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How The Turks Really Feel - A Moment Of (Un)-Silence
Observing a moment of silence for the victims of last Friday's massacre in the streets of Paris has become something of a global phenomenon at everything from sporting events to stock exchanges and generally speaking, everyone has been outwardly happy to oblige.
Well, not Turkish soccer fans.
As Reuters reports (and as you'll see below), the moment of silence for France was booed on Tuesday before what ended up being a disappointing match between Turkey and Greece.
Turkish fans booed during the minute's silence for the victims of the Paris attacks before their national team drew 0-0 with Greece in a friendly international soccer game on Tuesday.
The mark of respect was observed at matches across Europe, including at Wembley where France faced England, after Islamic State militants struck Paris on Friday killing 129 people.
Turkish Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu and Greek counterpart Alexis Tsipras watched the game together, in a sign of reconciliation between the two neighbours, whose relationship has suffered from hostilities in the past.
It was the first time the two teams had met for eight years and the Turkish Football Federation had announced a string of additional security measures before the match at the Istanbul Basaksehir stadium, which was a 17,000 sell out.
However, the occasion was a disappointment with both teams trying out new players in a game of few chances with former European champions Greece, who failed to qualify for the Euros, having just one goal attempt against Turkey's 12.
Perhaps the Turks are angry that there was no worldwide moment of silence observed after bombings in Ankara killed 102 and injured more than 400 just last month.
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As if FIFA holds the moral high ground ...
Mizzou fans.
The crowd was chanting something. As usual the ignorant and uncurious new services could care less about informing people of what they were chanting.
Checked around and found another report that says what they were chanting.:
http://itsbreakingnews.com/soccer-fans-sabotage-a-minutes-silence/
“Allahu Akbar”
Was the wording of the chant left out since it didn't fit the narrative the author was pushing?
Of course not.
So many want to mock the claim that Muslims hate us for our freedoms and instead say it has nothing to do with Islam (while also proclaiming their general disgust for religion (Christianity) because of its supposed mindless destruction) and has everything to do with Americas bombing of innocents (while they pile up the heads of their victims), conveniently ignore these Muslim "victims" constant refrain of Allah Akbar. The religion of peace has absolutely NOTHING to do with it. Obviously
But "we" do kill far more of "them" than "they" do of "us." And we celebrate it on football fields with great pomp and circumstance. Since your point seems to be that only Muslims commit murder and mayhem does that mean "we" are bigger Muslims than "they" are?
Billy I was not equating or comparing carnage, only pointing out that religion plays a significant role in this. Turkish people yelling Allah Akbar in response to a moment of silence for dead French makes this apparent to me. Further while we can argue who has killed the most, the one thing you can't argue is that Muslims are killing a lot more Muslims than Christians are killing christians in the name of religion ANYWHERE in the world. To me this is a war of culture and religion that is fueled by injustices on all sides. To ignore or deny the religious aspects of this is to deliberately blind oneself to important and relevant facts.
"Physician, heal thyself," said the atheist to the Christian.
Being an atheist at some point between birth and death is like being a vegetarian between meals.
Not all bad people are atheists, but all atheists are bad people.
Of what about the Russian airliner? No one even groaned in the West, disgusting.
some people are pigs loud ones.
I'm begining to think not too many in the western MSM give a rats ass about plane crashes unless they can play where's Waldo with 'em.
Not all bad people are atheists,
That's true. For example, a bad Christian might ignore the following:
Judge not, that ye be not judged.
For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
but all atheists are bad people.
My Christian friends don't think so. But then they've read the instruction manual.
Obivously you don't think that over a million murdered Iraqis, quarter of a million murdered Sirians and who knows how many murdered in Libia and where have you in the middle east can possibly have anything to do with it either
as if football fans are prime examples of a country's public opinion
I doubt you'd find a better cross section of society.
Soccer fans the world over aren't exactly representative of the wider population.
Of course not.
There are lots of moderate Muslims out there, they are just afraid to say so.
Ha! Ha!
Pay money, waste time, drink beer and watch monkeys kick balls around!
There are lots of moderate Muslims out there, they are just afraid to say so.
No, you just bear false witness against them.
Muslims Around the World Speak Out Against Terrorist Attacks in Parishttp://time.com/4112830/muslims-paris-terror-attacks-islam-condemn/
'Not in My Name' campaign by Muslim group surfaces after Paris attacksKABC-TV - 2 days ago
Muslims are speaking out against the Paris terror attacks with the ''Not in My Name'' campaign, which was started in 2014 by The Active ...
Muslims should declare Jihad against terrorism: Islamic scholarDeccan Herald - 16 hours ago Muslim organizations in Germany unite against terror
Deutsche Welle - 2 days ago
More news for muslim against terrorism
Billy, the only real counter to the religious aspect of this is through other Muslims and where are these moderate Muslims in the ME? Sure there are moderates in western nations but that is not the core of the problem. Moderates in the ME are becoming more rare by the day as they either leave or die. This is indisputable. These people ARE AFRAID TO SPEAK OUT. For you to claim I give false witness is bullshit. To see a stadium full of Turks screaming Allah Akbar in a moment of respect for the dead French is NOT moderate peace loving Muslims. You can quote song and verse of all those Muslims condemning these radicals but what do they accomplish? Who have they reported on, turned over to authorities? And look at surveys done of Muslims in these moderate areas and just see how many support sharia law in place of their democratic laws and then tell me of their moderate stances. Show me all of the moderate Muslims who still keep their women subservient and practice beliefs completely incompatible with modern societies. Do not tell me of my false witness on this shit. There can be no doubt that the Islamic agenda is dedicated to the domination if all societies and like with our progressives, many may be less than aggressive in their ideological desire to dominate, but they do not attempt to restrain it either. This is a battle for a form of civilization and while your progressive sympathies may tell you that tolerance will be our salvation, I'm betting it will be our end.
For you to claim I give false witness is bullshit.
You said, "There are lots of moderate Muslims out there, they are just afraid to say so."
You did not qualify the statement with any geographical exceptions. And now you're vacillating about what you said despite the fact that you, I and God himself can read what you wrote in black and white. If you misspoke or painted with too broad a brush then take responsibility for the fact and admit your error without any emotional outbursts at me. I'm just trying to help you find your way.
This is a battle for a form of civilization and while your progressive sympathies may tell you that tolerance will be our salvation, I'm betting it will be our end.
You play the judgmental collectivist while accusing me of being a progressive? Too funny. Maybe someday you'll see the value of individual freedom and individual responsibility but I fear it will be a long time coming.
People need to understand the Muslim term "taqiyya".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taqiya
Awesome, eh? The only religion that codifies lying as Holy!
Now you're lying. Rabbis tell us that lying can be a permissible practice under Jewish law.
Understanding the Permissibility to LieDespite the above, we find that in certain circumstances it is permissible or even commendable to lie. The reason for this is12 that the biblical commandment against lying only includes a lie that will be harmful to someone else, as the verse says: "Distance yourself from words of falsehood; do not kill an innocent or righteous man." That is, it is forbidden to lie in a way that might cause death or harm to any person.
It is only by rabbinic law that it is forbidden to tell white lies as well, as the verse says13: "Indeed, they deceive one another and do not speak the truth; they have taught their tongues to speak lies, they commit iniquity [until] they are weary." And in the words of King Solomon14: "Distance falsehood and the lying word from me." Nevertheless, in cases of extenuating circumstances, as will be explained, the rabbis were lenient.
And we are told15 that a lie told to promote peace (as shall be explained) is not included at all in the prohibition of telling lies. It seems then that since the ultimate goal of this lie is a positive one, it is not prohibited.
Examples of Permissible LyingOne may "change the truth" for reasons of peace.16 We derive this from a conversation between G?d, Sarah and Abraham in Genesis.17 Sarah said to herself: "After I have withered will I get smooth skin, and my husband is old." When G?d repeated her comments to Abraham, he said that Sarah had said: "How can I give birth when I am old." As Rashi18 explains, G?d changed Sarah's words so that Abraham would not realize that Sarah had made a denigrating remark about him.
Aaron the High Priest would employ this method when he would try to make peace between quarrelling spouses and friends. He would approach one party and tell him that the other party really is sorry and wants to reconcile. When the person would hear this, he would express an interest in resolving the dispute. Aaron would then go to the other party and tell him this fact. At which point, everybody would make up.19 The Rif20 says that it's actually a mitzvah to lie in this way in order to maintain peace.
Other examples of permitted white lies include:
On a similar vein, if a person has an incurable illness, and informing him of this will be detrimental to his health, it may be proper to withhold this information from him.24
http://www.chabad.org/library/article_cdo/aid/1049008/jewish/Telling-the...
I'd say they'd be very representative actually, especially outside the British Isles where the support becomes biased towards the working class.
This is why NATO is a joke. Several of the countries hate each other. If actual war broke out, they'd split up and attack each other.
Sorry to have to say this, but the war going on now is a race war. Muzzies hate whitey. For some inexplicable reason, whitey is in love with the muzzies and wants to have them as neighbors.
Check your history, bitchez. White males discovered and built everything we call civilization. Since man painted cave drawings, barbarians invaded and tried to destroy everything and kill everyone. The only way to have a few generations of peace was to genocide them.
Hugs won't work.
How shallow your masters have made you.
I'm afraid there is a lot of spaniel in Whitey! He's just got to be loved
Unfortunately, Morbid, I'm afraid sports fans most anywhere are prime examples. I'm not familiar with Turkish society, but I'm gonna start out with the assumption that they're every bit as indoctrinated, sedated, and entranced as the screentime-addled American sheeple.
I remember the Palestinians dancing in the streets of New Jersey celebrating on Sept 11th.
No matter what your beliefs, that's very morbid stuff.
Do you recall the dancing Israelis, found driving around New York in white vans that had explosives?
No but I am sure you can predictably blather on about how it was all the fault of Israel and the joos. I would expect nothing less here at ifuckinghateisrael.com (formerly known as zerohedge.com).
The word is "Jews." Why show so much disrespect?
Jerome,
I took a look into your comments over the weekend and now I understand your basic problem here at the Hedge.
You don't read anything and your comprehension level is even worse. Remember pal, never go Full Retard.
That dude gives stooges a bad name. Where's Moe when you need him?
I don't understand. Jerome says "No" he does not remember the Dancing Israelis. Is he claiming it did not happen?
yeah, its not like they forced fox news to stop reporting on it or something
oh, wait...how'd that go again, carl cameron?
eff the turks, qataris, and saudis
Or the fact that they know it wasn't ISIS and that only Israel benefits from "Islamic Terrorism" since they're desperate >> http://bit.ly/1MsOwe2
7 weeks...fucking figures.
Writer: “Perhaps the Turks are angry that there was no worldwide moment of silence observed after bombings in Ankara….
More likely: The Turks are tired of hypocrisy and double standards so they stopped pretending.
Which is why they always follow everything up with a good ole Allah Akbar.
I guess it would be weird if they shouted Hallelujah.
So I suppose if every white male you met said "fuck you and praise the lord" you wouldn't cal them a Christian nutjob. They are booing a moment of silence for people murdered in the street and following it up with praise to their prophet. Seems pretty religious based commentary to me.
They were praising Allah (God) not Mohamed - Mohamed Akbar?
FIFA and the Premier League's top priority is adding as many African players as possible.
Trayvonville in Europe. Dumb white male Americans love their Trayvon thug ball players like little grils.
I feel the anger in the giant EU Utopia. Perhaps it might have to do with the fact there is this little thingy called "Nationalism"? Dunno.
I am wondering O'Bama's plan to vet his thousands of Muslim imports will be as thorough as his vetting of the thousands of Mexcians flooding across the border?
Illegals beat USC grad student to death with bathttp://www.gunssavelife.com/?p=13083
" …and the family of the deceased student from China were unable to enter the U.S. for a week because of immigration paperwork. How’s that for irony?"
Friggin sad, isn't it. That tragedy summarizes Barry's total failure with his far laft wing distorted immigration policies.
Well, he's going to make gun control The Issue for his last year. Let's hope he's as successful as he has been at bringing peace to rhe Middle
East.
As thorough as the vetting of the "moderate" headchoppers, friends of John McCain and Gen. Allen got before arming and supplying them?
Je suis something.
je suis charlie (sheen)...!
I didn't take a moment either. You have to be tough if you are going to be stupid by letting terrorists back in your country.
Good point by the Tylers that the crowds reaction may be partially attributed to the lack of similar empathy by the West to their pre election bomb blast victims.
I think it goes much deeper than that though, Erdoghan recently described the J Al Nusra and other Islamists jihadis fighting in Syria as 'his brethren', a view shared by the majority of the muslim Turks.
The Wall Street Journal said that "Al Qaeda affiliate Al Nusra" are "moderates" who shouldn't be bombed by Putin a few weeks back.
U.S. Rebukes Russia Over Syria Strikes American official said Islamic State does not appear to be the targetUpdated Sept. 30, 2015 8:09 p.m. ET
"But with the exception of the area east of the town of Salamiyah in Hama province, none of the areas listed by the Syrian regime have a known presence of Islamic State fighters. They are largely dominated by relatively moderate rebel factions and Islamist groups like Ahrar al-Sham and the al Qaeda affiliate the Nusra Front."
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-09-30/propaganda-war-begins-russias-s...
The Russians asked for the coordinates of the moderate headchoppers the US did not want bombed, but they got no reply.
Surveys in Western Europe show that most young Turks there have sympathy for IS and that they hate Jews. The latter of course is not uncommom on ZH either. Turks in Europe are more nationalistic than their compatriots in Turkey.
In Europe when a 1 minute silence was observed on Monday, at schools many of these import students were violating it with shouts.
Hard to believe Erdogan won the recent election, huh?
anagram of "Erdogan Obama" is Dragon Amoeba or Bondage Aroma
Not really nmewn, the yokel Turk still pines for the days of the slave trade. The mausoleums did not build themselves. Time stands still and a donkey carries the same weight it did 200 years ago.
Sure the country is divided but those who would see Erdogan ousted are as fickle as your dumbed down US/UK subject.
"...the yokel Turk still pines for the days of the slave trade. The mausoleums did not build themselves."
Yeah, it was tongue in cheek on my part.
But (turning to the predominate high school/university slave trade elite narrative) the trading port of Zanzibar was conveniently located on the west coast of Africa to get them over to Charleston harbor in those vile slave Confederate warships!
Again, tongue in cheek...sarc.
The propaganda bullshit is so deep I might as well engage in it too but you never know what the interested reader may find ;-)
The election was fixed. Major discrepancies in exit polls, etc.
The most recent elections were Parliamentary in nature, not Presidential. Even if the AK Party had lost all of their seats a couple of Sundays ago, Erdogan would still continue his term as President.
It is a far far greater probability that Erdogan & Scum want a return of the Ottoman Empire than the Middle Kingdom Sunni strives for a Caliphate.
Interesting...Saudi though would love to overrun the place with Wahabists. Same is true of Iran wanting their Shiite crescent. Far-right Israeli's wanting Greater Israel. The US wanting a corporate serf state system or outright looting. Isn't that why everyone's there? I mean Russia is protecting it's interests too Tartus, Gazprom pipeline etc.
Turns out elites like to expand their spheres of power regardless of their background. I do agree that Turkey may very well have imperial ambitions, but they aren't alone in that region.
I don't care who you are it's tacky to Boo another man's request for a moment of silence, for people who have died..
no one even had a moment of silence when hitler died ....so how fair is that.
Well go ahead and suggest it at the next Klan rally you attend. I'm sure they'll be happy to oblige.
well jerome why dont you bring it up at your next LGBT meeting....
Typical nonsensical, absolutist "logic" we all come to expect from most ZHer's.
ZH: where everything is about zionism, nazism, and false flags.
Fucking morons.
ZH: where everything is about zionism, nazism, and false flags.
Fucking morons.
"Everything" at ZH includes you too!
The European powers, including Russia and the United States, must now band together and drive the Muslims out of Constantinople and restore this city to Christendom. This will teach the Muslims a lesson and put them back in their place.
Seven brutal Crusades didn't come close to managing that.
Not happening.
yeah ? let's see what happens when we go Medieval...with nukes.
cougar, that's retarded. '7 brutal crusades did not free Constantinople from the Turks'. Which 7 crusades? How would the Crusaders free Constantinople from the Turks if the Turks never occupied the city during the time-frame of the Crusades? The last crusade ended almost 200 before Constantinople fell to the Turks around 1453 AD.
Were they yelling "False Flag ! False Flag !! ?
There's enough of that going around in the commentary here.
False flag it was, so what is your point? ISIS is a Fase Flag organization in that they fly the Jihadi flag, but work for the Zinos. Ain't that right Jerome?
We need the social justice warriors at mizzou to set up tent city at midfield.
Good. The moment of silence for it while not for other alleged terrorist acts that didn't happen in U.S butt buddy countries is idiotic. Where is the moment of silence for the Russian passenger plane that was blown up?
I had to turn the channel at the start of an NFL game I watched Sunday because of this shit.
Further proof to me of it being a false flag event.
Good point but it wasn't until the 16th November that the Russians finally said it was blown up as opposed to an "accident".
I'm sure it would have been much diffrent if the official story was prepared ahead of time and distributed to the media within an hour of the plane crash.
So what is your point? They waited for the investigation. You seem to think you are on to something. What exactly? So what? That was after all the information had been looked over.
At least they're not hypocrites like Kerry and Obama and the rest of American sheep.
The Turks were forwarding millions of Muslim refugees to Europe. Since Paris many of those refugees will be coming back to the lovely Turkish camps -- at gun point -- and not happy about it, either.
So booing into the "moment of silence" might have had a lot of reasons, actually. The Turkish situation just became a very bad deal, and everyone knows it.
bullshit. have you been to Turkey or dealt with Turks? I have a Turkish visa from 3 weeks ago. Turkey is out to create the new Ottoman Empire and Europe be damned. Turkey, our esteemed NATO partner, has an open border supplying ISIS and Turkish hospitals treat ISIS injuries. Turkey is a proud exporter to EU of Turish products like washing machines, prefab buildings and ISIS INFILTRATORS POSING AS REFUGEES. Yes, they do get pissed off with the returns of defective merchandise but they will fix the passport and get the infiltrator to remember his lines better and send back to Europe DDP.
People are afraid....as they should be. We have got mixed up in a thousand year religious war and we have no way out. The fearful would like to believe that the solution is to capitulate. Confess our sins and retreat respectfully while begging mercy, but they haven't been paying attention. They have been closely watching and documenting the west's series of mistakes and corruptions and being convinced of our collective guilt (which strangely enough they never believe includes them), hopes that our capitulation will save us, but completely ignore the fact that typically those who do surrender, who beg for mercy are slaughtered. Right or wrong we will end up in a fight where our innocence is not up for debate, where there is NO empathy for us, no discretion as to who is REALLY to blame for this tragedy. We will either but it or noy.
Dumb fucking Turks. The youngturks are no smarter either.
Today's Islamic Lesson will be courtesy of Pastor Steven Anderson. He pretty much nails it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyizRJwnIkQ
Most of the people on this site need serious phyciatric help.
Or, maybe, like some of the truly crazy people in the mideast, there's just no help for you....just not enough drugs in the world.
Silver, don't take it all too seriously or you will never get out alive. :)
It is healthy for people to have a place to vent their angst.
Aussiekiwi, can you spot the hasbra whiner when same appears in your field of view?
Hasbras got to whine. You can not reason with an ideologue.
americans used to call bullshit bullshit when they saw and/or heard bullshit. now they bend over and moan in delight for any .gov sweet nothing whispered in their ear, no condom needed.
I don't know besnook, Americans swallowed The Tonkin Gulf, Colin Powell, the Apollo Moon Landings, the original Pearl Harbor, The Federal Reserve Act, the unratified 16th Amendment ...
Lemme translate it to you, folks. I'm from Turkey.
Those were ultra-nationalist chants. They were saying something in line with "martyrs never die and we won't allow any secession".
This phrase is often repeated in Turkey by lumpen mobs. They are the conservative right, stupid and ignorant. Turkey has an abundance of them.
I don't know why they did such a thing but my guess would be that they wish to show that they have no respect to the deaths of the Westerners.
The basis of life for these troglodytes is "being Turk and Muslim" and nothing else matters to them.
Well, I guess you can't explain to all MSM audience and youtube viewers.... That's how public opinion is created. Too bad for Turkey.
Moment of silence is not a part of Turkish culture, instead there is "condeming the horrible even moment", so these booings are a reaction to those who did this terrible event. This happenned exactly after ankara bombings, moment of silence broken by booings. Its just not fits into Turkish culture, but geneiunly the feelings are same, europeans silence for the deaths, turks reacts for the killers what is hard to understand?
Additional info : the chant that turks saying is = " victims of terror shall never die, unity can never be broken" clearly proves my point prior comment.
Unfortunately, these comments will be disregarded but the silly jokes / dis informatitve comments will be highlighted. Anyway if some one really seeks the real truth read my prior comment and this one.,
There are incredibly negative comments towards turks that i believe is not fair. First of all , turkey is not an islamist country, fundamentally turkey is no more islamist than france or germany, state is completely secular and probably 30-40% of the folk lives secular and rest are muslims in a sense that a european christian who goes church every sunday. You need to understand this image created by western media, fact is different.
And regarding the ISIS thing, there is no single hard evidece has been found that turkish state supporting ISIS. we now 100% sure that USA has created it, supported it funded it, maybe some of the support went through the US bases in turkey without the concent of the turkish state, but that doesnt mean turkish state is supporting ISIS.
The most shocking fact is, turkey is the single most harmed developed country beacuse of this ISIS thing. You dont have to be genius come on just be fair, europe down on their knees just beacuse couple of thousand refugees trying to enter europe.. Turkey has been hosting 2,5 MILLION Syrion refugees. YES! 2,5 Million! We build fuking refugee cities, refugee hospitals schools and everything. Even angelina jolie said no other country has been this succesfull hosting refugees during her visit.
And this war is not even our war, usa france england russia and god knows who else fights just right across our border, de-stablizing the region, smashing the economic relationships, destroying the future,how much patience and good will can we show to the world? We only accept the war refugees, and trying to solve the problem..
This is a developing country whos gdp is only 1/4rd of germany, if we can do this much im sure you can do 10x better than us. Just please think before you establish an opinion. ask for the proofs. Because amount of disinformation and anti-turkey campaign is incredibly high. And the reason is turkish government and people wants equal and fair international relationships with every country, and rejects to be a puppet of western elites or russian empire. That is why both side demonize turkey, both parties aiming to use Turkey as a watch dog on middle east. And if ZH community can not realize these, i have no hope rest of the world can.
Sorry for the emotional burst, please upvote this and hopefully couple of people can see the other side of the story.
I don't disagree with everything you wrote, but are you claiming the largely unintelligible collection of chants and shouts during a moment of silence was meant to be respectful?
I didint say it is respectful. This is not respect, this is protest. But to whom? To the killers OF COURSE!, how can you think thousands of people bohooing dead french civilians. What I say is a cultural difference between european "respect silence" and eastern " protest slogans". Core feeling is the same, different people shows their feeling differently. When 130 french people die, they shout/protest at killers.. they dont feel "respect silence". It is just like some cultures burn their dead bodies, some bury underground. Do you question the difference between those? Both in their own way the most respectful goodbye to the beloved death people.
What this article does, is deliberetly deflecting the truth to create a horrific turkey image.
Plus, chant is not unintellgible, it is a naive peaceful rhyme a wish for a better world, whats wrong with that?