZED CRIME GANGS, AS WELL AS THE LAYERS OF CONTROLLED OPPOSITION THAT SURROUND THEM.
Given that overview of the nature of the problems that the human species are facing, OF COURSE, "the aim has been to kill as many people as possible." And also, OF COURSE, that is presented as being a totally evil thing to do, by people who generally have NO "sympathy with the devil" regarding how and why that must be done, in one way or another, sooner or later ... At the present time, it is politically impossible to develop better human artificial selection systems, that operate better death control systems. Rather, we are STUCK with the existing systems based on upon the maximum possible deceits.
In the context of the Middle East especially, since the currently dominate kinds of Neolithic Civilization, social pyramid systems, that spread out and conquered the rest of the world, started there, to become the most psychotic systems, that is also where one expects that there must necessarily develop the most psychotic death insanities, since it makes perverse sense that those areas are the least able to change in any better ways. In my view, the overall plans of the ruling classes are to attempt to mass murder the majority of the human population, whose total activities have already seriously OVERSHOT, since there was never any ways to prevent that from happening. Of course, those ruling classes have some psychotic plans for themselves to perhaps survive through that. However, they are primarily acting on the basis of their own morbid psychological and political habits, while they do NOT have any guarantees that their plans are possible.
The biggest of all booms will be followed by the biggest of all busts. Since it is now politically impossible to develop better death control systems, the paths we are necessarily on are for the most psychopathic people to do things in the most psychotic ways. Thus, "the aim has been to kill as many people as possible." Since it is NOT possible for the total of human population and activities to continue to double and double, as it has been possible previously, and since the only thing that can stop that are death controls, and since the actually existing death control systems are operated through the maximum possible deceits, and since the controlled opposition groups that surround the core organized crime gangs that are actually doing that are just as full of bullshit about everything regarding those topics, the most probable futures are the vast majority of human beings getting miserably murdered, as the limits of being able to strip-mine a finite planet become more and more manifested.
Of course, there are plenty of theoretical alternatives to those scenarios. However, none of those are politically impossible. Rather, one expects that the most psychopathic people, who developed to actually operate the existing combined money/murder systems, will continue to become ever more psychotic. Meanwhile, there are also no good reasons to believe that the controlled opposition groups would stop believing the same basic bullshit as well. Hence, the potential for severe social storms to blow through has been building on the horizon of history for quite a while ... and we are getting closer and closer to those social storms finally blowing through in quite severe ways.
If one was realistic about the real problems, then one should propose and promote better death control systems being designed and implemented. However, more and more it becomes clearer and clearer that we continue to head towards the default results, whereby the ruling classes continue to be excessively successful in realizing "the aim has been to kill as many people as possible," while the controlled opposition against them provides nothing better, because that kind of controlled opposition can not think about the death control systems in sufficiently different ways.
It has been OBVIOUS to anyone who looked at the problems of apparently exponential growth on a finite planet that that was ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE, and would necessarily be stopped, one way or another, sooner or later. Indeed, the known universe is NOT big enough to sustain endless exponential growth. (Considering the mathematics of even several thousand more years of exponential growth of the human population is enough to demonstrate that is ABSOLUTELY IMPOSSIBLE.) We are already at the point where even one or two more doublings of the total human population and activities appears to be no longer possible, despite that our society is based upon having been able to do that for Centuries and Millennia before now.
However, it has never before been possible to have any rational public debates about those basic issues, due to the established systems of artificial selection having been driven by natural selection pressures to become based on the maximum possible frauds and deceits, through the established money/murder systems. Therefore, the only politically possible resolutions to those real problems are for the psychotic and psychopathic ruling classes continuing to implement that "the aim has been to kill as many people as possible."
Mere "regime change" of those governments which were not already controlled by the international banksters is no longer enough. Rather, the only thing that is sufficient is to kill off the majority of the human population. Since the vast majority of that population acts like incompetent political idiots, that have been brainwashed to believe in the biggest bullies' bullshit social stories for generation after generation, and thus, the vast majority of people tend to believe in various old-fashioned religions and ideologies, that developed as the layers of controlled opposition groups, around the core organized crime groups, the prospects for actually being able to design and implement better death control systems look extremely dismal, while runaway debt insanities provoking death insanities look extremely probable.
Of course, there are theoretically possible alternative death control systems, which could be much better. However, those would take enough people going through series of intellectual scientific revolutions, in order to radically change the ways that they perceived the death control systems, in order to change those systems. I WISH that I could believe that was remotely possible ... Well, maybe it eventually will be? However, for now, the established ruling classes and their surrounding controlled opposition groups, are so totally dominated by professional liars and immaculate hypocrites that any such better death controls appear to be politically impossible, especially due to the degree that the overwhelming vast majority of people are already behaving like incompetent political idiots, that do not want want change the ways that they think.
Meanwhile, we are running out of time to be able to adapt and change, and that appears to be happening faster and faster. Those ruling classes who actually control civilization are implementing their agenda, while none of their controlled opposition groups has any better agenda to implement. Hence, we are rushing faster and faster towards the majority of the human species being mass murdered, because the ruling classes are psychotic psychopaths, while their controlled opposition groups are actually no better, since there is no genuine opposition able and willing to propose and promote better death control systems, instead of those which operate now through the maximum possible deceits, backing up a political economy based on the maximum possible frauds.
Good stuff, RM, but try to be more concise. A lot of what you say is repetitive and that works against you.
You are right, Herd, that my stuff could be better edited. However, the irony with respect to attempting to do that would STILL BE there is no practical political point to bothering to do so ...
Another article published on Zero Hedge,
Here's Why The Status Quo Is Doomed
correctly states, while also understating:
While all of that is correct, although the exact time horizon is not certain, the ruling classes' "solutions" to those problems are what they have actually prepared and implemented, namely starting more wars based on deceits, in order to engage in more genocides and democides.
Whether or not I edited my articulations about those problems any better would NOT MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE. I merely write what reading articles provoke me to actually think after I read them. I WISH that there was some practical point to doing that, which then could motivate me to edit that stuff better, however, my current conclusions are that it is politically impossible to stop the eventual mass murders of the majority of the human population. For several decades I have been worrying about those issues and working on theoretical solutions, only to more and more confirm my current conclusions.
Yes that and in many of these countries in the end its all about the physical gold they hold, a new leader doesn't matter we need to go there kill whoever and take their shit.
Saddam had lots and lots of gold, I think Ghadaffi had more.
Many of these places we end up going had loads of gold all of which now belongs to us aka the west aka the bankers aka the tribe. So in the end maybe we are all doing gods work just by being part of that system.
I think the aim was to spook the cattle and start a stampede of parasites north into the white heartland. Syria first, then Crimea and Ukraine. Presto, Kazaria is reborn, but its new name will be zion.
It didn't fit into President Zippy and the wicked witch's plans or narrative so couldn't be allowed. Now we have Ketchup-Boy, who is even less competent as SoS and we'll probably bomb and invade Canada next........
And what about the Japanese, at the end of WWII?
Couldn't let them surrender BEFORE dropping the A-Bomb, now could we?
Harry Solomon Truman saw to that.
We also had to get the results of the effects of nukes on undamaged cities and their inhabitants - a magnificently evil medical experiment.
Yes... and then we got... ObamaCare...