Not So Fast: Scotland And Northern Ireland May Have Brexit Veto Rights

Tyler Durden's picture

Two days after the shocking Brexit result, the nightmares for the Remain camp - which refuses to accept a democratic reality - will not go away. As a result, it has gotten to the farcical point where disgruntled Remain voters have launched a petition demanding a second EU referendum, having clearly forgotten that it was the dramatically low turnout among their ranks that allowed the Leave vote to have such a knockout victory. To be sure this is a well-known technocrat approach: keep voting and revoting until the desired outcome is finally achieved.

We doubt this particular approach has any hope of success. We also doubt that a call by Labor MP David Lammy, urging for a vote in Parliament to "stop this madness", the madness in question being the will of the majority, which clearly is not appreciated by a member of a "democratically" elected institution. One can spend all day analyzing the amusing ironies in that statement.


However, while these are merely desperation antics by a group who will do almost anything to hang on to the benefits presented to them by the status quo, regardless of the will of the majority, a curious observation has emerged courtesy of Jim Fitzpatrick, who points out that according to the 28-page government Command Paper laying out "The Process of withdrawing from the European Union", which goes through the infamous Article 50 of the Treaty on European Union (TEU), the first time in history when Article 50 will be invoked, there may actually be a hurdle to the actual Brexit process, in the form of a Scottish and Northern Irish veto to Britain's separation from the EU. To wit:

The role of the devolved legislatures in implementing the withdrawal agreement:


We asked Sir David whether he thought the Scottish Parliament would have to give its consent to measures extinguishing the application of EU law in Scotland. He noted that such measures would entail amendment of section 29 of the Scotland Act 1998, which binds the Scottish Parliament to act in a manner compatible with EU law, and he therefore believed that the Scottish Parliament’s consent would be required. He could envisage certain political advantages being drawn from not giving consent.


We note that the European Communities Act is also entrenched in the devolution settlements of Wales and Northern Ireland. Though we have taken no evidence on this specific point, we have no reason to believe that the requirement for legislative consent for its repeal would not apply to all the devolved nations.

To be sure, this is merely an interpretation and not a legalistic prescription. The basis of this opinion is as follows:

In February 2016, the Government published a Command Paper entitled The process for withdrawing from the European Union, the findings of which have been widely challenged by those campaigning to leave the EU. We wanted to have as clear an understanding as possible of the process whereby the UK would withdraw from the EU, should the electorate so decide on 23 June. We therefore held a public evidence session with two experts in the field of EU law: Sir David Edward KCMG, QC, PC, FRSE, a former Judge of the Court of Justice of the European Union and Professor Emeritus at the School of Law, University of Edinburgh; and Professor Derrick Wyatt QC, Emeritus Professor of Law, Oxford University, and also of Brick Court Chambers.

So is one interpretation of Article 50 on the potential stumbling block behind Brexit sufficient to derail the process? We doubt it: David Cameron has already resigned while Europe has activated the machinery for a British separation (even if it means keeping the UK as an "associated member" as Germany desperately needs the UK market to keep its own economy afloat). Then again, anything is possible and we are certain that thousands of lawyers are working feverishly at this moment to preserve any optionality the Remain group may still have before too much time has passed and enough procedures have been implemented making a return to the status quo impossible.

Further complicating matters is the announcement by Scotland's first minister Nicola Sturgeon who said that a second Scottish independence vote 'highly likely' adding that it was "democratically unacceptable" that Scotland faced the prospect of being taken out of the EU against its will. She said the Scottish government would begin preparing legislation to enable another independence vote.

Whatever the outcome, it is certain that the status quo elites, who already lost hundreds of billions in equity "value" as a result of Brexit, will stop at nothing to prevent the existing globalized system from being deconstructed before their very eyes due to the "unexpected" arrival of democratic forces which demand real change. This will surely mean spending egregious amounts trying to find legalistic loopholes, and doing everything in their power to delay and prevent any incremental steps.

All of that is perfectly expected. That said we wonder if the same elitist minorities, which have already shown boundless disdain for the voice of the majority, will keep their interventionism within a peaceful framework because the last thing the world needs is for a tiny majority to start yet another global war to distract from their accelerating loss of influence and power. Then again, just like in the 1930s when the world was also squeezed in a global depression, the only thing that can boost the fortunes of the 1% is war.

Why is why war is the inevitable outcome that a world saddled with gargantuan amounts of debt, borrowed from a future that has no growth prospects, will get. We can only hope that Brexit is not the spark to this outcome.

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The Duke of New York A No.1's picture

Oh, the uncertainty ... wheres my popcorn.

NotApplicable's picture

"The law" means whatever they tell you it means.

TahoeBilly2012's picture


knukles's picture

Ya' know, the best way to handle this would be for Nigel Farage to miraculously land at 10 Downing, look at the cameras and simply say; "So what.  Enforce it.  Molon Labe.  You know where to find me when you need us."  (mumbling "Assholes")

glenlloyd's picture

This is just ridiculous....WAH WAH WAH...we got outvoted so we need to vote again...WAH.

Sorry if you don't like the result douchebag but that's how it works, the one with the most votes wins.

As for Ireland or Scotland, if they like their EU maybe they can keep their EU. IIRC one of the two voted not long ago to not separate from Britain, looks like you can't have it both ways, either suck it up and leave with the Brits or sever your ties to Britain and stick with the EU assclowns


greenskeeper carl's picture

"We got outvoted so we need to vote again"

Funny how important 'democracy' is until the people vote in the 'wrong' way. Same in the US. You have the right to vote as long as you vote in the desired manner. Same story with freedom of speech.

BuddyEffed's picture

"the only thing that can boost the fortunes of the 1% is war."
A grid down scenario from big war weapons actually will decease the 1 % fortunes. There are scenarios in war that might send us back past agrarian to hunter gatherer.

HowdyDoody's picture

Wow, the GCHQ robo-signer is working overtime.

bamawatson's picture

i got a slew of downvotes this morning for pointing out what is now the essence of this article

 "Jun 25, 2016 9:30 AM

"there will be no exit. the "unwinding" process is a complete inescapable trap ( more difficult than a contested divorce)

already today there is a petition for re-vote circulating; it has over 1 million signatures

there will be no exit"


hell, my above quoted 9:30 a.m. comment IS the cliff notes version of this current zh article


read and learn, rather than knee-jerk, no knowledge down vote, uninformed reaction


hotel california

earleflorida's picture

so we keep on voting til we get it right?

eforce's picture

EU was a Nazi project and the SNP leader got arrested for being Nazi back in the day and the SNP is arguably still Nazi by definition (nationalist and socialist).

I expect the SNP to get a second referendum and MI5 willstop them again or they will be allowed to leave by a small margin and ultimately crushed and then reattached to the UK, Trump also doesn't particularly get on well with the SNP either iirc and if they fuck with his gold course...

NidStyles's picture

You're saying an internationalist organization that operates on communist priciples is National Socialist.


Fuck me you trolls are retarded.

PP's picture

STOP this shit stupid Petition!!!!

Even I am a Chinese I signed for that petition with fake name and email address, only for fun.

If we Chinese help you, we can give you 100 millions signature with multiple fake name and email address, does it mean there are 100 millions people who want to remain in EU???????

bamawatson's picture

"It’s true that the referendum is NON-BINDING and the U.K.’s next prime minister is under no legal compulsion to act on the result. "

Squid-puppets a-go-go's picture

i think - without being conclusive - you may have a point

but i think that whatever is written into the process to compel compliance will not be enough ultimately to overcome the systemic socio-political entropy and unsustainability of the debt issue

let the lawyers draft what they want to draft, there comes a point where history has its way regardless

maskone909's picture


Omen IV's picture

The price of oil is low and will continue - but the volume of production is getting ncreasingly lower and more expensive to produce and drill more wells


Scotland is in a pickle - the eventual new deal with a disintegerating EU will put the UK in the catbird seat ina negotiation  and Scotland is a wasteland going alone

Ghordius's picture

reading skills? Scotland wants to stay in the EU
S T A Y as in Remain
evidence: poll results

you are not entitled to your own facts. not if you want to be taken as an adult, anyway

yes, grow some. in the sense of G R O W. U P

Nobody For President's picture

Memory skills? Scotland voted September, 2014 to stay part of Great Britain, and not become independent. STAY as in remain not independent from British Parliment laws and a whole bunch other shit.

Evidence: poll resuilts. 55.30 to 44.70

And you, Ghordius are not entitled to a short and very selective memory, if you want to be taken as an intelligent adult, anyway.

Great Britain wants to Brexit, as OVERALL polls have it 53 to 47%. Scotland wants to be not an independent country by 55 yto 44% less than two year ago, but now they want to remain part of the EU.

These once proud Scots, reduced to gutless fucks that want somebody, somewhere to take care of them, need to make up their fucking mind. And guess what, you are gonna be part of Great Britain and live without the EU, and you will be just fine.

Ghordius's picture

evidence: the Scottish Prime Minister wants to start Scottish-EU talks, and calls for a new Scottish independence referendum because of Brexit

Bernardo Gui's picture

Exactly.  The Scottish faction that lost its bid to separate from Britain sees this Brexit vote as another bite at the apple.  It is a purely political ploy.  No one south of Hardian's Wall gives two squirts of sheep's piss what the Scots think.

Overflow-admin's picture

Evidence: poll results -> BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Now poll = vote?

adanata's picture


Thanks for the link... I was watching Hawaii for the GMO war underway...  has Hawaii become a 'test' state?

Yep, just keep tightening the screws guys... That'll fix it.

Cloud9.5's picture

Hawaii is a freaking colony.  It is an outpost of our 19th century empire.  It never was American.  What it does has little relevance in fly over country.

COSMOS's picture

A good comment below that article was...
by John...
"My name (a very common one apparently) was on the airline watch list. Every time I flew, I was delayed at the ticket counter 15-20 minutes until a sheriff's deputy was called to "check me out," whatever that means. On calling the airlines to determine how I could get off the 'list', I was told I to call the FBI. When I called the FBI, I was told there was no established procedure to remove my name from the 'list', in other words, no due process. I began using the initials of my first and middle names which allowed me to "check in" with no delay for a conversation with a deputy. This shows how ineffective, but intrusive, a Federal bureaucrat-run gun registration list would be with no provision for a due process procedure for removing one's name from the list. Big Brother, anyone?"

Quote : "Hawaii state Senator Will Espero, a Democrat and a co-author of the law who owns a gun, called the law "common sense legislation that does not hurt anyone.""
Every unConstitutional action against the 2nd Amendment is always described as 'common sense' by the Left, and has been since the 1930's, when gun restriction really took off. There are thousands of laws on the books, but they are never enough. Why? Because the Holy Grail of the Left is to ban and confiscate all guns in private hands.
The Left is the enemy of the Constitution and the Bill of Rights.

This law is going to create a market for non-serial numbered armament. Criminal minded people will make themselves sellers of unregistered guns and create a supply channel to those people of criminal intent and terrorist goals. This law and any law will not stop criminals and terrorist's. Proof of this in the fact that the FBI did not respond to the call placed by the pawn shop owners when the Club Pulse shooter asked for full "type 3" body armor! And this shooter was already flaged. Two government agencies dropped the ball, (including the San Bernardino shooters)!!! Makes me wonder if my Country's government is using civilian citizen lives to fulfill an agenda.
The sad part is that responsible gun owners that possess armament in the US are a Militia in Readiness 2nd Amendment of the US Constitution). This FBI registration is inching closer to creating a data base that will be used to disarm The American Patriot.

What could go wrong? How about 2006 and the Duke University Lacrosse Team Scandal, in which three guys were accused, arrested and charged with rape and a hate crime by a rogue prosecutor named Nifong, who was later disbarred for his handling of the case? It took months to resolve, and in the end the charges were dropped by the state's Attorney General.
The arrests are still on the record. Under the HI law, they would be barred from firearm ownership for life. Good Democrat thinking, once again.
The test of a good law is not how it works when everything is fine, but how it works when things AREN'T. This case makes the point: a false accusation, an overzealous prosecutor, and conviction in the court of public opinion.

Denying someone of their constitutional rights is illegal. The first time someone loses their Constitutional right to gun ownership because of Governor Ige's law, the Governor himself should be arrested. Then his Constitutional rights will be removed as well. And they can take away his right to keep silent, his right to any attorney and the other nine amendments that make up the Bill of Rights as well. Where does this end if the State can arrest (not convict, mind you) and deny you of whatever Constitutional rights the State thinks you no longer deserve because THEY arrested you?

JohninMK's picture

Whilst we, the people of England would probably vote in huge numbers to allow the Scots their freedom, this is not the view of the Government in London. They are desperate, I mean really really desperate to keep the Union.

The reason, the UK's place at the world's top tables. Without Scotland there would be a much smaller UK, if a UK at all. Leading to increasing difficulty in justifying our role in the world.

Personally I couldn't care less whether the UK existed of whether we were just England and in many ways we, the people, would be much better off as just England. But we don't make the decisions, TPTB do and clearly it is in their interests for the UK to continue as it gives the UK a much more powerful voice in World affairs, which is good for them. A Scottish independence vote is not like the vote we have just had where to said PTB it didn't really matter which way it went. If anyone thinks that Scotland will be allowed to leave the UK against the direct and personal interests of that group they don't know enough about the insidious power and influence of money and position. One reason it was not allowed last time.

Scotland MAY get a referendum but only if Nicola Sturgeon, the SNP leader, thinks she can win it and all she is saying atm is that it is an 'option' and laying the legal groundwork just in case. We can stake our life savings on her not wanting to go down in history as the person who killed the Scottish independence dream (one of the most powerful and long lived dreams in the word) by losing twice in quick succession thus losing everything. She is a very clever lady, much better to be seen as wise, to stay in power, to sit back and watch, to keep the dream alive and see how things turn out for everyone over the next 5 years of turmoil, after which the World will be a different place. Especially as, on top of that, the private personal rewards of staying onside to TPTB are so considerable (see Tony Blair as an example).

BarkingCat's picture

I have an idea. England should hold a referendum to exit UK instead.

Then Scottland can go on wearing their skirts and find a new reason to complain.

sunnyside's picture

Someone help me with nomenclature.  The media keeps calling this "Brexit". To me, if I understand correctly, "Britain" is the island of England, Scotland and Wales, whereas "The UK" is England, Scotland, Wales AND Northern Ireland.  The UK is the country, which just had the vote to leave.  Why is it called "Brexit", when it is The UK leaving?

I'm not trying to be a dick, but there appears to me to be a difference. Now, if Northern Ireland were to somehow join back together with Ireland, then the UK and Britain would be interchangeable terms, but that isn't the case right now. 

Am I missing something?

IReallyDontCare's picture

Your over thinking it, its just a clever slang word. The N.I is not about to leave the U.K, the EU vote and a United Ireland vote are completely different issues.

JustUsChickensHere's picture

Simple 'legal' way around this: Westminster repeals the Scottish Act 1998 -  ... no more devolution or ability to block the referendum result.

Rubicon727's picture

Does this mean if Trump wins, we'll be forced into "A Do-Over" 'cause there weren't enough votes for him that The Establishment could call "a winner?"

Maybe UK Conservatives should have considered constructing a "super majority" for Friday's outcome. But living in their conclave of smug power and money, they simply couldn't believe their peasants would want to "Leave."

Tallest Skil's picture




How do you guys embed images? I'd prefer everyone just SEE it.

Seems Legit's picture

Would not surprise me in the least - probably by the same "rent-a-mob" who stood outside Boris Johnson's home - causing deployment of a police escort.

Rusty Shorts's picture

To embed emages, you have to be on the ZH team.

doctor10's picture

Brexit is a reality test.  The Brits opportunities  historically have been the consequence of their being able to read reality and act on it in  a timely fashion.


The reality is that the  future of the world is REGIONAL


The beginnings of the end of the 20th century have finally commenced as people are starting to grasp that attempts to extend  20th century legacy institutions rooted in 19th century ideology are the principle impediments to the 21st century



wildbad's picture

so its looks like all of the losers are either splitting legal hairs, lawyering up or decrying the perils of democracy in the streets.


fuck all of you whiners.  EU is smouldering toast. 

hte head whiners have all been invited to herr merkel's tax farm for a good cry-in and to pretend they don't know that the jig is up.


Roar your victory in their elitis powerhungry faces. and double down NOW!

EuroPox's picture

The SNP does not like democracy. They've now done two referendums:  Scots independence and the EU. They have accepted neither.

dark fiber's picture

Scotland can just fuck off.  Brussels will not give them even half of the subsidies and handouts they get from the UK, on the contrary they are very likely to get austerity.  Give them independence and let them join the EU.  It will be hilarious to watch them beg to rejoin the UK after a few years and England telling them to get stuffed.  But there is one thing the Scots should get through their thick heads.  You can't have it both ways. 

Harlequin001's picture

To deny this referendum is to begin the civil war.

Too many have died defending this nation to let arseholes give it away in exchange for money, handouts and well, what? funding for films and plays? The arts?

and yes, Scotland can just fuck off. 'You just voted to stay in the UK. You voted as did everyone else as part of the UK. You voted to stay in the UK and you didn't get your minority way. Tough, that's democracy.

The next referendum on Scottish independence should be voted on by the English, Welsh and Irish, as to whether we are all sick and tired of your constant fucking whining and we want rid of you.

dark fiber's picture

I have said it before, if you want Scotland out for good let just the English vote on it.  They will literally get kicked out at hypersonic speed.

Billybullshit's picture

Is there anything faster ? warp speed, wining ginger haired socialist penis envy small country of pissed up jocks can just fuck off. Please

fockewulf190's picture

I doubt William Wallace would had ever bowed to an EU bureau-crap.

Harlequin001's picture

William Wallace was a loser. And he lost.

It's a bit of a pisser when he's the best hero you got...