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Obama Withdraws Aircraft Carrier Support From Middle East Just As Russia Unveils Its Syrian Airbase
One glance at the map below, showing the current distribution of U.S. naval assets, reveals something that has almost never happened at any time in the past decade:
As the map shows, US aircraft carrier, CVN 71 Theodore Roosevelt is currently on its way out of the Persian Gulf, leaving just the LHD-2 Essex Amphibious Warfare ship group to defend the Persian Gulf and more importantly, leaving the hotly contested middle east without U.S. carrier-based air support for the first time in years.
How did this happen?
According to USNI News, the Theodore Roosevelt Carrier Strike Group left U.S. 5th Fleet on Tuesday with no public timeline for when its replacement will reach the Middle East to continue U.S. air strikes against Islamic State in Iraq in Syria (ISIS) targets. While the CVN 71 The Harry S. Truman Carrier Strike Group is slated to be the next CSG bound for the Middle East, but the Navy would not specify a deployment time other than later this year, a service official told USNI News on Tuesday.
“We’re not going to talk to future operations,” the official said.
That said, the redeployment of the Roosevelt is not a surprise: two months ago the CNN Pentagon correspondent warned that this was coming:
The U.S. Navy will not be able to keep an aircraft carrier in the Persian Gulf for much of the fall season, according to a Navy official. The official said that's because the Navy has to schedule needed maintenance after years of extended deployments and because of reduced spending due to mandatory budget cuts.
While there have been so-called "carrier gaps" in the Persian Gulf before, this one will leave the Navy without the presence of a high-profile aircraft carrier just as a proposed nuclear deal with Iran is at center stage. It also comes as Iranian naval forces have conducted low-level harassment of U.S. and other shipping in the region.
U.S. military officials insisted that there would be no impact on U.S. operations in the gulf because the Air Force can briefly send additional, land-based aircraft to the region if needed. Airstrikes against ISIS targets in Iraq and Syria are also largely undertaken by the Air Force. The Navy accounts for only about 20% of the ISIS strike missions.
Whatever the reason, the Roosevelt is out of there, and the ship is now said to be bound for its new homeport at Naval Station San Diego, Calif.
While in 5th Fleet, the Roosevelt CSG was the largest symbol in the U.S.-led anti-ISIS collation responsible for "1,812 combat sorties totaling 10,618 combat flight hours, taking on 14.5 million gallons of jet fuel and expending 1,085 precision-guided munitions," as part of Operation Inherent Resolve, according to a Tuesday statement from the service.
Which probably does not explain why in over a year, the US did less damage to ISIS then the Russian airforce has achieved in less than a month.
As for the reason why suddenly the Persian Gulf has an unprecedented US carrier support gap in the middle east - one which could last for two months or well longer - it is because the Harry S. Truman Carrier Strike Group, which is slated to be the next CSG bound for the Middle East, has been delayed and the Navy would not specify a deployment time other than later this year, a service official told USNI News on Tuesday.
Earlier this month the Truman CSG completed its Composite Training Unit Exercise (COMPTUEX), the complex training exercise that certifies the strike group for deployment.Previous CSG and three-ship Amphibious Ready Group deployments were often extended to meet the demand of U.S. geographic combatant commanders (COCOMs) at the expense of maintenance setbacks and crew fatigue.
Furthermore, this may be just the beginning of key US naval "gaps" across critical geographic regions:
As the Navy continues to implement stricter deployment tenants, more gaps in Middle East carrier presence may emerge, several service leaders told USNI News in September. Last month Rear Adm. Jeffrey Harley, assistant deputy chief of naval operations for operations, plans and strategy (OPNAV N3/5B) told the House Armed Services Committee (HASC) that it would take a directive from the Secretary of Defense to the Navy to extend the deployment of a carrier to longer than seven months.
While extending a carrier is always an option, another option would be “to reduce our global input as to what we can provide [to the combatant commanders] for a designated period of time, and mitigate that presence, that carrier presence, in some other way using our joint partners, using joint aircraft to cover a gap in time in which we may not have a carrier present,” Harley told the panel.
Whatever the future of US naval "gaps" may be, one thing is clear: the departure of the Roosevelt comes at a particularly awkward time - just as Russia is setting up its own aicraft base in Syria.
As we reported yesterday, "The start of Russian airstrikes in Syria has given new hope to loyalist forces in their battle against a host of rebel factions, including the Islamic State. Now Russia may expand these operations into Iraq if requested to do so by Baghdad. Indeed, from its position in Latakia, Russia has the range to strike Islamic State targets in Iraq, although further deployment of resources may be required to do so effectively."
More importanly, Russia can now also reach the all important global "choke point" of the Suez Canal within minutes, not to mention Tel Aviv, Jerusalem, Baghdad, and - if propertly equppped - Bahrain, the headquarters of the U.S. Fifth fleet.
In conclusion ,we take one final look at the map up top, and ask if on its way back to San Diego the Roosevelt will be the ship that Obama uses to send China a message as he has threatened to do, by sailing around the contested islands in the South China Sea, a move which China has warned twice it will be forced to retaliate against. Recall that yesterday China's Global Times said that should Obama carry this out, it would be a "breach of China's bottom line".
"If the US encroaches on China's core interests, the Chinese military will stand up and use force to stop it," the paper warned.
In light of this upcoming showdown, one hopes that the USS Rosevelt won't be known in history as the second coming of the USS Maddox.
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Ever consider the possibility that Russian and American military assets/mercenaries are controlled by the same global oligarchy? To me, it looks like Russia was handed the ball in Syria and the USA was reassigned. Just a thought...
I don't think Putin would kow tow to anyone.
Senator Joe McCarthy is getting the last laugh. He tried to us the American people that there were communist infiltrators in the government, in academia, in the media, in the entertainment industries. But Americans soon lost interest. One thing saved the communist. Senator Joe's revelations coincided with the introduction of a very powerful tool: TELEVISION. Americans wanted "I Love Lucy", "The Honeymooners" and televised sports, they soon tired of the stories of reds everywhere. it didn't hurt that you had all of the networks doing there best to marginalize the Senator as being on a witch hunt, or veiled references to a drinking problem.
The Senator was eventually howled down, everybody had a good laugh at him, and American went back to sleep. By he 1960s, the reds felt comfortable enough to go mainstream, and come out from hiding. And come out they did. They went on to capture nearly every institution in the country, even the Catholic Church. Obama is the proof of their success. Anyone who still doubts he is a Marxist can put those doubts to rest. his mission all along was to destroy the USA as we once knew it, and transform it into something else, HE SAID SO HIMSELF. And now he is pulling out military assets from the most strategic area on the globe without so much as firing a shot. This was all planned, anyone with half a brain can see it.
McCarthy and Forrestal were giants for America as a free standing Republic. Another was Larry McDonald, cousin of General George S. Patton who was himself a hero in defense of American ideals. Of course there were and are many others.
The big thing here is that all were killed (McCarthy politically) for supporting true Americanism. JFK is another although not as vociferous as these others, but nonetheless very concerned about America’s role in the world and who and who should not have nuclear weapons.
We all know how that turned out!
Thanks wabbits, didn't know that about McDonald
Something big is coming. There are a million ads on radio and TV NAVY ARMY NATIONAL GUARD MARINES.i have never seen that many and so frequent. The table is being setup. gulp!!!
So you have just started watching TV? Check out sports shows (including baseball playoffs) and especially football this weekend. It is called recruiting and has been going on since the end of the draft.
Do you have a draft card?
Why the gulp?
- Ned
Those USSA terrorist AC Carriers are outdated floating coffins, no problem to sink one of them for Russia or China.
I respect the contempt whith which Admiral Rickover and his follovers have regarded the aircraft carrier. Their contempt may be well-warranted. But there is no other way to project military power beyond our shores without the aircraft carrier. That's why we need them; and that's why we have more than the rest of the world's navies combined.
Soon, howver, this will not be the case. Construction of new aircraft carriers are underway in China, India, the United kingdom. Russia is restoring the Kuznetsov, which will give it 2; and is preparing to build an ultra modern super carrier that will set to sea within the next decade.
So, in the grand scheme of things, it looks like a lot of nations believe that the aircraft carrier is an essential element of naval power; and it will be the centerpiece of their navies for many years to come.
Sinking a carrier by submarine is so 20th century {and outdated}. The way you kill them is the way the US MIC is working on now: KILLER SATELLITES. Carriers are too large to hide. They can easily be tracked via satellites, and at a time of the enemies choosing, deploy a guided kinetic weapon against it {from said satellite}. One hit would be all that would be needed.
I like the supersonic ASMs. Coming in on the deck at mach 1, by the time you see it, you have maybe one second to react. oops.
Carriers are necessary for air superiority in far away places but there are other weapons systems that project our exceptional authoritah. ICBMs, ballistic missile subs, the Marines !, long range bombers, and yeah, new-fangled satellite weapons.
"In conclusion ,we take one final look at the map up top, and ask if on its way back to San Diego the Roosevelt will be the ship that Obama uses to send China a message as he has threatened to do, by sailing around the contested islands in the South China Sea, a move which China has warned twice it will be forced to retaliate against. Recall that yesterday China's Global Times said that should Obama carry this out, it would be a "breach of China's bottom line".
"If the US encroaches on China's core interests, the Chinese military will stand up and use force to stop it," the paper warned.
In light of this upcoming showdown, one hopes that the USS Rosevelt won't be known in history as the second coming of the USS Maddox."
CHINA'S "NINE DASH LINE", which delineates the limits of its coastal claims in the South China Sea (and which encompasses almost all of that body of water), comes within 20 nautical miles of parts of the Philippines Malaysia and Indonesia. It is practically impossible not to infringe upon China's "territory" when traversing the South China Sea. There are various lines of importance used to determine a country's claims upon the sea. The two most important are 20 NM (approximatel the limits of the visible horizon at sea), which is considered the "no-go" line for warships of another navy; and 200 NM, which is the limits of the "zone of economic interest".
As long as the US Navy sails more than 20 NM away from each of these Chinese islands, China can do nothing and claim that the US did not trespass within its territorial waters, while the US Navy can claim that they sailed within the waters claimed by China as its economic zone. I expect that most of the carrier group will sail well away from the islands; but that a destroyer or frigate will veer within the 20-mile zone -albeit briefly- just to make an appearance. I also expect that several Chinese naval vessels will be sailing within 3 miles of the US Navy as it passes through the South China Sea.
As long as the US Navy sails more than 20 NM away from each of these Chinese islands, China can do nothing and claim that the US did not trespass within its territorial waters . . .
The internationally recognized "territorial waters" limit extends 12 miles out from the coast of a country's land - not 20 miles. The US has repeatedly stated they intend to encroach into this 12 mile area around the reclaimed islands China has been building in the South China Sea. That's what has China so pissed off . . . .
Thank you for the correction. I must have confused 20 kilometers with 20 miles (20 Km = 12 Nm). I may have mixed up the economic zone as well (200 Nm = 325 Km).
It's just a simple training rotation ordered by the President. The Roosevelt is due for mandatory crew training in color coordination, accessorizing and african studies.
The USS Theodore Roosevelt is headed toward the Indian Ocean for a military excersise.
Russia has developed a superior fighter aircraft. This has been demonstrated in fighter jet competition over and over again.
Don't forget electronic warfare. Pretty much a gamechanger.
Don't forget electronic warfare. Pretty much a gamechanger.
Yeah it is . . . and Russia's capabilities in this area are FAR more advanced than the USA's. See the USS Donald Cook incident in the Black Sea in May of 2014 for a good example where a Russian un-armed fighter jet equipped with a new electronic warfare unit totally disabled the AEGIS radar system on the Cook. The Russian plane then did like 15 simulated strafing runs over the deck of the ship while the pilot flipped the crew the bird.
And a single, conventional 20MM CWIZ shell could have taken him out of the sky. at alt 500 ft(reportedly) But it didn't. It was not because it couldn't be done. 50 cals are manual weapons. " good example where a Russian un-armed fighter jet equipped with a new electronic warfare unit totally disabled the AEGIS radar system on the Cook." This is incorrect, he simply did not respond his intentions, via WORKING radio request. They should/could have revoked his birth certificate, he's a lucky Russkie!
Makes complete sense to move out of harm's way when you've given up. We used to make jokes about the French and their appetite for surrender. Guess who's the butt now.
Let's get the hell out and never, ever return. I kinda like the idea of trimming the Pentagon budget WAY back and actually buying oil instead of spending TRILLIONS of dollars to steal it and still coming home empty-handed. Yeah, those FAT-ASS neocons are a REAL piece of work....
Holy fuck you are retarded. Who pays you to hammer that tripe into your keyboard?
Have you ever considered taking a night course in Arithmetic? I hear you can earn an extra number "two" if you pass.
If only we had stolen the fucking oil! We didn't do jack shit.
"
Again to self talking? Earn yourself a reexamination, while can still be treated. And in public take bluetooth on headset, the delirium to camoflage.
p.s. Haloperidol, many say helps, try it.
Pilfer. 15 years of nonstop, unrestrained, in fact, over-the-top pilfering. Pallets of tax payer dollars handed out like candy.
Actually, that should tell you that the underlying agenda never really had anything to do with oil in the first place, except as a prop and a smokescreen.
The US has ten Nimitz-class carriers, the Nimitz, Washington, Lincoln, Roosevelt, Eisenhower, Vinson, Bush, Reagan, Truman, and Stennis, and they can't keep one in the Med? Actually there are plenty of airbases in the region they could asign the Navy aircraft to USAF bases and operate cheaper and safer that way.
And 5 of those carriers are at their home port right now. So none of them could replace the USS Roosevelt in the Gulf?
Absurd. Something else is afoot.
AC withdrawal is because they recall critical (propaganda wise) assets from direct threat areas. In other words they are sitting ducks in Persian Gulf. So all ACs will be beyond range of the Russian and Chinese guided missiles. Meaningless move since nowadays ballistic missiles (multiple warheads) are guided independently during the last leg of the flight (non ballistic trajectory). No one is safe. Such thing however makes sense only as a prelude to the war since AC will be wiped out in the matter of hours (according to the US admirals) and have no value in global conflict.
More on Syrian war at:
https://contrarianopinion.wordpress.com/syrian-war-update/
This should make it obvious to everyone that the neocon/Zionist dream of starting an Apocolyptic nuclear war in the Middle East (or the Ukraine) has utterly failed. The US is, in fact, being given the bum's rush and simply kicked out of of the area, leaving nothing in the carrier's wake but a dead petrodollar and a Russian/Chinese/Iranian umbrella of containment finally clamped tightly over Israel. Unfortunately, the die is cast, and all this will soon come home to roost in just a few weeks in the form of the Mother of All Credit Collapses. The good and the bad is of course, arriving in equal extremes.
....early withdrawal due to lack of stamina......
Map showing the range of Kalibr-NK cruise missles when fired from Russian ships in Caspian Sea (right circle) and Black Sea:
http://orientalreview.org/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/1444394612_466959_o...
Above taken from this article:
http://orientalreview.org/2015/10/13/kalibrating-the-foe-political-impli...
Ha ha, the Donald Cook story seems to be true after all...
The Persian Gulf is a precarious place for aircraft carriers and other large naval vessels. The confined space of the Gulf, along with the relatively slow maneuverability of these large vessels makes them extremely vulnerable to cruise missiles and other weapons, which Iran learned during the Iran-Iraq war. Iran has invested in highly maneuverable, small vessels which are ideal for navigating in the confined spaces of the Persian Gulf. In addition, Iran has fortified its litoral coast line with thousands of cruise missiles. It is worth recalling that in 2006, Hezbollah hit an Israeli SAAR-5 Missile Corvette off the coast of Lebanon with a cruise missile supplied by Iran. Link: israelbehindthenews.com/an-analysis-of-the-hezbollah-anti-ship-missile-strike-the-attack-on-ins-ahi-hanit/4892
The Carrier must rely on it's escorts ability to shoot down anti shipping missiles. Even short range sub launched ones. But the new modern fast torpedoes a sub may fire. Those are hard if not impossible to defeat. A Carrier is so huge and long, it can't turn and comb a torpedo launch,, even of warned by escorts that a torpedo is on the way.
What's the point of trying to annoy China right now? Not only are the people in control of the US Government evil, they are also quite stupid.
Just imagine if they actually force the Chinese to fire upon them. Sure narrative for war, but what happens next?
1. China dumps US treasuries and ceases trade to the USA. 2. Inflation soars in the USA and shelves run dry as the Dollar dies and supply chains break. 3. USA issues war bonds: another form of monetization overnight and you remove liquidity from the system combatting inflation. 4. Deal with unemployment by drafting thousands of civilians while you pump the military budget to infinity. 5. Suspend the elections in favour of keeping the Commander in Chief for the imminent threat and kick off Jade Helm to suppress the anti-war protests. Even if the USA does all of those things, you're still talking about fighting China and in all likelihood Russia too with a society in chaos.
That's an all round pretty shit plan for a country that's on the precipice economically and with it's military might in question. Maybe that's exactly what Obozo wants to do, reestablish their dominance through giving the Chinese a bloody nose in the South China Sea and give the economy the good old war steroids. Except I don't think it will go the way he planned militarilly or economically. I'm sure the Russians will give the Chinese some of that sweet EWar to completely embarrass the US. They wouldn't even need to fire a shot, just disable those fancy digital systems and take photos of the ships drifting dark in the current. Economically, I don't think you can control such extreme forces.
" and with it's military might in question"...who's? USA's? Shit, Forrest, doubt that.
I clicked on the map, it lists the carriers and major navy ship locations.... 90% are in home ports, and just LHD2 all by itself in the persian gulf, nothing anywhere near europe. Add the deployment off Chile and it's a very defensive posture. I wonder why? Surely a few of those other ships must be seaworthy, or do they have the same systems as the Donald Cook when they got buzzed by the Russians last year in the black sea?
If the russian emp stories are true the ac are like fish in a barrell.
You should read Escobar's article to understand, why Theodor Roosevelt was withdrewn.
Say Hello to My Cruise Missiles
"The New Great Game in Eurasia advanced in leaps and bounds last week after Russia fired 26 cruise missiles from the Caspian Sea against 11 ISIS/ISIL/Daesh targets across Syria, destroying all of them. These naval strikes were the first known operational use of state-of-the-art SSN-30A Kalibr cruise missiles. All it took for the Pentagon was a backward look over the shoulder at the flight path of those Kalibr missiles -- capable of striking targets 1,500 km away. Talk about a crisp, clear, succinct message from Moscow to the Pentagon and NATO. Wanna mess with us, boy? With your big, bulging aircraft carriers, maybe?
The best the Pentagon could muster, apart from widespread apoplexy, was NORAD commander Adm. William Gortney telling the Atlantic Council Russian long-range aviation and long-range cruise missiles present a new "threat" for US strategic homeland defense. The Russian cruise missile threat is a "particular challenge for NORAD and for Northern Command." Oh, really?
Talk about a New Great Game-wide understatement. A case can be made that Russia's military development over the past few years has put Moscow generations ahead of the US. In case of a Hot World War 3.0 -- and nobody, apart from the usual Dr. Strangeloves, could possibly want that -- missiles and submarines will be the key weapons, not US-style monster aircraft carriers.
Once again, assuming the Dr. Strangelove scenario, the only possible US response if the going gets tough would be to launch nuclear ICBMs; but then Russia's air space will be sealed by S-500 anti-missile missiles, carrying 10 interceptor missiles each and unable to miss on any American ICBM."
Conclusion: I think any war with Russia is out of the question for Pentagon, at least right now. However, they will still try to break Russia by sending jihadists and arms to jihadists. And one can't say, if they may start WWIII with China instead, which is also stupid, but perhaps they hope Russia would not join? Or China will have to show some similar powerful surprise to be left alone on its islands?
"In case of a Hot World War 3.0...missiles and submarines will be the key weapons, not US-style monster aircraft carriers."
Very true. The carrier is ideal as a mobile airfield to support ground operations in third world countries; not so good for defeating a peer-level competitor in actual naval combat.
"Russia's military development over the past few years has put Moscow generations ahead of the US"
Very false. The USN enjoys massive superiority in terms of submarines and guided-missile surface ships. The US can accomplish this even while wasting huge amounts of money on carriers because it spends 7x more than Russia on the military (which it can afford to do since the US economy is 8x larger than Russia's). Russia will never have conventional superiority over the US - take that to the bank. It's simply a matter of money.
Now, China?
That's another story...
Spending 5,7,10,100 x "what Russia Does" does not equate to getting a similar increase in ROI.
America is corrupt from the top down, especially where the MIC is concerned, and ZH alone regularly exposes the extent and depth of this nepotism and corruption. Never make the mistake of "Dollar for Dollar" comparisons with the efficacy of others' spending, especially Russia, which has an amazing track record of getting things done - things that "US Experts" stated were "impossible" - the Caspian Sea Monster (Ekranoplan) being just one example, as is the unexpected performance (and accuracy) of the Kaliber LACM.
Russian military aircraft are already far, far cheaper than the US equivalents, with comparable (or better) performance. They are certainly getting a far better "bang for their buck", and then there are all those cases of "missing billions" or more dating all the way back to the 9/11 incident (and before). Whilst there is some doubt as to the magnitude of Rumsfeld's "Missing Trillions" ( http://www.cbsnews.com/news/the-war-on-waste/ ) , there have been many more exposes of wastage on a pretty grand scale.
Since the collapse of the Union, Russia has had to learn to "do more with less", and the bare fact that they CAN, is pretty telling. America has always had the "luxury" of largesse, so the need to produce "better for less cost" in MIC land is completely alien - the F-35 JSF being a rather telling example.
So, it is not at all impossible, or even unlikely, that Russia could develop a superior conventional force to the USA. Right now, "The Rest of the World" is seeing just how effective a TINY Russian force is in "combating terrorism" - in comparison with the lack of effect shown by over a year's US "action", and the "Rest of the World" is rapidly re-evaluating their assessment of "The Indespensible Nation".
"Spending 5,7,10,100 x "what Russia Does" does not equate to getting a similar increase in ROI."
There's no reason to assume that Russia gets a higher ROI.
"America is corrupt from the top down, especially where the MIC is concerned"
As is Russia
"Russian military aircraft are already far, far cheaper than the US equivalents, with comparable (or better) performance."
American 4th generation fighters are substantially cheaper than their Russian counterparts, probably because of economies of scale (the US has produced far far more of them over the years). As for 5th generation fighters, the American one is obscenely expensive, true, but the Russians haven't produced one at all. There are only a handful of prototypes. So, we simply don't know, about price or quality.
"...just how effective a TINY Russian force is in "combating terrorism" - in comparison with the lack of effect shown by over a year's US 'action'"
That's a reflection of American motives, not a lack of ability on the part of the US military (hell, the Danish military could smash ISIS easily if it were so inclined - they're a ragtag militia with no air force). The US doesn't really want to destroy the rebels, at least until after the rebels have ousted Assad (that being the entire purpose of American involvement in Syria).
Definitely they are getting that aircraft carrier out of there due to the cruise missile threat. I wonder if tensions are ratcheting up though not because this carrier might traverse Spratly region. Does anyone else think tensions are high with China due to Exercise Malabar going on right now? It used to be a yearly bilateral drill with the US and India. But this year Japan entered the Exercise which is ongoing till October 20.
The Rothschilds aka America/Nato pulling back! clearing the area!? the devil in me says nukes are about to fly.
Who is to say that the terrorists just didnt leave them strewn about? They are terrorists after all. Te ultimate in ied technology. some bombs are beetles and some bombas are dragonfies. god help us all.
Whatever happened to the core idea of America? We stay out of foreign conflicts. The government is focused on what's best for the American people and not on this insane "grand chessboard". The government has an army only to protect America and not to meddle in other nations. Politicians were meant to be part time workers and not careerists in DC. It's really very simple. Protect the borders, sound money, peace, prosperity and good relations with all. What the hell went wrong?
nothing is wrong, Murikistan is just exceptional now.
"What the hell went wrong?"
The political class lost the plot a very long time ago, if indeed they ever understood it.
People with their own agendas but who don't understand what they're doing represent a very dangerous mix.
The guy at the top sure knows his stuff.
As a former sailor I am gladdened to see the Navy putting hard research dollars into frickin' lasers. The anti-ship missile is about to become obsolete itself.
Prudent Move.
Things can escalate; and if the SHTF, TEAM_USA will have problems getting past the Hormuz.
RUS's Caspian Cruise Missiles woke them up. Add IRN's small subs/manned Torpedoes, new ASMs, Silkworms, and any SAMs (rigged to be SSMs), and considering their aircraft can refuel in flight, one can see how it makes sense to keep them out of there.
The fact of the matter is........... we have already contracted out the Syrian war to the Russkis. So, its not like we need to keep the USN Roosevelt there.
If a traitorous president and his cohorts came on the scene, saying, "Rapidly as we can, let's bankrupt and destroy this country before they catch on to us - let's do it from the inside out, ripping up their entire system, let's tear it to the ground!" - I don't see how such a group could do any better than president Obama and company have done! I don't know how they sleep at night.
Long after they are gone and we are on the hook for the trillions of new debt they piled on our backs!
Traitors have been in control in Washington long before Oama came on the scene. Not least by prioritizing Israel's interests ahead of America's in deploying US power and wealth.
What is the state of nation ?
CabalA$$lickerLiarDemonicObama : 'I need urination'