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You Want War? Russia Is Ready For War
Authored by Pepe Escobar, originally posted at Sputnik News,
Nobody needs to read Zbigniew “Grand Chessboard” Brzezinski’s 1997 opus to know US foreign policy revolves around one single overarching theme: prevent – by all means necessary – the emergence of a power, or powers, capable of constraining Washington’s unilateral swagger, not only in Eurasia but across the world.
The Pentagon carries the same message embedded in newspeak: the Full Spectrum Dominance doctrine.
Syria is leading all these assumptions to collapse like a house of cards. So no wonder in a Beltway under no visible chain of command – the Obama administration barely qualifies as lame duck – angst is the norm.
The Pentagon is now engaged in a Vietnam-style escalation of boots on the ground across “Syraq”. 50 commandos are already in northern Syria “advising” the YPG Syrian Kurds as well as a few “moderate” Sunnis. Translation: telling them what Washington wants them to do. The official White House spin is that these commandos “support local forces” (Obama’s words) in cutting off supply lines leading to the fake “Caliphate” capital, Raqqa.
Another 200 Special Forces sent to Iraq will soon follow, allegedly to “engage in direct combat” against the leadership of ISIS/ISIL/Daesh, which is now ensconced in Mosul.
These developments, billed as “efforts” to “partially re-engage in Iraq and Syria” are leading US Think Tankland to pen hilarious reports in search of “the perfect balance between wide-scale invasion and complete disengagement” – when everyone knows Washington will never disengage from the Middle East’s strategic oil wealth.
All these American boots on the ground in theory should be coordinating, soon, with a new, spectacularly surrealist 34-country “Islamic” coalition (Iran was not invited), set up to fight ISIS/ISIL/Daesh by no less than the ideological matrix of all strands of Salafi-jihadism: Wahhabi Saudi Arabia.
Syria is now Coalition Central. There are at least four; the “4+1” (Russia, Syria, Iran, Iraq plus Hezbollah), which is actually fighting Daesh; the US-led coalition, a sort of mini NATO-GCC combo, but with the GCC doing nothing; the Russia-France direct military collaboration; and the new Saudi-led “Islamic” charade. They are pitted against an astonishing number of Salafi-jhadi coalitions and alliances of convenience that last from a few months to a few hours.
And then there’s Turkey, which under Sultan Erdogan plays a vicious double game.
Sarajevo All Over Again?
“Tense” does not even begin to describe the current Russia-Turkey geopolitical tension, which shows no sign of abating. The Empire of Chaos lavishly profits from it as a privileged spectator; as long as the tension lasts, prospects of Eurasia integration are hampered.
Russian intel has certainly played all possible scenarios involving a NATO Turkish army on the Turkish-Syrian border as well as the possibility of Ankara closing the Bosphorus and the Dardanelles for the Russian “Syria Express”. Erdogan may not be foolish enough to offer Russia yet another casus belli. But Moscow is taking no chances.
Russia has placed ships and submarines capable of launching nuclear missiles in case Turkey under the cover of NATO decides to strike out against the Russian position. President Putin has been clear; Russia will use nuclear weapons if necessary if conventional forces are threatened.
If Ankara opts for a suicide mission of knocking out yet another Su-24, or Su-34, Russia will simply clear the airspace all across the border via the S-400s. If Ankara under the cover of NATO responds by launching the Turkish Army on Russian positions, Russia will use nuclear missiles, drawing NATO into war not only in Syria but potentially also in Europe. And this would include using nuclear missiles to keep Russian strategic use of the Bosphorus open.
That’s how we can draw a parallel of Syria today as the equivalent of Sarajevo 1914.
Since mid-2014 the Pentagon has run all manner of war games – as many as 16 times, under different scenarios – pitting NATO against Russia. All scenarios were favorable to NATO. All simulations yielded the same victor: Russia.
And that’s why Erdogan’s erratic behavior actually terrifies quite a few real players from Washington to Brussels.
Let Me Take You on a Missile Cruise
The Pentagon is very much aware of the tremendous heavy metal Russia may unleash if provoked to the limit by someone like Erdogan. Let's roll out an abridged list.
Russia can use the mighty SS-18 – which NATO codenames “Satan”; each “Satan” carries 10 warheads, with a yield of 750 to 1000 kilotons each, enough to destroy an area the size of New York state.
The Topol M ICBM is the world's fastest missile at 21 Mach (16,000 miles an hour); against it, there’s no defense. Launched from Moscow, it hits New York City in 18 minutes, and L.A. in 22.8 minutes.
Russian submarines – as well as Chinese submarines – are able to launch offshore the US, striking coastal targets within a minute. Chinese submarines have surfaced next to US aircraft carriers undetected, and Russian submarines can do the same.
The S-500 anti-missile system is capable of sealing Russia off from ICBMs and cruise missiles. (Moscow will only admit on the record that the S-500s will be rolled out in 2016; but the fact the S-400s will soon be delivered to China implies the S-500s may be already operational.)
The S-500 makes the Patriot missile look like a V-2 from WWII.
Here, a former adviser to the US Chief of Naval Operations essentially goes on the record saying the whole US missile defense apparatus is worthless.
Russia has a supersonic bomber fleet of Tupolev Tu-160s; they can take off from airbases deep in the heart of Russia, fly over the North Pole, launch nuclear-tipped cruise missiles from safe distances over the Atlantic, and return home to watch the whole thing on TV.
Russia can cripple virtually every forward NATO base with tactical – or battlefield – small-yield nuclear weapons. It’s not by accident that Russia over the past few months tested NATO response times in multiple occasions.
The Iskander missile travels at seven times the speed of sound with a range of 400 km. It’s deadly to airfields, logistics points and other stationary infrastructure along a broad war theatre, for instance in southern Turkey.
NATO would need to knock out all these Iskanders. But then they would need to face the S-400s – or, worse, S-500s — which Russia can layer in defense zones in nearly every conceivable theater of war. Positioning the S-400s in Kaliningrad, for instance, would cripple all NATO air operations deep inside Europe.
And presiding over military decisions, Russia privileges the use of Reflexive Control (RC). This is a tactic that aims to convey selected information to the enemy that forces him into making self-defeating decisions; a sort of virus influencing and controlling his decision-making process. Russia uses RC tactically, strategically and geopolitically. A young Vladimir Putin learned all there is to know about RC at the 401st KGB School and further on in his career as a KGB/FSB officer.
All right, Erdogan and NATO; do you still wanna go to war?
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let's roll! drag Larry krudlow and Lynnsy Graham out of the gay bars, send the to the front lines stat!
We don't want war, the Globalists want war so they can roll in their NWO. Don't support them, we all lose if that happens.
I like and respect the Russians, NovoRussians, Syrians and others fighting to protect the Syrian people including Hezbollah who are also protecting Christian Syrians.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u3d_yxJhmjk
Here is Putin at Christmas Mass that starts at Midnight and goes for 3 hours. He does it every year at a different church. American politicians are at bath houses.
The American white men I have known like Trayvon football thug heroes like little girls. They play fantasy sports and update their Facebook page like little girls. Or get giddy about Star Wars. Pathetic.
Russian men are generally smarter and they are far more serious. they do not cheer on white genocide by Trayvons on the ball field like fu**ing sheep boys.
Hi Freddie. Where do you live? I'm curious.....I like most of what you write.
Thanks.
Pick a country that has the worst puppet President in probably the history of the world.
A puppet installed to destroy the country.
Here is a clue: He is not even from here.
I weep for this country plus the people in Western Europe and elsewhere. They are controlled by evil puppet leaders and an evil newsmedia.
You can say what you want about Putin but he appears to truly care for his country and his people. Assad appears to be another leader.
By the way - I have been to Sweden when I was younger. Beautiful country and people. I weep what the globalists have done to Western Europe and pray that some in Eastern Europe will rise up to help the western Europeans get their countries back and send back the invaders to where they came from.
Somebody explain to me how exactly is that "Full Spectrum Dominance" thing supposed to work in a conflict against Russia or China ? Hint: in such a conflict satellites (military or otherwise) will go out first, probably long before any ICBM launch...
"enough to destroy an area the size of New York state."
Jesus Christ get your number right. That is enough to destroy New York CITY, not New York State. A weapon powerful enough to destroy a state is unusable because the debris injection into the atmosphere will kill everyone on Earth. Tsar Bomba only had a destructive radius of about 60 miles (ie unsheilded people 60 miles away get third degree burns), and that was 50 MT.
partly true. regarless of the specifics for this weapon, most developers figured out the problems with one big and high yielding bomb like the Tsar Bomba. Hence the development of MRV and MIRVs. So basically (and I do not know the specifics of this weapn) it is still possible to destroy a "state of ABC" with many MIRV like lower yielding weapons to prevent fall out on the other side of the globe. After all, there must be a winner in a nuke confrontation.... *sigh*
Want to see a revolution in Germany tomorrow? Have Merkel start shooting at the Russians today. All the Muzzies in quick order will wish they were back in Syria, where they could at least shut their mouth and blend in. Here in Europe -- not so much.
and why should Merkel start shooting at Russians, today (or tomorrow)?
the German armed forces are engaged in assistance to a Franco-Russian war effort, remember?
you are one of those asking for a Big War, asap, or a Great Catastrophe, or a Grand Resolution, or Whatever, As Long As It Involves "Bang!"
Here in Europe -- not so much
and this... includes Russians. it's not Europe's Peoples that are pining for a set of revolutions, or Something Big To Happen
stop projecting and open your eyes
Y’know, the west is notorious for being duplicitous, changing its mind and reneging on commitments.
What would make nut job Erdogan think the west/NATO won’t flip and find a good excuse to leave him out on his own to get eaten by the bear.
What other choice will there eventually be? Erdogan is too dangerous and crazy to be allowed to stay much longer, plus, he and his clan have been outed for supporting ISIS. US/NATO probably hope Russia will find a way to do it for them without causing too much of a disturbance that might draw NATO further in......or NATO wants to be drawn further in. Who knows anymore? Everything and everybody is being played, but the public is gradually waking up, and all the info is out there for anyone who wants to educate themselves on how these terrorist groups survive with the support of the West.
Our leaders have a lot of problems to deal with, and most of them involve the common man and his Internet connection. It isn't so easy to lie to us anymore and get away with it. Because of the economy, millions of workers are either un or under employed, which gives them more time and motivation to learn about why they don't have jobs. Everyday, thousands of Baby Boomers retire or cut back their work load, giving them more time to spend on the web. Many find their way here, or to other sites where the discussions and debates rage. Secrets are hard to keep, and TPTB are very nervous. All the evidence of their fear was on display last night in the debate, where the main theme was BE AFRAID, THE SKY IS FALLING, MORE MONEY FOR THE MIC, MOAR WAR!
I live in SC, and wanted to vomit on Lindsay Graham last night. He was about to cry for our poor Muslim friends and somehow sees himself as their savior. Said he would be building little schoolhouses all over Iraq & Syria. He's been to the "War Zones" 36 times, which leads me to believe he has an Arab boyfriend(s). But when was the last time he visited the poor regions of this state? We had badly crumbling infrastructure even before we were hit with a 1,000 year flood a few months ago. We have failing schools and wide areas engulfed in poverty. Much of this state, and all across the deep South, is rapidly becoming a 3rd world shithole, with no jobs and no prospects, and Lindsay Graham and his ilk dress up and play war games. He is a fucking JAG officer - a military lawyer - ensconced in safe zones and heavily protected wherever he goes...but he sure does like to pretend.
Turkey is a Black Swan event. A Black Turkey event
"A Black Turkey event"
Sounds like Thanksgiving at my mother-in-laws.
dats rayc- oh ur talking about her cooking.
Im rayciss!!
Cooking is one thing blacks can do well. It's not nuclear physics.
OK.
I'm born & raised in NJ. Left the States in 1978. Been living in Scandinavia since ´81.
Yepp, it's a ga'damm shame. Unbelievable how the place has deteriorated. I'm just glad the Russians & Russian Leaders still have their sanity; their counterparts in the Usa are for the most part totally wacko.
You're a 'sane' voice in that wilderness. B Good & Take Care.
Banks want governments and people to be afraid and to spend money on _______. If a war breaks out, then at least one side goes bankrupt and can't pay its debt to the banks. My bet is there is no war. Plenty of posturing and spending money on guns and bombs, but no war.
So what word would you use to describe the things going on in Syria, Yemen? I mean other than the obvious violations of UN laws and national sovereignty. Heated Twitter exchanges?
Oh, those are police actions.
They gain by looting the spoils of commodities and trinkets, the real money.
I've marveled at the bankers loaning worthless paper to Dick brained bureaucrats, knowing they would default, and then legally loot the country from the non-participants. The borrowers should be treated just as the evil bankers, slowly drowned in the black tank of a cruise ship.
I like the drowning idea, but why a cruise ship when there are plenty of port-a-johns with holes big enough to shove their heads in?
So are the women as fine as they say they are? Are they friendly and do they like Americans? Has the population been substantially impacted by the arrivals of the refugies? Is it worth visiting? TIA
mein bruder!
Hi Freddie, I used to like your said country in my earlier days, but a decade or so I had the complete u-turn seeing how menace indeed the Empire is... it's really an Empire of Chaos (borrow it from Pepe Escobar), has been causing turmoils and deep pains even great destructions everywhere the beast is exporting its democracy, freedom, human rights and its wonderful R2P program.
Some lethal alien dual-ID parasites have been taking over the great body and turn it into the giant lethal monster inflicting the relentless suffering to the entire world incl. the inhabitants of the said body :-( ...pretty sad situation but nearly helpless nowadays but to witness the demise of the hollowed-out body for the sake of the true world's peace!
the top civilian war-making savvy of the u.s.: barack and ashton.
victoria nuland knows more than both but she ain't no putin.
Given that one does not need to be a US citizen to be POTUS, would Putin beat Trump?
Or would they be good drinking buddies?
Hopefully share a few bottles of Bourbon and Vodka. Trump knows his real estate holdings will be worthless after a nuclear exchange and his $Billions will not save him or anyone else. Nobody can get to their underground bunkers in less than 1/2 an hour so even if his $ survived there'd be nothing left for him to spend it on.
First Strikers have months to move into their new posh digs. They have shit canned that dinosaur bunker in Greenbrier and have 7 new really large ones all connected underground. We the people are super fucked (if we aren't vaporized), condemned to eating sardines out of an irradiated can with soggy saltines.
Trump doesn't drink...or smoke, and never has.
I completely agree with you. He always seemed insightful and very reasonable to me, and I admired his careful articulate approach to diplomacy and creating a cooperative relationship with the US. It has been frustrating to see him rejected year after year for more than a decade. Even now, I'm impressed by the strength of his patience and resolve in light of all this B.S.
...I really fucking hate the oligarchy here. Those limp dicks are going to end up killing so many people over nothing.
Here's Vlad on who created ISIS
http://www.globalresearch.ca/president-vladimir-putin-who-armed-the-terr...
all this vlad talk reminded me of a song https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bN7VBhU_QWk
The Globalist want domination not war. They pretend to be able to fight a war.
This blog post is perhaps the most transparent piece of Putin worship ever submitted by one (or more) of Putin's propaganda trolls.
All NATO wargames recently resulted in Russia's favor? Really? Where exactly does one come by that useful tidbit of data? NATO posts wargame results on a Yahoo! board somewhere?
And Russia has unstoppable Mach 21 missiles, whereas NATO is just chilling on its laurels, unable to figure out how to make its own missiles go that fast?
How does inane shit like this get reposted on ZH?
The US is far behind in rocket tech.
The US buys all rocket engines used to launch satellites from the Russians.
The US can't even get into space (re: Int'l space station) without Russia and Kazakhstan.
"How does inane shit like this get reposted on ZH?"
That's how.
"“Russia currently pays Kazakhstan $115 million annually to use Baikonur Cosmodrome, plus $50 million every year for maintenance, under a deal signed in 2004. That agreement is slated to expire in 2050.” This is a pretty good deal considering the following, “NASA Administrator Charles Bolden sent a letter to Congress Wednesday saying the agency would need to pay $490 million to Russia for six seats on Soyuz rockets for U.S. astronauts to fly through 2017. That comes to nearly $82 million a seat, up from $71 million a seat. Since the retirement of the space shuttle in 2011, NASA has relied on Russian federal space agency Roscosmos to provide seats on its Soyuz spacecraft to send U.S. astronauts to the space station.” Further, “At the moment, Russia is the only nation capable of launching astronauts to the International Space Station. Russia’s crew-carrying Soyuz spacecraft all launch from Baikonur…” In addition, the US buys its rocket engines used for satellite launches from Russia and will need to do so for years to come. The American space program seems to be completely dependant on both Russia and Kazakhstan. What would happen if they decided to cut the Americans off?"
Reproduced from my own article accessible here.
I believe the US launched a lot of satelites and sent a few people into space without Russia. Never looked very deep into it but the story was that it was an economic decision. And do not confuse satelite launches with anything military. Russia does have some excellent (as far as we know) tech for it's military missiles but there seems to be a lot of hype.
This article is like the claims that Russia shut down a US naval ship with their super secret "ray cannon". Then for good measure the story changed to claim Iran actually developed the ray cannon and gave the tech to Russia and Iran will disable any plane that approaches Iran and all the US navy ships in seconds with it.
Pepe discredits himself with this article. It is much hyperbole.
If Putin has any intent to fight NATO and wants to avoid nuclear tactical nukes he needs to grow a pair and actually act and stand up to NATO. Putin cannot even declare a no-fly zone over Syria. What will most likely happen is Putin will be pushed back to Russia. He can keep his bases and a good portion of western Syria for years but he will pay a price.
Or Putin is just a party to the plan to destroy these countries a theory Russia's past action in support of NATO's/UN actions attest.
"This article is like the claims that Russia shut down a US naval ship with their super secret "ray cannon"."
This is the article you are refering to, I think.
Not exactly a ray cannon.
Tupolev 142
No, that is not the article. The articles about how Russia shut down an entire US navy ship such that it could not be steared or sailed, then the story went that the crew mutinied once the ship was towed to port and refused to reboard the ship and left the navy. Then the story became that it was done by russia by using an airplane mounted version of a device developed by Iran. That evolved into how Iran had a land based version of the device called a "ray cannon" that could knock down enemy jets out of the sky, disable missiles fired at Iran and (of course) disable any enemy ship.
It is all a wonderful bit of fantasy. But it is perplexing. Russia is the powerful bear you do not want to poke, Putin is the super duper tough guy you better never mess with (see Putin wear judo outfits and ride a horse with no shirt) and Iran has developed the secret new technology that makes them invincible (which was shared with Russia/Putin making them now invincible) - but in reality they have been incapable to act while making a great show of fluffing their feathers and crowing.
I have not read that one.
It sounds like something one might see on beforeitsnews.
Took me under a minute to find a source, not too difficult. Not a pro-Russia site either, as they speak of a Russian "invasion" of Ukraine. The war games were for a Russian attack against the Baltics only, however.
http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/09/18/exclusive-the-pentagon-is-preparing-...
'Ochmanek has run the two-day table-top exercise eight times now, including at the Pentagon and at Ramstein Air Base, in Germany, with active-duty military officers. “We played it 16 different times with eight different teams,” Ochmanek says, “always with the same conclusion.”'
We live in a time when every decent man, announced " as supporter of Putin."
If you are honest, decent, and you have a conscience, then you will be called a "supporter of Putin."
You categorize nationalists and homophobes as "honest, decent, and with a conscience"? I will assume you are a Donald Trump supporter; this man isn't worried when people openly compare him to Adolf Hitler, either.
Nationalist? As opposed to what? Internationalist? Then call me a Nationalist.
Not a homophobe, but what do internal social issues have to do with war in the ME? Social issues are just another wedge in the Globalists tool box. Rights, rights rights! Very little discussion of the responsibilities that go along with those rights.
The America you remember quit the arms race, quit exploring space and started getting fat and lazy off wall street and promoting muslims in Armerica. Russia and China never stopped developing newer technology. The media would have you believe we are still THE most powerful country. Sadly, that is not a true statement and simply repeating it over and over wont make it any more accurate or correct. Take for example the F35 piece of crap, the military lowered its standards because it cannot perform like earlier jets. Our missle defense system is a joke now, there is no way to combat a supersonic missle. The phalanx guns on ships cannot even mechanically keep up with those things. You can burry your head in the sand and believe the media hype or you can come to the realization that our government has decided it was more important to steal the peoples wealth and make plans to get out of the country when shit hits the fan. Just go look at how many government officals have dual citizenship. Or how many have homes in other countries. As they say, their kids go to Harvard and our kids go to war.
"Promoting Muslims"? What does that mean? To give immigrants from the Middle-East the same opportunities to build out a prosperous new life as European immigrants were previously given?
I thought that to roll a New world order a world was needed.
Comrades, Vlad is bleeding petro-dollars faster than he can procure replacement dollars.
Please proceed post-haste to your local Western Union and support this 'malinki mooshina'. He urgently needs your support and your dollars (notice I did not say 'rubles').
Please - stand with little Napoleon in his time of need. Do it now. He's fighting quagmire wars that have no end date and his primary means of finance is drying up quickly. The Russian people are tired of always being someone's victim, someone's bag man. Let the Russian people have at least one success this millenium. If you do this we will re-build communism into the hope of all mankind. You will be so proud!
Some of you have sent vodka in the past. Vlad appreciates this, but most of all you must send dollars! Do it now!
I'm no Putin sycophant, but I fear what will happen to America when the Zionist NWO types destroy the dollar. Americans have become soft, and soft populations tend to strong leaders to save them when the shit hits the fan. Which is exactly what the Zionist NWO types have in mind.
God forbid that individuals should take charge of their own lives and stop supporting such leaders.
Thankfully, if you decide you don't want a nation or government, the rest of the world will respect your non-borders.
Private property has borders and individuals have a natural right to voluntarily organize to defend their property. Free individuals would have greater incentive to protect their own property than the US government which obviously has little interest in protecting the national border.
Free individuals don't have nukes, tanks, missile systems, etc. But dream on, brother.
You're right. Individuals could not voluntarily pool their resources for common defense. Only when those individuals are forced to give their money to a small group of elitists whom they've never met and who have no concern for them can defensive arms be obtained.
How could I have not seen that before? Thank God for big government, the F-35 and the USS Milwaukee.
Curse the Devil for big government, the F-35 and the USS Milwaukee. But all this shit exists and when you ignore it you speak in terms of academia and not reality.
I actually don't see our huge military doing much good around the world against peasants with AKs.
Let us spend our taxes, defense is unlikely to unfunded, just speaking for myself. So many toys in a modern civilization, I do believe they would not be able to keep arrlines working.
https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/07/05/bunny-bangers/
https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/11/20/ghandis-terrorists/
We run this country. It does't work if we don't want it to run. IF it doesn't run for us, it doesn't run for them. They can't deal with that. We can demonstrate it any time we want, e.g.
https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/01/08/operation-afghanistan-1000...
Really, they can't even contemplate winning.
https://thinkpatriot.wordpress.com/2015/02/17/why-patriots-can-win/
But we could get very poor together.
You're missing a critical word- Individuals could not voluntarily pool their resources for the successful common defense. Without even getting into the timelines and internal conflicts associated with the inevitable tragedy of the commons, individuals are currently pooling their resources along the southern US border and not succeeding in stemming the incoming tide of either aliens or drugs. The US MIC may not be the best or most efficient fighting force, but they are a successful deterrent, or the cartels would simply swat the volunteer flies who are no match for them.
More Urban than Redneck, it seems to me.
Read mine above. If peasants in Afghanistan can do it with AK47s in a poverty-stricken 34d world country, I bet a bunch of clever guys wit hall of our technology and flows of chemicals and goods through a very complex system can do so much better.
You have no imagination. My neck is redder than yours, I think.
Only a member of the armchair ignoratti would think that the Afghans are winning in Afghanistan. Go ask the parents of a fun sized terrorist how that "voluntary resistance effort" is working out for the common defense of their loved ones. The goat fuckers haven't defended anything successfully for over a decade, Afghanistan is an OCCUPIED country. Winning and #WINNING are not synonymous.
The subject at hand is DEFENDING against EXTERNAL aggression, and whether voluntary collective efforts can be effective in this day and age. Against any force larger and more organized than the Hatfields or the McCoys, the answer is unequivocally - no.
The math simply doesn't reduce to 1 inevitable victor and 1 inevitable vanquished, and whether the US is winning or losing in Afghanistan is irrelevant (whether the resistance in Afghanistan is either voluntary or collective is another can of worms you ignored).
Imagination is no substitute for experience.
A 4 man team can cause absolute havoc with supply lines to feed and fuel brigade sized field units. Read some Sun Tsu man.
https://www.sonshi.com/original-the-art-of-war-translation-not-giles.html
I recommend Chapter 6 at a minimum.
Causing havoc is not victory. The are two problems with the American perspective (and the 3% lunatics in particular) they don't know what victory is, much less how to achieve it, and 2) the sum total of the experience that only a few of them actually have is waging military actions on someone else's home territory.
The most popular delusion of the insane mob is that when they come for them, that are any other options than surrender and walk out, or be carried out. With a non existent leadership, force structure, unit cohesion, financial and industrial base there is are possible (but improbable) paths to victory, but it comes at the cost of very large number of those wanna be Rambos, who don't understand that they WILL have to give their lives, AND their loved ones' lives IF they want even the chance of victory.
Victory is only achieved when the other side realizes they have lost. Reducing or eliminating the ability to fight is how you bring that about. In fact it is the only way to bring that about. A $4.3mil tank does you no good if it doesn't have fuel to run, and an M1 that runs out of fuel is costly to bring back into service. This is what the military DOES, and why the US daesh campaign has been a total cluster fuck. Not taking out the oil convoys (funding the ability to fight) was a such a fundamental strategic error that it HAD to be intentional. Environmental bullshit excuses be damned.
It's like you've never read any history ever.
Victory is achieved when the enemy is vanquised or retreats from the field of battle.
Realization, or even self actualization in an aspiring Bonaparte is an internal phenomenon, unlike victory. Battles and wars are often won by the contributions of individuals who realized "they had lost".
The notion that the US government is going to loose a war of attrition on its own territory and retreat to God knows where is beyond ludricrous.
In the war between the states the south must not have been able to lose, since they were neither vanquished completely nor could retreat to anywhere. General lee didn't surrender because he didn't realize the south was lost. Same with the Japanese in WWII, Vietnam, and any other conflict ever in the history of mankind.
I'm sorry, but you don't know how things work in warfare or what victory actually is.
You misconstrued or misunderstood what I wrote. It was a simple 15 word sentence in English with one spelling error and less than 1.5 syllables per word. And it accurately and concisely describes the reality of every example you cited. Wars are almost never ended when the leadership of the eventual loser realizes that there is no path to victory, Switzerland (with its shockingly low casualty counts over many civil wars) is one of the few exceptions that proves the rule.
"Americans have become soft..."
exerpted From Clipper Ships and Captains
by Rosemary and Stephen Vincent Benet
There was a time before our time,
It will not come again,
When the best ships still were wooden ships
But the men were iron men.
...
Nowadays the ships are made of iron and the men are made of wood.
This is not Putin has built 800 FEMA camps in the United States.
Anyone who scolds Putin can at any moment be as a prisoner in one of this 800 FEMA camps. Then he will be able to continue to criticize Putin, 24 hours a day until his death.
Dude, the Chinese have his back, you are acting stupid about money.
Russia has much more than oil.
And your freshly printed/ponzied digital dollars really...and made in the USA production is ...is...isnt.
All we make is weapons.
That's sick.
bill
Your telling me the USA has zero natural resources and produces nothing? and yeah China will help russia to blow up there biggest customer. GFY bro - you can drink the putin kool-aid all you want - but at least be level headed about it.
The US has plenty of natural resources, but what it mainly produces nowadays is a bunch of people who think the gravy train will never end because "Murica!" China and Russia don't have to blow us up in one fell swoop. All they have to do is maneuver us into making mistakes that weaken us over time while making other potential customers stronger.
By all indications, we're playing their game, not ours.
Goods don't move without money moving.
The prolblem for any organism is "Where is the energy flow?"
The problem is NOT the energy input so much as the energy outgo, in the case of heavily indebted nations. The difference is what you can use for defense, and what has bankrupted us.
Actually, quite a strategic advantage to Russia over the last 14 years while we have been wasting $Ts on keeping our Israeli-Neocon's heads out of nooses by making everything worse and worse, each a step toward their totalitarian rule.
Putin was strong enough to begin organizing a Nato of Victims. We have too many victims, all of our natural 1st world allies and all of the more recent ME nations we have attacked with either bullets of $s to buy their rulers. Our remainign 'allies' in the ME are some version of taking the US for a ride and small authoritarian bastards even more unhinged than our own Israeli-Neocons.
We couldn't beat him at checkers from this position on the board.
Well worth the 45 minutes
Pepe Escobarhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRhbs_m463A
The Next War
Ah, PutinLover, latest incarnation of multibanned retard Amerikan Patriot.
Very primitive thought, at the level of chimpanzees, sorry...
ace do some homework - his debt to GDP is marginal and on absolute terms is a rounding error compared to the USA
Do not poke the Russian Bear. For hell's sakes they are the largest contingent of Western Civilization left east of the Atlantic!
it's seldom to see all the usual "suspect" words in two sentences like this, so I can't resist
first, I agree. Do not poke the Russian Bear. second... no, it's not a cuddly Teddy Bear
third, no, Russia is large in terms of territory, but not in terms of population, in your "they are the largest contingent of Western Civilization"
fourth, yes, Russia is part of "The Western Civilization". but the largest part of it on both sides of the Atlantic is still the 28 countries of the EU, with a total of 500 millions
"The West", on the other side... is becoming a more and more difficult term to describe or properly define
Pepe Escobar in this article brings us a little gem: "the Russia-France direct military collaboration". As a reminder, it's a collaboration with German assistence
who wants war? many sides, and they are having wars. in the case of Syria and Iraq, a whole set of separate and interlocking wars
who wants... a big war?
only some very, very strange and completely propagandized minds, be from Dr. Krugman's "we need something that makes America great like WWII" to some radical fundamentalist religious bigots convinced that The End Of Times has to come soon
Interestingly, this group is made up out of Jews, Christians, Muslims and Atheists, Zionists and Anti-Zionists, pro-this and anti-that, conservatives and liberals and socialists and anarchists
It is the most heterogenous grouping of people the world has ever seen, and they all get dizzy at the thought of a big war, each for his/her own "reasonings", and some for profit
if you are one of those "Big War Idiots"... a heartfelt invitation to get your head examined, or jump from the next bridge. This world does not need you
Since Reagan, the terms president and cartel druglord have been interchangeable. American air bases at home and abroad have been used for drug running. (See http://www.militarycorruption.com/sabow-3.htm) In the past 30 years, while military whistleblowers like Colonel Sabow got murdered for talking too much about generals who became rich men from drug dealing, the government has spent trillions of dollars on near worthless military hardware. Jets with defective oxygen supply systems that kill pilots. A live H-bomb accidentally dropped from a bomber on a training mission. New destoyers that break down almost as soon as they leave the dock.
Meanwhile, Russia has built ballistic missiles with greater throw weight than any American ICBM, cruise missiles that can be launched from 1,000 ton ships, a military GPS system more advanced than the one the USA has. But then, the USA was busy hiring drugged drone pilots to send drones to blow up civilians in the Middle East to appease a deranged president busy hoovering up lines of coke when he is not underlining names on his kill list.
Russia's military hardware is 20 years ahead of the hardware the U.S. military has, with the exception of computer technology. And Putin has plenty of faults, but he is not a cokehead whose career is based on complete falsehoods about his life. Unlike Obama. You can't trust liars.
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Russia are ready and very capable and will be joined by Iran in the early stages of WW3, who else throws in their hat is anyone's guess!
When this takes place there will also be an exposure of who really runs the planet.....
http://beforeitsnews.com/conspiracy-theories/2015/12/is-russian-presiden...
The exceptionally stupid believe God has chosen them.
can they be so exceptionally stupid that even after conducting and losing every one of 16 different war game scenarios (with conditions favorable to NATO winning) they will still continue poking the bear? certainly looks that way.
You assume that they are not after the same goal. Two weak trees can lean on each other.
God has chosen people...just not many and not usually who you'd expect.
"The exceptionally stupid believe God has chosen them."
Not me. I chose God!
If you weren't a fag you would choose the Goddess....
And the US continues to chart its course into a robust assfucking.
Never gonna happen. If so, send your kids you dirty ZIO fucks.
i see some people around here saying that the collapse of the financial house of cards is still years away. all of this escalation by the empire has me thinking that it might be a lot closer, especially when its done in the face of such extinction-inducing odds.
If the Israeli-Neocons lose power, they hang.
Now what do you think?
War isn't as profitable as it used to be. If you're the victor, what's your prize? Syria?
Eretz Isra-el, why are you confused?
I don't care for regular Israel. Why would I want any Ersatz Israel?
Israel has a difficult time controlling the current "occupied territories." Eretz Israel isn't going to happen. Why? Because war isn't that profitable any more.
I don't want war....but i'm sure I won't have a choice
Everyone always has a choice. You can say you don't, that is a choice.
Think about it. So many easy ways to make changes, no killings, of course, very safe for everybody. Folks, did you all see the CIA manual on sabotage that went around a while ago? Do you work for a company whose slow-down would ding our lords and masters?
Well, what are you waiting for. We, the citizens, can shut this system down tomorrow and keep it down as long as we want. We just have to want that, and we all agree on a time.
Come on, this is easy.
We just have to want that, and we all agree on a time.
LOL.
Most people wouldn't agree on the weather, and demand safe spaces from your radical ideas...
There is nothing radical about his ideas.
It`s only when the sheeple in the West see death and destruction on their own doorstep, when the TV`s go out, when they have to fight for their food and water just to sustain themselves, when their houses are a pile of rubble, when they realise that hollywood was just a load of American bullshit propaganda spread over the whole world for decades and that superman doesn`t really exist, then, and only then they will wish that they had got of their fat arses earlier and made their voices heard. Unfortunately, we live in a surreal world where evil has won and unfortunately for us all, the stoneage beckons.
Alleppo will look like the garden of eden.
OK, time to crack open a beer and watch dancing with the stars.
"I don't want war....but i'm sure I won't have a choice"
No, you won't. Once again:
"Why, of course the people don't want war. Why would some poor slob on a farm want to risk his life in a war when the best that he can get out of it is to come back to his farm in one piece. … But after all, it’s the leaders of the country who determine the policy, and it’s always a simple matter to drag the people along whether it’s a democracy, a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to greater danger. It works the same in any country." — Nazi Reichsmarschall Hermann Goering
So prepare accordingly.
You have a choice, just made it and published it. Thanks for withdrawing your consent. It helps to encourage others you know to do the same.
I fully expect to wake up one morning to no power, internet, or phone and have no way of knowing WTF is going on. Shit, we have no way of really knowing what's going on now, but at least the blender still works......
Get a Geiger counter. You may have a way of finding out.
You might prefer a war survey meter. Geiger counters are about 100 times too sensitive for that kind of work.
Don't buy a Russian one, no matter how cheap the price may be.
Get a short wave radio.
That runs on batteries.
America needs to topple this diminutive nincompoop Vladimir.
Job 1 after the election needs to be regime change in Russia.
It's already been tried. And found wanting.
JoBlama has a 30% approval rating, Putin 70% plus....who needs regime changing? American's are dumb but they know something is wrong.
I thought it was over 80%.
Can't stop meddling, can we. Can't stop giving people good avice and play the benign while preparing perpetual war.
....Putin Lover. How many hyrvinas ya' get per comment? Go eat your potato and shut up. https://duckduckgo.com/?q=potatoes+ukraine&ia=recipes
job 2 breaking all your typing fingers.
nah. we could remove your hands and feet and you would still submit your crapy comments with your hook nose or tongue,
You need to get back to giving shrillary a blowjob
Amerika needs to nuke Tel Aviv and put in jail the Zionists dual passports holders . Only then we will have a chance .
We swaggered some folks off
NATO was never supposed to "beat" the Soviet Union in an invasion of Western Europe, the whole premise was to buy time until major American reinforcements arrive. I don't think that has changed.
What reinforcements? The 103rd Pansy Brigade from Fort Tenderlion District in San Fran? The 69th Ghey Trooper Brigade from Fort Lauderdale? Anyone with a brain has told their kid they are a moron to fight for Soros, Zuckerberg, Zollywood and The Pentagram.
What a joke. Go look at the miners and farmers from Novo Russia aka Eastern Ukraine. Men like Givi, Motorola and Zakarchenko. Hard men who are serious and are not updating Facebook pages and going to Starbucks,
The Ukraine had supposedly an army as big as France's as of 2010 and one of the biggest in Eastern Europe.
They were beaten by NovoRussian farmers and miners raiding old WW 2 weapons in museums to have weapons to defend themselves against Kiev. They were using 1930s recoiless rifles against Ukie tanks.
Many Ukies got hip and realized that zio-Kiev was using them as cannon fodder.
American males like idiots worship Trayvon thugs and Jameis rapist quarterbacks like little cheerleader girls. While also playing fantasy football like girlies.
How will they do against Russian miners and farmers who will fight to the death. Who are backed by the best programmers in the world, who have the best rockets, missiles and ICBMs in the world along with the best fighters in the world?
Good fu*king luck.
Yeah, Russia the high tech paradise. The same place that just banned TURKEY from building stuff in their country. That wanted to buy two warships from France. That can't get any arctic oil fields opened up because they no longer have western partners to do the actual, you know, work and stuff. That needs China or the EU to produce the undersea pipe stock and cable they need to get their raw materials to market. That is holding home cheese-making seminars all over the country because nobody wants to buy the dreck being sold in place of the European product they used to get. You got that? They aren't even any good at making fucking cheese and you think they're the Wehrmacht reincarnated.
Just what does Russia make exactly? I mean, apart from Soviet legacy goods?
They make rockets that the US and rest of the world uses for space travel. They also make good weapons that are not expensive. What does America make besides hamburgers and $300,000,000 warships that don't work? Well we can claim facefuck and twatter.
So they make Soviet legacy goods, as I said, and not much else.
Would you really want to play the Russian hand rather than the NATO hand in the big game for all the marbles?
NATO is a paper tiger - beyond US there is nobody there - France and UK have nothing - Germany isnt going to fight with Russia
USA is a long way from Ukraine and Syria - Iran is on deck in the neighborhood and so is Russia in Ukraine
Unlike the wonderful F-35 disaster that costs $100 million per plane? Great new Americant weapons, right?
Russian legacy goods built 40 years ago destroyed the fuck out of modern US weapons in Iraq. The Russian RPG7 designed in 1961 has been destroying M-1 Abrams tanks in Iraq. Dig a little deeper than the lame stream media to find out how many. LOL
So you're saying that you'd prefer to play Putin's cards. Got it.
Russia is developing. America is collapsing. The U.S. simply cannot make jet planes or rockets anymore. Russia can. The Russians are strong and can handle the coming collapse. The Americans are weak from fluoridated water and GMO food.
The Russians have extensive underground shelters for most of their population, while the U.S. has them only for the 1%, at taxpayer's expense.
Russia is backward but moving forward. America is moving backward economically, productionally, and spiritually.
Unlike Russia, America has succumbed to the blandishments of greedy psychopaths.
I find I am getting weary of these Putin Team / Not Putin Team debates...they are exactly on par with the Red Team / Blue Team debates...the idea of "nations" is every bit as mind-numbing dreary as the concept of "choice" in kabuki elections. It's all just a bunch of angry masturbation with no closure. I find myself tuning out even more and not giving a fuck. Just about every "nation" on this planet is run by a cadre of self-centered elitist douchebags, all belonging to and partnered with self-centered elitist douchebag parties and corporations. War, no war, prosperity, despair...whatever. Thinking you can influence them or one is better than the other is the pinnacle of ignorance, because if you think that way chances are you are part of that system. Get the hell out of the matrix, make a break for reality and prepare for the aftermath of folly.
Don't forget the most lethal Russian weapon of all time - the AK47. Cheap and extremely dependable, it has probably killed more people in battle than any other single weapon. Used by revolutionaries, guerrillas, insurgents, freedom fighters of all flavors, the AK is their dependable companion all around the globe. Elegant simplicity.
The more defensive side with the fewest exposed pieces on the board, the shortest supply lines, the least-divided objectives AND the largest resource flow of motivaed and trained people aganst mercenaries? Who couldn't play that side better?
The only Israeli-Neocon advantage is that Chaos is all the need for their 'win', but that isn't playing so well any more.
The need a big and bad false flag, but you know, they really aren't good enough ot make us believe those well enough any more.
They are losing in the court of public opinion, MSM does not control the agenda as they need it to, and the attempt is too obvious for world citizens to continue to believe. AND the cash flow begins drying up NOW, did you notice no one is loaning the US $ now? All treasury sales, net, are to CBs.
Rocket engines.
I said: apart from Soviet legacy goods.
And the Obama-induced anomaly is about to come to an end anyhow.
Yes, rocket engines, indeed.
See my post above for links and references.
"....apart from Soviet legacy goods."
Naturally they kept the best of what remained. The real question is, have they improved on it? I would in their place.
food in Russia is about 1,000 times better than that processed shit they sell in Safeway.
they have good clean food which is why their women are so hawt.
An (involuntary) influx of nordic genes is another possible explanation.
And who is making you buy your food from Safeway? I'm sure you could get some Russian friend to mail you some, if you feel that strongly about it. But stay away from the cheese.
Seriously, though, I have no issue with the Russian people. What I object to is the silly one-sided propaganda that paints Government A as a paragon of virtue and Government B as irredeemably evil. I have put my faith in neither Prince Vladimir or Prince Barack, or rather I have put my faith in both of them-- for I am confident that they are equally selfish and power mad people who believe that their own judgment outweighs that of anybody else in their realm. Those who disagree need to be silenced. Those who cooperate need to be rewarded.
I care nothing for the validity of their respective outlooks but merely about the precedent they are BOTH setting of taking the world backwards towards a renewed rule of absolute monarchs who feel perfectly justified in tearing up the rule of law whenever it suits their own individual schemes.
Offer us an alternative then. Something that can actually work. Otherwise you're just part of the same noise you disdain.
Kindly provide us with specific examples of Putin tearing up the rule of law.
There was talk recently about Putin burning food which could have been sent to starving Russians. Putin was demonized for this by the western media, but none of the MSM outlets spoke of the reason why he did that, instead putting it down to sanctions and counter-sanctions. Putin destroyed that food because it was 'GMO-laden poison.'
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eo9pXGXer8k
they'll fight them with porn, opiates and debt while telling their kids that gay is ok
America is done for but the big question will be if Russia will go after the Illuminati or will they just be happy to be crowned the next world policeman instead
Absolutely. REFORGER (Return of Forces to Germany). US/EU GDP is more than 20 times that of Russia. US/EU population is 6-7 times that of Russia. Even though Russia is illegally breaking out of the various nuclear arms limitation treaties, the US/UK/France probably still have some margin of superiority there. All sea access from Russia to the world is blocked by US and allied nations.
Sure they can do some early damage, but once they are roped off-- they wither and die. Or go nuclear. NATO has no need or desire to escalate. Russia has no choice in a real shooting war. The first finger on the button belongs to someone whose initials are VVP.
The only western European country that could form a decent army (maybe) is Germany. NovoRussia aka DPR and LPR would kick the rest of European countries asses. The Germans would be tougher and maybe the Brits.
Why would Germans fight for EVIL scum like Merkel destroying Germany? Putin and the Russians are largely white Christians. You think Germans are going to fight for muslim germany so they can keep being f**ked by their evil govt?
The second and third western European countries are UK and France. Also being f**ked by their politicians turning their white countries into Islamic hell holes. The UK police looked the other way as muslims raped young English girls. You think British men are gonna fight for that?
The Poles may be dumb enough to fight but they see the Muslims flooding in and they fought Islam 300 years ago at Vienna.
The Western Europeans would beg Putin to invade if he promised to send the Muslims home. Most Americans and Canadian would beg the Russians to send the muslims home too.
Russia and Novo Russia and a few other places like Hungary and the Czech Repub have real men who do not want their countries destroyed by islamo and third world refugees.
PS - go f**k yourself with ZATO.
KGB agent Putin is a white Christian. Sure he is. He shows up for a photo op to benefit the state-controlled religion every now and again. It does wonders in fooling the easily gulled.
I've been trying to figure you out Tarabel. At the beggining I just thought "well he has a different opinion". But then after a while I realized, you don't actually have an opinion. And I'll tell you why. Because intelligent people with opinions, after finding out about new facts or new information, either outright change it or at least re-analyze it. But not you. You just follow what limited knowledge you have and try to agressively defend it with personal attacks. You already showed us you have the ability to predict the future ("it's going to happen!") so please elucidate us further of how the future will unravel (the gospel according to Tarabel).
So only two conclusions here: Either you are paid troll to say these things and to shift public discussion (it's already been proved that Western intelligence agencies do this on a fairly regular basis) or you are a fool, who can't open his little shithead to even grasp the knowledge that has been bestow upon you by much more intelligente people around here.
So with that in mind, I bid farewell you terrorist supporter.
Kind regards
Don't forget about Finland Freddie.
They are extremely tuff. The Finns had, depending on which sources you use a 30:1 - 50:1 KillRatio against the Soviet Union during WWII.
How do I know this? I've lived in Finland for 3 years. My wife is Finnish.
this isn't the old cold war nuke scare anymore.. these days 100 nukes in all directions can strike in less than 20 minutes. You want to keep laughing at Russia for being in the stoneage? Sure, force them to bring everyone back to rubble... goad them into a nuclear pearl harbor type attack
Oh stop it. Nobody is going to be goaded into a nuclear war. It's going to happen whether Putin likes being ridiculed or not. Or Obama. Or any other luciferian tool sitting on their respective secular throne. It's going to happen.
Prepare or deny, it's going to happen. Stop pretending that surrender or appeasement or anything else is going to save you. It's going to happen.
I love the certainty. So good, I get to sleep at night peacefully.
About the guarantees ...
'Surrender or appeasement' are my only choices here? Why should I accept that? If we could get the FUBARed government out of the way, I am just positive we could play positive-sum games with the world. We are not all incompetent in this country, I have worked on many good products, world-wide shipments.
But the our wonderful NSA went and used our wonderful commuication and computer products as a way to penetrate everyone's networks, so that market has dried up as they have found new sources.
NOBODY can have ANY certainty about 'the future'. That is unknowable land, it arrives, very unexpectedly at times, no guarantees as to the condition.
And any other cliam is a lie by definition.
Population as a Metric?
look the technology Russia has is superior in rockets - US - France - UK aircraft carriers are meaningless in the face of 1,000 mile missles and submarines
SA is going to be wiped out and so is Turkey - once done this may end the US aggression for a generation
"Even though Russia is illegally breaking out of the various nuclear arms limitation treaties, the US/UK/France probably still have some margin of superiority there."
Wrong on both counts, tarabel.
It is the US who have not respected the terms of any nuclear treaty - the US and Israel, that is. The Russians have a slight advantage over all the allies combined, despite the fact that the allies have about 5-10% more warheads. When China is considered, it's about even. Even so, Russia has better tech, tracking, speed, range, defense, and deployment, and leadership, too.
1) Russia is illegally breaking out. It is not the US that is slobbering about its new toys, nor will I bother to get into a technical discussion on the subject. If you don't believe, you don't believe. Doesn't matter. War is coming, no matter what you believe.
2) I had no idea that Israel was party to the US/Russia arms limitation treaties. But I suppose their arsenal should be added to the other western allied powers' inventory-- which gives them a somewhat larger margin of superiority than I suggested.
3) Russia has to spread its targeting over all of Europe and North America, plus many overseas bases all around the world. Not to mention US allies in the Pacific and Asia. The western SIOP would have a smaller target list in a much more restricted geographical space to deal with. Which means that they probably can hold back a substantial second strike capability that would further enhance their margin of superiority after any initial exchange.
4) The real unrecognized breakout power is China, which is building like crazy and unhampered by any bilateral agreements.
5) Russian weapons always look good on the details that the Kremlin leaks to the world. Have you seen any of their weaponry in action that does anything which was not displayed by the US during the First Gulf War in 1991? Not what they advertise, but what you've seen in action against a hostile foe? If it was Lockheed Martin that were making these claims of invulnerability, you would indignantly deny them. Since it is Putin propaganda factory cranking it out, people swallow it whole.
6) Russian leadership = At once, Comrade Putin. Whatever you say.
7) American leadership = At once, Comrade Obama. Whatever you say.
I'm sure there are many fine weapons in their inventory, as there are in ours. But that 25-1 lead in GDP is very hard to overcome in any "materiel schlact". The Air Force is crying over only getting 187 5th gen F-22s, yet Russia cannot match even 1/2 of that humble total and never will. Much less the thousands of F-35s coming along. Even if they aren't Fokker Triplanes, that's a lot of networked air power to deal with. I doubt that I ahve the technicl expertise to understand what they are trying to do with the plane but I'm sure it will ahve some effect on the battlefield even at worst. At best, it could be a revolution in air power-- a swarm of carefully-directed hornets going after lonely Russian Red Barons. And you'll soon see inferior Chinese and Russian knockoffs of the plane they ridicule so badly. You can count on that.
. . . __