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Something Just Broke In The U.S. Silver Market

Tyler Durden's picture




 

Submitted by Steve St.Angelo via SprottMoney.com,

After looking over all the figures, it seems as if something broke in the U.S. Silver Market this year. By that, I mean the normal supply and demand forces no longer make sense. I believe this stemmed from the massive amount of physical silver investment demand beginning in June as financial and geopolitical events pushed the retail silver market into severe shortages.

To start off, the United States has been the largest importer of silver in the world for many years. Even though India has imported more silver recently, its annual amount has fluctuated widely, while the U.S. has been more consistent.

For example the U.S. silver imports have ranged between 4,500-6,000 metric tons (mt) a year, while India imported between 2,000-7,000 mt. Overall, the U.S. is the clear winner by importing a total of 39,500 mt of silver from 2007 to 2014, while India totaled 31,700 mt.

To put these metric ton figures into perspective… look below:

  • Total U.S. Silver Imports 2007-2014 = 1.27 billion oz
  • Total India Silver Imports 2007-2014 = 1.02 billion oz

The reason the U.S. imports so much silver is due to its large industrial silver manufacturing industry. Here were the top five industrial silver fabricators in 2014, according to the 2015 World Silver Survey:

  • China = 5,788 mt
  • U.S. = 3,902 mt
  • India = 1,470 mt
  • Germany = 652 mt
  • S. Korea = 652 mt

While China is the largest industrial silver fabricator in the world, it also produces a lot more domestic silver than the U.S. In 2014, China produced 3,568 mt of silver, while U.S domestic mine supply was only 1,169…. three times less. So, the U.S. must import more silver than China to meet its total fabrication needs.

Furthermore, the U.S. Mint has been producing more Silver Eagles each year, which requires additional imports of the metal. Now, with that basic ground work, let’s look at why the U.S. Silver Market dynamics were altered this year.

Something Changed In The U.S. Silver Market

As I mentioned in several articles, U.S. silver imports surged at the beginning of the year. This continued with another whopping 533 mt of silver imported in September for a total of 4,476 mt for the first three-quarters of the year:

U.S.-Silver-Imports-Q1-Q3-2014-vs-2015

Thus, total U.S. silver imports are up 798 mt from the 3,678 mt imported last year during the same time period. Which means, the U.S. imported an extra 25.6 million oz (Moz) of silver this year over last. That’s a lot of silver.

NOTE: These U.S. silver imports are bullion and dore bars. Silver bullion is high quality bullion ready to be used as investment or fabrication, while dore bars are semi-pure bars poured at the mines needing further refinement.

Why all this extra silver? Was it due to industrial demand? Well, let’s take a look. These next two charts show the change in U.S. industrial silver imports and exports (Q1-Q3) compared to last year:

U.S.-Industrial-Silver-Imports-2014-vs-2015

According to the USGS, the U.S. imported more silver waste silver scrap (4,710 mt vs 3,690 mt), semi manufactured forms (795 mt vs 252 mt) and powdered silver (664 mt vs 436 mt) in the first three-quarters of 2014 compared to 2015. The total silver imports of these three industrial categories was 29% lower this year compared to 2014.

Okay, how about U.S. industrial silver exports:

U.S.-Industrial-Silver-Exports-2014-vs-2015

Here we can see the same trend. The U.S. exported less silver waste scrap, semi manufactured forms and silver powder this year to date compared to the same period in 2014.

NOTE: There are two other categories of industrial silver imports-exports, however I did not include them as their total figures were much smaller than the three listed above. In addition, even though total U.S. silver waste scrap tonnage is significant (11,000 mt ytd), it turns out to be only worth 33 cents an ounce.

Now, if we take the net change for Q1-Q3 2014 vs 2015, this is the result:

U.S.-Silver-Market-Dynamics-2014-vs-2015

As we can see in the chart above, the U.S. imported 798 mt of silver bullion and dore bars Q1-Q3 compared to last year, but industrial silver imports (silver powder & semi manufactured forms) were down an astonishing 771 mt and industrial silver exports were down 353 mt.

When I made the chart above, I only included the two fabricated silver components of semi manufactured forms and silver powder. So, as total silver imports surged, industrial silver imports plummeted while industrial silver exports declined significantly.

Again, why did the U.S. import so much more silver this year if industrial silver supply and demand were down considerably compared to last year. If U.S. silver imports continue to be strong for the remainder of the year, it could reach over 6,000 mt. The last time the U.S. imported that much silver was in 2011.

I went back and looked at the data for 2011 and found some surprising results. If we compare U.S. silver supply and demand for the first three-quarters of 2015 vs 2011, this is the outcome:

U.S.-Silver-Market-Dynamics-2011-vs-2015

Even though the U.S. imported 284 mt more silver bullion and dore bars during the first three-quarters of 2011 than during the same period this year, industrial silver imports were 161 mt higher and industrial exports a staggering 1,150 mt larger. So, it made sense for the U.S. to import 6,300 mt of silver in 2011.

However, this wasn’t the case this year. So, again… where did this silver go? Maybe some of it went into the surging physical investment demand. If we look at the next chart, we can see that U.S. Silver Eagle sales hit a record 47 Moz this year:

Silver-Eagle-Sales-vs-Avg-Annual-Price

While total Silver Eagle sales were 7 Moz higher this year versus 2011, the Comex silver inventories also fell from a high of 184 Moz in the beginning of July down to 158 Moz currently:

COMEX-Silver-Inventories-DEC-18-2015

To sum this all up, the U.S. has imported 20% more silver in the first three-quarters of 2015 compared to last year while industrial demand has fallen considerably and the COMEX silver inventories declined 26 Moz from its peak.

So, for whatever reason… there is more silver coming into the U.S. than the market dictates. Of course, physical silver investment demand is much higher this year, but it doesn’t account for all the extra silver imports. Thus, some large entities must be acquiring silver off the radar.

Why Did The U.S. Silver Market Break From Its Normal Market Dynamics

According to the USGS silver import-export data, the U.S. Silver Market is behaving much different from previous years. As I stated, U.S. silver bullion and dore bar imports hit a record 6,000 mt in 2011. However, this was due to elevated industrial silver demand and exports.

This year, the U.S. is on track to import 6,000 mt, but industrial silver supply and industrial exports are down considerably. Which means, the huge increase in U.S. silver imports must be due to physical silver investment demand. This doesn’t make sense as the price of silver is trading at a four-year low.

As I mentioned, there was a large decline of silver inventories at the COMEX this year. Furthermore, according to the 2015 Silver Interim Report by the GFMS Team at Thomson Reuters, they show a 17.1 Moz net decline of Global Silver ETF inventories, while physical bar and coin demand rose to 206.5 Moz this year.

Looking at the following chart from my article, DEATH OF PAPER GOLD & SILVER: The Data Proves It,

Silver-ETF-Build-vs-Coin-Bar-Demand

We can see the drastic change of investor sentiment for physical silver bar and coin over Global Paper Silver ETFs. In over the past five years, Global Silver ETF inventories experienced a net build of 18.2 Moz compared to 994 Moz of physical silver bar and coin demand. Moreover, that figure is conservative due to the fact that the GFMS Team at Thomson Reuters does not include private silver rounds (bars) in their data.

Again, something broke in the U.S. Silver Market this year. I believe it had to do with the beginning shock of a possible Greek Exit of the European Union and continued by the threat of a U.S. and broader stock market collapse. Even though the Fed and Central Banks continue to prop up highly inflated over-leveraged Bonds & Stocks, this is not a long-term sustainable economic policy.

At some point, investors (especially wealthy investors and institutions) will start buying physical gold and silver to protect wealth before the collapse of the Greatest Ponzi Scheme in history begins in earnest. It will only take a small percentage increase of new buyers, say 2-3%, to totally overwhelm the precious metal market. When I say 2-3% new buyers, I am referring to those currently invested in paper assets.

The U.S. Silver Market broke a trend this year which I believe is significant going forward. While precious metal investors may be frustrated by the low paper price of gold and silver.. the fundamentals for owning the metals are stronger than ever.

 

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Wed, 12/30/2015 - 18:49 | 6979856 SolidSnake961
SolidSnake961's picture

traditionally unedible relic of barbarions

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 18:59 | 6979883 Barnaby
Barnaby's picture

I get into barfights. For thirteen years I collected teeth until they changed the amalgam. So I suppose you're right.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:22 | 6979956 Captain Debtcrash
Captain Debtcrash's picture

As shown here, silver is one of the few assets that are worth buying at the prices we see today.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:00 | 6980060 beemasters
beemasters's picture

"By that, I mean the normal supply and demand forces no longer make sense"

So what's new again????

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:11 | 6980303 AllThatGlitters
AllThatGlitters's picture

Check out the whipsaws in price today: 

Live Silver: http://www.pmbull.com/silver-price/

So what's going on here?  Normal market forces or something else?

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:47 | 6980409 strannick
strannick's picture

David Collin Year in Review has a great graph, showing the ratio of precious metals price to precious metals stocks has never been lower for the miners.

I'm loading the boat and am only telling you guys cause as alternative internet malcontents, I know you have no money.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:13 | 6980498 I Will Explain All
I Will Explain All's picture

A).  Miners always seem to underperform the metals market. 

B).  Sprott Money makes some of the worst calls I've ever seen.  Zerohedge only posts their shit b/c it matches their 'buy gold' mantra. 

 

FFS Zerohedge has been calling market collapse for like 7 years now, and they've been saying buy gold since 1500. 

I know they were right in calling the whole gold market bubble, but they seem to have missed the exodus in the 1500-1800 region.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:29 | 6980530 strannick
strannick's picture

Likewise ZH has been calling the inflation money bubble, and the central bank stupidity bubble and the government/ wall st. corruption bubble and the NWO military bubble and the peak Langley/NSA spook bubble, the stock bubble, the bond bubble and the derivative bubble

These are the bubbles that make the gold bubble narrative silly,

Sorry the 2016 collapse is taking its time, but ZH called the 2008 bubble if that helps 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:09 | 6980643 brockhardman
brockhardman's picture

It will take blood in the streets before the paper value separates from the market value.  And by blood, I mean banksters.  And by street, I mean Wall St.  But expect WW3 before that happens.  In fact, expect it next year.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:58 | 6980768 wee-weed up
wee-weed up's picture

 

 

Unfortunately, silver is such a tiny market compared to the rest of the market...

It is very easily (and shamelessly and illegally) manipulated by TPTB...

Comes the revolution... rope... lampposts...

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 00:38 | 6980859 MANvsMACHINE
MANvsMACHINE's picture

This must be why silver is spiking higher tonight.

Up 6¢ to $13.93! Yeah!!!

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 00:52 | 6980881 new game
new game's picture

surging...

silver is a cool color,

old people like it,

yea- it is a buy here...

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 06:45 | 6981155 VinceFostersGhost
VinceFostersGhost's picture

 

 

 

 

Paging Wynter Benton....please pick up the white courtesy phone.

 

Let's roll....

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 04:49 | 6981111 Farqued Up
Farqued Up's picture

It will sort itself out, no help needed. All it takes is one spark of lost confidence in the ungrounded system and it will twist the pendulum off its base in a blink. Try going to the stores for supplies before a hurricane hits and watch the stores empty out.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:12 | 6980917 strannick
strannick's picture

FFS Zerohedge has been calling market collapse for like 7 years now, and they've been saying buy gold since 1500.

Zerohedge wasnt even around in the 1500s

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 02:36 | 6981009 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

on a long enough timeline... Oh Wait!

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 06:46 | 6981157 VinceFostersGhost
VinceFostersGhost's picture

 

 

I was around at $256 gold.....just sayin.

 

 

I like to be early.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 09:21 | 6981298 SoilMyselfRotten
SoilMyselfRotten's picture

Do you know what the price was in 1500? Of course ZH said it was a buy.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 08:17 | 6981223 aurum4040
aurum4040's picture

Shit when did you start reading zerohedge.com, 2010? Zerohedge and Sprott both have been pounding the fiat FRN drum for 10 years + you idiot..You're mind lives in a vacuum like the rest of the sheeple 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:45 | 6980410 strannick
strannick's picture

.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:45 | 6980411 Soul Glow
Soul Glow's picture

We are litterally waiting for a large supply of silver - or gold - to not be delivered.  This is the only thing that will break the current system.  Otherwise the dollar will forever slowly hyperinflate until one day a beer costs $20.  No one will notice before then.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:04 | 6980631 Proctologist
Proctologist's picture

At that point I'll have to switch from Miller to pabst blue ribbon ;)

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 03:04 | 6981030 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

You ever hear of butt chugging? I can't imagine actually drinking those beers, and because of your screen name I thought...

Never mind...

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:06 | 6980061 beemasters
beemasters's picture

The question is how long can the disconnect continue. Any answer?

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:23 | 6980134 Kamehameha
Kamehameha's picture

The Fed can do this longer than you can stay alive.  1913-2013, so maybe 2015-2115 or so? 

2115, that's it.  That's when their system may break, but they get a new system all their's the same day...

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:45 | 6980225 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

they strip assetts out of buildings before they pullthem, WTC7 style

in this case the comex is the building wired up

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:55 | 6980254 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Nope. The Fed is done. It won't exist in five years.

All Jew-run central banks will collapse in the face of their own inadequacies and the crushing weight of financial innovation in the blockchain space.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:46 | 6980586 logically possible
logically possible's picture

I don"t think the Fed is done. The new gig is in place and has been for some time. See www.imf.org
This is the new boss, same as the old boss. Your current U.S. fiat is worth .677 cents to buy the SDR. As more sheep trade over to the new SDR fiat, the price to buy will go even higher and the value of the current U.S. fiat will keep going lower. Currently $1.47 U.S. to buy $1.00 SDR  If I calculated correctly, about a 32% loss on your U.S. fiat. I haven't completely rapped my head around how this will effect commodities. But I'm sure they will get manipulated down to the value of the SDR somehow. 

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 02:46 | 6981013 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

 "how this will effect commodities. But I'm sure they will get manipulated down to the value of the SDR somehow. "

 

How the hell is that supposed to happen?

 

OK, so let's just pretend you're right (and US fiat goes to .677 vs. the SDR). Why? Because the FED prints more or less debt out of thin air than the rest of the currencies which are printed out of thin air? Is that how the SDR is valued? How much fiat you print out of thin air?

 

Or

 

Is the SDR somehow, loosely based upon physical PM holdings (which is a total secret to everyone). & in that case, if the US has no gold and a declining fiat value to the SDR, what's going to be used to 'manipulate it down'?

 

These postulations are absurd.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 04:16 | 6981089 edotabin
edotabin's picture

OR.....

The SDR can be backed by ignorance and kool-aid drinkers. It may take 2-3 decades for the sheep to see through that smoke screen.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 04:56 | 6981113 Farqued Up
Farqued Up's picture

Firepower, overwhelmingly demonstrated.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 10:19 | 6981436 LawsofPhysics
LawsofPhysics's picture

You are contradicting yourself again.  The Fed, via it's primary dealers has been in the "blockchain space" since the inception of the internet.

If the the Fed is "done", then the blockchain space is a bust.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:50 | 6980425 The Next Millen...
The Next Millennium is Now's picture

"The Fed can do this longer than you can stay alive."

Or until the rest of the world stops playing the US dollar game. I think I'll stick around a few more years to see how it all plays out.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:21 | 6980938 Salami
Salami's picture

So basically I been buying more silver this year then my local jeweler. Interesting.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:00 | 6979886 Uchtdorf
Uchtdorf's picture

Insert usual "Wake me up when silver hits $50/oz." here.

Although silver (and gold) will eventually achieve the status it deserves, we should just be happy it's easy to acquire now.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:13 | 6980309 TheRideNeverEnds
TheRideNeverEnds's picture

More like wake me when it hits $5/oz

 

Sure I fell that silver and gold will not go appreceable lower than current levels, I also felt that way @20 and have been an incrimetal buyer since that time.  Looks like we are making a strong base here however metals could easily drop another 50-75% from current levels before reaching historic support.  USD being cleanest dirty shirt etc etc.  The true test will come once the fireworks kick off next year.  Not the pyrotechnics canceled by the cowards in Europe, the proverbial ones.  I fully expect metals to have a brief washout to the downside when everything gets sold.  The fun part is owning metals alone will not protect one from what is on the horizon.  That is why I am well diversified into a strategic combination of lead, steel, brass, WC844 and other things. 

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:03 | 6979898 Theosebes Goodfellow
Theosebes Goodfellow's picture

Shit man, from the headline I thought you were going to tell me that silver Eagles had busted down to under 6 for $100 or something.

Go back to sleep, folks. Nothing to see here.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:42 | 6980019 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

ASE's $6.49 premium over spot at the LCS (& been that way for awhile).

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:42 | 6980394 stacking12321
stacking12321's picture

$6.49 is high unless you really need cash & carry for some reason

silver.com has them for $16.98 shipped, $4.12 over spot

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:19 | 6980675 bamawatson
bamawatson's picture

not to be rude mr stacker, but using your figures, spot is $12.86. 

when? where?

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 02:27 | 6981004 stacking12321
stacking12321's picture

not rude at all, thank you for the correction.

i think i meant 3.12 not 4.12 at the time

currently it shows spot price 14.00, silver eagle price 16.99, so 2.99 over spot.

http://www.silver.com/2015-1-oz-silver-american-eagles/?utm_source=compa...

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 02:49 | 6981017 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

So great. If you want your Ag purchases to be tracked (by purchasing online), plus, the risk of a shipment error &/or not being to be able to see or hold what you're buying... Knock yourself out & save $2

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 04:23 | 6981095 stacking12321
stacking12321's picture

i don't care at all about purchases tracked.

risk of shipment error is near zero, i've probably made 50-100 purchases and never any shipment issue. and they are supposed to be insured as well but i've never had a need to test that.

going from 2.99 premium to 6.49 premium on silver is $3.50 difference.

$3.50  is exactly 25% of $14.00 spot price.

so, yeah, if you feel like getting 25% less silver for your buck than i do, knock yourself out, i don't mind, just leaves more for me.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 08:53 | 6981252 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

My LCS, more than once, has had a shipment to THEM disappear. I'm not criticizing you. Everyone has their own motivation for doing things. Also, for purchases over $1,000, ZERO SALES TAX is charged, so that's another motivation besides the seeing it, feeling it, and anon factor.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:21 | 6980515 Jack's Raging B...
Jack's Raging Bile Duct's picture

Here is a little secret. Buy a 100oz or say ~1000oz bar of silver bullion, though any quantity will do. Take it to a US Mint. Cite the 1792 Coinage Act, Section 14. Ask for Dollars. Expect friction, but be firm.

You're welcome.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 02:51 | 6981023 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

I'd expect friction from my ass sliding along the pavement after a firm kick in the ass. & if I put up a fuss about it, I'd expect the police to confiscate it in the process of disturbing the peace. Whether I was right or not would not be likely to make a difference.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 10:41 | 6981490 jakesdad
jakesdad's picture

step 1  silver

step 2  ?

step 3  profit!

 

step 4  buy winnebago b/c you've taken your last flight...

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 08:23 | 6981229 PirateOfBaltimore
PirateOfBaltimore's picture

I may seriously try this next time I'm back in Philly, after I do some more research to see if that section was repealed.

 

Seems like the only thing that has changed is for the US Treasury redeeming silver/gold certificates, where as this is merely asking for silver coins from silver bars...

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 10:46 | 6981506 NoDoomForYou
NoDoomForYou's picture

Section 14. And be it further enacted, that it shall be lawful for any person or persons to bring to the said mint gold and silver bullion in order to their being coined; and that the bullion so brought shall be there assayed and coined as speedily as may be after the receipt thereof, and free of expense to the person or persons by whom the same shall have been brought. And as soon as the said bullion shall have been coined, the person or persons by whom the same shall have been delivered, shall upon demand receive in lieu thereof coins of the same species of bullion which shall have been so delivered, weight for weight, of the pure gold or pure silver therein contained: Provided nevertheless, That it shall be at the mutual option of the party or parties bringing such bullion, and of the director of said mint, to make an immediate exchange of coins for standard bullion, with a deduction of one half percent from the weight of the pure gold, or pure silver contained in the said bullion, as an indemnification to the mint for the time which will necessarily be required for coining the said bullion, and for the advance which shall have been so made in coins. And it shall be the duty of the Secretary of the Treasury to furnish the said mint from time to time whenever the state of the treasury will admit thereof, with such sums as may be necessary for effecting the said exchanges, to be replaced as speedily as may be out of the coins which shall have been made of the bullion for which the monies so furnished shall have been exchanged; and the said deductions of one half percent. shall constitute a fund towards defraying the expenses of the said mint.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 10:49 | 6981514 MopWater
MopWater's picture

Would this work on, say, another large coin from a different country? Say a Chinese Panda perchance?

I'd think my old man would love exchanging that for some eagles.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:41 | 6980173 The Merovingian
The Merovingian's picture

Your wish is granted. APMEX 1oz Silver Bars.

http://www.apmex.com/product/27086/1-oz-silver-bar-apmex

Hope the Eagles follow ... They are getting close 6 for $103.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:03 | 6980474 stacking12321
stacking12321's picture

got some 10 ouncers at $14.65/oz shipped on ebay today, they are sold out now but you can find real deals once in while there

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 04:07 | 6981079 stormcrow
stormcrow's picture

You can preorder 2016 ASEs for 2.49 over spot from SDBullion. That makes six for $98.80 as of this writing.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:07 | 6980296 Takeaction2
Takeaction2's picture

I just bought another 100 oz today...I love it when it shows up...onto the raft it goes. 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:53 | 6980446 Clowns on Acid
Clowns on Acid's picture

eh ...would love to shove a 20 oz bar up Bernanke's ass.... then into Buffet's gob....both sideways of course...

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 18:49 | 6979859 J S Bach
J S Bach's picture

The silver market has been broke since it made its natural run up in the early 2000s.  It's not a "market" at all.  But those who collect it for savings purposes know the wisdom of its inherent worth.  The manipulation cannot continue ad infinitum... and it will again find its proper place among the "precious" metals.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:00 | 6979873 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Silver will find it's "proper place" around $8 to $12 an oz.   

It will go on like that for about 30 years, when a new bunch of "investors" come up through the ranks and don't remember the last irrational runup.   Many things are cyclical.   It often happens on a generational basis, when the collective/living  memory of the last "boom" has faded.    Without that long past memory, younger people believe the next rally that "this is the one". 

It happened in 1980, and the living memory of that event is pretty much gone. 

 

 

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:00 | 6979889 johngaltfla
johngaltfla's picture

Because JPM needed it to break to get out from their horrible short positions while silver was above $40 per oz....

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:05 | 6979906 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Thank you for making my point. I knew someone would.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:11 | 6979923 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

You have no fucking point.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:23 | 6979960 kliguy38
kliguy38's picture

he's a JPM troll

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:59 | 6980057 agNau
agNau's picture

She.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:56 | 6980256 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Xe.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:02 | 6980622 NuckingFuts
NuckingFuts's picture

He. She. Xe. All I see is 29 weeks on ZH. Yeah, I may be cocky having just cracked my 5 year mark and many other longer than myself but I pretty much ignore anyone under 2 years, where have they been? Yahoo? Huffpo? Moms basement? .gov troll? Or just some dumb ass who found this site and think we care about their opinion. Bitchez!

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:33 | 6980702 Almost Solvent
Almost Solvent's picture

And it only costs $5! to dig it out of the ground!

 

Master Bates / Johnny Bravo we hardly knew ye!!

 

Buy Solar! Great tip Leo K!!

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 00:46 | 6980872 WSMassiv
WSMassiv's picture

That was funny. Lol... Thank you and happy new year.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:07 | 6980910 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Not to mention Spaulding Smailes, Math Math, GoldenMiddleFinger, William the Bastard, abiggs, and countless others...

Cheers, and Happy New Years my fellow ZHers...

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 03:21 | 6981042 MsCreant
MsCreant's picture

They don't even know.

His name was Cheeky Bastard.

His name was Project Mayhem (he was Goldman Sachs over at Mish's site)...

His name was Miles Kendig.

Her name was Howard Beale.

Her name was Marla.

His name was gordon_gekko. (Gold, bitchez).

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 08:56 | 6981253 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

all replaced by fonestar, YAY! :-/

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 02:49 | 6981018 Blythes Master
Blythes Master's picture

+1000

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:04 | 6980281 El Oregonian
El Oregonian's picture

Obviously. What else would the poor bastard be doing on a silver story other than to stroke his master's tool in defiance of the obvious manipulation.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:43 | 6980964 Vex
Vex's picture

Why on earth would there be a manipulation down in a downtrend?

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:18 | 6979940 Barnaby
Barnaby's picture

You're right. The next time silver hits $50, a Ulysses won't be worth a square of Charmin.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:02 | 6980069 NeverForgetSilver
NeverForgetSilver's picture

With all the silver miners losing money and operating at losses, we know the current price is not justifiable. Like what happened in late 19 90s and early 200$, silver  miners became so few and governments had to liquidate their stockpile, in a few years, the price had to rise to attract investment. Otherwise the supply will not meet demand and price spikes.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:43 | 6980400 frankly scarlet
frankly scarlet's picture

Never forget....please remeber most silver is a by product of mining for other metals so when lead zinc and such becomes unprofitable to mine then silver will be also.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:53 | 6980748 NeverForgetSilver
NeverForgetSilver's picture

This is doubly bad since the market cannot survive without the 30% of the products from primary silver mines. In addition a lot of base metal mines are also unprofitable and they have to scale back production and may go bankruptcy as well. Base metal is massively over produced due to over investment caused by persistent high profit margin since 2000. 

 

We are facing a perfect storm in silver. With silver reached 50 twice in the last 35 years, you haven't seen anything yet.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:32 | 6980336 LoneStarHog
LoneStarHog's picture

"You can't spare just one square?"

"I don't have a square to spare."

Now, who remembers this famous conversation?

There are times when that square is priceless.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 00:08 | 6980794 Automatic Choke
Automatic Choke's picture

how about a ply?

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 00:45 | 6980871 EINSILVERGUY
EINSILVERGUY's picture

That would be Elaine Betis and the Hottie from "The Lost Boys"  Jamie Gertz

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:24 | 6979964 nmewn
nmewn's picture

Apparently you missed the point somewhere along the line in valuing/pricing things in dollars or euros or yuan or etc.

Cuz, a piece of paper always holds its value!...lol.

Bankruptcy courts are full of people who think that way too ;-)

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:59 | 6980059 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

You missed the point that none the wealthiest people on earth or even the 1% or 10% didn't get to that point by holding PMs

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:19 | 6980116 booboo
booboo's picture

and the bottom 99%-90% lost all theirs holding the same shitty paper, go figure.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:24 | 6980139 oooBooo
oooBooo's picture

PM's aren't about gaining wealth.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:29 | 6980160 nmewn
nmewn's picture

And you missed the point where they conned their way into paper wealth. How much is paper with ink on it worth to you?

Does it have & hold value like say, the NYT's newspaper or is it more like a Playboy magazine type value? ;-)

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:23 | 6980681 swamp
swamp's picture

Federal notes are debt instruments not money.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:33 | 6980170 bshirley1968
bshirley1968's picture

Right.  They got that way by using their bankster ponzi paper scheme to rob the rest of the world blind.  As far as I am concerned, anyone who thinks like one of them or thinks what they did and are doing is okay, IS one of them......a low life, evil, POS.

I have to use their paper because that was the world into which I was born, but I revolt with every oz. of PM I buy and will continue to do so until I die.  I will also pass it on to my children, friends, and other family members.  Someone someday will benefit from what I have done when the little bankster house burns down on them.  Hope I am around to kick their sorry asses back into the fire when they try to run out.  They will just be getting a taste of what they are about to get for an eternity.

Bottom line, men of character, which you know nothing of, would rather stay poor and humble than to become filty rich by robbing everyone else around them.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:48 | 6980257 Squid-puppets a...
Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

Anopheles, before i give any of your future posts the slightest consideration, please advise how the US will resolve the debt issue without significant -if not hyper- inflation, resulting in significant commodity price increases in the multiples

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 06:28 | 6981144 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

When the US dollar crashes, it will take PMs down with it.   Not quite as much, but PMs will be worth a fraction of what they are today.   I'm talking about value, not price.  

It's the strong dollar and strong economy that's propping up PMs.    PMs are a luxury, and when the US dollar crashes, so does the world economy. 

The last small worldwide economic hiccup was in 2008.  It was a worldwide event.   What happened to PMs?  Did they rise?  Nope, they went down. 

Yes, AFTER that PMs went up, but that was primarily due to trillions in QE, and the excitement that rising gold prices created, combined with zero interest rates. 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:57 | 6980263 tmosley
tmosley's picture

Warren Buffet literally did. His silver was bought from him for a huge amount of dollars and government favors that continue to this day.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:14 | 6980928 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

Who would junk this? That is exactly what happened, Buffett gave up his entire silver horde of 130M ounces or so to get SLV going and got a paltry $9 or $10 an ounce for it.

Officially anyway...who knows what kind of extra bones they threw the old man.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 06:43 | 6981154 Tarshatha
Tarshatha's picture

Officially anyway...who knows what kind of extra bones they threw the old man.

-Warren and Hank Greenberg AIG fix.

-2005 Greeberg is done but Warren only gets a 50 million slap on the wrist and coincidentally coughs up his barbourous relic hord of Ag for peanuts.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:05 | 6980288 mccvilb
mccvilb's picture

The wealthy buy the mines,

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:48 | 6980420 frankly scarlet
frankly scarlet's picture

Anopheles...the wealthy also no they are going to get stuck holding a shit load of worthless paper if they can't convert it in to something tangible like farmland in Africa or some such.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 12:17 | 6981903 Farqued Up
Farqued Up's picture

Nor does any bird that flies do it on PMs, and I can't fly either, so may as well collect PMs.

Uh, are you sure you made a valid point?

If I remember correctly, an Anopheles is a type mosquito that kills a million a year with its drooling malaria. Good choice for a handle but I'm sure you have your reasons.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:35 | 6980557 Bill of Rights
Bill of Rights's picture

Oh goody now we can guess what that may be...

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:13 | 6979924 Theosebes Goodfellow
Theosebes Goodfellow's picture

~"Silver will find it's "proper place" around $8 to $12 an oz. "~

Sadly I think you have the cart before the horse. Silver, (and gold), never change. It is the number of dollars it takes to buy them that does, (thank you Kieth Wiener). Hence, the dollar either strengthens or weakens and the requisite number it takes to buy drops or rise, (respectively).

I think though that you are correct that we will see silver between $8 and $12 per ounce before we see 40 clams again. Deflation is just beginning. Keep your powder dry and don't shoot until you see the whites of their eyes. Upvoted ya' anyway.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:19 | 6979945 Barnaby
Barnaby's picture

Perfect.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:05 | 6980283 Mayer Amschel R...
Mayer Amschel Rothschild's picture

Gold in 1999 was $200/oz. Gold in 2012 reached $1900/oz. Did the dollar loss 90% value?

As much as it might chap the hides of ZHedgies, gold & silver are subject to the same manic investor swings as other financial instruments -- with or without speculator manipulation.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:36 | 6980370 froze25
froze25's picture

Deflation is coming and lots of it, bullish USD, bearish PMs and everything else but maybe short term treasuries and A or better Govt bonds for the short to mid term IMHO

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:13 | 6980499 oooBooo
oooBooo's picture

Maximum debt and stagnant wages are driving deflation and central banks fight it by printing money. Currently the federal reserve seems to be creating the least money of the major currencies. Which of course makes the dollar attractive, so that newly created money finds a home in dollar demand. So yeah the bottom may come yet but it's not going to stay there. Silver and gold are constant things, but their demand varies as well. But like a good Itallian Beef sammich each ounce represents human labor and resources and if the price in dollars falls too low supply will fall with it driving price back up.

 

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:01 | 6979893 Uchtdorf
Uchtdorf's picture

Nah. During the run up in 2011, everybody was talking about the Hunt Brothers supposedly cornering the market.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:13 | 6980095 WillyGroper
WillyGroper's picture

IIRC that HB episode had an oil angle to it, which is why they had to break'm.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:21 | 6980128 booboo
booboo's picture

what the fuck? are you guys like 12 years old? 2011... hunt brothers? really?

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 03:52 | 6981070 Uchtdorf
Uchtdorf's picture

Hahaha. I did not communicate well. Didn't intend to say that the Hunt Bros. were in action in 2011. What I was trying to say was that in 2011 when the price of silver/gold shot up, there were many who recalled the late 70's when Nelson and Herbert were buying physical and futures. 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:04 | 6979903 kill switch
kill switch's picture

 

The world as it is presently constituted will not exist in 30 years. No new investors. No money system,, total SHTF scenario.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 08:59 | 6981257 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

 "The world as it is presently constituted will not exist in 30 years."

 

Well, if you wind the clock back around 30 years, the movide 'Blade Runner' came out in 1982 (which featured Los Angeles 2019 in the opening credits).

 

I guess those flying cars were supposed to be made in Detroit or something.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:07 | 6979910 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

"It happened in 1980, and the living memory of that event is pretty much gone. "

 

Living mammaries are the best kind....

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:18 | 6979937 SuperRay
SuperRay's picture

You're right.  I don't think you should buy any precious metals.  I recommend you go deeply into debt to live it up and get what you want right now...

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:19 | 6979943 WTFUD
WTFUD's picture

This TIME it's different Guv! You know it, i know it and soon your bosses will hang you out to dry in their rush to get out of Dodge.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:25 | 6979970 class of 68
class of 68's picture

Dear Mosquito.

 

Take a few moments to peruse Steve's site  SRSRocco. a wealth of information. Unlike you Steve has spent hundreds of hours discovering nuances in the silver market. Not just comex or SLV but production, supply etc. He routinely talks to market participants.  I work with some Marcellus and mid stream players. I share some of my knowledge with Steve, as do many other interested parties. 

 

Your posts are without merit. They add nothing. Maybe you seek to gloat of your short SIH6 position on the Comex. If so you should put your money where your mouth is. I remember quite well the 80's and the Hunts. I was trading with Bache.

Tell us something that's worthwhile, instead of your worthless opinion.

 

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:20 | 6980121 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

And you've contributed what exactly?   Parroting a conspiracy theory website?  

Wow such deep thought and insightful analysis you provide.......  Fail

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:46 | 6980229 class of 68
class of 68's picture

Malaria Guy,

 

I'll tell Steve you called him a "conspiracy site"  You're dumber than you first appeared. Spend a few moments my young man on the site and you (or anyone) would see the countless hours Steve puts into hard, thoughtful research. No conspiracy, numbers, production curves, asset allocations, by product studies. 

 

I don't have to convince you. Steve has a great handle on fundamental analysis of Silver mining. You can dismiss him if you like. I didn't anwser you to educate you, I posted because you have no basis in fact for any opinion you had. Nice name, fitting.

 

My question? if you are bearish how many contracts are you short? what month are you trading? who do you like to use for your FCM?   come back when you have some life experiences.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:37 | 6980374 Bunghole
Bunghole's picture

Spot on.

A worthless 29 week blood sucking, disease spreading vector of human misery is what we have here.

Paid trolldom at its finest.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:36 | 6980722 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Like walking into a creationist convention with evidence the world is 3 billion years old.  It's irrelevant how many hours someone puts into "research" If they aren't willing to open their eyes to FACTS. 

Searching for facts, to substantiate you predetermined BELIEFS is a waste of time.  Creationists spend thousands of hours justifying their BELIEFS while dismissing actual evidence and facts. 

I alway listen to people who present ALL  the evidence, without bias,  for and again their position.  And from THAT, draw logical conclusions. 

Tell Steve that.

 

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:06 | 6980909 WSMassiv
WSMassiv's picture

"It's irrelevant how many hours someone puts into "research" If they aren't willing to open their eyes to FACTS."

Looks like you are calling the kettle black.  I find this very amusing, the irony is very rich. (I read your previous comments as well.)

"Like walking into a creationist convention with evidence the world is 3 billion years old."

There is nothing so irrational then a person clinging and comparing an arguement to religious beliefs.  Nice strawman.

"I alway listen to people who present ALL  the evidence, without bias,  for and again their position.  And from THAT, draw logical conclusions."

More irony. Lol.

 

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 06:54 | 6981162 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

The real irony is you can't see the dogma in yourself.    Your dogma is your BELIEF in glitter.    Like all true believers in anything, you believe it's "right" and everyone else is wrong and you refuse to EVER question your beliefs.   

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 07:01 | 6981167 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Tell me.  You say that Steve has "a great handle on fundamental analysis of Sliver mining". 

Does Steve go to the PDAC convention?  PDAC is the largest convention on earth for miners, with every PM miner in the world attending.  Every year, 30,000 miners and mine developers attend.  

To get a "handle" on things THAT'S where you need to be to actually talk to people who are DOING the mining, and buying and selling the mines themselves. 

Without that direct contact, he's just getting second hand (or less reliable) information.

 

 

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:32 | 6979987 Kefeer
Kefeer's picture

I doubt you could find anyone living in the EM's tied to USD monster to agree with you.  Once the USD is no longer on the "world reserve" throne, a cyclical certainty coming to a theater near you, then the replacement "dollar" will be severely devalued and all the rest that comes with it.  Of course we do not know the exact timing; only that it is close and war could change all of it whereby none of it matters...I hope that is not the case.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:02 | 6980067 topshelfstuff
topshelfstuff's picture

BINGO!!!

a bit more to the story but you got it...for myself, I believe a time will come, perhaps a week of bank closures, and on the re0open the PM's will be multiples of current...many multiples

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:17 | 6980112 oooBooo
oooBooo's picture

That's sort of like me expecting an Itallian beef sammich to go back to $3.75 and stay there for 30 years. Or expecting oil prices to find their place around $20/bbl and stay that way for 30 years. Neither is going to happen and there's no reason to suspect it will happen with silver.

1980 was caused by the Hunt brothers, not anything like what has happened in the last ten years.

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:30 | 6980162 The central planners
The central planners's picture

When in history the last bull market is higher than its predeccesor $50 1980 is like $250 in todays's dollars so $48 in 2011 its no even close we still have no seen that deserved bull market on silver yet.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:30 | 6980163 The central planners
The central planners's picture

When in history the last bull market is higher than its predeccesor $50 1980 is like $250 in todays's dollars so $48 in 2011 its no even close we still have no seen that deserved bull market on silver yet.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:31 | 6980165 The central planners
The central planners's picture

When in history the last bull market is higher than its predeccesor $50 1980 is like $250 in todays's dollars so $48 in 2011 its no even close we still have no seen that deserved bull market on silver yet.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:31 | 6980169 slobug
slobug's picture

Silver bullion physical silver historically goes through a point of being undervalued then overvalued it doesn't take a lot of math to realize it's undervalued at this point and it's quite easy for a blue-collar worker to add a little bit to their portfolio every month although you hear that silvers highs will be higher many folds over in my opinion it's so suppressed that how a person can not accumulate as much as possibly until it hits 30 per ounce hold selll 48. All I can say is if it last another three years. I made retirement

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:50 | 6980241 Wow72
Wow72's picture

When silver gets revalued as "money" because people are looking for a "safe" haven because of the awakening, there is not as much left as people believe in my opinion, the reduced industrial demand wont even matter.  People will be looking for a safe haven and when you compare silver and gold, In my personal opinion silver is much more attractive and it has the most uses of any metal, including medicinal.  It will hold value because it is valuable, more than most other things.  This "recession" in my opinion isnt going to go quite like the last one?  Why dont you guys just say what your really trying to do with all the B.S. psychology? People will search for alternatives to the dollar in my opinion and I think Silver will be a clear winner among many.  It is "true" money, it will hold its own.

 

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-12-17/all-world%E2%80%99s-money-and-markets-one-visualization

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 21:26 | 6980344 The Fonz...befo...
The Fonz...before shark jump's picture

You know in 1980 half of Europe was in a soviet bloc and China and India were still wiping their asses with their hands.....not to mention cities like Dubai were just desert towns....how does that factor into your cycle?

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 09:13 | 6980435 J S Bach
J S Bach's picture

 

Where I disagree with you, Ano, is in the simple analogy of the original "silver dollar".  In 1913, at the advent of the unconstitutional Federal Reserve System, one ounce of silver was worth roughly one FED dollar note.  Using the current suppressed dollar valuation of the metal ($14 per ounce) as a guide, the FED notes now in existence should equate to 14-times that original amount.  I don't know the exact figure, but I DO know that our currency supply has exponentially expanded well beyond 14 times since 1913.  Therefore, the true unsuppressed price of the commodity in fiat dollars should also be "well beyond" 14 times.  Forgive me if this all sounds convoluted, but I am of the belief that there will be a natural re-leveling of prices soon based on this simple analysis.  I realize that commodity prices naturally rise and fall due to their abundance or scarcity, but there has not been any kind of overwhelming glut in silver in the past 100 years to cause its price to be so low as it is today.  Like gold, it is being smashed down to maintain the fictitious value and kingship of the dying World Reserve Currency dollar.  Interesting times to say the least.

 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 22:04 | 6980476 SilverDOG
SilverDOG's picture

"Silver will find it's "proper place" around $8 to $12 an oz."

Buy when hated, sell when loved.

You prove my point.

Thanks!

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:15 | 6980660 Anopheles
Anopheles's picture

Yes.  

For some irrational reason, people always want "things" more when those things are most expensive.  Gold and silver are perfect examples. When prices are low, as they were from 1985 through 2005, the price hardly changed.  Nobody wanted it.  

When it began rising I simply couldn't believe how high the excitement around it pushed up the price.  It was, as you say, an  irrational love affair.   No different than tulip bulbs. 

This cycle will happen again,  but it's going to be a while. It has nothing to do with silver/gold is money,  it has to do with that love affair and irrational sentiment. 

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 00:34 | 6980844 Wow72
Wow72's picture

It has to do with an unbacked currency and a FED that is made of private bankers and engineered to produce no confidence? print a few more bucks? see if it helps? talk about irrational sentiment? If cracks appear sound money is going to look pretty inviting? It could just be me?

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:18 | 6980934 Bay of Pigs
Bay of Pigs's picture

You are talking to an idiot bro. He won't listen to you.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 07:50 | 6981188 Wow72
Wow72's picture

I agree, but Im talking to someone who Uncle Sham pays to spew B.S.  I try as much as I can to make sure he does not go  unchallenged.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 02:00 | 6980983 Ward no. 6
Ward no. 6's picture

bravo

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 18:49 | 6979860 highwaytoserfdom
highwaytoserfdom's picture

Jamie die and go away....  Moar nailguns for Banksters

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 18:51 | 6979862 kerfuffled
kerfuffled's picture

Again? I'm shocked, shocked that fraud is going on here!

 

Please fix aspect ratio of zh images.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 18:51 | 6979864 skinwalker
skinwalker's picture

I have a few ounces of silver. I either have way too much or not nearly enough. 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:03 | 6979895 Manthong
Manthong's picture

If you can move it all at once without a dolly, not enough.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 23:11 | 6980647 Temporalist
Temporalist's picture

I don't think dollies work at the bottom of lakes.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 18:58 | 6979882 Dragon HAwk
Dragon HAwk's picture

Hey we all try to Do our Part..

 All mine went to hookers Officer. Now we know why the cops always want to know what you paid.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:00 | 6979888 Kagemusho
Kagemusho's picture

Importing silver...while the domestic mines get trashed from the low spot prices? As the dollar is steadily devalued?

Somebody is definitely trying to kill off the mines, just when domestic production is sorely needed. WTF?

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:19 | 6979946 SuperRay
SuperRay's picture

My question is, where is all this imported silver being imported from?

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:47 | 6980029 KesselRunin12Parsecs
KesselRunin12Parsecs's picture

Methman's back yard... Oh wait, then there was fonestar (back in 2012), that was bragging about exiting his bitcoin position and buying PHYZ Ag at $30 an ounce (before those stops got run too)...

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:26 | 6979969 Kefeer
Kefeer's picture

Killing off mines is a small piece of the entire puzzle; the puzzle is killing of an entire nation, including the people.  Time is all that is needed as many will be & now are totally dependent on the basic necessities of life from the state-sponsored handlers and when "critical mass" is achieved, then that is when "they own you".  That is also when people will really see what exists in the "inner man" and it ain't pretty.

Thu, 12/31/2015 - 01:13 | 6980922 roccman
roccman's picture

Post of the day.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:00 | 6979890 gmak
gmak's picture

"By that, I mean the normal supply and demand forces no longer make sense."

 

The force is strong with Captain Obvious.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:22 | 6979953 Kefeer
Kefeer's picture

"Captain Obvious"..very funny. 

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:55 | 6980046 BustainMovealota
BustainMovealota's picture

What market does make sense, to the commoner?  It makes perfect sense to the NWO elite.

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 19:03 | 6979900 RaceToTheBottom
RaceToTheBottom's picture

Filling up Fort Knox.

God knows there is lots of space where the gold used to be...

Wed, 12/30/2015 - 20:00 | 6980065 Im possible
Im possible's picture

+1 "Fort KNOTS" you mean,  full of knots 0 0 0 0 0000000. Nothing inside.

Do NOT follow this link or you will be banned from the site!