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Obama Folds Again, To Begin Syria Military Talks With Russia "Very Shortly"
Ever since Russia began stepping up its technical and logistical support for Bashar al-Assad’s forces at Latakia, Washington has insisted that Moscow’s intentions “aren’t yet clear.”
Essentially, that’s the excuse the US is giving for why it won’t join Russia in what would ultimately amount to an all-out push to rout ISIS in Syria.
The problem with that excuse, is that it creates a problem in terms of how the public perceives the situation. That is, the more explicit the Kremlin became about its aims in Syria, the harder it became for The White House to explain why the US isn’t on board.
The West has gone to great lengths to create a bogeyman par excellence in ISIS and it has, from the public’s perspective anyway, largely succeeded. However, Russia’s presence in Syria now means that the US will no longer be able to sit back and wait for ISIS (or anyone else for that matter) to overrun Assad. Russian military intervention has effectively taken that eventuality off the table, putting Washington in the extremely awkward position of having to either i) explain to the public that in fact Assad and Russia are the greater threats and therefore it’s in the US’s geopolitical interests to see if ISIS can finish the job even with the Russians on the ground, or ii) cave and admit privately that unless the US intends to go to war with Russia, Assad, and ISIS all at once, achieving the original goal (i.e. routing ISIS once ISIS routs Assad) is no longer possible, and say publicly that the US is willing to partner with Russia to defeat ISIS and the two nations will then negotiate for the future of the Assad regime.
To be clear, the first option is obviously a no-go because it blows the entire charade wide open.
As for the second option, as of Friday, it’s now in play. Here’s The New York Times:
Secretary of State John Kerry said on Friday that the United States was prepared to engage in military-to-military talks with Russiaconcerning Syria.
“The president believes that a military-to-military conversation is an important next step,” Mr. Kerry said, “and I think, hopefully, it will take place very shortly.”
The initial purpose of the talks with Russia, Mr. Kerry said, will be to help “define some of the different options that are available to us as we consider next steps in Syria.”
Mr. Kerry said that the Obama administration would not change its basic goals in Syria: The defeat the Islamic State, also known as ISIS or ISIL, and a political solution for the conflict there.
But though the administration has long said that President Bashar al-Assad must go for there to be a durable solution to the Syria crisis, Mr. Kerry seemed on Friday to allow for the possibility that Mr. Assad might remain in power in the short term. Mr. Assad has had Russia’s backing throughout the conflict.
“Our focus remains on destroying ISIL and also on a political settlement with respect to Syria, which we believe cannot be achieved with a long-term presence of Assad,” Mr. Kerry said. “But we’re looking for ways in which to try to find a common ground. Clearly, if you’re going to have a political settlement, which we have always argued is the best and only way to resolve Syria, you need to have conversations with people, and you need to find a common ground.”
And so, two years (nearly to the day) after Kerry folded to Sergei Lavrov over Assad's chemical weapons stash (the pretext for the original attempt to justify ousting Assad by military force), the US looks set to fold again.
Note that if Russia ends up negotiating for Assad to remain in power, all of this will have been for nothing. Make no mistake, none of it was "justified" in the first place. Engineering a civil war by funding and training extremists knowing that the resultant chaos will cost the lives of countless civilians would be deplorable even if the regime one sought to overthrow was unequivocally evil and the outcome was 100% certain. In Syria however, what you have is another example of a Mid-East strongman being destabilized by the West only to find that i) the human suffering brought on by the fighting and the chaos that reigns in its aftermath is far worse than the oppression the people suffered under the regime's rule, and ii) the outcome is far from certain and in this case, it appears that thanks to Russia, Assad isn't going anywhere.
So at the end of the day, hundreds of thousands of lives will have been wasted only to see the very same regime in power, only now, mutliple violent extremist groups that otherwise might not have existed will likely be present in one form or another in the region for decades to come.
Another US foreign policy success story.
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The citizens of Alaska would probably be happy to be given back to Russia.
Too bad militaries speak with bombs. Just sayin.
Lavrov to "Horse Face"...
"We've seen what you can do with little boys... Now lets see what you can do when they come a little bigger!...
We're waiting Horse Face for an epic "I don't think so" moment with your "Booby" leading the charge!
Looks like General(s)Austin and Dempsey and the rest of the United States Army, Navy Air Force and Marines are the craving little fucking cowards we always knew they would be when it's time to face 1968 all over again!
Pussified nation. Typical coward liberal.
i think its a GREAT show of leadership that trump is going to talk to putin when he comes to the U.N. this ISIS needs to get squashed and a trump/putin coalition would do just that. (serves obama right (getting front-run by trump) for that comment he made to 1 of putin's guys "tell vladimir once im re-elected, ill be in better position ..." ) imagine russian soldiers & our boys working side-by-side. then we could help each other economically. OMG just imagine that. hillary, obama, and the republican establishments head would explode if trump of all people could make deals with russia.
we are not going to agree on everything but this chilly relationship is good for nobody. the middle east is burning and both our economies could use a dropping of the sanctions.
i keep coming back to ANYONE who questions me on this: "how the FUCK would u feel if putin lined up his tanks on the mexican border? his airfoce on the canadian border? his navy in the gulf of mexico? as an american, you'd DEMAND your government blow them apart." instead of pissing on his shoes, why not try shaking his hand & see where u can agree. trump i think would do just that - economics & war on terror - i think putin's had enough of this shit in syria and said its time someone steps-up. NATO, U.N., fuck we haven't. ISIS is running around chopping off anyone with a heads neck off so why not WORK TOGETHER INSTEAD OF DRIVE EACH OTHER FURTHER APART.
i swear common sense makes my head hurt so much sometimes.
Trump talk to Putin?
I don't think Putin is interested in talking with more clowns.
i think its a GREAT show of leadership that trump is going to talk to putin when he comes to the U.N. this ISIS needs to get squashed and a trump/putin coalition would do just that
As long as he gets permission with a "hall pass" first from head master(s) Zakheim and Silverstein!
Your post makes me cry...What an opportunity we squandered back in the 90's!!!
We SHOULD be allies right now. We COULD have been allies, were it not for a handful of neo-cons unwilling to give up the Cold War...
Things could have been SO different today. The world would have been an entirely different place if we had shut these idiots down from day 1.
What you just said..
(period)
Let me add to your thoughts.
Why didn't the men and women in the United States Armed Forces less than 3 years after they were engaged in Afghanistan and Iraqt try for "all out mutiny" when they knew the pretext of 9/11 was a complete and utter lie that sacrificed their own in order to start those engagement(s)?...
Misplaced arrogance will get you nowhere. And that's all this Country has been since the close of WWII!
Now we're as worthless as the the paper we push and everyone knows it!!!
It's more complicated than most people realize, in this multi-sided battle for land, power and influence.
The Russians have a direct interest in Syria, now that Omar the Chechen is leading a large group of ISIS. Which might explain why Russia, Israel and the USA will want to talk to each other like adults, before this Frankenstein creation gets even more out of control.
Suggest you get more informed with the following links, for starters.
http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/iraq-turmoil/rising-star-isis-has-chech...
http://eaworldview.com/2013/12/syria-spotlight-interview-isis-chechen-le...
http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2014/07/02/isis_chechen_a_foreign...
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2677683/The-face-evil-Young-red-...
http://www.rt.com/news/184836-isis-putin-kadyrov-syria/
http://www.inquisitr.com/1451619/chechen-leader-tells-isis-following-put...
http://yournewswire.com/isis-terrorist-leader-is-cia-agent-chechen-presi...
What give the US the fuckin right to tell Syria who must remain in power on not in their own country?
The USSA is pretty good at this rgime change thing...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Covert_United_States_foreign_regime_change...
Bottom line is simple. All about keeping the Capitalist Growth Model growing. Need new markets to lower labour costs and generate GDP Growth. Finding the Multi-Nationals and the 1%ers behind all this is not to difficult to understand. Along with a global Central Banking cartel to keep the money printing and the proletariet enslaved. Surely anyone can see how fucked up this model is and how corrupt the USSA really is. Shame, shame, shame.
Russians are a pragmatic people. They aren't hobbled by the phony 'moral superiority' thing that plagues us here in the West. They know Assad is an asshole, but they also know that this region REQUIRES strongman-type leaders to maintain some semblance of stability. And stability is, in the long run, a better situation. When the Syrian people are good and ready, they will send Assad on his way, if they choose.
But they can't do that if their country is embroiled in a messy civil war, can they?
The Russians look at us and wonder at our stupidity. Instead of being patient, and letting these things evolve as they must, we storm on in and trash the place in the interest of 'fixing' things, only to create an even bigger mess.
A mess that apparently Russia will now attempt to clean up. Now watch as we spend billions to fuck things up even more, just to deny Putin any credit for mopping up our vomit.
If Assad is such an evil oppresive dictator, then why do 96% of his people support him . . even christians.
I smell another US hegelian rat.
Rule of thumb. If a traditional pious soverign country is at peace and economically stable, be assured the US is going to seek its overthrow.
This was the purpose of Putin making a public speech, which incidentally was given no mention at all by the British media by order of the establishment, Putin was giving fair warning to Obama to get a grip on the mad dog warmolngers in his administration, and tell the Wall Street bosses that starting WW3 would be of benefit to NOBODY.
I think it was Khomeny who once called the USA " the great Satan", he was wrong, it`s Wall Street and the City of London who are the " great Satans", and they have subverted the American and British security agencies to do teir dirty work for them.
Greed s good, in their bible.
We have been arming the Syrian Rebels. It will come out under Hillarys email gap.
Computer forensic technology will nuke the Clintons involvement under the foundation and Hillary using a private server to bill taxpayer's charges/expenses is a felony.
The FBI is looking in the wrong direction. They should of pulled the Clinton Foundation server as well. It was hosting a address email forwarding thru closet host server to receive all correspondence. It's a simple approval check to authorize incoming to be copied to xzy@fuckme.com to receive carbon copies via BCC.
This may be one of very few good things Obama administration did in its career so its a good news and we should be glad.
Worst part: the Russians offered to broker a peace treaty where Assad steps down 3 years ago. The state department didn't do it. 3 years of conflict, the arming of a dangerous regional Baathist regime, and a Syrian refugee crisis in central and Southern Europe. And yet the Russians are still the regional stabilizer.
These people could fuck up a cup of coffee. They just want war. Anywhere for any reason.
Only one question matters is putin a freemason or not. if he is... just playing his part
We have been arming the Syrian Rebels. It will come out under Hillarys email gap.
Computer forensic technology will nuke the Clintons involvement under the foundation and Hillary using a private server to bill taxpayer's charges/expenses is a felony.
The FBI is looking in the wrong direction. They should of pulled the Clinton Foundation server as well. It was hosting a address email forwarding thru closet host server to receive all correspondence. It's a simple approval check to authorize incoming to be copied to xzy@fuck.com. The emails are sent as BCC.
US is not going to abandon it's death squads in Syria, whether you believe those to be of the moderate cannibal or the extremist headchopper variety. At these talks they'll probably issue more threats but Vlad will say "da, do your worst, comrade".
Remember when Qaddafi had Sunni terrorists (Al Qeada) on the ropes in their Benghazi stronghold? The Sunni murderers made a 3:00am phone call to Hillary Clinton complaining that Qaddafi was about to wipe them out.
Hillary and obirdbrain saved the Sunni murderers of Benghazi and set in motion the destruction of Libya AND Syria.
Google it, it is all there. Soon after the Sunni murderers in Libya were installed in power they began an assault on Shia supported but secular Assad, with help from Hillary and Obirdbrain. And yes, ISIS was born as a result.
The scale of this crime of off the charts. Hillary and obirdbrain, the progressive champions are directly responsible for the rivers of blood flowing throughout the middle east today. Combine this with Shrub's intervention in Iraq and the picture looks very bad. Intervention in other sovereign countries is purely a PROGRESSIVE policy. A CRIMINAL policy.
True constitutional conservatives would have never interfered with the affairs of other nations. Bloodthirsty Progressives OWN this shit.
The progressive stupid, it burns and kills millions.
Grimaldus
Appreciated a lot what you say but please, leave your Enter key alone :)
All this comes after Syrian army show how good and fast they have mastered to operate new and deadly Russian hardwares.
Yup
http://english.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13940627000174
http://english.farsnews.com/newstext.aspx?nn=13940627000141
Email mapping is the other trick. It requires administration privileged access. You take a host of emails and silently re-direct to a single source email. It a big brother tactic. The person sending out emails is unaware, unless you right click.
Many ages ago, a small owner did this to his employees. His employees would create falsehood emails between each other. Business related.
The owner would blow a gasket because, he thought the emails were true. It backfired on the owner. The staff went on for months.
They basically told him to stop or we walk, you can manage your company behind emails and not interact with the employees who make this company profitable.
They all walked away. The owner lost his company in eight months. It was a privately owned company.
This story was shared by a hosting company friend. Cannot reveal either sources.
Human race desperately needs the war, the civil war, the class war: against parasitic landlords which rented us already their earth. If they not stopped, they ultimately will start to demand payment for the air we breeze and the sun we enjoy.
We don't need a war. We need to start arresting the guilty involved in government espionage.
Again the Ruski's are giving Obummer DC morons a face saving "way out" by joining them in the fight against (the US/Saudi created/funded/trained) IS/ISIS murdering/looting extremist scumbags.
No wonder Ann Coulter couldn’t constrain her rage as neocon (neozio) Jake Tapper turned the GOP debate into a warmongering contest to determine which presidential candidate would offer up the most American soldiers to fight Greater Israel's wars of expansion in the ME and Ukraine, tweeting “How many f---ing Jews do these people think there are in the United States?”
Trump, however, didn’t fall for the neocon bait, while Fiorina swallowed it hook, line and sinker.
Writes antiwar.com’s Justin Raimondo today:
In spite of [Jake] Tapper’s apparent determination to turn the debate into a Barnum & Bailey production, substantive foreign policy issues did come up – although the questions, again dominated almost exclusively by the egomaniacal Tapper, had a pronounced neoconnish spin. Here’s Tapper:
“Russia is sending troops and tanks into Syria right now to prop up a U.S. enemy, Bashar al-Assad. President Obama’s incoming top general says, quote, ‘Russia presents the greatest threat to our national security.’
“Mr. Trump, you say you can do business with President Vladimir Putin, you say you will get along, quote, ‘very well.’ What would you do right now if you were president, to get the Russians out of Syria?”
Surprisingly, Trump challenged the premise of Tapper’s question, averring:
“You look at what’s going on with ISIS in there, now think of this: we’re fighting ISIS. ISIS wants to fight Syria. Why are we fighting ISIS in Syria? Let them fight each other and pick up the remnants…. I would talk to[Putin]. I would get along with him. I will get along – I think – with Putin, and I will get along with others, and we will have a much more stable – stable world.”
A reasonable approach, and that phrase – “a much more stable world – no doubt resonated with the television audience’s deepest longings: here is Trump, the alleged “hothead,” promising a Return to Normalcy! Who would’ve thought?
The clearly disappointed Tapper naturally turned to the militantly unreasonable Marco Rubio, the neocons’ favorite candidate, who launched into a diatribe about how Russia is trying to supplant us as the Middle East’s most powerful actor and made the rather odd case that Putin is trying to snatch the Saudis away from Washington and into the Kremlin’s orbit – an unlikely scenario, to say the least. Tapper then moved on to another neocon favorite, the icy Ms. Fiorina, who gave him the answer he was looking for:
“Having met Vladimir Putin, I wouldn’t talk to him at all. We’ve talked way too much to him.
“What I would do, immediately, is begin rebuilding the Sixth Fleet, I would begin rebuilding the missile defense program in Poland, I would conduct regular, aggressive military exercises in the Baltic states. I’d probably send a few thousand more troops into Germany.” ...
“Vladimir Putin is someone we should not talk to, because the only way he will stop is to sense strength and resolve on the other side, and we have all of that within our control.”
Oh yes, everything is “under control.” That’s what she told Hewlett-Packard’s stockholders until the crippled company had to lay off tens of thousands of workers. ...
http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2015/09/17/the-gop-debate-outsiders-versus-warmongers/
As for another bonus, there are now thousands of ISIS Jihadists in Germany and other European nations. They don't want to get waxed by Russia so they are coming to Jihad the shit out of Europe.
Minding our own business [and it's about time we did] is NOT Folding.... FU Jew York Times...
Folds over and spreads cheeks! Love it!!!!
I suppose folding is better than launching nukes?
It is apparent to me that SATAN is indeed ruling the world, and the NWO got its power from Satan, whom they worship. However, I also know the Bible puts the end of it all very near, and I know that Jesus will be the victor.
I saw a documentary aabout the christians attacked by ISIS... they said all the attackers were foreigners and spoke English with an American accent. I can not help but feel extremely grieved over how much evil is taking place by the Americans and the Hebrews. I find it all very dispicable.
The gods use religion as a means to keep humans divided and distracted.
We are slaves to the gods, bred and born to do the dirty work.
During WWII, the US and its allies held the high moral ground. Take a look at the middle east situation today: the US will fail and fail again, because the stated reasons are really lies, and the US does not hold the high moral ground. In this case Russia holds the high moral ground. Their moves are more legitimate than the US, and the truth is now exposed. Once again, the US has been stapled to the town square poster as the falling star.
High moral ground in WW II. Destroying White Man makes no moral ground.
https://caesartort.wordpress.com/2013/04/16/americas-unpardonable-crime/
+100
WW2 was just a replay of what the tribal banksters had been doing in Europe and also USA (Civil War) in getting white Christians to kill each other for a profit.
Hitler was funded by US industrialists and banksters plus European bankster klan families. Bush klan was there as well (Union Bank).
Same thing with the creation of the New York city, London and German non-christians Bolsheviks backed by banksters. The Bolsheviks murdered about 25 million white Christians.
Moral high ground? No wars are mass murders of innocent people for a profit.
Whether they be of the individual variety or a state, there is no negotiating with a psychopath. They cannot be trusted to hold their end of any bargain and they will only be attemping to gain further information or advantage with which to cudgel your scull in.
It was best left at "be my guest", why couldn't they leave it at be my guest? If Putin ever backs down on Syria after the debacle in the Ukraine that would just be sickening. If Assad falls those people will be slaughtered and Bibi will be wearing that sickening demonic smirk, not to mention that giving these Zionists once inch could end up being the end of Russia down the line too.
Isn't ISIS the current boogieman threat to the world, common enemy of all that is decent? Then Nuttyyahoo should be welcoming Russia's assistence in defeating them, no?
That's because US knows its fucked. Putin with Assad can totally annhilate ISIS which would disrupt US's agenda with ISIS.
Obama's not folding. Neither Obama or Putin will admit the problems in Syria center around who controls natural gas pipelines. The deal to stop or continue hostilities would have to be reached between the US and Russia, neither of whom seem willing to give up control of the pipelines. However, Obama and NATO are caught in an ISIS trap of their own making. Since we can't admit ISIS is our proxy mercenary force, and keep the lie going they are supposedly our enemy, it makes us look really foolish when we don't allow Russia to fight ISIS. But that's where we are.
Did one of Tylers personalities have a psychotic break writing this crap. Assads father was a real bastard but this guy was significant improvement. Chriistians, and other groups pretty much lived in peace for a thousand years. Now, after our interference, as in Libya and Iraq, we are leaving FUBAR, not to mention the impact of a refugee invasion of Europe. Putin called for military to military tslks last week, once again showing he is the only adult in the room. By the way, we are in no way shape or form ready for another pro tracted war with Russians or anyone else. We have been shooting our wad since Vietnam, we are far worse off noe economically and militarily. If Tylers subset personality wants a war with Russia, HEY GO FOR IT. The US of Eisenhower is dead. Our military, manufacturing ripped to shreds. All we have left are big mouth blustering living in the past. Assad was no saint, but I bet he is responsible for far fewer deaths than either Obama or Bush. I hope this subsection of Tyler gets some help. This essay reminds me too much of an article written by Bill Kristol or Charles Krauthammer.
Paveway IV call sthem The Weekend Tyler. The Weekend Tyler sucks.
I don't think this is "folding" but is actually a little sanity creeping in. Who knows, there may be a real outbreak of sanity in D.C. and we will pull back on our invasion of the circular firing squad that is Syria.
Obama folding or Bush holding hands with a Saudi King - SSDD. These elites care nothign for you and I.
Obama finally does something intelligent-sounding and is judged to have 'folded'. Neocon narrative and propaganda.