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Russia Says It May Send Troops Into Combat In Syria As A Worried Netanyahu Heads To Moscow
On Thursday evening, we detailed a Reuters report which suggested that the influx of Russian technical and logistical support to Bashar al-Assad’s depleted army at Latakia might have breathed new life into the regime as it seeks to rout Islamic State and a whole host of other armed groups fighting for control of Syria. “Foreign Minister Walid al-Moualem said on Thursday Russia had provided new weapons and trained Syrian troops how to use them,” Reuters said, before describing what certainly sounds like an invigorated air campaign against the de facto ISIS capital at Raqqa.
Importantly, al-Moualem also indicated that Syria would be willing to make an official request for Russian combat troops “if needed.”
Now clearly, it seems likely that Russian troops have already joined the battle and indeed, when the bullets start flying, the distinction between “logistical” support and “combat” support quickly becomes blurred, but through all the sabre rattling and back-and-forth banter between Kerry and Lavrov, both sides are still keen to at least pay lip service to the unwritten rules of international diplomacy which is why before Russia can admit that its troops are actually on the ground to fight, they’ll be a charade where Syria will pretend to be raising the issue with the Kremlin for the first time at which point the Kremlin will take a few days to “consider” things. As of Friday, it appears as though that process has begun. Here’s Bloomberg:
Russia said it’s willing to consider sending troops into combat operations in Syria if President Bashar al-Assad’s government requests assistance.
While the possibility is hypothetical now, “if there is a request, it will be discussed as part of bilateral contacts,” Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov told reporters on a conference call on Friday. “Of course it will be discussed and considered.”
The prospect of direct Russian involvement in the country’s civil war, in which more than 250,000 people have died since 2011, would mark a sharp escalation in President Vladimir Putin’s support for the embattled Assad government. The U.S. has accused Russia of increasing military aid to Syria in recent weeks by sending tanks, artillery and personnel, as well as setting up what the Pentagon says might be a forward airbase near the coastal city of Latakia. Syria also hosts Russia’s only naval facility outside the former Soviet Union at Tartus.
The possibility of troop involvement emerged before a visit to Moscow by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu on Monday for talks with Putin about Russia’s growing military involvement in Syria. Netanyahu “will present the threats posed to Israel as a result of the increased flow of advanced war material to the Syrian arena and the transfer of deadly weapons to Hezbollah and other terror organizations,” the Israeli government said in an e-mailed statement on Wednesday.
To be sure, Netanyahu’s Russian visit comes at an interesting time. In the US, the last challenge to the Iran nuclear deal was defeated in the Senate on Thursday, paving the way for the agreement’s implementation. Needless to say, Netanyahu isn’t particularly pleased with The White House’s stance on Iran’s nuclear ambitions and US-Israeli relations have deteriorated markedly this year thanks in large part to the Iran deal. But the Israeli PM is also concerned that Russia’s move to reinforce Assad could have implications for Hezbollah, something Netanyahu and Putin will discuss on Monday. Here’s Reuters:
Western officials and a Russian source said last week that Russia was sending an advanced anti-aircraft missile system to Syria in support of Assad.
The Western officials said the SA-22 system would be operated by Russian troops. A U.S. official, who confirmed the information, said the system may be part of a Russian effort to bolster defences at an airfield near Latakia, an Assad stronghold.
Even if Russians operated the missiles and kept them out of the hands of the Syrian army, the arrival of such an advanced anti-aircraft system could unsettle Israel, which in the past has bombed sophisticated arms it suspected were being handed to Assad's Lebanese guerrilla allies, Hezbollah.
(Hezbollah chief Hassan Nasrallah)
Worried about accidentally coming to blows with Russian reinforcements in Syria, Israeli officials said last week they were in contact with Moscow. But Israel also made clear it would continue its policy of stopping advanced arms reaching Hezbollah.
And let’s not forget that just one month ago, Israel hit targets inside Syria after Damascus-based Islamic Jihad lobbed rockets at a village in Northern Israel. Netanyahu claimed the militants were acting on order from an "Iranian general."
“This is another clear and blatant demonstration of Iran’s continued and unabating support and involvement in terrorist attacks against Israel and in the region in general. This attack has also occurred before the ink on the . . . nuclear agreement has even dried, and provided a clear indication of how Iran intends to continue to pursue its destabilising actions and policies as the international sanctions regime is withdrawn in the near future,” Israel's foreign ministry said at the time.
That came just four weeks after Quds commander Qassem Soleimani reportedly met with Vladimir Putin in Moscow where, according to GOP mouthpiece Fox News, the Russian and Iranian leaders discussed "a new joint military plan to strengthen Syrian President Bashar Assad, a plan that is now playing out with the insertion of Russian forces in Syria."
In what looks like a rather conveniently timed announcement ahead of Netanyahu's trip to Russia, the Treasury said on Thursday that any Iranian bank receiving sanctions relief as part of the Iran nuclear deal would have sanctions re-imposed in the event they support Hezbollah or the Quds.
(Soleimani who, according to a CIA officer who spoke to The New Yorker in 2013, is "the most powerful operative in the Middle East today")
So this is the backdrop for Netanyahu's visit to the Kremlin and, as mentioned above, it's complicated by the fact that the Prime Minister is now at odds with the US over Washington's handling of the Iran Nuclear Deal. At the end of the day, one is certainly left to believe that Israel's "worries about accidentally coming to blows with Russian reinforcements in Syria" will quickly evaporate should Netanyahu get confirmation that the Quds are indeed on the ground as some reports have recently suggested and if it becomes clear that weapons are being funneled to Hezbollah, well, then all bets will officially be off.
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If Netanyahu wanted to exchange high fives, back pats, and mazel tovs with Putin over his handling of the "terrorists" that are totally definitely going to take over Israel he could have done it without a visit.
I'm actually disappointed in the low quality statecraft on display from Israel and the west. They're giving it away, telegraphing moves like children.
I'm actually disappointed in the low quality statecraft on display from Israel and the west. They're giving it away, telegraphing moves like children.
That is usually a sign of misdirection. In war.
Which I could believe, if the US and Israel had an ulterior motive involving Assad staying in power. After spending years trying to fire up a formal, international war in the region I find it hard to swallow that Netanyahu wants to coordinate strikes against Mossad ISIS with Russia - unless he's going to try to steer Putin away from the real targets, which Putin should obviously be on guard against.
I think Russia is in Syria to evacuate Christians from Lebanon/Syria.
I think you don't know what you're talking, but somehow you feel an urge to continue...
+100 for the above statement.
What´s wrong with that? Russia cares for Russians and Christians. Yes, hard to believe someone cares not only for money.
Sure, Putin can care about people - certainly he'll want to be seen caring about people, but that's not it.
Princes care about their interests more than people, any day of the week. If they come off as caring for the people at the same time, so much the better.
Whether they actually do or not - that would be a personal querk.
Come on Mister Bear just a few more steps, then, BOOM! Slam the door, we get back on the sidelines, Russian Afghanistan Part2. Obama is a geo-political genius, or a bumbling idiot and the world is staggering toward WW3. Place your bets on which one, cause the betting window is getting ready to close and the game is about to start
Well proven, bumbling idiot. But the blind squirrel sometimes finds an acorn.
Notice something about Israel: they live in peace among themselves. No slaughtering each other over their religion. They vote in citizens to govern the country. They aren't hanging people on light posts. And they have good relations with their allies. Maybe the Syrians, Iraqis, Yemenis and others should look to Israel for some guidance.
They aren't hanging people from light posts, just keeping them (Palestinians) in a giant concentration camp, and shooting children for throwing rocks. Yeah. They are models for the world.....moron.
Give him some credit, he's lasted a whole 3 weeks and 5 days here so far, and I've yet to see him state anything that has received more upvotes than downvotes.
Bible looks like it is coming true... all armies will come and Jerusalem will be uttlerly destroyed... all cause Jews did not follow God's law... They even want to rebuild a temple to offer dead animals to their witch doctors.
hey, don't down vote God's words... you evil being
You forgot the sarc tag.
My neighbor's dog fucks your god.
You're right. I think God is doing a reasonably good job considering what he's up against.
Putin: Friend Or Foe On Syria?
Patrick J. Buchanan September 17, 2015
Purging America’s White Male Heroes Patrick J. Buchanan September 14, 2015
Yes Pat.. tell your American friends they need to support Putin... they don't have to seem much sense listening to the Zios
What if American policy is to clear the ME of non-Muslims? It sure looks that way from outside.
And suppose they want the Sunni on top? The Sunni who are currently allied with Israel.
Putin may be in Syria as an evacuation force for Christians.
Wasnt' Buchanan the one who coined the term ZOG? Zionist Occupied Government?
No, Buchanan came up with the phrase "Congress is Israeli-Occupied Territory". Close enough though.
My thoughts are the americans want to rule the world no matter what the cost, ...they want ISIS to take over Syria then they will take syria from ISIS... Oops Russia just put a major wrench into their plan.
The US likes independent contractors, it removes the responsibility from them and keeps their people fooled.
If as most Jews believe, that anti-Semitism is in all gentiles – just waiting to be ignited – there is no better an igniter than Netanyahu.
Netanyahu’s definition of anti-Semitism = disagreement.
Second definition = failure to capitulate 100%, 100% of the time.
He wants world dissention so he can keep building settlements.
A nation without borders can build settlements until it reaches a border which cannot be breeched.
Most likely a border previously breeched by the same tactics or persons.
Most European Nations realize that immigration without assimilation is invasion.
Netanyahu likes to point out that the Jews have a history.
Well, Russia has one too!
The history of Russia is economic stupidity, Potemkin Villages, over expansion, and collapse. Followed by rampant alcoholism. Their population is in decline (TFR 1.75 - which is an improvement. But replacement is 2.1)
Time is not on their side. Neither is it on the side of China. Or Japan.
https://news.yahoo.com/few-jobs-little-hope-rural-russia-sticks-putin-12...
Few jobs and little hope, but rural Russia sticks with Putinquote Yahoo/AP will lose your propaganda war here...
Russian unemployment is lower
better worry about your own country
You can say the same about the US and many other countries. How are those booming Appalachian towns doing??
Want to take a trip to white trash meth country in rural Oregon?
Try going some place remote in Scandinavia. I had a friend who spent 9 months in Norway. He came back and said the alcohol and suicide are very high. That was 20 years ago.
Russia is not the only place with people downing vodka like it was water. Poles and Ukrainians do the same. No surprise when you consider that in many Slavic languages vodka's root word is water.
..
Irish are fucking drunks too and they are nowhere near Russia.
You left out the Bolshevik Revolution!
Yeah. That was a brilliant 70 years in Russian history. And now a KGB guy leads them.
And the US/Saudis are repeating an old play. Financial/military stress coupled with an oil crash. It worked in '88. It might work again.
Did the 'Old Play' really work, or was it the US state dept. and lizards like Brez. taking credit for what was the natural conclusion to a decrepit political system?
The USSR suffered far more during WW2 than in the 1980's yet destroyed Hitler.
Flash forward to 2015, and the US economy stands to lose Trillions in defaulted energy junk bonds and derivatives, with record deficits and debt levels, fighting hugely expensive wars in far flung domains. Meanwhile Russia has record low debts, alliances with SCO, and short supply lines.
I doubt history will repeat in the same way.
I doubt history will repeat in the same way.
It rarely does. And yet low debt Russia just had a 50% decline in their currency relative to the worthless (and I agree on that) dollar.
What that tells you is that a LOT of money thinks America's (totally screwed) fundamentals are better than Russia's.
You mistake me for an American cheerleader. I'm just looking at the evidence.
currencies are manipulated just like eveything else is manipulated. dont try to claim ignorance when you are so clear about other points.
Remember how the Greek problem REALLy stared? When US rating agencies lowered their credit rating and they couldn't secure loans. NOT because "the Greeks are lazy" or of that other BS.
MSimon, never confuse central bank created paper dollars with tangible or real assets. Printing money never creates wealth, it creates debt. The USD is not money but a promise to pay. When the confidence goes, then the whole wretched scheme falls apart. Google the decline in 'value' of the Fed Note since 1913. It is down over 99%
The Judeo-Bolsheviks did their job well in Russia.
Fortunately for Russia, they left in the 1990's and moved to the U.S. to work their magic there.
Looks like its working...
In the meantime, Russia has been recovering from the Marxist infection...
Indeed. And after all, the S.S. brigade was an outgrowth of the Cheka...
Well a few of them came back in the nineties accompanied by American Tribesmen like Summers and Schleifer.........and hightailed it to the USA with Russia's treasure shortly after.
The history of America is economic stupidity, Potemkin Villages, over expansion, and collapse. Followed by rampant drug abuse. Their population is in decline (TFR 1.75 - which is an improvement. But replacement is 2.1)
Time is not on their side. Neither is it on the side of China. Or Japan.
Americas TFR is 2.1 - do keep up.
And wishful thinking does not make for sound analysis. Russia was the inventor of the Potemkin Village.
But yeah. Russia. Russia. Russia. Go Putin! Beat America. - Because cheering works.
Now ask yourself a little question. So far whose currency has devalued the most? The Ruble or the USD?
The alcoholics of Russia are WINNERS! I belive life expectancy in Russia is on the rise again. After dropping to 57.
Jesus Christ, how dumb and blind you are.
Hell, you must tell your doctor that you forgot medical recipes. He'll help I'm sure.
Well sure but name calling is not refutation. Is American TFR 2.1? Or not?
Did life expectancy in Russia decline to 57? Or not?
Does Russia have a serious alcoholism problem? Or not?
In America white people are not reproducing. It is their own damned fault.
Forgot to add massive illegal immigration from Mexico!
Well who is trying to get into Russia en mass?
Ukrainians two million already for safety from kiev mess
"Time is not on their side."
Time is on no one's side.
Like they used to say in the Soviet Union:
Today me. Tomorrow, you.
Time is not on their side. Neither is it on the side of China. Or Japan.
Name a single "Western" country that has time on its side, please... they're all bankrupt, with a demographic hangover coming on that is being papered over with vast numbers of unskilled immigrants, who are more likely to be a nett drain than an aid to productivity in the long run.
If you don't let Neti kill you, you are an anti semite.
He doesn't need to kill you. Getting you to tie yourself in knots with hate suits him just as well.
So does the West. Time we took a page out of Putin's book and started driving our Jewish Oligarchs out.
The MSM never tells the Americans that Lebanese CHRISTIANS support Hezbollah. I guess that clashes with the Zio-propaganda agenda.
"Arab Palestinian Christians and Arab Palestinian Muslims lived side by side for the past 1400 years, and for anybody to say that the Arab Palestinian Christians have been persecuted recently by Muslims is absolutely another big lie, like the big lie that spoke of Weapons of Mass Destruction in Iraq."
Riah Abu El-Assal, Christian Bishop of Jerusalem
"Children have been shot in other conflicts I have covered, but never before have I watched as soldiers enticed children like mice into a trap and murdered them for sport."
Christopher Hedges, Pulitzer Prize Winning American Journalist, on assignment in Gaza
The state of Israel must invent dangers, and to do this it must adopt the methods of provocation and revenge…. And above all, let us hope for a new war with the Arab countries so that we may finally get rid of our troubles and acquire our space. — From the diary of Moshe Sharett, Israeli’s first Foreign Minister from 1948-1956, and Prime Minister from 1954-1956.
We Jews are in a state of panic, given the fact that dead Jews are precious and deserve a special burial. The fact that 5-10 Jews might be lost forever among some 125,000 gentiles is pretty horrifying, as I am sure you can see. — Comments of an Israeli worker sent to Indonesia following the tsunami in late 2004 to prevent the bodies of dead Jews from being defiled by being buried in mass graves with non-Jews.
Regarding what took place on September 11, well it’s very good… Well, it’s not good, but it will generate immediate sympathy for Israel. — Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s response to the attacks on America as reported in The Jerusalem Post, September 12, 2001.
The big winner today, intended or not, is the state of Israel. There is no question that as a result of these attacks the Israeli leadership is feeling relief. — George Friedman, director of www.stratfor.com, a pro-Israeli intelligence think tank, commenting upon the attacks of September 11th.
But they aren't "real" Born Again Christians.
You mean those John Hagee Jonathan Pollard Christians who will sacrifice their children for Bibi.
Meanwhile they watch their Trayvon thugs play ball and they worship their Trayvons like sissy fanboys. cherring on white genocide like morons.
You're not a real Christian unless you're a white, Anglo-Saxon Protestant... like Jesus.
http://www.cnn.com/2015/09/17/asia/saudi-diplomat-sex-allegations-india/...
how do you say "too bad" in russian? "tough shitsky!"
Let's go bombing
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cLkhRMBOtzk
(an updated proof that explosives took down the towers)
The problem with 911 Truth is this: ANYONE looking at videos of the collapse:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dueVm1UGvXo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wplhB-h49m0
comes away with the first impression that the building is EXPLODING, which is good and of course a correct assessment to us. But the problem then comes up when well meaning experts such as Gage or Chandler focus on the dynamics of the collapse; they come up with scenarios that are difficult for lay people to understand and then paid government liars can cast doubt or confusion in their minds. There is no way to conclusively prove any postulated sequence of structural failures and so the government liars can claim that there is no way to prove or disprove the governments gravitational collapse story.
But there is a SIMPLER AND MORE POWERFUL way TO PROVE BEYOND A SHADOW OF A DOUBT THAT EXPLOSIVES WERE USED. The answer is using the basic premises of THERMODYNAMICS and STATISTICAL MECHANICS. By comparing the state of a system BEFORE and AFTER a change occurs and determining the energy needed to effect the change we can determine whether the system containedd enough gravitaional potential energy to account for this change or was another source of energy necessary (such as chemical or nuclear explosive energy) was required.
The following video called "911 The Towers of Dust" shows at 1:17 seconds into it, that the WTC 1 RUBBLE FIELD IS NOT A PILE (OR HILL), BUT INSTATED SHAPED LIKE A BOWL, WHOSE HEIGHT AT THE CENTER IS AT STREET LEVEL AND THE WALLS OF THE BOWL AVERAGE ONLY ABOUT 30 FEET IN HIEGHT MEASURED FROM STREET LEVEL. Together these facts prove beyond a doubt that explosive forces arranged along a vertical axis of the building, blew out the millions of tons of building material that comprised the above ground structure. HARDLY ANY RUBBLE FELL NEAR THE CENTER OF THE FOOTPRINT OF THE BUILDING which is IMPOSSIBLE THERMODYNAMICALLY in a gravitational collapse OF A NEARLY 1400 FOOT TALL BUILDING. This VIDEO HAS BEEN IGNORED, but just one look at it is CONVINCING.
THIS IS THE SMOKING GUN!!!!!!!!
To see the evidence, pause this video at 1:17 you can see that after the collapse, WTC 1 turns into a CRATER SHAPED rubble pile. You can see that a lone steel pole protrudes from the center of the pile, the only remnant of the core. Locate the bottom of the pole and you can determine that the height of the rubble pile at the center is at GROUND LEVEL!!!!.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPJUP-Ry7d0 "911 Towers of Dust"
The following arguments will prove that WTC 1 and 2 were BLOWN RADIALLY OUTWARD by explosive forces emanating from their central cores along a vertical axis. The type of explosive is immatierial, although the most likely scenario is that either micrnukes or conventional explosives were used, or both, alone with thermite to weaken the girders. The type of central core the towers had is also immaterial. The argument is valid and irrefutable.
In a pancaking collapse starting from up hight in the building, the building fragments progressively as the debris falls down and the falling debris scatters fairly evenly around the center of the buiding's footprint, so that the highest point of the rubble pile is at the center. Numerous forces such as horizonatal beams attached to the walls pull the building inward as these beams give way and their attachment to the walls will help fold the walls inward, due to unbalanced forces The height of the center of the rubble debris pile usually measures roughly 1 foot per floor, or in the case of the 110 story towers, the pile should have been about 110 feet tall at the center. But instead the height is seen to be the same height as the sidewalk around lower Manhattan; i.e., GROUND LEVEL!!.
The government's pancaking theory is thus conclusively shown to be ABSOLUTELY 100% BS since only a very small amount of the debris fell in the footprint of the building, not enough to cause a 'pile driver collapse' of the structure and it cannot explain why 90% or more of the debris was thrown laterally outward away from the footprint forming a crater where each tower once stood. Only explosive forces, from demolition charges, could have done this.
The crater shaped rubble pile of WTC 1 and 2 is impossible to explain thermodynamically as being caused by a gravity collapse due to structural failures. The presence of a crater shaped rubble pile proves BEYOND ANY DOUBT that explosives were set off within the cores of WTC 1 and 2 resulting in the building's material elements fragmenting and being thrown laterally outward a far distance. The close spacing of the explosives charges on each floor, separated by air gaps, created coincident shockwaves that pulverized most of the concrete instantly; see page 266 of this reference:
https://books.google.com/books?id=YcUBwgOhoskC&pg=PA266&lpg=PA266&dq=explosive+shockwaves+of+multiple+charges&source=bl&ots=WmEjdKEqcn&sig=n0cV19bPn1v4Vaj4gBowPbXaw6o&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0CEAQ6AEwCWoVChMIqcm21--ixwIVxSUeCh2SZgxY#v=onepage&q=explosive%20shockwaves%20of%20multiple%20charges&f=false
The sound of the explosions was masked as follows. The number of explosions per second, if greater than say 30 or so would be nearly impossible to discern as individual explosions (similar to needing 30 frames per second to make motion appear smooth) and would sound more like a constant roar due to muffling and echo chamber effects of the building structure.
Since the buidings collapsed in 10 seconds, at least 200 to 300 charges (probably more like double or triple this, or about 900 charges, 8 per floor) were carried by moving vans and placed in the elevator shafts which were arranged radially around the steel reinforced core. These charges, triggered in sequence floor by floor, imploded the steel reinforced concrete core (which seemed to 'evaporate' into dust due to the complete fragmentation by multiple coincident shockwaves) and created outwardly expanding shockwaves that fragmented and threw outward building material including the cement floors, resuling in the crater shaped rubble pile. Thermite was used to weaken all the support columns before the charges were set off in sequence, but the presence of thermite had little contributing effect to the formation of a crater shaped pile; thermite without the many explosive charges used in the towers, would have resulted in a conventional hill shaped rubble pile.
You can see the floor by floor pulverization of concrete (by charges separated by air gaps causing multiple reinforcing shock waves) in this video of the collapse of WTC 1; at around 48 seconds into it, you can see that the remnant of the steel reinforced concrete core or 'mast', about 20 feet in width (the left edge is partly obscured by some trees) stripped of it's concrete by explosive charges, stands briefly, then falls over:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sYzIja6mlRs
Although the WTC 1 and 2 tower blue prints became, for mysterious reasons, classified once the 911 commision and NIST began their 'investigations', they were leaked out a few years ago, by somebody concerned that the NIST model of the buldings had purposefully left out the important center mast design element in each tower. Each tower had a 15 by 20 foot rectangular mast made of reinforced concrete and extending 1300 feet up. The center mast was a novel design feature of the time, needed to dampen oscillations that would occur if just 1300 foot tall steel columns ran up the building. Each mast contained more concrete that all the floors combined and was located dead center in the middle of the footprint of the buildings. The Sears tower and other towers over 1000 feet have had to use the same mast design to dampen oscillations. In contrast, earlier skyscrapers such as the Empire state building relied on their outer walls of masonry to dampen oscillations. The WTC design, and later buildings such as the Sears tower and current WTC building, put this stiffening element on the inside. This core structure carried 20% of the building's weight.
http://911review.org/WTC/concrete-core.html
The shape of the WTC 1 rubble pile is crater like, is sufficient proof that explosives blew the building out along it's vertical axis. A few scraggily walls at the base bend backward and away from the center, appearing as if they were blown back from explosive charges in the center of the towers....obviously because they were!. The towers basement was only 60 feet deep. Normally there should be a "hill shaped" pile of rubble following a pancake collapse due to structural failure, and the center of the rubble pile should be about 100 feet above street level, 1 foot per floor. However the shape of the WTC rubble pile is crater like, or 'bowl like', and impossible thermodynamically to occur from the collapse of the tower. The mammoth weight of the centrally located 1300 foot tall concrete mast, measured from ground level, would have made certain that the rubble pile would be hill shaped and not crater shaped.
In contrast, WTC 7 was 640 feet tall and had a 40 foot deep basement, not proportionately different from the towers, yet it's rubble pile was hill shaped, as expected in a gravity collapse. The basement of the WTC 7 and the towers was supported by the soil all around it, and thus would not collapse outward at all, and thus would be expected to provide a street level platform for the buidling material to pile on top of.
Pause this video at 43 seconds to see how tall the WTC 7 pile was at the center:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U2L_lu8ocLM
WTC 7 was demolitioned normally, probably because as it was not built over the 16 acre concrete bathtub that WTC 1 and 2 were built over, falling chunks would not endanger damaging the walls of the bathtub and letting the Hudson flow into the tunnels beneath lower Manhattan. If the towers were allowed to gravity collapse by explosives placed to remove supports as in a normal demolition, the cleanup of the asbestos and debris would have shut down lower Manhattan for months. And the towers had an extremely stiff steel reinforced concrete mast that would have been left standing if just the column supports were cut, so the perps pulverizing the towers into dust.
Unlike WTC 7 which lacked a rigid core, they had to pulverize the strong cores of WTC 1 and 2, whether it was made from just tubular steel, steel reinforced concrete, or both. If they did not target the core, a huge problem would have occured in the months ahead due to having to pull a several hundred feet tall structure down and safely remove the fire retardent asbestos material that had been sprayed on it. The amount of concrete in the core exceeded that of the floor which itself was huge; each floor had 4 inches (1/3 of a foot) of concrete; there were 110 floors which pancaked together would amount to a 110 x 1/3 or about a 37 foot tall solid concrete block itself. Doubling that would amount to a block of about 80 feet solid of concrete, but it is not in the crater shaped rubble pile.
As to where this concrete went, a reporter asked Govenor Pataki the next day why there was so little rubble present where the had stood towers and his response was that it had turned to a 3 inch layer of dust from river to river.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcvvhVv-cAE
The photos of ground zero are crime scene photos that tell how 3000 people were murded. The TYPE OF CORE, WHETHER STEEL REINFORCED, TUBULAR, OR BOTH DOESN'T MATTER regarding proving beyond a shadow of a doubt that the towers were blown up. What is critical is the presence of the crater shaped rubble pile. WTC 7 didn't have a concrete core, yet it has a hill shaped rubble pile and so should have WTC 1 and 2. If WTC 1 and WTC 2 had a concrete core as opposed to a steel tube core, then the only difference this would make would be for the perps to have needed more explosives but it wouldn't change the argument.
The crater shaped rubble pile of wtc 1, whose center is at ground level and whose edges go up about 30 to 50 feet, prove conclusively that powerful explosives were used to blow rubble out (over 100 concrete 4 inch floors, huge amounts of steel,...etc) and away from the center of the building
The crater shaped rubble pile is sufficient proof to show that explosives blew out the material of the towers and that no pile driving or pancake effect took place. Any physicist or engineer would be able to see the logic of this argument That's the beauty of thermodynamics: by looking at the tower on September 10 2001 and the crater shaped pile of rubble it turned into on September 11 2001, we can determine the least amount of energy needed to effect the change without worrying about the path the structure took to get there. Obviously to effect this change, MUCH MORE ENERGY than simply gravitaional potential energy was involved. Architects and Engineers for 911 Truth have been trying to explain the dynamic collapse of the towers but this a very complex a system to model and the public is not going to understand the arguments made by these professionals when they discuss joints, braces,..etc.
Simple 'thermodynamic arguments' are easier and more accessible to people since they can easily agree that tall buildings collapsing from pancaking effects must necessarily form a hill shaped rubble pile and that if they instead form crater shaped rubble piles, then much greater explosive forces were at play.
For those who think the government has never been in the WTC demolition business, the 1993 WTC bomb was made by the FBI's informant on the group, Emad Salem, using FBI supplied bomb parts. He can be heard talking to his FBI handler about his concerns about the group being given a real bomb, a bomb that had just exploded in the WTC parking garage. Pause at 5:48 into this video
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0Y4Qaap6SM
The group had planned to park the van near the support columns of either WTC 1 or 2, but by 'coincidence' that day all the parking spots closest to the towers were occupied by government vehicles (most likely prearranged this way to minimize casualties--the US had not yet morphed into a monster that eats it's own children) and they could only find an empty parking space in the middle of the parking garage, between the towers; of course an explosion there would result in the fewest casualties The FBI pretended to solve the case by finding an axle in the rubble, when all along they were involved with the group for 2 years. They let 2 of the group fly to Iraq the day after the bombing, probably to form a casus belli for war with Iraq in 1993. Only when Salem gave his 600 or so audio tapes of his conversations with the FBI to the judge and defense attorneys in the case, did the whole false flag operation get burried. Even Dan Rather reported on national TV that the FBI knew about the plot:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YXBmmf9F4rw
So who in the FBI was fired or demoted for letting a 1000 lb bomb, built by the FBI informant with FBI supplied parts, go off in the WTC parking garage, killing 6 people? No one of course.
On this video, you can hear Salem talk to the FBI agent about the bomb, or go to 3:50 for the main point:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3M8QtYTplyk
This youtube video came out recently showing what may be an orange explosive material called semtex attached to the inside face of one of the few scraggily walls still standing after the towers collapsed. The FBI men are looking right at it:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EUwmBsvrTQg
More proof that 911 was an Israeli false flag:
The Chesed Gomel incident:
http://911blogger.com/news/2007-04-04/follow-%E2%80%9Cprior-knowledge-911-attacks-overheard-hebrew%E2%80%9D-story-fbi-looks-documents-where-they-cannot-be-found
There's the Mexican incident 4 weeks after 911:
http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/mex.html
There's this as well; flight 93 appeared to be headed directly for lower Manhattan for 5 minutes before it crashed. Was it headed for WTC 7? Look at the segment H to I from this wikipedia flight path:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Airlines_Flight_93#/media/File:UA93_path.svg
No jet fuel contamination was seen in any soil sample from the flight 93 crash site, the first time this has happened in an airline crash site
One of my favorites is that hundreds of FEMA agents arrived in NYC on 9/10/01 and stayed in hotels around 41st street,, for a mass casulty dril schedued for 9/12/01. Therefore on the morning of 9/11, hundreds of FEMA agents walked from their hotels and took over ground zero, preventing investigations including testing for explosive residue as is required by NY state and city laws.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8nv9V8-dnEw
Then there are the 20 or so Israeli art students living for 2 years on the 91st floor of the wtc 1 in 1990-2000; they had repelling gear, construction passes, and were photographed with dozens of fuse boxes. Check out Rebakah Roth's work on it.
Tell it again PaPa, and don't leave anything out
If you tell the truth over and over again finally the masses will understand it and start to deal with it. The crater shaped rubble pile with the center of it at level at the same level as the side walk is just too simple and elegant a proof that explosives blew the towers out.
Arrest the PERPS who killed 3000 on 911 and directed the subsequennt wars that have killed millions. All the destruction in the mid east is predicated on the phony story fed us on 911. Show people the truth, and they begin to wake up.
You throw around words like truth, this proves that, physics etc... Replicate the events of 9-11 down to exact weight of plane and outside temp . Do this 5 times if none of them follow the pattern of the original we will talk. Until then you can draw whatever conclusions you are predisposed too. No one can prove you wrong because it has never happened before or since
A building that is 1400 feet tall can be constructed and collapsed by gravity a trillion, trillion times and it will NEVER EVER form a crater rubble pile. Even more unlikely, if that is even possible to argue about, is that the center of the crater is at street level !!!!
Game over for the hasbara trolls. Planes don't matter, fuel doesn't matter, construction doesnt matter
The forces involved in the collapse of towers 1 & 2 were enormous. You seem to be forgetting that they had multiple stories underground; why wouldn't the "1ft per floor" fill those basements up, leaving the resultant pile of rubble roughly at street level.
Two planes smacked into those towers, carrrying a lot of fuel. People know this and look askance at arguments trying to prove they had pre-wired explosives in them too.
WT7 is the real smoking gun. Forget the twin towers; they're just too big and sustained too much damage for the average person not to think they fell because of the fires, etc. Show them WT7, however, and 9 out of 10 of them will say... WTF???
no I ddidnt forget that wtc 1 and 2 had basements; they were only 60 feet deep while the building was nearly 1400 feet tall. I stated that WTC 7 was half the height at wtc 1 and it's basement at 40 feet deep was proportionately LARGER than the wtc basement, yet WTC 7 had a rubble pile about 60 to 70 feet tall !!!!
The fuel doesn't matter and it was burned off anyway by the time the buidings collapsed. There were fires of course; but the locations or intenstiy of firs will not change the statistics of collapse of a 5 million ton structure.
The collapse will always form a hill shaped rubble pile; it can be modeled on a computer and then any BILLION ways of collapsing the building can be modeled to have occured, girders give way, ....etc. and it will NEVER CREATE A CRATER SHAPED DEBRIS FIELD. Chunks breaking up and tumbling down scatter randomly but overall will tend to pile up more in the center just as flipping a coin a milllion times will never result in a million trials with the distribution of 20% heads and 80% tails.
Even if each object that fell had a 50% chance of falling outside the footprint (which is even higher than any observed gravity collapse where 90% of the material falls in the footprint), the chance that 90% of the 'chunks' or tons (4.5 million out of 5 million tons) of the towers fell outside of the footprint and only 10% (0.5 million tons) fell in the footprint is statistically impossible. !!!!!
This is the SMOKING GUN VIDEO. "9/11: The Towers of Dust" paused at 1:17 IS ALL THE PROOF YOU NEED FOR A CONVICTION !!!!!
WTC 7 Makes people take notice but it can't prove anything. It is a dead end. The modeling of the collapse can be massaged by changing struts, melting points, or modeling steel as having ZERO THERMAL CONDUCTANCE which NIST did (that's a hoot!!!) but as the argument I'm making that a gravity collapse will never, IN A BILLION TRIALS, make a debris field shaped like a crater with a center height at GROUND LEVEL is scientifically irrefutable. The jet, jet fuel, fires, buiding specifics, dynamics of collapse don't matter diddly squat. Statistical mechanics rules
And because everybody has built block structures as kids and watched them fall they already have done the experiment themselves and know the result that always occured. My argument is for the experts to use in court.
the leftover Mass of debris just didnt add up to the volume of the building. Most of the concrete was pulverized....tacticle nuke....plus the pools of molten metal in the basement for days afterward-not jet fuel fire for sure
anyway if you watch some of the videos you can see squibs exploding, just like a demolition job
The problem with discussing the origin of the squibs is that there are always counterarguments that cannot be disproven, hence framing questions about it is not scientific ("air was driven out of lower floors by the weight of the debris above...etc'). And molten metal can be argued over too by hasbara trolls ('well a gas line was hit under the towers and it caught on fire for days until the leeks were fixed....blah, blah, blah).
But the rubble debris field is incontrovertible because statistical mechanics is at work; random motions will tend to average out in a gravity collapse.
The change of the state of WTC 1 from 9/10 to 9/12 tells us the lower bound on the energy that drove this process. Then studying the photo at 1:17 fromt the video "9/11: The towers of dust" shows incontrovertible proof that the building was exploded along it's vertical axis since the center of the rubble pile is at the same level as the sidewalk; in other words, the horizontal blast forces blew all the material sideways but when the blast got down to the ground floor, the blast wave was reflected off the walls of the solid soil around the towers and the forces tended to cancel. You can see that the outer wall bends out but the wall next to it is more straight up indicating that two different waves cancelled out at the inner lower wall.
But what only matters is the crater shaped debris field and it's central height of ground level.
To me it was always - why Building 7. Why did Bldg 7 have to go? There is a video on youtube that goes into detail.
The answer were the physical bond certificates were held in a vault in that building. Hundreds of billions in bonds coming due. I am not sure if Deutsche Bank held them or another firm in the building.
9/11 was a huge bond and gold heist, the excuses to follow PNACs plans to destroy all independent states in the Middle East.
Oddly weird things happened after a certain country lost and was kicked out of Lebanon by Hezbollah in 2000 (catalyst for 9/11?) and 2006 (catalyst for the Arab Spirng phoniness?)
Both Robert Baer (ex CIA) and Normal Finkelstein said a certain country lost to Hezbollah in 2000 and 2006.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8VfnGpHOEXQ
Finkelstein's point is people have a right to defend themselves from foreign occupiers.
"If you tell the truth over and over again finally the masses will understand it and start to deal with it."
No they won't. They'll put their hands over their ears and go la la la la la.....
I think the phrase you're looking for is "If you repeat a lie often enough, people will believe it."
I agree; we just need to repeat ours more than they repeat theirs. We can do it because we believe our view to be the truth and not a lie and because if we don't, the future will be a fascist hell for our children
Are any of you actually serious about teaching the masses anything? No sarc
If you really are then here's the how to:
Keep it damn simple. Preferably three words or less.
Spend a fuckload of money to make the message nice and glossy - ie give it the glamour of money - it helps in mind control
Give it a ditty or backround tune they can instantly associate with.
Repeat ad nauseum.
Putting forward great intellectual and factual arguments will lose them every time. Try to think retarded five year old and start again. Then you'll have it.
Sad, I know - but I also know I'm not wrong.
Do the Tell.
But as we all know, Dan Rather is crazy....
I take issue with your statement that your explanation is simpler. It could be more powerful, but I haven't studied it yet.
This 3 minute Chandler video is so simple that anyone who hasn't forgotten high school physics should be able to easily follow:
Downward Acceleration of the North Tower
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjSd9wB55zk
I've studied Chandlers stuff; the problem is that dynamic modeling is not statistically foolproof, as it depends on too many variables. The model I'm using is statistical mechanics which is about a trillion times much more reliable in it's predictive power. And simpler since EVERYHONE has seen their playing block constructions collapse into piles and not craters as kids but few people have studied physcis or differential equations
ok, I'll take a look at it. BTW, NIST abandoned the "pancake" theory in 2006: http://911blogger.com/news/2006-09-30/nist-officially-kills-pancake-theo...
exactly!! NIST has abandoned modeling any collapse sequence, but that is because they are trying to imply, in the manner of Hitlerry "What does it matter anyway!".
But the focus is properly on the shape and size of the debris field. Statistical mechanics is a trilliion times more reliable in it's predictions than dynamic modeling.
This one picture captured at 1:17 on this video "9/11: The towers of dust" is like having a real autopsy of JFK done in Dallas, not after LBJ had his men draw guns on the Parlkland docs and take JFKs body away on his airplane that left DAllas that day.
You are using some block construction done as kids to reach a conclusion?
That is about as dumb as using you kid's Hot Wheels toy cars to determine an outcome of an collision between two cars.
No barking cat;
For simpliicity, it is possible to model WTC 1 as a structure divided into 5 million blocks each weighing 1 ton. They are held together by the usual forces that hold steel and concrete together but it doesn't even matter if we imagine that 5 million angels each hold a ton up.
Once these 5 million blocks begin to fall toward the earth in a symmetrical gravitationally driven collapse, then THERE IS ZERO STATISTICAL POSSIBLIITY THAT THE CENTER OF THE PILE IS......ZERO FEET TALL. !!!!
The building is not seen to lean to one side as it collapses; the collapse has radial symmetry as does the crater shaped footprint. The building was both blown out and COLLAPSES EQUALLY IN ALL RADIAL DIRECTIONS. A PILE DRIVEN collapse by defintion must have a PILE PRESENT WHEN THE COLLAPSE ENDS !!! But no pile is seen in the debris field so we can infer that NO PILE EVER EXISTED
Roughly an approximate Gaussian distribution occurs around the footprint of the building since JUST OUTSIDE THE BOUNDARY OF THE BUILDING, NO BLOCKS ARE FALLING. The forces that hold buildings tend to make the shape of the rubble pile even more peaked. Look at the scraggily walls of what remains of WTC 1 bending outward. They should be holding back debris, but their not!!! What made them bend outward if no debris is piled against them? The only possible answer is blast forces. The falling blocks are going to hit each other, pile up on the bottom, form a rough frictional surface so that as more blocks fall, they prevent the blocks from rolling away,...etc.
Falling blocks would hit the pile and roll or bounce to the walls of any crater that began to form and fill it in.
YOU WOULD NEVER SEE A CRATER WHOSE CENTER HEIGHT IS ZERO FEET IN A COMPLETE SYMMETRIC GRAVITY COLLAPSE OF A TALL BUILDING.
NEVER IN A TRILLION TRIALS OF MODELING THE DESTRUCTION WTC 1 WOULD WE SEE A CRATER HAVING A CENTER NO HIGHER THAN STREET LEVEL !!!!.
Put aside the argument of how the building came down for a moment and just think about the why!
This is a Russian/Isreali diplomacy thread. You are probably preaching to the choir or no one gives a fuck to read your epic/sarc post.
sorry cornfed I disagree with you. Skip over my rant if you wish, but these articles are read by thousands and a new batch of people comes in everyday. Many have not been convinced that 911 was an inside job; nobody was pointing out that the center of the wtc 1 rubble pile was at ground level and the edges sloped up to a crater before my posts and I wanted new readers to see them and challenge them. This configuration is statistically impossible without explosives. QED. WTC 1 was blown outwards.
Now everything about the US involvment in the wars in the ME comes from 911. It is extremely important to let everyone know that there may be an incontrovertible argument showing that 911 was an inside job, planned by Israel and the US deep state, by showing that a crater shaped debris field is impossible unless the buildings were blown up.
How do we know whom our enemies are unless we analysze 911? Clearly our enemies are not the Arabs in general.
Clearly 911 was the brainchild of Israel with the help of dual state citizens in the CIA and other deep state personnel here in the US. I'm not sure who the other enemies of America are of if Israeli the only one. I suspect that Israel is are only enemy and that is unfortunate for them because they will soon have no friends in the world, other than the small island nations that they can buy. Regarding onself as Chosen will soon become a curse.
The Israeli art students had construction permits and free reign of the towers for 2 years; they were photographed with rapelling gear (why would art students have repelling gear?) and dozens of fuse boxes.
The Chesed Golem incident where a former IDF soilder told the FBI that in Oct 2000 he overheard 3 Isreali military people say that planes would hit the towers in Sept 2001 and bring them down is critical for knowing who are friends are in the ME.
It would be like trying to work out a just Versaille treaty without knowing the whole reason for the entry of the US was a setup by Churchill in the first place.
Yes this is a debate about Russia and Israeli relationships in relation to the US and 911 is extremely important for us to understand. After reading my rant, whom should we trust more, Israel or Russia?
Never forget. Share the knowledge that 911 was an inside job with eveyrbody.
Show them the video "9/11: The towers of dust"
agree maxwellsdemon...this is precisely why it's important. the truth needs to told. it's a crucial piece of the puzzle and as you say it is easily told, easily understood, as readily as newton's apple. simplicity is what makes math so extraordinary.
Of course all this has been pre-scripted between Russia, Iran and Syria. Pooty slyly slips his sausage into the Middle East's crotchical region and before the West knows it - BANG!
Pooty had BANGED all their geopolitical aspirations in the region!
This is similar to his 'invasion' of Crimea. It's yet another example of the new warfare tactics Russia is perfecting while Western leaders pick the lint out of each others' navels....
Russia has the same problem it always did. Some people don't want to be their vassals and Russia doesn't have the cash to buy them off. The strain starts small and builds.
America likes to make its former enemies rich. Russia likes to brutalize them. Long term which policy has had more success?
What clear example of your claimed differing approach strategies you got since Japan and Germany a half century + ago? Just curious. I can't think of any. They made some Dictators they installed rich. Vietnam? Aaaah...that's pretty relative.
Russia would seem to be one of their "enemies"...when did the US try and make it rich? China got rich on their own terms...saying the US "made" them them rich is too much a stretch. The counter there would be that China has "made" the US think they were rich instead.
You have to surrender to the Americans first. Then comes the loot. Now name any surrenders since Japan and Germany.
Vietnam? Well they want to get back in America's good graces. And they are - slowly.
China? They are collapsing. I expect China to wind up where Japan is. Do you remember the Japan bubble when they were going to defeat the US? They were buying up America. It was over. Until it wasn't.
The American system prefers allies. The Russian system prefers vassals.
Now here is the quiz. Where do people want to go to escape from... or just to make it? China. Russia? The US?
Does the US have problems? Yeah. Bad. A butt load. But that is not the correct question. The correct question is - are the other places worse?
The US was a beacon of freedom (relatively speaking) at one time but those liberties become fewer by the day. In a lot of respects, you'd probably be freer in Russia.
Furthermore, the US' economy and geopolitical power grew on the back of the petro dollar and its GRC status. Once those start failing, all bets are off. You think the Federales will be rolling back the State when the USD folds and the food riots start?
MSimon, don't be shy. Say what you really mean. "You have to surrender to the Zionist banksters who have captured America first. Then comes the loot."
You didn't make yourself rich. The US government did that.
...Russia doesn't have the cash to buy them off
Hasbara much?...they can print as much "money" out of thin air as we can
When the US prints its currency, it's printing the world's premier* currency; ie, it exports inflation to the entire world
The Russians? Not so much. If they start printing rubles too fast they'll suffer a currency collapse. Their inflation stays at home.
*until it isn't. Fuck knows when that will be, though.
They could put a gun in somebody's face and say take this fiat and hand over whatever I want in return. Why not? Works for Uncle Sam.
There ought to be a ratio between M3 and the amount you can print in a month or quarter.
No prob. Just print US dollars then.
Really, so Russia has used her magical powers to convince other nations' governments to create strife in counties that Russia was interested in just so Russia would then have an excuse to insert itself in???
What kind of magic mushroom have you been eating??
They don't have navels. A navel indicates humanity.
Suddenly everybody wants to talk to Russia. Netanyahoo , Hussein Obama.
Looks like another masterstroke of the russian administration, they should be anticipating a get even.
An alternative viewpoint: Russia's game plan is compel Obama to deal with Russia,
"On Syria, Moscow is driving the Barack Obama administration nuts. This is coercive diplomacy at its best.
With about three weeks to go for the UN General Assembly session to begin in New York, Russia abruptly stepped up its military intervention in Syria. The intervention is no longer ‘below-the-radar’. Moscow intended to create misgivings in the American mind. And it has succeeded.
Yet, no one in Washington knows what the Russian intentions are."
http://atimes.com/2015/09/russias-game-plan-compel-obama-to-meet-with-pu...
What are the Saudi intentions?
To hang onto their golden thrones at any cost.
And be the Zio asshats we've come to know and hate.
"That came just four weeks after Quds commander Qassem Soleimani reportedly met with Vladimir Putin in Moscow where, according to GOP mouthpiece Fox News, the Russian and Iranian leaders discussed "a new joint military plan to strengthen Syrian President Bashar Assad,"
DC weeps to see its beautiful little love child (ISIS) eradicated in a classic pincers....Alas-nowhere to go for Jihadi John. His beheading will NOT be staged on a green screen. 'Arab Spring' finally over, USA marginalized, discredited. Stability restored in Syria, Quataris furious:no gas pipeline; neocons thwarted (again) by their own arrogant stupidity
I hopes it plays out just as you wrote
Man its a good thing we have the UN security council in this situation. Just think how F'd up things would be if we didnt have that brilliant creation to keep the peace.
When Zionist Jews (baphoment's bethen) Control a country, they use it to create destruction and death to their enemies & when they are finished with it....
They have it destroyed... to make it look like justice has been done for the fallen, while concealing the evidence of THEIR BLOODY HAND causing it all.
I wonder how many countries are about to become scorched earth? God knows, & Israel is about to be swiftly reminded again what happens when the zionist rulers play host to the baphomet.
How many jag officers did the Russians bring?
Zero.
They figure that if they need one, they can make a campaign contribution to Lindsey Graham, and he will come help them out. He loves to put on military garb and wander around in secure areas of combat zones with his personal protection force.
All the raving anti-semites here might go back and listen to Marco Rubio again. There's a fair chance that Netanyahu is going to talk of alliance with Russia - Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, and Israel may welcome Russian influence, just so Russia does not join the US in going all pro-Iran. Israel already has some nice agreements with Russia over oil and gas, and more is being proposed.
BTW Debka.com says Russian troops are already in direct combat with ISIS.
Let's see if the Saudis take their entire carnival that just visited Washington up to Moscow to have their own direct talks.
sorry Hasbara troll. Read the reaction to Ann Coulter's rant. Americans support her about 6 to 1 which is truly shocking and a sea change from a few years ago; the train has left the station and it's not slowing down any time soon. More of us are waking up everyday. Israel is going ot the same way as the Nazis, Japanese empire, and any other nutty superiority cult. Such cults self destruct due to hubris. They go to far, and don't cover their trail, 911 being an example. The towers exploded out, undeniably. Israel and dual citizens did it.
Israel is the worlds ENEMY; always has been. Israel always knew they were at war with the world. Finally the world is waking up and Israel is outnumbered 1000 to 1. Learn to Deal with it
Anne Coulter right again!
Americans are tired and waking up thanks to the internet. Not even the MSM owned by the buddies of the supremicist state can reverse what is happening now.
Listening to Marco Rubio on Foreign Policy is about as useful as listening to Obama ramble on about profit-to-earnings ratios, and I say that as relative of one of his political mentors and string pullers. The great game in the great bathtub is always about the division of spoils after the next inevitable shifting of Arabian Sands. 43.75 years ago, when the British were sent packing, was the last time they reset the hour glass. Rubio and his Russia-KSA axis mongering is naive balderdash. KSA has already signed on the dotted line with China, the open question with Russia is how strong the commitment to Iran will be (and vise versa) in light of the forthcoming change on the KSA side of the bathtub, since neither Russia nor China desires a nuclear arms race in the neighborhood, and the strength of their relationships with their proxies (a step removed from the US vassal model) will have a great impact on their ability to prevent such an arms race, assuming it doesn't break out before the US gets booted out.
In general yeah, but he hit it square on this one.
Got a link? Google is not my friend with something as over hyped as a US Presidnetial election and as misconstrued as US foreign policy.
'Member when you used to threaten to hold your breath if you couldn't have another cupcake?
the rich Israeli oligarchy would sooner eat Netanyahu raw while drinking a glass of milk, than show what ingrates the Jews really are.
Funny how everyone is always so 'worried' about what the Russians will or will not do. There is nothing special about the Russians. They simply don't Fuck around, that's all. Then again, in a world where Fucking around (with nearly everything) is the norm, I reckon dealing with an entity who doesn't might be somewhat nerve racking.
Russia doesn't want the mess to reach its borders. Nip the problem in the bud, but a bit late IMO.
Gosh, it would suck if Israel had to fight one of their own wars .... especially against someone who could fight back.
putin playing chess again. the zionazis created this beast isis. it is an obvious cover to disrupt iraq and syria with an eye on iranian influence in the region. putin says he wants to help eradicate these rdical isis guys but he says the zionazis don't want his help so he is going to do with his regional allies, quds and assad. who can blame him? the russian coalition is killing dangerous islamic fundies. everyone wants dead islamic fundies. the dumbfuck zionazis created putin's cover! lol!
the sa22 has been there for awhile having already shot down one israeli fighter/bomber. that is why nutandyahoo is going to russia. he wants assurances that israel will be spared if russia gets officially involved directly in syria. russia involvement neuters israel's prideful displays of bombing defenseless people. they haven't been back to syria since the the shoot down but they did go back to bombing gaza.
This is more about fecal zoos and less about urinal cake factories ...
(and fuck you Magical Mike ...)
(fuck you ...)
(that's what I think)
Netanyahu, fyi
http://www.rt.com/news/315869-russia-us-military-restore/
Religion is the tinsel curtain behind which we play the real game : for power and money. Always has been, even then in medieval times!
It was silk and spice then; thats why the Frankish West took out Byzantium!
And that name has one face today in the ME : OIL !
The rest is all make belief. Popes and kings did the same thing then and used the Templar elites (ostensibly to defend the Sepulcher) but in reality as warmongering ethnic cleansers and bankers who got rich from spice/silk/precious stones trading.
CIA/Banks today on same page along with Israel as local Templar type kingdom protecting nOT holy Jersualem but Holy GHAWAR !
The face that launched a thousand ships --since the Saud/FDR handshake, the subsequent discovery of Ghawar by Chevron thanks to renegade Saint John Philby and the ousting of UK/FRance from Arabia--- gave the US the monopoly role that spawned the triple alliance of OIL/MONEY (petrodollar)/Big stick protection.
That triple play, veritable Gordian knot, is now getting unstuck as the Saud strategy of Fitna against Iran backfires--since the regime change replacing Shah by rabid nationalists using religion as ideology-- and brings down the triple alliance; leaving all the partners in that unholy scheme scuttering like rats from the US boat.
Enter Putin... He also has oil and a big stick.
But more than that he has learned from the past bitterness of Soviet Afghan rout and Elstin's sell off of Russia's resources. He wants his Empire back thanks to Gazprom and he wants to dictate the terms of the OLD Great game of Western Asia; along with strategic new partner China (and India) and now Iran and Assad!
Sounds like a better team than those supporting the condottiere of ISIS/Al QAeda!
Allah? Can't face the gleam of Oil revenues except for a few demented who play the role of the useful fools of the great game. Always have been.
Power and Money. >>>>OIL. Period.
They have perverted religion, but they can't pervert the truth because it is the final, final...that which can not be changed.
just wait and see
This is what happens when a Community Organizer tries to match wits with a KGB Colonel. What other outcome could you expect?
Russia plunging headlong into a Mideast Vietnam means they have outsmarted the community organizer?
Russia gets to try out first-line Russian weapons against first or at least second-line American weapons operated by ISIS. Anyway, Assad better watch his six, Russia may have interests in Syria but he ain't one of them.
they will be done and out by January-if not before
you get an "F" for analogy
As stated above Russia is not likely to try to "liberate" Syria as it doesn't have to. Russian interests in Syria don't require it.
They'll just cover their military bases and Assad. No need to conquer the country - that's the Zio's boat.
No Mideast Vietnam to be seen here, move along.
nope your good for laugh
isis is not vc charlie charlie travel light
syria is not nam terrain
Screw it, I'm ripping up the lineup cards and burning them.
Might make for an interesting Call of Duty: Kill Them All and Let God/Allah figure it out.*
* Paraphrasing a Marine saying - I think.
This is such bullshit. The SA-22 is just a Pantsir! Syria claimed to have Pantsirs long before the conflict even started, and well before the Turkish slow level recon F-4 was shot down in June 2012. So Syria already has these damned things, since 200, "SA-22" is just a short range low to mid altitude Pantsir battlefield GBAD system.
A S H O R T R A N G E S A M / A A A !
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SA-22
--
Does no one ever examine these damned things or reality-check anything? This whole discussion of Russian SAMs arriving is pure bullshit. The Pantsir system has no capacity at all to ever defeat a concerted attack by Israeli or Western strike jets at high-altitude, using standoff PGM weapons against fixed and moving targets. NONE WHATSOEVER. So someone is misleading and scaremonger in the media, with obvious bullshit.
Now who might that be, do you suppose?
i.e. Nuttywho is beating up the spectre of Russian threat, as it wants the Washington/West to apply pressure to warn-off Russia in Syria, during this visit.
The Pentagon and Washington knows damned well that it's bullshit, and that is why Putin is using the Pantsir. He is not trying to threaten here, he is trying not to threaten the Western aircraft over Syria, or even Israel.
daily beast and wiki?
Are you saying that what was posted is inaccurate? Where?
And it is not just Wiki, there are links to the REFERENCES CITED in the wiki text, so press on them and check them and report anything inaccurate about them.
Don't just smear, show it to be wrong.
If you're right, I'll listen.
If not, then you should just read it and take it on board, and learn.
....................
Ah fanboyism rising again from down under placement of an SA-22(ANTI-AIRCRAFT GUN ) I would not be surprised if the Russians are putting them there for the purposes of testing out their hardware on U.S. and coalition aircraft. By testing I do not mean shooting down aircraft, but measuring signatures of aircraft to improve weaponry. Rest quoting wiki is a foolish act .
Yes, but you 'think' that only because you are an ignorant russian troll idiot.
AAA has an effective range of 2-3 km against a fast jet.
i.e. less than 10,000 ft altitude.
Western jets are attacking targets at 30 to 40 k ft, and 15 km to 100 km oblique distance with PGM standoff weapons.
What don't you grasp about that moron?
well, it has nothing to do with Syria in the future.
the coalition jets are not going turn left en mass and attack military positions in Western Syria.
Yeah this guy is a poster boy for Aussie douchebags. I cannot stand the accent too. Sound like retards. looks like he loves his zio overlords downunder.
I'm sure you're very, very familiar with the sound of a full-blown retard. :D
Slow F4? The plane top ends at over Mach2.
If you're right, I'll listen.
No you won't.
He is referring to a specific incident.
In that specific incident, the Turkish F4 was flying fast, not slow as your hommie stated for whatever reason.
Not my hommie. And no, it wasn't fast. It was low.
Exactly.
One wonders what on earth these fools can't understand about a Pantsir being a mere short-range battlefield system designed to protect a very small bubble of local airspace from low to mid level battlefield attack aircraft, tactical UAVs and especially from attack helicopters?
Seems to be a fundamental lack of honesty here, or just a denial, or a total lack of grasp of what that system is and isn't.
The fact remains that if Putin is deploying that system it is to protect his troops, and he is also doing it with that short range system to ensure he is not threatening western aircraft at all, while protecting his forces own forces in the field. He knows perfectly well that shooting down Western jets by a Russian SAM in Syria would lead to certain failure to preserve the Baathist State in Syria, and the end of Assad, and the end of an ally, and that ISIS would win. And Israel would absolutely love that, btw, and would play right into their hands. Putin's forces are making sure as best they can that that does not occur.
If Moscow wanted to threaten western jets, Russia has several options that would actually do that, and Moscow is has clearly deliberately decided not to.
The RF-4 is so old and outdated, you are saying the equivalent of, "Young boy shoots down Wright Bros. with a slingshot."
The J-79 engines leave a smoke trail, like burning creosote.
Now don't go flying off the handle, guy, but the the series of raids on Syrian weapons depots in in the first half of 2013 are the most educational examples of Israel doing what it does best.
What the US tells it to do.
The 5 or 6 Israeli raids from January to September 2013 were to destroy the land-to-ship Yakhont missiles also called aircraft carrier killers. A NATO flotilla was headed to the eastern Mediterranean to back up Obummer's threat to rid Syria of Assad. Which included the 'false flag' gas attack and Obummer's lie about secret evidence.
So Israel was tasked with destroying the Yakhont.
But where were they?
The FSB disseminated through various CIA assets where in Damascus they were located.
The same way they disseminated the information that Putin was on MH17 and the 'fuck-everybody' CIA had Poroshenko shoot it down.
Same with how successful the Israeli raids were. How could the Pentagon know if all the Yakhont were destroyed or none?
So Obummer tried to coerce Assad into capitulation because of the false gas attack. and if he didn't, a cruise missile from a ship out of range of Yakhont some where in western Syria.
Obummer backed down when Putin, i think, threatened him with tit for tat.
The US Army has totally failed to put down ISIS. A bunch of incompetents who simply do not know how to fight well.
The Russian army will show them how it is down and defeat ISIS in short order and handsomely. Using ballistic missiles.
ISIS is CIA/Mossad
And, God, what a brilliant move it is! Send one pack of rabid goatherds out to kill the other pack of rabid goatherds, rather than having them come to your house to play.
Come on, Dutch, admit it. Fucking brilliant and highly cost effective.
Tell your bullshit to all the dead, maimed and run-off innocents of Syria you freakin' ghoul.