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Trump Polling Lead Surges After Anti-Muslim Comments
Donald Trump, GOP frontrunner and self-styled anti-establishment candidate, knows how to entertain.
He also understands that he has built a political brand which garners momentum from the very type of controversy that would sink any other candidate in the field.
When you put those two things together, you have a recipe for bombastic rhetoric designed to hold the electorate in a perpetual state of shock and embed a tiny voice that says “you know, maybe he’s right” in the back of voters’ collective mind.
The genius of Trump is that he’s been remarkably adept at making voters question whether what he says is actually crazy or just sounds that way because Americans have been conditioned to recoil at anything that breaks decorum or sounds like it might not be “PC.” And that plays right into his message. He makes you wonder if it’s you that’s the crazy one. Perhaps you’ve been put in a stupor by years of watered down stump speeches and Trump is just speaking plainly and saying what everyone knows is true but is too scared to say in public. If that’s true, he’s a kind of nationalistic Morpheus trying to pull you out of a dangerous, misplaced multiculturalism Matrix. Or at least that’s what he wants you to think. It could be that he is exactly what his detractors say he is: a demagogue that’s stark raving mad.
As we said earlier this week, voters will ultimately decide what Trump is or isn’t and render their judgement at the polls and make no mistake, the Donald’s controversial suggestion that Muslims should be banned from entering the country has resonated with large swaths of the electorate and a new poll shows that in South Carolina, Trump has opened up a commanding lead since creating a firestorm on Monday.
“It’s no wonder Trump is leading,” GOP mouthpiece Fox News (which has had its differences with Trump this year) says. “He’s ahead among both those who prioritize national security and economic issues. He’s the top pick among voters on the two most important candidate qualities -- strong leader and, to a lesser degree, honest and trustworthy. Plus, he’s considered the most electable -- by a lot.”
The poll surveyed 437 likely Republican primary voters by phone from December 5-8. Here are the numbers at a glance:
- Trump: 35%
- Carson: 15%
- Cruz: 14%
- Rubio: 14%
- Bush: 5%
Don’t even ask about the rest of the field.
Here’s more from Fox:
There’s no gender gap in Trump’s support, as about a third of men (37 percent) and women (32 percent) GOP voters make him their first choice.
The favorites among white evangelical Christians voting in the GOP primary are Trump (34 percent), Carson (18 percent), Cruz (15 percent) and Rubio (12 percent).
Trump holds a wide lead among voters who say national security is their top issue. He receives 32 percent -- twice the support for Carson, Cruz and Rubio, who each get 16 percent among national security voters.
And those who prioritize economic issues back the same four candidates: Trump (32 percent), Rubio (14 percent), Carson (12 percent) and Cruz (12 percent).
[In a] 48 percent landslide, Trump got [the nod] when GOP primary voters are asked which Republican candidate is “most qualified” to handle the economy. No other candidate even garners double digits on this measure. The next closest are Bush and Cruz at 9 percent each, followed by Rubio at 8 percent.
Strong leadership is the top trait GOP primary voters want in their party’s nominee (26 percent).
Voters who say strong leadership is the most important trait are most likely to support Trump by a wide 23-point margin.
GOP primary voters think Trump is the Republican most likely to beat Clinton in the general election next year. Some 42 percent feel that way. Next is Rubio at 14 percent.
As for the Democratic ticket, the poll showed that as far as South Carolina voters are concerned, Clinton is essentially running unopposed.
And the punchline: "It looks like his [Muslin ban] comments helped him in South Carolina. Support for Trump increased eight points after his statement -- from 30 percent the first two nights vs. 38 percent the last two nights."
Trump is also surging in the national polls. According to the latest New York Times, CBS poll, Trump’s support among Republican primary voters has gained 13 pts to 35%, his highest level yet.
You can read all of the details in the document embedded below, or you can save yourself some time and just read these tweets:
Wow, my poll numbers have just been announced and have gone through the roof!
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 10, 2015
I have decided to postpone my trip to Israel and to schedule my meeting with @Netanyahu at a later date after I become President of the U.S.
— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 10, 2015
Fox SC Dec 2015 Topline Release
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But, but, but.....he can't win.
I never hoped I could make fun of Fox and CNN at the same time....but it looks like today's the day.
says more about the voters than Trump's resilience
Hillary is also up in the polls: 78% (up from 69%) now think she'll serve hard time once Trump wins the election.
Obama will pardon her.
Then Trump will have the FBI conduct a proper investigation of Obama's background which will prove conclusively that he was constitutionally unqualified to be president. Trump will declare every official act of Obama invalid, including all the laws he signed and Hillary's pardon.
So off to jail she'll go. Bill will phone Trump to thank him effusively.
Stop it. I'm getting all misty.
Well here you go. Every rank and file politician in Britain and in this country have been proven to be stark morons pandering to terrorists because they fear their own lives.
‘Trump is right!’ Police say parts of Britain ARE no-go areas due to ISIS radicalisationhttp://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/625545/Donald-Trump-Muslims-speech-Brit...
Americans have been programmed to hate muslims ever since 9-11, why the backlash now?
Haaaaaahaaaaaaaaaa.....un frigging believable...
ZH sheeple? In force? Never thought I'd see this day....
Enjoy your divided rule by the mop head you are all drooling about....
Un frigging believable....but I already said that...
Fool me once...etc...
We're gonna have to sacrifice of a lot more virgins.
Hopefully.....we'll get get some volunteers.
NB: Stonings and Beheadings will be placed on hold until after the election.
However, in the meantime, all infidels must regsiter at their nearest S&B Community Center.
Trump says to ban Muslims until there is a cohesive policy and answers to questions and the MSM, Obammy, Hollywood, etc. lose their minds and start screaming BAN GUNS because that's their agenda and only answer. Americans are stating YES to Trump and telling the Progressive Left to fuck off. I love this shit...
The more the jew run media attacks him, the higher his numbers are going.
I'm feeling PROUD ABOUT AMERICA for the first time in a very long time.
Yesterday I posted a video that proves San Bernadino was a false flag, using MSM video. The guy who did the video said "the democrats have failed at everything, Syria, Iraq, jobs, debt, the economy, Benghazi, Fast and Furious, immigration. They can't win, the only issue they own is gun control because they are good at it. So they must make this election about gun control and they will do false flag shootings one after another to make the election about gun control.
he nailed it.
BTW Trump didn't vote to kill one million Iraqi's, Hillary did.
Trump is a fraud and a hack.
tell the millions of Muslims dead in the ME killed by Hillary and Obama about that
Trump is hired by the Clintons.
Hopefully anyone who votes Republican or Democrat in 2016 dies and has their family totally destroyed.
I thought I saw you turning tricks at a soup kitchen line, slimebag.
What happened, those bitcoins stopped working for you?
http://www.thepornster.net/video/475/homeless-blowjob-reality-porn
Nice try fuckhead...
People don't hate Trump because he is "anti-muslim". People hate Trump beacause he is a fake anti-muslim and we're not falling for his shitty acting job. TPTB have decided Hillary will be President and it is Trump who will hand it to her.
Trump is a distraction to the real issue. You think the powers that be will give you want you want? Fools.
trump gets it.
trump doesn't get it.
Trump has totally gone off the reservation. He love it when he told the Zionist Jews, that all politicians are required to grovel to, that he doesn't need their money!
He's a good businessman and that's what we need as opposed to a career poltician who caters to a handful of special interest groups. He is beholden to no one except the American people.
That would be a real change I can believe in!
Sure, that's why the whole fuc*ing planet is going crazy over his potential nomination. Trump is simply exposing the Matrix/Uniparty for all to see. The reaction says it all!
Who is "we"?
I truly admire Trump's ability to make people totally lose their mind at the realization that he cannot be stopped.
im with you on that one, and the thought of the ulcers he is going to give the leftists who have been in power way too long garners my vote.
Much of Trump's popularity is a vote against Barry's destruction of America's middle class and his chaotic leadership.
just as barry's vote was against the fucking idiot george bush, someone has to break the cycle of punishment voting.
SOMEONE!
Please ask President Obama how many times "Peace Loving Muslims" have TURNED IN a fellow Muslim for suspicion of radicalism?
I'll bet a ton-o-money the answere is ZERO!
Why?
Because if it was ONE or greater, Obama would be offering it up as "proof" to his "Muslim Community" claims.
I don't not believe that all Muslims are bad...but I do believe that a HIGH PERCENTAGE smile, just a bit, when other crazy Muslims kill those that HAVE KILLED MILLIONS OF MUSLIMS and DESTROYED MUSLIM NATIONS in the name of "Spreading CHRISTIAN Freedom and Democracy"!
scared much?
"scared much?"
Not so much for myself here and now...but for my children, and everyone else, down the road, I'm horribly frightened.
Despite what Obama says, we are in the early stages of an Islam vs. Christianity GLOBAL RELIGIOUS WAR...The clash of two major, incompatible, Religions will require lots and lots of dead before peace regains a foothold.
Please report to the nearest Community Organizer for your matrix. Your beheeding will be scheduled for the next available slot.
To be used against you every time you post now and in the future...
Standard Disclaimer: And fuck your little dog "Bitcoin" too.
Dumb faggot sheep.
Coinhead - Thu, 12/10/2015 - 08:51 | 6903746
Hopefully anyone who votes Republican or Democrat in 2016 dies and has their family totally destroyed.
Standard Disclaimer: And fuck your little dog "Bitcoin" too.
Well. That will solve the over population of North America.
You one of the Elites in troll clothing, Coin-ster ?
That is entirely plausible!
Google picture of trump and clinton. Interesting.
END THE FED!
Google picture Trump and anyone. That guy gets around!
I think you have that particular sentance backwards, my friend.
You don't buy billionaires. Billionaires buy YOU.
Billionaires are already in collusion with other billionaires. They don't need to be initiated into any new club or social crowd. The problem is, The Don will get the US into a war. And he won't end the Fed, IMO.
At least Trump isn't exhorting the muppets and sheeple to..............wait for it.......... " Buh teh fucking Shitcoin "
Trump's resilience says more about the candidate offering than the voters. Those responding to the polls are likely sick of the SOS.
The GOP openly claimed that the voters don't vote responsibly and that the GOP controlled Congress would have to "fix things" because of it. Now the GOP has Trump to deal with. Karma.
many hating on trump here share one quality: They are not even US citizens.
go & fix your own election systems and countries and STAY OTTA MINE.
Sure, just as soon as "yours" stops fucking meddling in teh rest of teh world's governments...
Allow me to quote you...
Hopefully anyone who votes Republican or Democrat in 2016 dies and has their family totally destroyed.
Thu, 12/10/2015 - 08:51 | 6903746 coinhead
Awe Nailed, you foreign scum. Get a life and go get some toothless, ulgy women who need to wear a veil so that they can mask their bad breath...oh I forgot the full head to toe potatoe sack dress that covers the hairy arm pit and kookoo & arse hair.
http://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/minnesota-man-accused-of-conspiring-to-...
Well, Trump is one of the few candidates who wants discourse with Russia and says he would not have gone into Iraq.
stupidest. response. ever.
What about non US citizens whom like Trump.
See, in contrast to your idol. Do you support free speech.
and i quote:
Hopefully anyone who votes Republican or Democrat in 2016 dies and has their family totally destroyed.
Thu, 12/10/2015 - 08:51 | 6903746 coinhead
That's right want we to repeat it again?
You wanted a troll... Now you have one.
Coinhead - Thu, 12/10/2015 - 08:51 | 6903746
"Hopefully anyone who votes Republican or Democrat in 2016 dies and has their family totally destroyed."
Standard Disclaimer: And fuck your little dog "Bitcoin" too.
All your thoughts are belong to "we". You really are a bot.
Where is the video? I'd like to see it.
The left, PC, no offensive speech crowd have no problem being vocal, offensive and violent.
They will have to be countered with tactics that exceed the rhetoric and energy of their protests.
I think Trump has the formula.
I just might get to respect this government again someday... a little bit.
I wonder how proud the Wookie will be soon.
http://hotair.com/archives/2008/02/18/michelle-obama-hasnt-been-proud-of-america-in-at-least-26-years/
Truedat. NPR, HuffPo and MSM seem to never report about the rampant knockout punch atrocities committed against innocent victims in 'Merica every hour of every day ... or the rayciss remarks of Rev Al or the honorable Rev Farrakhan ... but suddenly they scream when they hear sumthing they don't agree with.
Wake me up if Barry attends ANY of the funerals of the Paris massacres or the San Bernardino massacre.
while i have no faith whatsoever that banning muslims from coming here will do one single thing to prevent attacks, i am 100% in favor of no longer importing people who can't take care of themselves and are likely to rely on various forms of govt handouts their entire lives, which probably includes most muslims
Yeah, although I think the culture is pretty ass backwards, I don't think most of the (actual) violence is simply due to culture.
I think the petrodollar system has helped them expand their influence, as money talks.
Once oil is history, so will be the ME.
As for current events, well, there is just too much happening all at once to gel support for more US action to make me think this is organic. Has that plasticky taste to it.
If you ended the handouts, those that add to society will flourish, those who suck off it will die or leave. Just ask Mexicans.
But, and Carl you know this, modern nations are fawning over one another for a chance to keep their populations expanding (exponentially), in hopes to keep up with that exponential function that is quickly running away from reality.
pods
yep. The germans, in their naive belief that mohammed wants to pay into the system rather than live off of the system, keep importing these people, thinking that a bunch of young muslims coming into the country will work and pay into their retiement plans in order to allow the aging german population to retire and live the high standard of living they have been promised. The problem is that these people have no interest in becoming german, and have no desire to work or pay taxes, and instead demand that everything be handed to them. So, rather than helping alliviate the problems of an aging population, they actually make it worse by taking from the same dwindling tax base thats supposed to be supporting their old retirees.
I have no idea how all of this will end, but I know it won't end well. And allowing a strongman like trump(or anyone else for that matter) to infrigne further on the constitution WILL NOT fix it.
I heard Trump this morning ranting about the "Muslims who flew planes into the Twin Towers".
It appears the delusion is still strong in America and even with some of my fellow ZHers who apparently think he will fix things.
"...fellow ZHers who apparently think he will fix things. ..."
yes, he will fix.. at least the IMPORTANT things:
1. the illegal immigrant freeway from Mexico to the USA
will be one of the first things addressed and FIXED.
2. the asylum-seeking immigrant waves from Syria and other select places in the ME will be FIXED.
sorry but the muslims have been backward before oil. Afghanistan doesn't have oil...why are they backward. There are plenty of good mulims....but too many allow the muslim all emcompassing lifestyle to become a brainwashing. Don't forget the muslims hate the other type of muslims probably more than the remote christisans. From Indonesian to Africa and inbetween primitive islam is being used to murder others.
They will alwayws be backwards, but after oil we can ignore them.
That was my point. That the petrodollar has allowed expansion of their influence.
pods
You still don't get it.
It can't physically be done. What are you going to ban the people whom come up to you and say 'allahu Ackbar'?
'Are you a Muslim?' 'No' 'OK then!'
Are you of Pakistani descent? I see you have just arrived from Wahabi Saudi Arabia. And you two met on the internet. Welcome to America.
Hey stop that old white granny in the wheel chair- she looks dangerous.
Trump does get it. Hillary long ago sold her tiny, little soul.
"Nobody panics when everything goes according to the plan...even if the plan is horrifying"
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-gf29nuYYA
Me too. I support his common sense approach. And, he's got a pair which is something we don't have now - and most assuredly won't have if killary get's elected (God forbid!).
This is how revolution comes. When passionately believeing sheeple like trump followers learn that they were lied to.
"Lied to" ??
Oh you mean like the many Democrats who believed that "Hope and Change" crap lie?
They're trying SO hard to pin a "Dean scream" or a "Kerry windsurfing" on him.... it's starting to reek of desperation. They gotta know trump is gonna win on anything immigration by now. Save your attack dogs until trump does something stupid outside the immigration debate. That'll be the chance to hang something on him. If trumps smart he'll just stick to ginning up the immigration hate!
my favorite is still dukakis in the helmet....
That's the one I couldn't remember... I sat there for a minute, but it didn't come to me, so I moved on...
It's worth noting that this only seems to work against D's... so tge Donald has that going for him...
Any of them with the corndogs.
Yep, we can feel it too. Everyday Americans are sick and tired of progressives "taking care" of us. From the open borders to "legal" immigration of unassimilable third-worlders many of whom hate us, to the attack on the Second Amendment so that we can't defend ourselves, yanks have had enough! Hell, with friends like these....
The Brit's and others are afraid they will have to take more if Donald don’t, that’s all. The EU will pay for their irrational "do the right thing". Whoever decided or blessed what "do the right thing" is and why do they think that includes me?
Well in order to ban people from entering the country, he'd have to you know, get rid of the 1st amendment, or do you think the 1st amendment only applys to the Christian religon? Trump supports are people that want to maintain mass survaliance and shred the Constitution even more as most of Trumps proposals violate articles of the Constitution.
your statement is absolutely, astoundingly, incorrect.
You have never read the 1st Amendment have you? Goverment cannot ban someone from entering the country based on their religious beliefs. You can impost nationality bans, but not religious. When you elevate your intelligence beyond an 85 IQ, then post.
first division I rarely call a fellow zh a stupid shit head, so I will not use that term for you..do you not understand the president in time of emergency can suspend any and all immigration? do you know that today to qualify for asylum the border and custum agents are required to ask your religion to see if that is a cause of persecution??
Is reading hard for you? I said you can ban on nationality (we did during WWII), but not religion.
Sure we can ban on religion or any other factor. The first amednment has piss all to do with immigration.
Careful, your mental retardation is showing.
The constitution and its amendments do not apply to non citizens that are not in the country.
And how asinine is that?
Would you say that the Declaration only applied to those here at the time?
Why did it speak in such generalizations?
this is one of the reasons trumps rise infuriates me. It makes otherwise freedom inclined individuals to toss their beliefs by the wayside in favor of a strongman like trump promising to take care of them if they just allow him to violate the very constitution they claim to revere. Its pathetic, and infuriating, at the same time. Remember the 2012 elections? where this place was all ron paul supporters? now its full of people who are begging for daddy trump to come take away even more civil liberties and please keep them safe. Its pathetic.
Yep, but election time around here can be iffy.
I agree Trump could suspend immigration, well, with Congress.
But what gets me are the people who clamor for freedom cannot see that other humans are not entitled to the same natural rights they have due to where they were born.
It's always "But they are not citizens."
So hypocritical that those who think they know liberty cannot seem to see others having the same liberty that they have.
pods
If they recognise the separation of church and state they are welcome. Sharia Law has no place in the Western World.
@'firstdivision': Islam is not only a religion- it is a POLITICAL IDEOLOGY that runs counter and dangerous to free people and their nations
You shouldn't have held back. His comment is worthless. He is more filled with shit than real information. The first amendment has nothing whatsoever to do with immigration.
Sure it can. They can't stop them from exercising their religion. Doesn't say a word about immigration bonehead.
No, all he'd have to do is enact VISA requirements from Muslim countries that would be so strict and onerous that no one gets through without special dispensation.
And, since Barry and Bush have done end-runs around the constitution for years (as probably did Bill and Bush I and Reagan..), why are you all worried about it now? Frankly, I think Trump is going to do more to 'preserve and protect' the union than anyone since Reagan.
Trump realizes what all the mini-Chamberlains don't. We are at war with radical Islam, and if a few innocent Muslims get their noses tweaked by not being allowed entry to the US while the West gets it sorted, too bad. If those same Muzzies worked harder to restrain their brethren, then they might not be in that situation.
As much as I like Trump's bluster, sadly, I don't think Trump has the disposition to be prez. Most likely Hitlery will win to all of our dismay.
In the unlikely event that Trump wins, he will most likely short circuit when the power surge hits him.
The Internet is the dream of the STASI.
Spoctor Din
Hillary goes to jail for her blatant long list of felony crimes. She does have the disposition to be criminal.
President Trump goes on to be the best President ever in the history of the United States.
Your attempt to stump for Hillary is noted.
Grimaldus
Not going to happen. Anointed ones do not go to jail.
...and what I said is hardly stumping for the Queen of Cankles...
Wishful thinking will not restore our republic.
Spoctor Din
It is a very effective strategy to attack your adversary by using its most strongly held beliefs as the weak point in their defenses. The reason for this is that if your attacks are effective, even to a minor degree, your opponent cannot counter them without first changing that strongly held belief, something that can happen only with great difficultly over time with much consternation and hand-wringing.
The USA has been been building a "cult of the individiual" for decades now. If some people are in wheelchairs, enact laws requiring that every public bathroom must be redesigned and every curb cut so we can help them realize their full potential, no matter what the opportunity cost. Enact all sorts of local, state, and federal laws and create a huge bureaucracy to prevent any sort of "discrimination" against "protected classes" so that, once again, that individual can be encouraged to achieve their full potential, no matter what the cost (and no matter, also, that most of these folks were poor employees who never deserved the promotions or jobs the legal system saves for them. Exhibit A in support of that conclusion is that if they each were as great as they think they are, some other employer would snap them up ASAP and no claim or suit would ever be filed).
Our system of criminal law applauds the idea that it is better for many guilty people to go free than for one innocent man to be found guilty.
It is deemed better that the teeny-tiny minority of transsexuals be allowed to pee where they please even if it offends the modesty of millions of others.
And it is supposedly better that each Syrian refugee be granted entry to the USA than any one of them be denied entry absent proof of radicalization. A universal ban would "violate their individual rights".
Paradoxically, the more laws that are passed to protect individual rights, the greater the loss of individual freedoms as we all find ourselves trapped in an incomprehensible web of rules and regulations restricting our actions in our daily lives. The more "rights" that become enshrined in legislation, the greater the jeopardy of completely innocent people having their lives ruined after being sucked into litigation that drains away all of their savings for legal fees. Our rights have had to be destroyed in order to preserve them. This has happened in considerable part because much of those laws have been enacted by special interest goups who slap an Orwellian name on a legislative act which leads people to believe it ensures individual rights (and thereby satifies the cult), when, in truth, it only serves a particular special interest group and has little or nothing to do with protecting anybody from anything.
It is refreshing to see finally that we may have reached the point where we can have a public discussion about whether, at a minimum, the individual "rights" of non-citizens are being questioned in the context that maybe it is absolutely senseless to let 99 good people into the country if the one-hundreth refugee is a radicalized suicide bomber. Certainly, at least in theory, there must be a point where the risk of the harm that will be done by that one radicalized Muslim outweighs the total good that would supposedly (!) be achieved by letting the other 99 into the country. A ban on Muslim immigration won't guarantee the end of terror attacks in the USA, but at least the occassional radical will not have been invited here with a welcoming kiss and given a free ride on the taxpayer dollar while plotting death for as many Americans as possible. Only the True Believers in the cult cannot see the simple truth in that proposition.
Trump is merely saying that, in his opinion, it is better to ban them all than to let in the one deadly lunatic. He is absolutely right. Even if you accept the proposition that the USA created the refugee problem in Syria, it still makes no sense to accept Syrian refugees out of a sense of guilt that ignores all reason. Even the non-violent ones will likely blame the USA for their refugee status, and hate Americans for years or decades to come.
Another crazy idea cherished in Washington D.C. is "American exceptionalism", a corollary of which is that if you just gave anybody the chance to live here and see the awesomeness of our way of life, each and every one of them will immediately abandon all of their cherished belief systems held by their forefathers for centuries and try their best to be just like us. That is a core tenet of the neo-cons that has caused horrendous misery throughout the Middle East. It is the foundation of the idea that we should just let all the refugees in to join and embrace all of this awesomeness, after all, what could possibly go wrong once they see how wonderful everything is here?
Trump's proposed ban is merely common sense, but to consider it requires the beginning of the end of the cult of the individual. Those wrapped up in that cult cannot fathom such an attack on such an utterly and dearly held belief, and are completely aghast at the suggestion that one Syrian child or woman should experience the hardships normally associated when your men either lose a civil war or turn tail and run.
Easy deflection: "But but but they aren't americans, so the Consitution doesn't apply. (so all the things in the declaration only applied to the people here at the time, gotcha?)
Don't get caught up arguing with these Chowderheads. It is not worth it.
Just sit back and learn to enjoy watching trainwrecks.
I mean, sure, he says what we all think from time to time, but let's be honest, the whole government (empire to me) has become too powerful. I wouldn't want a Saint to wield that kind of power.
Just prepare as much as you can, accept that you might die, and then watch things burn.
pods
So let me get this straight. If there were a cult-like religion such as the Aztec blood cult that was still in existence, one which encouraged its followers to sacrifice non-cult members to pagan gods by removing their hearts from their still living bodies, you would support bringing them in in unlimited numbers?
As far as free speech, should we have allowed unlimited immigration from Nazi Germany while we were at war with them? Because make no mistake, we are at WAR with Wahhabi Islam. And just like the Spanish and the Aztec blood cult, we are perfectly justified in treating the followers of that cult like the absolute dogshit that they are. It is not unreasonable to stop all immigration of Arabs and Muslims until we can come up with better, more targeted criteria for filtering out the bad actors.
Even in an anarcho-capitalist society these people would be absolutely shut out, and would wind up being killed by the local militias when they tried to impose their laws on the locals.
My beef is how the enemy du jour is looked upon as sub-human, therefore the laws of civilized society do not apply.
As for immigration, that IS a purveyance of the Fed Gov. And as long as we are in a state where they take my life (labor) at gunpoint and give it away, I say keep everyone out.
Same for Mexicans, Chinese, Indians. Everyone.
Re-reading what firstdivision said, I do not think it is a first amendment issue.
But, my points about how Amerikans hide behind their beloved Constitution but cannot seem to apply those principles (lets face it, they are talking about natural rights, not Article I sec 8) to others.
Hey, in the USA you cannot kill someone without trial by peers, etc. But when someone is killed overseas in a drone strike, it becomes an issue of "are they a citizen?" which is hypocricy at its finest.
And as to being at War with Wahhabi Islam, when was the last time we dropped a bomb in Saudi Arabia on purpose?
We are in fucking love with the Salafists. We need them to do our empire bidding on the down low.
The USA is so fucking turned around that nobody knows how to apply the salve of liberty to others around the world.
And now, a strongman comes along, venting all of our innermost fears, like he is one of us.
Trump could have said the USA reserves the right to deny entry to anyone it wants to, with no oversight and that would have been fine by me.
But, he had to tap into the meme du jour of terrorists versus refugees, versus sneaky Nike army.
Means he is no better than the rest of them. A fucking whore.
pods
Really? Never knew the 1st amendment conveyed a right for everyone to immigrate to the US. How odd, I thought it prevented the federal government from enacting laws to establish a religion or prevent the free exercise thereof.
I don't think foreigners, who desire entry into the USA, have any constitutional rights, do they? Insofar as shedding the Constitution, what about that traitor that's in the WH now?
There are no Consitutional rights. Well, in the organic con.
There are merely rights, some of which were enumerated in the constitution (BOR).
As for immigration, that is one responsbility of the Fed gov. So if they decide nobody from X,Y,or Z can't come in, so be it.
But whenever I start seeing arguments about rights, and somehow people not in the US, or *gasp* US citizens don't have the rights we have because of some piece of paper, it makes my ass twitch.
The constitution, well, the BOR, doesn't bequeath anything upon anyone. It merely says that The People have these certain rights and this is off limits to the gov. It also says that this list is not the only set of rights that The People have.
It matters not where you live, were born, or who you pray to. It tells the government how it must treat you.
Or it used to.
pods
Thanks for that Pods, there are a few here that think natural rights end at a national border. The fact that natural rights are codified in our government structure doesn't mean that those rights don't exist elsewhere, just that they are recognized (if not respected) by the .gov.
Few? lol.
Look at all the red marks whenever anyone dares not shout loud enough during the 2 minutes hate for the enemy du jour (Muslims).
Anytime anybody dares stray from the meme gets shouted down.
When people still ask the question as to how Htler came to power, we can use the USA as a modern example.
Even if it is not Trump, it just the thought that somebody who has to "do something" that causes tyranny.
Long gone are the days of actual arugument and discourse
pods
firstdivision, You are uneducated at best and most likely an idiot for spouting off about shit you obviously know nothing about.
Reality about the US Constitution on immigration: http://www.captainsjournal.com/2015/12/10/turning-away-immigrants-is-nei...
Now read that and STFU until you know what your talking about.
The Stonings and Beheadings will continue until morale improves.
divided rule?
Yes, the result of a divide AND rule policy is divided rule. A cognitively dissonate polulation ruled by a cognitively dissonating soap box screamer....
Got it? You are welcome.....to your upcoming trumtoupeea....
How are those 150 million muslims working out for you in India, Jugdish?
Again, I ask, do you think the 1st Amendment only applys to the Christian religion or do you propose the 1st Amendment be stripped out?
Again, you are stupid if you don't think there are many different ways to accomplish this without expressly violating the 1st.
First, the Amendment says "Congress shall make no law"... so do it by Executive Order.
Second, the Amendment says "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion'. "Establishment" does not mean an edifice, here. It is in particular opposition to the position of the Church of England, which is the "Established" (i.e. state-sanctoned) church in England. (Hence, the old playground question 'what's the longest word in the English language? Antidisestablishmentarianism') Nothing Trump has proposed represents the 'establishment' of a religion.
Finally, the Amendment says "Congress shall make no law.. prohibiting the free exercise of'. See the first point above (i.e. it could be done by EO), but also it could be argued that he is not prohibiting the free exercise of Islam by people within the USA already; he is merely not letting any more in. The US kept Jewish refugees out of the US in the late 30's/early 40's before they got involved in the war. So the precedent is set.
Game, set, and match. Try to find another argument.
firstdivision apparently believes, as do most progressives, that the Constitution means whatever they want it to mean. My problem with your analysis is "so do it by Executive Order." It's worrisome enough that there are limits and exceptions to what's in the Constitution: one can't legally, for instance, practice a religion that requires barbecuing and eating infants, or shout "fire" in a crowed theater.
As others have pointed out here in other threads, under US law- as passed by Congress - a president may selectively restrict immigration by certain groups. Not that any of this has a single thing to do with the First Amendment.
Can you tell us which countries, religions, races, tribes, planets or any of their citizens have legal protections under our Constitution?
I'm not sure this is something to get angry about. Every election the people are fooled. This isn't exactly new or unexpected.
Someone tell me again, who's "running" the polls? The same people who are reporting them? Hmmmm...
Everyone knows that polls don't reflect popular opinion—they create it. Oldest trick in the Tavistock book.
and you're working on the dissolution of the boarder between your hindu country and that friendly neighbor muslum Pakistan --is that right? Fuck you -you hypocrite--
g speed, good on ya mate..exactly.
Keep larping about bordlerless anarchism and legalized weed...we'll be over here making America great again.
If you like your totalitarian state, you can keep it. there really is no other option a)owed for you. Wake up, seriously.
States are always totalitarian, you will always live in one, get on the winning side for once pussy.
Exactly, I have no idea how these people can be so easily deceived. Anyone with one iota of sense and has done any research at all knows trump is a soldier for hitlery. We have entered the land of the absurd. WTF
.maybe even the ZHERS can't bring themselves to the truth that there is no longer a choice. We are in full fledged fascism now. They are starting to pull down the curtains.
That's what I said.... it's like the place has been hijacked by trump supporters. I'm not one of those guys that goes and checks how long a userid has been around, but I think we have a lot of newbies here... but it's even worse if it is the older userids jumpin on the trump train. After all those years of "two sides of the same coin" and "it doesn't matter if it's a D or an R, it's all fucked" and diebold, and they STILL get suckerd by the .gov con?
I don't vote, the act itself lends credibility to the winner and results in YOU giving your consent to getting corn holed but ORI up here is laughing at himself as he voted for the negro demagogue twice and plans on giving his consent to a proven evil statist Hitlary.
Political systems are dynamic. Voting is one act in a continuing event. Politicians do not adopt positions unless there are votes on the margin that make it worthwhile.
Voting shows them there are votes there. So vote for a 3rd party candidate every time and pull the other parties in that direction.
This is how we got socialism : the socialist party never had more than 5% and 25 or so congressmen, but it was a consistent 5% across the country. Those were the margin of victory for both major parties, and so the major parties moved their positions to win. Over 50 years, we are a fully socialist nation, generally a corporatist-fascist version of socialism.
If you want your vote to count for something, it has to be meaningful to the politicians. D vs R is not meaningful in guiding the nation's long-term, they are the same party dividing the spoils of the kleptocracy. Voting against bond issues and for anyone representing your votes is the only way to move the system, but it takes a while.
"Enjoy your divided rule by the mop head you are all drooling about...."
Trump is the fifth Beattle! Gonna be bigger than Jesus!
Eh? Trump is very clearly different, though in different ways to different people. Some see him as common sense made flesh, others see him as Hitler. But one thing is certain, he is DIFFERENT, and we must try something different, because doing the same thing over and over while expecting a different result is the Einsteinian definition of insanity.
Paul and Sanders are also "different" candidates, but Paul played to much to the middle and played too much politics, abandoning his libertarian base, and Sanders would with 100% certainty destroy the country possibly beyond all hope of repaired, so they are both highly unlikely to gain much traction.
Too bad Ron Paul wasn't a few years younger and running this year. His message might have taken off as something else that is "different" but in a more concrete way than Trump.
https://www.youtube.com/user/BROTHERRACHID
Considering India's very social structure is one of the most bigoted and repressive in the world, I think you should perhaps concern yourself with your own country first and foremost before ranting about American's support for Trump. Or perhaps you're blind to it Oh Regional Indian?
Bullshit!
From Bush on, all we have heard is that Islam is the religion of peace, that we re NOT at war with Islam, just a few freaks who have perverted its true peaceful meaning. This shit has been going from day one. Every futile effort stymied by political correctness. Even our war efforts (for better or ill) have been prosecuted with one arm tied behind our backs, demanding approval before returning fire, not firing on Mosques or any other perceived religious site regardless of what fire is coming out of them, using our military to build schools hospitals and water systems while being fired upon....simple madness to PROVE our love of Muslims. Hell look what we did in Kosovo...we defended the Muslims from the evil Non-Muslims.
You are full of shit. Hell we have the white house full of them, and 72 people in the Homeland security are on No Fly Lists.
their own holy book the koran states plainly how they are to treat with non-believers. here's a few quotes:
“Punish the unbelievers with garments of fire, hooked iron rods, boiling water; melt their skin and bellies.” Koran 22:19
“The unbelievers are stupid; urge the Muslims to fight them.” Koran 8:65
“Muslims must not take the infidels as friends.” Koran 3:28
“Terrorize and behead those who believe in scriptures other than the Qur’an.” Koran 8:12
“Muslims must muster all weapons to terrorize the infidels.” Koran 8:60
O gee someone downvoted your for qouting the Koran!
Quoting inconvenient parts of the Quran is a form of microaggression against Islam. Hurt someone's feelings and you get downvoted.
For the doubters and bleeding hearts:
https://www.youtube.com/user/BROTHERRACHID
Islam is like communism. It has no real future. The only reason it is a threat is because the US (among others including Russia and Europe) made it one. They don't fly jets they make, they don't fire guns they made. They aren't exactly competent in any way in terms of fighting on their own. Suicide attacks are used by those that are desperate and losing (see Japan in WWII).
The common right wing idea that "if only we really went to town on them, they wouldn't be a threat" is just total BS. We've bombed enough people indiscriminately to show how that first part just isn't true and we've had enough blow back to know that the second part of that stupid idea is also total BS.
tarsubil, it helps to be a student of history. I agree with you that USA has contributed mightly and fact has been the lead instigator and destablizer in the middle east. But to claim that the west has has made Islam a threat to the west is to be totally and completely ignorant of what islam is and ignorant of islam's history.
Islam has sought out to be conquerors since it's establishment...I'm hard pressed to find a country called USA in the 600-1200 time period that "caused" Islam to war and seek conquest in other lands.
ISLAMIC CRUSADES 630Muhammad conquers Mecca from his base in Medina.
632Muhammad dies in Medina. Islam controls the Hijaz.
636Muslims conquest of Syria, and the surrounding lands, all Christian – including Palestine and Iraq.
637Muslim Crusaders conquer Iraq (some date it in 635 or 636).
638Muslim Crusaders conquer and annex Jerusalem, taking it from the Byzantines.
638 – 650Muslim Crusaders conquer Iran, except along Caspian Sea.
639 – 642Muslim Crusaders conquer Egypt.
641Muslim Crusaders control Syria and Palestine.
643 – 707Muslim Crusaders conquer North Africa.
644 – 650Muslim Crusaders conquer Cyprus, Tripoli in North Africa, and establish Islamic rule in Iran, Afghanistan, and Sind.
673 – 678Arabs besiege Constantinople, capital of Byzantine Empire.
691Dome of the Rock is completed in Jerusalem, only six decades after Muhammad’s death.
710 – 713Muslim Crusaders conquer the lower Indus Valley.
711 – 713Muslim Crusaders conquer Spain and impose the kingdom of Andalus. The Muslim conquest moves into Europe.
718Conquest of Spain complete.
732Muslim invasion of France is stopped at the Battle of Poitiers / Battle of Tours. The Franks, under their leader Charles Martel (the grandfather of Charlemagne), defeat the Muslims and turn them back out of France.
762Foundation of Baghdad.
785Foundation of the Great Mosque of Cordova.
789Rise of Idrisid amirs (Muslim Crusaders) in Morocco; Christoforos, a Muslim who converted to Christianity, is executed.
800Autonomous Aghlabid dynasty (Muslim Crusaders) in Tunisia
807Caliph Harun al—Rashid orders the destruction of non-Muslim prayer houses & of the church of Mary Magdalene in Jerusalem.
809Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sardinia, Italy.
813Christians in Palestine are attacked; many flee the country.
831Muslim Crusaders capture Palermo, Italy; raids in Southern Italy.
837 – 901Aghlabids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Sicily, raid Corsica, Italy, France.
869 – 883Revolt of black slaves in Iraq.
909Rise of the Fatimid Caliphate in Tunisia; these Muslim Crusaders occupy Sicily, Sardinia.
928 – 969Byzantine military revival, they retake old territories, such as Cyprus (964) and Tarsus (969).
937The Church of the Resurrection (aka Church of Holy Sepulcher) is burned down by Muslims; more churches in Jerusalem are attacked.
960Conversion of Qarakhanid Turks to Islam.
969Fatimids (Muslim Crusaders) conquer Egypt and found Cairo.
973Israel and southern Syria are again conquered by the Fatimids.
1003First persecutions by al—Hakim; the Church of St. Mark in Fustat, Egypt, is destroyed.
1009Destruction of the Church of the Resurrection by al—Hakim (see 937).
1012Beginning of al—Hakim’s oppressive decrees against Jews and Christians.
1050Creation of Almoravid (Muslim Crusaders) movement in Mauretania; Almoravids (aka Murabitun) are coalition of western Saharan Berbers; followers of Islam, focusing on the Quran, the hadith, and Maliki law.
1071Battle of Manzikert, Seljuk Turks (Muslim Crusaders) defeat Byzantines and occupy much of Anatolia.
1071Turks (Muslim Crusaders) invade Palestine.
1073Conquest of Jerusalem by Turks (Muslim Crusaders).
1075Seljuks (Muslim Crusaders) capture Nicea (Iznik) and make it their capital in Anatolia.
1076Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) conquer western Ghana.
1086Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) (see 1050) send help to Andalus, Battle of Zallaca.
1090 – 1091 Almoravids (Muslim Crusaders) occupy all of Andalus except Saragossa and Balearic Islands.Ha! It hasn't been a real threat for 1000 years. Constantinople first fell to crusaders not muslims and it's fall to the turks was as much about infighting as the turks. It was truly over when the Ottoman empire fizzled out over 100 years ago.
Give me a break. I know about Islam's expansion when people were using swords and throwing rocks. Times have changed just a little. Yes, it has teachings to conquer. It hasn't had the means because it also has teachings that encourage stupidity (similar to the teachings of neocons suck as yourself).
Tarsubil,
i agree with ya. in very much the same way, amoricans in the 60s were convinced this nation was doomed to suffer the apocalyptic nightmare of a negro-revolt; when in reality these people couldn't organize a popsickle stand without it quickly deteriorating into a slush-bucket and a few splintered sticks. all of their organizations (be it the naacp, uncf, splc...etc.) are owned and controlled by a certain tribe.
the watts riots, explosion of inner-city violence, protests, social-engineering from cinema...all of it coordinated and choreographed to effect sweeping political & social change. middle-america was, in a sense, grey-mailed into sacrificing so much of their way of life and collective power to succor a swelling rage within this nations black community...a rage that was manufactured and magnified but altogether impotent with respect to any meaningful revolt.
and now we have islamic terrorism. i know as well as any that these retrograde hordes couldn't even feed their domestic populations much less bring down an advanced society; and so i realize that there is something highly duplicitous and nefarious in back of this terrorist madness.
i look at it like this: blowback is a sword that cuts both ways. tptb's expectation is that, since they think they've successfully inverted the moral/ethical orientation of the western world, the populations, once saturated with terror-induced trauma will, instead of responding as humans would in days gone by (purge their borders of the threatening agent), instead call for increased 'security' all while abiding their moral conditioning by standing firm to the dictates of 'tolerance' and 'multi-culturalism'.
i think tptb are going to be shocked to learn that inversion of the human organisms natural psychological arrangement not only doesn't last, it creates inner tensions which, once given outlet for expression and exploration, tend to push back with immense force against the prohibitions enforced by the inversion. it's the olde pendulum theory...and i think it holds to this day.
so, sure, keep up with the terrorism tripe...we'll just bend it back against them and their sacred multi-cultrualism rather than continuing to spend on fruitless 'security' ventures -- be it war, deep-state snooping, airport molestations...what have you.
i, personally, hate to see various peoples' feelings hurt; but their sensitivities are not worth it in the exchange of liberty.
furthermore, and in completing the circuit back to certain cultures and their capacity to organize, it is only ours (broadly speaking -- western christendom) in possession of the traits and characteristics necessary for stamping out these internationalist control-freaks. this terrorism nonsense affords us the perfect pretext to mutually identify amongst ourselves, coordinate and define objectives, and then attack those who seek to subvert all of humanity to their exceedingly wicked designs.
and, last but not least, inasmuch as we're entering a new epoch, it benefits this age and ages to come immeasurably (and all of the peoples of the world for that matter) if its advancing force is of consolidated identity and force...the head always brings up the tail (and for so long we've allowed the head to be shackeled to the tail) and the more solid the foundation the higher succeeding ages can climb.
all of which is to say, i think they're fucked either way. in the end, they're gonna lose their sacred multi-multiculturalism AND their control.
janus
How much of the turmoil in the black inner cities in the 70s was due to the FBI's COINTEL?
We know that quite a lot of the extremism and killing in the ME and terrorist events in other countries was done by CIA, Mossad, etc.
Including the 9/11 False Flag attack on American citizens by Israeli-Neocons controlling the US government.
That is the issue, and eveyrthing else is small potatos in comparison.
It was a coup. We are being moved totalitarian because the Israeli-Neocons will hang if normal politics is allowed.
Muslims are the vehicle for Israeli-Neocons, just as Jews were for Hitler. Scapegoats have been a leading political tool at least since the invention of writing.
spam
My god, you are clueless. Um, 'the gates of Vienna'? You weren't aware that the seat of the Austro-Hungarian empire was besieged by the Turks in the 1680's - that's 350 years ago, not 1,000 - and if not for some late minute replacements from Poland, it might have fallen.
In recent years, far from the middle east, Muslims have killed Christians in Indonesia, Malaysia, the Philippines, Chechnya, Bali.. the list goes on and on and on.
How much more evidence do you need? Or are you one of those brain-dead liberals whose mind is made up, never mind the facts?
I mentioned the Turks and them fizzling out 100 years ago. That was after 350 years ago. 350 years ago is a long long time ago. The Ottomans were the last muslim threat and islam has been associated with backward shit hole nations ever since. Oh my God, but 350 years ago the Ottomans... Seriously? Iraq and Iran fought for years with equipment from the US and Russia and the US basically wiped Iraq out in Iraq I in about 2 weeks. It is so obvious when you objectively look at the situation in recent history that they are not independent threats that you have to be brain dead not to see it. Oh but look back to medieval times! That is not a legitimate argument. That is some dumbass reciting history he doesn't even understand.
Dupe
I cannot believe you took the time to make that up.. Islam is peace..
s
So everything was fine until some dumb fucker gave them guns.
Everything was fine except for the historical accident that placed oil fields under their dirty feet. That gave them the money to buy the guns and weapons with which they annoy us. If all that oil was in the midWest US, they'd still be a bunch of useless goat herders, and no one would have heard from them.
Islam has no real future?
That's ludicrous simply because of birth rates. Demographics is destiny and Muslims are destined to become the majority. Maybe not in our lifetimes, but if you're a 'European,' your granddaughter is going to wearing a burka.
Public Service Announcement.
"Be sure to have your Muslim spayed or neutered."
You should hope your granddaughter wears foreign genes, as that is the best strategy for your genetic heritage.
But 'wearing a burka' isn't too likely, as Muslims will be just like Christians when they are exposed to a bigger, freer society. We Christians all used to wear our European equivalents, and many older women still won't leave home without a headcovering.
Religions all change because of contact with Freedom, which is why so many of them hate it.
https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/08/19/conserving-my-neanderthal-...
https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/09/13/how-to-destroy-islam-in-eu...
9/11 was a False Flag operation by the Israeli-Neocons in the US Government
spam