Why Do We Have Wars?

Tyler Durden's picture

Presented with no comment...

 

 

h/t flash at The Burning Platform

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jaap's picture

don't forget the MIC

BullyBearish's picture

Well done...should be required of every parent to have this "sit down" with the child the bankers want to use as cannon fodder

Billy the Poet's picture

Because government's only tool is the gun. A system based on violence must create violence.

 

"Men who are free to produce, have no incentive to loot; they have nothing to gain from war and a great deal to lose. Ideologi­cally, the principle of individual rights does not permit a man to seek his own livelihood at the point of a gun, inside or outside his country. Economically, wars cost money; in a free economy, where wealth is privately owned, the costs of war come out of the income of private citizens — there is no overblown public treasury to hide that fact — and a citizen can­not hope to recoup his own finan­cial losses (such as taxes or busi­ness dislocations or property de­struction) by winning the war. Thus his own economic interests are on the side of peace."  -- Ayn Rand's The Roots of War, 1966.

Clint Liquor's picture
Fuckin' A......................And B and C!
Keyser's picture

Funny how a single cartoon can sum up the true nature of things so succinctly... 

Itch's picture

"Funny how a single cartoon can sum up the true nature of things so succinctly... "

 

That's why the nazis loved using them.

1033eruth's picture

You're an idiot.  Why?  Because this is so damn easy to figure out that only an idiot would still come up with bullshit.  Defense budget is $600 billion for 2015.  If you weren't so retarded you would understand that Uncle Fraud has to spend taxpayers money before it can come back in the form of PAC donations.  Weapons acquisition is one of the best methods for laundering PAC donations.  The F-35 for example.  

When you watch all those candidate commercials on TV.  Remember, retard, it is taxpayers money that is funding it.  Stop thinking of bribery, aka lobbying as non-existent.  IT IS NOT!!!!   It is what makes our political machine operate.  What the FUCK does it take to make you recognize this?  We conduct wars simply for this reason.  To recycle money back for reelection campaigns.   

LetThemEatRand's picture

"Men who are free to produce, have no incentive to loot; they have nothing to gain from war and a great deal to lose."

One of Ayn Rand's most obviously and objectively (no pun intended) wrong tirades.  Private bankers and arms manufacturers have been profiting from war for as long as we've had both.  Not to mention that there is profit to be made from the resources that belong to others before they are taken by force.

Billy the Poet's picture

So you believe that a socialist banking scheme and arms production at the behest of the state are "productive" activities?

 

The Ten Planks of the 
Communist Manifesto
1848 by Karl Heinrich Marx

 

5. Centralization of credit in the hands of the state, by means of a national bank with state capital and an exclusive monopoly.

stacking12321's picture

you're not thinking this one through very clearly, LTER.

how exactly do bankers and arms dealers make money from war?

could it be that their customers and the source of their income is government, hm?

without a government, what do you think would happen to their business?

 

LetThemEatRand's picture

I actually agree with you.  The problem is that human beings form groups, and whether by choice or force, governments have existed for as long as human beings have.  Ignoring that fact and basing an ideology around the absence of that which is inherent in human nature is sophomoric or just childish.

And Ayn Rand was a Zionist who advocated for a strong military, by the way.

Billy the Poet's picture

As always you refuse to admit the difference between groups formed by voluntary participation and those formed by coercion.

LetThemEatRand's picture

As always, you refuse to admit that almost all governments before the United States existed were formed by force.  I'm speaking of reality as demonstrated by all of human history.  You read some books about a better way.  I like the idea of a better way, but all of history teaches us that it won't work.

Billy the Poet's picture

"If man was meant to fly God would have given him wings."  -- LTER, circa 1902

LetThemEatRand's picture

I'll give you this, Billy.  If mankind ever develops a machine that makes whatever you want out of thin air, maybe we could have your world of no force and agression.  Unti then, sociopaths will take what they want, and enlist others to help them do it.  Even then, I'll bet some sociopaths will just take control of the make whatever you want machines and use them to make big guns to make the rest of humanity bow down before them.  Because they are fucking sociopaths.  And then the rest of humanity will need to form groups to try to take the machines back.  And we'll be right back at this discussion.

Billy the Poet's picture

I'll give you this, Billy.  If mankind ever develops a machine that makes whatever you want out of thin air, maybe we could have your world of no force and agression.

 

There is no such machine but there is something that can lead to a similar end in a more practical manner. It is called the human intellect.  When informed individuals can educate other individuals as to the fact that voluntary cooperation creates more wealth for everybody while government coercion can only lead to the redistribution of whatever wealth remains after a destructive war then we'll be on our way.

The biggest obstacle to this is not the oligarchs themselves but the otherwise intelligent individuals who refuse to cast off their chains.

 

When you said:

 

As always, you refuse to admit that almost all governments before the United States existed were formed by force.  I'm speaking of reality as demonstrated by all of human history.  You read some books about a better way.  I like the idea of a better way, but all of history teaches us that it won't work.

 

You correctly indicated that there can be changes in the way individuals are organized despite previous history. If you can see the historical progress from tyrannical monarchy to a democratic republic why do you suggest that any further progress is impossible?

 

"I HEARTILY ACCEPT the motto, — "That government is best which governs least"; and I should like to see it acted up to more rapidly and systematically. Carried out, it finally amounts to this, which also I believe, — "That government is best which governs not at all"; and when men are prepared for it, that will be the kind of government which they will have." -- Thoreau

LetThemEatRand's picture

"Give me something to believe in."  - Poison.

Billy the Poet's picture

 

 

"Don't try to change me or rearrange me
To satisfy the selfishness of you
I'm not a piece of clay to mold to your moves each day
And I'm not a pawn to be told how to move
I'm sorry I'm not the fool you thought would play by your rules
But to-each-his-own philosophy.

Let me be, let me be,
To think like I want to
Let me be, let me be
That's all I ask of you
I am what I am and that's all I ever can be"

-- The Turtles

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xav6C6YyLU

Tall Tom's picture

 

 

 

 

On the side of a hill in a deep forest green

Tracing a sparrow on snow crested ground

Blankets and bed clothe the child of the mountain

Sleeps unaware of the clarion call

 

On a side of a hill a sprinkling of leaves

Washes the grave with silvery tears

A soldier polishes and cleans his gun

 

War bellows in scarlet and blazing battalions

Generals order their soldiers to kill

And to fight for a cause they've long ago fogotten

 

Are you going to Scarborough Fair?

Parsley, Sage, Rosemary and Thyme.

Remember me to one who lives there

She WAS once a true love of mine

 

WAR SUCKS..FOR EVERYONE...EXCEPT THE BANKERS

 

It is a RACKET. It makes the fucking Bankers rich off of the blood and suffering of the injured and dying.

 

Does any of the nonsense that you and LTER debating really matter?

 

War is so fucked up. I know that both of you can agree with this.

herkomilchen's picture

"That government is best which governs not at all"

Truer words were never said.  People have been violently ruled for so long and propagandized so effectively that even now they adamantly insist on having a master.  Vehemently arguing forced subjugation is necessary for health/safety/order/peace/wealth/feeding the poor/educating the children/building the roads.....  They clamor to bow some higher authority labelled "government" which is nothing more than some other ordinary men, laughing.

o r c k's picture

There's something much worse than a "wish machine" LetThemEatRand,  It's one of the unintended products of the wish machine: "The monsters from the ID".

(Forbidden Planet)

Lockesmith's picture

Slavery has existed for 99.99% of human history, but thanks to straight WHITE males, it has been virtually eliminated. "That's how we've always done it" is an argument for moral cowards.

Calmyourself's picture

Go unionize your employees llibtard.

TheReplacement's picture

The people who connive to place others into situations where they can be used to kill and steal from still others are not men.  They are demons and should be dealt with as such so that men know what awaits them if they allow themselves to be possessed by them.

But seriously, even if they are human they are evil psychopaths and you cannot apply a simple stricture to such extreme outliers to justify dismissing it.  Look at socialism.  If you applied the same technique you might conclude that socialism works because of a few outliers with unique circumstances (hello Norway and all your black bubbly) when the vastest of vast majorities fail miserably and often violently.

There are exceptions to every rule.  Delving deeper...  If said demons/psychopaths were not intentionally creating the conditions that put other men into positions where looting and war look to be better prospects than the status quo then we might have some pretty interesting results. 

Chris88's picture

Billy:

I'm not sure why three government parasites downvoted your comment.  Rand's comment there is spot on, there is zero economic value add by building shit to blow it up and murdering people.  Anybody who can't grasp that simple comment is a Grade A moron.

StychoKiller's picture

It may be a zero-sum game, but SOMEONE is profiting at everyone's expense!

Billy the Poet's picture

Hi Chris88.

The state propagandizes in many ways. Some people support war because they fall for the jingoistic claptrap of "bad cop" militarists. Others support war less directly by believing that the state and only the state can create "social justice" and so they fall for "good cops" like Obama who can kill without conscience while bearing a "Peace Prize."  Public schools and media lead people to avoid individual thought. This supports the state and ensures that the violence of the state will continue against targets both foreign and domestic.

Escrava Isaura's picture

 

 

Why do we fight?

 

“In times of stress the genes assume control and reason disappear.” — Reg Morrison 

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1qJENhVdgXI

 

 

 

Billy the Poet's picture

Well, September 11 was stressful for everybody and helped usher in a whole new era of destruction but the US (and other colonial powers as well) have waged war on small countries for a majority of its history, In many of these cases the populace wasn't even aware that such wars were taking place let alone being stressed out by them.

Escrava Isaura's picture

 

 

September 11, 2001?

 

Is this the best you can do?

 

Americans don’t know stress, Buddy.

 

"The General population doesn't know what's happening... and it doesn't even know that it doesn't know." — Noam Chomsky

 

September 11, 1973:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1973_Chilean_coup_d'%C3%A9tat

 

Billy the Poet's picture

You said that stress causes people to support war and here you cite the stress put upon the supporters of Allende in Chile. Is your point that Allende's supporters then ran around fomenting wars due to that stress?

Escrava Isaura's picture

 

 

First, I wrote “Why do we ‘you’ fight?’

 

Second, I used Chile’s September 11 because, as I wrote, Americans don’t know stress. And even less history. And you prove my point. 29 thousand people were detained and tortured in Chile. 30 thousand had to leave Chile. And the terror went on for 13 years. All supported by America.

 

My final point

 

By Chris Hedges: A public that can no longer distinguish between truth and fiction is left to interpret reality through illusion.

 

When opinions cannot be distinguished from facts, the world becomes a place where lies become true, where people can believe what they want to believe. This is the real danger, far more pernicious that stereotypes.

 

Decayed civilizations always make war on independent intellectual inquiry, art and culture for this reason. They do not want the masses to look into the pit. This obliteration of “false hopes,” requires an intellectual knowledge and an emotional knowledge. The first is attainable. The second, because it means that those we love, including our children, are almost certainly doomed to insecurity, misery and suffering within a few decades, if not a few years, is much harder to acquire.

 

 

Billy the Poet's picture

 

 

 

First, I wrote “Why do we ‘you’ fight?’

 

No you didn't. You wrote:

 

Why do we fight?

In times of stress the genes assume control and reason disappear. — Reg Morrison

 

And then you followed up by saying that Americans are not stressed but Chileans are stressed leading to the logical conclusion that you believe that Chileans have no reason and act aggressively.

 

 

Americans don’t know stress.

Of course Americans know stress. We are human animals too.  If you think that being oppressed by the US government from afar is stressful try living directly under the boot of the tyrant like we do. For example, does this person look stressed to you?

https://i.guim.co.uk/img/static/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/red/blue_pics/20...

 

 

And even less history. And you prove my point. 29 thousand people were detained and tortured in Chile. 30 thousand had to leave Chile. And the terror went on for 13 years. All supported by America.

Of course I am aware of what happened in Chile. Just because you imagine that I don't know about it has no bearing on my actually knowing about it.

 

 

When opinions cannot be distinguished from facts, the world becomes a place where lies become true, where people can believe what they want to believe.

You mean like when you express the mistaken opinion that I don't know history when in fact I'm well versed in that subject? Why engage in the very behavior which you claim to oppose?

False_Profit's picture

A true understanding cannot begin until the correct verbiage is used.

It's not about profit-the bankers create the currency we use!  They can, and do, create "profit" at will.

 

It is about CONTROL. Pure and simple.

 

Their currencies are the puppet strings of us humans.

It is about the domination by the dark side of the force.

It is about a denial of the God [insert name here] given INDIVIDUAL SOVEREIGNTY of each one of us.

If we do not exercise our individual sovereignty, we are but merely MINIONS.

Store the fruits of your labors in their 401k's...they control it.

"Buy" your properties...they control them.

Drive your petrol fueled vehicle...they control the supply.

Watch your electronic entertainment device...they control the mass produced content.

Breathe the fresh mountain air...they [will] control the carbon credits.

 

"It is in vain, sir, to extenuate the matter. Gentlemen may cry, Peace, Peace but there is no peace. The war is actually begun! The next gale that sweeps from the north will bring to our ears the clash of resounding arms! Our brethren are already in the field! Why stand we here idle? What is it that gentlemen wish? What would they have? Is life so dear, or peace so sweet, as to be purchased at the price of chains and slavery? Forbid it, Almighty God! I know not what course others may take; but as for me, give me liberty or give me death!"

Gott mit uns.

 

Escrava Isaura's picture

 

 

Obviously that we’re talking in circles. And that you don’t get it.

 

First: The gene point was to bring attention to our animal (survival) instincts. Unless, of course, you are a follower of Jainism; because, for what I read, their religion overcame this animal spirit.

 

Second: Americans, because of our (two car garage/the bible tells me so) lifestyle, are the main cause of global stress. Especially in South America and Central America. Does the Iran-Contra scandal, just one example, that killed thousands of Christians in Central America ring a bell?

 

My answer: No. It doesn’t. Because they have no clue about these issues.

 

Again, don’t take my word for it. Ask the people you know about the US funded Contras in Nicaragua, and the Jesuits priests killed in San Salvador by US trained forces.  

 

Billy the Poet's picture

Obviously that we’re talking in circles. And that you don’t get it.

 

As you've already discounted everything I might say before I even say it I'll let you chase your own tail from here on out.

Gusher's picture

Oh...so it is Jamie Dimons fault. Got it.   

Slomotrainwreck's picture

...should be required of every parent to have this "sit down" with the child

How about reading a bed time story to the kid? We don't need no stinkin' badges; coersive governments, police, taxes, jails, courts, legislation, etc. The free market manages all circumstances of wrong doing.  Consider the Non Agression Principle. 

Step by step instructions: Here -or- Here

You're welcome.

MsCreant's picture

Regarding this:

Well done...should be required of every parent to have this "sit down" with the child the bankers want to use as cannon fodder

They do wait a little longer for the "where do babies come from" talk, like preteen at least. 

They are both talks about the mechanics of "getting fucked." 

wisebastard's picture

dont forget you MEDS...........

Femme Fatale's picture
Femme Fatale (not verified) jaap Oct 30, 2015 8:47 PM

How these psychopath Jews Conquered the West => http://wp.me/p4OZ4v-2mp

A Nanny Moose's picture

MIC is a byproduct of the elite psycopaths. Let's face it, if the people in charge could do it on their own, in the free market, they would not need all the guns, and would not need war.

Nostradumbass's picture

 

 

End of history lesson. No need for 8 more years of the bullshit. Let's study something worthwhile now students...

conscious being's picture

Shhhhh! Don't tell Jim. He did say the banks own the government.

Tallest Skil's picture

Oh, grow up, you namby-pamby leftist pacifists. War existed before globalization and will exist long after we hang them high. Pretending otherwise is mental illness.

Billy the Poet's picture

“I do not believe any policy which has behind it the threat of military force is justified as part of the basic foreign policy of the United States except to defend the liberty of our people,” Taft wrote. It is that comment, along with his 1949 vote against joining NATO, which explains why Taft is usually cited by Republicans today as an example of the so-called bad old days. Taft also didn’t want the United States to have a peacetime draft. The domestic consequences of an aggressive foreign policy, he warned, would lead to the curtailment of civil liberties."

 

https://mises.org/library/robert-taft-and-his-forgotten-%E2%80%9Cisolati...

 

 

"Robert A. Taft, in full Robert Alphonso Taft   (born Sept. 8, 1889, Cincinnati, Ohio, U.S.—died July 31, 1953, New York, N.Y.), Republican leader in the U.S. Senate for 14 years (1939–53) whose espousal of traditional conservatism won him the sobriquet “Mr. Republican”

 

http://www.britannica.com/biography/Robert-A-Taft

Tallest Skil's picture

>“I do not believe any policy which has behind it the threat of military force is justified as part of the basic foreign policy of the United States except to defend the liberty of our people,” Taft wrote.

>Taft also didn’t want the United States to have a peacetime draft. The domestic consequences of an aggressive foreign policy, he warned, would lead to the curtailment of civil liberties."

And I agree with that. That's exactly what I'm saying, in fact.

Chris88's picture

Socialized defense isn't leftism?  I'm confused.  Government bootlicker.