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"Maybe It's Not The Guns... Maybe It's The People Holding The Guns"

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Submitted by Mac Slavo via SHTFPlan.com,

If the only gun violence statistics you see are disseminated by the mainstream media or left-wing anti-Second Amendment groups, then in all likelihood you are horrified by America’s murder culture.

But what if what we’re being sold as truth is merely a means to achieve an agenda focused on seeing the American people totally disarmed?

In the following must-see video report from Truth Revolt, host Bill Whittle shows  the reality of America’s per capita murder rates.

Though we understand that a cranial rectal inversion may be their immediate response for fear of admitting the truth, we strongly encourage you to share this with those who may not have the full picture:

“Maybe It’s Not the Guns… Maybe It’s the People Holding the Guns”

In a recent article Dr. Ignatius Piazza from the Front Sight Firearms Training Institute examines the reasons behind the push against personal firearm ownership in America and why anti-gun proponents like President Barack Obama refuse to address other deadly issues that cause far more deaths than guns:

Guns are not responsible for the 10 deaths at Umpqua College yesterday any more than cars are responsible for the 395 deaths over Labor Day weekend. That’s right, 395 men, women and children were killed over Labor Day in car accidents.

 

Why didn’t Obama hold a press conference the day after Labor Day, expressing, his grief and anger over the senseless killing of nearly 400 people on our highways during Labor Day Weekend?

 

Why didn’t Obama ask the American people to do something by pressuring their elected representatives to change our laws?

 

Why didn’t Obama take a swipe at the car manufacturers and car dealers for building and selling cars to the American people knowing full well that EVERY YEAR, over 32,000 people are killed in car accidents? Yes, 32,000 EVERY YEAR.

 

Why didn’t Obama plead with the American people to make a change and pressure Congress to pass laws that forbid the sale and consumption of alcohol, recreational drugs, and pharmaceutical drugs, all of which dramatically contribute to 87 highway deaths PER DAY?

 

Why didn’t Obama sign an Executive Order forever banning Labor Day. After all it would save nearly 400 people EVERY YEAR.

 

WHY? Because banning the manufacture and sale of automobiles, or alcohol, or recreational and pharmaceutical drugs, or getting rid of all the national holidays, does not fit in his Socialist agenda to disarm the American public so he doesn’t give a shit about the 32,000 innocent lives that are lost EVERY YEAR on our highways.

 

Full Report: Show your anti-gun neighbor this… #1 With a Bullet

It should be obvious that guns are not the problem. As Ignatius Piazza and Bill Whittle note, it’s the people holding the guns that are the problem.

Banning firearms or imposing unreasonable restrictions not only goes against the spirit and letter of Constitutional Law, but increases the odds that innocent Americans will become targets of violent criminals like we have seen in “gun-free” cities such as Detroit and Chicago.

We realize that if you are a left-leaning gun grabber you could argue that we are merely throwing out Republican and Libertarian talking points, so don’t take our word for it.

Maybe the warnings from this little known author and Statesman will convince you:

“Laws that forbid the carrying of arms…disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed one.”

 

Thomas Jefferson

We’ll be happy to give up our guns… just as soon as former New York’ Mayor Michael Bloomberg, Chicago Mayor Rahm Emanuel and President Barack Obama remove their ARMED security details.*

Lead by example, right?

protected-by-guns-2

(*Note: This statement was made in jest. We don’t plan on giving up our guns even if the President and aforementioned Mayors were to give up their armed security details.)

 

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Sun, 10/11/2015 - 20:49 | 6656748 JustObserving
JustObserving's picture

There are about 784,000 iatrogenic deaths (deaths induced inadvertently by a physician or surgeon or by medical treatment or diagnostic procedures) a year in the US.  No one complains about those deaths

http://www.ourcivilisation.com/medicine/usamed/deaths.htm

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 20:51 | 6656764 TeamDepends
TeamDepends's picture

Subtract the Democratic utopias of New Orleans, Chicongo, D.C., and Detroit and we are middle of the pack in gun violence.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:04 | 6656789 greenskeeper carl
greenskeeper carl's picture

exactly. Take black on black crime that occurs in urban areas controlled by black democrats(notice some kind of pattern here?) and the whole "gun violence" thing shrinks down. A lot. So much so that we are pretty much in line with other western countries. Not that its really relevant to me anyway, my rights aren't up for debate, no matter what.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:15 | 6656815 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Silly people still trying to win an argument.

Since when did progressives ever seek a debate on anything?

They care not for facts, for statistics. You can't win an arguement with someone over religion and that is what this is. It is a belief that cannot be argued with and the argument will only be tolerated as long as it keeps the door open for their agenda to be implemented.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:22 | 6656827 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

True Dat. The same people manipulating the gun data are the same ones manipulating the economic data, all to their advantage......

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:34 | 6656846 The Juggernaut
The Juggernaut's picture

To ask the American Republic to lay down their weapons is is an act of war.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:39 | 6656862 The Juggernaut
The Juggernaut's picture

Thats actually fascism... To force a purchase of something from a particular store.  If someone doesn't want a gun then let them not want it.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:41 | 6656874 Welfare Tycoon
Welfare Tycoon's picture

"But what if what we’re being sold as truth is merely a means to achieve an agenda focused on seeing the American people totally disarmed?"

Is this a question?

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:50 | 6656900 espirit
espirit's picture

If it can't be tested, it can't be quantified,

No, it's not a question that can be tested.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:38 | 6657040 Government need...
Government needs you to pay taxes's picture

How about we de-nigger our country?

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:46 | 6657054 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

Liberia should have been compulsory.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 01:51 | 6657368 Pinch
Pinch's picture

This article paid for by the firearm manufacturers of America. Yawn, you sheep. I live in a country that has not seen a mass shooting for decades. Because we outlaw knuckle-draggers (like the commenters at ZH) from owning them, that's why!

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 05:30 | 6657534 Nenad
Nenad's picture
Obama will not finish his second term! Current Events Linked to Ancient Biblical Prophecy. http://motivationdose.com/is-america-babylon/
Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:22 | 6657628 TongueStun
TongueStun's picture

Knot tha gunz? Than your raycess!!!!!

 

Obama blamed the kneegrow's gunz,

and forgot to blame his kneegrow sons!

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 09:17 | 6657933 All Risk No Reward
All Risk No Reward's picture

Big Pharma kills about 100,000 people a year with their assault arsenal of FDA approved drugs...

http://www.fda.gov/Drugs/DevelopmentApprovalProcess/DevelopmentResources...

Over a decade, they kill 1,000,000 people and seriously screw up another 20,000,000.

And that's no even including all the deaths in mass shootings where, invariably, the shooter is on their FDA approved mind altering products with violence as a known side effect.

Now you know why Piers Morgan really kicked Alex Jones off his Debt-Money Monopolist financed TV programming episode.

To make it even worse, most murders in this country are directly attributable to the Rockefeller promoted (Debt-Money Monopolist) drug laws that allow their mega-bank corporate fronts to launder trillions of dollars while providing a pretext for the erection of their police state.

Tax free, too... even when caught.

How a big US bank laundered billions from Mexico's murderous drug gangs
http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/apr/03/us-bank-mexico-drug-gangs

And while your $500 cash is being stolen from you because you don't trust the criminal banking enterprises, the planes used to bring the drugs into the country are not confiscated.

Banks Financing Mexico Drug Gangs Admitted in Wells Fargo Deal
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2010-06-29/banks-financing-mexico...

Ddon't you worry, little ones... the DEA is hard at work...

Documents: Feds allegedly allowed Sinaloa cartel to move cocaine into U.S. for information
http://archive.elpasotimes.com/ci_18608410

...literally escorting the drugs across the border, expediting their delivery to your local school.

But, hey, how else are the DEA agents gonna hang out the drug cartel hooker parties?

Report: DEA agents had ‘sex parties’ with prostitutes hired by drug cartels
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/report-dea-agents...

Now, how many of these agents were fired?

BTW, this could be a double-cross operation, too. In other words, maybe the DEA agents weren't actually at the cartel hooker parties, maybe that's a planted story to keep the agents that are disgusted by the Debt-Money Monopoly / government drug running operations in line.

I don't know for sure...

All you need to know is that "government loves you." Go out and vote now, you are POWERFUL on this cognitive slave plantation - The Debt-Money Matrix.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 08:00 | 6657680 TuPhat
TuPhat's picture

Pinch,  you outlaw knuckledraggers from owning sheep?  I don't get it.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 08:15 | 6657720 NOMO
NOMO's picture

Hey Pinch - do us a favor stay in your Country -

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 08:55 | 6657849 schatzi
schatzi's picture

This is the crux. People in different countries have very different experiences with gun laws and its resultant success.

No one outside of the US has a right, nor the desire to change your gunlaws. It's your burden to carry (or privilege) and affects us in no way.

But we do comment from a non-US perspective, so possibly expect a very different viewpoint.

For most Europeans, the US gunlaws are ludricously lax and ONE of the reasons we perceive so much firearms related crime - and accidents happen.

For Europeans, individual independence from the state is not related to gun ownership. It never was. In Europe there is a much stronger tie to the state, for better or for worse and it has gone both ways. But with the rise of the EU Brussels bureaucracy and centralisation of power, the balance of power has shifted away from the people with the state having lost much accountability. The state being accountable, guaranteeing democractic rights, having state powers seperated, having free economic choice, freedom of movement and so forth are what we consider the variables affecting our freedom.

(I consider myself very gun tolerant, have extensive weapon experience and have grown up in a multi gun/rifle household, yet I too wonder why there is such a strong emotional attachment in the US to guns).

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:44 | 6656882 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

It absolutely IS the people holding the guns that do the killing

HOWEVER

why enable unstable people with a profusion of weapons ? If someone has a mental episode that will pass inhalf an hour and they only have a knife available to them, whats the maximim potential damage vis-a-vi the snap brainsnapper with an AK47 ?

the only issue that trumps this IMHO is that americans are now facing a govt apparatus that is tyrannically hostile and exploitative to the american people

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:43 | 6657172 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

one a year?

you just proved my point. mass shootings are now more than one a day

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 03:37 | 6657459 WOAR
WOAR's picture

Take away the guns, and what weapon takes their place?

Exactly. People will kill, regardless of weapon choice. It's more preference, really, since criminals will keep their guns regardless.

Oh, and if someone does decide to come and take them...I WILL become a criminal. To do otherwise is to live in a prison with no walls, and no escape.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 03:49 | 6657474 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

ok give everyone a nuclear warhead. why not? people will kill regardless. not your best pro-gun argument.

Look, no-one is saying you will get homicide down to zero. But its the ease of murder that is the problem. because when its that easy, people finish the job of killing in a split second, before theyve had the time for their cooler head to prevail. You gotta chase someone for a block before you get the chance to make that killing blow? Gives you a few strides to think about whatcher doing and the consequences.

I got no problem with folks owning a pistol or farmers owning a rifle. but srsly -

WHO NEEDS MILLITARY ASSAULT WEAPONS in a domestic urban environment? 

Dont treat guns like a black and white issue. Im not saying paint it all white. Im saying its charcoal grey and it should be changed to light grey

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 03:57 | 6657480 Dr. Bonzo
Dr. Bonzo's picture

WHO NEEDS MILLITARY ASSAULT WEAPONS in a domestic urban environment?

First of all, whether you fucking like it or not, they're not "military style assualt weapons." Fucking moron. Who needs them? Any shopkeep defending his property from a mob for one. Seen anything like that on teeeeeeveeeeeeee lately? Naaaaaaaaaah. Have you seen how po-leece refuse to respond to calls in areas that are experiencing civil unrest? Naaaaaaaaaah. When the shit actually hits the fan, you are on your own sweetheart. 9-1-1 isn't going to save your ass. There are no goddamned po-leece coming to your rescue Cinderella. No rescuers. No Superman. You. Are. IT.

20 years on the internet and these fucking bullshit memes still won't die. Jesus H.

Get the fuck out of here with your bullshit.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 08:20 | 6657736 NOMO
NOMO's picture

Yeah - What Duh Doctor Just Said !

It seems that we now need to be restricted in our use, ownership and ability to carry our weapons because lithium laced Ritalin popping young common core products are going bat crap crazy from the psychotropic induced fog in their heads.

It seems the Administration and the lemmings following their lead want to not only De-Ball the American people but they want to take away our right to self-defense and preservation. Because of course tyranny could never happen in America.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:59 | 6657678 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Then please inform us of the unfortunate loss of life attributed to "military assault weapons" or even rifles of any type. It is a tiny percentage of overall fatalities and a deliberate straw man argument.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 08:21 | 6657738 NOMO
NOMO's picture

“A well-regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a Free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” – This is the one right that secures them all.


Feel free to exercise your First Amendment right on the issue and no need to thank me for my exercising of the second amendment to make sure you can use your first.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 17:26 | 6660200 Zymurguy
Zymurguy's picture

Remember, these rights are inherently possessed by our self being and woven into the fabric of human nature.  They are not provided by the Constitution or any man who writes a law.  The Constitution of the US is a document that was supposed to detail the limits of government.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 09:22 | 6657955 All Risk No Reward
All Risk No Reward's picture

This one is strong in their red pill intake.

Parroting establishment programming narratives engineered by Debt-Money Monopolists is unbecoming.

If you can muster a unique opinion of your own, do share it.

And it isn't you saying it.

It is you parroting the Bankster establishment narrative.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:41 | 6656875 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Ultimately many will voluntarily because they still respect the law and will always hope for peaceful resolutions. Those that do not will be the "extremists" that they have been warning of for years. Those who refuse to surrender their arms will become outlaws and will be forced into silence...which has always been their ultimate goal. They don't need more prisoners, they need people who will willingly follow THEIR laws or just slink away and hide, self censoring in an attempt to retain their last vestiges of liberty...their gun.

I will self identify as an outlaw, I guess I always have been secretly, and so it will be.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:17 | 6656971 fockewulf190
fockewulf190's picture

I´m waiting for the Limerick King to pop up and entertain us with a rootin´shootin´ rhyme.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:35 | 6657166 savagegoose
savagegoose's picture

there was a gun toting farmer,

who thought lets kill obama,

but he was ok in the brain,

he was quite very sane

so off the the range , no drama.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:14 | 6657216 daveO
daveO's picture

They are manipulating everything!!!

Umpqua seems to be as staged as Sandy Hoax. Why? Search for videos. In this day and age of ubiquitous cell phone cameras, there are none of Umpqua! Just like Sandy Hoax, all video is being distributed by the MSM. They could pull this off years ago, but today? Even a brain dead teenager is gonna ask 'where's the amateur video?'

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:33 | 6656852 Mr. Bones
Mr. Bones's picture

http://s3.documentcloud.org/documents/748675/gun-violencemessaging-guide...

Page 10 of the pdf

#1: Always focus on emotional and value-driven arguments about gun violence, not the political food fight in Washington or wonky statistics

#2: Tell stories with images and feelings

 

It doesn't get any better from there.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 10:14 | 6658180 Deathrips
Deathrips's picture

IM going to use this and replace gun violence with Govt violence .... some of their own medicine.

 

RIPS

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:39 | 6656865 cheeseheader
cheeseheader's picture

Do not play their word games on their idealogy.

 

Baseball bat violence; bus violence; drug violence; skateboard violence; surfboard violence....

 

Ever heard of those?  Didn't think so.

 

 

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:19 | 6656980 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

"Gunman" is one of the most fucking stupid terms ever adopted.  "Gunman".  Just fuck off.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:28 | 6656841 nmewn
nmewn's picture

But but but...JustObserving, those doctors, surgeons, pharmacists and generally "health care providers" (pardon the PC-Speak...lol) all went through back ground checks and extensive training!

Why...what in the world is society going to do about this silent, deadly, hidden carnage?! ;-)

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:43 | 6656881 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

And we KNOW they only had the best of intentions. That makes all of the difference you know. Its not about consequences, its about intentions.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:17 | 6657228 daveO
daveO's picture

That reminds me of the military cop outs, friendly fire and collateral damage. Stay away from hospitals AND the hood. 

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:32 | 6657641 Debt-Is-Not-Money
Debt-Is-Not-Money's picture

Stay away from all doctors, they are dangerous to both your health and your life!

Good surgeons are excepted from this, but where to find one...

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:00 | 6656928 Big_Hitman
Big_Hitman's picture

I'm making over $7k a month working part time. I kept hearing other people tell me how much money they can make online so I decided to look into it. Well, it was all true and has totally changed my life. This is what I do... www.wallstreet34.com

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:31 | 6657022 Big_Hitman
Big_Hitman's picture

I'm making over $7k a month working part time. I kept hearing other people tell me how much money they can make online so I decided to look into it. Well, it was all true and has totally changed my life. This is what I do... www.wallstreet34.com

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:01 | 6657089 Cthonic
Cthonic's picture

 

In the United States estimated iatrogenic deaths per year include: 

  • 12,000 due to unnecessary surgery
  • 7,000 due to medication errors in hospitals
  • 20,000 due to other errors in hospitals
  • 80,000 due to nosocomial infections in hospitals
  • 106,000 due to non-error, negative effects of drugs

 

Medical debt is the leading cause of bankruptcy in the US

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iatrogenesis#Epidemiology

 

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 20:49 | 6656758 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

Great Bill Whittle video!

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 20:58 | 6656778 billwilson
billwilson's picture

Maybe it is a fucked up US society that sees violence as a solution to every problem.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:46 | 6656887 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Violence seems like a reasonable solution to violence. Or we could just talk about it if we survive.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:47 | 6657056 Government need...
Government needs you to pay taxes's picture

Sure does seem like our Dear .Gov thinks pulling a gun can solve all its problems (well, along with a printing press).  Problem in Ukraine?  Pull some guns.  Syria?  Moar guns.  Citizen not resspkectn' dat cop?  Blast his sorry ass and go on unlimited paid vacation.  Need to search a home?  Send in the SWAT.

When a bully buys a gun, it starts an arms race.  15.7 million gun purchase notifications in 2015 (YTD) aren't wrong.  We the People are up-gunning in response to what .gov is doing.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:16 | 6657226 OldPhart
OldPhart's picture

Won't admit to it under any circumstance.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:00 | 6656781 Surrealist
Surrealist's picture

"Maybe It's Not The Nuclear Bombs... Maybe It's The People Holding The Nuclear Bombs"

 

Nuclear bomb rights for all!

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:06 | 6656796 greenskeeper carl
greenskeeper carl's picture

I agree. Take them away from all governemnts at once. They have clearly shown they can't be trusted not to kill people, so why should governments that kill so many be allowed to own weapons that, just with the simple push of a button, can kill millions in the blink of an eye? Do you NEED nuclear weapons to defend yourself, I think not

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:18 | 6656821 o r c k
o r c k's picture

   Duck and Cover !

    (c'mon now, stop that)

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:04 | 6656792 robnume
robnume's picture

TPTB don't want us to have guns because they're afraid of their own shitizens. I used to be an ardent gun control supporter until I studied enough twentieth century military history to come to the conclusion that having the right to gun ownership is all that keeps the USSA Army tanks from rolling down our streets. More people were killed by their own governments last century than at any other time in recorded history I really now believe that my next door neighbor, a Marine, would shoot me with impunity if he thought he could get away with it or if I said something he didn't like. These military people are totally brainwashed today. I stay the hell away from them, which is difficult to do here in San Diego, home of the right wingnut.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:07 | 6656800 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

I really now believe that my next door neighbor, a Marine, would shoot me with impunity if he thought he could get away with it or if I said something he didn't like.

So you just sit in your urine soaked drawers in the dark of your studio apartment?  You choose to live in ignorance and fear.  Pretty sad really.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:54 | 6656909 SgtShaftoe
SgtShaftoe's picture

Everyone who has enlisted or have been commissioned since the Iraq fiasco are ignorant fools or complete and utter dumbfucks. The people who have remained in the service through that clusterfuck are the worst kind of stupid or true kool-aid drinkers.

I was in before 9/11 and it's a different military now. Current Marines are some of the worst. The indoctrination is just so over-the-top. Marines have always been proud, some to the point of utter idiocy. You may have moved in next to the latter.

If you know someone you care about in the military, convince them to ETS or resign. Also, get the fuck out of California. Are you fucking nuts??!?! There is no way out of coastal CA if everyone tried to leave. Get smart and get out now.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:56 | 6656916 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

I have several relatives and friends who have enlisted since Bush's Iraq war.  All are good people.  None are deluded fools.  They are performing their work honorably.

But I agree with you.  They(aforementioned people) are the exception and not the rule.  I certainly wouldn't want to be in this generation's military.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:06 | 6656939 SgtShaftoe
SgtShaftoe's picture

Well, do what you can to get them to ETS out when they're up for it. It is a very bad time to be in the US armed forces especially in any combat arms branches. Their souls are in grave danger, and not necessarily in any religious way. I've seen the destruction on soldiers during Iraq and it still brings me to tears.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:06 | 6656944 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

I agree man!  Especially with the military going FULL SODOMITE right now with the new sodomite secretary.  

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:06 | 6656797 Harry Balzak
Harry Balzak's picture

 

“Laws that forbid the carrying of arms…disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed one.”

This was originally written in Italian by Cesare Beccaria.  Thomas Jefferson quoted him.  

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:06 | 6656799 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Lead by example.Now that is funny!

The is the last thing in their mind.They will not even restrict themselves to follow the laws the rest of us must obey.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:09 | 6656803 new game
new game's picture

ah fuckit, just face reality, we are going to have to exercise our second amendemnt rights

sooner than i once thought...

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:09 | 6656804 Wolf in the Wilds
Wolf in the Wilds's picture

Maybe its the country and not gun ownership.  

http://www.theguardian.com/news/datablog/2012/jul/22/gun-homicides-owner...

US #1 gun ownership 88 per 100 people,2.7 homicide by firearm per 100k pop

Switzerland #3 gun ownership 45.7 per 100, 0.77 homicide by firearm per 100k pop

Finland #4 gun ownership 45.3 per 100, 0.45 homicide by firearm per 100k pop

 

If gun ownership = gun deaths, why the discrepancy?

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:12 | 6656811 new game
new game's picture

a smelting pot has issues, never to be discussed, just like population numbers...

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:24 | 6656831 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Its called demographics. Break the numbers down further a bit and you might see these European utopia's future at hand.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 11:06 | 6658422 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

Demographic breakdown of Philadelphia shootings...

http://stuffblackpeopledontlike.blogspot.jp/2015/10/of-known-shooting-of...

Extra! Extra!

Read all about it!

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:24 | 6656832 CunnyFunt
CunnyFunt's picture

I suppose that the Crips and Bloods haven't established their Helsinki or Zurich chapters yet. Any gun-free zones in Lappland?

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:25 | 6656834 DanDaley
DanDaley's picture

...why the discrepancy?

 

Democrat-controlled cesspools called major American cities, run by Democrats for generations. Take those cesspools out of the picture, and you have a low-crime country like Switzerland or Finland.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 11:10 | 6658438 Kobe Beef
Kobe Beef's picture

They're called Africans. Seattle & Pittsburgh go highly democratic, but they don't kill at the rates of Detroit, St. Louis, New Orleans, or Camden.

It's the African genome, coding for high aggression, low conscientiousness, low IQ, and low future time orientation, not the Donkey party.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:28 | 6657249 dark_matter
dark_matter's picture

In Switzerland you are in the military reserves until you are 35 (or older) and have to train every year. Every able bodied man in this age group has a semi-auto rifle and 30 rounds at home. Young men in train station with weapons was a common sight. Maybe they have fewer gun deaths because all the men have guns and know how to use them. Breaking into a Swiss home would be a scary thing.

 

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:53 | 6657668 Infinite QE
Infinite QE's picture

Not a lot of neegros nor latinoos in Finland nor Switzerland. But leave it to Barbara Spectre and their probably will be and lots o'them.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:13 | 6656812 CunnyFunt
CunnyFunt's picture

I carry on my person every time I leave my premises, and I'm never more than a few feet from a loaded firearm. This option was not always available to me, as I once lived in a state where private ownership of firearms was actively discouraged via legislation. In that state, I noted a tendency for people to "get in my face" and "start shit." In my current state, nobody even looks askance toward me. This is all anecdotal and has been said before, but a well-armed citizenry is a polite citizenry.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:28 | 6656840 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Strange world where we are prevented from defending ourselves at the same time we are indoctrinated to believe that virtually everything is an insult, every thought an offense.

CHAOS

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:24 | 6656996 TSA gropee
TSA gropee's picture

Well said Oldwood. I knew these days would come where right is wrong and the victim is the guilty one and vice versa. Have to say though it's much more upside down and sideways than I ever imagined.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:39 | 6656863 Shpedly
Shpedly's picture

I live in Guntucky and am pleased to say, I never feel the need to carry. Was at the gun shop the other day and saw a grandma, who was well into her 70's, plunking down the cold hard cash for a Kel-Tec KSG. 12+1 3" 12 guage shells at the ready, in a compact 26 inch package. It was a warm and comforting moment.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:40 | 6656869 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

Awesome!

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:52 | 6656906 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Got one hanging in my closet. Perfect home defense, close quarters weapon.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:30 | 6657248 daveO
daveO's picture

I've noticed Blue State inhabitants who move here are always looking for trouble. Last summer, an Iranian, via Los Angeles, followed a car into a parking lot to pick a fight. He got shot and nearly died. Shooter's still at large and the cops aren't searching too hard for him.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:26 | 6656836 A Lunatic
A Lunatic's picture

Get rid of all of the people then. That might actually be easier.....

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:27 | 6656839 FredFlintstone
FredFlintstone's picture

that comes after they take your guns

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:43 | 6656859 SgtShaftoe
SgtShaftoe's picture

I'm not sure why everyone is wringing their hands over what gun laws Washington may decide to pass. Even if the idiots of Mordor on the Potomac repealed the 2nd amendment, compliance would be essentially zero. Guns aren't going away and there's enough civilian ammo stockpiles to fight WWIII against the entire world. There would be a civil war first. Spoiler alert: the government would lose.

There's over a 400 year supply of rifles, pistols and ammunition in the US for any blockade of imports/manufacture. That 400 year figure is at least 7 years old, prior to several odd potential false flag ops against the american people. Since then, the people have armed up and how! After Sandy Hook, the US civilian population purchased more AR pattern rifles than all the Garands produced during the entire conflict of WWII.

However, the persistence of DC in attempting to control guns is illustrative to how disconnected to reality they really are. If they think they can soften the domestic targets with gun regulation, they're out of their mind. However if they're trying to provoke a domestic conflict, they should be careful what they wish for. I've met a ton of very capable random people who won't stand for any more restrictions or shenanigans of any kind.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:00 | 6656932 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

I will repeat...

This is not about eliminating guns anymore that it is about eliminating gun deaths, as Chicago proves EVERYDAY.

This is about making the majority of Americans outlaws. Not to incarcerate us, but to silence us, to legally remove our rights, not only 2nd amendment but 1st amendment freedom of speech, as we will be forced into silence in our desire to retain our guns.

It is a perfect solution to their ends.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:21 | 6656964 SgtShaftoe
SgtShaftoe's picture

Well in states like Montana, it will have very little impact, and even less as time goes on. States are increasingly giving the middle finger to DC. What they think or legislate simply won't matter pretty soon. They won't get the desired result of "silence". They will get increasing levels of civil disobedience. Bundy Ranch was just the start.

DC flinched. The next one will have a bigger draw. If they get a conflict started, all the TPTB will likely be in grave danger. Hence it will be a very bad move. If they have any intelligence, they should know that.

I find this whole game of chess that's going on simply fascinating. I'm also quite disappointed by the lack of intelligence of the TPTB. This game has a very predictable ending. They can leave the board voluntarily with their treasure, or they can double down and push for a conflict where they lose it all.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:54 | 6657072 Government need...
Government needs you to pay taxes's picture

That nigger in the White House could start a shooting war with Mother Theresa.  He's a fucking candy-ass pansy, and when he feels bad about it, he starts a war.  Dont worry, he's still got 1.5 years to start a Civil War here on the homefront.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:07 | 6657110 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Look at what has come out of their mouths for years now. It has been the right wing extremists that have ALWAYS been painted as the real threat. While I'm sure we are a threat politically, I think there is a more direct reason why they keep going there. They are indoctrinating Americans to be ready to accept that indeed, it IS these people who constitute the real threat. The crazy people who defy law and live in compounds planning on taking back the government. They will throw out their twisted statistics while telling one and all "see something, say something". Gun owners will go silent and invisible at that point. And no one will will give one rat's ass what people in the mountains of Montana are doing. Bundy's ranch would have gone a bit differently if all those guns people were carrying were illegal.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:45 | 6656867 raki_d
raki_d's picture

Funny fella. Its really very very simple. Its the easy acquiring of guns thats the issue. Countries with tighter gun control laws tend to have less gun related deaths. Period.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:51 | 6656904 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

really? you dont think the overprescription of psychotropic meds has anything to do with it?

spend time in LA. People get up in the morning "im not awake enuff yet, take a pill" breakfast time "I should control my appetite, take a pill" start work "need to be sharp, take a pill" lunchtime "should relax a bit take a pill" back to work take a pill  feeling strung out from too many pills take a pill cut off in traffic too angry take a pill run out of the right pills - how stressful take a pill murder someone take a pill need to straighten up to drive take a pill time for bed need to sleep take a pill

hey wait was there some kind of felonious behaviour i dun yesterday, i cant recall

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:58 | 6656924 raki_d
raki_d's picture

so ur saying - thrz no issue with buying guns being as easy as buying pills ? oh no! ban pills, then haha

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:05 | 6656938 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

Have you ever tried to buy Sudafed or any other drug that has ephedrine or pseudoephedrine?

You could take your 14 yo. girlfriend you impregnated to Planned Parenthood and fewer questions/ID asked for to execute that unborn child than to buy a firearm.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:27 | 6656976 raki_d
raki_d's picture

ok. I agree with you. Great argument and an eye opener and I say it again. Ban the pills. No issue with being able to buy Guns as easy as candy. hahaha

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:31 | 6657021 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

Candy doesn't require a 4473.  Then again there are FTF sales that do not require anything but an exchange.  FTF is the way to go.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:09 | 6656949 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Maybe you haven't noticed that every problem has a government solution that always requires further surrender of our liberties.

Looking at the world as it is today, what fucking idiot would suggest that this is working? Will it be that the gilded cage is our ultimate solution.

Was Europe suffering from excessive gun violence before they outlawed them, or was it simply precrime? Show us where outlawing guns ended or even changed gun violence statistics. We have plenty of cities in America where extreme gun laws are a precursor to gun violence.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:37 | 6657030 raki_d
raki_d's picture

http://www.newsweek.com/gun-control-what-we-can-learn-other-advanced-cou...

"Australia hasn’t had a mass shooting since 1996

The story of Australia, which had 13 mass shootings in the 18-year period from 1979 to 1996 but none in the succeeding 19 years, is worth examining.

The turning point was the 1996 Port Arthur massacre in Tasmania, in which a gunman killed 35 individuals using semiautomatic weapons.

In the wake of the massacre, the conservative federal government succeeded in implementing tough new gun control laws throughout the country. A large array of weapons were banned—including the Glock semiautomatic handgun used in the Charleston shootings. The government also imposed a mandatory gun buy back that substantially reduced gun possession in Australia."

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:55 | 6657078 Government need...
Government needs you to pay taxes's picture

Yeah, that gun buy-back wouldnt work in the US.  I wouldnt give up my guns.  I never will.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:01 | 6657096 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

Oh, but their glorious buyback was MANDATORY!

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:11 | 6657119 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

I'm convinced.

Where do I send my guns?

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 03:54 | 6657482 WOAR
WOAR's picture

If I make my own, do I get paid for the full price of a Glock?

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:49 | 6656891 runswithscissors
runswithscissors's picture

Those Belgians twice as violent as the Plano Texans 

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 01:08 | 6657315 Uchtdorf
Uchtdorf's picture

Is that the regular Belgians or the the US Treasury-buying Belgians?

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:51 | 6656902 silverer
silverer's picture

Just introducing anti-gun legislation should be grounds for immediate arrest.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 21:56 | 6656905 Arthur Schopenhauer
Arthur Schopenhauer's picture

I saw this coming years ago. I invested in gun and ammunition companies and am now making big profits from people buying guns and munitions.

I am also talking to some prominent movie producers regarding making some more movies about apocolyptic scenario kind of movies.

Man there is so much money to be made from people who feed on fear.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:14 | 6657128 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Then you should work for the government. No entity has prospered more from the dissemination of fear than government.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:00 | 6656931 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

H/T to rogerb @hotair.  Dude makes awesome posts.

90% of the population (and I’d imagine he was trying to say the 78.6% that is older than 14) has sex every year. And yes, I know, it may just be mutual touching and no fluids exchanged, but just go with it. We’re defaulting to the most helpful position for them.
 
*** MATH TRIGGER WARNING ***
 
78.6% of 90% of the 2011 population of 311,670,300 is 245M
 
245M people are potentially exposed to HIV/AIDS each year.
 
As explained above, our entire population is exposed to potential gun violence, so that’s the full 311.7M.
 
*** MATH TRIGGER WARNING ***
 
<1/2 of 1% of the population has HIV/AIDS and is responsible for 8,369 deaths and 50K injuries to other people in a population of 245M each year.
 
37% of the population has guns and is responsible for 6,900 deaths and 74K injuries to other people in a population of 311M each year.
 
There are 70 million more people
 
(Visualize every person in the U.S. between 20 and 35 years old. That’s about 70 million. It’s almost the population of two Californias.) 
 
in their exposed population and yet the “has guns” group
 
(double that 70 million you just thought about – that’s still not as many people as those with guns in the U.S. – It’s almost equal to the entire population of Mexico)
 
cause 1000+ fewer deaths each year than the “has HIV/AIDS” group.
 
(which is only 1.1 million people. Visualize about 1.5 Detroits. That’s it. Nationwide.)
 
It really is shocking to understand how safe gun owners are.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:16 | 6656968 PoasterToaster
PoasterToaster's picture

Maybe it's not anything.  Maybe we are being led around by the nose over these stupid nonissues while important things are being ignored.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:17 | 6656973 man of Wool
man of Wool's picture

"Banning firearms or imposing unreasonable restrictions not only goes against the spirit and letter of Constitutional Law, but increases the odds that innocent Americans will become targets of violent criminals like we have seen in “gun-free” cities such as Detroit and Chicago."

 

BULLSHIT. Its the way you run your country. If the whole country bought in strict gun control at the SAME TIME you would not have these problems.  You got to have regulation to stop the "mentally ill" geting hold of guns.  Work it out.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:20 | 6656985 Teh Finn
Teh Finn's picture

Year To Date
Shot & Killed: 359
Shot & Wounded: 2029
Total Shot: 2388
Total Homicides: 407

http://heyjackass.com

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:07 | 6657208 dexter_morgan
dexter_morgan's picture

There is a whole lot of very telling information in that graphic if one is willing to analyze it just a bit more than at the surface. Locations, demographics, laws in effect, etc.

I do have one question - If you visit the downtown are of Chicago, nearly all buildings have little signs on the entrances saying guns are not allowed. This is their effort to reverse the effects of the CCR law recently put in to effact.

If someone were to go in to one of those buildings and shoot it up and kill some people, could the families sue the building owners for restricting their right to defend themselves by banning their legal right to concealed carry?

 

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:41 | 6657275 daveO
daveO's picture

You could, but that's not the Chosenites'(many lawyers and judges) agenda. Dead in the water.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:25 | 6657003 xxxxx
xxxxx's picture

Guns don't kill people. People kill people.....Wait oh yeah it's people with guns that kill people!

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:28 | 6657008 Teh Finn
Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:02 | 6657198 Tachyon5321
Tachyon5321's picture

Hammers and bats don't kill people. People kill people.....Wait oh yeah it's people with hammers and bats that kill people!  

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:19 | 6657135 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

The same rationale every Statist uses. All failures of policy are only indication of not pursuing said policies to a greater extent, and NEVER because it is a failed policy. Failed in its assumptions, failed in it effects and failed in its ideology that seeks always to limit choice and freedoms rather than enhance them.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 05:57 | 6657557 mr coffee
mr coffee's picture

They dont care and wont until someone they know gets killed. Their culture breeds gun violence.

 

2 and a half million people in Prison in the land of the free. ( mainly for crazy drug laws)

At least 22 veterans commit suicide every day.

 http://thinkprogress.org/health/2014/01/11/3150531/young-male-veterans-m...

More than 10,000 killed so far in 2015. http://www.gunviolencearchive.org/

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:31 | 6657020 cougar_w
cougar_w's picture

Or the truth may simply be the truth. Not like that's going to make any difference, we like our running illusion and we're keeping it.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 22:31 | 6657024 GRDguy
GRDguy's picture

99.99% of gun owners have been behaving themselves quite respectfully. They know they have an option should they be attacked. I deplore what a few psychopaths among gun owners have done to innocent victims who didn't have guns to fight back.  One thing I'd like to know, "What happens if we take away guns from those 99.99% who have been self-protecting themselves from psychopaths with guns?

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:20 | 6657136 Oldwood
Oldwood's picture

Freedoms must be sacrificed for the greater good of a relatively few who are obviously more important than you.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 05:50 | 6657552 mr coffee
mr coffee's picture

School children and university students and people in church should all carry guns. Good point.

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:26 | 6657148 falconflight
falconflight's picture

Homicide rates have been continuously declining within the US for decades. BTW, homicide rates across the world place the US at about #97 when compared to other nations. Further, the people responsible for about 75% of homicides are people who look like Obama and the millions of illegals squatting here.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:47 | 6657290 daveO
daveO's picture

Yes. The 3 strikes laws put BHO's boys into prison for good. Now, the pols are starting to try to turn them loose.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three-strikes_law#Effects_in_California

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:53 | 6657185 Bill of Rights
Bill of Rights's picture

You gave little Johnny meds back when he was 4 now little Johnny is 24 and as nutty as a fruitcake...

Sun, 10/11/2015 - 23:53 | 6657186 Equalizer
Equalizer's picture

You yanks crack me up making all the excuses in the world about your pathetic gun and mass shooting culture,........... you're always shooting yourselves in the foot IMHO.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:58 | 6657306 Peak Bull
Peak Bull's picture

Freedom is not an excuse, it is a way of life.

We do not have a culture of mass shootings, it is done by a select few. You do know what culture means, don't you?

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 01:17 | 6657327 Uchtdorf
Uchtdorf's picture

You Brits crack me up when you pretend to forget how you begged the US for our spare guns to give to your citizens so they could protect themselves when Hitler and his troops arrived. Guns delivered. Average citizens increased in confidence. Crisis solved.

So...you're welcome, you English bed-wetting type. I burst my pimples at you and call your post a silly thing.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:46 | 6657655 Infinite QE
Infinite QE's picture

Ha. The inbred brits let their zio overlords take away their gun rights now all the third world scum they've imported are killing people with knives. Britain was once a beautiful place to visit but now it's an open sewer.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:37 | 6657265 hadriansnightmare
hadriansnightmare's picture

Uhh please don't quote or attribute something to Jefferson without sourcing....Ever 

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 00:57 | 6657303 honestann
honestann's picture

Love the video.  Okay, just a bit of selective data presentation, but the point was completely valid.  And hilarious.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 01:36 | 6657350 colin2862@gmail.com
colin2862@gmail.com's picture

Well OK, so how many own guns and how many own cars, if you are going to compare, that should be a part of it, and then how often do they drive vs. shoot, as that statistically is relevant.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 01:46 | 6657364 Stlouiemike
Stlouiemike's picture

Funny I do not recall any shootings "mass" or the regular varity being committed at a shooting range.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:03 | 6657609 nickt1y
nickt1y's picture

The shooting of Chris Kyle and his friend comes to mind ... but that was only 2.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 03:07 | 6657432 PoasterToaster
PoasterToaster's picture

The worst people holding the guns are the ones wearing uniforms.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 04:57 | 6657518 22winmag
22winmag's picture

(black and blue uniformes, while on steroids)

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 03:38 | 6657463 Itch
Itch's picture

Maybe it's not the guns...maybe it's not even the people holding the guns...maybe it's the current zeitgeist and culture creating the people, that hold the guns, that kill the people. Yeah, time to take the guns off the crazies, if you want sensible people to bare arms, at least do everything to stop imbeciles getting their hands on one. Too many fools in the US, if you ask me, it's probably the last country in the world that should have lax gun laws.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 04:22 | 6657498 moratar
moratar's picture

Free ppl can use guns. Only slaves can't use weapons.

In order to have real slave population US gov must disallow using guns.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 05:43 | 6657543 mr coffee
mr coffee's picture

Its not the guns... its the people using the guns, an excellent point to ponder.  A country full of gun toting nut jobs each waiting to see who will snap and start shooting the rest first.

What a great list of crime ridden, underdeveloped, poverty riddled countries the US is proud to rank itself among when it comes to gun violence. I didnt see many developed, sophisticated well educated world leading, technologically advanced countries in that list until we get to the United States.  Well Done!

Were the best of the crapest. Hooray.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 05:59 | 6657558 Why.Not.
Why.Not.'s picture

Want to reduce the incidence of war? Openly resolve, as a nation: If you attack us or our friends, we will come after your leaders first, and we will not stop until they are dead. All of them - families and close relatives included. After that we will obliterate your culture. We will not fight a "nice" war, and we will not stop until your country is a smoldering heap of ruin.

You'd only have to do this once, and the world would become a much nicer place.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 06:56 | 6657603 DrDre
DrDre's picture

The defense of guns ownership is becoming more lame by the day. Car deaths happen because of accidents, not because of people ramming into schools with the deliberate intent of killing children.

As an aside, the constitution talks about a "well regulated militia", so why regulating guns ownership would be against the second amendment?

A democracy is run via peaceful polls, not via armed insurrection. Individual freedom should not infringe upon other people'rights to go to school safely.

Unfortunately, no constitutional amendment defends the right to get a sensible education.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:12 | 6657618 DirtyHarry
DirtyHarry's picture

Whilst we are at it, lets solve the rape issue as well. This can easily be achieved by banning penises.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:12 | 6657619 DirtyHarry
DirtyHarry's picture

Whilst we are at it, lets solve the rape issue as well. This can easily be achieved by banning penises.

Mon, 10/12/2015 - 07:24 | 6657632 TongueStun
TongueStun's picture

Take away the violent  kneegrows, and America has the lowest gun violence of any other third world country....

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