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Obama Promised Healthcare Premiums Would Fall $2,500 Per Family; They Have Climbed $4,865
Submitted by Mike Krieger via Liberty Blitzkrieg blog,
How’s that Obamacare working out for you? That’s what I thought.
Considering that pretty much every single thing Obama promised when he was running for President turned out to be an outright lie, we shouldn’t be surprised this is also the case when it comes to his so-called “signature achievement.” Before getting into the meat of this post, let’s take a trip down memory lane and watch a video clip of Obama on the 2008 campaign trail.
As you can see, he didn’t just say it once or twice. He said it over, and over and over again. Now here’s what actually happened.
From Investors Business Daily:
Employer-based health insurance premiums climbed 4.2% this year for family plans, according to an annual Kaiser Family Foundation report. That’s up from 3% the year before.
Since 2008, average family premiums have climbed a total of $4,865.
The White House cheered the news, saying it was a sign of continued slow growth in premium costs.
“We will start,” Obama said back in 2008, “by reducing premiums by as much as $2,500 per family.”
And Obama wasn’t talking about government subsidized insurance or expanding Medicaid or anything like that. He specifically focused on employer provided health care.
For “people who already have insurance, and the employers who are providing it,” he said at one campaign event, “we will work to lower your premiums by up to $2,500 per family.”
“We screwed some folks.”
* * *
For related articles, see:
Yep, You Guessed It – Obamacare Website Funneling Private Consumer Info to Private Companies
ObamaFraud: GAO Study Finds Almost All Fake Applicants are Approved for Subsidized ObamaCare
Serfs Up – Average Healthcare Premiums Have Soared 39%-56% Post Obamacare
Computer Security Expert Claims he Hacked the ObamaCare Website in 4 Minutes
»
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So Obama is a lying sack of dung.
What's new?
BOHICA!
http://www.wnd.com/files/2013/03/obamadevil.jpg
Come on, ZH, let us post images!
Assholes
Didju all hear Nazi Pelousy's comment about Boner's retirement? She said that it was dangerous when a minority fringe group controls the majority.
Hah ha ha ha Some fucking fringe group.
Good thing we're a civilized bunch, and not out in the streets like those other third world countries.
Talking about minority control, if that was true, the LGBT and black community are getting Way the Fuck too much press, attention and political clout.
That's fringe minority for ya' doll babes
Just wait till cash is outlawed
Oh thats just typical "political" speak. If they hadn't passed OCare, then premiums would have went up $10,000 or $10,000,000
Might as well have gone up 10,000,000 as far as most working families (non government) are concerned.....
And that's why I'm all for the idea that families should donate their first born to the state for patriotic duties.
And America could sell them off to China where they can use a few extra small hands to produce plastic crap and the females can be shipped to Saudi Arabia because they like to fuck young children.
The deficit would be in a better situation then it is now and families can always make more children.
Every Democrat that I know is still voting for a Democrat....
Just saying.
Democrat = Progressive = Brain Dead
Barry did promise Fundamental Transformation. He didn't lie about that.
What do you mean SOME FOLKS. He fucked EVERYONE! He did not discriminate, black, white, faggot, lesbian, pedophile, cross gender...if you were paying before, you are paying alot more now, everyone took it up the old keester. He fucked everyone equally.(Reggie Love)
Not sure why everyone is using past tense. He is fucking everyone.
And the fucking will contine until morla improves.
Carry on soldier.
" If you want to keep being fucked, you can keep your being fucked."
Some gvt folks are about to get FUCKED!!
I didn't downvote you, but agree.
Their fingerprints and personal clearance info didn't just get hacked by the Chinee, it was given to them.
and bush was as bad or worse. here is an early and prescient critique of the current shithead's brilliant idea: http://paulcraigroberts.org/2013/02/03/obamacare-a-primer/print/
and here's a screensaver that's just good clean fun:
http://www.planetdan.net/pics/misc/barry.htm
and bush was as bad or worse
Bitch....you've got it bad.
Watch what they do, not what they say.
He didn't fck members of CONgress. As far as I know they still get their free health care. Make those fkrs go to the
exchange and pay for their insurance like eveyone else. Ck Skrs.
They were not paying before, so they are excluded from "Reggie Love" Reggie would fuck the Pope if he could. He is a non discriminate fucker.
Boner knows he's on THE LIST, that's why he's bailing early to hide out.
(he must read ZH)
Wake me up when you figure out something that Obama hasn't lied about.
To be fair, the world needs something stupidly awesome as a technical innovation to create new economic productivity and growth. Nationalizing the health care sector has given biotech a 'moat' of nearly 100% ROE on every new drug, regardless on success or pool of actual suffering clients. That large wealth transfer to corporate R&D theoretically should lower the risk threshold for extreme R&D which is pretty much what the global economy needs right now. Particularly since the mean human age is rapidly going more to the elderly skew.
So at a global level, something like the cure for cancer or neuroscience "leaping forward" is exactly what the world needs to generate the kind of productivity gains seen in the 1970-1995 "tech miracle". Biotech requires little feedstock or raw material imput, creates infite high paying jobs in biochem/pharma/retail medicine and is union/holistic friendly for political stakeholders. Its a no brainer and it would not shock me if this was the true motive for Obamacare, and 100% coverage was just a nice afterthought to sell it to the muppets. Lies are just stories you tell to make people do what they individually would be reluctant to consider. Like how carrots give you better eyesight.
A cure for cancer? Surely you mean expensive treatment? Shirley!
Vitamin B-17, Just youtube it, nice documentary on it from a long time ago.
I like B-52 myself
Personally, I'd like a directional EMP device.
Did I just say that out loud?
(knock, knock)...
it's called a Wealth Pump.
What the world needs ain't the same thing as what the world gets.
It's going to be zero point energy or anti-gravity that they announce, unless they just have decided to let folks die in mass quantities in the reset. That realistically could be in the cards.
You could accomplish the increased investment by reducing the monopoly of doctors.
The god complex Drs are a major cause of healthcare problems and lack of competition in DR performance and research.
Ok, fair enough, Obam is a liar and all politicians are liars, but where is the actual meat of this story? Where are the calculations that premiums have risen by $4865?
Apparently you've been downvoted because it is bad to have hard data detailing how much premiums have gone up with which you can confront the progressives who will call this story a lie.
"Where are the calculations that premiums have risen by $4865?"
Well, as a Single Male (not married, no children), non-smoker, in good health (spend maybe $200 per year in healthcare usually for anti-biotics for an infection), My healthcare premium increased by $3,600 per year. For an entire family (man, wife 2 kids), $4,865 seems low balled. My guess is that the $4865 estimate probably is just for increased premiums and not the higher deductibles.
You're as sick as the shit you live in, british hypocrisy you are.
I pay my own health insurance (single male) which works out to be about $6,500 in annual premiums with $2,500 deductiible and 80/20 co-pay. Last year, I got rotator cuff surgery which ws billed at $78,000 and remibursed at $18,000. So I still ended up paying $6,500 + $2,500 + $3,100 = $12,100 when I had full coverage. Most working class families can't afford that so they basically can only afford a life and death procedure. I am sure I could have gotten the surgery done in another well qualified country for less even if I paid the whole thing myself.
And a year later and my shoulder still hurts.
Yeah, that's the real killer when you get a Gold, Silver or Bronze health plan from the Affordable Care Act. The premiums are high enough, but the deductibles and co-pays are outlandish. I can't imagine that the vast majority of people who got a Bronze Plan, thinking they finallly have health insurance, can even come close to paying the deductibles and co-pays for a typical hospital stay. Hell, I would bet the majority of them couldn't pay the co-pay for a standard doctor visit unless it was the free annual checkup you get.
With the Obamacare Bronze Plan, you get one free annual checkup. It doesn't include lab tests. After that, you have to pay the deductible out of pocket (usually $4,500-6,450) before the Bronze Plan will pay a cent.
I'm 63. My Bronze Plan costs me almost $6,600 a year. That's pretty expensive for one fucking doctor visit.
Obamacare is bullshit. Fortunately (or unfortunately, as the case may be) I only have 22 months to go before I go on Medicare...
I cancelled the bronze plan after denied charges and joined a sharing ministry. Obamacare is catastrophic insurance at cadillac rates.
Most doctors in my area do not accept ANY of those plans. I won't even get into hospitals; they say "NO!"
I work in a part of medicine and I just had this discussion twice today. Obamacare only works for the poor who have it paid for (like all the other free shit they get) and the starry-eyed leftists who have the ability to deny all reality.
What I suspect is that data will begin to show that people are cutting way back on their medical care, including office visits. This will not include Medicare or Medicaid as they are protected classes. Obamacare's end result will be that everyone pays twice as much for half the care. This is government genius, at work.
The reality of it is that an individual who cannot get subsidies (i.e. middle and upper middle class) will pay around $500 per month with a $5-6k deductible. So, he/she will pay about $12k out of pocket each year, totally unrefundable.
Almost no one can actually afford $12k annually. You could effectively self-insure for that kind of money. So, what you have done is bought someone else a policy first before you got your own. You paid for another person or family before you got to insure your own.
I will predict the following as the date come in (hopefully not massaged by government):
1. People will reduce their use of healthcare (early effect).
2. More people will wait and therefore critical care will increase (later effect)
3. Insurance companies will rake in huge profits because use of healthcare drops while premiums skyrocketed. (I am not anit-profit but this is government induced profit).
4. More people will become criminals because they are refusing to pay (I have met them and seen them personally).
5. Really sick people may find themselves discharged from practices (This has to do with the formation of ACO's).
6. EMR company profits will skyrocket (Mandatory under ACA).
7. More doctors will move into conceirge as they have had about enough mandates and their patients are paying out of pocket anyway.
8. Physician shortages (later effect).
9. It's failure will be used force the issue on single payer.
I am on the fence as to whether Obamacare was simply incompetent, the product of Ivy-League theorists or it was designed to sound good but inflict maximal pain and ultimately force capitulation to a single payer system. In either case, it is evil and along with a bunch of other government pain I hope that it gets returned to its originators.
I see a lot of layoffs coming. In the Pharma business, Non generics are getting squeezed, since manage cares is forcing everyone on to generics. Without label brand prices, there will be no new drugs coming. Pharma will only complete projects already in development and have deferred\canceled new development.
2. On the hospital size, i see this resulting if more untreatable infections. People will wait until they are really really sick. Take the prescription until it runs out and delay going back until severe symptoms return. Thus leading to more drug resistant infections as the microbes become immune to anti-bionics.
3. I am not sure if we will see a rise of medical concierges. I see many physicians simply retiring, and no one taking thier place. Gov't will surely regulate concierges out of existence. How will doctors get malpractice insurance unless they follow the mandates? At best I could see Medical cruises, that go on a 12 mile cruise offshore to perform medical services outside of US regulations.
4. I doubt insurance companies will continue to rack up profits. the increase premiums is going to pay for immigrants and the poor that have no money.
5. OTC will become a growth industry as patients seek self-treatment.
"I am on the fence as to whether Obamacare was simply incompetent, the product of Ivy-League theorists or it was designed"
In my opinion its designed to bring about the single payer system. Once the gov't controls health care they pretty much control the population. if you break a rule: no healthcare for you! People will fear big brother since gov't will control your access to medical care. It will also reduce the US political system into a single party (Already the two parties are merging - Both are chasing after immigration, more gov't regulation, more authoritarian control, etc) Once the Single payer system is law, it will be the end for the GOP, and it will also pave the way to nationalize the rest of the economy, Energy, manufacturing, education (including colleges), housing, food, etc will all fall under full gov't control pretty quickly. Its what socialist do!
I cannot disagree with anything you say.
I think Pharma will go into two tiers. You will have to go virtual OTC pricing and ignore third party payers, even if a doctor prescription is needed. This is not all bad and pricing will actually reflect or match up to a person's ability to pay. The second tier will be you will gouge the hell out of the market if you have a medication that actually has to be covered. It Pharma is going to make a living on only 5 or 10% of the market it will have to be really really expensive. Think of fighter plane type prices where you have to make a living off selling ten planes. This will only further enrage the public and cause more pressure for government to control all prices.
I am not sure on your insurance company profits. It depends on how illegals access the medical system. In any case, what they get will be free compliments of the rich gringo's. They are also very good at accessing other benefits including disabililty.
People have no idea what will happen if they get single payer. They will learn that part of the reason the private sector got so expensive is because it has always subsidized the government sector, i.e. doctors made enough on private insurance so that they were willing to take some crappy reimbursements for Medicaid or Care. It is the same with nursing homes, hospitals and even medications. When that subsidy disappears people will be horrified at either the costs or the limits government will place on their access.
I also believe that Europe and Canada will discover that they too have been subsidized by the American market. It is similar to their crappy little militaries they do because the Goliath United States military backstops them. It is roughly the same in medicine.
"I'm 63. My Bronze Plan costs me almost $6,600 a year. "
Bob, Count your self lucky! You will soon qualify for medicare, which is a much much better deal. I am envious! I still have about 20 years to go, but I very much doubt SS or Medicare will exist by then.
Well, the ironclad government guarantees of Social Security are already moving farther away. I cannot even remember when that was passed. Seemed nary a peep in the press.
All the systems will break. When that is I do not know. I am preparing as best I can but you can only do so much.
We fell for the lie and we will get the results.
FWIW: I am working on going Galt. Buying a large lot in rural area, will plant lots of edible things (fruit/nut trees/bushs), raise some chickens, and more importantly: lots of popcorn! Need something to munch on when this show starts going full tilt!
Had to review the 57 plans available to me and the wife recently as a 'just in case'. The plans ranged from ~$720/mth with $6500 deductible (EACH family member with a total min $12500 deductible) to ~$1350/mth with a $250 deductible EACH before the plans pay for much of anything.
So the 'low end' of the plans cost $8640 plus $12500 or $21,000 a year if both members happen to use the full amount of the deductible to the 'high end' costing $16200 in premiums plus $500 in deductibles or roughly $17,000 minimum.
Affordability is nowhere to be found... most of the plans premiums are more than my mortgage payment which is a 15 year loan and a relatively inexpensive home(for the region)in the boondocks.
These are just the facts about the whole scam played on the nation
I'm glad Boner quit. He and the Repugnicans did zero to stop this disaster. That's why I am going with Trump. If anything he will definitely be a real change.
Frankly, half the Republicans are morons. They are like someone who is two moves behind in chess. The Democrats broke most every rule and the Republicans waited too long to oppose it. Hell, many R's are not even really opposed. You remember RomneyCare? That was a Republican invention and model for this monster.
about 85% of the population are morons
"I'm glad Boner quit. He and the Repugnicans did zero to stop this disaster. That's why I am going with Trump. If anything he will definitely be a real change."
Trump is a life long democrat. I doubt Trump will win, His womanizing past will check up to him next year. Once the cat is out of the bag it will be over. Trump just part of the three ring circus and just as bad as the rest (Obama, Hillary). You just been fooled like 10 year old at a magicians show.
Vendetta, I am honestly sorry for you and your family. We talk a lot of theory and pretend we know a lot of stuff here on ZH. However, this stuff is happening in real time with real pain and future severely negative economic consequences. People who pay these extreme sums cannot effectively add to their wealth or plan for self sufficiency over time. Maybe that is really the goal.
The outrage at this stuff is diffused but still there.
Personally, I hope government buildings burn one day and the absolute morons and sociopathic statists who passed this stuff get a good old fashioned tar-and-feathering. Pain for pain.
The State is merciless, relentless and there are no alternatives allowed...unless you want to move into the criminal-noncompliant class.
get a round trip ticket from Los Angles to Bangkok for under $700.
good cheap medical care in the land of smiles
Take a few AGE's with you and it won't hurt a bit.
Get travel insurance go on a trip to a good medical country in the far east, let's say South Korea, get it fixed....
Or become Cuban, it's free there i think.
I hear they do great dental work in Mexico to.
Options
I remember the days (not too long ago) when your comment would have been made in sarcasm. Now it is truth. How far we have fallen...
Hence no /s
Some dutch are going to Turkey to have dentals fixed, go figure.
Chiang Mai has a booming medical industry and it's very good. Mostly British doctors but now they have recruited some young American docs. Easily less then 20% of the cost of having a major surgery here in the USA. Things like total joint replacement very reasonable. And the Thai nurses there are actually nice to the patients there. My neighbor had his hip done there and loved it.
Next time say your name is Jose and you're an illegal immigrant, I mean undocumented whatever. Tell the doctor that Obama promised to pay the bill. It works better if someone coaches you in how to say all this in Spanish.
Your idea is not really a bad one, even in jest. The real problem is that to dodge Obamacare or seek even a reasonable alternative like medical tourism means you must become a criminal first. That opens you up to IRS and government abuse, in general. Unlike the IRS you will not be allowed to lose your server or emails. Only they can destroy theirs. You will get prosecuted and property will be confiscated.
If you are a Christian take a look at Christian Health Ministries (CHM), Samaritan Ministries, CURO (Catholic version), Medi-Share (more like an HMO), Liberty HealthShare, and Altrua HealthShare (newer in Texas).
CHM is the oldest and has been doing it for 35 years.
You have to pretty much be a non-smoker, not a heavy drinker and not a deviant which disqualifies much of ZH. ;-)
They work the way insurance should work. Sharing premiums with needs and no $40 million stock options for the CFO of United Helathcare (who wrote ObamaCare with the Blues, Aetna and the rest).
If you are not that religious than Liberty might be your best bet.
They are all ACA compliant and the prices are great.
If you are outside of the USA and can get the bills translated into English, you may be able to join because missionaires use these services as well. they may take non-Americans.
This is not for everybody but it is a very good alternative.
http://www.chministries.org/
https://mychristiancare.org/
http://samaritanministries.org/
http://altruahealthshare.com/
http://www.libertyhealthshare.org/
http://www.libertyhealthshare.org/3-program-options
http://selfpaypatient.com/2013/12/13/make-that-five-sharing-ministries/
As a not totally devout person, but not a hypocrite either, may I just say a rather un-christian thing:
F ObamaCare!
Freddie, as I recall it is the Lords Name you are not to take in vain. I think and occasional " Fuck, bitch, cunt" when used appropriately won't be frowned on considering the context of which it was used. It doesn't seem many on Zh have weak constitutions ( delicate ones probably leave quite quickly) so the chances of offense seem to be low.
I say let one fly and feel the joyful release!
Now, if I am incorrect, I will volunteer to add your turns on the spit to my already high count as a Lady who aims to be fair and honorable.
Miffed;-)
+1
;-)
Yeah ObamaCare is totally disgusting facist destruction of the middle class.
~"You have to pretty much be a non-smoker, not a heavy drinker and not a deviant which disqualifies much of ZH. ;-) "~
Wait a minute there, Freddie boy. I thought there weren't any deviants anymore with this administration! Either that, or we're all deviants.
...
Oops. never mind.
If you become an enemy of the State the NSA will suddenly find a lot of deviant stuff on your laptop, cell phone, i-thingy. It's the flip side of being able to read and monitor all your communications.
This pretty cool where Kim.com wants to create a fully encrypted Internet and currency.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CE8vrIlP3Uo
Yeah he is a big flamboyant character German and half Finn but he is a bright guy. He was able to defend himself in New Zealand court better than most attorneys.
I'd sign up for that.
A privately owned and unmonitored internet? Sounds like freedom. Freedom is great to all but government.
The comment of the day!
You have to pretty much be a non-smoker, not a heavy drinker and not a deviant which disqualifies much of ZH. ;-)
Therein lies a huge problem Max:
Most people don't get the deductible part, or how the insurance company will take forever to pay their part, and one find's oneself hounded by the hospital for payment when the insurance is to pay.
Or, the insurance simply won't pay, and will fuck you up one side for the ever increasing premiums and fuck you up the other side when one needs the help the most.
The best part is that most provider networks (doctors covered under the plan) are virtually non-existent:
Narrow-network health plans controversial despite popularity under Obamacare - Modern Healthcare
The scam cuts deep. In every way possible.
For insurance companies, their behavior is very predictable. They can directly affect their bottom line by not paying.
One must ask why would they pay off on anything? Government? Regulations? Please, there is no regulation after WS was freed to the profit whores.
didn't the doc give you any form of warranty? hahaha
only legal and medical practicioners get away with no guarantees as to how this all works out
They have what are called medical practices and legal practices. In other words, they're still practicing. Hope that makes you feel better.
We are all looking at this the wrong way. Last time i went to the Doc. my copay was $50 for specialist visit. EVERY SINGLE OTHER PERSON after me, 8 or 9 people had NO copay. NOT A DIME. The FSA gets all the free stuff because they vote them in...we need to join them, collapse it and jump back in where we left off because cutting them off is such a social negative. The sooner the better. Or put all our hopes in Trump, and then what? Gun control? Nuke Iran? Just sayin.
The USA has a chunk of "purple mountain majesty" stuck in it's crack pipe...collapse will follow, eventually.
Sorry dude. No fuckin chance of joining the Free Shitters. Fuck them. Myself and many here couldn't join that coalition if we tried. Fuck them and their demonic criminal masters.
Per your case, the billing for the surgery was $78,000 and the insurance company "reduced" that to an allowable $18,000. The falsified billing is a scam run by the Insurance/Hospital/Pharma complex.
The biggest positive of insurance was that it allowed you to get the "real" price at the hospital. Hospitals and critical care are the bulk of all medical costs. Pharma is about 5-10% depending on what you read and about 85% of the market is generic by volume.
What the current laws do is actually encourage this crap. It has to do with percentage discounts, cost shifting and even tax laws.
Let's take your excellent case. Let's say you were uninsured and you got hit with the $78k bill. Corporate tax rates can be as high as 40% plus another 10% state. It pays the hospital more to not negotiate with you, call in the debt-collection dogs and ulitmately get a 40% tax deduction than settle. Insurers tend to pay about 20-25% of the face price and everyone in the game knows this.
Obamacare may have just made it worse although I am not 100% sure. The reason is that you will have to now go full out of pocket and pay your deductible. I am not sure what will happen to the rest of the charges but they could be shared, as well.
I am a free market guy but medicine is a different market. You cannot access much of it without permission of a medically certified person (usually doctor) or get anything paid except through a third party. You do not have either the expertise or knowledge to know how much you need or what you need. It is a sort of "gotcha" thing. When you or your company hired insurers it put them on your side when you had to deal with hospitals and ambulances. Now, they kind of work for government who will guarantee their margins.
I was sent from an urgent care to a hospital via ambulance because the doctor detected some EKG changes. I was supicious but decided not to fight it. I figured I had good insurance (before Obamacare). The bottom line was a $1500 ambulance-taxi where we joked and chatted and did not much of anything followed by an in by 9am and out by 5pm $28k hospital bill. I was never admitted but I had most every cardiac test you could do only to find out I was quite well at least cardiac-wise. The actual insurance bill was less than $6k and no ambulance coverage. They do not contract.
Later they wanted to take out my gallbladder but I happen to know something about this. I resisted, got a HIDA scan mostly out of pocket costs and found out my gallbladder was also quite healthy. It still cost me over $3k to keep it and prove I was healthy.
The point is that we are dissociated from all sanity and reasonable decision making, true costs and market forces. I personally believe Obamacare just made it even worse.
that's because you not an illegal alien, they get everything for free
Madmax - For $12k would have gone to Portugal, partied my ass off, had the procedure and stil saved money.
That sounds like a Kurgman response, well played BMUS.
too late....the suckers already fell for it.
best,
Bart Stupak
The sociopaths have a sick sense of humor...After the sucker punch you they like to piss on you too.
Affordable care act.......higher prices
Patriot Act......more spying and intrusion with less freedom's
Wall st reform act... more robbing and stealing
give me a break
It must be awesome to be a gov't analyst. You can be off by 4,500%, and you don't get fired. Hell, you might get a raise. Not only that, they keep coming BACK to you for some more flawed analysis. The only surprise would have been if they were only off by 100%.
You can be off by 4,500%
Or Obama just lied to America.....
Seriously what kind of braindead fucking idiot white person ever thought you could give millions of ticks and leeches FREE HEALTHCARE and it would end up being cheaper for those who had to pay for it???/?
America must have a lot of braindead f-ing idiot (color not needed) leeches and ticks... we voted him in. TWICE!
We get to look forward to many additional gifts from Odumb@$$ yet to come.
What is interesting to me is that the ticks and leeches already had free healthcare. It makes me wonder where the extra premium money is actually going.
Also, not enough people really asked pointed questions like "Where are the people actually dying in the streets or not getting healthcare because they do not have a policy?" There was no one but one large party has a bunch of lemmings who will quickly and unthinkingly vote for anything government with a few flowery phrases.
My favorite was a woman who wrote, "Obama gave us healthcare!"
I threw up in mouth.
"America must have a lot of braindead f-ing idiot (color not needed) leeches and ticks... we voted him in. TWICE!"
Granted that OBOZO is the worse. On the Flip side, who ran against him 2012? Romney. Ever hear of "Romney-care"? its the same fracking think as Obamacare! There is no choice. You can vote or A or vote for B, and your guarenteed to get S... SCREWED!
I used to work in Fortune 500 Corporate Finance.
The company I worked for routinely gave out large bonuses to the IT group every time there was a fucked up computer conversion.
Why?
Because the conversion was not as fucked up as it could have been.
Only in America...
From the time the media and medical industries were owned by teh cabal, mostly jewish cabal in the us, the public has been gulliblized.
If they saw it on TV (earlier heard it on radio and before that, read it in the paper), they believe it.
Now, with TeeVee everywhere, manufacturing consent amongst a gullible populace is as easy as a ritual filled olympic opening ceremony or a globally watched, ritual filled football match...
Fooled me once twice, thrice.....whatever....
Justice
Entertainment
World Finance
Ideas & Education
Science
health
He thinks he could still win a third term...and probably could...
And if Hitlery is taken out, the Dems may draft him in for another term. I think that is time for Rednecks to go hunting.
Upvote not because I like what you say, but for what you say is true.
We are all doomed.
Single Payer......here we come.
Yeah, I can't imagine who that will be.
Miffed
I was being serious. Single Payer is the end goal. Has ALWAYS been the end goal. Obama Care was just the step needed to make Single Payer palatable to the Sheeple.
Here's how. First.....let the Insurance companies write the law to enrich them. Then after they RAISE rates for all.....blame them and their stooges the REPUBLICANS.
After the appropriate number of years of rising prices and blaming the Republicans......and another leg or two down in the Long Depression 2.0.....the Sheeple will be begging for Single Payer.
Then between the years 2022-2024.....we'll get Single Payer.
That's it...that's all.
You can't raise rates for all without killing just about everyone first, been proved already, timer bitches.
Jumbotron, I am not sure if you work in healthcare but I suspect you are actually more correct than even you think. Your connections and predictions are perfect.
What I will add is that the stupid Republicans have backed themselves into a corner. Now that they let Obamacare become the (illegal) law of the land they will be portrayed as taking away healthcare, health and even life itself if or as they try to repeal it.
Bunch of schmucks. I hope Boehner has to get the Bronze plan.
"Then between the years 2022-2024.....we'll get Single Payer."
Maybe not so long if Sanders wins in 2016.
Possible Scenerios:
1. RNC (McCarthy) Shuts down the gov't this fall. Obozo halts the entitlement checks, makes lots of angry voters. Blames the RNC. DNC wins in November 2016 by landslide.
2. RNC (McCarthy) Shuts down the gov't this fall. Obozo halts the entitlement checks, Chaos reigns. Obozo uses emergency executive order (state of emergency) seizes control of the gov't, Bans the RNC from Gov't, suspends elections or forces elections on all RNC seats, and only DNC candidites are permitted.
Miffed, I love your wit. Was that original? I may plagiarize.
No...he WAS NOT lying.
What he MEANT was....and was telling the TRUTH about was....he was going to WORK ( does not mean I will SUCCEED) in reducing your premium (INCREASE PER YEAR) by $2,500 dollar ( over the next 10 years)
To the Junkster....
/ <sarc off>
Sorry.... I thought you were intelligent eough to get it.
Fuck that stupid queer shit packing communist fool.
"So Obama is a lying sack of dung.
What's new?"
What's new is your implied tolerance of it dipshit.
And the second damning fact that you were the first poster/nonitoring this site.
Well said, lol.
They didn't a nickle from me and they wont!
Three Percent Bitches
Not addressing the reasons healthcare inflation is soaring caused Obamacare premiums to soar?
Who would have thunk it.
Obama promised. What don't you understand about that.....?
The first month was free and once you've got them hooked you raise the price.
It's the typical way to do business in America.
Step 3 is to set some examples against those who don't pay up, break a few legs and so, you know. Teaching them respect by respect.
Seems like a drug pushers MO ;)
Come on now, it's for the children.
Ritalin
Our insurance is $10,000 per year WITH a $5000 deductible for 3 healthy people. I pay for everything including co-pay until the $5000 is hit. Thank you Obama, you motherfucker.
Big pharma thanks you for your donation to the 'We sell our pricey drug to 100x who actually can benefit from it' Fund.
Now there's a good little sheep.......
Thank you for helping to fund the FSA and illegals that clog up our ERs. Including our healthcare reimbursement acct, we pay the same for 4 people. My husband's insurance was even more expensive. Another reason I must work until I drop.
I can't imagine what my kids will pay when no longer covered under my plan.
Miffed
Hopefully they will be able to afford it.
Otherwise they join the countless millions who are still uninsured, and my brothers family included. He couldn't afford the $5K hit so he pays the few hundred in fines now.
The country and gov't is totally fucked!
Have them go illegal. I see it almost every single day. If enough do it, the government cannot come after them all.
I have a faint hope that Obamacare will actually generate a new generation of anti-government types as they get classified as criminals. A good solid IRS anal-rectal should convince even the most die-hard starry-eyed leftist.
I'm opting out. Not trying to sell anyone on this - just providing info re alternatives. You'll need to investigate for you particular situation and run the calculations.
You can buy a short-term health care policy which is true catastrophic insurance. The downside is that it doesn't exempt you from the Obamare penalty. You can also look at healthsharing options (some are rather restrictive): Medishare, Liberty Healthshare, Samaritan. Joining healthsharing plans exempts you from the Obamacare penalties.
https://www.ehealthinsurance.com/short-term-health-insurance
Grubermerica. Remember, we are still stuck with those fanatical imbeciles that bought all this BS hook, line, and sinker.
AND IT ISN'T EVEN FULLY IMPLEMENTED YET!
Hans Gruber...?
Yippee Kai Yay.....Motherfucker !
And herein lies the problem with Obama and the rest of the government clowns ... credibility!
The lies are sickening.
Maybe Washington has not yet woken up to the fact that people ARE watching them and are very, very, very displeased. Propaganda is not working to hide lies with more lies as it used to work. One has to wonder if that is their intent. They want an excuse to create an evil war of extermination against the population.
Yeah but it's free....
The same way Hillary Clinton's drug price cap plan is free...
The "Let's run up gov debt by the trillions so I can personally make a few million political action plan"
All of these treasonous vipers need to answer for what they have done.
Obamacare has three things against it that bump up premiums -
1. Limited competition. (Though there was supposed to be more)
2. Pre existing conditions - a huge issue with insurers
3. A Cadillac package of requirements and benefits that insurers had to provide, beyond what they offered before
As a youngish, heteronormative, non drinking, non druggy, white christian male I have the best OB/GYN coverage IN THE HISTORY OF THE WORLD!
LOL
Bruce Jenner is glad he has it !
Obama for the win.
He simply can not succeed.
And, if you want to keep your "premium" plan, don't forget to get your pap smear.
"Obamacare had three things against it that bump up premium"
not sure of the point you are trying to convey. What, it would have been great if not for some gremlins injecting language that destroyed it? It sucks ass from page one to page 2,409
There is no real competition. The reason is that having to go through government with guaranteed margins and the same packages actually allows a type of collusion with government as the cover.
The only possible problem I see with the likely enormous profits are that Obamacare requires a certain percentage of revenue to actually be spent on healthcare.
My theory is that campaign donations will count as healthcare expenditures and we will see that become a non-problem.
"On Eazy-E and PCP, ass-cash or EBT
How you monetize pigeons on a power line
On a road to the riches every dudes a dollar sign
I don’t mind, I don’t mind, long as all the smoke is mine
And the liquor store delivers faster than a Papa Johns
And I heard that def-ass caller money’s on the other line
The last episode of Good Times is my life"
lyrics from the roots
Barry, Piglosi and Reed stepped all over the Repugnicans and slapped Middle Class Americans in the face with this tax law. I remember Piglosi yelling at those seniors calling them, Nazis" for opposing Obamacare.
The Sheeples are so Gruberized, Barry could lead them off to the "showers" and they would be clueless to the last mintute.
Prostate exam with every premium payment. While your in there obama, can you milk my prostate...
Obie would like that
He is one nasty faggot son of a nastier whore that's a fact Jack.
He said "A system where we are going to work with employers to lower your premiums by UP TO $2500 per family, per year."
and "We will start by reducing premiums by AS MUCH AS $2500 per family."
and "...we will work to lower your premiums by UP TO $2500 per family per year."
and "... will save the average family $2500 on their premiums."
There's wiggle room purposely in there. And here's the liberal/PC spin on 0Banana's statement.
"He said 'as much as' -- not exactly $2500!"
"Negative numbers are still numbers, right?"
"He said AVERAGE family, and TYPICAL family. These are not average or typical families."
and blah blah blah, who cares. If you believe anything a politician says, especially in an election campaign, you have no right to act surprised.
That is why there will be no 2016 election. they can't take the chance of trump DOJ launching real investigations. If you can't see SHTF right now then you might as well give up studying econ because youll never understand it
What does the Head Padre have to say about this while he's traipsing around the US? I mean, is this Christian and all?
he is too busy passing around his own basket...
No matter WHO attempts to install a"sensible" health care system into the USA, it always fails. It always degenerates into a name-calling contest. And then when nothing works out, Americans start blaming "the system" again.
According to rankings, the 3 countries in the world with the most efficient health care are Japan, Singapore and Hong Kong.
SO IF ... Americans really want a system that works, the only solution is to FIRE the government agencies, FIRE all the medical insurance companies, FIRE all of the hospital administrators, and put Japan in charge of our new health care system.
The USA is not capable of putting together a health care system that operates with common sense.
I have in-laws in Singapore and have visited there quite often. Health care there is quite good, but it's pretty much completely controlled by the government and paid for by a combination of regular income taxes (to offset subsidies that lower income people get) and payroll deductions from salary.
From wiki:
Singapore has a non-modified universal healthcare system where the government ensures affordability of healthcare within the public health system, largely through a system of compulsory savings, subsidies, and price controls. Singapore's system uses a combination of compulsory savings from payroll deductions to provide subsidies within a nationalised health insurance plan known as Medisave. Within Medisave, each citizen accumulates funds that are individually tracked, and such funds can be pooled within and across an entire extended family. The vast majority of Singapore citizens have substantial savings in this scheme. One of three levels of subsidy is chosen by the patient at the time of the healthcare episode.
My in-law is a surgeon who has worked abroad and said the surgeons in HK, Singapore and Taiwan are excellent.
I also have many Chinese friends, more from Taiwan. They often train in the USA or Europe.
The basic thing they have done is actually connect prices to ability to pay plus rational things like medical savings.
Now... if the companies involved who make billions and billions and billions of extra dollars on it gave a few millions to Obama's election fund and a few million in a brown bag....
ISN'T IT JUST FAIR THAT THEY CHARGE THE MINIONS A BIT MORE????
And which American will miss a few thousand dollars a year?
Americans should be glad to live in America and if they don't want to contribute to their devine leader's wealth, they should leave the US.
what the hell are those people thinking after all... that they own the land they live in?
That they have rights? That's not patriotic at all! Being a patriot means "PAY UP AND SHUT UP!!"
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!
I actually met a guy who had been a lobbyist. The whole "little brown bag full of money" is not a myth according to him. He told me how they did it in general terms.
I was surprised he was alive and to tell the truth he appeared to be the kind of guy who'd seen something tragic and was scarred for life.
You're going about this all wrong.
First, in all fairness this should be calculated from the implementation of the program rather than 2008. He did make the promise in 2008 but the very first goalpost attempt is going to be "intransigent Republicans" and it doesn't matter anyway because the program doesn't work and never will on the criteria it was sold on.
Second,
So you need to change your operators around. They successfully lowered (-) premiums by -$4,865.
Everyone spin!
If the extremely expensive US health system is so good, why is the life expectancy of the average American citizen three years less than that of the average UK citizen with its national health system? (WHO figures)
In fact in terms of life expectancy the US is THIRTY-FOURTH in the world.Hot dog, what a crap system you have in the US.
This is not a comment on the wonderful US doctors and nurses, rather it provides evidential PROOF that some sectors, eg health, perform better when run by the government, than run for profit by private providers.