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'Gold' Spikes Off 2015 Lows As Gold Coin Sales Surge To Highest Since Financial Crisis

Tyler Durden's picture




 

With the 'paper' price of gold are a somewhat unprecedented barrage of selling currently (down 9 of the last 11 days) to 4-month lows, one could be forgiven for thinking that demand for the precious metal is dropping. However, as almost every nation in the world (ex US) is devaluing their currency, The World Gold Council reports that physical gold demand has risen dramatically with US gold Eagle coin sales at the highest levels since the financial crisis.

'Physical' Demand is exploding...

 

As 'Paper' prices collapse...

 

And then spike off 2015 lows...

 

As the latest report from The World Gold Council shows, gold buyers jumped on the new low prices...

"US retail investment demand jumped to 32.7 tonnes, generating growth of more than 200% year-on-year,"

 

"This signaled both a level of interest in gold investment not seen since the global financial crisis, and a level of price awareness on a par with that of Indian and Chinese retail investors. Nowhere was this more clearly demonstrated than in the US, where the US Mint reported rocketing sales of gold Eagle coins."

 

...

 

"Demand for was the highest for more than five years: in volume terms, sales hit 397,000 oz.,"

 

"Demand for newly minted coins surged across all key product lines: sales across all denominations were many multiples of their long-term average levels. Secondary market activity was correspondingly weak as profit-taking slumped in favor of bargain hunting."

Finally - who is buying? It's not just those crazy retail gold bug doomers... Central Banks continue to back up the truck, taking advantage of the 'low' prices...Gold as a reserve  asset remains firmly on the radar

Central banks continue to build their holdings of gold, adding 175t to official reserves.

 

Purchases by central banks and other official sector institutions almost equalled the Q3 2014 record of 179.5t as gold’s diversification benefits were increasingly recognised and sought. A couple of new countries joined the ranks of repeat buyers, the most significant of those being China.

 

The People’s Bank of China (PBoC) confirmed in July that its gold reserves had expanded by over 50% since its last announcement in 2009. At 1,658t, that put China at number six in the global rankings. Subsequently, the PBoC has begun regularly to report changes to its gold holdings and has confirmed an additional 50.1t of purchases between July and September.

 

And in another small but significant step, the central bank of the United Arab Emirates (UAE) confirmed that, between April and September it added 5t of gold to its reserve asset portfolio, having held none since 2003.  The result is that the UAE makes it into the top 100 holders of gold and expands the geographical spread of central bank buyers.

Q3 saw continued buying by regular names, primarily concentrated in the CIS region. Selling was again limited and sporadic.

 

So it makes all the sense in the world that gold 'prices' are testing the lowest levels since October 2009...

 

Charts: Bloomberg and The World Gold Council

 

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Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:50 | 6781727 XAU XAG
XAU XAG's picture

It's not spiking in £

 

It's the currency spiking

 

http://www.24hgold.com/english/gold_silver_prices_charts.aspx?money=GBP

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:52 | 6781748 Publicus
Publicus's picture

Lol, you goldtards are desperate.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:12 | 6781857 greenskeeper carl
greenskeeper carl's picture

this goldtard isn't desperate at all. I helped, a tiny bit, with the coin demand yesterday by buying a little. I do not need gold to spike. Im not planning on parting with any gold, any time soon at least. Im happy to be able to buy at lower prices. Ive long since given up on my mining stocks I own, and will be happy to see these low prices as long as possible.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:17 | 6781902 jakesdad
jakesdad's picture

this ag-tard doesn't really care if it goes down either - yellen can't print it & blankfein can't steal it so as long as hrc doesn't send her winged monkeys to confiscate it I'm perfectly content to keep acquiring at lower prices & sit on it...

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:28 | 6781952 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Look at the whipsaw:

Live Gold 5 Min:
http://www.pmbull.com/gold-price/

Bullard et. al are doing that. How hard is it to believe they don't have proxies making trades off the pre-planned comments. To believe some random academic schmuck can mouth a few words and change the real expressed value of anything this rapidly is naive and stupid, yet there it is.

And of course even more fun:

Live Silver 5 Min:
http://www.pmbull.com/silver-price/

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:40 | 6782014 jakesdad
jakesdad's picture

manipulation?  what manip - HEY!!!  did someone just TWEET a stock DOWN?!?  HOLY F_____G _S__T!!!  sent a swat team over & kick in their mother's basement door STAT!!!

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:11 | 6782227 VinceFostersGhost
VinceFostersGhost's picture

 

 

We don't know nuttin about no manipulation......do we Billy Bob?

 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:53 | 6782470 SSRI Junkie
SSRI Junkie's picture

if you buy gold it's hoarding, if you buy stocks it's investing...lol

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:56 | 6782834 Leopold B. Scotch
Leopold B. Scotch's picture

Then what do we call what CBs do with sovereign debts?!?   The Fed is clearly Hoarding USTs and GSEs! 

 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:22 | 6782983 jakesdad
jakesdad's picture

{beep!  beep!  beep!}  what is printing?

 

alex:  correct!

 

I'll take "low latency electronic front-ru..", er, sorry, I meant "liquidity providing high-frequency trading" for $800, please...

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:57 | 6782845 Dog Will Hunt
Dog Will Hunt's picture

What's with the bowdlerization?  "Fucking shit" is okay.  Now, literally fucking shit, on the other hand, requires a stronger constitution.  

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:15 | 6781882 Spectre
Spectre's picture

My observations are that you are under the age of 35, an IQ just above your shoe size and maybe graduated high school. Guessing a net worth of low $1,000's, if that.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:09 | 6781922 Dame Ednas Possum
Dame Ednas Possum's picture

You over estimate his capability... considerably.

His statement is correct, although not in the way numb-nuts intended.

This gold tard is desperate... to go buy more physical gold and then go boating...

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:22 | 6781928 Bunghole
Bunghole's picture

Still paying off that liberal arts degree and cant afford gold.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:34 | 6781986 greenskeeper carl
greenskeeper carl's picture

he is a troll. I don't know why I even responded to him above. He always posts shit like this and "god protect trump and his family" on every trump article. I forgot that when I posted earlier but now I remember. He won't respond to anything either, so its pointless to even comment on his posts. hes just a troll.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:21 | 6781924 Bill of Rights
Bill of Rights's picture

If you had a clue you would realize it is not us who are the desperate....Dope.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:48 | 6782069 Jonas Parker
Jonas Parker's picture

I just checked over at APMEX. The gold pickin's are a bit sparse, to say the least...

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:26 | 6781929 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

Just keep buying physical.  Little here, little there.  Don't be skipping meals to do it, but keep doing it.  It adds up.

And then keep your freaking mouth shut about it.  

Don't tell your neighbor (who is probably also putting some aside), don't tell your Mom, don't tell the guys at work.  KEEP.  THAT.  YAP.  SHUT.

You aren't going to get rich.  What you ARE doing is taking out an insurance policy against the monetary insanity of central banks around the world.  This is a long term thing, not something that's likely to matter 3 months from now.

Don't believe me?  OK, try this one out:  If your great aunt Edna decided in 1955 she wanted to put $10,000 aside for you, would you prefer she had put $10,000 cash in her mattress for you or purchased $10,000 worth of gold to put in that mattress?  (Hint: the gold would be up multiple hundreds of percent since 1955).  Did I mention that gold also happens to be one of the greatest intra-generational transfer of wealth vehicles available to the average family?  Good.  Because it is.  Zero taxes, zero government interference if you all can play nice together in the family.  

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:31 | 6781966 Pliskin
Pliskin's picture

I'm guessing this guy's aunt Edna slapped him around like an unwanted, ginger stepchild.  Anyone that uses 'Lol' in a sentence is an insecure muppet.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:34 | 6781979 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

If Aunt Edna had put that $10,000 into Berkshire Hathaway (in the 70's) or any of a dozen different stocks or funds, you'd be a multi billionaire today and frack the taxes.  

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:37 | 6782000 greenskeeper carl
greenskeeper carl's picture

that is 100% correct. Different times. Today, now, if you had 10k to put aside to pass down wealth to your young child, would you think buying BH stock or gold would be a better idea?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:59 | 6782073 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

I certainly wouldn't put it into gold. 

My bet is select junior miners and some healthcare.     They are significently undervalued.   I always look at PERFORMING assets, not ones that return zero.   Property is good, but significanlty overpriced right now.  Wait until interest rates rise, property values will drop. 

You need to look at things that people DON'T want right now.   Gold is still high, becasue people still think they want it. 

Put gold into prespective.   The article talks about a few tonnes here and there and 150 tonnes this year to some CBs.  

The world produces 2,400 tonnes of NEW gold a year, that's 200 tonnes a MONTH.  And (almost) none of the existing gold inventory has been used up!!! 

So, over the next 10 years, that's 24,000 tonnes of new gold coming into the world, and only a couple thousand of that being used industrially (and much of that will be recovered).   Now THAT'S a lot of new gold.  Will people just keep hording it until they burst?  or will they feel that they have enough, especially when the price just goes down?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:04 | 6782533 Bazinga
Bazinga's picture

Put on the "proper perspective glasses". It's all about PURCHASING POWER.

 

In 1913 an item costing $20 is now in 2015 selling for $480. Gold was $20 per ounce in 1913. In terms of holding value the gold holder has maintained purchasing power not the dollar holder. In other words I will now yell...

 

That is an increase in the price of gold of some 6,000% as the value of the dollar versus gold has fallen over 90%.

I have no problem buying the gold non-bugs don't want to buy.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:06 | 6782894 Billy the Poet
Billy the Poet's picture

Now THAT'S a lot of new gold.  Will people just keep hording it until they burst?

 

All the gold in the world would fit inside a 25 meter cube. Hardly enough to burst a decent sized backyard.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:33 | 6783026 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

So what's your point?  Of course the value of a dollar has fallen.  It's NOT a commodity, it's a medium of exchange.

Are average incomes the same as in 1913?   You are trying to compare apples with air. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:51 | 6782790 silvermail
silvermail's picture

Double post

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:50 | 6782815 silvermail
silvermail's picture

"The world produces 2,400 tonnes of NEW gold a year, that's 200 tonnes a MONTH.

But: The world demand has 3,600 tonnes of NEW gold a year, that's 300 tonnes a MONTH! LOL.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:46 | 6783096 Argenta
Argenta's picture

Then you just made an excellent argument for buying silver over gold. 

-Argenta

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:45 | 6782044 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

BH as you know it didn't exist in the 1950s (it was still just a textile company, before WB bought it).  And how good a stock picker do you think Edna was, exactly?  The most likely "safe and reliable" stock that Edna would have bought in 1955 was General Motors.  

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:57 | 6782091 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

I know BH didn't exist, that's why I said in the 70's.  

But at that time, I would have put it into property, like my grandparents did.   $10k then, and a million dollars today, and still generating annual rental income, after taxes and maintenance, of about $12k a year. 

What would the annual income be from that stash of gold? 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:50 | 6782269 Dame Ednas Possum
Dame Ednas Possum's picture

And if Auntie Edna had balls she be your uncle.

If you'd put the money on a winning race horse/ lottery ticket blah blah blah...

If if if if if if if...

It's in the past... so you can hypothesise all you want. Fucking pointless.

If you can't work out for yourself the exceptional merit of precious metals in the modern day monetary madness that surrounds us... then tough shit for you.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:29 | 6783000 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

I'm NOT hypothesizing.    My grandparent DID put $8,000 cash into a second house as an investment.   And that house today is valued OVER $1 million and it DOES produce $12,000 a year income after taxes and maintenance.

How much is your aunt Edna's gold worth today and what ANNUAL INCOME do you get from it? 

Edna's gold would be $300,000 today and produce zero annual income. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 16:59 | 6783805 Dame Ednas Possum
Dame Ednas Possum's picture

Yeah whatever...

Loser.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:25 | 6782315 bbq on whitehou...
bbq on whitehouse lawn's picture

One day you will understand the value of mobility and on that day you will wish you didnt.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:30 | 6782693 thetruthhurts
thetruthhurts's picture

So...When is Tresury going to offically run out of gold and close the retail "gold window"?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:58 | 6782850 Publicus
Publicus's picture

Never, there is a glut of gold. Hence the price keeps falling.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 17:27 | 6783914 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

"Haha..Leonard, I've got some Gold!"
"Big deal Jim. I have shares of that too in the Enterprise 1701(k)."
"No, Bones...G-O-L-D, real coins, I had Spock verify them with that machine he uses."
"Moons of Kyros! How much you want for one?"
"They're NOT for sale."
"C'mon, Jim, remember when I got you through Risilian Fever?"
"That was medicine, Bones, this is Finance."
"Can I look at one?"
"Yes, but not too close. This phaser is set to kill."

According to your Native American history, Jim, this is The Yellow Metal that drives White Men crazy."

"Nobody asked you, Spock. Clear out. This is no time for a history quote."
"Let me see the other ones, Jim!"
"OK, but quick! I've got a date with Yeoman Rand at 1700."

 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:14 | 6781939 herkomilchen
herkomilchen's picture

Gold did spike in £.  The USD/XAU chart on that page was being updated but the GBP/XAU chart was not (and now is).

If you do some chart overlays you'll see the fall was all gold weakening. GPB/USD remained flat while both GPB/XAU and USD/XAU fell.

The spike was both gold strengthening and USD weakening.   GPB/USD, GPB/XAU, and USD/XAU all rose simultaneously.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:49 | 6781732 Callz d Ballz
Callz d Ballz's picture

shhhh.......I like buying the "paper price".

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:32 | 6781972 kralizec
kralizec's picture

Crap.  Now everybody knows...

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:50 | 6781738 Seasmoke
Seasmoke's picture

Fuck these moneychangers. The world needs to hang them. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:15 | 6782935 Kirk2NCC1701
Kirk2NCC1701's picture

Are you talking about Western Moneychangers, or the Asian/Chinese variety?  Think...

Q: QUIS BONO?  Who benefits the most from artificially/manipulated low PM prices?  

Think... Who else, but those with lots of USDs and USTs?  And who in the world has more of it than the Chinese themselves?   Who? [tick, tock].

It is therefore a logical inevitability that China fits the CSI criteria more than anyone else: It is the Chinese who have the Motive, the Means and Opportunity to pull this off on a sustained manner.  Thanks to US Prime Dealers, like GS.  It is not at all unreasonable, and given GS's psych profile, it is highly likely that they would Aid & Abet the Chinese in their program to acquire Western gold -- all to gain a dominant foothold in China itself.  It is GS that is the Trojan Horse within China, and working for the Globalist R-Clan.

Blame their well-paid footmen (GS et al) all you want, but it should be obvious who the End-Beneficiaries are.  And note also that recently the PBOC has started moving their gold into private hands.  

Who knows when PM will have equitable value in fiat terms?  It may not be on a timeline or circumstances that benefit the Common Man, if history is a guide.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:51 | 6781744 unplugged
unplugged's picture

gold coin sales - what difference does it make ?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:52 | 6781747 youngman
youngman's picture

we are just a few short months before the Comex is out of real gold...and so is the west for all practical purposes.....then we will see what the real price is....if some guy will pay 176 million for a piece of art....you can bet he has some gold too....

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:56 | 6781767 Max UK
Max UK's picture

Comex will get it from somewhere.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:14 | 6781867 FreeShitter
FreeShitter's picture

CTRL G for gold.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:21 | 6781926 unplugged
unplugged's picture

DOD/CIA will steal it from somewhere.

fixed it

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:37 | 6782001 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

Maybe we can invade Russia.  Rumor has it that they have a lot of gold and mines.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:57 | 6781770 Bioscale
Bioscale's picture

I have been reading about Comex out of gold for years. Who cares about Comex?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:34 | 6781987 RockRiver
RockRiver's picture

Exactly...unless every long decided to take delivery it doesn't matter....

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:57 | 6782120 agent default
agent default's picture

You  are both right and wrong. Long term the COMEX is irrelevant.  That is if you don't count the great default and the rioting mess it will create.  Short term COMEX sets the spot price of gold.  Take your pick, set your time horizon and hedge accordingly.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:59 | 6781785 Bastiat
Bastiat's picture

What is it now? 300 to 1 paper vs physical?  What's the limit? Why does it matter when they can just force settlement in paper ... at their price.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:03 | 6782182 agent default
agent default's picture

The moment they force settlement out in the open it's game over. Not just for the COMEX, reverberations will set the dollar and the US economy on fire.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 17:52 | 6784086 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

"Today, US and French troops seized the gold mines in Mali, after reports surfaced Yellow Cake had been found in one of the mine's unused tunnels. More from Wolf Blitzed at Eleven."

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:03 | 6781798 DeadFred
DeadFred's picture

Puts on GLD will pay 1600:1 if the fund goes belly up by the end of the year. Do you think you have the right timing though.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:11 | 6781849 NoDebt
NoDebt's picture

"we are just a few short months before the Comex is out of real gold"

You could have posted that 3 years ago and it would have been true then, too.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:25 | 6781947 unplugged
unplugged's picture

...few short years or decades maybe....    fixed it

like that really matters anyway - the central planner cartel will commit whatever crime or war to make the price whatever they want to make it - you are living under the illusion that there are markets and that there is "freedum"

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:53 | 6781755 Magnum
Magnum's picture

Reading news written by goldbugs as the market has tanked from 2011, is great entertainment.  

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:15 | 6781884 zeroaccountability
zeroaccountability's picture

Right, because the last 4 years is representative of ALL of Silver price action.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:41 | 6782021 TheReplacement
TheReplacement's picture

You are so right.  I envy your brilliant strategy of waiting until the price goes back up before buying.  Where can we get smarts like that?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:07 | 6782204 oddjob
oddjob's picture

Since 2011, so that's about half the time the MSM has been predicting higher interest rates, even better entertainment.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:47 | 6783106 crazybob369
crazybob369's picture

Please define "tanked". In US$ the value of gold has declined; true. Against the dollar. However, had you purchased gold a couple of years ago in CAN$, AUSS$, EUR, YEN the value of gold in those currencies would have increased substancially (by almot 50% in some cases). And that's the problem of discussing the "price" of gold against a single currency unit; it's meaningless. Especially when said "price" is set, and determined, in a market (paper) that is completely segregated from the actual (physical) market.  Gold (and other PM's) are an insurance policy against currency devaluation. No more, no less.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 15:22 | 6783270 Magnum
Magnum's picture

Good point, in 2011 gold was about C$1400/oz and today's it's about the same.  A$ similar story.  It's still good entertainment reading gold bug stories.  An archive of Kingworldnews.com for example.  

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:55 | 6781759 cpnscarlet
cpnscarlet's picture

Yes, like everything else PM-wise for the last 5 years, this all makes absolute sense and there's nothing we can do about it.

Captain Unactionable Faggot Wild Hair

(A Goldman-Sucks subsidiary of the CFTC)

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 10:58 | 6781779 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

"Smoke 'em while you got 'em, men. That's the last carton."
"Damn, sarge, we're gonna have to get some off the Krauts."

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:00 | 6781786 Xatos
Xatos's picture

Banks are buying gold too, otherwise I'd have to wonder if there were a plan to somehow screw over PM holders too when the crisis comes. But they're buying, so we have to believe we're getting close.

Of course, "close" and "soon" seem to be relative to an individuals entire lifetime when it comes to this crap as opposed to how everyone else uses these words.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:03 | 6781796 MadVladtheconquerer
MadVladtheconquerer's picture

Gold bouncing off its bottom.  Guess it beats bouncing off its head.  So, its time for the latest version of the mother of all gold rallies to begin in 5, 4, 3, 2.....

But, but, but........ China and Russia central banks are buying gold w/ both feet and their central bankers

are sooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo much more smarter than ours and they are brilliant market timers!!!!

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:04 | 6781800 holgerdanske
holgerdanske's picture

physical gold demand has risen dramatically with US gold Eagle coin sales at the highest levels since the financial crisis.

 

Since the financial crisis??? good one!! we are still in the beginning stages of the financial crises proper!

It has been a drawn out long affair, but the reign of the FED is about to end.

You know the story, years of very little happening, and then you get weeks, days or hours, where everything seems to happen at once.

We are on the verge of one of those moments, me thinks!

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:32 | 6781970 Arnold
Arnold's picture

Sociopaths are not overtly conscious of their suicidal temperaments.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:05 | 6782192 agent default
agent default's picture

You are right.  We have seen nothing yet.  We take stability, any sort of stability of anything for granted.  We are about to get  a very nasty wake up call.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:05 | 6781808 cbaba
cbaba's picture

Deflation is eating corporate profits, the CB's will print more and more to stop this and at some point they will lose control and at that moment nobody will be selling gold.

The credit generated by CB's fractional system is everywhere, the most important thing in peoples lives to buy houses, cars is credit, credit backed by nothing.

At some point this credit backed by nothing will disappear, sheeple will understand that only way to buy something is to save first. You can only save gold, not paper promises of CB's.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:07 | 6781817 pachanguero
pachanguero's picture

Bitgold.com selling %1 over spot!

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:08 | 6781825 katchum
katchum's picture

Only, these are Q3 numbers, Q4 is much much weaker.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:19 | 6781916 bluskyes
bluskyes's picture

source?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:23 | 6781933 katchum
katchum's picture

1- look at U.S. mint sales for gold

2- look at premiums

3- look at SGE withdrawals

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:16 | 6781890 holdbuysell
holdbuysell's picture

It's puzzling how a 'pet rock' can garner so much attention from central banks. I'm sure the WSJ is all over trying to solve that one. /s

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:18 | 6781906 GLA
GLA's picture

Anddd.... it's gone.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:51 | 6782081 HungryPorkChop
HungryPorkChop's picture

Comin' to a bank near you...  A favorite South Park clip and it's gone!

 

https://youtu.be/-DT7bX-B1Mg

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:20 | 6781917 moonmac
moonmac's picture

20 cases of Jim Beam handles is my gold. I'm glad I stocked up on Smirnoff too. They stopped making their glass bottles with handles. They'll be useful carrying fresh water when the SHTF! The cases of Everclear is my platinum. It can be used as fuel if needed. I'll trade you a bottle for a gold coin when we all have to barter to survive.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:27 | 6781949 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

I'll trade you a bottle for a gold coin when we all have to barter to survive.

 

That's the point the bugs don't get.  When SHTF, it's a buyers market for gold, not a sellers market like it is right now.     Gold is a luxury that's purchased in good times when there's lots of disposable income,  but, like all luxury goods, it's next to useless in bad times.    People want necessities, not luxuries.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:42 | 6782029 moonmac
moonmac's picture

My GF asked why we have so much firewood. I said because we have a huge backyard. I'm getting another cord this weekend.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:43 | 6782033 Bunghole
Bunghole's picture

So in your feeble mind, stackers put every penny into their shiny and nothing into necessities.

C'mon over to my house, Copernicus.

Water, booze, cigarettes, TP, feminie products, dehydrated food, grains, guns, ammo, water filtration, backup genset, fuel, solar, gardens, chickens and of course, PMs.

Not everybody is so one dimensionsal as you think

 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:58 | 6782139 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

I'm not fully versed in his previous stance on gold, but I'd bet that he's not advocating a single asset approach.  Reckon he owns more than one of the vital assets you listed.  The actual feeble minded folks are those still out there running the hamster wheel, oblivious to the upcoming storm.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:58 | 6782141 moonmac
moonmac's picture

I agree. That's why I buy shiny stuff for pennies on the dollar at Goodwill. Almost everyday I find silver or gold behind the glass case.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 17:56 | 6784101 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

I think most ZHers are Hedged with numerous products needed in hard times.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:55 | 6782117 RockyRacoon
RockyRacoon's picture

A big thumbs up on that comment.  A concept so few understand.  That's why it's a good idea not to have all your financial eggs in one basket.  Spread out the wealth in several different forms, but be sure you understand the implications and limitations of each one.  If you don't fully control each then you don't really have any. Whether it be gold, ammo, land, a full larder, or art work, know the asset inside and out.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:56 | 6782121 Panafrican Funk...
Panafrican Funktron Robot's picture

The idea with gold is to easily store the value of your productive labor outside of the FRN system, which is likely to suffer further significant devaluation as it moves towards competing with other currencies as a reserve currency (this has been in play for several decades now, but has accelerated since the birth of the Euro and will suffer further losses once the yuan is made official).   In a true SHTF scenario, I agree that any kind of money would be of limited barter use when you need to take care of basic necessities, however, it would still be of significantly higher barter value than, say, a collection of digital information in a bank acount or brokerage firm.  Considering that the most likely iteration of such a scenario would be a temporary or longer term electricity blackout (really, as long as there is electric power, the risk of a SHTF scenario is remote), wouldn't you rather have gold than your non-functioning ATM card or digital wallet?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:12 | 6782218 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Why do people always assume my choice is paper (even digital) over gold?  It's not.  It's other forms of barter (money) and production of needed goods and supplies and needed services.  

I was in the middle of the NE blackout in 2003, when 55 million people in the NE US and Canada were without power for a few days.  After 12 to 24 hours, almost all telephones and cell phone systems went down, becasue most run on battery backup, not generators. 

What was valuable?  Cash, water, gasoline, generators, propane (for BBQs), batteries, flashlights, transportation and perisable food (milk).     

 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:45 | 6782252 herkomilchen
herkomilchen's picture

Gold is not a luxury item.  It's money.  Money is a specialized tool of production.  Remarkably effective at facilitating specialization of labor and trade among groups of people.  This is an extraordinary multiplier of a man's productivity.  This is true in good times and bad.

The alternative to money, barter, is heinously inefficient by comparison.  Anyone attempting to live by barter is heavily incentivized to graduate to using money and a market instead.  Any traders able to mutually agree on a form of money for trading will become vastly more productive because of it.  That is especially important in dire circumstances where even a small amount of extra productivity can mean the difference between life and death.

Dried food, ammunition, and everclear make better barter items, but not better money.  Yes, in an immediate aftermath of a disaster where there is no recurring trade and no reliable consensus around what constitutes money, having good barter items would be more immediately valuable than having good money.

But this state of affairs wouldn't last long.  On the order of weeks maybe.  Months tops depending on how bad things were and how holed up people had to remain.  In prison camps prisoners promptly abandon barter in favor of using cigarettes as money.  Likewise, promptly after SHTF groups would start forming to specialize labor and conduct recurring trade among themselves.  They would need a good form of money to facilitate this.  For providing money service, no consumption goods would work as well as gold.

You could produce more wealth and use it to obtain more of these goods by doing all your trading in gold and then trading gold for the goods.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:25 | 6782655 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Gold isn't money, it's simply a commodity, and a luxury one at that. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:03 | 6782527 Dickweed Wang
Dickweed Wang's picture

The cases of Everclear is my platinum.

 

With my home still I can make 10 gallons of the stuff in about a week or so . . . . 90% plus ethanol.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:20 | 6781918 arbwhore
arbwhore's picture

Be careful not to drift into KWN mode. Bounce is now fading. $1030 target.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:22 | 6781927 Demdere
Demdere's picture

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/11/11/dynamics-of-national-colla...

The mechanisms of hedging are failing. If you can't hedge, how can you have a financial system leveraged 37-1? Based on sovereign bonds, 60% of which will default.

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/07/28/lebowski-enlightenment-3/

With timeline:

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/10/24/lebowski-enlightenment-9/

A question I can't resolve is what happens to interest rates when the Fed is paying off maturing bonds with created electronic fiat.  $5T / year in new money looking for hard assets quickly and then circulating after that first spending.  It will want to leave the US, currency controls to prevent that.  OTOH, high rate of inflation, who would loan at a lower rate?  $1T new currency  in a recession ==> 10% CPI of 1980.  $5T + currency controls in a worldwide greater depession ==> ?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:25 | 6781937 JPMorgan
JPMorgan's picture

There is plenty of trashy worthless cash awaiting lower precious metal prices.

The only question is when to pull the trigger.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:28 | 6781955 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Wait until interest rates rise.  

You ain't seen nothin' yet. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:33 | 6781980 honestann
honestann's picture

The federal reserve is trapped... they won't raise rates until the dollar is already burned toast and precious metals prices are already in orbit.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:02 | 6782177 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

So, why are PMs dropping?   Oh right, it's a worldwide conspiracy. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:36 | 6782340 Dame Ednas Possum
Dame Ednas Possum's picture

Finally shit-for-brains gets it.

Look at the big brain on Brad.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:52 | 6782468 honestann
honestann's picture

MANIPULATION.
MANIPULATION.
MANIPULATION.

As long as the predators-that-be can manipulate the prices of precious metals via massively leveraged paper instruments, they can keep the prices low...

UNTIL ALL PHYSICAL IS GONE.

They get away with this scam because too many people accept worthless pieces of paper instead of demanding the real, physical goods their paper supposedly corresponds to.

If even 1% of people holding futures contracts for delivery of gold or silver demanded the gold or silver they are owed...  GAME OVER... and precious metal prices shoot through the roof.

The same kind of scam is happening in the ETFs called GLD and SLV, as well as many other paper frauds.

Also, central banks and governments have leased out their gold to companies that sell that gold into the market to satisfy the few demands for physical delivery that do exist.  When they have no more gold to lease out, that practice will end.  When they demand their gold back, those companies will have to buy the gold from the physical market... and won't be able to get that much gold back AT ANY PRICE.  When that happens, gold and silver prices will rocket past the moon.

This is all being done because the predators-that-be get mind-blowing astronomical advantages from the fiat, fake, fraud, fiction, fantasy, fractional-reserve debt-notes and debt-bits scam the run.  And so, they are willing to DO ANYTHING WHATSOEVER to keep that scam running, including destroy the world economy, and wipe out all human life on the planet.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:21 | 6782624 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

There's no shortage of gold in the world.   In fact, vaults all over the world are overflowing with it.  And there's 2,400 tonnes of NEW gold mined EVERY YEAR (that's 200 tonnes a month) but only 12% of that is used industrially.  The rest is stored in vaults or made into coins or jewelry.

Do you know any simple math?   Over the next 10 years, that's 24,000 tonnes of new gold being dumped into the market.  

But keep dreaming of your conspiracies. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:40 | 6782753 honestann
honestann's picture

I'm a scientist and engineer, so yeah, I know simple math.  For instance, I know that every year China imports more than the total worldwide production of gold.

India and Russia are also importers of considerable quantities of gold.  Since China alone already grabs more than worldwide production, that means they and others MUST BE getting gold from western vaults (central banks and governments).

Since most central banks are now trying to accumulate gold, clearly the excess demand for gold must be coming from government vaults.  This is one reason (though certainly not the only reason) the USSA invades nations and immediately steals all their physical gold.

Soon all the gold that was in Fort Knox will be gone.  Some people believe the federal government is already out of physical gold.  Or if they aren't, they've sold every ounce to 10 or 100 customers (given them paper that says they own the gold).

Once enough people demand physical gold instead of paper and/or the predators-that-be run out of physical gold to satisfy demand... GAME OVER.

When will that happen?  Difficult to tell, because the predators-that-be are not transparent about anything important.

You keep dreaming about gold being dumped on the market.  As my comments indicate, ALL PRODUCED GOLD IS CONSUMED BY CHINA ALONE and ALL PHYSICAL GOLD BEING DUMPED ON THE MARKET IS COMING FROM GOVERNMENT VAULTS.

PS:  When I say "China", I mean government + corporations + individuals == total-demand.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 15:25 | 6782962 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

You are also very simple minded and lack reasoning skills and are not willing to do REAL research. 

You talk about Chinese and Indian IMPORTS, but you neglect to mention EXPORTS.   Both of those countries, especially India, have SUBSTANTIAL EXPORTS of gold.  

But, you're a true believer in conspiracy theories.   Continue to bask in your delusions. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 21:01 | 6783546 honestann
honestann's picture

China NET gold demand is more than worldwide production.  You just invent nonsense and pretend they are facts.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 21:09 | 6784769 Wow72
Wow72's picture

I totally believe that, I also would add I think lots came from the mid-east, Libya, Iraq, etc.  I wouldnt put it past them to be melting down gold from the ancient tombs.

Sat, 11/14/2015 - 04:26 | 6785367 honestann
honestann's picture

One reason the predators-that-be invade nations is to steal their physical gold.  The USSA did that in Ukraine, and elsewhere in the mid-east.  That's one reason they are so intent on taking over Syria, Yemen and elsewhere... at least long enough to steal their physical gold and establish a central bank that collaborates with western central banks to keep the USD on its perch and massively impoverish people everywhere.

Fri, 11/13/2015 - 08:56 | 6785841 Wow72
Wow72's picture

" Over the next 10 years, that's 24,000 tonnes of new gold being dumped into the market.  "

 

and thats close to whats left in the world, THATS IT! THIS GUY IS GOV! W/O a doubt OR A REAL HARD-on in the least.  There is only about ten years of production left then its gone.

http://www.visualcapitalist.com/forecast-when-well-run-out-of-each-metal/

 

Anopheles    and a few others keep making the above statement which is a non-argument.  Seeing that they are talking about everything that is left and making it sound like we will be able to dig it like that the rest  of our lives, NOT TRUE.  Gold is finite and it will run out in 10 or so years given todays production, if not sooner.  So it sounds like alot but thats it.  He Flaco and a few others are on a different team for sure.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:58 | 6782494 Dickweed Wang
Dickweed Wang's picture

So, why are PMs dropping?

 

Very simple . . . every time there is high demand for gold or silver on the Crimex they simply create more fraudulent paper shares to cover the demand.  Why do you think there are about 300 paper contracts for every ounce of physical in the Crimex??  All that it will take is one large institutional player to demand delivery and the whole house of cards will come crumbling down . . .

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:26 | 6782320 MadVladtheconquerer
MadVladtheconquerer's picture

You ain't seen nuthin yet:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4cia_v4vxfE

"You need educatin';

you gotta go to school!"

 

 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:24 | 6781940 Pliskin
Pliskin's picture

It's up and down more times than a whores drawers..

 

Fuck it, I'm keeping hold of mine till the whole shithouse goes up in flames.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:31 | 6781968 honestann
honestann's picture

If you have any fiat left.
Time to back up the truck.
And load up on silver and gold.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:54 | 6782475 Dickweed Wang
Dickweed Wang's picture

Yep

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:32 | 6781973 Demdere
Demdere's picture

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/11/11/dynamics-of-national-colla...

The mechanisms of hedging are failing. If you can't hedge, how can you have a financial system leveraged 37-1? Based on sovereign bonds, 60% of which will default.

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/07/28/lebowski-enlightenment-3/

With timeline:

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/10/24/lebowski-enlightenment-9/

A question I can't resolve is what happens to interest rates when the Fed is paying off maturing bonds with created electronic fiat.  $5T / year in new money looking for hard assets quickly and then circulating after that first spending.  It will want to leave the US, currency controls to prevent that.  OTOH, high rate of inflation, who would loan at a lower rate?  $1T new currency  in a recession ==> 10% CPI of 1980.  $5T + currency controls in a worldwide greater depession ==> ?

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:33 | 6781975 Argenta
Argenta's picture

High demand?  Time to make sure the price gets knocked down, thus ensuring gold and silver move exactly opposite of every other commodity on the planet in terms of supply and demand.

-Argenta

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:33 | 6781976 ciscokid
ciscokid's picture

Short the paper and buy the physical.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:34 | 6781985 Wahooo
Wahooo's picture

I had a dream last night about having a big bag of gold eagles, but when it came time to use them they turned out to be silver eagles. Having a bag of them was nice, but I thought I bought gold eagles.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:41 | 6782019 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

   Gold is not the answer to freedom

It will merely be the last thing the bank will inflate.

They will then attempt to take if off you and in most cases they will.......

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:12 | 6782919 FlyinHigh
FlyinHigh's picture

I was gonna up vote your statement until I read the last 6 words.

The reason: most people smart enough to own gold are also smart enough to hedge it with lead.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 17:36 | 6783992 Not My Real Name
Not My Real Name's picture

Well ... to be fair, he does admit that he's a dork from Cork.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:41 | 6782020 moratar
moratar's picture

What lower prices? All over the world gold has same price. Only gold price in USD changed.

USA is not a whole world you know.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:43 | 6782035 pliny the longer
pliny the longer's picture

i'm tired of seeing this article on here, demand is so freaking strong spot is . . .  er . . . down; but at least PM is . . .  er . . . down for year; pass the hopium around

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:33 | 6782363 Dame Ednas Possum
Dame Ednas Possum's picture

Then go back to reading My Pet Goat.

Keep trying and you'll get all of the words one of these days.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:53 | 6782469 Dickweed Wang
Dickweed Wang's picture

. . .demand is so freaking strong spot is . . .  er . . . down; but at least PM is . . .  er . . . down for year . . .

 

And why is it that the "spot" price of PM's is down??  Unlike stocks, where there is a finite supply and prices have to go up when there is an increase in demand, the criminal bullion banks in concert with Crimex just create more fraudulent "paper shares" of gold and silver when demand rises - thereby suppressing the prices.  It is only when this criminal activity is brought to a screeching halt that regular price discovery in the PM markets will take place.  Until that happens now is the time to buy both gold and silver at these suppressed prices.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:46 | 6782050 Demdere
Demdere's picture

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/11/11/dynamics-of-national-colla...

Gold is a no-loss store of value, a protection for wealth in times just like this.  No mystique is necessary to appreciate that usefulness.

https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/11/10/a-measure-of-propagandas-p...

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:47 | 6782440 Dickweed Wang
Dickweed Wang's picture

Gold is a no-loss store of value, a protection for wealth in times just like this.

 

Absolutely!  If it wasn't then why would central banks be stocking up on gold right now??  When the fiat currencies crash (and history says there is a 100% probability that is going to happen) what will be left is the oldest form of money in the world - gold and silver.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:48 | 6782068 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

Utube Julian Phillips gold confiscation interview from 2 years ago.

The money power is much worse then even the wildest iminagination of a zero hedge reader.

British power is inherently maltusian in nature.

It's not a sustainable sharing culture type of thingy.

Utube

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 11:55 | 6782110 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

 in the interview there is speculation about which country engages in confiscation first.

I would be willing to bet 500 Francs it will be Ireland.

We are their most perfect little Frankestein monster.

Watch this space......

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:00 | 6782150 THE DORK OF CORK
THE DORK OF CORK's picture

The core problem with our world is that the bank state perfected during the treaty of Westphalia and Transformed into today's market state is incapable of crediting your account with the wealth of the commons.

It is only programmed to debit.

To Destroy all life.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:04 | 6782186 MadVladtheconquerer
MadVladtheconquerer's picture

Well, hell.  It looks like it has spiked right back down on the Dec contract.

Plumbing 2015 lows around 1078 too. 

Spikes are like boners--they don't last long unless you're popping Viagra.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:46 | 6783098 Montani Semper ...
Montani Semper Liberi's picture

Tyler always calls the top on these gold "spikes". Almost uncanny.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:09 | 6782219 Bahamas
Bahamas's picture

Gold is so hyperinflated..we'll reach a point where thieves that break into houses to steal, if they see a chest of gold sitting around, will steal the chest and leave the gold (sarc on)

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:30 | 6782348 moonmac
moonmac's picture

I managed 2 safe deposit vaults at wealthy suburban banks. There’s more gold stored in safe deposit boxes in Chicago then at Ft. Knox. I got 2 herniated discs carrying tons of gold around every single day!

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:43 | 6782416 Dickweed Wang
Dickweed Wang's picture

There’s more gold stored in safe deposit boxes in Chicago then at Ft. Knox.

 

Anyone that stores their PM's in a too big to fail bank's safety deposit box is a fool.  Good luck getting the gold out when the bail ins start . . .

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:50 | 6782455 moonmac
moonmac's picture

Every month we shipped gold, silver and other valuables down to Springfield. People stopped paying on their boxes or they died with no heirs. The locksmith was super busy drilling boxes.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:06 | 6782549 moonmac
moonmac's picture

The old hags I worked with hated when married men rented boxes without their wives knowing. When they saw they had no other accounts at the bank and got billed to a PO Box they’d be so pissed. Some guys would attempt to pay rent 5 years in advance and they would try dissuading them. A monthly publication comes out for ex-wives who found keys. All they had to go on was a box # and sometimes the name of the locksmith. The name of the bank is never stamped on the key. We were required to try tracking down any of our keys listed and notify authorities.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:15 | 6782598 moonmac
moonmac's picture

A co-signer is entitled to everything in the box. There was always some guy coming in crying that all his gold was stolen.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:21 | 6782625 moonmac
moonmac's picture

 

Typical scenario an elderly wife comes in to clear out her dead husbands box. I carry the 100 lb box to a room. After 10 minutes she comes out asking for a cart while leaving the box in the room. I grab a cart to carry away the gold and then check the back of the box but there’s still gold bars in the back of it. I’d have to run out to the parking lot to get them or else it was 10 pages of paperwork to fill out. Why couldn’t I have just put the box back in with the gold bars then later take both keys open it up and be rich? I still ask myself that question.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 12:33 | 6782365 1hirtleman
1hirtleman's picture

Can anyone lead me to the chart showing the trajectory of GDP growth estimates for the past five or six years starting  from the initial estimate for the year to the conclusion of the year? I've been searching and can't seem to find it. 

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 13:17 | 6782605 jomama
jomama's picture

Whatever.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 14:50 | 6783121 ramgold2206
ramgold2206's picture

Canada is hoovering up our product at record rates... even though we are aiming at small savers we are seeing huge demand and big purchases of  5gram bars.... and even considering our premium is higher because we sell by the gram and no by the OZ, (a point that is oft hammered on me here on ZH) the feedback im getting is that the big buyers dont care about a few extra % premium because the can get the product... interesting times for bullion dealers

 

www.teamramgold.com/about-us

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 17:04 | 6783832 KingOfMilwaukee
KingOfMilwaukee's picture

Sooooo, you guys are trusting the word of a "council" that promotes gold to tell you that it is doing well.... instead of just using your own eyes? Good luck. See you ar $850.

Thu, 11/12/2015 - 22:34 | 6784983 AlienOvichO
AlienOvichO's picture

China keeps adding more gold with new discovories !!
https://www.rt.com/business/321669-china-gold-seabed-discovery/

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