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Visualizing Russia's Intervention In Syria

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Earlier this week, a rather amusing piece appeared on Sputnik entitled “Ahead of the Game: Russia Moving Faster in Syria Than US Media Can Report.” In it, Russian media outlined five steps US diplomacy expert Robert Farley thinks Russia will take next in Syria. The point of the article is this: Russia had already taken four of the five steps by the time Farley produced his list. 

That is in many ways emblematic of Moscow’s deployment in Syria. From the time a Russian three star general strolled into the US embassy in Baghdad and informed the staff that airstrikes “start in one hour,” the rapidity with which Putin’s forces have established a base, sent in equipment, and launched a coordinated campaign with the IRGC and Hezbollah has been nothing short of astonishing. 

That said, the mission hasn’t been without setbacks. There was of course the downing of a warplane by Turkey and the subsequent destruction of a Russian search and rescue helicopter by the FSA and as Bloomberg correctly points out (although the article is absurdly biased), “many senior officials in Moscow underestimated how long the operation in support of Bashar al-Assad would take when Putin entered Syria’s civil war on Sept. 30 and no longer talk in terms of just a few months, with one saying the hope now is that it won’t last several years.”

But Putin isn’t Obama and irrespective of how long the campaign will ultimately take, The Kremlin looks prepared not only to stay the course, but to ramp up the deployment. Not only is Moscow hitting terrorist targets with cruise missiles from Russia’s Caspian Fleet, but now, Moscow is shooting at ISIS from a submarine in what can only be described as an effort by Putin to use Syria as a testing ground for Russia’s long dormant military juggernaut (after all, you don’t really need to shoot at a group that doesn’t have an air force or a navy from a sub). 

On that note, we present the following update graphic prepared by Louis Martin-Vézian of CIGeography as post at The Aviationst. It documents the scope of Russia’s operation in the Mid-East and should give you an idea of just how committed Moscow is to the fight.

 

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Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:09 | 6907379 SILVERGEDDON
SILVERGEDDON's picture

" We Putin-ed some folks. "

"Aw, shucks, son, yer Putin me on. "

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:12 | 6907403 El Vaquero
El Vaquero's picture

It may soon be the Sinola Cartel in Syria.

 

http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/news/2015/12/10/looks-like-it-on-chapo-...

 

LOL, this shit is beyond surreal. 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:28 | 6907469 Occident Mortal
Occident Mortal's picture

Where's the submarine? Where are the drones (I'm sure they took more than 1)?

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:34 | 6907500 ShrNfr
Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:38 | 6907514 cheech_wizard
cheech_wizard's picture

Good to see someone taking charge of the northern Mexican border.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:50 | 6907559 apocalypticbrother
apocalypticbrother's picture

This has the stink of psyop all over it. Chapo has been let out of jail to play a role for the Khazars that let him exist. What this role is I cannot be sure yet but this Chapo vs ISIS meme is just getting rolling

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 09:52 | 6909714 False_Profit
False_Profit's picture

Didn't we have the drug cartel money to thank for getting us out of the liquidity crisis of 2008 as well?

What would we ever do without the dons from down south...

Gott mit uns...

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:00 | 6907596 Demdere
Demdere's picture

ISIS hates drugs and drug dealers?

Goodby ISIS.  The governments of this world will not tolerate you.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:12 | 6907404 Citxmech
Citxmech's picture

What I'm not sure of is why Putin took so long to intervene in the first place.  No doubt, once the decision was made - Putin has been all-in, but our proxy stooges had been turning Syria into a rubble pile for a really long time beforehand.  Why the wait?

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:18 | 6907428 HowdyDoody
HowdyDoody's picture

He had to gain some degree of protection from the US weapons of financial destruction - accumulate gold, get SWIFT alternative running internally, allow time for the reverse sanctions aginst the EU to weaken their appetite for supporting US demands for more sanctions against Russia, dampening down things in Donbass at least for the short term via Minsk to avoid a dual front attack, build up evidence for US/NATO suport for ISIS, bulid up a target list (heck, they were bombing full on from day one), get agreement from Iran, Iraq, Syria for action, get Iran out of the US sanctions to enable Iranian support, etc, etc.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:30 | 6907456 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

Hopefully this shuts up the morons who claim Russia "invaded" Ukraine, unless now they want to say Russia has some super secret alien cloaking technology that makes the invasion invisible, but it only works in non-desert locations.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:47 | 6907546 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

doctrine of maskirovka   works best when enemy is naive

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 05:14 | 6909128 Lore
Lore's picture

Psychopaths don't like it when their intended victims can be just as deceitful.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:27 | 6907722 Karaio
Karaio's picture

Wow!

That analysis!

Better than the product!

Sincerely: ++++++++

Grateful.

:-)

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:23 | 6907446 Mr.Sono
Mr.Sono's picture

There is a thing called premature. You need a strategy before you put your neck out

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:46 | 6907496 iClaudius
iClaudius's picture

'What I'm not sure of is why Putin took so long to intervene in the first place.'

Public opinion. With the large numbers of migrants flooding into Europe and on their way to the US, Putin is the only player doing anything tangible and visible to right the situation. Plays wonderfully to the TV audience. Why do you think that limp wristed pig molester in the UK has been so keen to get involved now, and the same reason why Obama is desperate to send troops and helicopters into Iraq. 13+ months of doing nothing while ISIS lopped heads off and burned people alive on video isn't good PR when the Russian military turns up and starts doing something about it. However, if Russia had intervened at the start it would have looked like he was simply supporting Assad against the rebels, which would have played right into US state departments hands.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:06 | 6907622 AriusArmenian
AriusArmenian's picture

Good answer.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:21 | 6907686 Blankone
Blankone's picture

Putin does not want an independent Syria.  It appears he wants to keep a part or all of the western coast for himself and that is easier to get (he thought) with a decimated and weak Syria.

And Putin did not go all in.  There is not a no fly zone and Turkey has moved troops into Syria.

Moscow is being treated to one of the largest fires in 25 yrs right now at a factory.  Coincidence?

 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:23 | 6908028 Baby Bladeface
Baby Bladeface's picture

Very interesting to look at the bleating, throwing and finding "hidden meaning".

From the infamous ukropedia nothing else expected.

Pravoseki, reap the rewards of Maidan and jump!

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:34 | 6908847 o r c k
o r c k's picture

Yeah, he's spotted a nice 2 bedroom cottage overlooking the Med. And He will NOT be out-bid.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:41 | 6907808 wafer_roll
wafer_roll's picture

I tit's way too. It seems imho  that russia underestimates zog  bravado. Putin didn't think zog   would attack them or wanted a full blown war, but zog has been chipping away at russia for years now, at least since he Georgia war. I hope with recent events against turkey Putin will understand zog is hell bent on destroying putin. The Russian central bank is no friend of putin either having put russia into a recession. 

 

Imho putin needs to take control of the board and stop the bs  attacks on isis. Just go straight to Saudi Arabia and  destroy them once and for all. Russia is a sitting duck in syria and way outmatched against zog. The french, uk, turkey, israel, and Saudi Arabia are all watching and can easily knock russia out. Then what is russia going to do? It's too late to do anything. Hence putin recent threat of nukes. 

 

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:35 | 6908850 BarkingCat
BarkingCat's picture

Sorry but you are way off. Russia could light up London faster than those useless child molesters could brew another cup of tea. France could also find their ships turned to a brief before they smelled the next morning's coffee.
Israel?? If their military installations were hit with a barrage of cruise missiles the Palestinians would make them very busy and out of the game.
Yes Russia would suffer terrible losses but they are very likely to do so without crying like little girls which is that the Europeans would do.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:14 | 6907983 Baby Bladeface
Baby Bladeface's picture

"

What I'm not sure of is why Putin took so long to intervene in the first place.  No doubt, once the decision was made - Putin has been all-in, but our proxy stooges had been turning Syria into a rubble pile for a really long time beforehand.  Why the wait?"

Oftenly is overlooked explanation and explanation a simple one at that. Syrian politics and a consequence of is formal request is not made of Russian assistance until this year recently.

Better than I can is told on syrianperspective site and details given:

http://syrianperspective.com/2015/09/the-ironies-of-syrian-politics-the-...

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 02:19 | 6908947 tsuki
tsuki's picture

He needed a crisis for cover to divide the "allies". 

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 20:06 | 6912663 Gonzogal
Gonzogal's picture

Under International Law, which Putin follows to the letter, Russia had to receive a formal request from the Government of Syria.  Once he did, Russia's Parliament agreed, and within a few days Russia was engaged with its military.

It also underlines the fact that all the countries who are currently bombing in Syria other than those who have been officially invited to assist are BREAKING INTERNATIONAL LAW and under such are legitimate targets of the Syrian governments AF as well as Russian AF.

There is also this: 

http://www.globalresearch.ca/putins-blitz-leaves-washington-rankled-and-...

 

 

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 04:18 | 6909070 StychoKiller
StychoKiller's picture

Strange, there were no Submarines shown in that graphic!

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:08 | 6907383 Baby Bladeface
Baby Bladeface's picture

Kerry is a moron, Obama is a clown, the leaders of the West - rags that Putin boots wipes.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:12 | 6907405 HowdyDoody
HowdyDoody's picture

Biden covets the oil and gas off the shore of Crimea.

 

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:39 | 6908867 o r c k
o r c k's picture

 Baby ?  Wipes that rag boots is Kerry too that no. Leaders the now part in of tooth me. So so.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:09 | 6907389 MilwaukeeMark
MilwaukeeMark's picture

Took a moment to climb up out of the hole I'm digging for my fallout shelter to read the article. I'm going back down now. Think I'll add an extra few inches of concrete to the plans.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:11 | 6907396 SILVERGEDDON
SILVERGEDDON's picture

Re bar - lotsa rebar.

And, make sure it is eighteen feet deep.

Because, deep down, we're good people.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:16 | 6907418 SunRise
SunRise's picture

One nuke digs a 900 foot hole.  You may want to go deeper.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:35 | 6907502 cheech_wizard
cheech_wizard's picture

Or live within a very short driving distance of any of the following...

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_caves_in_the_United_States

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:41 | 6907529 Chuckster
Chuckster's picture

When I was in highschool I worked on two of them.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:14 | 6907408 memento_mori
memento_mori's picture

Putin the KGB thug will run out of money very soon.

The second collapse of Russia is coming. For once, the west is playing it smart. 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:15 | 6907417 Bear
Bear's picture

I don't know ... even when you're out of money things just keep rolling on.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:18 | 6907432 Mr.Sono
Mr.Sono's picture

"Putin the KGB thug will run out of money very soon.

The second collapse of Russia is coming. For once, the west is playing it smart."

 

you so full of shit, its not even funny. Obama the gangsta is the one you should worry

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:23 | 6907447 tired1
tired1's picture

Shalom, troll.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:46 | 6907544 Ignatius
Ignatius's picture

43 weeks.  He's a virtual oldtimer among the trolls.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:24 | 6907449 Stainless Steel Rat
Stainless Steel Rat's picture

You can tell that Martin barely reads the site... Just comes here to see if we're talking about him again, lol.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:27 | 6907462 Manipuflation
Manipuflation's picture

That has to be one of the dumbest posts I have ever read on any website.  Putin is NOT going to run out of money.  Perhaps you would like to inform us of when Russia collapsed the first time?  I would love to hear your version memento.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:19 | 6907676 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

Even IF he did get into trouble, China would back him.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:24 | 6907710 Blankone
Blankone's picture

 China will not extend itself for Putin.  They have kept an arms distance and only given moral support.

I am sure China has noticed how Russia has set up and abandoned every allie in the ME. 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:24 | 6907708 jm
jm's picture

He just burned through about $200 billion in one year.  This has nothing to do with his military stuff.  Just cash burn due to revenue shortfalls (oil prices). At that run rate, the coffers could run dry without serious cuts.

 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:40 | 6908120 Baby Bladeface
Baby Bladeface's picture

Stop with the drugs you got from them crazy.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:43 | 6908878 BarkingCat
BarkingCat's picture

The biggest problem for Russia with their involvement in Syria is the cost of fuel and usuage of military equipment. All that stuff has a fixed amount of life in it. When the jets are flying lots of missions there is mechanical wear.
That equipment is not cheap.
The munitions they are expending are not that much of an expense. Most of it is probably old Soviet stuff that they have ton of in storage.
Also what it costs them for replacement is a small percentage of what it costs the US. No $800 hammers in Russia.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 23:25 | 6908360 memento_mori
memento_mori's picture

This site seems to be taken over by russian trolls. Not saying that US government is perfect but Putin is an absloute gangster by any mesure. Yes, Russia's second collapse is coming and wont be pretty, the first one being when Russia was part of USSR. With the exception of Moscow and St Petersburg, life in Russia is worse than living in Africa, an absolute dump, without the sunshine. Putin has impoverished russians beyond belief. But Russians are tough guys, they dont know better anyway, so go on cheer for your hereo Putin the KGB thug. Peasants and muzhiks like to be led by strong man (in appearance). Nazadarovje tovarish!

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:42 | 6908876 o r c k
o r c k's picture

Just remember the drones.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 04:26 | 6909078 Egao
Egao's picture

Please update your anti-Russian troll guidebook. Small Russian towns are far from what you think they are. They are comparable to UK small towns I've seen. In most cases Russian infrastructure beats British by far.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 08:50 | 6909480 sebmurray
sebmurray's picture

He's definitely never lived in Africa either

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:29 | 6907476 McMolotov
McMolotov's picture

Never go full retard.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:40 | 6907522 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

Never go troll retard 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:41 | 6907528 Volkodav
Volkodav's picture

better worry about your own country

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:47 | 6908886 BarkingCat
BarkingCat's picture

The busy self important assholes always worry about everyone else.
Take for example the island of dead pig fuckers.
What was the last century they did not fuck with someone else's nation?

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:47 | 6908887 BarkingCat
BarkingCat's picture

The busy self important assholes always worry about everyone else.
Take for example the island of dead pig fuckers.
What was the last century they did not fuck with someone else's nation?

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:57 | 6907585 Berspankme
Berspankme's picture

Good thing US is so flush and debt free

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 23:15 | 6908310 markar
markar's picture

I got a bonus 5 downvotes for your beyond stupid post.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:14 | 6907412 Bear
Bear's picture

Do you think we are a little overmatched with Forrest Gump as President?

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:44 | 6907540 Stainless Steel Rat
Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:56 | 6907579 Berspankme
Berspankme's picture

Insult to Forrest

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:22 | 6907690 G.O.O.D
G.O.O.D's picture

He must be the stupidest sonofabitch alive, and hes not even fast.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:44 | 6908880 o r c k
o r c k's picture

There needs to be a Goober Gump.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:15 | 6907414 Lost in translation
Lost in translation's picture

Read the posters' comments on ANY Vice News [sic] video concerning Russia. 

It's as solid an indicator of American/western ignorance and abject stupidity as any I can presently think of...

Honest to God I wish all of these foaming-at-the-mouth, "AmeriKa uber Alles" freaks were serving on the front line of the war they covet so rabidly.  But then, I'd wager most of them have never served a day in their lives, or can even qualify...

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:25 | 6907454 kerfuffled
kerfuffled's picture

didn't you know vice was agency operated?

 

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 06:38 | 6909241 Flagit
Flagit's picture

 

They REALLY don't like this guy. Special Edition Fight Club poster near bottom of page.

http://thebeerbarrel.net/threads/vice-magazine-gives-me-a-shout-out-blessed-am-i-amongst-men.27958/

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:28 | 6907471 jm
jm's picture

How many USDs you think Russia is burning through a month to fund these activities?

They have reported about $350 mln in the coffers, down from $500 this time last year.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:50 | 6907557 Thorny Xi
Thorny Xi's picture

Billion, not million. Russia has nothing to worry about yet in that regard. They don't owe trillions to thr Chinese, or Japanese, or the banksters, either.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:02 | 6907603 jm
jm's picture

Sorry, typo.

any idea on what the outlay for these activities are.

 

Not saying the US is a model of fiscal virtue.

 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:33 | 6907497 stiler
stiler's picture

I found this most interesting:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ABOJn0UehPc

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:08 | 6907630 Demdere
Demdere's picture

Possibly I am wrong, but I think that ZH is the wrong place to discuss biblical prophesy.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:33 | 6907760 socalbeach
socalbeach's picture

It's not a biblical prophecy, it's from 200 years ago.  Only listened to a minute or so of it.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:34 | 6907498 Smegley Wanxalot
Smegley Wanxalot's picture

Plus Putin's military isn't pissing and moaning about "running out of bombs" like some poorly managed backward ass militaries do.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:37 | 6907510 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

As with anything, I weed out as much speculation as possible and focus on what is fact. Fact is, Putin has made the decision to dig in for the long haul. No one can say for sure whether the decision to join the fight in Syria will prove good or bad for the future of Russia. Another fact is that Putin has thousands of tons of old Soviet Bombs and they seem to do the trick just fine.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:45 | 6907527 jm
jm's picture

I'm not sure Putin can go for the long haul.  The state will be broke if oil prices don't recover.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:52 | 6907567 Thorny Xi
Thorny Xi's picture

And when they do recover, Russia will be fine and we will be broke. Wait. We are already.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:16 | 6907664 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

The Russian Defense of Stalingrad against the best army in the world at that time is all you need to know.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:31 | 6907750 Blankone
Blankone's picture

The economic destruction and downfall and the taking down of the Berlin wall in defeat.

No one is going to roll tanks into Russia.  The attempt will be by economic destruction and using the crook/mafia/traitiors/elite within Russia (like last time).

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:49 | 6908888 o r c k
o r c k's picture

The book Enemy At The Gates is one of the best war books ever. (About Stalingrad) How Russia survived that siege is truly jaw-dropping.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:57 | 6907582 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

Taking an objective look, the whole world is going broke and struggling with political and demographic issues. Things in the U.S. are far from perfect and anything can set the trigger: oil collapse, China collapse, etc. I can't even figure how the conflagration will ultimately happen, I am just fearfully confident that it will.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:04 | 6907615 jm
jm's picture

I'm certainly not syaing that things in the US are perfect.

I'm really just trying to figure out if there is a long-term capability here. 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:34 | 6907772 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

I think there is.  Everyone likes to liken this to the Soviet Collapse, but that was really much more due to loss of faith in the political system.  lWhether the West likes him or not, Putin is popular in Russia and Russians seem to unite and rise to the occasion when facing an eternal threat.  Thanks to short sighted NATO policies of encirclement, many Russians believe Crimea, E Ukraine and Syria are their chance to prempt a new Barbarosa.  Sadly, I am inclined to think they may be right.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:54 | 6907857 jm
jm's picture

I think there are a lot of dispossessed people in the world, and that leads to paranoia, persecution fears, and the extreme dominating in general.

Obama is definitely a fringe character, with all the instincts of a tyrant. Putin is essentially the same except he has a pair. 

Calling a global recession isn't enough.  It is seen as an apocalypse.

 

 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:54 | 6908186 Dark Daze
Dark Daze's picture

Well, Russia goes back at least 1,000 years to when the Ukrainians defeated the Khazzarian Arab/Jews. China goes back at least 10,000 years, probably more. The US? Well, it's only been around for 230 years and from where I sit they have made a complete hash of their country. I don't think a real contest between either Russia and the US or China and the US would be much of a contest, frankly. The US loves to crow about defeating the Germans when in fact it was the Soviet Red Army that did the hard work. If it wasn't for Patton and a lot of luck (and the Canadians on the coast) the entire invasion would have collapsed. Russians don't do things that way. The go in with the intention of completely destroying the enemy. No prisoners, no surrender. Then they consolidate and move forward again. They are tough, resilient fighters, as are the Chinese.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:12 | 6907649 Aeneid
Aeneid's picture

It's a game of "Chicken" to see who goes broke first - US fiat dollars or Russian (Gold).

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:18 | 6907674 jm
jm's picture

The oil market means more than gold  here.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:38 | 6907792 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

Historically, loss of manufacturing capability and manpower is what causes a country or empire to cry Uncle.  With all the talk of sanctions and weak economy, I have seen little in the way of true results.  Didnt topple Iran, North Korea or Iraq, so I think Russia will probably do just fine.  If not, they can always do a strategic default on Western debt obligations, which would like be the trigger needed for the "big one."

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:48 | 6908130 Dark Daze
Dark Daze's picture

Perhaps. What is 'interesting' is that the IMF has voted to amend it's rules and allow any 'US friendly' country to default on their debts while maintaining some kind of sick double standard about every so called 'non-US friendly countries'. The entire Asian/Russian/Europe land mass has a lot of resources. The US has none, other than what they can import, with all the attendant issues over supply chain security. Russia has only 360B of external debt. That is not an insurmountable amount, especially when you consider the amount of gold the Russians have been squirrelling away. At the end of the day, if the US keeps on it's path of naked belligerence towards Russia, they simply don't have to pay. That alone would cause unbelievable tremors in Western financial markets.

I don't know much about Chinese military hardware but I do know about US, Eruopean and Russina hardware, and I can tell you this. In every category, from offensive and defensive missiles, airframes, engines, ICBM's, tanks, survivability, tactics, crusie missiles, stand off weaponry and the possibility for the 'big one', a Tsaz Bomba nuclear torpedo with a 10,000 mile range, the Russians have outdone the US in every category, including troop tactics. The Germans and the French would have to think long and hard before they ever allowed themselves to get sucked into a US war of aggression against Russia, although NATO keeps trying (at US prompting). There is a reason that most of the US Atlantic fleet is in port. They are completely naked. Their vaunted AEGIS systems are useless. Their 'stealth' aircraft, that they have paid trillions to build are easily defeated with either the S-400 or any of the low band radars that Russia has delpoyed into their aircraft, even their old SU-24's. For a fraction of the cost that the US has spent on it's jazzy war toys (that don't work or are unaffordable or can't be maintained in the field) the Russians have devised counter measures that cost virtually nothing. That is the measure of who is doing things right.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 23:30 | 6908389 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

In terms of hardware, ours is little more than a way to distract Americans from the true weakness of the "real" economy and to transfer wealth to MIC oligarchs. Russian hardware is designed to be tough and survivable, plus, they sat back and observed Western strategy in Bonsia, Kosovo, Afghanistan and Iraq, learning that Naval Projection and Air power are our only real strengths. Nothing that can't be overcome by some good missiles and electronic warfare tech.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 02:07 | 6908925 tsuki
tsuki's picture

DM Rogozin said as much in his 2014 interview with Soloviev.  After Georgia, they looked at the readiness of the RF army and equipment which, by his admission, was lacking.  They started the upgrades then.  With a small population, they focused on "smart" weapons.  It did not cost what the US spends.  He claims they get more for their buck (a swipe at the F-35?). 

It was an interesting interview preformed before a live audience.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 23:37 | 6908421 memento_mori
memento_mori's picture

All technical progress in russia is thanks to the german prisoners of war they had.

Most russians are a bunch of drunkards unable to tie their shoes, but they do have beautiful woman thank god as they didnt have to endure the inquisition as europeans did.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 23:54 | 6908500 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

Sparing the dissertation, you give the Russians too little credit. Both the US and SU benefited from the importation of German scientists post WWII. Bear in mind, Russia's military was destroyed by Stalin in 1934. Russians, prior to the purges, had the first airborne division founded in 1930 and huge armored divisions. Aside from that, Russia reconciled the US strength of mass production with the German strength of durability and function. In WWII, the US mass produced inferior gear, but could overwhelm by force of numbers. Germany produced amazing technology, but tolerances were too tight to function in austere combat conditions and the costs were high and production rates slow. The Russians found a way to combine both strengths, case and point the T34.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 02:05 | 6908920 BarkingCat
BarkingCat's picture

Bullshit. The Russians have a much higher educational standard than the US. Also their universities produce real sciences graduates not liberal arts monkeys.
Their biggest challenge is lack of
entrepreneurial spirit engrained in their national psyche, mostly because of nearly a 100 years of soul crushing communism.
Ironically, the West is purposefully crushing that same spirit in their general population.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:36 | 6907709 squid
squid's picture

"The state will be broke if oil prices don't recover."

 

How?

Russia's missles and bombs are MADE IN RUSSIA.

The workers are paid in Rubles, the materials are purchased in Rubles, the CPUs come from China which are purchased in the Yuan the Chinese pay for the Natural Gas with.

Russia can feed itself, clothe itself and fuel itself.

 

I'm not following this idea that Russia will go broke.

 

HOW?

 

Squid

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:43 | 6907820 jm
jm's picture

The broke part has to do with oil prices.  Russia is heavily dependent on oil revenues to finance the budget.  The price of oil collapse is causing a budget shortfall leading to reserve depletion on a massive scale.

I honestly don't know how much these interventions actually cost. Trying to find out, but I don't think anybody really knows.

They probably have decades of ordinance on hand.  But ruble or not, materials to build and replace have a cost. That plane Turkey shot down cost a lot of money to replace.  Stuff wears out and crashes or gets blow to bits. Ca't size this yet.

Russia is in a position such that if they just print money to finance the budget it is instant inflation. Not so with reserve currencies.

 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:05 | 6907928 Reichstag Fire Dept.
Reichstag Fire Dept.'s picture

Vlad's Debt to GDP is under control and if at war with the US, do you really think Vlad is going to continue paying Owe-Bama? Scratch that US$ debt and watch China help Vlad in every way possible!

I was concerned back when Owe-bama was implementing his "Energy Indendence Plan" because it sound like they were going to use their own reserves...how is this a good idea ever? ...to deplete your own oil to you can import forever later?!

No. It sounded like securing your own oil supply before you think your going to war. Vlad's got his, Owe-bama's got his, Turkey is sealing theirs!

Let the games begin!!

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 01:25 | 6908833 Wild E Coyote
Wild E Coyote's picture

There is a lot of talk within China and Russia exactly about that. To forget debts of US and EU. 

Chinese or Russian Governments do not have debt. The Chinese and Russian Corporations do. 

IMF is now advising and supporting Ukraine to forget debt owed to Russia. The payback is close behind for US and allies. 

Full scale war is also not far. 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:23 | 6908025 Dark Daze
Dark Daze's picture

Saudi Arabia will go under long before Russia does. The Chinese have signed multiple deals for Russian gas and oil, the latest being 400 Billion US$ (nominal) a few months ago. The Chinese pay in gold, or Yuan (which is just as good) and not only that, but they have Putin's back and NATO knows it. If any NATO country tries screwing Putin and the Russians over, the Chinese will be there in a flash, and although China is suffering somewhat right now from the world depression, they still have the largest foreign reserves of any country and they have a whole lot more gold that they have ever admitted to, probably something in the rang eof 45,000 tons. Add to that the possibility that they could literally put a military force of 225 million into the field, if required (10% of the population), and I realy doubt there are any idiots in the US who actually believe they could ever be defeated. 

The Russian people as well as the Chinese people have a long, long history of having to survive in deplorable conditions; they are very stalwart peoples. The US and Europe on the other hand, other than the Germans, have a history of throwing hissy fits any time they can't get the last episode of their favorite TV program on the tube. I doubt it would be much of a match up.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:48 | 6908152 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

I agree with pretty much everything you said, I still am not fully sold on where China stands. They look at things in terms of centuries and millenia, so while Russia is an ally now, I wonder if their term strategy views Russia as a large, resource rich land with a shrinking population.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:53 | 6908179 jm
jm's picture

Everybody is a stalwart when they have to be. 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 23:24 | 6908355 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

Most humans rise to the occasion, but few have been tested in the way of the Chinese and Russians. The US has a veneer of toughness that I feel could easily be wiped away. It is impossible to tell until a situation arises to truly put it to the test, but based on what I experienced in Iraq, most US personnel want the cards heavily stacked in their favor and expect the comforts of home to the greatest degree possible. Where we have strength is in greater precision and inter-branch coordination. But, even against enemies with few real advantages, the US has struggled. I really question the sanity of those who think it is smart to pursue policies of perpetual war that will ultimately put us against someone who has more than IEDs and rusty T55s.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 06:54 | 6909258 Flagit
Flagit's picture

Not trying to pick a fight,

but just think of the logistics involven in a 100 million man army. Food, transport, fuel. My brain just exploded.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 06:14 | 6909206 Wahooo
Wahooo's picture

Look at t a little differently. Will Russia's economy collapse before the US economy? I think not.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 09:25 | 6909612 localizer
localizer's picture

The song remains the same.. we've heard it before.. many "experts" were saying it will take a year at $60/barrel for Putin regime to collapse.. how is that collapse going? 90% approval.. oops, LMAO. One thing "The West" don't get: the Russians stick with their leader when times are tough and they are used to be "broke" and can adapt easily, anything beyond broke is a bonus for them - Americans/ Europeans have got so used to their high standards of living that they would be truly fucked if their economy implodes.. they should really be more concerned about their own economies/people instead of the Russians..

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:14 | 6907658 lakecity55
lakecity55's picture

Plus, his forces will be in top shape to obliterate ZATO's moves in Ukraine!

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 20:47 | 6907547 Barnaby
Barnaby's picture

So we know the SU-24 was downed unjustly by a NATO partner and new EU Pledge (Turkey)? Was this a fraternity ritual?

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 02:29 | 6908965 PADRAEG
PADRAEG's picture

UNJUSTLY? LoL

Any attack against Vlad is justified, as he murders, rapes & tortures in his own personal interests. Russians be damned! The country will not recover from Putin's reign for generations, as it disintegrates!

He may well be on the right side with Assad, who knows? But RF will be stuck long after Putin carcass pollutes our earth!

 

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 04:16 | 6909067 bid the soldier...
bid the soldiers shoot's picture

Hyperbole

The country will not recover from Putin's reign for generations

Do you really think the world's supply of in-ground oil will last for more than two generations?

That's what this whole thing as all about, Sherlock.

WHO GETS TO CLAIM THE EXISTING RESERVES OF CRUDE OIL WHEN THERE'S BARELY ENOUGH OIL TO MEET THE NEEDS OF THE WORLD'S MILITARIES.

And the Pentagon trumps Capitalism and commandeers it's essential bodily fluid, crude oil.   

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 06:11 | 6909205 Wahooo
Wahooo's picture

More like a gang initiation.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:30 | 6907744 Ms No
Ms No's picture

I watched the short film "All wars are bankers wars", it left out a few things but I thought it was generally accurate.  I wonder if other Hedgers would agree.  We all know that all wars are bankers wars but it's a matter of how it played out and who the players were.  The film doesn't mention much about the link but being that the Templar bankers were killed off almost everywhere but Scotland has me wondering if the Scottish lodges played a big role in preserving their BS at the time.

On a side note and also not mentioned in the film, it's interesting that the Templars are the origin of the pirate skull and bones flag. 

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/all-wars-are-bankers-wars/

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 02:15 | 6908941 BarkingCat
BarkingCat's picture

All wars being bankers' wars is bullshit.
Most were not.

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 21:59 | 6907892 Reichstag Fire Dept.
Reichstag Fire Dept.'s picture

Vlad "Cruise Missiled" some folks.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 04:29 | 6909079 Egao
Egao's picture

Calibr-ated :) 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 22:44 | 6908135 10mm
10mm's picture

Dear Russia. Keep making robust firearms. Thanks from a Yank

 

Thu, 12/10/2015 - 23:17 | 6908317 Collectivism Killz
Collectivism Killz's picture

Nothing like snuggling up to a VEPR 7.62x54 with a bottle of wine and a cozy fire. Well, hot chicks work too, but I still love my VEPR, at least it won't drain my bank account that much.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 00:17 | 6908622 Joe A
Joe A's picture

Russian planes need to take big detours. 'Liberating' East Ukraine and Kurdistan would significantly shorten airroutes.

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 00:26 | 6908664 onmail1
onmail1's picture

Sooner or later everyone will realize 

that

a conventional war drains your economy

it takes billions (or trillions) to destroy a whole country

a war that drags on & on

with no tangible result

while 

a few (say 10) nukes , one for each city

can do it economically 

costing 100 times less

&

in just a few minutes

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 02:41 | 6908977 PADRAEG
PADRAEG's picture

Putin has destroyed Russia's future for generations. That highly educated elite just can't innovate, somewhat similar to Japan into the 1960s. Putin will never allow them to innovate and create jobs, as then Russians will expect an honest vote... Lol

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 04:36 | 6909085 Egao
Egao's picture

Russia just put on grid a new closed fuel cycle nuclear power plant with fast-neutrons reactor. Your iPhone's sapphire glass is made in Russia. Not to mention US astronauts that ride Russian rockets :) No innovation bullshit. 

You sound like Russian immigrant from 90s. 

I'll just leave it here http://www.sdelanounas.ru/

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 04:56 | 6909112 africoman
africoman's picture

Come again? [evil]

Ruskiy no creative?

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 05:25 | 6909144 Fireman
Fireman's picture

Obviously Paddy aint the sharpest of pencils in the box....

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NePChnsuMNs

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 05:32 | 6909154 peterk
peterk's picture

good place to get long ROUBLE vs  USD

as the war goes well for russia in syria , the rouble will strengthen

russia is on sale at dirt cheap prices.........  people will be amazed they missed the opportunity  by next year imo

Fri, 12/11/2015 - 07:07 | 6909270 webmatex
webmatex's picture

Russia controls the fuel supply of EU and Turkey.

They now have two permanent and unassilable  bases in Syria nestled in the very heart ofl the middle east oilfields.

Saudi fields are particularly large and exposed.

Reggie: Damage to the infrastructure could take years ro repair - if you know what i mean - wouldn't want to see all that production go up in smoke now would we Ronny.

Ronny: Crumbs no Reggie - specially as NATO and EU wouldn't have a fuel supply.

 

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