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Dogfights Next? US Sends F-15 Jets To "Counter" Russian Air Force Over Syria
When the Obama administration announced it would soon put 50 (er... 100 we guess, since soldiers generally have two feet) boots on the ground in Syria, the US media immediately asked the wrong set of questions.
As we noted in “US Sends Troops To Syria: Here Are The Questions The Media Should Be Asking,” the Josh Earnest presser was nothing short of a joke, as the media peppered the Press Secretary with question after question about whether the President had gone back on his promise (made to the American people at least 16 times) to not put US ground troops into combat in Syria.
Of course that completely misses the point. And here’s why:
There have been boots on the ground in Syria and Iraq for years and indeed, the public seems to have forgotten that just five months ago, US commandos executed a raid in Syria that purportedly killed Islamic State’s “gas minister” (and yes, that’s just as absurd as it sounds).
Additionally, Washington has made no secret of the now defunct “train and equip” program for Syrian rebels - clearly, the American public hadn’t thought very hard about who was doing the on-the-ground “training.”
Finally, there’s no telling how many CIA operatives and black ops have been running around in Syria assisisting Saudi Arabia and Qatar’s proxy armies from the very beginning.
Given that, there are two questions everyone should be asking: 1) how does Washington plan to explain to Ankara that the Pentagon is set to embed US ground troops with the YPG in Syria and fly sorties from Incirlik in support of those ground troops when Turkey is literally flying from the exact same airbase on the way to bombing the exact same YPG forces with whom the US is set to embed?, and 2) how does the US intend to make sure that Russia doesn't end up "accidentally" bombing US positions?
Well, one way to answer both of those questions is to send US dogfighters to Syria. The Daily Beast reports:
The U.S. Air Force is deploying to Turkey up to a dozen jet fighters specializing in air-to-air combat—apparently to help protect other U.S. and allied jets from Russia’s own warplanes flying over Syria.
Officially, the deployment of F-15C Eagle twin-engine fighters to Incirlik, Turkey—which the Pentagon announced late last week—is meant to “ensure the safety” of America’s NATO allies, Laura Seal, a Defense Department spokesperson, told The Daily Beast.
That could mean that the single-seat F-15s and the eight air-to-air missiles they routinely carry will help the Turkish air force patrol Turkey’s border with Syria, intercepting Syrian planes and helicopters that periodically stray into Turkish territory.
But more likely, the F-15s will be escorting attack planes and bombers as they strike ISIS militants in close proximity to Syrian regime forces and the Russian warplanes that, since early October, have bombed ISIS and U.S.-backed rebels fighting the Syrian troops.
Well, kind of. We could always be wrong, but it seems unlikely that The Pentagon is going to send F-15s into battle against Russian fighter pilots in western Syria. What's pretty clearly going on here is that Washington is sending just enough air support to ensure that once the Russians and Iranians secure Syria's major cities in the west, the US has the capability to shoot down Russian jets should they threaten whatever the hell Washington's spec ops are trying to accomplish near Raqqa in conjunction with the YPG. Anyway, back to The Daily Beast:
Seal declined to discuss the deployment in detail, but hinted at its true purpose. “I didn’t say it wasn’t about Russia,” she said.
Russia’s air wing in western Syria is notable for including several Su-30 fighters that are primarily air-to-air fighters. The Su-30s’ arrival in Syria raised eyebrows, as Moscow insists its forces are only fighting ISIS, but ISIS has no aircraft of its own for the Su-30s to engage.
The F-15s the U.S. Air Force is sending to Turkey will be the first American warplanes in the region that are strictly aerial fighters. The other fighters, attack planes and bombers the Pentagon has deployed—including F-22s, F-16s, A-10s and B-1s—carry bombs and air-to-ground missiles and have focused on striking militants on the ground.
In stark contrast, the F-15s only carry air-to-air weaponry, and their pilots train exclusively for shooting down enemy warplanes. It’s worth noting that F-15Cs have never deployed to Afghanistan, nor did they participate in the U.S.-led occupation of Iraq. The war in Syria is different.
And while that is indeed interesting, the following is nonsense:
Incirlik and its growing contingent of warplanes is the key to a new northern strategy in the U.S. campaign against ISIS, an unnamed Pentagon official said on Oct. 30. “One of the principal things we will do to put pressure in the border area and into Syria is, quote, ‘thicken’ air operations in northern Syria.”
“That means we want a greater density of planes striking. We need a greater density of intelligence assets developing targets. You—the White House announced A-10s, which are already on the ground at Incirlik, and F-15s forthcoming on—in Incirlik, to help in the counter-ISIL campaign,” the official added, using another acronym for ISIS.
As we've said on too many occasions to count, if Washington and Ankara (both of which are flying from Incirlik) were that concerned about ISIS in the "border area", then they wouldn't have explicitly forbidden the YPG from advancing on ISIS west of the Euphrates.
In the final analysis, Washington has absolutely no idea what's going to happen now that i) the PKK has suffered a bitter electoral defeat at the hands of Erdogan in Turkey, and ii) it's just a matter of time before Hezbollah advances on Raqqa supported by Russian warplanes and so, the Pentagon is sending in the dogfighters to make sure that in case something goes horribly wrong, the US can shoot down whoever happens to be in the sky before the "50" spec ops get bombed.
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That and Transgender beauty contests.
More and more each day, the true character of the US gets painted, described, written, and documented. And it's not a picture you would want to hang in your living room.
Kind of like one of John Wayne Gacy's clowns.
The USSA .gov IS John Wayne Gacy........
I had the same thought today also with Manson and Dahmer.
Inserting obligatory...
USA USA USA
chant here.
Fuk Ya! We're number one!
Exceptional.
Because Caitlyn.
The Judeo-Bolshevik immigrants from the USSR nomenklatura are busy foisting their poisonous values on their new host.
The old heros, like General Robert E. Lee are pushed to the curb, replaced by the ultimate modern hero, Bruce Jenner who is the embodiment of the white male ideal which the Zionazis envision for America. All you have to do is cut your own balls off and you too can be a modern hero and be extolled in the Zionist media.
What a clusterfuck.
Cluster bombs are ruled illegal by the Geneva Convention. Clusterfucks are not.
Cluster bombs sure get used a lot for illegal weapons is all I can say.
Amen. You know the Hague would never want to upset their benefactors.
There is going to be SHTF on the first shootdown.
This is getting more fucked up by the day. God help us all.
Prepare for a catapult in WTI.
The F-15 Eagle is the most powerful (reasonably available) fighter jet the U.S.A. has.
Too bad it fails so miserably to the Russian Su-35.
It's a slam-dunk loser.
The U.S.A. productionality deficit is showing its weakness now.
Don't worry. The US will send the F35, as soon as Turkey install the chillers to keep the fuel cool.
hahahaha
I'm sorry to say, the US Air Force confirms your statement. Let's go have a few beers.
Don't know enough about either plane or its total capabilities, to comment one way or another.
But... using the Working Assumption (as a starting point for hypothesis-testing) that the SU-35 is indeed better, then Russia should not back off from exerting its air dominance over Syria -- is what cold hard logic demands. Especially if they are backed by their 'vaunted' Ground-to-Air defenses.
Thus, any backing off by Russia is an undeniable 'Tell'. So... we'll see.
Maybe the strategy is to support the Kurds to such an extent that they can take over more territory from and fight the Syrian government. Since the US and allied backed Islamic militants are being defeated, this is Plan B.
But Turkey is at war with the Kurds. So that doesn't work...very good....
Good point. I was thinking the Kurds could be encouraged to take over more Syrian territory in return for giving up their effort against Turkey.
Also, aren't the US and allies already supporting the Kurds?
Syria will not get divided. Didnt you get the memo from vienna talks ?
Psychopaths, every damn one of them.
Psycho or not, they're desperate. On top of that, I don't see this happening unless there are some dumb cunts telling the pentagon and Obama that we can "win" with a first strike. So perhaps delusional should be added too.
This whole scenario is false, surely. The US would surely not be stupid enough to shoot down a Russian plane.Yes, yes, the US is controlled by psychopaths - but, sheesh! Even psychopaths know not to get into combat so far from home. A lust to kill has its limits!
http://barlowscayman.blogspot.com
The psychopaths in control are not the ones that die on foreign soil.
Long gone are the days when the king led his armies and fought alongside his men.
I'll bet you a Litecoin that not only they can shoot down an SU-35, but that they will.
Russians may be masters at chess, but no one beats Americans at Poker.
FYI... Reading historic documents relating to US-Soviet negotiations, it was the observed US position that the Soviets would always take a hardball stance and then huff & puff (bluster), but always back off at the last moment. Clearly they sucked at Poker back then, and not so sure they are good enough to beat the Americans at bluffing.
US combat aircraft are slaves to AWACS. Much like the philosophy of inundating a carrier with antishipping missiles you can bet that the Russians will go after the command and control ship and when it goes offline then we'll see who has their shit in one bag. And to those who think that Israelis are super aces; they faced some real third stringers as far as pilots go no matter what the aircraft was. The Russians have freaked US commanders out with their domination of the electronic warfare theatre, blanking NATO screens and jamming comms at will. That makes me think that US pilots should be ready to find that their countermeasures aren't effective and the Russian shit is.
Good comment, now dump the handle..
Talk is cheap like the worthless paper we "sell" at gun point!...
Now after Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan,Libya, Ukraine and Syria...
Walk the fuckin Walk and back the "pie hole" up!
Is it just me? Or are we being set up. Cuz it sure feels like a set up to me.
Zionjoo false flag coming before New Years
-
Obama --> Thesis
Putin --> Anti-Thesis
?? --> Synthesis
The Russian Federation has my permission to blow-the-F15s-out-of-the-air on sight.
Give em' one for the old Gipper, eh.
IRAN still has those F-14 Tomcats to fight the Russians with.
NIXON 2016
Those old F-14 Tomcats Iran has pack a pretty mean punch.
Actually, we should get more of those.
It's Turkey who is going to feel butthurt about all this, first. The reds are talking about 'talks' to throw Assad under the bus. They're not going to mess with the Kurds and their imbedded US special ops. Remember, the first gulf war and the no fly zone was all about Sadamm killing the Kurds. Russia and Turkey are epic and long term enemies. Installing the Kurds into a crescent of power stops all the crazy shit from marching east towards the Stans. Why would Putin not say, "sure, we can deal with a Kurdistan..."
Read the tea leaves, boys. The only player in the region NOT feeling betrayed by the US? The player we are airlifting weapons to? The player we are sending special ops troops to[and now F-15s]? An ethnic group of 25 million that is actually quite sane and tolerant considering the region? A group that has oil and occupies a good chunk of Turkey, Syria, Iran and Iraq? Talk about nation building. Russia gets ports on the coast and the US gets a buffer. Europe gets to clean up the trash. Suddenly have a very large new nation in the M.E. that is more than happy to deal with the West and not be so damn fundimentalist. Win Win.
Only the Turks actually see the Kurds as 'terrorists'. Everyone else in the region just sort of kills them and keeps them down. The US recognizes the Turkish version of the Kurds as 'terrorists' then teams up with them in Syria and Iraq. It would aslo really piss Iran off as they have a big swath of territory there, too. You watch. The US is putting all their chips on the Kurds and and telling Turkey, FU. Russia won't lift a finger on the Kurs{they see them as a rational and good player} and will tell Iran FU.
Russia won't lift a finger on the Kurs{they see them as a rational and good player} and will tell Iran FU.
Tell that to the Hezbollah/QUDS on the ground providing coordinate(s) to those "finger heavy" guys flying above them that have cleared out in less than a month what took the Israelis and U.S. 3 years to assemble! And just what exactly did the U.S. and Israel assemble and accomplish in those 3 years???
It's all about the timing...
Where the U.S. is now and has been vs. where the Russians are after 25 years of keeping their mouths shut, keeping out of entanglements (when they aren't provoked) and rebuilding a very capable fighting force.
At the end of the day where militaries are concerned it's the leadership that controls them and the caliber of the people you put in uniform... After where we've been and what we've done the last 14 years Ukraine and Syria being the end of the rope for the U.S. military I sure as fuck wouldn't want to be wearing a stars and stripes flag patch in this operation given the stakes and the quality of the people we have now driving it!
Nothing more nothing less than a PR circus stunt to send home bagged bodies to tell the American people look at what Russia and Iran did to us!... Need volunteers. And when that doesn't work a draft!
Of course this is making some very broad sweeping assumptions that nothing else happens in an asymmetrical context outside this "sand box" and that all the players play nice without escalation!
Right?!!!
The Kurds are the MOST coherent group in the entire area. All the other countries have infighting factions. It's a thrid party that can be trusted and has good track record.
I can't even imagine how Russia could explain off attacking the Kurds and risking WWIII. They won't, is my belief. If Iran gets defacto Iraq all the way up to Lebenon, they might be pacified. Kills Turkey in the baking of the recipe.
Explain to me how Russia could attack the Kurds? They fight all the bad guys better than anyone else. They're not really looking to overthrow Assad, their aim is indepenence not running Syria, Iraq or Turkey.
Holy shit the Kurds are in 2 major disparate factions just in Turkey.
They dont all have the same language or religion even.
And they surely know that the US and Israelis value them only as pawns.
WHY would Russia or anyone else risk catastrophe by engaing US forces that have .. and are now actively regrouping in Kurdistan? Everyone else has told us to bugger off. The Kurds are pretty much the only damn 'friend' we have over there right now.
Because retard there is no kuridistan legally. They are an ethnic community living in Syria for years. Syria will not get divided at any cost , it was already decided in Vienna Talks. Go learn some facts.
US should respect International Law which they dont and they must pay for their consequences and negligience
US gets a buffer??? A buffer between what?
Are the Atlantic and Pacific oceans not enough of a buffer??
A stable group that they can deal with. Southern Iraq is now Iran. Western Syria and much of Lebanon is now Iran. We've pretty much pissed of the Sauds and the Sunnis. Why not establish a new state of 25 million people out of four nations we did the same with a 100 yeasr ago?
pretty much everyone else hates us, over there. making a kurdistan would be our best option.
Russia and Iran would need to demonize the Kurds before they could make war on them. That's very tough to do. All those countries have been doing pretty much nothing but opressing and killing the poor souls.
Before that ever happens, A political 'restructuring' will happen in Syria. Assad will get a retirement home in Sochhi. The US will be so far up into the Kurds, that they will demand more Automony in all four nations.
The Kurds wll keep the crazy fundies in check.
I can be wrong, like anyone else. But, i suspect Russian and Shia will stop not too far outside of Aleppo. There will be no 'encounters' of war planes.
Syria is hostile to the US.. so is Iran, Russia, Lebenanon, and seemingly now, Iraq. What can we do? We can't just throw a tantrum and push the 'button'. We can't send a million troops over.
The US is playing the last card it has left. Alligning with the Kurds. putting troops and planes in with them in order to keep a presence.
and you guys forget.... either Russia or China could put the US out of it's misery in a day. Russia would merely need to default on its debts.
this is akin to when the US ran the UK out of Egypt and the Suez canal. that's all.
US send F-15C to counter Su-30? Are you really that MAD?? That sukhoi designed to counter F/A-18. Not F-15.
If US stupidly wants to dogfights Russian jets? Then i suggest that pilot makes a written LAST WILL, before, they fly that coffins..
Got "one name" and a "number" that follows it for those F-15-C jockeys
"Metrojet" "9268"
Wouldn't want to be you after that along with the 270,000 Syrian dead and 8 million displaced in that Country since you started it in 2011
Think about it!
P.S.
Hope you aced your SERE training classes!!!
Good Morning Vietnam......again
A place where US troops were not appreciated nor were they appreciated at home for fighting for 'freedom', Napalm, Agent Orange and such were used, psychos massacred villagers.
Most soldiers had no clue what they were fighting, except 'commie' and 'gook' were often times mentioned.
Death, injuries, loss of homes for what?
Decades later, the 'fortunate' Vietnamese have the honor of making $200 sneakers for pennies a day to export to the USA
Nahh....
We're truly dreamin if we think that it will be another "Vietnam". After what happened last year in Ukraine and last Sunday with the Russian civilians in that commerical airliner labeled for "target" America is doing it's own slow walk of death.
This is the war the worst of the worst medicated Pentagon planners always wanted but never got after 1951...
Be careful what you wish for moving forward!
Did Jeb Bush start-up the flight school? You know those ISIS.
When are Americans going to take the government back by force? Or are they content to let the Neocons keep it at Numba 1.
America Fuck YA!
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGQaH3-LK54
Wait till an American pilot gets roasted alive in a cage after bailing out of his plane.
Won't happen. The cage roasting part. More likely a quiet handoff.
F 15's will crash cause they are old and then blame Russia
US will have them painted in IDF colors and attack Russian and Syria to make a false flag
Russia should bring some Foxhounds out to scare them.
Makes no sense to send F 15's unless they are planning on something strange.
I suppose there will be a lot of S300's S400's in and around Syria now... and later in Iraq...
F15 can't outrun them... Total denial of airspace... What is this crap about US can take out Russian airplanes... What do you think is on those Russian ships?? They can knock out anything in israel or turkey as we speak...
THIS SHOWS THAT a 1972 designed F15 is all the US has for AIR superiority. What a joke. The Russian Frogfoot ground attack planes without bombs can take out F15's no need to call on the big boys...
You guys just don't think strategically. Russia has never attacked nor will they attack the Kurds. Putting US troops and planes in there assure this will be the case in the future. Russia hates Turkey, doesn't trust Iran/Iraq and doesn't see the Kurds as bat shit crazy. The Kurds have basically been the rape victims, over there, for centuries. Russian people wouldn't even put up with that.
There are 25 million of them spread over 4 nations. They have proven themselves to be the best fighters in the region. They are the original Aryan People who settled in Anatolia from Europe. They don't tend to behead Christians or other odd sects. Russia will consolidate power on the coastal regions. The US will consolidate power in the newly formed Kurdistan. Everybody else will feel betrayed and just need to deal with it. It's not like we've not arbitrairily redrawn the borders before.
aryan as ethnic group is hypothetical
indo-european is grouping, but language based
more correct is semite, as descndants from Sem Genesis 10
Relying on genesis is fucking absurd.
The stage is set for for a war unlike any war in history...
http://www.raptureready.com/soap2/ungurean71.html
After reading all of these comments, there's one thing everyone seems to leave out; GOD and Jesus Christ! Ephesians 6:12 "For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms."
Russia has the ULTIMATE advantage!
I get so tired of the bad logic of some of you bible thumpers. Was at a local country funeral, yesterday. In one sentence the pastor was going on and on about how 'it's not goodbye... she's up in heaven waiting on you" ONly to be followed up by God sacrificed so much by sending his son down here to have a bad weekend. A: a long term terminal illness would have been far more suffering than a bad Friday. B: If the whole goal is to go ahead and die and go back to where the getting is good, then wasn't it mission accomplished? C: If you were the Son of God and were aware of it?... knowing you're going to die but fully aware, without faith, of where you going? Why would you really give a shit? Seems like going to a better table .
it takes a lot of lying to yourself to believe all those fairy tales - kind of like believing into what FED preaches.
the hell they don't.... it's the largest reason behind human conflict. "we're all certain we are going to a absolutely FABULOUSY better place! so..... let's condemn or kill anyone who doesn't believe us."
actually it's the non believers that drink so much
their spirit feels doomed by the stupid stubberness that the mind refuses to deal with, that is, consequences for behaviour.
so they drink till they bleed out the mouth, their rectum and pickle their brain
just sayn
You say that as if getting back home to Jesus quicker is a bad thing? If the world sucks so badly, and is so evil... why not go ahead and go home? Leave all us sinners behind? ...just saying.
pretty sure the story goes that Jesus was the life of the party and turned the water into wine...... just saying.
hello?! pretty sure the story goes that the wine is the blood of christ? when did it get replaced by grape juice? damn babticostals....
downvote me all you want... I asked that very question back in Southern Babtist Vacation Bible School? They tried to feed me some bullshit line about how the water back then wasn't so good, so they needed to make grape juice into wine..... 'cause you know.....couldn't make potable liquids in any other way than the long ass and complicated process to make booze. Booze is all over the bible. yet the latest sect hates alchool.... even while the very act that of the eucharist involves alcohol.
you wonder why folks no longer 'believe'? it's 'cause your stories no long make any fucking sense.
Used to believe. Then when I was about 11 I reached the age of reason.
It is all donkey shit.It is something that was dreamed up by some sand dwelling donkey fuckers a very long time ago.
It is not even Europe's native religion. It is like a mental plaque. How many centuries and great minds did Europe lose because of that idiotic superstition?
Dsty is not Christian.
Neither is TF.
More proof USA is defending and organizing ISIS. Russians are just being too mean to the poor lil ISIS headhunters. What a clusterfuck of foreign policy. Traitors.
Let's cut the crap, posturing and head-faking. Enough Foreplay!
All that Russia has to do, is to attack any and all Rebel positions: Shoot first, ask questions and grandstand later. Why? Because...
Russia is there legally (at the formal request of the Syrian government), the US is not. Given that the US is there illegally, they will have to take their chances accordingly.
Christ, even a 1st year law student can argue and win that case. And any good student of Ed Bernays can front-run that story.
"This business will get out of control, it will get out of control and we'll be lucky to live through it..."
or unlucky as the case may be
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JultKcPcKjk
love tht vid! HUg thAt terrAin, bABY!
GO EAGLES send in the ReApers
Yeah them dual engines are sweet!
Shit, one of our clumsy Shuttles can fly faster in 1st gear!
Not impressed.
Nice vid rusty, the best part you can see the Chemtrails come off their wingtips..
S
I'd pay an ounce of gold to see Vlad and Barry go at it in a cage.
Someone had to stand up to the western military/banking cabal. The build up to WW3. And everyone's fast asleep.
Syria is so small, they will be banging into each other...
Surely Turks will cause some kind of false flag... or the jews... trouble is a brewin.
Can't wait till China gets in there... give these Chinese some practice, come on China..
I wonder if we'll make it to Christmas without full-blown war. = (
I would have liked to have seen Montana.
US fuckers are trying to get Vlad to bleed off his assets into Syria...
Don't fall for this trick Vlad... just a few more S300 units will do the trick.
It is better to sacrifice USA now rather than let them start WW3... the wimp population there are content to maintain their status so they won't do shit against the evil that run it.
CIA FED NSA IRS and US dollar need to be destroyed...then if anyone says how they are the chosen ones or indespensible people - then destroy them too.. enough of this shit.
Don't worry- Putin has already won this one- the US and the West are stuck in an unwinnable gambit. The can't get the territory they need without starting a major shooting war. Starting that war would cost them all their remaining credibility and almost certainly incite their allies' populace into open revolt, if not their own. As is, they openly admit supporting "moderate" syrian rebels, are openly allied with Saudi Arabia and Turkey, two of the worst human rights abusing regimes in modern times, and are dangerously close to being publicly and openly recognized in the West itself as directly supporting ISIS/AL Qaida. Though I truly believe that the West has already lost the PR war with the next generation of humans, it truly risks putting an exclamation point on that statement with it's recent and upcoming moves here in Syria.
Europe will not fight for Ukraine or Syria, nor can it afford to. The US will not either at any rate that requires a true sacrifice of itself, for that would risk awakening the populace from it's carefully-planned slumber. The Wests corrupt and anemic allies in Turkey and Saudi Arabia, (continually) contending with their own internal problems, will not be able to dislodge Russia and Iran from Syria. The West, unable to justify the level of intervention required for victory to it's own populace, will ultimately fail to remove Assad from power, and will ultimately fail to achieve their oil pipeline ambitions. With a concordant loss of relative economic power, it will be ultimately rolled back geopolitically by the emergence of China, Russia and India as major global economic powers in that neighborhood of the world.
If I had 10 seconds with Putin.
Id tell him to flood syria with tv news reporters and film makers from all over the globe.
And time for chinese troops.
The Anglo Zionist Empire is the Dark Side.
Don't worry- Putin has already won this one- the US and the West are stuck in an unwinnable gambit.
To add to this, the West is simply morally wrong. Honest moral humans will be attracted to the more appealing "mate."
Many Europeons are looking on and cheering Russia. As time goes on, the game tilts further into BRICs hands.
BRICs are also at the beginning of their money cycle. The BRIC system has not built up debts yet, so plenty of investment money is avaialble for uniting Eurasia. Once the ME is quiescent, the Eurasia project will begin full swing.
American and its environs will decline to a steamy third world hodgepodge. If Zionisim is ejected, then America has a chance to join in the future. Otherwise, America will continue to misfire and be on the wrong side of history.
America was usurped fully in 1912 by Zionist Banksterism. Russia's brain was parastized by Bolsheveiks in 1917, but Russia has managed to purge their parasites, and employ new systems to keep them away from organs of power.
America has not gone through "200 years togther," nor lost an estimated 60 million people to gulags.
Let's hope American's can revert to their true constitutional principles, otherwise the future is not good.
http://truedemocracyparty.net/2012/05/most-banned-book-in-the-world-200-...
Not just "bleed out", but get overly focused on and preoccupied with fighting on two fronts (Ukraine, Syria).
In the meantime... the US is marching forward with its Trade Treaties (TPP, TTIP), which will ensure the continued hegemony of the USD (as the Reserve Currency of said treaties), and also with aggressive space development (next gen super rockets, sending man to Mars, Lunar Base).
Real of faked, if Russia and China fall behind, they are hosed. If they over commit on their budgets, they go bankrupt. The US is truly playing the Full Spectrum Dominance Game, and they are playing for keeps. Russia and especially China need to face this and deal with it on a proactive, not reactive basis. Russia needs to get China to commit more overtly, and in a way that they cannot easily back out. Which China (being sneaky) will avoid at all costs, of course.
My bet is that China is two-faced and cannot be trusted: They are simply pursuing on two tracks, thus hedging, and seeing which track turns out for the best. The US knows this, but not so sure everyone else does.
TTP, TTIP failed projects. A dance with the Walking dead.
You are right about China.
I have a friend whose son does a lot of agra business with Chiina. He does not trust them at all.
Syrian forces should take out US special forces operating in Syria - kill these terrorists along with their ISIS subordinates. Shoot down any Turk, Jew, or US plane as well.
ya'll are pretty gullable if you don't think the Rooskies have nothing to do with this mess
the good guys that are cleaning it up heh?
60 years of world terrror involvement and training, then suddenly they are angles
the US propaganda machine is nothing compared to the Rooskies
ZH is evidence of that.
ya what ever NEOCON lover...
Well, ISIS is a neocon proxy. The Israel Uber Alles crowd always flocks to the Syria stories to cheer on ISIS.
http://landdestroyer.blogspot.com/2015/11/washington-post-confirms-isis-...
Like I said, all that Russia has to do, is to "Shoot first, ask questions later". I.e.,
There are no 'moderate' rebels -- especially none that can be discerned from the air. They are all, for all practical purposes, part of ISIS. The Syrian official position is (or should be) that they can come to the Negotiation Table or face death in the field. To use an analogy: You can sue in court, or take your chances in a shootout with Law Enforcement.
The Russian AF will thus target any and all Rebel positions, irrespective of who supplies them. And, given that Russia is there legally (at the formal request of the Syrian government), and the US is not, the US has no legal or valid PR position to complain about its two-faced efforts in the region.
In the meantime, I'd use scout-drones 24/7 over Rebel/ISIS regions, to get real-time info on positions, movements, supplies, etc. Anything that moves along any transport or battle lines that looks suspicious, get shot by killer-drones or planes.
And you'd think that the Syrian+Russian forces would be shrewd and devious enough to lure the Rebels toward weak-looking supply-line places, and then ambush/attack them there. Assuming that the Russians+Syrians+Hezbollah+Iranians have enough combined bandwidth and coordination going on, to do all these things.
So.. The shit is way out of control. There is no profit in what IS is doing.. ever!
There is profit for those who supply weapons and munitions.
There will be profit for those who will supply materials and expertise for the rebuilding effort.
There will be profit for those who will supply food and other basics of life once the fighting is over,.
There will be profit for those who move in with wholesale and retail businesses after the fighting is over.
News flash, dipshit: The USSR fell over 20 years ago. 60 years my fucking ass. This is history that you fucking lived through. If you cannot get that simple fact straight, then you should abstain from commenting on anything that has to do with what is going on over there. Tell me, who has been militarily involved in MENA for the past decade and a half? I'll give you a hint. It wasn't Russia.
Let me tell you a little secret: Vlad could be the most vile human to live during our lifetimes, yet the way the US is doing things, the most insidious thing, the most damaging to the US, that he could do is to play it straight.
A load o crap Dusty
This whole mess started when Retarded Ronald made a lot of promises to Gorby that RR's VP, the pimp meister Bush, had no intention of keeping.
He could have cleaned out the poisonous nest of neocons but when they told him how much moola he could expect from the Saudi king if he got rid of Saddam, he kept them around. By the time Clinton got there, they were embedded everywhere like rats in a landfill. Or more like a culture of bacteria that's killing itself as it expands.
Hey, that's where we are now.
A hasbara troll whining about people not buying the Zioprop, eh?
You should have disappeared in a puff of irony.
60 years of world terrror involvement and training,
You're talking about the USA and Israel, right?? It's a lot longer than 60 years pal . . . .
If CabalA$$lickerLiarObamma has his way, the only race that will survive , will be the humble Africans
World war III , inevitable
Its all working just like as told in Bible NT
---------
Wake up Russia
Russia is committing a big mistake to assume that America will support Russia in elimination of terrorist groups similar to cooperation in WW2.
Russia should realize that :
1. America is very selfish & self centered
2. America assumes that it itself is the ONLY superpower
3. America assumes that Russia (& China) are only weak developing countries
4. America assumes technological superiority
5. America intends to further break Russia with the policy : In order to make omlette(money) , the egg(Russia) must be broken.
6. America has no moral values left (with its head os state a homo & drug addict)
7. American people will not rise against American govt. becuz they are always in shock over 9/11
8. ONLY NUCLEAR ATTACK CAN CHANGE ATTITUDE OF AMERICA
and many more....
Russia must prepare for battle especially the nuclear one, enforce a no fly zone over Syria, establish & enforce administration of controlled territories.Form a military coalition with like minded i.e. Iran, Syria etc and also, time has come now to station nuclear weapons in Syria once the situation comes under control becuz ,
The only way to deter evil America & it euroPeon followers & allies is :
TO STATION NUCLEAR WEAPONS IN MIDDLE EAST.
America is a piece of shit.
why down vote me, you know I am right...
American Government must be overthrown... along with the crazy military commanders, and of course, the BANKS
The 'BIG PLAY' is against Edogan.. can't anyone figure this out.. The Russians have embedded advisers with the Kurds, the 50 US troops are with them.. NO more bombing from the air of the Kurds.. that is the story. No S-400s flying. The Turks now will have F15 escorts on their bombing missions and they will hit the designated targets (as assigned by the anti-IS coalition).
perhaps you are right, Kurds should get their own nation or autonomous region... but this does not change the fact that US gov is evil and has been for a long long time.
It's time to eradicate US power in the world once and for all.
If the US and the West want to continue to use Incirlik air base, I dont think they should be giving ultimata to Erdogan.
"America is a piece of shit."
Sorry, had to junk you for making a low-brow, no-value comment.
no problems, at times I get very angry at US Gov
Omega, American Government, fixed it for you..
Very nice and welll put
Seems like they are setting them up to lose the dogfight.
That rings true. Send in the old dogfighters they don't mind losing as a pretense to further action.
The false flag attacks within the military were more successful anyway (like bay of Tonkin).
Hopefully our boys won't have occasion to shoot anybody. But if they do, I'm sure they will come back with plenty of Russian pelts on the wall.
Another Israel Firster insipid troll, rooting for ISIS and the Oded Yinon Plan.
'Your boys' are mostly busy shooting unarmed civilians in occupied Palestine, and waiting for Uncle Sugar to fight more battles for them before they feel safe killing more Syrians and Lebanese and stealing more land.
Ersatz Israel Uber Alles!
Russian brings air against ISIS, US bring air to defend ISIS. Got it.
That map really makes it plain, that nat gas and pipelines aside, it's all about controlling the water. WATER. It explains Israel's big hurry, I guess. I always thought they had time on their side, home again...get along with the neighbors, lead by example, everyone prospers, golden age...seemed like a good strategy to me. Not 'trash the neighborhood and piss everyone off.' It just didn't make sense. But if you are running out of water.......
Ah Borski you don't get it, Pushki is out of cashki to build your flying tank.
https://medium.com/war-is-boring/russia-s-stealth-fighter-is-in-serious-...
12 sheesh thats it?!
I know the F-15s are old, but they are a primo design. When the engines were rolled back, the plane had to be tied down in a 30 mph wind or it would try to fly.
Accelerating straight up they had a power to weight ratio greater than 1. Without bombracks, air to ground systems and hardpoints they are light and maneuverable as hell. Good avionics too, if a little dated.
A modern fighter's turning ability is limited by the g forces on the pilot. An F-16, F-15, or a MiG 29 can turn harder than a human can stand. No matter how advanced the new Russian fighter, the pilot can only take so much. Most Air to air engagements are fought at a distance anyway.
It all comes down to the radar, missiles and pilot competence.
I spent 1983 stationed at Incirlic, that was a weird place. Your ass is hanging out over there, you're almost in Russia.
Spot on. The F-15 ECM and radar package is always being updated. That's where the advantage comes in. Also, the US pilots are usually in better physical condition. The F-15 is old and that's one of its strengths. The IAF had a well known incident where in a mid air collission an F-15 was still able to fly missing a wing. http://toocatsoriginals.tumblr.com/post/99068614904/skariaxil-toocatsori...
Russians should be paying attention right now.
what's your bet on F15 vs S400 missile... they only go 11,000 mph
OM, I agree with you 100% that the S400/500 will make mince meat of an F-15 (or and F-35). No doubt about that.
But toe-to-toe, mano-y-mano, I think the F-15 comes out on top of any Russian fighter including the Su-30. This is because
1.) US Pilots are younger, in better physical conditioning, and get more flight time
2.) Avionics and Radar packages are better in F-15
3.) The US knows what the Russian pilots will do before the Russian Pilot does thanks to that 'souka' Adolf Tolkavchev https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Adolf_Tolkachev
But toe-to-toe, mano-y-mano, I think the F-15 comes out on top of any Russian fighter including the Su-30. This is because
1.) US Pilots are younger, in better physical conditioning, and get more flight time
2.) Avionics and Radar packages are better in F-15
Sorry to bust your bubble pal but:
Regarding item #1 - What gives you the idea that "US Pilots are younger, in better physical conditioning, and get more flight time"??? Did you hear this from a DOD press briefing or something? The Russians have been making a huge effort in the last 5 years or so to recruit and train a whole lot of pilots and the people that are being trained are not 40 year olds - they are in their 20's. All of the elite personnel in the Russian military adhere to a very strict regime of physical training that would rival or exceed that of the US military. Russia has also devoted a lot of money for flight training of their "top gun" (i.e. fighter) pilots. Yeah, back in the late 90's and early 2000's your assertion might have been accurate but times have changed big time.
Regarding item #2 - Maybe you haven't been keeping track of recent encounters between Russian and US forces but there is a lot of evidence that the Russian's electronic warfare capabilities are far in advance of the USA's at this point. Two cases in particular bear this out:
I'm a US citizen and obviously don't want to see our planes and pilots put in harm's way unnecessarily. The problem as I see it is the US military is prone to underestimating the capability of Russia (or anyone for that matter) when it comes to their top of the line aircraft and EW capabilities. In many cases their professed superiority in these areas is unfounded.
IMHO if there was a one on one dogfight between the F-15C's being sent to Turkey and the Russian SU-30SM the F-15's would get blown out of the sky. The SU-30SM is faster, more maneuverable (it has maneuvering canards and vectored thrust) and has EW capabilities (Khibiny) that could totally disable the F-15's targeting devices. I for one hope a confrontation like this never happens though because if it does the shit will totally hit the fan (it'll be time to "duck and cover" or better yet, grab your ankles and kiss your ass goodby!).
This is funny because I am normally very much a supporter of Russia - I have spent a lot of time in Moscow. I am here to tell you that eating lots of svine and drinking lots of piva does not make one physically fit. I go to Russia and I just can stop eating and drinking. Also, it is well known that adult males in Russia usually die in their mid-50s. The lifestyle is good but it has its side effects.
on the EW - yes, I am familair with the Aegis incident. However, I still think the F-15 avionics and radar system are more durable than you give credit for. I also think that the US does a very good job of spying inside Russia these days as the country is remarkably open and money is no object for the Yanks and what Russia has now is probably already known to the Yanks.
" " I think US does a good job of spying in Russia because Russia is open and yanks know already what Russia has ". Hahahahahahahah.
Wishful thinking isnt good for health. What a load of fcuking tripe. #Whatever helps you sleep mate. Facts are not your play.
Russia has more spies inside the United States today than it did at any point during the Cold War.
Russian males dying in the 50s is complete bullshit.
However even if they did, that is not who is flying the planes.
YouNger so what ? Did you ask russian pilots age operating in Syria. Younger also means stupid and prone to mistakes more than experienced.
Su-30SM is a multi role fighter just because your f-15 ecm suite was being updated doeant mean russian are sitting with outdated suites. Their planes are also contains upgradable and latest suite and when it comes to Electronic Warfare Russia wins hands down. Little do you know Russia was the first country to use ECM in warfare against Japs.
Avionics and Radar packages are better in F-15. Typical muriturd prejudice statements. Cognitive Dissonance is strong with you.
" US pilots know what Russia will do before they do that " hahahah Wikipedia is the last source you should use as evidence. Yup US pilots know beforehand what Russian pilots will do thats why they literally bumped US plane in Syrian Airspace and your better avionics radar packaged plane with young fighters were unable to see them. Hahah man you amerikans are so deluded a single propaganda drivel on US military and tech is superior goes on air and you shovel it down your asses quiet firmly without checking it. Su-30SM gave your better avionics and radar packaged young pilots flying F-15s a hard time.
But I can see cognitive dissonance is strong with your case so enjoy your prejudiced false facts because whatever sails your boat.
what's your bet on F15 vs S400 missile... they only go 11,000 mph
To use an analogy... It's not the cards you got, it's how you play them that decides who wins the hand or the Poker tournament.
Russians suck at Poker, so they will never go to "Call". The US, OTOH, is 2nd to none at Poker and wins many a weak hand by being a better Player.
The Russian birds in theater arent just more manueverable, their electronic warfare package is formidable, and s400s are in support.
This is bad, and deliberately so.
The MIC needs lots and lots more money - initial engagements will prove it.
Who wins in aerial combat between the U.S. and Russia? Hands down, the U.S. would have won 20 years ago, when promotions were based on proven ability. Now that advancement is based on diversity quotas, and all the straight white Christian male commanders are on the Russian side...
bankers win
Remember when shock and awe started - bombing of Baghdad in the Gulf war - it was on CNN..
I would love to see that happen in DC... and I am not a muslim or a jew...
Soon most people outside the US will want to see this too. Bomb the hell out of America for all the years of suffering it caused to other people.
Germans will cheer, everyone in the EU... people around the world will finally be happy that the evil is defeated...
Then they can send bags of rice and things like that... just like when Japan and Germany were rebuilt...
The only people to pu-vote you on this comment are those who are outside the US.
Those inside are too scared to have the Fed open or expand a file on them. That seems pretty obvious.
Wow.
And the internal cannon on the F35 fired its first shot today.
Check out Bro Nathaniel's new video...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmcoRZfPTKk
nothing will change... if Trump gets in , they will try and off him like they tried with Reagan.
Any critical thinker would have to wonder how a supposedly 'terrorist' organisation like ISIS can declare 'Jihad' on Russia a week ago (this threat can only come via the western media) and release a low grade 'video' purporting to take down the Airbus - Wake up !
These Russians have been murdered by the CIA/Mossad and they are trying to shift the blame onto their 'privately owned' terror group - Don't get caught up in MSM hysteria who always suggest a million and one 'scenarios' !! This incident will change everything ! Russia knows exactly what happened !
Why would any objective thinking American support his government or it's military?
There is absolutely no reason whatsoever.
If you are in the US military - best to resign.
0bama and the rest of the trash in his administration are looking for ways to start a war so they can surrender to Russia and China. This is not a joke nor am I being sarcastic.
Dude that makes no sense. Care to substantiate your point?
Can anyone foresee a way to restore the USA to the constitution in a PEACEFUL way while the banks have all the power over politics, media, and military... along with the money? Is it possible??
And, given that Americans actually like being number 1 and the indispensable people.. so it seems they don't want anything to change.